I was sort of waiting for you to give these a whirl :) After I used these pigments in a video a lot of people in the comments where referring to your homage to Vallejo Liquid Gold. I quietly thought.. well... this is pretty liquidly gold too. Now I can, with pleasure, reply to these comments "Vince likes the pigments as well". Thank you for the very in depth trial. /Alex
I hope you are happy Vince, you just made me buy MORE FRIKING PAINT! Not only that but I will now be mixing my own friking paint on top of that! I don't have time for that, I almost don't have time to actually paint! I hate this channel sometimes...
@@Himle_ I can't even remember ordering it. Just learned I was going to get them when the bank app notified me. My mind just cannot accept the fact that I keep buying more paints
@@JuanHidalgoMiniatures Ouch! Usually I do remember what I buy, but... Yepp, it has happened that i forget what I've ordered end up ordering another set... Sadly, this isn't a one time thing^^
@@Serpsor From my personal experience I'd also say t hat scale has better gold than vallejo. Also the latest "best metal" which is the mentioned Vallejo Metal Color is lacking in bronze and gold in my opinion. It has the best silver-ish tones, but I think only 1 gold and 1 copper styled and they both are not as good as the silvery ones.
@@MrStatistx sorry if this is long but I have a real bugbear about what colour paint companies sell as bronze. To be honest I doubt manufacturers have ever actually seen bronze they just say it's some sort of Sark brass (or sometimes red brown gold.) It comes in a huge variety of shades and I haven't seen a paint that looks like any of them (maybe ProAcryl is the least worst I have seen.) The best example of a mid tone bronze seems to be from bronze padlocks that are used in hazardous environments as they're spark proof and weather resistant they're a mid tone (yes I collect padlocks) but can be polished or aged, your own sample is better than any photo. Most people talk about bronze they always point at the very dark busts and statues where hot oils and waxes are used to put a weatherproof skin over the item. In India they still make wonderful bronze mirrors which looks almost silver when polished (extra tin percentage in the alloy) Vince's bronze with Vallejo metal colour silver and Fyreslayer Flesh is a pretty reasonable starting point, though I have taken to adding glazes of chestnut and black ink. I have been tending to a mix of bronze and light bronze (ProAcryl) and then start glazing it with fyreslayer flesh, chestnut and black ink depending on what I am after. The Badger metalsmith set gives a nice bronze but can be horribly glossy.
Just got some of the Vallejo metal air colors. Excited to try them. All though first thing I noticed is that it seems best to open the cap then plug hole with your thumb when shaking so you don't waste that bit that would come out if you leave cap on and shake.
@@VinceVenturella Ok, wow! That Vallejo Metal Air line is an absolute game changer! Brush and airbrush. With the brush it seriously feels like you are painting with molten version of whatever color.
The bronze is actually very true color to a higher quality modern bronze, like a bronze pump fine-grain-casing or a polished or machined after cast part. The problem is when people think bronze, they are usually think older bronze age stuff, aged maritime bronze, aged steam parts, etc. That tends to turn darker, more matte & dull, and take on some heavy mustard or olive tones. You could probably add a little ink or even regular paint to get the color and texture of bronze you are expecting to see. How do these hold up compared to vallejo's regular metallics? From what I can see, the metal pigments look more glossy and true.
Thanks for this. I've been using the Antique Gold and Bronze with the Master Medium and liked it but not quite blown away. Was thinking of trying some different mediums so will give the gloss varnish a go. I've already been using gloss varnish to thin my Contrast paints when tinting metals to retain the sheen so makes sense to use it here as well.
Thank you for such an amazing video. This company is for me, the best in the hobby scene. Young people who want to surprise the general public. They have only been in business for six years and their products have taken the shops by storm. They are attentive on social media and their tutorials are a lot of fun.
Thanks for the killer review, Vince. These are some PRO LEVEL tips. Using the Metal Varnish is gonna be key for the highest level of finish. I ended up buying a set of these immediately after seeing the 52 Miniatures video from like a month ago.
I get what you are saying about the bronze, because i would want it more different as well That said, the color they made matches a lot of old marine bronze very well. So historical painters will love it. Fyi bronze and brass are very very broad categories of metals. Some look more red copper color than yellow, some look almost silver, some are very yellow and polish to look like gold, and a lot end up a dingy dark greenish yellow. C260/2600, aka cartridge brass makes great costume gold when polished.
Been having so much fun with these! really lets you be creative and run with it, anything from mixing em in with transparent paints for amazing colored metallics to rubbing them dry ontop of a "regular" metallic paint with q-tip to add amazing luster to the base color. One of my favorite uses so far have been mixing those into an oil paint medium like liquin or gel medium for a crazy good metallic paint and a very long open time to play around with. Really fun product and really goes to show how crappy the pigment is in some of the regular metallic paints
Have you tried mixing additional colors in to shift the shades? For example, adding a greenish tone to the bronze to make it more realistically bronze? I'm curious whether that ruins the metal effect, or if that's an option for tweaking the colors.
We have some bronze statues in town, one of them was so oxidised the green had stained the sandstone / limestone plinth. The city council painted the statue black, but left the stone a sickly green.
I love these I ordered some. 52 miniature did a review on them as well in his metallics video. I agree that the bronze is not bronze though it reminds me more of a brass look but from what I used of them they work really well. Would have probably worked well on sigvald
If you like these you might want to try out the metal polishing powders by Ushi van der Rosten. Fantastic steel/ chrome and iron pigments. A technique used in scale modeling is Priming gloss black and using a fine sponge tipped makeup brush to rub the metal pigments onto the surface.
Oh wow. This is incredible! Looks like Vallejo liquid gold...but can be acrylic! I feel like I've got to pick these up and premix some into dropper bottles to avoid the dust hand issue. Custodes styled after the older art have been my holy grail of hobbying but I've never been satisfied with my golds...perhaps these are the key!
Just got mine in the other day. So pumped to try these out. Only problem I had was someone obviously missed when putting the copper in in the pot before sealing it and it was covered in dust now one of my hobby tables is lightly dusted with copper. Hahaha
With only isopropanol there would be no binder. If you get it to stick that would probably be because the alcohol would disolve some of the stuff you are painting on - or it is just sitting there waiting to be blown off, or you are not using pure isopropanol but a mixture containing a binder. The ususal binders are: - acrylate emulsion (acrylic paint) - oil (such as lineseed oil [but lot of oils work] oil paint) - gum arabic (water color) enamel paints is a term that is used for very different kinds of stuff including multiple oils and resins
With these pigments, alcohol alone can do a good job of setting them. It's much the same as Vallejo Liquid Gold, which only has alcohol and the pigments. - acrylicosvallejo.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/SDS-Liquid-Gold-Old-Gold-2019.pdf Section 3 for components.
