My understanding was that it was intended for there to be sub-castings that could be cut and welded in at strategic locations for certain impacts. It's easiest to build from a gigacast, but for repairs you only need certain sub-casts. ...that's the intent...but currently those are not available to my knowledge. If someone fractures their gigacast (cough cough towing or doing stupid shit), they are a write off.
@@mikecounsell salesmen work hard at relieving you of your hard earned then ignore you once the payment has cleared. Then a new shiny promise is rolled out, BUT you buy it again......and so on
@@samholdsworth420 Cuba is still using cars that were mass produced 50 years ago, partially because they are stupid simple to repair & reliable. These old cars were mass produced only once, which is a whole lot greener than todays disposable mass production model.
About the "repairability" issue. We Had same problem with my kids car. Minor hit in front, twisted some of the structure. Thought it was an easy fix, but insurance adjuster pointed out obvious problems and "totaled" the car. If we had chosen to repair it, it would have been almost double to repair, via local shop. I asked the adjuster who would do this, and she said that some people have a "personal attachment to their cars" and will spend extra money. We thought about this, since our car was well maintained otherwise and still good for another 50K-miles, but actually found a replacement online for about the totaled cost, and only put about 1K$ in repairs into it. Worked great for us then, maybe not in modern times.
That's because of all the BS modern cars are made of. Bumpers that cost over $5k for the plastics? Common! Headlights that are over $2k? Also common! The front end body parts, nothing structural, on an SUV can be worth $15000+ in parts only, no paint or labor! A $10 (STILL!) sealed beam headlight still meets DOT on older stuff. It's just a scam and new car owners are the suckers.
The other side of the coin is the same problem as in health "insurance" vendors, in this case body shops, have been inflating prices because they can, because an adjuster can either take a high estimate or total out the car.
@@whodat9198 A *VERY* large crash; a right-off. Lucky if you survive it. As opposed to most crashes where you generally get to walk away. I suspect that part of the crumple zone is to also protect the battery pack so that the likely trapped occupants (given the crash intensity) don't get burnt alive.
@@Clark-Mills Not so...the crumple zone is why most people walk away these days. It takes survivability up from street level crashes into freeway level crashes.
@@MunroLivewhat happened with this cracking on whistling diesel video, any thoughts on this? Does Cody have a point on cracking vs bending? Also, can Tesla probably fix the issue?
Would like to see a discuss about the post of rear casting of cyberpunk trucks snapping from towing/impact. Is it expected from aluminium vs steel and is it acceptable
@@Chris-jt7xg A video where they jumped one 20 feet in the air then tried to use it to tow and when it broke, they were happy that it was clearly a bad design.
@@Chris-jt7xg He's probably talking about this entertainment channel where some guy flew the CT six feet in the air and landed its back repeatedly down on a slab of concrete. Not really a typical use case for a truck outside of a Hollywood set stunt perhaps.
As an Engineer who was unfortunate enough to graduate during Covid, I really love to see those videos and learn as much as possible! So please keep them technical! If you ever happen to make videos on general engineering including the formulas and so forth, sign me up!
As an engineer I explained how cast aluminium was not suitable for fixing a tow hitch too, every engineer would know this. And yes the rear cast on the C T has failed on at least 2 vehicles. I expect you will delete this comment also like my last one where I explained in detail why.
Whistle Dixie and it was reported on an E V channel by an Australian/English lawyer guy that a CT had also ripped the hitch off while towing on the highway, about 6 months ago...
Its not surprising they use own CFD because they have massive data crunching abilities and taking out F1 superlab will end up/already own THE best CFD.
Thanks Sandy and Jordan. Really great review of Giga castings and their evolution. Hope the old OEMs can implement them soon. Looking forward to more videos as always. Lotsa love to all ❤❤❤
I read about how the car absorbs the crash energy so that the occupants don’t. It’s very easy to exceed the entire cost of the car in medical bills, as well as lifelong injuries so… destroy the car, take care of the people.
5:23 .. The latest showroom models here, are further upgraded, with lightweight cedar two by fours, used as cross members ... Rather than the construction grade spruce, shown.
@@MunroLive I’m a Tesla owner and a share holder as well. I’m still wanting a comment on whistling diesels test. My opinion is it should be recalled and a boxed steel rear frame as a replacement, or something to reinforce the casting. A toe hitch should not just crack off, even if the weight of the truck lands on it. I’ve done that myself with my model y, I hit something with the bike rack and it picked up the car.
When I changed my steel-frame bicycle for an aluminium one I felt the difference right away. During some time I had used them both and I understand the difference between hardness of the frame and how much energy does it save when you push the pedals. I bet almost the same thing is happening when you transmit the energy from the motor to the wheels of an EV
When mountain bike frames initially switched from steel to aluminum, I wonder what percentage of them developed stress cracks from the jumps? It might be interesting to hear how bike frame companies mitigated that.
@aussie2uGA I doubt that there was a big deal with aluminium frames at all from the very beginning (I could be wrong, correct me if so). I'm in MTB for 20 years already and I don't remember any issues with them. The cracks often occurred when someone tried to fix his bike without any knowledge and proper tools (almost the same was with carbon frames).
