Munro and associates are simply an amazing bunch of engineers and design people. Nobody does it better or smoother than Munro and his people. Carl like the rest just makes the whole presentation flow so smoothly and easily.
Munro - educating the public on where to look for car finish issues ! Where I live, panel gaps are largely irrelevant - if your mirrors are still on, and your car isn't keyed it's a bonus....
@@lemongavine BMW buyers are paying $20k above generic ICE for labour to control panel gaps. Tesla buyers are paying $20k above generic ICE for huge battery pack. And don't give a crap generally about panel gaps.
The different in thickness of glass is related to an acoustic phenomenon known as the coincidence frequency. Basically the bending waves in the glass couple with the incident sound waves at a certain frequency allowing more sound transmission through the glass more easily. This frequency is governed mostly by the stiffness of the pane, (actually density, thickness, Youngs Modulus). By having two thickness you are therefore changing the stiffness of the glass and offsetting the coincidence frequency of each of these panes of glass so they don't line up with each other so the dip in sound transmission loss performance is reduced. The thinner pane will have a lower stiffness and therefore high coincidence frequency than the thicker pane. Hopefully that wasn't to dull.
That could be due to a new wiper parking zone plastic area, and a rod length adjuster that shortens the length of the rod in forward motion, then and lengthens the rod to create a longer arc to park when the wiper Moyer is put into reverse. Chrysler and GM have both used those rod length adjuster cams for decades on the big expensive models that hav a hood design that could all ow gap to hide the wipers between the cowl/top of the firewall and the underside of the hood. What is old, is new again! That is another change in parts and revisions of the hood, wiper transmission rods, and cowl top to create a space for the wipers to “park” in and the ability for the wiper rod transmission to park them lower than when wiping.
Besides the security issues, I want the parcel shelf to help with sound deadening from the rear-end noises. I have an older Model 3 and I have attached a noise dampening pad up underneath the trunk area for just that - noticeable difference.
Yeah, this is a good point. Imo, if you were able to, putting foam on the inside of the side walls of the trunk, leading to the upper shelf (there’s a lot of gap), this would significantly reduce noise from back end. Also newer Model 3 have removed the bass port/hole in shelf.
What really counts is actual driving characteristics. I appreciate what Munro does on there tear downs and how it could have an overall effect on driving but rubber on the road is the final analysis.
It has been many years of watching videos here. Most were just mind numbing so-so time killers. Then one day I was presented with a Munro video. Finally I have something worth watching. Yes! Thank you!
Awesome video 1. Carla has a voice made for narration 2. Love the post speeding up as carl walks between vehicles 3. 2nd what others said re what's the gold standard
I will be very interested in finding out what the interior DB levels are for both the Fremont in Texas build. We have a handful of the Fremont build MYs and compare to the Ford Mach E, the interior noise (wind / road slap) it’s far more noisy on the inside - almost embarrassingly so for the price.
@@Heist1000 I was able to reduce the interior noise of my model three by about 50% using an aftermarket weatherstripping kit. Tesla relies on one line of weatherstripping on the door but I noticed that many other manufacturers use two. Unfortunately all of the videos and instructions I watched encouraged installation where there was still a 5 mm gap between the weather seal and the door. It’s important to test the weatherstrip insulation to make sure that there is contact using a paper strip business card size. You can also use a bright light inside the car while you inspect the seal outside the car in the dark. The gaps will be immediately apparent. I noticed that I had to install the weatherstrip far lower in the door then the instructions seem to indicate in order to get contact but I did notice a great improvement. Especially in the higher frequencies so you’ll still notice that the lower frequencies will rumble through the floor so mostly all you hear is tire noise. I also noticed that the glass roof allowed sound to be reflected from the floor off the roof and back into my ears. I was able to correct this by putting in an aftermarket cover over the glass. Personally feel that these classrooms are a really dumb idea; sure they look good in the show room but practically speaking as a driver I never ever look up anyway and just experience that heat and added sound for no reason. I would much rather have an all steel roof with a conventional headliner.
I was hoping you would speak to driving characteristics differences between the two. Does the casting structure add a more rigid experience? I appreciate your thoughts...
@@coltburks5450 I disagree. There is far less flex in a single piece, casted unit. Frames have welded in reinforcements to firm them up and reduce flex.
@@jeffkeryk3550 I believe that's what I said. A casted piece will Crack before flexing a welded piece will flex before cracking. Therefore more lateral flexing with the previous welded body sections.
I find it interesting there are a number of alignment issues in the new Austin build shown here vs. what a number of people have said about their recent Austin builds. They say their panel alignments are perfect. I think at least some have confirmation bias. They have heard for a couple of years now the Austin plant will produce much higher quality cars than Fremont and that has influenced their views of their Austin cars. I must say, I recently bought a new Fremont build Model Y and the panel alignment is great.
Great job fellas. Since the world has gone extreme trying to pick on Tesla fit and finish, a lot my friends and I have (for the first time ever!) taken the same scrutiny to our own existing cars. Amongst a Mercedes, BMW, Ford, Toyota and Subaru, we actually found ALL of them had at least the same levels of inconsistency and misalignments as the Tesla’s show. We all agree that previously nobody ever really looked this hard for all the issues, because overall they are all acceptable. I feel Tesla gets a real hard time for what is already a common problem across all brands. First world problems?
I don’t really agree. Owned lots of European cars and those has had much better fit and finish than my M3 LR. But driving experience, app and software is freaking awesome in Tesla, my favourite car so far.
Seriously? That panel gap on the roofline was unbelievable. It's not just the gaps (and lack of in some cases) it's the inconsistency between left and right. If I were looking to purchase a used car and it had those panel alignment issues I'd reject it as (not very well) crash repaired.
