วีดีโอ

definitely, but you need a water filter system made for coffee machines. Mine cost about £500, including fitting and I change the filter once a year.

The Lelit. I've never had a problem with it. Just wish it had a better screen.

@@bartalks1810 Thank you for sharing 🙂

nice. I love the description - you know I think I can taste that espresso now :). I wish robusta didn't have such a bad name in UK, but people associate Arabica with quality, instead of 'quality' with quality. But maybe it's better this way, and the robusta fans will just enjoy our quality robusta blend espresso without caring what the marketing says.

⁠@@bartalks1810 Arabica is good for taste but I feel on its own , it isn’t enough to get a traditional bodied Italian espresso. The market has totally changed with 3rd wave and single origin beans , and they are big on milk based drinks. I respect the concept although it doesn’t suit me because all I drink are single espresso’s normally without any sugar and being that these newer roasts aren’t composed of what a traditional Italian roaster would use, the final product in the cup just doesn’t taste the same. Most of the famous traditional Neapolitan roasters usually will incorporate a percentage of robusta in there blend. I wanted to ask you, is there a big emphasis on crema like there is in Italy, In the UK? If so, you should school them on why robusta would help achieve that in their cup and that arabica on its own may not be enough to yield the same results.

Ooh, that's a tricky one. The answer may lie in the way you make coffee. Is it just you, or does the whole family use it? The Rocket is easier to use and to change settings. The main thing on the LELIT which is a deal killer for me, is the flow control. But my kids who use it, tend to ignore the paddle. So, if it's just you, and you plan to develop your palette around lighter roast coffees, then you might get another itch a year down the road. OTOH, if you like medium-dark roast espresso, or prefer milky drinks, then the Rocket will serve you well. It's also easier to use, so if your family all want to get involved, I think they might prefer it. The final question is over support. If you can get good local support for the Rocket, then this shouldn't be overlooked. Either way, they're both great machines, and a big step up from the GCP!

@@bartalks1810 Thank you so much for your insights and thanks for taking the time to give me some great things to think about. Based on your comments, I think the Rocket R58 Cinquantotto will likely be the winner for me when I'm ready to take that next step. Right now I'm the only one using it, as my wife is more of a tea drinker and my boys are too young to drink coffee, but every once in awhile she would like me to make her a single shot latte with steamed plant based milk. Steaming oat or almond milk is definitely harder with the GCP than full fat dairy milk! We sometimes have company over that will drink coffee and it would be nice to have such a capable machine as the Rocket at the ready. It's also beautiful. I like to work on my own appliances and electronics, and luckily there is an authorized La Marzocco and Rocket dealer here in my city. If something were to happen and I couldn't resolve it myself, I'm sure their service technicians could work on it for me. I really enjoy medium roasts and so far I'm only making flat whites and lattes for myself. I haven't mastered the GCP process enough to be able to really get consistent espresso shots yet, so I find that milk drinks are much more forgiving. I have a Eureka Mignon Specialita grinder so it will definitely be a good complement to any machine that I upgrade to. With all of that in mind, I think I'm sold on the R58 Cinquantotto! Thanks again for your time!😁

I'm personally not convinced by the Breville smart machines. My Dad had the Touch, and it was clunky. On paper it should work, but in practice it never did. If you get a chance to try one out, I recommend you do that before committing. An alternative is to buy one used, and then if you resell it, you won't lose much. I do like some of the other breville models, like the dual boiler, or the Barista express, which is a lot cheaper. My friend has a Barista express, and with the money they saved, bought a separate grinder. Hopefully those give you some ideas to think about :)

nope. I like the flow control on the Bianca, and it's working brilliantly for me.

a year already? wow. we're both OK, but our friend Gerald - who founded peaberry roasters passed in December. His son has taken over, but Gerald was a class act. Max and me are. both fine, but both our jobs have accelerated somewhat monopolise our time.

Not had any hands on with the VBM. They seem to be offering a lot of value. I'm a little 'unfairly' suspicious of how good all those features will translate in practice - and in the photos it looks like some of the materials are maybe a bit cheaper. But I'd love to be pleasantly surprised, and if it was my money, I'd be really tempted, but I'd like to put my grubby hands on it first.

Saturated. But only if you're willing to pay the additional cost, and have a more complex system to maintain.

@@bartalks1810 like a la marzocco micra vs lelit bianca right?

@@youtubeaccount7137 hmmm, not the lelit - that's an E64, the LM Micro, yes, but also others like the Sanremo You

@@bartalks1810 en how is the e61 different from what lelit uses? Is what lelit uses better then tradionel e61?

