How to convert GM alternator to 6 volt positive ground for a Ford Model A
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ค. 2022
- General Motors (GM) 1-wire alternators are everywhere and cheap at swap meets, flea markets, etc. Ford Model A expert Robert Guimarin shows how to convert a GM alternator to 6 volts, positive ground for a simple bolt-in charging upgrade to any Ford Model A.
If you don't want your Model A to break down, just subscribe! th-cam.com/users/paulshinn...
"I AM THE WARRANTY" shirts- amzn.to/3zj7yZ1
How to buy a Ford Model A- • Ford Model A Buyer's G...
What motor oil to use in a Model A- • What motor oil is best...
How to shift the Ford Model A transmission- • How to shift gears in ...
How to check and change fluids in Model A- • How to check and chang...
How to lubricate a Model A- • How to lubricate a For...
How to do Model A front end alignment- • How to align Ford Mode...
How to set the timing in a Model A- • How to set Ford Model ...
How to properly adjust Model A brakes- • How to adjust Ford Mod...
Ford Model A daily driver- • Daily Driving a 92 yea...
Why the Ford Model A is the best American car ever made- • They call it the "Best...
www.PaulShinn.us
"I AM the Warranty"
#paulshinn - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
A man who is missing part of a finger is a man worth listening to and learning from. He has life experiences that the common man does not.
And he will almost always make you laugh when he holds up that hand and says "five" but inside your brain, you think "four and a half"
I'm missing part of a finger got bit off by a rabbit when I was 3 lol
The most valuable thing to learn from him is how to not cut off your finger, because clearly he got it after the first one and knows pretty well.
A big Thank You to Bob and Paul for posting this video. I had picked up a Delco 10SI alternator at a swap meet this spring. It had the 6V regulator in it but was Negative ground. It even has a chrome body for $15...LOL I was going to attempt the Positive ground conversion but my Wife said that I should wait till Paul posted the video. I now have a project for the day... Thanks a Million!!
Your wife Mrs. Shark is very wise!
Run across your videos a few weeks ago. And boy do I enjoy watching them. A lot of very good and useful info!! Keep up the good work!
Welcome aboard, and Thank You!
I knew you could rebuild an alternator but never have I seen it done. Love it!
Thanks Paul and Bob for this great how to video. Definitely going to save this for reference in the future. Have a great weekend guys.
Thanks VMG!!
Thank you for doing this video, I have been looking forward to it since you first mentioned being able to convert these! I don’t have a model A, but I plan to do this for my 1950 F3. Thank you again!
Great video Paul, thank you and Bob for the demonstration and lesson on how to convert the alternators. Have a great weekend.
Thanks, you too!
Paul you and Bob excite one's knowledge and generate enthusiasm alternately keeping one well grounded. Seriously your videos have certainly kept a lot of Ford Model-A's on the road.
Our pleasure!
Sir Robert! Sir Robert!
A genius is he!
We watched and we learned
Entirely free!
Thanks Paul! Pass the kudos on to the old Model A Jedi!
It’s always good to see Bob, he is quite the celebrity gauging from the comments everyone loves him and his knowledge and know how is priceless. I think we can all see the influence he has had on you. A great video, thanks for taking the time to share. Now we all know what’s in our alternators. I think we all appreciate your hard work and what you’ve done for the hobby of Ford Model A ownership, I know I do. Thanks again friend.
BRENDA!!!!! Whasssap??!
Thanks Robert and Paul!
A parts list in the description of the video would be helpful. I've been considering this for my '29 coupe but haven't found the instructions. Till now. Thanks.
I learned a lot as a kid from my '3 fingered Shop teacher' back in the 70s.
I have never owned a model A but do love the content and information of these videos!
Glad you like them Darren!
Thanks Paul and Bob for posting and sharing you knowledge of the Model A!! That was interesting!! Guess I need to be looking for a GM alternator!
Our pleasure!
Much more simple than I thought. Great video!!