@@albert7311 With steel, there is a minimum stress level required to initiate cracking. With aluminum even the slightest stress, if repeated enough times, will cause crack creation/growth. Downhilling on a MB is constant repetitive flexing.
They didn't there is no way to do that as Aluminium doesn't have force threshold and will eventually fail given enough elastic deformation cycles. On hardtail MTBs the upper limit is around 25000 km of mixed driving, probably lot less if only riding off-road. Suspension can prolong the lfie of the frame, but they are finite unlike well made steel frames which will last hundreds of thousands of kilometers with no sign of cracks.
Sandy complaining about procurement and dies having to be "tuned" is so spot on!!! I wonder if it is a horse a piece between steel and aluminum. My life is aluminum.
If they are just casting the Cybertruck frame anyway is there any point to the steel skin at all? Can/will they move to a more conventional (+lighter +longer range) design?
Its great half the discussion is about the speed of decision making behind the innovations. Traditional companies have giant consensus meetings that make even modest change a battle
A simple explanation is that companies that make products with a high degree of liability are very reluctant to make changes that may cause their product to fail. They can require a great deal of long term testing to prove the changes will last. Say, for example, that you are a window manufacturer that has a 10 year warranty on the weathering performance of your windows. How willing are you to change over to the next great plastic covering without at least 5 or 10 years of weathering test results on the new plastic? Imagine having 2 million windows fail and you are responsible to replace them (including installation costs)!! Same thing in the Automotive business, except you can also be held responsible for dangerous product failures that are not under warranty. Years ago, just about every house siding manufacturer in the US had gone bankrupt at one time or another because of unforeseen product failure liabilities.
The back's not supposed to fall off. It hardly ever does that, unless you try to tow something. Still needs some work. I'm all for aluminum gigacastings as a cheaper inferior substitute, if you can make the whole damn thing cheap enough to lower the price floor on new automobiles. As long as you add a sacrificial bit that can absorb fender benders.
I am very interested to see all the lessons learned over the past 2 years of designing Cybertruck, trickling down to the next iteration of Model Y ("Juniper).
It looks like with the Cybertruck, Tesla has widened their manufacturing advantage over the competition (a lot of so called "experts" expected the competition to catch up).
Another advantage of a casting instead of a conventional stamped steel unibody is rust. In a sheet metal construction there are many locations where there are several layers of sheet metal sandwiched together and welded. There is no way to get corrosion protection between these layers and that's where water collects and over time the vehicle rusts from between these layers until there is not enough structure to hold the unibody (frame) together. With an aluminum casting, you don't have these layered construction methods, plus you have a metal that is inherently less prone to corrosion.
seriously which technology!? he said he doesnt care about towing which really shows how weack those castigns are! you watched wistlindiesel trying to destroy the trailer hitch of the ford f150 and he couldnt.
with the casting shown at 7:00, has Munro put any thought how a 2 piece mould with one held fixed and one moving produces castings with pockets as shown. The half castings shown at 1:25 would be fine for the 2 piece moulds, but the full with castings at 3.41, and 7:00 show that there would be impossible for a 2 piece moulds with the pockets and gussets
9:12 It looks like they've built in the beginnings of a crumple wave- the vertical front bit is caved in a little and the load rails have that wave pattern... Like he said, "Water formed"? And, do all those 1/4" holes aid in cooling the part faster when it pops out of the mold?
The model 3 is a partial development cycle behind the Y. Also the Y is the highest volume car so it makes most sense for them to put their biggest cost save tech into the Y.
When I look at them stockpiles of castings outside the Berlin plant there seems to be lots of old models in the pipeline or most have to be melted down again.
@MilushevGeorgi I've been somewhat worried about him. He definitely is looking and sounding better. I suspect the doctors have found better meds for him.
Do you think they will switch to magnesium soon? Does it make sense from a weight reduction vs cost standpoint as reduction in weight result in cost saving in batteries and almost every structural components.
Can't wait to hear Sandy pontificate on the 6 new standard connectors Tesla just announced and are sharing with the legacy OEM and supplier universe to help move the industry to 48 volt architecture.
The only reason Tesla went 48 volt was for the steer by wire system. It's going to take quite a while for other manufacturers to get to that point. Until then 12 volts is plenty, unless you're done doing something really high end like the Mercedes active suspension.
I think the future eveloution of these casting will be a page from aerospace. If a jet is designed into a (QEC) for rapid replacement, it will serve the cyber cab excellently. Imagine swapping out a front or rear clip in ten minutes. The in service time would go through the roof. Module rehab could be a whole new industry. I wish my vehicles had this ability.
And if either of these components snap, I doubt you will be going anywhere but the scrap yard, that's if you survive an impact hard enough to break one.
@@mrlemm2030 The problem is not with the castings but the collision repair industry. Cars built with the large casting are bolted together. Unbolt the damage and bolt on new parts. This destroys their existing model. One could setup a repair center much like a factory when a damaged car could be repaired in a few hours instead of days. Another example of resistance to change by people making money on the status quo.
These castings are fascinating, but why on earth haven’t they incorporated a sacrificial bolt or glue on crumple section at the front and rear? This would mean any small crash could be repaired fairly easily, as opposed to writing off the whole car?