Definitely true that it's a first world problem and also only an issue when it is pointed out. Most people don't look for it, thus never see it. Also true that everything has uneven panel gaps, not just Tesla. I've worked in the automotive field for 20 years for Nissan/ Infiniti, Honda/ Acura, Mercedes, Jaguar/ Land Rover, Bentley, and Lamborghini. All have brand new cars with uneven panels. It's also largely just a cosmetic issue with not proof of an underlying problem with build quality.
This looks like you made a script and thought about everything you wanted to say. This is a big improvement over earlier videos. Thank you for showing all these details.
Parcel shelf is a great place to put your suit jacket when you don't want to hang it inside the cabin. Also great place for hats and other light things you don't want inside the trunk.
Okay I don't usually comment on youtube videos but I had to stop this one to give congratz to the guys, especially the "interior man" the way he explains and speaks is just great, it seems like he was trained to be a professor or he is just natural. Keep it up guys.
Very good comparison! Some would argue that it wouldn’t matter in their choice for shopping a car, however for payment $$$ for a car, quality should be better imo.
8:05 "...added a partial shelf...": On my 2001 Toyota Celica, they have a little plastic hook on the right and on the left. When I finally realized what they were for, ...well it's pure genius. They're for hanging plastic grocery bags so they don't fall over when you're driving home. Where are these hooks on the Tesla? With so much attention to cup holders...and LED accent lights with dial-in colors, surely the world has learned about grocery bag hooks in 20 years!
We have them on our 2018 Model 3 in the frunk. They were deleted in later years. We've used them twice, maybe. We're not going through a slalom when we're driving our groceries home. Hooking the grocery bags (all different sizes) around these things is more trouble than they're worth.
Having been a show car owner in the past the gaps do stand out to me. On the other hand even with the differences they would not keep me from buying this car. Most people are going to use them as a daily driver and 'stuff' happens, stone chips door dings etc. That's where I am now, a daily driver. Done with show car stuff. Great review as always. Looking forward to the mechanical and electrical stuff.
Love the recessed wipers, that will improve aerodynamics and efficiency a lot more than one would think. The thinner inner glass pane is a nice improvement too. It was just wasted extra glass before, more costs, more weight, and shrinking the inner cabin area. I bet the fit and finish gets better with later production runs like we saw in Shanghai.
I had a 1981 Oldsmobile Firenza SX hatchback with a large rear window, similar to the Model Y. It had one of those "window blind" style pull-out covers in the "cargo" area. It was great for adding rear visibility, by stopping the reflections of whatever you were carrying from bouncing their light points into your rear-view mirror. Yes, it hid what you were hauling around from casual inspection, but I found it a better driving aid than just a cargo hider. Even if Antonio cannot retrofit a parcel shelf into his Model Y, he could probably go to his nearest NAPA Store and buy a "Window Blind" style cargo cover that would fit. Mine also had the ability to be removed when you had the rear seats folded down to carry lots of stuff, like wood for several projects I built. I loved that car, but had to get rid of it when our family grew too big.
I picked up my model Y long range from Texas today. Boy let me tell you… Body panel gaps omg 😳 The places you described in the video you are %100 correct they were there. Also, let me say the driver door you had to slam closed. And I had two dents on the front of the hood on either side of the emblem and no this wasn’t a paint defect following inspection from Tesla service center members. It was actually a factory problem 😳 we measured the dent from one side to the other and it was the same distance. Also, the seat release pull handle for the center seat was dangling by the cord. The service guy pushed it back in place 🤦🏼♂️. Yes it did go back in. Also, I wanted to note I will be checking this in 10 weeks to see if it’s operational as I didn’t try myself. So yeah I didn’t get to take home my Y because of all the defects they have to fix. It sucks because I was so excited to bring it home after waiting 7 months. But now another 10 day wait. This was at the Nashville, TN Tesla center. This is my second Y. The first I got was from Fremont and it’s was perfect! I just wanted to let people know check your Texas model Y’s guys.
This is hilarious. People obsessing over minutia. The first AH at Walmart who backs into the bumper of any brand new car will cause that and more. The tolerances that matter to me are the tolerances of the mechanical parts like the motors and drive line components. That Plaids can rip off 9 second runs one after the other for months and months tell me that Tesla's true quality is where it counts. My 2016 S has been trouble free, and that's what counts to me. TBH, I never took a quarter and ran it through the gaps looking for a mm or two from side to side.. All I know is that the paint is as bright and glossy as the day I bought the car.
This is knowns as "willful blindness". If there is an assembly problem that is causing gap issues, then it should not be ignored. These things need to be addressed and refined just as much as a gear or axle problem would need to be addressed-- when you're talking about "quality". Someone, somewhere has a job of putting these things together, and you're just ignoring that they even exist by only focusing on the motor/ battery ect.. those people do exist, and they need to step up their QC in letting these defects slip through; and/ They are not "obsessing; they are simply nothing the differences that are there. This kind of stuff isn't important to me either-- I take all my vehicles offroad, and they will have scratches and dents all over, and I couldn't care less. But that's me.
@@calholli But it is obsessing. Back in the 70s, when you could slide a sandwich between the gaps between the fender and front door of a Caddy, auto magazines praised the "beautifully turned out" coachwork of German and Japanese cars. Well, my buddy has a mint 300ZX with 12K miles on it and my Tesla gaps and paint are better. So what? It has gotten to the point of absurdity. When you have to get your face 12" away to see these "quality" problems, the problems no longer exist.