Glad it was helpful!
great teaching Paul
This is a great practice, and reminds me of my 1963 Triumph TR4. It was 12 volt generator but positive ground also. It’s weak spot in the Lucas “Prince of Darkness” electrical system was the mechanical voltage regulator. It just wouldn’t allow proper charging no matter how much I adjusted it. My solution? Wire in a 1968-1971 ( or so) Chrysler transistor voltage regulator. I mounted it on rubber and wired it backwards. Worked flawlessly for many years. Wish I still had that car. (Doesn’t change the fact I still want to own a Model A!)
I learned when putting the 10DN or the 10SI GM alternators together, use a wooden toothpick. Put one brush in a start the pick. Then put the other in and finish pushing the toothpick in. Sooooo simple. Pull it out once the alternator is bolted back together. Interesting info. Thanks Paul.
Thanks, I have been waiting for you to do this one.
Sorry it took so long. We ave had the stuff out on the bench for 6 months! Other stuff kept taking priority
Thanks for the great info, it's much appreciated!
I don’t recall my dad ever buying a new alternator. He always rebuilt his. Enjoyed your video.
Mine neither.
A master class in converting an alternator, just awesome! I remember back 28 years ago when i was in my early 20's, forgetting to pull out "the wire" when i was done. 😵💫 I ended up driving by moonlight, when the battery finally died (about 2 hours). A lesson I'll never forget!😜
Hahahaa!! I am embarrassed to say how many times I have forgotten to pull the wire...
Another great informative video. Thanks for making these.
Thanks Michael
Thanks again Paul ...
We love Robert. A true stalwart and testament to long life. A diamond in the rough!
He's more like a jagged kidney stone in the rough
@@ModelA Too funny!
I would be spending a lot of time “Talking story” with you and Bob. Bob is full of information and seen things we haven’t experienced.
He is a treasure!
Great video, Paul!!!
I've been waiting for this for what seems like a year! LOL!!
I learned a lot of new information that I will put to good use on my Model A. Sincere thanks to both you and Bob.
Here's hoping Tina is getting better.
73 Om,
de Benton w4jba
Thank you Benton!! 73
Wow Paul !!
Both you and Bob set the bar high for Model A expertice!
Wondering how one even thinks about pulling apart a 12v alternator in the first place …….. I am back at novice level !!
Great video
Just take the 4 screws out and it comes apart.
@@ModelA 🤓 nice
Another fantastic video! Thanks Paul and Bob!
Thanks Andy
@@ModelA we have a ‘30 Tudor and my 22y/o son who is a radio sports broadcaster with a love of old technology wants to find a period correct radio that might have gone in an early ‘30s car like ours. Any suggestions for brands, models, resources, where to search, etc?
@@andyweixler662 Crosley made a radio in the 30's and so did Galvan Manufacturing. I thought about it and even acquired a 1935 Crosley, but decided against it after seeing how much AM radio interference a Model A makes.
@@ModelA thanks so much. I knew if anyone would have the answer about old radios and Model A’s, you would!
Great video 👍Thanks for showing us 🇺🇸👍
Glad you enjoyed it
Another great video, than you Paul
Glad you enjoyed it Warren!
Nothing more rewarding than fixing something yourself
Absolutely!!!!
I've been waiting for this video California prices are great! junk yard alternator here is $45 off to the garage I go!!!!
I assure you, California prices are NOT great. We have the highest gas prices in the country right now I hear. That's making everything else go up too. Then our whacky state government RAISED gas takes again a couple weeks ago!! Insanity!!
Thanks Paul
You're welcome Jerry!
Paul, I’m in the process of buying a 1930 Roadster. And it’s ALL YOUR FAULT! Just kidding, it’s fulfilling a goal I’ve had for 60 years. But seriously, I’ve watched all your videos and you’ve given me the confidence to go ahead with the purchase. Thank you and Model T.
- David L, The newest member of MAFCA and Alamo A’s of San Antonio.
Awesome!! I accept responsibility for being a bad influence. Hahahaa! Please say HI to Rudy Blanco and his nephew for me. You're in great company with those Alamo A's. Very respectable club.
Little tip a tooth pick or match stick can also be used to hold the brushes in place while you are putting the armature back in to the alternator if you do not have a piece of stiff wire.
