SUBARU RINGLAND FAILURE! Explained (Simple In-Depth)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 มิ.ย. 2018
- Talked about how and why ringland failure happens commonly in Subaru Engines. I did not cover too much about pre-ignition which is a huge problem of its own, but it also derives from too much heat. So keep things as cool as possible and air flowing freely to prevent such a tragic event of a subaru blowing up in your life! Subsribe ;)
Daily Instagram Stories and Posts -- @cameronalford
My Camera Equipment: a.co/6Ecd9UO
SAVE $40 on Airbnb: www.airbnb.com/c/camerona72
Music: epidemicsound.com - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
Hi buddy, great video 👍 just to let you know, I spoke to the director of the uk’s largest Subaru engine rebuilder/tuner. And I asked the question what was the causes of ringland failure (RF)? He said to forget about the myths about unequal length headers causing RF. There is no evidence to support that, as they have pistons 1,2,3&4 fail all the time. The causes are from low octane fuel and lugging your engine. Oil catch cans, again not really a must on stock cars as blow bye is minimal. Tuned cars yes a must. Also the stock tune isn’t the best and pro tune is better as they are better tailored to your countries fuel and remove lean spots. Hope this helps 👍
The way i always seen it, downpipe, exhaust, intake, tuner, professional tune, and 93 octane will give u better performance and reliability
ScoobySTI Chris is it also
Safe to say the horror stories are from people going with OTS(off the shelf/canned tunes) with catless DPs / header swap and last but not
Least turned up boost & aggressive driving on these improper tunes? I’ve been eyeing an STI trade my ‘15 mustang gt. But from all
The videos I’ve watched the following has been learned:
1. If you’re not buying Cobbs complete package don’t use their OTS tune with your mashup set up.
2. Anything over stock boost needs a catch can
3. Catless DPs header swaps anything other than a catback get the damn car pro tuned or else!!!!
4. You gotta pay to play. These are not the car to try and mod
And cut corners on tuning.
End of the day most of
These failures are do to lack of or improper tuning? Correct?
Steve Buckler what about for right now being stock just using the OTS map from my accessport with no mods? And run that until I mod it later on? Would that be more reliable than just leaving the tube stock
ScoobySTI Chris unequal headers isn’t a myth, my local tuner shop says it CAN contribute to it on cylinders 2 and 4 due to heat build up. Why keep the heat high on those 2 cylinders with ricer UEL’s? If you’re going to spend the $ on headers do it right and switch to a EL setup, aftermarket UEL’s are a waste of $... you can advance timing more and get a little more power out of it...
Just now seeing your comment and I thank you for taking the time to post it.
More info from my experience:
Ringland failure happens when the compression ring gap closes from thermal expansion, causing the rings to buckle and crack. This will allow oil and combustion gases to move pass the rings, creating a high level of oil consumption and low compression numbers.
Best explanation on ringland failure I've heard yet. Mucho gracias
Pretty much.
Warm up car.
Proper maintenance
Tune for any engine changes.
AOS for the win!
3rR4h does the aos really help prevent ringland failure? Would it be good or bad on a completely stock car or should I not worry until modifying?
@@thatonetimeatbandcamp1326 these cars require a level of monitoring and technical experience that's beyond what the laughable power they make deserves. Garbage cars. Wouldn't recommend doing anything you can't fix to it if and WHEN it breaks.
@@thatonetimeatbandcamp1326 not really
@thatonetimeatbandcamp1326 how has it been since you've had it bro? You still going strong? Everybody I get replies from is nothing but bad news
Every engine, no matter what the design, has their limits. However the weakest link to their reliability are shitty owners. People still give too much credit to themselves no matter how ignorant they are with cars and just blame the engine. I've seen this way too many times. Biggest denial ever. Lol
thank you i always hear guys bag on subarus but i think its a combination of operator error and pushing a stock engine too far with bolt on parts
I totally agree with both of you
Every engine has a limit if you push it over the limit it will blow up whether it's a boxer or inline
EJ25 is just aids... weak cylinder liners, weak pistons...
EJ207 short block with ARP head studs is a good combo
@@oldfashionedwrx3574 Unless you're sponsored by a laundry list of aftermarket manufacturers, any econobox engine won't last if pushed way past their limit. EJ207s break, FA20s break, 4G63s break, 4B11Ts break. All because of the owners.