There are a bunch of model S that aren’t quality including plaids. Reddit is the spot to verify my statements. My own model Y was a steaming pile of 💩 and spent 4 of 7 months I owned it being “fixed”
I own a 2020 Model3 and it is the best car I ever had. Period. Since it was delivered no issues whatsoever. No maintenance, no rattling, no squeaking , just fill up the washer fluid sometimes and you good to go. Panel gaps, you ask? I won the award for the least amount of facks given.
@@jarhead1145 That red Model Y in the film looks like someone backed into it. If I saw that on a used car lot, I would assume it had been previously hit and poorly repaired.
I would accept this on a small car like a Hyundai or Ford Focus or something but not an 80k car and I think that’s why people are so obsessed about it.
Sandy, I got my Henson razor in the spring of 2020. They custom made me a 5/8" handle because my hands cramped up on a thinner one. All of my blades still haven't filled one pint mason jar.
@@world-karma9127 they are all publicly scrutinized. Literally everywhere. Maybe the perception that Tesla‘s are overly scrutinized is because a layman can easily spot their defects. Parts don’t fit, crazy panel gaps, and terrible paint to name a few.
Curious-any improvement as far as the exterior paint is concerned? My 2020 Y paint is extremely “fragile” rubbing through/off from minor abrasion. The paint durability is a big issue to me. I wish I’d done a total body wrap rather than partial.
All these detail changes are understandable, including the window lamination thickness reduction, which was probably done to save weight. Would be interesting for you to compare the weight with the earlier model when the tear down is done, Carl.
In my experience, the left side of the car was always worse than the right which the manufacturing seniors at the plant I worked at said was because a lot more people on the assembly lines are right handed than left handed.
Fit and finish "symptoms" can result from misalignments of many things, including hundreds of structural components.... many of which were removed with the giga castings. So you were lied to.
That makes no sense at all. The cars are broadly symmetrical along the longitudinal axis. You’d therefore expect the fit & finish of the front quarters to differ, but on the rear quarters the ‘best’ side would be reversed.
8:43 in Europe, all cars have a shelf or retractable roller to cover if you have anything stored and for crash safety, not having everything thrown around. Many people also get a cargo separator Webb, mesh, or metal grille not to die from being decapitated by your MacBook Air when front-ended by a car in the opposite lane. In Sweden, this is considered a standard option, and I am a bit surprised that this isn't a legal requirement for everybody. Since the Tesla's are designed in the USA, I Don't know if there are attachment points/holes to attach a cargo separator to. Many cars also have these attachment points/holes behind the front seats in case you have folded the rear seats and have cargo in the hole space behind the front seats.
Tesla more often than not can get away with telling customers that any gap is “within spec”. I own a Shanghai Model Y LR and it has no noticeable panel misalignments. I’ve seen a Berlin model Y performance and it had some ugly panel misalignments. As far as I’m concerned, only noticeable/inconsistent misalignments are an issue
My 2022 Fremont Model Y, delivered late November 2021, has the thinner window glass and the wipers that are recessed. No privacy cover for the back, and no carpet anywhere except the floor.
Interesting. Panel gaps are not a big deal for me, so long as wind noise and water leaks are not an issue...on the other hand, the precision fit of my Henson shaver has spoiled me to the point where I no longer use my old travel razor, or the safety razor I left at the summer home. Another example of an somewhat expensive initial cost product that outperforms, as well as being cost effective over time. Highly recommended.
I have a May 22 Fremont. I haven't put a straightedge to it put just eyeballing the gaps are good, EXCEPT, the rear edge of the right rear door protrudes a bit at the bottom. Other Y owners have reported same so maybe this is where assembly workers have decided to hide the stacked tolerances, LOL. I mean didn't notice that until my first wash and wax job. Seal on the door is wind and water tight so I am leaving it as is.
The Parcel Shelve can be folded an stand upright just inside the back door. Usefull when the shelve is too low. It is very good fit - wonder if it on purpose?
Very interesting comparison. There was an earlier video of the front gaps and the bad shape of the front of the Model Y 22. Could it be, that the whole car is contorted? Would be interesting to measure the whole body.
No it won't. Fanboydome is a big money biz. Any little anything with a Tesla vehicle means its "cheap garbage" while those same people buy the VW ID4. It would be a comedy if the tribalism wasn't so ugly
Munro first model 3 tesla tear down was not complimentary at all but tesla seemed to listen to his suggestions. When he did the second tear down and saw that tesla made so much change lol s when Munro paid respect.
my Mercedes sprinter is terrible I had to adjust doors for alignment and rattles and door locks fell apart, I fixed all myself being a auto tech. Dealer replaced both airbags, software updates and exhaust system which involved a class action lawsuit received $3600 so all car manufacturers have some issues so panel gaps are minor
Always nice to get a new video but apart from this panel measuring being high level nitpicking I don't think that the build quality of an entire product line or a whole factory should be judged by one car, especially early into a new body part introduction. Tesla customers have no disadvantages from those barely noticable panel misalignments anyway.
I've noticed slightly less road noise with a parcel shelf. Ours gets used for long trips for that reason, but is instorahe because our EVs are used for farm work.
Panel gaps LOL :-) - You guys look so much closer than I ever have, because that is your job. When I look closely at my other car, a NON-Tesla, I see gaps and inconsistencies that I have never noticed before. Now I can’t UNsee them. I wish I had never looked. (99.9% of people will not see them of course.)
Interesting stuff. As with any evaluation, perspective and a point of comparison is what allows the viewer to make sense of it all. In this case, you compared the same model from different factories. That's helpful. However, is there a vehicle out there that represents a gold standard, with consistently impressive fit and finish, at reasonable price point levels? Consumer perceptions likely lean towards Toyota, but on a professional level, what stands out in your view?