Hi Sandy, strange request or ask from me, a guy in the UK. I placed an order for a Cybertruck many years ago, paid the deposit and have an order number but I cannot get any information as to when or if the Cybertruck will be available in the UK and what may become of my order, deposit and truck. Are you able to provide any help or suggestions as I now you are close to Tesla and the team.
Around 15:00 wind noise was mentioned. As a consumer, it would be interesting to see what is done to reduce cabin noise. There are areas where some substance is applied - but it isn't applied to the entire part. How do they determine that spot will reduce noise? Also, are there any technologies or techniques to reduce road noise? I wouldn't think so as the tires must contact the ground and noise will travel through every part to the cabin. Is this interesting enough for an episode?
One way sound is transmitted through parts of a vehicle is as vibrations. These vibrations are waves that have spots that are nodes (almost no vibrations) and antinodes (the majority of the vibrations). The automotive manufacturer models the complete vehicle construction and knows the exact placement of these antinodes. Sound dampener are than place only on the antinodes to save cost and reduce weight. Look up ASTM E756 for some background on vibration dampening.
The Chinese are working on Magnesium mega castings, which may be the holy grail of castings for longevity, weight saving and vibration mitigation. Once perfected, it’s just the cost to work on…..
whistling diesel did a great real world review on these cast alum frames, they won't bend is the good news, but he proved why no other company ever did a cast alum frame, they are very brittle and make it easy for the vehicle to be totaled. LOL the giga-MINI factory where they are hacked together.
Innovation is what I admire about Tesla/ Elon. I believe the reason Tesla can get things done so quickly is that Elon isn't just an owner. He's an engineer and someone who encourages his employees to think outside the box. Where other manufacturers are bogged down with endless meetings and red tape.
@kevinlucas8437 I believe that there are instructions at Tesla that in the event you find yourself in a meeting where you have no useful input, or interest in the subject, walk out.
Elon is not an engineer. He has a BS in Physics which gives him a scientific background to understand the processes, but he has a glaring weakness in actually doing the work it takes to accomplish his "vision". He has a tendency to over simplify and over commit advancements so much that sometimes it tends to become lying. Being able to make swift changes can be good, but actually understanding the complications that come with these changes are another issue. As with SpaceX, many of these changes are not tested enough to ensure their actual performance or reliability.
You might not want to hear this so don't read it: I was once enamored of Elon Musk; his apparent intelligence, his push for electric vehicles to replace ICE cars (seemed wise for the planet and next generations); Tesla's method of production and rapid iterations that improved efficiency; etc.. I watched Munro Live and learned more amazing things ref. Tesla. Now comes a bit of background. My mother was a riveter during WWII working at Stapleton Airfield in Denver, Colorado. She told me some stories about her work. One such story was that at work there was a "hush-hush" assignment she participated in. In other words, she wasn't able to tell anyone what she was doing at work. She worked on B-17s there at Stapleton. Turns out her work crew was installing.... [I don't know if it's OK to say now]... they were installing RADAR. RADAR to help U.S. Army Air Corps pilots to more effectively kill fascists, & knotzees. It [killing fascists and fascist supporters] was a nation-wide endeavor in the 1940's in America, even in 'A-Murcah.' Her father worked at Remington Arms, also in Denver, with the same mission: Help the U.S. military kill fascists and authoritarian leaders of Japan & Germany. Americans learned to abhor the leaders and soldiers of Germany and Japan. Thousands of Americans died in this effort to defeat authoritarian rulers; fascists (also Italians under Mussolini). It was a national fervor... this national repugnance for things fascist and white supremacy. Seemingly, this fervor lead to the Civil Rights movement of the 1950's-60's. This fervor was supported by US History. The history of the American colonies rejecting the rule of a king. In my family the despising of things fascist manifest in an older member (who faught in WWII) yell at and leave the room when he learned that another family member (a young-adult with not much income) had informed the older member that he had purchased a used Volkswagen (in approximately 1962)... you know VWs ... the car built by Germans... the X-fascist ruled Germans... hated murderers of Americans, British, French, Dutch, Polish, Russian, etc... I recognized the conflict but did not engage in the argument. However, I have learned by my familial environment growing up; and my study of U.S. History in school to feel that fascism was, and is STILL not a good thing. Fascism is a horrible thing and this is not just my opinion. Now for what you don't want to hear (if you dared to ignore my warning). Elon Musk is no longer enamored by me. He is an [expletive deleted] supporter of fascism; an active purveyor of fascism [i.e., DumbP]. Musk is siding with not only a fascist, but a self-confessed, adjudicated sexual predator. [By the way, I was taught, and know instinctively, to abhor sexual predators and report them to the authorities if I ever detect that behavior]. And this fascist abhorrence was shared by CANADIANS. I had a Canadian friend tell me, "If it wasn't for the Atom Bomb dropping on Japan, I was in a group of Canadian Army members trained to invade the mainland of Japan. I probably wouldn't be here today if that A-bomb had not been dropped." So what we have here in Elon Musk is a [expletives deleted... fascist enabler, supporter... more expletives deleted]. And in my abhorrence of him, what he stands for/supports, I have done the following: 1) Sold my shares of Tesla stock; 2) Am in the process of selling my Model Y; 3) Have unsubscribed to Monroe Live and Tesla Time News (Now you know), and other Tesla hangers-on; 4) Encouraged my relatives, friends, associates, people I come into contact with... to do the same. Isn't this a shame... a needless shame. For an Engineer to minimize as "political" these feelings is missing a WHOLE lot. For an Engineer to mock this abhorrence is an element of "Gaslighting." Gaslighting is what bullies do to remain powerful (though still an [expletive deleted]). I wish you all well... well some of you... for I warned you that you would not want to hear this and not to read this message. Bah bye.