@@VinceVenturella The Vallejo liquid metals have resins (tells "synthetic resin" on the pots themselves) as binder which is disolved in alcohol. Alcohol itself evaporates and does nothing as a binder.
It's got my attention. My GO-TO for metal is VMC Aluminum and then stain it to get golds and other tones. But the largest problem with the otherwise perfect paint is that it flicks. Man I need to post a video on that. But anyways, no matter how careful one is with the VMC the paint is so metallic that any little thin splatter of paint will of course be very visible. My painting desk glitters in the light where I tend to paint because this stuff seems to have low surface tension as well and as such it makes little splatters when used. So I often have to go back and repaint areas to cover over little tiny, but bright, flecks of paint.
A head to head comparison with Liquid Gold would be sooo helpful, I don't think messing with alcohol is any less annoying than messing with powders and since I guess many people (including myself) bought Liquid Gold before on your recommendation, it would be very nice to know if these are actually better.
You certainly could, I don't think it would be any issue. I don't think I will, as I like mixing them in lots of different ways, with lots of different things, so it behooves me to mix it each time.
Vince did you try these through an airbrush? I am waiting on my order to arrive. Simply looking at the video you made of these I fear they need to be a bit too thick for airbrush. Plus I think they would need several layers through an airbrush to be a rich as they lookk by hand.
Freshly cut bronze (polished, machined…etc.) is a fairly pale cold gold in colour. The patina takes quite a long time to build up and will take some of the lustre away. Might a glaze of burnt umber (or a wash if there’s texture to block the polishing) be a reasonable facsimile for that?
In the videos Green Stuff World demonstrates using the pigments straight out of the pot on minis primed black. They also have a black metallic pigment, I wonder how good that is.
Wow, these are cool. They look so metallic! I recently watched the Hobbit again, just because it was on TV. It was something to have on in the background while I painted some nurgle stuff. Anyways, when you first made them all liquidy, the first thing my mind went to was all the liquid gold that the dwarves tried to dump on Smaug. Man. More stuff I want to buy. Lol.
I have and use both, the pigments are about 5 ties as reflective. Goes on smooth and works great. The pigment can sometime get a little to bright. Take over the model but if used right it is hands down much more luster and shine then the metal color from Vallejo or any other brand. The only other color that come close is the Liquid gold line from Vallejo but that one is in alcohol and dries out quickly.
They cost 5,80 euro per pot if you order them directly from GSW. You get the same amount as the metal color range, but you will get so much more out of it and it costs less. Seems like a great deal. Would you recommend buying all for or leave the bronze out of it?
I would buy the bronze as well. I have come to like it a little more now that I have figured out to mix it 2-1 Bronze to copper. that is closer to the color I like.
I already saw it used on your latest demon on Instagram and now I want some of those. I bought the black one before, but their gold looked cartoony in their own promo video, but you made it work.
After you said the paint didn’t quite look like bronze, I realized that I wasn’t entirely sure what it’s supposed to look like. What I found was literally zero consistency in the color of bronze, even in actual rolls and ingots of raw bronze. The pictures range from a pale greenish gold to deep brown to almost copper-like, and aged bronze is practically black. So since I still don’t know what color bronze is supposed to be, GSW’s choice of color seems as good as any to me.
Another informative review of an intriguing product. Might be worth touching on safety issues because I can’t see how aluminium powder would be a good thing to inhale.
they look like they cover very nicely, but im a huge copper fan and that copper is too red. the bronze is ok, but the gold suffers from the same issue I feel the VMC suffers from and thats that its WAY too green. when dried, do the colors soften a bit or are they generally pretty true to tone wet vs dry? thanks for doing this video, Vince. it helps a lot to see reviews like this.
Thank you for the review! Great as always, can't wait to see the second part. Considering the quality of the result, and how difficult are they to apply/use, how would you compare this pigments to the alcohol based Liquid Gold range of Vallejo? I know you used to love them, but the different medium was the biggest drawback. After watching the video, these pigments seem to have similar pros and cons. And please, please keep reviewing GSW products. They have such an unique range of technical products that you can't find on other brands, and your reviews are always on point.
Hey Vince, love your stuff so far. I've tried out your gold recipe and its really helped with my first stormcast! I also want to try using brass, but vallejo metal color doesnt have brass. I was thinking of trying to mix some up myself with GSW metal pigments, but I'm a bit unsure about the ratios. As far as I understand Copper/bronze + gold= brass. Was wondering what rations would be best, I'm not oo sure what colours take priority. Thanks for any help!
I think you might be responsible for a pretty good run on the stock of these 😎😎😎. It's true that I haven't paid super close attention to how regularly they are in stock since they debuted... But now all of a sudden this week a lot of places had their full run snatched up, lol. I was going to get mine on Element and just a week ago they had them marked for 3/10 dispatch. Must have moved all of that stock already because they're all marked for 4/21 dispatch now (except Copper which their system says they have just 3 bottles of left in stock).
Hey Vince, great video! I bought antique gold few months ago and I found em amazing, and I'm looking fwd to test your trick with gloss varnish. But I have a question: you shown the GSW master medium: I bought a 17 mm too, and I was astonished: it's completely transparent! I spent months looking for fully transparent acrylic medium, from any brand even scientific materials suppliers, and I found none. And then in this little bottle you can find 100% clear acrylic medium, which is great for washes so to don't be fooled by hue change when dryed as usuallu happens with milky matt medium. So, at your knowledge there is anything else like this which may come in bigger bottle?
Yep, you can get the larger bottles, but honestly, I love GSW master medium, I use it all the time for the reason you said, I haven't found another I like as much.
@@VinceVenturella Me too. My research continues tho, especially on technic products for paintings restoration, which have several acrylic emulsion that could have specs useful for us and be way cheaper on quantity. Because you have experience of GSW products, have you ever tried their ultra matt varnish (MAXX MATT)?
Hey Vince! Your content is great as always, however I have a question (apologies for asking so long after the video came out): I’m encountering obstacles for getting the Vallejo Gloss Metal Varnish, however I already have their regular gloss varnish. What would you say is the differences in them for mixing with the pigments, from your experience?