Strange that American-built model Ys have the parcel shelf that appeared late 2021 but don’t have the updated door cards with the wood trim extending onto the doors, those have been standard fit on Shanghai and Berlin model Ys since early 2021
Parcel shelf or privacy screen? Probably the latter. It doesn’t look substantial enough to support much mass. Also, anything sitting there could become a dangerous missile flying forward in the case of a sudden stop or crash.
Usually in European cars it's standard, good luck trying to sell a car without it even in second hand market, myself usually it is used to put a jacket or something like that if have rear passengers and stuff in the trunk, hats or umbrellas can happen and in my dad case that special pillow for your neck on long trips, in other words it's light stuff that are not to worry in case of a crash...
@@DishNetworkDealerNEO You think alike. I almost replied to my own post with what you said about the net. I have a pair of1st generation Honda Insights. There is a rather large flat area under the rear hatch which is basically the cargo floor. The Insight shipped with a net and clips already there. There difference is the Insight mounting point and floor is substantial and well below the top of the seat backs. The Model Y foldy-thing looks like carpeted structural foam. I would not trust it to hold onto anything heavy, net or no net.
@@wtmayhew it is probably light structural plastic boards wrapped with carpet and seam sewn at the folds. Good only for light loads. Up to 20 lbs max, costing Tesla no more than $15-$17 to make in material and labor costs.
@@fredbloggs5902 Almost none. I have a friend that was a car salesman for years. "how many sales did you lose in 22 years because of panel gaps?" Answer: "what? what do you mean?"
@8:46 regarding the debate whether a parcel shelf is necessary…I think they do well to cut down on rear end road noise. My M3 has more road noise without the shelf in place
Ironically not being able to see into your trunk triggers thieves to assume something worth stealing is in there. That's where there is a rash of break-ins involving the small rear window - the thieves break the little window so that they can reach in and flip down the seat to see if there is anything worth stealing in the trunk. Some people have avoided break-ins by leaving their rear seat folded down when they are parked - the thieves see there is nothing in their, and don't break their window.
Every UK hatchback has a shelf ... it's always been that way ... so they all look the same to the thief. Most thefts are done on the spur of the moment ... usually triggered by the thief spotting something on view. It's true that some people try the tactic of leaving everything on view but that means you have to carry every last thing into your house or your work location after every journey!
The different glass thickness is for the window to absorb different noise frequency. That leads to a better sound insulation.
Super interesting and awesome.
God damn Carl, the confidence and articulation of information has become damn amazing. Thanks!
Munro and associates are simply an amazing bunch of engineers and design people. Nobody does it better or smoother than Munro and his people. Carl like the rest just makes the whole presentation flow so smoothly and easily.
I wish they would have popped the hoods--- kinda upset about it.
Double pane glass has different thicknesses so that they don’t vibrate at the same frequency, which improves their sound attenuation.
Munro - educating the public on where to look for car finish issues ! Where I live, panel gaps are largely irrelevant - if your mirrors are still on, and your car isn't keyed it's a bonus....
Only .01% actually care for panel gaps but has higher voice due being a youtuber
I don’t understand people’s obsession with panel gaps.
@@lemongavine BMW buyers are paying $20k above generic ICE for labour to control panel gaps. Tesla buyers are paying $20k above generic ICE for huge battery pack. And don't give a crap generally about panel gaps.
@@lengould9262 thanks. Yeah, I’d rather pay $20K for the big battery, better performance and not have to pay for gas, etc. than panel gaps.
The different in thickness of glass is related to an acoustic phenomenon known as the coincidence frequency. Basically the bending waves in the glass couple with the incident sound waves at a certain frequency allowing more sound transmission through the glass more easily. This frequency is governed mostly by the stiffness of the pane, (actually density, thickness, Youngs Modulus). By having two thickness you are therefore changing the stiffness of the glass and offsetting the coincidence frequency of each of these panes of glass so they don't line up with each other so the dip in sound transmission loss performance is reduced. The thinner pane will have a lower stiffness and therefore high coincidence frequency than the thicker pane. Hopefully that wasn't to dull.
Thanks Carl and Antonio for your first look at the new Austin model Y. Looking forward to watching all the disassembly videos as they progress.
More to come!
@@MunroLive please do a driving comparison. How does the casting change handling, nvh, etc.
me too norm. battery breakdown should be especially interesting
THANKS CARL AND ANTONIO ….for sharing this comparison 🤗😎😍😍😍
Nice notice with the wiper blades!!
Very interesting 🤔
That could be due to a new wiper parking zone plastic area, and a rod length adjuster that shortens the length of the rod in forward motion, then and lengthens the rod to create a longer arc to park when the wiper Moyer is put into reverse. Chrysler and GM have both used those rod length adjuster cams for decades on the big expensive models that hav a hood design that could all ow gap to hide the wipers between the cowl/top of the firewall and the underside of the hood. What is old, is new again! That is another change in parts and revisions of the hood, wiper transmission rods, and cowl top to create a space for the wipers to “park” in and the ability for the wiper rod transmission to park them lower than when wiping.
The employees at Munro's have become very good TV presenters. Very slick and well presented. Another fine job!
Thanks Lars
Besides the security issues, I want the parcel shelf to help with sound deadening from the rear-end noises. I have an older Model 3 and I have attached a noise dampening pad up underneath the trunk area for just that - noticeable difference.
You're so right, I have a Seat Ibiza, and if I take the parcel shelf out for whatever reason the car is so much noisier from the rear
Yeah, this is a good point. Imo, if you were able to, putting foam on the inside of the side walls of the trunk, leading to the upper shelf (there’s a lot of gap), this would significantly reduce noise from back end. Also newer Model 3 have removed the bass port/hole in shelf.
Agreed ... this has always been an issue with hatchback cars. They are always quieter with a parcel shelf.
One year “gap” in production.