Musk has stated other manufacturers will catch up to their tech but their production costs and speeds will always be ahead. Production line 2.0. Almost totally autonomous 24/7 with less machines and parts.
![BOWKYLION - วิงวอน (ex-change) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cLdnZWDaO-w/mqdefault.jpg)
![ลองสุ่มไอโฟน 990 โกงมั้ย? [ โกงมั้ยครับ ep.101 ] | DOM](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bfsWe0j492k/mqdefault.jpg)
My biggest issue with the giga castings is repairability a very small collision can completely total 850 to 60 to 70,000 car
Not true.
@@erikowren7894 how its not true?
@@zurielheros8872i’d love to hear this as well but my guess is he has no clue or else he would’ve answered why.
My understanding was that it was intended for there to be sub-castings that could be cut and welded in at strategic locations for certain impacts. It's easiest to build from a gigacast, but for repairs you only need certain sub-casts. ...that's the intent...but currently those are not available to my knowledge. If someone fractures their gigacast (cough cough towing or doing stupid shit), they are a write off.
@@erikowren7894 oh ok, it turns out if the repairs to restore a car to functionality exceeds the value of the car it ISNT totaled. good news everyone!
I love how Sandy say hello boys and girls. Make me feel like I am back in school again and still learning 😊
Sit up straight!
Who ever thought someone at his age will lead such a young modern society I love the way he prefers touch screens over anything.
He makes me feel included as well…
One of the best feelings, for me at least.
For those readers of Sandy's age group; we know the opening line from the TV show 'Howde Doody' Show
Such a pleasure to listen to experts pour over the output of experts.
Such a pleasure to see peeps who are good at something
@@mikecounsell salesmen work hard at relieving you of your hard earned then ignore you once the payment has cleared. Then a new shiny promise is rolled out, BUT you buy it again......and so on
@@davidpearn5925
Are you okay?
These castings are engineering marvels. No doubt. Repairability is zero though.
Tesla will repair it for you 😉
ease of Repairability is more 'green'
@@MonstroLabnothing green about mass production lol
@@samholdsworth420 Cuba is still using cars that were mass produced 50 years ago, partially because they are stupid simple to repair & reliable. These old cars were mass produced only once, which is a whole lot greener than todays disposable mass production model.
A perfect description of Elon Musk
You get a ⭐️ with 🎂
You didn’t ask about metal fatigue ? The sales guy will give probably a “it’s strong” answer
Always appreciate Sandy's outlook and knowledge.
About the "repairability" issue. We Had same problem with my kids car. Minor hit in front, twisted some of the structure. Thought it was an easy fix, but insurance adjuster pointed out obvious problems and "totaled" the car. If we had chosen to repair it, it would have been almost double to repair, via local shop. I asked the adjuster who would do this, and she said that some people have a "personal attachment to their cars" and will spend extra money. We thought about this, since our car was well maintained otherwise and still good for another 50K-miles, but actually found a replacement online for about the totaled cost, and only put about 1K$ in repairs into it. Worked great for us then, maybe not in modern times.
That's because of all the BS modern cars are made of. Bumpers that cost over $5k for the plastics? Common! Headlights that are over $2k? Also common! The front end body parts, nothing structural, on an SUV can be worth $15000+ in parts only, no paint or labor! A $10 (STILL!) sealed beam headlight still meets DOT on older stuff. It's just a scam and new car owners are the suckers.
The other side of the coin is the same problem as in health "insurance" vendors, in this case body shops, have been inflating prices because they can, because an adjuster can either take a high estimate or total out the car.
8:52 Crumple accordion zone in a casting; obviously for very high energy events - nice work and great to see. Thank you.
It’s for a crash.
@oggyoggy1299 that's what a high energy event is....
@@whodat9198 A *VERY* large crash; a right-off. Lucky if you survive it. As opposed to most crashes where you generally get to walk away. I suspect that part of the crumple zone is to also protect the battery pack so that the likely trapped occupants (given the crash intensity) don't get burnt alive.
@@Clark-Mills Not so...the crumple zone is why most people walk away these days. It takes survivability up from street level crashes into freeway level crashes.
those castings are just insane
Great presentation overtime with the gigacastings. Short sweet and to the point- love it!
Thanks for watching!
@@MunroLivewhat happened with this cracking on whistling diesel video, any thoughts on this?
Does Cody have a point on cracking vs bending? Also, can Tesla probably fix the issue?
Sandy, please address the towing issue where the rear casting is snapping off. Tesla needs a fix for this.
Would like to see a discuss about the post of rear casting of cyberpunk trucks snapping from towing/impact. Is it expected from aluminium vs steel and is it acceptable
What’s an example of one snapping from towing?