Nothing is unbreakable. a ej207 short + stronger head studs is a nice combo for a nice tough street/track package. $5,000 AUD drive in/out with recon heads is a good combo engine for a WRX.
From my experience good quality supporting mods and the strongest oem engines seem to last the longest if not too greedy with power.
a lot of these after market pistons with piston slap at start up do not last long lol but handle a lot more power in their shorter life
race engines do not last long at all LOL
On point info here. If you’re going to mod these cars at all go full bolt ons and an AOS. If not, just ride stock and keep your warranty.
Great info on this video! Easy to follow and very well laid out. I got some ELH on my STI and the rumble is still there :) car seems to be so much happier with it too! Very worthwhile upgrade!
Imlikethemoviesh a 4-1 EL setup (Killer B’s) tends to have more of a burble over a 4-2-1 EL setup (Tomei or Perrin). At high rpm’s the Killer B’s definitely smooth out compared to UEL’s but you still have that low-mid rpm growl. Sounds a bit more refined. Plus Killer B’s are top notch in terms of quality
Love your videos great editing!!
Great vid man, good information this helps a lot with my issue and my legacy.
Great video, explained very nice and detailed. Keep up the good work. 👍👌
Also consider a better oil pickup like KillerB. Helps flow for the oil to get where it needs to be.
What do you think about wrapping your headers and downpipe? It keeps engine bay temps much lower but keeps more heat in the pipes....
great explanation bro!
Very well explained, thanks homie
new to sti, thanks for the info!
Great info! Subscribed.
th-cam.com/video/-jDrkEEK99E/w-d-xo.html
How often should I change my spark plugs?
How much of a difference sound wise does a downpipe make? I'm stage 1 muffler delete and think the sound is perfect.
Detonation is when the heat in the combustion chamber starts to ignite the air fuel mixture before the spark plug does, you end up with multiple explosions in the chamber instead of one.
Is this ringland issue valid for the EJ20 , 2.0, naturally aspirated, 2009?
A great video. We'll said. Maintenance is the key. I let Subaru do all of Ocean Blues Maintenance. I'm @76k on my base model WRX. I'm keeping it until it dies. I'm waiting for for the new STI. I can't wait. Stay safe brother.
that ring-light though..
What is a whole steven doing here??
Wtf 🤣
The conecting rods in the fa20dit are offset. thats why they bent and break. but you can remove the pistons and rods together with the case halfs together unlike the ej. so pros and cons of all engine designs
also the turbo is close to the heads, higher compression thanks to direct engine. so its much nicer to drive daily and better fuel economy.
Great vid helpful
What do you think is the acceptable oil consumption for an EJ257?
Let's use some common sense here every engine has a limit if you push it over the limit trying to get 450hp out of a stock engine it will blow up whether if it's a boxer or inline
I have an 05 Impreza rs with a jdm swapped 2.0 ej205 engine avcs stock turbo
This car is my daily never misses a beat very reliable it starts at - 40 degrees in the winter with no issues and doesn't burn a gram of oil
If they really try they might get 500hp out of it - watch those pistons fail
Not every engine. 2jz, RB26, 4g63 can take more than 450hp
Wrc a stock 4g63 can make over 500 whp stock block reliably...
That motor is bulletproof. Doesn’t compare to the ej25 unfortunately:/
@@mikehundredson584 take about 700hp /1000 stock most them engines
Best Vid to date....keep it up man!
People say the equal length headers don't sound good, but I actually really like it. I have heard fa20's with uel headers and they don't have the sound of the 257 with unequal length; other inline 4 turbos. It might be the displacement of the 2.5, but I think the motor still makes a deep tone.
Cloroxb3ach55 tm agreed, porsches have ELH flat engine and they sound awesome
Nicholas I prefer the sound of EL’s. A little more refined and the performance and reliability gains are worth every penny spent
Stop lugging the engine... LOL
Great point about the busy gas stations. People are all "shell or notin' bro", I prefer busy gas stations in nicer parts of town (more cars using premium).
Happens the the best of us. #stimobbn.
I blame Ring land failiure on high in take temps caused by global warming
Dumbest shit I've heard today.
I’m blaming him for Coronavirus
Yep th-cam.com/video/-jDrkEEK99E/w-d-xo.html
"The foolishness of that comment is so deep, I can only ascribe it to higher education. You have to have gone to college to say something that stupid."