@@VinceVenturella yeah he's still in the box and I kinda want to go all out for it. I was thinking the old gold or ancient looked better on the vid than the straight gold
I have a theory. GSW looked at the market and saw that the Vallejo metal color range was the best out there. They realized that their gold and copper where the weakest part of that range and focust on those colors when de designing the pure metal pigments. Then again, it could just be a coincidence...
Great review, direct to what matters to the community. Question: Would these work to shad off the shelf metallic paint ex.: add the copper pigment to a Gold or Silver paint to tone it reddish? Or even to non-metallic paints just to add a sheen to them?
Hi Vince, what would you think to use these highly shiny pigments only for highlining or very small surfaces as it could be more dificult to deal with shadowing recesses and shadow gradient. Thanks for all your videos, I've learned a lot from you.
You could, you could also mix them with more matte paints, and then build it up. I like to apply it to the whole area and then use inks and paints to bring it down and shade it.
Great video Vince, I was hoping we'd get a challenger to the gold/copper colors from Vallejo Metal Colors. My only concern, you didn't mention the smell of the Vallejo Metal Varnish. Oh man, does yours not smell like the end of the world? I airbrushed some onto some metal terrain pieces I painted and I had to air them out in the garage.
I use a spare brush for Liquid Gold that I use only for that purpose. Do I need to adopt a similar habit for these as well, or can I just use my "normal" sable brushes?
I've been experienting a bit trying to get a brass colour. One thing I found, is that flow improver, when added to the pigment+medium mix tends to break it apart and seperate the pigment. Have you run into this problem?
Hi Vince awesome video as always 🙂 wondering if you could do a product review on the flour pigments from the same line and compare them to your recommendation for the liquid version if you can😊 thanks for the information 🙂
I think I'll mix it everytime, just because I want to make sure I can mix it in the way I need, as you'll see on the video saturday detailing with ways to work with them, I like the versatility.
Awesome been looking for to your vid on these! When you do get some measurements and work out a good standard ratio will you be premixing up a few little dropper bottles to make them less of a hassle?
I thought about it, but in the end, I think i probably won't it's easier as I can just mix what I need and play with the other items, as I'll often want to integrate other stuff as you'll see on Saturday.
Could you mix a good portion of the Gold pigment into a jar of the Vallejo Liquid metal Gold which has great properties but is just to green? I know the liquid metals have a different sort of base so not sure if it would work or just split horribly.
Watched video. Alright, I'm feeling better about implusively buying them earlier now. The fact that I could have some real fun just mixing these should worry me... XD
That Metal Color Varnish, does it offer much advantage over regular Vallejo PU Gloss Varnish? I'm asking because I'm about to work up a SCE army in VMC Steel and Duraluminium..
Well, I never varnish the metals, so it's ironic, I bought this originally with my Vallejo Metal color to see if I liked it over the VMeC, I don't. But it's perfect for this. As for difference, it's a little more liquidy, but it seems to be mostly the same.
In the Greenstuffworld video they recommend using a matt black undercoat, which confused me because a glossy black undercoat should get you better results, right?
@@bennybarcellos6098 with a airbrush it's no worries, but I guess with a brush it doesn't stick well enough. Will get tested (by me) in the future for sure.
Thanks Vince. What clear coat can they be sealed with and how much does that alter the metallic luster? Can they then be handled without rubbing off easy when touching them? Tks!
Neat! One theoretical question comes to mind: does this mean metal paint makers could just give us more pigments in the paints and get us there directly, instead of having to mix these? (I recon you have more flexibility when you mix your things yourself, of course.)
Yes, yes it does, but it really means they could be grinding their metal pigments more, as the smaller pigment of higher quality material makes a better product, but most don't because it's expensive.
Great to see Larry back! Other people have asked some questions I have but I'd also love to know how you highlighted with them, I assume using Vallejo metal silver? Did you mix or just layer? Or maybe I should just wait for the hobby cheating :)
A question please: If you slather this around the base or the minie, does it does fade away with handling I assume? Also can you seal it without loosing the shine/tone?
Vince, how do these influence your go to choice "vallejo metal colors". No longer the alpha and omega of metals or are the GSW mainly for gold while Vallejo metal color still supreme for other metals?
I use these over the Vallejo Metal Color gold/copper, but here is the real scoop - I sometimes use both!! I use my traditional mix of Vallejo Metal Color, then put in a small amount of GSW pigment. :)
Does the fact that it is aluminum powder instead of mica have any health and safety implications? Can't imagine it's good to breathe that stuff, given the association with aluminum dust and dementia. Also, would it be simpler to just pre-mix bottles of it with metal varnish?
I mean, it's open for maybe 2 seconds before it's mixed into anything and it shouldn't be put in the air in any way. Most of the good metal paints use aluminum powder, so I don't see any issue. YOu certainly could pre-mix, I don't want to because I am always doing slightly different mixes with different things, but no reason you couldn't.
I don’t have a use for this, and now must place an order. Vince, put down the voodoo doll and pick up your paint brushes. And NO CHEATING! a brush in each hand and voodoo doll on the bench.
What I'm wondering is what golds fit for golden demon\crystal brush entries. I tried the vallejo liquid gold. they were perfect in terms of hue, but very difficult to highlight smoothly with. and these look also perfect. but limited. can I mix em right with darker hues like acrylic brown metal? thought of giving up true metal but to be honest I want to stay in true metal territory
I mean, really any can work, because it's more about the finish and the extra shading and elements added to them. The glazes and paints you put over the top. Many are done with poor quality Citadel metallics, but you wouldn't know because of all the extra layers.
Thanks for this Vince - I know this is a late comment, but the video is much appreciated! Can’t wait to try them out on my new Stormcast. Do you think with less medium they’d be appropriate for drybrushing, or is that just a waste of them? I’m thinking that the really bright sheen could help that really pop, but maybe it’s just a waste. No worries if you don’t answer - as I said, I appreciate I’m very late to the party!
Amazing product,my go to gold since i got it.Would you pre thin a batch of it (let’s say 10 ml)and store it in a dropper bottle? And as an additional info,would you mix it with inks to get different colors?
I have some Pearl-Ex powders that came in the Jazza art box set, was wondering what I could do with them. Seems like those might be usable in much the same way?