@@Chris-jt7xg A video where they jumped one 20 feet in the air then tried to use it to tow and when it broke, they were happy that it was clearly a bad design.
@@Chris-jt7xgHe be referring to Whistlindiesel's video about the Cybertruck 😅
Whistling diesel is an idiot, but I would like at least a little bit of an explanation also. Especially considering my truck will be here soon.
@@Chris-jt7xg He's probably talking about this entertainment channel where some guy flew the CT six feet in the air and landed its back repeatedly down on a slab of concrete.
Not really a typical use case for a truck outside of a Hollywood set stunt perhaps.
As an Engineer who was unfortunate enough to graduate during Covid, I really love to see those videos and learn as much as possible! So please keep them technical!
If you ever happen to make videos on general engineering including the formulas and so forth, sign me up!
As an engineer I explained how cast aluminium was not suitable for fixing a tow hitch too, every engineer would know this. And yes the rear cast on the C T has failed on at least 2 vehicles. I expect you will delete this comment also like my last one where I explained in detail why.
@@mrlemm2030 I know of at least one case where this happened, but which incidents are you talking about?
Whistle Dixie and it was reported on an E V channel by an Australian/English lawyer guy that a CT had also ripped the hitch off while towing on the highway, about 6 months ago...
I also explained it on Zack 9778 comment.
@@mrlemm2030 Do you have the name of that channel?
Maybe the steel towing hitch should have suspension so impacts are not carried over to the aluminum...
Its not surprising they use own CFD because they have massive data crunching abilities and taking out F1 superlab will end up/already own THE best CFD.
Thanks for the well-delivered video guys!
Good video! I am looking forward to Sandy's reaction when the Model 2 tear down begins. 👍👍🇨🇦
Thanks Sandy and Jordan. Really great review of Giga castings and their evolution. Hope the old OEMs can implement them soon. Looking forward to more videos as always. Lotsa love to all ❤❤❤
What benefit do these castings bring to your life? Do they make the vehicles less expensive? Safer? Cheaper to repair?
Great run through of the evolution, great presenter as well, well done with the show Sandy👌
Welcome back sandy❤
I Can’t believe i almost missed this, Appreciate the quick update my man!
Tesla eliminated 600 robots when implementing giga-castings….🕺
That's the whole factory, not just the castings
Now the robots are going on strike because automation eliminates their jobs
@@lightningdemolition1964 haha, probably being re-trained as super soldiers.
And a lot of presses and tooling to stamp the steel. Oh and assembly stations/lines to put those hundreds of parts into subassemblies…
@@aussie2uGA or COVID cops and Hunters for Harris opponents
Thanks for always keeping us updated.
It would be nice if you addressed repair costs after an accident. Appears to me that almost any crash totals the car.
including whatever you're driving now
Sandy HAS "commented" on this subject at great length, numerous times.
Try searching for those comments on the channel?
Just get the GAP and move on.
I read about how the car absorbs the crash energy so that the occupants don’t.
It’s very easy to exceed the entire cost of the car in medical bills, as well as lifelong injuries so… destroy the car, take care of the people.
@@scottaxness3971not everybody lives in America😏
Big Sign saying "sharp edges, do not touch".
Sandy touches anyway.
If you know where the sharp edges are, no problem.
Thanks for the update
Great observation, great video! Thank You.
Thanks for watching!
5:23 .. The latest showroom models here, are further upgraded, with lightweight cedar two by fours, used as cross members ... Rather than the construction grade spruce, shown.
Thanks!
Thank you for your support!
This was a great.
Thank you gentlemen!
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@MunroLive
I really did. Learned a lot from this discussion. I own a 3 and a Y and still get excited about Tesla’s latest tech.
@@MunroLive I’m a Tesla owner and a share holder as well. I’m still wanting a comment on whistling diesels test.
My opinion is it should be recalled and a boxed steel rear frame as a replacement, or something to reinforce the casting.
A toe hitch should not just crack off, even if the weight of the truck lands on it.
I’ve done that myself with my model y, I hit something with the bike rack and it picked up the car.
You guys cover such great detail. I hope the cars are affordable and repairable! Otherwise, insurance will be crazy
When I changed my steel-frame bicycle for an aluminium one I felt the difference right away. During some time I had used them both and I understand the difference between hardness of the frame and how much energy does it save when you push the pedals. I bet almost the same thing is happening when you transmit the energy from the motor to the wheels of an EV
When mountain bike frames initially switched from steel to aluminum, I wonder what percentage of them developed stress cracks from the jumps? It might be interesting to hear how bike frame companies mitigated that.
@aussie2uGA I doubt that there was a big deal with aluminium frames at all from the very beginning (I could be wrong, correct me if so). I'm in MTB for 20 years already and I don't remember any issues with them. The cracks often occurred when someone tried to fix his bike without any knowledge and proper tools (almost the same was with carbon frames).
There are a few videos on TH-cam of aluminium frames shattering under the extreme stress of downhill mountain biking.
@@albert7311 With steel, there is a minimum stress level required to initiate cracking. With aluminum even the slightest stress, if repeated enough times, will cause crack creation/growth. Downhilling on a MB is constant repetitive flexing.