Hey, I was thinking of getting a subaru but there aren't any shops specialized in Subarus where I live. I've already read a lot about the EJ25, if I get one first thing I would be doing would be the safety upgrades such as AOS, cyl 4 cooling mod, equal length headers and killerB pickup tube. The thing is, is it worth getting one if I don't know how to do the maintenance myself and there aren't specialized shops for subarus near ?
The 15+ wrxs have a oil temp Guage on the center display..im not hard on it till oil temp hit 185°+ it runs around 205° wen fully warmed up..if im getting on it it will go up to 212..if it goes past 215 i let off qn let it cool back down
Took my car to the dealer for oil change 1 week later my car starts shaking i call the dealer they say its find my rod blew out through the head and my engine caught fire now my dealer is blaming me for it
This for the FA-20 motors too?
I hear a lot about this but how come none of the Metzger engines experience this? Or is it just not as big of a problem with Porsches?
Is a simple fix to just get better/forged pistons?
Never been a Subaru owner but I've been car hunting lately and Subaru and Audi keep popping up in my crosshairs (really want an AWD car next).
Because Subaru made the crown thin on the pistons!!
This especially applies to my fellow mazdaspeed owners too. Avoid zoom zoom boom!
I've just seen this video and thinking about an sti 2019 real soon, my plans are to give it a stage 2 tune and upgrade rods and pistons......that been said do ya think I'd have many issues wi the VIX providing I maintain it well and dont thrash it everytime I drive it?
Wait for the next year when they swap engines. The engine they will be putting in the WRX from now on is much more beefy.
that shirt is fye
I had ringland failure in my 2018 Subaru WRX with 54k miles on it. It's fully stock no mods and my extended warranty covered a new engine block for free. I learned from the service manager that adding BG MOA oil addictive helps with keeping the engine healthy, which helps prevent carbon build up on the valves and oxidation. I also change the oil every 3k but will go as far as 5k every once in awhile. Also you need to do fuel injection service every 15k miles and I only did that once which was just a few months before I had ringland failure. I am wondering if anybody else does this for their WRX. This is my advice but would like to hear other people's input as well.
does the aos really help prevent ringland failure? Would it be good or bad on a completely stock car or should I not worry until modifying?
An AOS should be one of the very first things you do.
Nice info here, starting to learn that these cars have serious maintenance involved, also the oil. I was changing at 3200, now I'm doing at 2000 to 2500 miles and avoiding like Royal Purple going with more standard oil from Subaru. However, do you have any recommendations on the most suited oil for these motors?
These engines like oils that stay in grade throughout the entire drain interval - with the EJ, this is arguably much more important than with most other engines, as these engines brutalize oils to an extent where lubrication-related catastrophic engine failure can occur. Oils with HTHS values of over 3.5 are arguably very much desirable, and HTHS should arguably be favored over TBN with the turbo EJs (the implication being that a less-robust additive package means the particular oil is less-suited for longer intervals.) I'm currently using Motul X-Clean EFE based on favorable EJ UOAs as well as the oil being officially approved by divisions of Subaru outside the US...my first two UOAs have come back looking positive and suggest that around 4,000 mile intervals are more than safe for my situation. (In the summer I'll use X-Cess, which some prefer over X-Clean [side note - for the DI WRXs, X-Cess is probably not a very good choice.]) As Motul is definitely a premium price-wise, there are also quite a few other brands/lines that people have had good success with.
www.bobistheoilguy.com/effects-of-shearing/
Mobil 1
@@mopar21 If using a 30 weight, Mobil 1 ESP is IMO worth consideration over their standard SN-RC.
93 Octane Must.
AOS is nice.
5000km oil change with Full Syn Oil.
Stay Stock.
Pre and post idle for warmup cooling.
Live in Canada (lol cold place)
Anything else?
Every 5000km, make it every 500km. You want the oil fresh bro
Can you run the after market down pipe on stock exhaust? I have a 2016 STI with stage 1 Cobb. Also being in the phx area like yourself, I want to do anything I can to remove extra heat build up in the engine bay.
Air to oil separator, down pipe, stock exhaust and Cobb stage 1 (intake, access port) seems like the safe way to go? Obviously with being on top of preventative maintenance/ timely oil changes
Also, did your BOV (atmosphere) have any effect on Ringland failure?