Thanks for the review; I didn't even know about these! Are there any special considerations when working on top of these like we would over other traditional TMM paints? And as asked elsewhere, how do they stack up against your tried and true Vallejo Metal Color? If not for the color then just for behavior/quality overall. They surely seem a good stand-in for the somewhat lacking "non-silver" paints in that range, but I'm not sure I would replace the Scale colors in my collection with them.
I will say that I am using them instead of vallejo metal color for golds, The only special consideration is that they are very, very smooth in the finish, so it can be hard for something like pure inks to stick.
@@VinceVenturella as an update to this question, did you ever figure out a more exact ratio of varnish to pigment with your measuring tools, and have your tried "pre-mixing" these in large batches and storing them in say spare dropper bottles? Thanks in advance!
Maybe Lahmia Medium would be better, contrast might cause some strange effects as it's made to shrink away from flat surfaces, but i've never tried it, could be worth a go. :)
I'm going to have to buy some of these, they look like a great way to add vibrancy and variation to metallic paints. Is there a silver pigment that you would recommend to use alongside these?
Hi Vince! You mentioned you have a recipe for thinning airbrush paints, I'm guessing a ratio between thinner and flow improver, can you share the link of the video please?
Well, the trick would be they don't have a silver pigment unfortunately, so that would be a challenge, you could always use vallejo metal colors (I have lots of videos on those as well) or Vallejo Liquid Silver.
Once the employee of my local gw tried to convince me that retributor armour was made with actual gold; and that was why it cost more lol.
Quality (and obviously very wrong). :)
I was sort of waiting for you to give these a whirl :) After I used these pigments in a video a lot of people in the comments where referring to your homage to Vallejo Liquid Gold. I quietly thought.. well... this is pretty liquidly gold too. Now I can, with pleasure, reply to these comments "Vince likes the pigments as well". Thank you for the very in depth trial. /Alex
Awesome, always happy to help sir. :)
haha ya i saw you use the gold and it looked really great !
I hope you are happy Vince, you just made me buy MORE FRIKING PAINT!
Not only that but I will now be mixing my own friking paint on top of that! I don't have time for that, I almost don't have time to actually paint!
I hate this channel sometimes...
You hate it, but you also love it...
@@MrSJPowell it's complicated
My sentiment exactly.
Don't need more paint, WANT more paint, don't need more paint, paint ordered...
@@Himle_ I can't even remember ordering it. Just learned I was going to get them when the bank app notified me.
My mind just cannot accept the fact that I keep buying more paints
@@JuanHidalgoMiniatures Ouch!
Usually I do remember what I buy, but... Yepp, it has happened that i forget what I've ordered end up ordering another set...
Sadly, this isn't a one time thing^^
Good ol' Larry. He deserves as many gold stars as you can give him!
He's always there for us, the hero we need.
would have loved to hear a little bit of a comparison with metal color range seeing you often call them the best metal paint by far.
also with the scale76 metal / alchemy line, which looks like it has a nicer gold than vallejo
@@Serpsor in the past, Vince has recommended mixing the Vallejo Metal Colour gold with the copper to get a more neutral gold tone.
@@Serpsor From my personal experience I'd also say t hat scale has better gold than vallejo.
Also the latest "best metal" which is the mentioned Vallejo Metal Color is lacking in bronze and gold in my opinion. It has the best silver-ish tones, but I think only 1 gold and 1 copper styled and they both are not as good as the silvery ones.
@@MrStatistx sorry if this is long but I have a real bugbear about what colour paint companies sell as bronze.
To be honest I doubt manufacturers have ever actually seen bronze they just say it's some sort of Sark brass (or sometimes red brown gold.)
It comes in a huge variety of shades and I haven't seen a paint that looks like any of them (maybe ProAcryl is the least worst I have seen.)
The best example of a mid tone bronze seems to be from bronze padlocks that are used in hazardous environments as they're spark proof and weather resistant they're a mid tone (yes I collect padlocks) but can be polished or aged, your own sample is better than any photo.
Most people talk about bronze they always point at the very dark busts and statues where hot oils and waxes are used to put a weatherproof skin over the item.
In India they still make wonderful bronze mirrors which looks almost silver when polished (extra tin percentage in the alloy)
Vince's bronze with Vallejo metal colour silver and Fyreslayer Flesh is a pretty reasonable starting point, though I have taken to adding glazes of chestnut and black ink.
I have been tending to a mix of bronze and light bronze (ProAcryl) and then start glazing it with fyreslayer flesh, chestnut and black ink depending on what I am after.
The Badger metalsmith set gives a nice bronze but can be horribly glossy.
@@RobCrawford23 Just do it like me and inherit colorblindness from one of your parents and subtle differences are no issue anymore ^^
Just got some of the Vallejo metal air colors. Excited to try them. All though first thing I noticed is that it seems best to open the cap then plug hole with your thumb when shaking so you don't waste that bit that would come out if you leave cap on and shake.
Good call!
@@VinceVenturella Ok, wow! That Vallejo Metal Air line is an absolute game changer! Brush and airbrush. With the brush it seriously feels like you are painting with molten version of whatever color.
The bronze is actually very true color to a higher quality modern bronze, like a bronze pump fine-grain-casing or a polished or machined after cast part.
The problem is when people think bronze, they are usually think older bronze age stuff, aged maritime bronze, aged steam parts, etc. That tends to turn darker, more matte & dull, and take on some heavy mustard or olive tones. You could probably add a little ink or even regular paint to get the color and texture of bronze you are expecting to see.
How do these hold up compared to vallejo's regular metallics? From what I can see, the metal pigments look more glossy and true.
That's a very fair point.
Thanks for this. I've been using the Antique Gold and Bronze with the Master Medium and liked it but not quite blown away. Was thinking of trying some different mediums so will give the gloss varnish a go. I've already been using gloss varnish to thin my Contrast paints when tinting metals to retain the sheen so makes sense to use it here as well.
Yeah, the metal varnish is really a key. :)
Thank you for such an amazing video. This company is for me, the best in the hobby scene. Young people who want to surprise the general public. They have only been in business for six years and their products have taken the shops by storm. They are attentive on social media and their tutorials are a lot of fun.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thanks for the killer review, Vince. These are some PRO LEVEL tips. Using the Metal Varnish is gonna be key for the highest level of finish. I ended up buying a set of these immediately after seeing the 52 Miniatures video from like a month ago.