They didn't there is no way to do that as Aluminium doesn't have force threshold and will eventually fail given enough elastic deformation cycles. On hardtail MTBs the upper limit is around 25000 km of mixed driving, probably lot less if only riding off-road. Suspension can prolong the lfie of the frame, but they are finite unlike well made steel frames which will last hundreds of thousands of kilometers with no sign of cracks.
Sandy complaining about procurement and dies having to be "tuned" is so spot on!!! I wonder if it is a horse a piece between steel and aluminum. My life is aluminum.
If they are just casting the Cybertruck frame anyway is there any point to the steel skin at all? Can/will they move to a more conventional (+lighter +longer range) design?
Its great half the discussion is about the speed of decision making behind the innovations. Traditional companies have giant consensus meetings that make even modest change a battle
A simple explanation is that companies that make products with a high degree of liability are very reluctant to make changes that may cause their product to fail. They can require a great deal of long term testing to prove the changes will last. Say, for example, that you are a window manufacturer that has a 10 year warranty on the weathering performance of your windows. How willing are you to change over to the next great plastic covering without at least 5 or 10 years of weathering test results on the new plastic? Imagine having 2 million windows fail and you are responsible to replace them (including installation costs)!! Same thing in the Automotive business, except you can also be held responsible for dangerous product failures that are not under warranty. Years ago, just about every house siding manufacturer in the US had gone bankrupt at one time or another because of unforeseen product failure liabilities.
How much does collision repair factor into these cast parts? I love the idea but I cant imagine is cost effective to repair.
Fantastic video, Einsteins
Great analysis, thank you!
The back's not supposed to fall off. It hardly ever does that, unless you try to tow something. Still needs some work.
I'm all for aluminum gigacastings as a cheaper inferior substitute, if you can make the whole damn thing cheap enough to lower the price floor on new automobiles. As long as you add a sacrificial bit that can absorb fender benders.
Tesla and Munro...innovation and expert analysis at its finest.
thanks Sandy, another great story about Tesla....
I am very interested to see all the lessons learned over the past 2 years of designing Cybertruck, trickling down to the next iteration of Model Y ("Juniper).
so why does the rear fall off when you tow?
Ordered mine years ago, but when it will come to the UK 🤷♂️🤔
It looks like with the Cybertruck, Tesla has widened their manufacturing advantage over the competition (a lot of so called "experts" expected the competition to catch up).
Cant wait to see the 2 seat robo taxi casting
Those castings are beautiful.
Who care what a part inside your frame looks like, what matters is how durable it is, and how repairable it is.
@@hankkingsley9183 I should have said, beautifully engineered. I didn't mean to say they look pretty.
Another advantage of a casting instead of a conventional stamped steel unibody is rust. In a sheet metal construction there are many locations where there are several layers of sheet metal sandwiched together and welded. There is no way to get corrosion protection between these layers and that's where water collects and over time the vehicle rusts from between these layers until there is not enough structure to hold the unibody (frame) together. With an aluminum casting, you don't have these layered construction methods, plus you have a metal that is inherently less prone to corrosion.
White dots? Scanning aid?
Yes, they're for 3D scanning.
Yes
Do the cars rattles less now? My MYP 22 is so noisy / cabin noise. Major reason I want to upgrade soon
I have a German made MYP, late 22, no rattle.
I got a CT and know where the NVH is for the most part. Haven't mentioned it to Tesla or tried to remedy it yet.
My Austin built 2022 MY LR has no rattles.
Perfect fixture every time, that can be used in arhitecture?
That associate is FIT!
6-pack versus 1 pack...
🙋♂️THANKS SANDY,JORDAN AND MUNRO FOR THIS 🤗😎🧐EDUCATION AND THE PROGRESS OF TESLA USING TECHNOLOGY, AND WE WILL BE HAPPY 😊 TO LEARN…WHAT IS NEXT 💚💚💚
seriously which technology!? he said he doesnt care about towing which really shows how weack those castigns are! you watched wistlindiesel trying to destroy the trailer hitch of the ford f150 and he couldnt.
good job
with the casting shown at 7:00, has Munro put any thought how a 2 piece mould with one held fixed and one moving produces castings with pockets as shown. The half castings shown at 1:25 would be fine for the 2 piece moulds, but the full with castings at 3.41, and 7:00 show that there would be impossible for a 2 piece moulds with the pockets and gussets
Sandy back? im in.
Is that an Aerogel poster on the wall above Sandy?
Looks like an Aerogel on top of a Dandelion
9:12 It looks like they've built in the beginnings of a crumple wave- the vertical front bit is caved in a little and the load rails have that wave pattern... Like he said, "Water formed"?
And, do all those 1/4" holes aid in cooling the part faster when it pops out of the mold?
I don't think they are holes. They look like stickers that are reflective for use with 3D scanning?
SO why did the rear end get ripped off in that video?
I was never into engineering. But then came Elon. And Sandy showed me.
So why no castings for model 3.
The model 3 is a partial development cycle behind the Y. Also the Y is the highest volume car so it makes most sense for them to put their biggest cost save tech into the Y.
Castings are in the Model 3 Highland that has been on sale for many months. Tesla is always updating designs.