@@youtubeaccount7137 all e61's are the same including the one Lelit uses, and that is the benefit - it's old, but simple technology - easy to repair and get parts for. But, temperature stability is important for getting consistent good results. The e61 doesn't do this very well (depending on the use case), and the temperature is measured at the boiler, not the group head - where it matters. So each company uses their own method to estimate the actual temperature when it makes it to the group head - The Lelit Bianca allows you to manually set an 'offset temp'. Many ideas like this just don't work though. Saturated group heads, kind of have the boiler as part of the group - so there's no temperature loss, but the mechanism is more complicated and expensive. Hope that helps.

If it was me, I'd go with the cheaper Giotto and use the saved money to put toward a top grinder.

Love it. I've given it to my dad now, and I doubt he will care, but I'll think of that next time I need some trim

that's our style 😄

Thank you :)

I think so. After you spend all that money, you want the machine to look good for a long time. Mine looks almost as good today as it was when I took it out of the box. The same is not true of chrome finishes, unless you are meticulous in cleaning after each shot in my experience.

sorry :(

I like some things about the rocket more, and there's new machines out there all the time. The E61 keeps the costs down, and the flow control is something that I wouldn't want to live without. Check out reviews of new machines by searching host Milano 2023 and see if there's anything that takes your fancy. I can say that several people had issues with their water tank on the rocket, including me. The pump on my LELIT has got a bit noisy recently, but it's worked faultlessly for almost a year, and we totally abused this thing. If you don't mind it's looks, the Sage/Breville Dual Boiler is a good machine too, and the prices are so good, especially if you can find a quality used version.

@@bartalks1810 Id never buy a Sage again. It leaked and wrecked the inside in 9 months. Took 3 months to get Sage to listen and do something. I demanded a refund and sent it back. Its chinese made junk and not designed to last beyond warranty. Makes OK coffee if you are lucky. No temp stability, no pressure stability. Grider and dosing sucks. I have bought a Linea Micra and Libra Grinder. Got amazing deal from La Marzocco direct on Cyber monday 15% off RRP. Machine is made from real stainless steel not chromed brass. Makes consistently good drinks although i suck at dialing in as im still learning. I need a simple set up for my gf who just wants easy coffee and this is likely a good option, plus i think will retain good value longer term.

Absolutely. Oat milk has more carbs than cows milk.

It might not be the level of roast as much as the type of bean. Try a quality robusta... no wait, before you swear at me, the problem with robusta is not the bean, but that most people sell low quality robusta because it's cheap. Maybe try a blend of 70/30 robusta/arabica from a specialty roaster that does them. You might find it gives you the body you want, with great flavour.

@@bartalks1810 That’s an idea. Although, Robusta beans are usually harsher and more bitter,

not the good stuff - trust me - a good canephora, not just robusta, can be sweet and nutty.

I think that's a great point. I've had an Elektra commercial machine - the Barium, without any issues, but while in a cafe in Germany, they told me they had gone through two Barlumes before changing to another manufacturer. Reliability might be an issue, although my un-authoritive response is that QA issues are the sort of things that can go good to bad and bad to good in a short period of time. Look at how managers destroyed decades of Boeings reputation after cost cutting QA that led to the Max disaster. So, I guess I'm saying that it's hard to tell, but possibly Elektra need to work a bit harder to earn some trust back in that department.

Thank you for taking the time to read and reply. A Verve is being delivered tomorrow.

Amazing feedback, thank you. sorry for the late reply, somehow I missed it. How is it working out for you? I have no regrets keeping mine, and even with the new fancy stuff coming out, I'm not really tempted to change it.

and I know others that like it, but the review title is 'not right for me' (I'm me). The wonderful thing about product diversity is that there is no one right product for everyone. Seriously though, it's good to have the feedback, even if it's 'your review sucks'. When we do reviews, we purposefully make them an opinion, because the internet is full of bland inoffensive videos where nobody sticks their neck out.

It's true - I was at the italian Coffee event in Trieste last year, and tasting some really great traditional espresso I would say was made to be true italian espresso, but with a blend of specialty coffee in there - My friends at Bazzara made some great coffee with either specialty arabica or robusta beans - OK I"m biased, but it's still true. Thanks @prolNpro for a great market overview.

Yikes, missed this comment. Well, no really. although yes. Remember the oldest Italian burr experts are Mazzer I believe. They make the burrsets for other manufacturers. They also make a lot of the grinders Italian Espresso shops use. Maybe start there.

Mazzer, Anfim, or Eureka

prices globally seem to vary quite a bit. If it's that much cheaper than an R58 and you don't mind the limitations, then why not. It does look pretty :)

I'm not sure if I will be able to do a full review of each side by side. I gave the rocket to my Dad, who is enjoying it at the grand age of 93. Maybe I'll have a reunion with Max and discuss the two...

nothing wrong with it. has a nice kick - no frills.

I have a BWT bestmax system. There are a lot to choose from, but luckily I have a friendly coffee maintenance professional who came by and tested the water and then chose this for me.