Excellent, happy to help. :)
I get what you are saying about the bronze, because i would want it more different as well
That said, the color they made matches a lot of old marine bronze very well. So historical painters will love it.
Fyi bronze and brass are very very broad categories of metals. Some look more red copper color than yellow, some look almost silver, some are very yellow and polish to look like gold, and a lot end up a dingy dark greenish yellow.
C260/2600, aka cartridge brass makes great costume gold when polished.
Been having so much fun with these! really lets you be creative and run with it, anything from mixing em in with transparent paints for amazing colored metallics to rubbing them dry ontop of a "regular" metallic paint with q-tip to add amazing luster to the base color.
One of my favorite uses so far have been mixing those into an oil paint medium like liquin or gel medium for a crazy good metallic paint and a very long open time to play around with.
Really fun product and really goes to show how crappy the pigment is in some of the regular metallic paints
Absolutely, I haven't tried the oil trick yet, but I want to do that for sure.
Have you tried mixing additional colors in to shift the shades? For example, adding a greenish tone to the bronze to make it more realistically bronze? I'm curious whether that ruins the metal effect, or if that's an option for tweaking the colors.
Yes, I have mixed in paints as well, it works great. You will see some of that in action in the second video coming saturday.
Saturday will be the literal best of all days! Wait, wrong channel...
I too would appreciate any suggestions on how to make the bronze more bronze, I ordered these last week and I have some Astartes Minotaurs to paint.
@@mattdillingham7668 So for Bronze, I have gone to a 2-1 Bronze to Copper ratio and I am enjoying that a lot.
We have some bronze statues in town, one of them was so oxidised the green had stained the sandstone / limestone plinth. The city council painted the statue black, but left the stone a sickly green.
Just got the set. I am surprised that they do not have a couple of silver/chromes.
I love these I ordered some. 52 miniature did a review on them as well in his metallics video. I agree that the bronze is not bronze though it reminds me more of a brass look but from what I used of them they work really well. Would have probably worked well on sigvald
Yeah, they are really fun to work with and the finish is great.
Vincent: “just get out the little bit you need”
Also Vincent: *keeps his weathering pigments on a palette*
Fair point.
If you like these you might want to try out the metal polishing powders by Ushi van der Rosten. Fantastic steel/ chrome and iron pigments.
A technique used in scale modeling is Priming gloss black and using a fine sponge tipped makeup brush to rub the metal pigments onto the surface.
I'll have to take a look at those, sounds interesting.
One of my first thoughts was, "Ooh, Larry is getting some bling!"
Never enough bling for Larry.
Oh wow. This is incredible! Looks like Vallejo liquid gold...but can be acrylic! I feel like I've got to pick these up and premix some into dropper bottles to avoid the dust hand issue. Custodes styled after the older art have been my holy grail of hobbying but I've never been satisfied with my golds...perhaps these are the key!
They are really fun and you are right, the shine and finish is really very much the vallejo liquid gold.
Very helpful, thanks. I was on the fence and you helped me decide.
Glad I could help
In this episode of Product Review Larry the Ogre becomes baller when he gets blinged out with a Gold boot and semi matching belt.
Indeed, Larry is always hunting for the bling. :)
Just got mine in the other day. So pumped to try these out.
Only problem I had was someone obviously missed when putting the copper in in the pot before sealing it and it was covered in dust now one of my hobby tables is lightly dusted with copper. Hahaha
Ouch!
And here I just picked up some of the alcohol based liquid golds. These look to offer similar results while being far easier to work with.
Yep, pretty much. :)
With only isopropanol there would be no binder. If you get it to stick that would probably be because the alcohol would disolve some of the stuff you are painting on - or it is just sitting there waiting to be blown off, or you are not using pure isopropanol but a mixture containing a binder. The ususal binders are:
- acrylate emulsion (acrylic paint)
- oil (such as lineseed oil [but lot of oils work] oil paint)
- gum arabic (water color)
enamel paints is a term that is used for very different kinds of stuff including multiple oils and resins
With these pigments, alcohol alone can do a good job of setting them. It's much the same as Vallejo Liquid Gold, which only has alcohol and the pigments. - acrylicosvallejo.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/SDS-Liquid-Gold-Old-Gold-2019.pdf
Section 3 for components.
@@VinceVenturella The Vallejo liquid metals have resins (tells "synthetic resin" on the pots themselves) as binder which is disolved in alcohol. Alcohol itself evaporates and does nothing as a binder.
It's got my attention. My GO-TO for metal is VMC Aluminum and then stain it to get golds and other tones. But the largest problem with the otherwise perfect paint is that it flicks. Man I need to post a video on that. But anyways, no matter how careful one is with the VMC the paint is so metallic that any little thin splatter of paint will of course be very visible. My painting desk glitters in the light where I tend to paint because this stuff seems to have low surface tension as well and as such it makes little splatters when used. So I often have to go back and repaint areas to cover over little tiny, but bright, flecks of paint.
Yeah, you have to wick it on a paper towel first and get all that excess liquid out, then move the brush slowly, helps to avoid the flick.
A head to head comparison with Liquid Gold would be sooo helpful, I don't think messing with alcohol is any less annoying than messing with powders and since I guess many people (including myself) bought Liquid Gold before on your recommendation, it would be very nice to know if these are actually better.
I am going to do a full metal comparison video soon.
That antique gold looks so good. Making me want to re do the trim on my nightlords. I dunno why alot of golds are so green.
Could you pre-mix them in a dropper bottle?
Was going to ask the same thing. Seems like a big timesaver.
You certainly could, I don't think it would be any issue. I don't think I will, as I like mixing them in lots of different ways, with lots of different things, so it behooves me to mix it each time.
The bronze is close to modern machining bronze. Very close to 954 aluminum bronze in color after buffing.
Vince did you try these through an airbrush? I am waiting on my order to arrive. Simply looking at the video you made of these I fear they need to be a bit too thick for airbrush. Plus I think they would need several layers through an airbrush to be a rich as they lookk by hand.
Yep, I've used them through an airbrush, works just fine, use a little more flow improver, but no issue.
Freshly cut bronze (polished, machined…etc.) is a fairly pale cold gold in colour. The patina takes quite a long time to build up and will take some of the lustre away. Might a glaze of burnt umber (or a wash if there’s texture to block the polishing) be a reasonable facsimile for that?
Yes, some soft brown ink can achieve that for sure.
Can I dry brush them?( I mean after mixing)
Yep!