Another great video from the Guru's of grease! Ever notice how most great mechanics are missing part of an appendage? I have all 10, which means I stink at this mechanical stuff. 😁
Ha! I’m now retired as a professional mechanic, first on autos before moving on to aircraft. I’m a member of the lost finger club, a casualty of a falling auto transmission. Any claim to greatness, I doubt that.
Funny that you should put out this video today. I was watching the channel for onewhocollects and he did the same thing. If only I had seen one of those before I bought the one on my car for BIG money. I always enjoy your videos and I look forward to seeing them on Saturday morning. Kind of like the way I used to look forward to Saturday morning cartoons. No, I am not saying that you put out cartoons, just that I look forward to seeing your videos.
Thanks! Well, I am kind of a cartoon.. Don't know about the other channel. I have enough difficulty staying in my own lane. This video has been in the tank for over 6 months!
One Who Collects, his name is Charlie I think, also “dug out” the front bearing to replace it. Just another fun step in the whole process.
Excellent, if you can use this on your model A , you should be able to use this on your antique farm tractor. Always liked the look of a generator but if you could tuck this under the hood it would be fine. Thank you for your video
Thanks 👍
Looks good. Is this a one wire back to the battery as the power is regulated with in the alternator?
Very good. Little shaky Paul, (but you knew that when you edited it.) Thanks for this tutorial.
Hey, QSG!! Let's see YOU try and record Bob doing something!! hahaa! Good luck!!
@@ModelA LOL! I'd love to try actually. It would be an honor just to be in the same room.
@@quailstudios You're on! He still wants to do a video on generators. You come on out and record and edt him and I'll post it.
@@ModelA Thanks for the invitation. I'm considering it. :)
I just looked at the parts that I could find, rectifier $12, regulator $26, pulley $20, some or most are out of stock,,, any suggestions, I just started looking tonight, so I will find them.... I think I have an old alternator some where in my parts bins....I actually have the 6 volt alternator and bracket that you show a the end, not sure of the make, I have not looked ...good stuff, thanks....see you at Model a days next month...never been looking forward to it...
Thanks
Welcome
My grandpa worked as an electrician for GM for over 30 years. Retired in the early 90s.
We owe him thanks
I stumbled across your video and it caught my attention. Can you use this conversion in other 6-volt
positive ground cars like my '49 Packard? if so, do I remove the voltage regulator and/or make it look like it is being used? Thanks, I took notes I hope I remember the sequence of events.
I suppose if you alter the mounting options, you could do this in anything
Interesting!
It is!
Great video. Will do it. Question. Understand the parts shown. But, still need to make a jumper wire and buy new brushes and springs? Need a spec for those?
If your brushes are still good, keep them!
I have rebuilt many of these as they were used on heavy equipment such as Case and Bobcat but never converted one like Bob is doing.
He's old school!
Thanks Bob and Paul. Question: any benefit to a positive ground or is it just a wash between that and a negative ground? Just curious.
Some minor advantages
Good video and a couple of points. Armatures are the rotating part of a DC generator. The rotating part of an alternator is a rotating field usually called a rotor. Current is applied to the rotor via slip rings not a commutator. Also... It's unclear as to what parts were installed.
It's explained in the video what parts are installed... Diode pack and regulator
Great video. I have found where to buy regulator, but where can you get the pulley?
We get everything from our local generator shop. He gets it direct from J&M.
Paul, did you post on another video the links for the parts? I need to do this on the 46, I just don't trust the generator while running in parade mode. 73.
I showed the part numbers in this video
I really like the look and working of the traditional alternator. I cleaned it out and refurbished it, it charges good, but my heatlamp glowlights still use a lot of amps, and in the winter, driving a lot in the dark, my battery still drains over time.
But I don't want an ac alternator. Any other options?
Switch to LED lights?
Where do u buy the parts from
In fairness to the Nu-Rex, it does come with a quality engine mounting kit. Now that the alternator has been modified it must be mounted on the engine. Alignment and security are important.
The modified smooth black housing doesn’t scream GM so loudly, I don’t find it quite so out of place on the A engine. Likewise with their unobtrusive pusher belt tension adjuster versus the somewhat goofy appearing modified GM gooseneck adjustment arm as used on some cheaper or homemade installations.