That thing looks like a little kid built it in his backyard out of Plywood.
There is no project like xAI66x...it is literally owned by Elon Musk
Too bad Musk can’t keep his love of apartheid and authoritarian figures to himself. He may have to move his headquarters to Putin’s Russia.
🚨🚨🚨don’t be fooled
When I look at them stockpiles of castings outside the Berlin plant there seems to be lots of old models in the pipeline or most have to be melted down again.
IF there were castings there which will be melted down, the point is they CAN be melted down.
When fully set up, this is an almost zero waste process.
@@rogerstarkey5390 This logic still eludes the minds of the stubborn. Good to see Musk can see beyond it.
@@rogerstarkey5390No, that's undergraduate thinking at best. The energy and the labor to reprocess are substantial waste products.
Please explain how the tow hitch may break off because the casting is too ridge. Apparently it’s becoming a problem.
Somehow Sandy is getting younger, fresher
@MilushevGeorgi I've been somewhat worried about him. He definitely is looking and sounding better. I suspect the doctors have found better meds for him.
@ for real he is reversing
00:08:22 Was the white, 4 door, truck chassis an example of a more conventional cyber truck option?
I now realize that the white chassis is not related to a Tesla product. Your engineering is impressive.
Do you think they will switch to magnesium soon?
Does it make sense from a weight reduction vs cost standpoint as reduction in weight result in cost saving in batteries and almost every structural components.
$$$$$$
Imagine a lithium battery + magnesium frame fire...
Can't wait to hear Sandy pontificate on the 6 new standard connectors Tesla just announced and are sharing with the legacy OEM and supplier universe to help move the industry to 48 volt architecture.
The only reason Tesla went 48 volt was for the steer by wire system. It's going to take quite a while for other manufacturers to get to that point. Until then 12 volts is plenty, unless you're done doing something really high end like the Mercedes active suspension.
🔥
I think the future eveloution of these casting will be a page from aerospace. If a jet is designed into a (QEC) for rapid replacement, it will serve the cyber cab excellently. Imagine swapping out a front or rear clip in ten minutes. The in service time would go through the roof. Module rehab could be a whole new industry. I wish my vehicles had this ability.
Tesla is moving in that direction. A non Tesla tradeshow booth demonstrated how a model 3 was a stack up of modules.
And if either of these components snap, I doubt you will be going anywhere but the scrap yard, that's if you survive an impact hard enough to break one.
@@mrlemm2030 The problem is not with the castings but the collision repair industry. Cars built with the large casting are bolted together. Unbolt the damage and bolt on new parts. This destroys their existing model. One could setup a repair center much like a factory when a damaged car could be repaired in a few hours instead of days.
Another example of resistance to change by people making money on the status quo.
Tesla would know how much production floor space the old design took up vs the new design.
Always great analysis.
These castings are fascinating, but why on earth haven’t they incorporated a sacrificial bolt or glue on crumple section at the front and rear? This would mean any small crash could be repaired fairly easily, as opposed to writing off the whole car?
8:30 ...wait cast in ALUMINUM? I thought this was a resin composite you guys were talking about.
Sandy talks in slow motion 😳😳😳
I genuinely think xAI66x will be the breakthrough for this run
*Laughs in Whistlindiesel*
good job boyz!
Thank you.
Beautiful.
You guys ROCK!!!! Thank you.
Hi Sandy, strange request or ask from me, a guy in the UK. I placed an order for a Cybertruck many years ago, paid the deposit and have an order number but I cannot get any information as to when or if the Cybertruck will be available in the UK and what may become of my order, deposit and truck. Are you able to provide any help or suggestions as I now you are close to Tesla and the team.
Sorry we can’t help you.
Around 15:00 wind noise was mentioned. As a consumer, it would be interesting to see what is done to reduce cabin noise. There are areas where some substance is applied - but it isn't applied to the entire part. How do they determine that spot will reduce noise? Also, are there any technologies or techniques to reduce road noise? I wouldn't think so as the tires must contact the ground and noise will travel through every part to the cabin. Is this interesting enough for an episode?
One way sound is transmitted through parts of a vehicle is as vibrations. These vibrations are waves that have spots that are nodes (almost no vibrations) and antinodes (the majority of the vibrations). The automotive manufacturer models the complete vehicle construction and knows the exact placement of these antinodes. Sound dampener are than place only on the antinodes to save cost and reduce weight. Look up ASTM E756 for some background on vibration dampening.
Sound IS vibrations
Does the Model 3 use these giga-castings?
Yes, the current version does.
Thanks for the advice! Got xAI66x, feeling bullish! 🚀
❤❤
A precise injection molded datum. Neat.
what a joke!? as if it was somwthing new!!!! injection molding is very old grow up!
@@alanmay7929 - You see trees, I see a forest. I'm over sixty, actually awake, and a natural oxygen breather. You might wish to adopt similar traits.
@@LegendaryInfortainment this has to be a new joke from you right! because its cringe at the limit!
@@alanmay7929 - Interpret any way you like.
@@alanmay7929 Injection molding for relatively small sizes is old, but Tesla is a pioneer in using injection molding for very large sizes.