Bravo, Carl 👏🏼
Carl, Your review/comparison presentation was excellent - really look forward to more from you, keep up the great work! :)
What really counts is actual driving characteristics. I appreciate what Munro does on there tear downs and how it could have an overall effect on driving but rubber on the road is the final analysis.
It has been many years of watching videos here. Most were just mind numbing so-so time killers. Then one day I was presented with a Munro video. Finally I have something worth watching. Yes! Thank you!
Awesome video
1. Carla has a voice made for narration
2. Love the post speeding up as carl walks between vehicles
3. 2nd what others said re what's the gold standard
Road noise and handling difference of the casting vs multiple pieces way more important. Put a sound meter in both cars and compare in real time.
I will be very interested in finding out what the interior DB levels are for both the Fremont in Texas build. We have a handful of the Fremont build MYs and compare to the Ford Mach E, the interior noise (wind / road slap) it’s far more noisy on the inside - almost embarrassingly so for the price.
@@Heist1000 I was able to reduce the interior noise of my model three by about 50% using an aftermarket weatherstripping kit. Tesla relies on one line of weatherstripping on the door but I noticed that many other manufacturers use two. Unfortunately all of the videos and instructions I watched encouraged installation where there was still a 5 mm gap between the weather seal and the door. It’s important to test the weatherstrip insulation to make sure that there is contact using a paper strip business card size. You can also use a bright light inside the car while you inspect the seal outside the car in the dark. The gaps will be immediately apparent. I noticed that I had to install the weatherstrip far lower in the door then the instructions seem to indicate in order to get contact but I did notice a great improvement. Especially in the higher frequencies so you’ll still notice that the lower frequencies will rumble through the floor so mostly all you hear is tire noise. I also noticed that the glass roof allowed sound to be reflected from the floor off the roof and back into my ears. I was able to correct this by putting in an aftermarket cover over the glass. Personally feel that these classrooms are a really dumb idea; sure they look good in the show room but practically speaking as a driver I never ever look up anyway and just experience that heat and added sound for no reason. I would much rather have an all steel roof with a conventional headliner.
@@colingenge9999 came across a yt video where a guy got great sound reduction in a MY by taping the rear tyre wells with sound deadening tape
I was hoping you would speak to driving characteristics differences between the two. Does the casting structure add a more rigid experience? I appreciate your thoughts...
+1 please do a driving comparison.
It shouldn't have much effect. I would think maybe a bit more body roll wout casting due to flexing otherwise the coil overs up and down are the same.
@@coltburks5450 I disagree. There is far less flex in a single piece, casted unit. Frames have welded in reinforcements to firm them up and reduce flex.
@@jeffkeryk3550 I believe that's what I said. A casted piece will Crack before flexing a welded piece will flex before cracking. Therefore more lateral flexing with the previous welded body sections.
@@coltburks5450 All good Colt.
I find it interesting there are a number of alignment issues in the new Austin build shown here vs. what a number of people have said about their recent Austin builds. They say their panel alignments are perfect. I think at least some have confirmation bias. They have heard for a couple of years now the Austin plant will produce much higher quality cars than Fremont and that has influenced their views of their Austin cars.
I must say, I recently bought a new Fremont build Model Y and the panel alignment is great.
The hood covering the wipers is a nice touch
Function of vehicle height and angle?
My 70 Pontiac Trans am had that back then as did Camaro
New to the Model Y but very common on many different cars (for decades).
I dont come over how good these Munro-Videos are made. Keep up the good work folks!! Greetings from Germany
Great job fellas. Since the world has gone extreme trying to pick on Tesla fit and finish, a lot my friends and I have (for the first time ever!) taken the same scrutiny to our own existing cars. Amongst a Mercedes, BMW, Ford, Toyota and Subaru, we actually found ALL of them had at least the same levels of inconsistency and misalignments as the Tesla’s show. We all agree that previously nobody ever really looked this hard for all the issues, because overall they are all acceptable. I feel Tesla gets a real hard time for what is already a common problem across all brands. First world problems?
Well said ⬆️
I don’t really agree. Owned lots of European cars and those has had much better fit and finish than my M3 LR. But driving experience, app and software is freaking awesome in Tesla, my favourite car so far.
Seriously? That panel gap on the roofline was unbelievable.
It's not just the gaps (and lack of in some cases) it's the inconsistency between left and right. If I were looking to purchase a used car and it had those panel alignment issues I'd reject it as (not very well) crash repaired.
Definitely true that it's a first world problem and also only an issue when it is pointed out. Most people don't look for it, thus never see it. Also true that everything has uneven panel gaps, not just Tesla. I've worked in the automotive field for 20 years for Nissan/ Infiniti, Honda/ Acura, Mercedes, Jaguar/ Land Rover, Bentley, and Lamborghini. All have brand new cars with uneven panels. It's also largely just a cosmetic issue with not proof of an underlying problem with build quality.
Your lame lie is boring.
Nice vid, I`m following the 4680 teardown with great interest!
Would like to add that Carl has a very plesant voice. More from Carl please =)
This looks like you made a script and thought about everything you wanted to say. This is a big improvement over earlier videos. Thank you for showing all these details.
Parcel shelf is a great place to put your suit jacket when you don't want to hang it inside the cabin. Also great place for hats and other light things you don't want inside the trunk.
Okay I don't usually comment on youtube videos but I had to stop this one to give congratz to the guys, especially the "interior man" the way he explains and speaks is just great, it seems like he was trained to be a professor or he is just natural. Keep it up guys.
Excellent video Carl and Antonio !
Can't wait!!!!
We love you Munro!!!!
Very good comparison! Some would argue that it wouldn’t matter in their choice for shopping a car, however for payment $$$ for a car, quality should be better imo.