That being said, I agree the used converted alternator can be a viable cost effective upgrade.
Can you tell me where I can buy the belt tensioning devise that is curved and bolts to the engine and bolts to the Alternator? Or, can you tell me what GM car fits? Thanks in advance.
Presumably this will work in other 6 volt positive ground vehicles of the day. I confess to havin to slow the speed of the video down to have a better look inside of the alternator as the work was being done! :)
Hi Paul!: Just checked out this video after seeing your Q&A episode. When you go looking for these alternators to rebuild you just ask for a GM 1-wire alternator? Also, I noticed that some of the alternators are painted black to make them stand out less. I would assume you would paint the casing when the alternator is completely pulled down. Do you use just a semi-flat or semi-gloss paint on them? REALLY fascinated by this video!
Just look for a 70's to early 80's GM alternator. The 10SI is really abundant around here and works fine. I do paint them sometimes. I just use whatever black is handy. Sometimes just primer.
@@ModelA Thanks Paul! I saw some nifty rebuild kits on ebay to convert to the 6V positive ground! Then all you need is the pulley. SO MUCH GREAT information on yours and Tina's channels!
Will improve lights but now originality is gone I went to 12 volt - ground. Resistor on horn and upgraded bendix, bulbs a must. Nurex generator pulley smaller and proprietary. : (
This upgrade to an alternator for a Ford Model A results in a system that can charge the electrical system and battery of a Ford Model A when the Ford Model A engine is at idle speed. The old DC generators that old cars had would not charge the battery at engine idle speed. This will result in brighter headlights at engine idle speed.
Paul and Bob Thanks for another great video!
I have a question, I talked to a gentleman who said he can take a generator and make it output BOTH 12V and 6V at the same-time? Any idea of how this would be accomplished?
I suppose he could do a tap or half wave it.
@@ModelA what is that Paul? I’m not that well versed unfortunately
@@TreadTalk247 Oh, sorry. He would have to rewind it in a special way and do a bunch of stuff. Totally not worth the trouble or making it that unreliable.
Paul, I have a question. I am converting alternator to 6 volt positive ground. My question is how do i wire it up and still have amp gauge. do i completely do away with regulator on firewall and run a new wire to battery. I am sorta lost at this point. Great video as usual.
You lost me at "regulator on firewall". I have no idea how your car is wired. If you have a totally stock Model A, and a 6 volt positive ground alternator, you just swap it for the stock generator and you're done.
Interesting coincidence! The TH-camr "onewhocollects" also just posted a video on how to do this conversion. :)
Someone else just said that too. I don't know about that one. I've had this video in the tank for 6 months!
By the way I'm 75, first time I had a generator/ starter apart was about 1966, first time I was into an alternator was about 1970
Have you tried a dynamator on an A, looks like a dynamo but has alternator internals, can be bought in 6 volt positive earth
I have seen them, but I am not a rich man. I'd rather invest $45 and have an alternator.
Good deal on the field modification. I am assuming that this is for a car used as a daily driver rather than a "show" car. Or is this mod not a check against a show car?
This is strictly for a driver car, not a blue ribbon car. This would be a definite deduction for non-stock component.
What head gasket do you prefer for a 1931 Ford Roadster? Where do you order one from? Thanks!
Copper. All the Model A parts suppliers sell them
Hi Paul, does he have a part # for a negative ground 6 volt? This would be what an older Caterpillar pony start would use
I do not
Hi Pa,
Where do you purchase the alternator parts?
We get them from our local generator shop.
I wish I knew then what I know now. I could have saved a lot of money by building my own alternator.
Yes!!!
does the negative ground feature come with the regulator ? the only other alteration was the excite wire which I doubt would make it a positive ground?
The ground option comes from the rectifier module. Stock is negative ground. The voltage option comes from the regulator you choose.
got it! thanks!@@ModelA
Hear me out, I have a question… first, I’m a big fan of 10si and 12si alternators for boosting reliability of vintage electrical systems, but I’m not a fan of the 1 wire set up. The 3 wire set up maximizes charging efficiency with the use of the sensor wire. I’m not criticizing anybody using the 1 wire set up, but I can’t find a 6v 3 wire regulator- they’re all listed as 1 wire. But if you didn’t install the jumper wire, would the two spade connectors work as intended for a 3 wire with one being the exciter and the other being the sensor??