Stock catback portion of the exhaust is fine, won’t hurt your car at all. The headers are the design flaw. Unequal length means heat retention on the bank with the longer runners. Heat retention is what causes the rings to crack. Don’t use the Cobb OTS maps, get a quality protune for all the mods done. The tune will be tailored specifically for your individual car, it’ll run at its best that way.
i laughed when u said lets talk on how to avoid it ... on engine #3 2019 sti
Been thinking of buying a 2002-2004 Impreza wrx but I heard Subaru’s boxers are bad for getting the knock knock.
Okay well roughly everything takes into account for ring land failure. How often at what mileage does it tend to appear on an 08 sti???
There really aren't standard cases because it is so highly-dependent on driving habits, maintenance habits, and modifications. IIRC, the 2008 is where Subaru changed the maps (and possibly piston-wall clearances?) for emissions-related reasons (someone more knowledgable than I could confirm that.) There have been some cases where someone has done everything right and the suffered piston failure on a totally stock car that was cared for properly - however, the more common scenario generally seems to be associated with something the driver did or did not do. Piston brittleness is definitely this platform's achilles heel, but it's also very often blown up out of proportion (pun intended.) With any used vehicle, how the previous owner(s) treated it certainly plays into question significantly IMO.
Aside from proper maintenance and being nice to your enigne, the number 1 thing is to keep an eye on your oil and use a better quality oil, even a thicker weight depending on where you live and your areas temperatures will do wonders. The oem subaru oil is much too thin for these enignes especially during spirited driving it can sheer, thin out and lose its lubrication qualities quite easily...which is a huge no no for boxer engines, even worse for turbo boxers. Unfortunately doing so can or will void your warranty if you have one
Run what the manual says to run. Change your oil often. And dont drive it like a ricetard.
My wife came home with a 2011 Forester [ no-turbo ] 114 k . She took it on a 600 mile trip, it used 2 qts of motor oil. We called the car dealer, he said to bring it in for a oil test. They changed the oil, using Dexos 0w20, and bring it back every 500 miles for them to check it. This went on for a month and they came up with 400 miles to a qt. And they said that this was with in the limits and there was nothing they could do, so we were stuck with it. The first thing i did was get rid of the 0w20, i wouldn't run this in nothing. I put Mobil 1 10w40 high mileage with one pint of Schaeffer's Moly engine oil treatment. No more motor noise at dead idle and its up to 1200 miles to qt a qt. Its been down to -30 with -55 wind chill and the Subie started right up with 0 motor noise, [ No engine heater ] I change the oil every 3000 miles, it might be a over kill, but its still running after a year at 134 k.
@@ticker511 sad
Its probably ring gap bro. You import guys need to run a lot more boost to make power. More boost equals more heat. Piston ring gap closes up from the heat and pinches the ring against the cylinder wall trying to seize the piston in the bore. The force of this breaks the piston ring land. You need to gap the rings or make sure you're car has spot on cooling. Gapping the ring gives more safety margin though. Contrary to belief many stock cast pistons are very strong if manufactured right. You really dont need to go forged to you're making huge power levels
good video but i would suggest to put the background music jus a little bit down
So say I buy a used WRX how can I prevent it from not blowing up the engine or the transmission
Just maintain it and don't beat on it like a civic
Keep it stock.
Watch out for your main bearing.
95 octane good?
Very. Most premium is 91.
In the UK/ Ireland we have access to 97 (super unleaded), from what I hear in the US 91 oct is the highest, which would concern me if I lived in the US as my 2014 STI is rated for 97 octane, fuel quality is key when it comes to ringland failure, but looking for unrealistic bhp with a stock motor your just asking for trouble, look after the motor and it'll look after you !
@@adrianford3 We've got 93 octane at most gas stations here in Indiana in the States. Not as good as 97 but it'll do.
People don't understand the flaw in the new subaru.
The rings are higher than they have been in the past.
Just replace the pistons to good aftermarket.
You say that like its cheap! Unacceptable
Hey if you can’t afford to replace a blown engine you shouldn’t be modding to begin with. All the bolt ons and tuning that goes with them cost about the same as getting forged rods and pistons installed. Worth it.
What is the right rpm when down shift then?
BLackStar 17 just dont mash on the gas when you are below 3000 rpm.