Thanks Vince, I have been trying to figure out how to make these work well.
Happy to help!
In the videos Green Stuff World demonstrates using the pigments straight out of the pot on minis primed black. They also have a black metallic pigment, I wonder how good that is.
I haven't tried the black metallic pigment yet.
Next on Vince's channel: how to directly apply gold foil to your miniatures :P
(love it, thanks for checking them out!)
It's only a matter of time.
Wow, these are cool. They look so metallic! I recently watched the Hobbit again, just because it was on TV. It was something to have on in the background while I painted some nurgle stuff. Anyways, when you first made them all liquidy, the first thing my mind went to was all the liquid gold that the dwarves tried to dump on Smaug. Man. More stuff I want to buy. Lol.
It really does look like that liquid gold.
How would you compare these to the Vallejo metal colors for a finished product?
I have and use both, the pigments are about 5 ties as reflective. Goes on smooth and works great. The pigment can sometime get a little to bright. Take over the model but if used right it is hands down much more luster and shine then the metal color from Vallejo or any other brand. The only other color that come close is the Liquid gold line from Vallejo but that one is in alcohol and dries out quickly.
Yeah, they are both good, but I will say that this has become my go to for gold and copper.
Well, metal colour doesnt have good yellow line, so no wonder. Even scale metalic golds are considered better
They cost 5,80 euro per pot if you order them directly from GSW. You get the same amount as the metal color range, but you will get so much more out of it and it costs less. Seems like a great deal. Would you recommend buying all for or leave the bronze out of it?
I would buy the bronze as well. I have come to like it a little more now that I have figured out to mix it 2-1 Bronze to copper. that is closer to the color I like.
I already saw it used on your latest demon on Instagram and now I want some of those. I bought the black one before, but their gold looked cartoony in their own promo video, but you made it work.
Yep, the key is that shading and highlighting. :)
After you said the paint didn’t quite look like bronze, I realized that I wasn’t entirely sure what it’s supposed to look like. What I found was literally zero consistency in the color of bronze, even in actual rolls and ingots of raw bronze. The pictures range from a pale greenish gold to deep brown to almost copper-like, and aged bronze is practically black. So since I still don’t know what color bronze is supposed to be, GSW’s choice of color seems as good as any to me.
That's fair, I like mine slightly more brown I guess. :)
@@VinceVenturella lol yeah thats totally fair and i think i agree
Well, I am no longer in any doubt as to which product I should buy. I love this brand!
I am really enjoying them.
Informative! Thanks. Looking forward to the follow-up. I'd like to see how they take shades
Well, this Saturday you will see. :)
Another informative review of an intriguing product. Might be worth touching on safety issues because I can’t see how aluminium powder would be a good thing to inhale.
Oh, I would definitely not breathe it in, but it's only open for a second or two.
they look like they cover very nicely, but im a huge copper fan and that copper is too red. the bronze is ok, but the gold suffers from the same issue I feel the VMC suffers from and thats that its WAY too green. when dried, do the colors soften a bit or are they generally pretty true to tone wet vs dry? thanks for doing this video, Vince. it helps a lot to see reviews like this.
They actually soften some for sure, that being said, I have been mixing some of the bronze and copper pigment in a 2-1 and I really enjoy that.
Can they be used with and airbrush or you ruin the airbrush?
You can put them through the airbrush.
@@VinceVenturella mmm that said.. I think I'm not gonna try. 😅
Thanks a lot for this! How do they behave with inks added alongside the metal varnish?
They are great, I will show some of that on Saturday in the hobby cheating video.
@@VinceVenturella looking forward to it!
Tell you what... a matte varnish on the gold looks like a pretty convincing brass. Not bronze, but related, I guess.
INteresting, I adn't thought about that, I'll experiment.
started with GE metallics then graduated to Scale 75 metallics then to Vallejo Metal Color and now I need to get thses! D'oh!
The journey never ends.
@@VinceVenturella neither does spending money on what we love
Superbly helpful review. Many thanks for uploading this.
Glad it was helpful!
Thank you for the review! Great as always, can't wait to see the second part.
Considering the quality of the result, and how difficult are they to apply/use, how would you compare this pigments to the alcohol based Liquid Gold range of Vallejo? I know you used to love them, but the different medium was the biggest drawback. After watching the video, these pigments seem to have similar pros and cons.
And please, please keep reviewing GSW products. They have such an unique range of technical products that you can't find on other brands, and your reviews are always on point.
Yeah, there is a lot to review. :)
Hey Vince, love your stuff so far. I've tried out your gold recipe and its really helped with my first stormcast! I also want to try using brass, but vallejo metal color doesnt have brass. I was thinking of trying to mix some up myself with GSW metal pigments, but I'm a bit unsure about the ratios. As far as I understand Copper/bronze + gold= brass. Was wondering what rations would be best, I'm not oo sure what colours take priority. Thanks for any help!
I'm not sure, I've messed around with different ratios to get the effect, my best advice is play with it and find one that hits the tone you like.
Thanks for the review.interesting product.
Now Larry is up for a good time on the dancefloor.
I think so too
I think you might be responsible for a pretty good run on the stock of these 😎😎😎. It's true that I haven't paid super close attention to how regularly they are in stock since they debuted... But now all of a sudden this week a lot of places had their full run snatched up, lol. I was going to get mine on Element and just a week ago they had them marked for 3/10 dispatch. Must have moved all of that stock already because they're all marked for 4/21 dispatch now (except Copper which their system says they have just 3 bottles of left in stock).
That's funny, well, they are very amazing, that's for sure.
Hey Vince, great video! I bought antique gold few months ago and I found em amazing, and I'm looking fwd to test your trick with gloss varnish. But I have a question: you shown the GSW master medium: I bought a 17 mm too, and I was astonished: it's completely transparent! I spent months looking for fully transparent acrylic medium, from any brand even scientific materials suppliers, and I found none. And then in this little bottle you can find 100% clear acrylic medium, which is great for washes so to don't be fooled by hue change when dryed as usuallu happens with milky matt medium. So, at your knowledge there is anything else like this which may come in bigger bottle?
You can also buy the GSW Master Medium in a 60ml bottle.
Yep, you can get the larger bottles, but honestly, I love GSW master medium, I use it all the time for the reason you said, I haven't found another I like as much.