I pondered the same thing. Unfortunately, the field won't excite that way, and the static drain is horrible. I also thought about using a relay to excite the field. But later decided that long term reliability would suffer. The Hegermeister near-zero RPM alternator is my favorite option now.
where can you buy the 6 volt regulator used?
Online. I have a local supplier, but he doesn't want me spreading it online because he only wants to do over the counter sales, no shipping. Sorry.
Were can I purchased the parts needed for the conversion ?
Anywhere. Even Ebay. That's why I provide part numbers.
Was this a speed-conversion? This experienced demonstrator could have been/should have been more forthcoming with explanation. Don't know any more about it now than I did before except that he could do it. Will have to play/stop/play/stop video on work bench .
The presenter is 92 years old. What quality will your videos be when (if) you make it to 92 years of age?
Where do you connect the cable from the alternator to a positive ground system, to the positive post of the battery or negative post of the battery?
Alternator post connect to battery negative. Battery positive connects to chassis ground.
@@ModelA
If someone use a power pack to help the battery to start a positive ground car how do you plug the cables, black to black and red to red? Just curious how it goes, it is mixing me, 😉
Is it not a smoothing capacitor? Why would you not want it or is it electrolitic and not polarity correct?
The capacitor is to reduce radio interference. But since Model A's don't have an AM or FM radio, we remove them because that is one less thing to go bad.
If I just want to change the alternator to 6v but keep the negative ground can I simply change only the regulator and keep the original diodes?
I believe the regulator is also polarized.
@@ModelA ok, the part desrciption just says to convert from 12 to 6 but doesn't say positive or negative
@@MrCorynick I have never built one for negative ground before, so I'm not positive. If you do it, please report back and let us know!
I'm sorry I don't know if you said or not but where do you get the parts?
We get them from our local alternator shop. But I see them on ebay, online, etc.
I already have a 6 volt alternator, my problem is the charging stud is coming loose. Do I need to remove the pulley and all that other stuff to get to that nut? I realize I'll probably have to put those pins in for the brushes. But is that it?
You don't have to remove the pulley. just take the case apart (4 screws). Yes, you will have to pin the brushes.
@@ModelA thanks!
Does the single wire on the alternator go to the positive of the battery just like a negative ground system?
No. In a Model A, positive is ground.
@@ModelA Oh I understand that. I just didn’t know if the single wire from the alternator went to negative or positive. I thought I saw red on the alternator’s terminal and was wondering it it still went to positive somehow or would wire to negative.
@@general23cmp The single wire on an alternator converted to positive ground goes to negative on a Model A.
Should this be painted black after the conversion?
Any color you want! Well, except pink, that would just be wrong.
Whenever you have the need to open a alternator always relub the bearings. Its not a big job. Dont even remove the bearings. Carefully peel out the brg seals on one side of each brg and then add a small amount of new grease. and re-install the seals. I use moly syn. I usully wash and blow out the old grease but my experience has shown it doesn't make much difference. Over 300K on my old 88 dodge caravan (two cycles of relubing ). Changed brushes each time. Sold that thing with orig alt and brgs.. Similar experience on '98 camry. Brushes are good for abut 150K on most vehicles.
We lubed the rear roller bearing but leave the sealed front on alone. 150K in a modern car is about right. Keep in mind a Model A motor redline is about 2,500 RPM, so alternator bearings should last over 300K miles in a Model A.
I bought a kit and installed it, but the alternator only puts out about 1.5 volts. Any ideas?
Something is amiss.. Perhaps the regulator?
I wonder if you could do this to a Ford Model T?