Binx thank u bro
If you want a wrx. Dont be a pinecone. Dont beat on it. Dont mod it without proper tuning. change your oil car will last just as long as anything else
With my speed it’s the rod blown out the block that happens a lot lol
MazDaspeedG or the VVT actuator failing and timing skip. Bye bye intake valves lol. Just happened to my Speed6. $2500 later lol
A collection of facts and myths.
Unless you see a vid from a large scale tuning company (cobb, perrin, haltech, hydra) I would not follow advice out of fear.
-Bjorn Racing (we are on FB)
dam i want a wrx STI but seems like they are just waiting to blow up
THAT_619_DUDE they are only waiting to blow up if you beat on it and don’t mod it correctly.
@@DIMILifts yea that i was thinking , i plan on making sure i got the proper parts to not blow my shit up lol
I had 2009 STi that I kept stock and no problems. Also had 2012 STi that I put in Invidia catted downpipe and Invidia TBE. Ran it for three years and did not abuse but ran it right with proper tune. Was going strong when I traded it. Just have to be smart how you mod and how you drive.
I have an 80,000miles 06 sti intake exhaust and a protune, runs like a champ, just warm it up, keep up on maintenance, and dont beat the hell out of it and you'll be good, I love my sti lol
you have never had mechanical problems with your subaru sti with power atreeing
What oil temp should i warm my car up to before driving off? I know you mentioned the amount of time to warm up but what would be the best temperature?
No set temp, just don’t beat on it cold and you’ll be fine
I just got school 👌
Dipstick dry every fuel refill 🤔 5w30 just evaporating.
Just have to build with forged pistons 😎🤙🏻
Lol because those will add longevity and reliability...
Don't tread on me .... in a performance engine at high risk of piston failure issues it does... 🤷🏻♀️
Don't tread on me a proper aftermarket pistons for an ej uses different dimensions on ring-lands and stronger material to avoid ring land failure.
Why would you spend 40k on a new car to overhaul the motor?
It's really weird that this is basically the exact same video and tips used by Evan Shanks in his video 2 years prior...
Is it true the 2019-2020 are stronger?
I hope so, I just got a 2020
I think they come stock with forged internals instead of the cast from previous years
Yes. They use the type ra block or heads one of the 2
Those came with Type ra shortblock, but they are not forged. They are suppose to support a higher limit of upto 450whp instead of 400whp of prior engines. Now, they relatively new and still most of those are running under warranty and not much mods yet.
Traded my 2020 STI for a 2020 Raptor lol
I have had a 09 wrx with bolts ons and a bone stock 05 foz xt blow up on me. The heart break of fixing theses cars when they blow. I'm over it. Rocking a charger rt 5.7 with 370hp and up to 28mpgs on long trips.
Salahadeen Ross don’t get too confy with the 5.7, like he said and you should know EVERY ENGINE has its weak spot. For the hemi it’s lifter/cam issue, I had swapped to a performance cam on my 5.7.
You modded the engine and it blew now you’re blaming the engine. 🤣🤣🤣😂
Knock knock!!
When the Subaru engineers designed this engine - don’t you think they knew what they were doing - they are mostly likely much smarter than some under 25 year olds - if you over mod this engine and it fails don’t blame Subaru
Barry Maskell good theory, but bone stock STI’s are getting ring land failures as well. Just like bone stock FA20DIT’s are getting bent rods.
Class action lawsuit says no Subaru doesn't know how to build a motor
Mike Hundredson they didn’t win that suit. Lol
@@nwbklr it was recently settled brother and Subaru is paying out. I even asked my dealer and my 2017 STI is part of it because this was the last year before they revised the motors internals. Not that it matters to me.
When you’re right you’re right.
You don't lose the rumble with eleh... Trust me.
I got some killer B headers on mine and the rumble is most definitely still there :)
The classic subaru rumble is def gone on the 15+ wrx
which type specifically? Like is it raw or just a hint of the rumble, curious?
It's kind of hard to explain it. It isn't as raw with the uel but it's there and sounds much better in my opinion. There's a good video with a guy running the killer B headers with a corsa catback that you should go listen to that'll give you a better idea of what it sounds like. Some microphones don't do it justice though and it is definitely better in person.