@@VinceVenturella Me too. My research continues tho, especially on technic products for paintings restoration, which have several acrylic emulsion that could have specs useful for us and be way cheaper on quantity. Because you have experience of GSW products, have you ever tried their ultra matt varnish (MAXX MATT)?
Hey Vince! Your content is great as always, however I have a question (apologies for asking so long after the video came out):
I’m encountering obstacles for getting the Vallejo Gloss Metal Varnish, however I already have their regular gloss varnish. What would you say is the differences in them for mixing with the pigments, from your experience?
The regular gloss varinish is fine. :)
Vince thank you so much, this is exactly what i am looking for.
Glad it was helpful!
I have the Sanguineous mini to paint..I might have to get some of these for his armor
If you've got a lot of gold, this is the way to go. :)
@@VinceVenturella yeah he's still in the box and I kinda want to go all out for it. I was thinking the old gold or ancient looked better on the vid than the straight gold
I have a theory. GSW looked at the market and saw that the Vallejo metal color range was the best out there. They realized that their gold and copper where the weakest part of that range and focust on those colors when de designing the pure metal pigments.
Then again, it could just be a coincidence...
GSW had a bit of a beef with Vallejo over the Shifters paints, so they're serious rivals.
Could be, but this definitely goes against the weak part of that line.
Great stuff! Can't wait until Saturday.
Happy to help. :)
Great review, direct to what matters to the community.
Question: Would these work to shad off the shelf metallic paint ex.: add the copper pigment to a Gold or Silver paint to tone it reddish? Or even to non-metallic paints just to add a sheen to them?
I didn't try that, I think most would give a challenge because they are so gel like, but they mix with Vallejo Metal Color without issue.
The natural question is... would you ever use Liquid Gold again after using these?
Honestly, no.
Hi Vince, what would you think to use these highly shiny pigments only for highlining or very small surfaces as it could be more dificult to deal with shadowing recesses and shadow gradient. Thanks for all your videos, I've learned a lot from you.
You could, you could also mix them with more matte paints, and then build it up. I like to apply it to the whole area and then use inks and paints to bring it down and shade it.
Great video as always. Will order these for sure. Could you do a tutorial on how to clean the palettes afterwards? :)
Just don't would be my answer. ;)
Great video Vince, I was hoping we'd get a challenger to the gold/copper colors from Vallejo Metal Colors. My only concern, you didn't mention the smell of the Vallejo Metal Varnish. Oh man, does yours not smell like the end of the world? I airbrushed some onto some metal terrain pieces I painted and I had to air them out in the garage.
I have basically no sense of smell, so I didn't notice anything.
Have you ever tried putting the pigment itself on a high gloss black surface
Never tried that kind of a direct application
@@VinceVenturella you should, you quite often get more of a pure polished metal or chrome effect
I use a spare brush for Liquid Gold that I use only for that purpose. Do I need to adopt a similar habit for these as well, or can I just use my "normal" sable brushes?
I would definitely have a spearate brush for this.
I've been experienting a bit trying to get a brass colour. One thing I found, is that flow improver, when added to the pigment+medium mix tends to break it apart and seperate the pigment. Have you run into this problem?
Yes, you have to stir often.
Hi Vince awesome video as always 🙂 wondering if you could do a product review on the flour pigments from the same line and compare them to your recommendation for the liquid version if you can😊 thanks for the information 🙂
I definitely want to try those eventually, they are on the list.
Hi Vince! Would you have any concerns about mixing and storing a batch in a dropper bottle, or is it better to mix it every time?
I think I'll mix it everytime, just because I want to make sure I can mix it in the way I need, as you'll see on the video saturday detailing with ways to work with them, I like the versatility.
This seems like the obvious play. I was thinking who would ever bother with this product with the extra fuck around just to paint. Premix a batch.
I need a metals comparison video! Vallejo Metal Colour, AK metals, these, and liquid gold :D
Coming soon! :)
@@VinceVenturella YAY!
Awesome been looking for to your vid on these! When you do get some measurements and work out a good standard ratio will you be premixing up a few little dropper bottles to make them less of a hassle?
I thought about it, but in the end, I think i probably won't it's easier as I can just mix what I need and play with the other items, as I'll often want to integrate other stuff as you'll see on Saturday.
I'm wondering how GSW Metallic paints compare with Metal Color, Liquid Metal, etc. I see GSW metallic paints are also named Metal Color
I'm going to do a full comparison video in the coming months.
Also, have you come up with a mix for making a true bronze that you like from these pigments (and possibly other paints mixed in)?
For bronze, it's largely been just using this pigment directly, I still don't have the perfect bronze. It's good, but not perfect.
Do you think these are worth the investment for ppl who already own the Vallejo Liquid Metal Colors ? Which of the 2 do you prefer ?
I honestly prefer this over the liquid gold, as I find this easier to work with.
Have you considered mixing these pigments with Airbrush thinner, or flow improver, or will it need a medium/varnish to carry it?
You absolutely can, you want to mix it all together if you are mixing it for the airbrush.
Could you mix a good portion of the Gold pigment into a jar of the Vallejo Liquid metal Gold which has great properties but is just to green? I know the liquid metals have a different sort of base so not sure if it would work or just split horribly.
Yes indeed, in fact, check out this video here - th-cam.com/video/26_1W7zR-cA/w-d-xo.html
Too late vince, I’ve already ordered all of them! I am going to watch the review now. XD
Watched video. Alright, I'm feeling better about implusively buying them earlier now. The fact that I could have some real fun just mixing these should worry me... XD
You have made a good choice. :)
@@VinceVenturella Parcel cleared by customs.
(Return to sender)
GAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! It was so close! XD
That Metal Color Varnish, does it offer much advantage over regular Vallejo PU Gloss Varnish? I'm asking because I'm about to work up a SCE army in VMC Steel and Duraluminium..
Well, I never varnish the metals, so it's ironic, I bought this originally with my Vallejo Metal color to see if I liked it over the VMeC, I don't. But it's perfect for this. As for difference, it's a little more liquidy, but it seems to be mostly the same.
@@VinceVenturella thanks for the advice, looking forward to the next one
In the Greenstuffworld video they recommend using a matt black undercoat, which confused me because a glossy black undercoat should get you better results, right?
Only try to brush paint gloss metallic paint over a gloss surface if you hate yourself and want to suffer.
@@bennybarcellos6098 with a airbrush it's no worries, but I guess with a brush it doesn't stick well enough. Will get tested (by me) in the future for sure.