I suppose so
Paul, my name is Scott Green, I’m working on a 1928 model a standard three speed unrestored, original car, vehicle was involved in small flood, water made it into the bell housing as high as a fly wheel and clutch plates, now my question, any thoughts on how I can get the friction plates freed up from the fly wheel, pressure plate seems to be functioning OK, and the pressure plate seems to be pulling away from the friction disc OK, this leads me to believe my only issue is the friction disc is stuck to the fly wheel and I believe that to only be about Small portion of the bottom of the friction plate, whatever was sitting around 6 o’clock, so we’re wondering if you had any ideas without tearing the entire transmission off the engine, thank you
Hi Scott! No shortcuts here, you need to pull the motor (leave the transmission in the car). unbolt the clutch housing from the bell housing with a 9/16 and yank er out. It should separate with the clutch assy coming out with the motor. Unbolt the pressure plate from the flywheel and then you can remove the clutch disc. I almost guarantee the flywheel needs to be surfaced after that soaking.
@@ModelA
Paul, thanks for taking the time to get back to me, I more than agree with you on the Shortcuts theory, I was just trying to get this car to drive, it needs to get to a reunion next weekend. I have no doubt that the fly wheel needs resurfaced and as far as I’m concerned as does the pressure plate, and I would definitely replace the friction disk as well.
Like I said, with a clutch disc glued to the flywheel, there are no shortcuts. Even if you manage to unstick it, it won't work properly after that.
This conversion apparently works but I had trouble with the use of a modern GM part, then I saw a chinese part inside the GM part, I was not prepared for any of this! I trust that this works alright, but I didn't expect any of this to go in a Model A. Am I just revealing ignorance? I am told we (USAF) buy spare parts for F-35's that are made in China--can that be true?
I am also told that much of the electronics in our nuclear arsenal are chinese made now.
Where can you buy the parts ?
online. I showed the part numbers
I am waiting for your viodes .
They are coming your way!
I'd like to see the alternator in action. It would be useful to actually see the charging current and to ensure when the battery is fully charged, the charge current is backed off so the battery does not get fried!
I did a video on that exact subject about 7 years ago
@@ModelA Great! I will look for it. Thanks!
@@ModelA can you link me to the video you did 7 years ago? I cannot find it.
Paul how is model T
She is 90% better!
Thats a GM DN alt, right? The SI would be a single wire
I don't know GM alternator types well enough to answer that
@@ModelA the one you have is internally regulated, so must be an SI 👍
👍👍👍👍👍👍
Did I miss the part where it's converted to positive ground?
Changing the doide pack to positive geound diodes, which you saw, changes the polarity.
NONE of my air tools or air lines leaked, and if they started to, I fixed them!
So how do I convert my 6 volt generator into an alternator
A 6 volt regulator would almost make it work like one
@@ModelA what I’m asking is ,,, I’d like to take my original 6 volt generator and turn it into a 6 volt alternator. Keeping the stock look.
I would find greater happiness in rebuilding an alternator, than just buying a new one from a parts company.
I like making my own stuff too!
Sure now you show after I bought a 6v pos alt and paid $$$$ plus customs fee to ship to Canada LOL
sorry, OM!
Thanks Paul for the info I called are gen shop Friday
He has the regulator in stock but has to order the reflector both come to about 50.00
Now have to call and order the brush holder broke when to it apart
.asked what they charged to make one said around 200 not bad that is Canadian dollar
what amp alternator do you use the one i just took apart to get ready is a 61 amp is that to big should i go for one around 40 amp then would have to have it made
will put in on a 39 plymouth gen burnt up
Thanks
Why GM’s alternator, not Ford’s?
The GM ones are dirt cheap
Someone needs to make a 6 volt alternator that looks like the stock genorator , with out made in China parts in it .👍
These days- Good luck.
What a great video! Such a shame that virtually all parts we can find now come from China. Not knocking Chinese people or the food but the government and the lesser quality….😉
You don't need to be all politically correct here or with me! We all know what you mean, and we get it. I just wish I still had all those made in USA parts for these, but they got used up years ago.
@@ModelA Yes sir; so unfortunate.
There's only one ultimate reason (regardless of how many other straw excuses are given) and it comes down to price. The Chinese can produce cheaper than anyone, mainly due to a) cheap labor rates and work conditions that no American would work for, and b) the gummint doesn't need to ask permission to build factories, highways, railways, other infrastructure to get the supply chain running. However, the only reason they succeed is because we all want the cheapest price possible, so you basically get what you pay for : ). It's not fortune - it's intentional