Killer B’s 4-1 headers don’t have as much of a rumble, especially at higher rpm’s, but compared to the Perrin or Tomei 4-2-1 headers they are much more aggressive. Plus Killer B’s quality is top notch. Regardless swapping to EL’s is worth every penny over UEL’s
In europe, we not have that problem with Subaru.
The main reason I got rid of my sti, don't want to deal with it sooner or later.
maybe it wouldn't have ever happened! thats a dumb reason to get rid of an sti i think there was something more to that. to each their own
Hunter Bautista Wow, that’s a crappy reason to let it go. Living in fear about something that may not even happen. Every engine has their issues.
Mark Shkurko it ain't about living in fear, it's a gamble whether or not Subaru of America will honor your warranty while modded or pay $4k+ out of pocket for engine rebuild which happens too often to others, so I left.
Hunter Bautista Yes it can be costly if it does come to that, that’s for sure. So what car did you replace your STi with if you don’t mind me asking?
Mark Shkurko I went to the dark side 😊, evo x.
Does this apply to the FA20DiT??
WorldRallyBlue_WRX spun rod bearings for FA20
mine rod knocked at 32k miles on my gt86 bone stock no mods never drove it stupid
how the heck you get a rod knock with a gt86? Did you get it used :O they're extremely reliable vehicles
@@BathSaltBadger The FA20DiT comes in the 2015+ WRX, its the turbo version, the FA20Di comes in the GT86, I havent got any problems, just trying to save my car's life
oh I know, I was talking to @jdmasfuck I know the FA20DiT i in the WRX haha :p don't rev the shit out of it (all the time), and don't mod it and you should be more than fine. Ask about seaform for later on 30k miles I believe (its for cleaning out the valves) or you can remove the head and walnut blast it from carbon build up. It's hard as hell to get these cars warrantied, so remember to remove any bolt ons before the dealership, even an exhaust etc etc.
Just change the pistons to aftermarket
Lol because that's a smart solution for people who buy a brand new one and have a full powertrain warranty...man there's some stupid people on here.
Just put forged pistons. Yes it is expensive, but this is sports car. It is not cheap.
How much did you spend? Did you do any of the work?
nowadays gas too expensive to idle for 20
blame the engine and driver
Mostly the driver
What you described is not detonation. Detonation is essentially pre-ignition. It can be caused by valve feathering and/or low-octane fuel.
Mac Miller lookalike *no knock
you dumb af he dont look like Mac
Looks nothing like but ok bud
Just add water injection, clean engine and problem solved lol
Dont floor it at 2k
Your explanation of detonation is not 100% correct. Detonation is also called pre-ignition. Where the fuel mixture ignites before the pistons reach tdc and causes detonation. Reasons why, mainly lean fuel conditions, ignition is set to advance, hot engine Temps, hot intake Temps. Each reason has a cause for those conditions.
The struggle of owning a Subaru
2jz has no weakness
Sure bud
@@AndrewB23 Yep, glad you agree too.
F
so now i need ELH... F***
SUBARU the best haters dont like them
Literally copied Evan shanks video
The boxer engine design is a failure. The rod bearings go bad. All the oils in the bottom of the pan and the cranks on top of the engine. A standard engine the cranks in the oil pan. So you have oil bearing starvation to the top of the block destroying bearings.
How to avoid: don't use trashy cobb ots shit.
Yeah people check your goddamn oil every single day lol
With a brand new car? That's stupid.
@@mopar21 I know it is. Good habit to do is check your oil while pumping gas, so every week.
No solution for this, Subaru flaw. Lawsuit in action because of this! Nothing will stop ringland failure you can slow it down but it will happen .
Roughly what mileage??
@@fxxk3664 yes
How to avoid ringland failure. Buy a Evo
What’s an evo
@@Dragunov302 imma go to the dealership and buy a brand new one.
You want to avoid it? Buy other car....fucking shit 2.5sti 🤮
Great channel but you have no idea what you’re doing with that car .
So.... you ditch the subie and move on to a focus.
or get a toyota and not get a ringland failure...
From the man that has owned both a FA and a EJ I say there all fucking junk. You shouldn’t have to worry about things like this. Knock on wood though my EJ257 has had zero problems. I attribute this to running mostly E85. I ❤️ E85.
They're badly built motors. REALITY!!!
Nope just idiots own them
@@AndrewB23 their pretty badly built. Unless you risk the only precaution you have to avoid paying out of pocket to replace motor.