I will say, with this mix, I really haven't noticed much of a difference on the undercoat.
Would adding some of the copper into the bronze to improve the color?
Yep, that's actually what I've been doing. Mixing 2-1 Bronze to Copper and I really like it.
Thanks Vince. What clear coat can they be sealed with and how much does that alter the metallic luster? Can they then be handled without rubbing off easy when touching them? Tks!
I don't varnish them. As they are being mixed with Varnish here, they are quite tough, so it shouldn't be needed.
Neat! One theoretical question comes to mind: does this mean metal paint makers could just give us more pigments in the paints and get us there directly, instead of having to mix these? (I recon you have more flexibility when you mix your things yourself, of course.)
Yes, yes it does, but it really means they could be grinding their metal pigments more, as the smaller pigment of higher quality material makes a better product, but most don't because it's expensive.
Great to see Larry back! Other people have asked some questions I have but I'd also love to know how you highlighted with them, I assume using Vallejo metal silver? Did you mix or just layer? Or maybe I should just wait for the hobby cheating :)
Yep, vallejo metal color silver, but you'll see it in play on Saturday with the hobby cheating video featuring these.
A question please: If you slather this around the base or the minie, does it does fade away with handling I assume? Also can you seal it without loosing the shine/tone?
It doesn’t really fade, but if you handle it a bunch you will leave finger prints on it of course. I don’t ever varnish it.
Vince, how do these influence your go to choice "vallejo metal colors". No longer the alpha and omega of metals or are the GSW mainly for gold while Vallejo metal color still supreme for other metals?
I use these over the Vallejo Metal Color gold/copper, but here is the real scoop - I sometimes use both!! I use my traditional mix of Vallejo Metal Color, then put in a small amount of GSW pigment. :)
@@VinceVenturella Sounds like another video in the making :) Thanks for the info. Love your channel. cheers !
That video was pure gold!
bu-dum-tiss! :)
Does the fact that it is aluminum powder instead of mica have any health and safety implications? Can't imagine it's good to breathe that stuff, given the association with aluminum dust and dementia.
Also, would it be simpler to just pre-mix bottles of it with metal varnish?
I mean, it's open for maybe 2 seconds before it's mixed into anything and it shouldn't be put in the air in any way. Most of the good metal paints use aluminum powder, so I don't see any issue. YOu certainly could pre-mix, I don't want to because I am always doing slightly different mixes with different things, but no reason you couldn't.
I don’t have a use for this, and now must place an order. Vince, put down the voodoo doll and pick up your paint brushes. And NO CHEATING! a brush in each hand and voodoo doll on the bench.
I'll get to it. :)
Vince, do you see any reasons to not pre-mix the pigment and varnish in an empty dropper bottle?
You certainly can, but I like to be able to mix as you can get slightly different tones.
What I'm wondering is what golds fit for golden demon\crystal brush entries. I tried the vallejo liquid gold. they were perfect in terms of hue, but very difficult to highlight smoothly with. and these look also perfect. but limited. can I mix em right with darker hues like acrylic brown metal? thought of giving up true metal but to be honest I want to stay in true metal territory
I mean, really any can work, because it's more about the finish and the extra shading and elements added to them. The glazes and paints you put over the top. Many are done with poor quality Citadel metallics, but you wouldn't know because of all the extra layers.
Might need to get the Copper out of this line at least. Kind of wish they had some silver/steel/grey tones in the range.
Yeah, the Copper and Antique Gold stand out to me.
Thanks for this Vince - I know this is a late comment, but the video is much appreciated! Can’t wait to try them out on my new Stormcast. Do you think with less medium they’d be appropriate for drybrushing, or is that just a waste of them? I’m thinking that the really bright sheen could help that really pop, but maybe it’s just a waste. No worries if you don’t answer - as I said, I appreciate I’m very late to the party!
No worries, and yeah, you could mix just slightly thicker and then they would be awesome for dry brushing.
@@VinceVenturella thank you very much. Looking forward to giving it a go!
Amazing product,my go to gold since i got it.Would you pre thin a batch of it (let’s say 10 ml)and store it in a dropper bottle? And as an additional info,would you mix it with inks to get different colors?
I thought about that, but in the end, I just like mixing it because of all the different ways I can mix it.
I have some Pearl-Ex powders that came in the Jazza art box set, was wondering what I could do with them. Seems like those might be usable in much the same way?
Should certainly be doable, I would note those are much larger pigments, so you will have more of a glitter effect.
Thanks for the review; I didn't even know about these!
Are there any special considerations when working on top of these like we would over other traditional TMM paints?
And as asked elsewhere, how do they stack up against your tried and true Vallejo Metal Color? If not for the color then just for behavior/quality overall. They surely seem a good stand-in for the somewhat lacking "non-silver" paints in that range, but I'm not sure I would replace the Scale colors in my collection with them.
I will say that I am using them instead of vallejo metal color for golds, The only special consideration is that they are very, very smooth in the finish, so it can be hard for something like pure inks to stick.
@@VinceVenturella as an update to this question, did you ever figure out a more exact ratio of varnish to pigment with your measuring tools, and have your tried "pre-mixing" these in large batches and storing them in say spare dropper bottles? Thanks in advance!
Great video Vince, do you think they would also work with Citadel Contrast Medium?
Maybe Lahmia Medium would be better, contrast might cause some strange effects as it's made to shrink away from flat surfaces, but i've never tried it, could be worth a go. :)
I'm going to have to buy some of these, they look like a great way to add vibrancy and variation to metallic paints. Is there a silver pigment that you would recommend to use alongside these?
Sadly they don't have anything yet. But good old Vallejo Metal Color delivers on the steel.
Hi Vince! You mentioned you have a recipe for thinning airbrush paints, I'm guessing a ratio between thinner and flow improver, can you share the link of the video please?
80/20 Airbrush THinner to Flow IMprover.
@@VinceVenturella love you Vince! Thanks a lot!
Excelent video! Can i use this to paint grey knights, and so, what mix or steps do you suggest? Thanks!
Well, the trick would be they don't have a silver pigment unfortunately, so that would be a challenge, you could always use vallejo metal colors (I have lots of videos on those as well) or Vallejo Liquid Silver.
@@VinceVenturella Thanks!
How would you compare using pigment + Vallejo Metal Varnish versus Vallejo Liquid Gold?
You get basically the same end product, but I find the pigment much easier.