Wow , really enjoyed this show , very well done thanks .
Our pleasure!
8:05 "...added a partial shelf...": On my 2001 Toyota Celica, they have a little plastic hook on the right and on the left. When I finally realized what they were for, ...well it's pure genius. They're for hanging plastic grocery bags so they don't fall over when you're driving home. Where are these hooks on the Tesla? With so much attention to cup holders...and LED accent lights with dial-in colors, surely the world has learned about grocery bag hooks in 20 years!
We have them on our 2018 Model 3 in the frunk. They were deleted in later years. We've used them twice, maybe. We're not going through a slalom when we're driving our groceries home. Hooking the grocery bags (all different sizes) around these things is more trouble than they're worth.
Yes,yes,yes...Carl is back....let's rock and roll.....
Having been a show car owner in the past the gaps do stand out to me. On the other hand even with the differences they would not keep me from buying this car. Most people are going to use them as a daily driver and 'stuff' happens, stone chips door dings etc. That's where I am now, a daily driver. Done with show car stuff.
Great review as always. Looking forward to the mechanical and electrical stuff.
Another great video Carl ! Never saw anyone mention the wiper difference
Love the recessed wipers, that will improve aerodynamics and efficiency a lot more than one would think. The thinner inner glass pane is a nice improvement too. It was just wasted extra glass before, more costs, more weight, and shrinking the inner cabin area.
I bet the fit and finish gets better with later production runs like we saw in Shanghai.
Recessed wipers, wonderful California design but buried in snow and ice in the winter!
@@youtubemakesmedothis7280 could have heated wiper blades. 🤷🏼♂️
I had a 1981 Oldsmobile Firenza SX hatchback with a large rear window, similar to the Model Y. It had one of those "window blind" style pull-out covers in the "cargo" area. It was great for adding rear visibility, by stopping the reflections of whatever you were carrying from bouncing their light points into your rear-view mirror. Yes, it hid what you were hauling around from casual inspection, but I found it a better driving aid than just a cargo hider. Even if Antonio cannot retrofit a parcel shelf into his Model Y, he could probably go to his nearest NAPA Store and buy a "Window Blind" style cargo cover that would fit. Mine also had the ability to be removed when you had the rear seats folded down to carry lots of stuff, like wood for several projects I built. I loved that car, but had to get rid of it when our family grew too big.
I picked up my model Y long range from Texas today. Boy let me tell you…
Body panel gaps omg 😳
The places you described in the video you are %100 correct they were there. Also, let me say the driver door you had to slam closed. And I had two dents on the front of the hood on either side of the emblem and no this wasn’t a paint defect following inspection from Tesla service center members. It was actually a factory problem 😳 we measured the dent from one side to the other and it was the same distance. Also, the seat release pull handle for the center seat was dangling by the cord. The service guy pushed it back in place 🤦🏼♂️. Yes it did go back in. Also, I wanted to note I will be checking this in 10 weeks to see if it’s operational as I didn’t try myself. So yeah I didn’t get to take home my Y because of all the defects they have to fix. It sucks because I was so excited to bring it home after waiting 7 months. But now another 10 day wait. This was at the Nashville, TN Tesla center. This is my second Y. The first I got was from Fremont and it’s was perfect! I just wanted to let people know check your Texas model Y’s guys.
This is hilarious. People obsessing over minutia. The first AH at Walmart who backs into the bumper of any brand new car will cause that and more. The tolerances that matter to me are the tolerances of the mechanical parts like the motors and drive line components. That Plaids can rip off 9 second runs one after the other for months and months tell me that Tesla's true quality is where it counts. My 2016 S has been trouble free, and that's what counts to me. TBH, I never took a quarter and ran it through the gaps looking for a mm or two from side to side.. All I know is that the paint is as bright and glossy as the day I bought the car.
I know this is important for some but oh boy how I don't care one bit if a panel is off slightly when my face is 3 inches away from the car.
This is knowns as "willful blindness". If there is an assembly problem that is causing gap issues, then it should not be ignored. These things need to be addressed and refined just as much as a gear or axle problem would need to be addressed-- when you're talking about "quality". Someone, somewhere has a job of putting these things together, and you're just ignoring that they even exist by only focusing on the motor/ battery ect.. those people do exist, and they need to step up their QC in letting these defects slip through; and/ They are not "obsessing; they are simply nothing the differences that are there. This kind of stuff isn't important to me either-- I take all my vehicles offroad, and they will have scratches and dents all over, and I couldn't care less. But that's me.
@@calholli But it is obsessing. Back in the 70s, when you could slide a sandwich between the gaps between the fender and front door of a Caddy, auto magazines praised the "beautifully turned out" coachwork of German and Japanese cars. Well, my buddy has a mint 300ZX with 12K miles on it and my Tesla gaps and paint are better. So what? It has gotten to the point of absurdity. When you have to get your face 12" away to see these "quality" problems, the problems no longer exist.
There are a bunch of model S that aren’t quality including plaids. Reddit is the spot to verify my statements. My own model Y was a steaming pile of 💩 and spent 4 of 7 months I owned it being “fixed”
@@ohger1 willful blindness. lol.. You're willing to look the other way not even see it. Some people can't do that
nice video there Carl, good to see you in front of the camera as part of the Munro dream team :) :)
I own a 2020 Model3 and it is the best car I ever had. Period.
Since it was delivered no issues whatsoever. No maintenance, no rattling, no squeaking , just fill up the washer fluid sometimes and you good to go.
Panel gaps, you ask? I won the award for the least amount of facks given.
More excellent Munroe people producing great content!
Panel gaps way down my list when car shopping. Thanks for the video.
Tesla: we love you, man 🤓
@@MarioDallaRiva Hey as long as the gaps aren't glaringly inconsistent, it isn't a big deal.
@@jarhead1145 That red Model Y in the film looks like someone backed into it. If I saw that on a used car lot, I would assume it had been previously hit and poorly repaired.
I would accept this on a small car like a Hyundai or Ford Focus or something but not an 80k car and I think that’s why people are so obsessed about it.
Never noticed the cut line in on the dash veneer in my Model 3 before. Now I will. Damn it Carl.
Sandy, I got my Henson razor in the spring of 2020. They custom made me a 5/8" handle because my hands cramped up on a thinner one. All of my blades still haven't filled one pint mason jar.
I’ve never seen a vehicle brand this minutely analyzed, ever. If there were any truth to all the FUD about Tesla, they would have found it by now
Other brands are as well, just not in the public domain. These analyses (benchmarking) is usually done in secret.
Every car, new or otherwise, is scrutinized.
@@TundishSkul others are scrutinised but not publicly, and un biased, quite a difference.
@@world-karma9127 they are all publicly scrutinized. Literally everywhere. Maybe the perception that Tesla‘s are overly scrutinized is because a layman can easily spot their defects. Parts don’t fit, crazy panel gaps, and terrible paint to name a few.
Curious-any improvement as far as the exterior paint is concerned? My 2020 Y paint is extremely “fragile” rubbing through/off from minor abrasion. The paint durability is a big issue to me. I wish I’d done a total body wrap rather than partial.
Now for them to take some time to upgrade the Fremont Model 3 lines
Great comparison guys! Every week something interesting! I heard that the Chinese made M3/Y has the best alignment and finish.
Yes , they do based on a few i have seen so far. equal gaps all round and surely not noticeable to me.
Give Antonio the parcel shelf!!!!!!
All these detail changes are understandable, including the window lamination thickness reduction, which was probably done to save weight. Would be interesting for you to compare the weight with the earlier model when the tear down is done, Carl.
Great video guys! Have measured the weight difference too? Greatings from Hungary
In my experience, the left side of the car was always worse than the right which the manufacturing seniors at the plant I worked at said was because a lot more people on the assembly lines are right handed than left handed.
Fit and finish "symptoms" can result from misalignments of many things, including hundreds of structural components.... many of which were removed with the giga castings. So you were lied to.
That makes no sense at all. The cars are broadly symmetrical along the longitudinal axis. You’d therefore expect the fit & finish of the front quarters to differ, but on the rear quarters the ‘best’ side would be reversed.
Never seen anything as bad as Telsa's for this, and the same ratio of handedness exists in the world
@@stuartburns8657 Not true, left handed ness is much rarer in China at 1% compared to the rest of the world’s 10%.
@@fredbloggs5902 China, much like schools in the 1960s North America, force kids to write right-handed etc.
Thick and thin glass in sound reducing widows is found in homes. Each thickness filters a different frequency.
Very interesting, thanks.
8:45 the parcel shelf could also help against road/suspension noise from the rear. It feels softly padded
Commendably illustrated comparative distinctions
8:43 in Europe, all cars have a shelf or retractable roller to cover if you have anything stored and for crash safety, not having everything thrown around.
Many people also get a cargo separator Webb, mesh, or metal grille not to die from being decapitated by your MacBook Air when front-ended by a car in the opposite lane.
In Sweden, this is considered a standard option, and I am a bit surprised that this isn't a legal requirement for everybody.
Since the Tesla's are designed in the USA, I Don't know if there are attachment points/holes to attach a cargo separator to.
Many cars also have these attachment points/holes behind the front seats in case you have folded the rear seats and have cargo in the hole space behind the front seats.
Tesla more often than not can get away with telling customers that any gap is “within spec”. I own a Shanghai Model Y LR and it has no noticeable panel misalignments. I’ve seen a Berlin model Y performance and it had some ugly panel misalignments. As far as I’m concerned, only noticeable/inconsistent misalignments are an issue
Yeah wait till they review a Model Y from Shanghai, Elon have said they were impressed by the work in Giga Shanghai
My 2022 Fremont Model Y, delivered late November 2021, has the thinner window glass and the wipers that are recessed. No privacy cover for the back, and no carpet anywhere except the floor.
Interesting. Panel gaps are not a big deal for me, so long as wind noise and water leaks are not an issue...on the other hand, the precision fit of my Henson shaver has spoiled me to the point where I no longer use my old travel razor, or the safety razor I left at the summer home. Another example of an somewhat expensive initial cost product that outperforms, as well as being cost effective over time. Highly recommended.
Great stuff, how do the weights compare?
I have a May 22 Fremont. I haven't put a straightedge to it put just eyeballing the gaps are good, EXCEPT, the rear edge of the right rear door protrudes a bit at the bottom. Other Y owners have reported same so maybe this is where assembly workers have decided to hide the stacked tolerances, LOL. I mean didn't notice that until my first wash and wax job. Seal on the door is wind and water tight so I am leaving it as is.
The Parcel Shelve can be folded an stand upright just inside the back door. Usefull when the shelve is too low.
It is very good fit - wonder if it on purpose?
The comparison is a good idea. That a Munro engineer owns a Model Y speaks volumes about the overall quality.
Sandy owns a jeep wrangler. Does that speak volumes about Jeep Quality?
Very interesting comparison. There was an earlier video of the front gaps and the bad shape of the front of the Model Y 22. Could it be, that the whole car is contorted? Would be interesting to measure the whole body.
Details, details, details!
love it, very details reviewing.
Beautiful looking cars. Definitely buying a mod Y
Is this an earlier video from the car they disassembled two weeks ago?
Is this the same Austin Y they’ve already started disassembling in their previous videos, and are having a hard time with disassembling the battery?
Thank you!
You're welcome!
It’s good to see genuine criticism, it might stop all the FUD clowns in the comments moaning about Munro bias towards Tesla.
No it won't. Fanboydome is a big money biz. Any little anything with a Tesla vehicle means its "cheap garbage" while those same people buy the VW ID4. It would be a comedy if the tribalism wasn't so ugly
Munro first model 3 tesla tear down was not complimentary at all but tesla seemed to listen to his suggestions. When he did the second tear down and saw that tesla made so much change lol s when Munro paid respect.
I would love it if you do build quality video's for other brands too.
my Mercedes sprinter is terrible I had to adjust doors for alignment and rattles and door locks fell apart, I fixed all myself being a auto tech. Dealer replaced both airbags, software updates and exhaust system which involved a class action lawsuit received $3600 so all car manufacturers have some issues so panel gaps are minor
Hahaha that advert!! So cool!
I would be curious to see if the castings have warp issues.
*And Johnny 5 told me: "No disassembly, no disassembly!"*
Always nice to get a new video but apart from this panel measuring being high level nitpicking I don't think that the build quality of an entire product line or a whole factory should be judged by one car, especially early into a new body part introduction. Tesla customers have no disadvantages from those barely noticable panel misalignments anyway.
A parcel shelf! Just like my PT Cruiser!
Laminated glass stops noise better if the two sheets of glass are of different thickness.
Next episode: Carl and Antionio drag race in the parking lot
I've noticed slightly less road noise with a parcel shelf. Ours gets used for long trips for that reason, but is instorahe because our EVs are used for farm work.
Panel gaps LOL :-) - You guys look so much closer than I ever have, because that is your job.
When I look closely at my other car, a NON-Tesla, I see gaps and inconsistencies that I have never noticed before. Now I can’t UNsee them. I wish I had never looked. (99.9% of people will not see them of course.)
What is the weight difference between the two
Interesting stuff. As with any evaluation, perspective and a point of comparison is what allows the viewer to make sense of it all. In this case, you compared the same model from different factories. That's helpful. However, is there a vehicle out there that represents a gold standard, with consistently impressive fit and finish, at reasonable price point levels? Consumer perceptions likely lean towards Toyota, but on a professional level, what stands out in your view?
Agree, they should have compared these to a gold standard. Or at least the bmw i4 they had around.
They should get a Model Y from Shanghai. Will make a huge difference.
@@Elektroschwaben and one from Berlin.
@@dchristo10 ... you better wait a couple of month with this one 😬
Thanks!
Thank you!
Any difference in handling due to the structural battery pack?
Strange that American-built model Ys have the parcel shelf that appeared late 2021 but don’t have the updated door cards with the wood trim extending onto the doors, those have been standard fit on Shanghai and Berlin model Ys since early 2021
Parcel shelf or privacy screen? Probably the latter. It doesn’t look substantial enough to support much mass. Also, anything sitting there could become a dangerous missile flying forward in the case of a sudden stop or crash.
Usually in European cars it's standard, good luck trying to sell a car without it even in second hand market, myself usually it is used to put a jacket or something like that if have rear passengers and stuff in the trunk, hats or umbrellas can happen and in my dad case that special pillow for your neck on long trips, in other words it's light stuff that are not to worry in case of a crash...
A cargo net is usually the answer to the missile problem.
@@DishNetworkDealerNEO You think alike. I almost replied to my own post with what you said about the net. I have a pair of1st generation Honda Insights. There is a rather large flat area under the rear hatch which is basically the cargo floor. The Insight shipped with a net and clips already there. There difference is the Insight mounting point and floor is substantial and well below the top of the seat backs. The Model Y foldy-thing looks like carpeted structural foam. I would not trust it to hold onto anything heavy, net or no net.
@@wtmayhew it is probably light structural plastic boards wrapped with carpet and seam sewn at the folds. Good only for light loads. Up to 20 lbs max, costing Tesla no more than $15-$17 to make in material and labor costs.
@@DishNetworkDealerNEO Thank you for the reply. Appreciated.
I liked the video, a recap at the end would have been good
What's the weight difference ?
I like the Red
Came for the shaving commercial! Joking aside, would have been great to see a Model Y from China too.
th-cam.com/video/ddw0V5mJVEg/w-d-xo.html
@10m....No it's mostly for wind noise purposes
But did y’all do a driving dynamics comparison??
I'm so over gaps.
I do wonder how many people really care about this stuff.
@@fredbloggs5902
Only people looking for them in the (vain) hope they can slow Tesla down.
@@fredbloggs5902 Almost none. I have a friend that was a car salesman for years. "how many sales did you lose in 22 years because of panel gaps?"
Answer: "what? what do you mean?"
How is the ride comfort different and obstacle avoidance
@8:46 regarding the debate whether a parcel shelf is necessary…I think they do well to cut down on rear end road noise. My M3 has more road noise without the shelf in place
Ironically not being able to see into your trunk triggers thieves to assume something worth stealing is in there. That's where there is a rash of break-ins involving the small rear window - the thieves break the little window so that they can reach in and flip down the seat to see if there is anything worth stealing in the trunk. Some people have avoided break-ins by leaving their rear seat folded down when they are parked - the thieves see there is nothing in their, and don't break their window.
Every UK hatchback has a shelf ... it's always been that way ... so they all look the same to the thief. Most thefts are done on the spur of the moment ... usually triggered by the thief spotting something on view. It's true that some people try the tactic of leaving everything on view but that means you have to carry every last thing into your house or your work location after every journey!
Carl great job thx
So when the Teslabot come out will you a straight ruler or a tailor tape to measure the gap?
Will Teslabot dress to the right or left?