Can please someone tell me if this gigacasting on the rear is shot peened or laser peened at all?
Great
It's injection molding to me, moulding liquid molten metal under pressure, rather than casting, which usually relies on gravity and one atmosphere.
Mass production is tough for sure
The attachment of a tow bar assembly to an aluminum casting is a failure point that shouldn't have been considered.
The Chinese are working on Magnesium mega castings, which may be the holy grail of castings for longevity, weight saving and vibration mitigation. Once perfected, it’s just the cost to work on…..
whistling diesel did a great real world review on these cast alum frames, they won't bend is the good news, but he proved why no other company ever did a cast alum frame, they are very brittle and make it easy for the vehicle to be totaled. LOL the giga-MINI factory where they are hacked together.
Chery Auto is gigacasting the entire underbody. Honda is also gigacasting beginning with their next EV.
Chery is using a VERY high pressure to do that.... Time will tell.
Honda? Probably a Toyota part that *They* will get from BYD (/s)
@@rogerstarkey5390 They're talking about a press with 13,000 tons of clamping force.. Not the pressure of the injection.
Has Munro commented on the instances of the CyberTruck tow hitch being torn from the truck?
Innovation is what I admire about Tesla/ Elon. I believe the reason Tesla can get things done so quickly is that Elon isn't just an owner. He's an engineer and someone who encourages his employees to think outside the box. Where other manufacturers are bogged down with endless meetings and red tape.
Elon dosen't own tesla. he is the CEO. tesla is owned by shareholders
@kevinlucas8437
I believe that there are instructions at Tesla that in the event you find yourself in a meeting where you have no useful input, or interest in the subject, walk out.
@@keithrose7209
In the same way that ... GM... is "Owned by the shareholders"....
BUT there's a difference.... somewhere?
@@grahammonk8013
Correct (And great use of the example!! 😉
Elon is not an engineer. He has a BS in Physics which gives him a scientific background to understand the processes, but he has a glaring weakness in actually doing the work it takes to accomplish his "vision". He has a tendency to over simplify and over commit advancements so much that sometimes it tends to become lying. Being able to make swift changes can be good, but actually understanding the complications that come with these changes are another issue. As with SpaceX, many of these changes are not tested enough to ensure their actual performance or reliability.
You might not want to hear this so don't read it: I was once enamored of Elon Musk; his apparent intelligence, his push for electric vehicles to replace ICE cars (seemed wise for the planet and next generations); Tesla's method of production and rapid iterations that improved efficiency; etc.. I watched Munro Live and learned more amazing things ref. Tesla. Now comes a bit of background. My mother was a riveter during WWII working at Stapleton Airfield in Denver, Colorado. She told me some stories about her work. One such story was that at work there was a "hush-hush" assignment she participated in. In other words, she wasn't able to tell anyone what she was doing at work. She worked on B-17s there at Stapleton. Turns out her work crew was installing.... [I don't know if it's OK to say now]... they were installing RADAR. RADAR to help U.S. Army Air Corps pilots to more effectively kill fascists, & knotzees. It [killing fascists and fascist supporters] was a nation-wide endeavor in the 1940's in America, even in 'A-Murcah.' Her father worked at Remington Arms, also in Denver, with the same mission: Help the U.S. military kill fascists and authoritarian leaders of Japan & Germany. Americans learned to abhor the leaders and soldiers of Germany and Japan. Thousands of Americans died in this effort to defeat authoritarian rulers; fascists (also Italians under Mussolini). It was a national fervor... this national repugnance for things fascist and white supremacy. Seemingly, this fervor lead to the Civil Rights movement of the 1950's-60's. This fervor was supported by US History. The history of the American colonies rejecting the rule of a king. In my family the despising of things fascist manifest in an older member (who faught in WWII) yell at and leave the room when he learned that another family member (a young-adult with not much income) had informed the older member that he had purchased a used Volkswagen (in approximately 1962)... you know VWs ... the car built by Germans... the X-fascist ruled Germans... hated murderers of Americans, British, French, Dutch, Polish, Russian, etc... I recognized the conflict but did not engage in the argument. However, I have learned by my familial environment growing up; and my study of U.S. History in school to feel that fascism was, and is STILL not a good thing. Fascism is a horrible thing and this is not just my opinion.
Now for what you don't want to hear (if you dared to ignore my warning). Elon Musk is no longer enamored by me. He is an [expletive deleted] supporter of fascism; an active purveyor of fascism [i.e., DumbP]. Musk is siding with not only a fascist, but a self-confessed, adjudicated sexual predator. [By the way, I was taught, and know instinctively, to abhor sexual predators and report them to the authorities if I ever detect that behavior].
And this fascist abhorrence was shared by CANADIANS. I had a Canadian friend tell me, "If it wasn't for the Atom Bomb dropping on Japan, I was in a group of Canadian Army members trained to invade the mainland of Japan. I probably wouldn't be here today if that A-bomb had not been dropped."
So what we have here in Elon Musk is a [expletives deleted... fascist enabler, supporter... more expletives deleted]. And in my abhorrence of him, what he stands for/supports, I have done the following:
1) Sold my shares of Tesla stock; 2) Am in the process of selling my Model Y; 3) Have unsubscribed to Monroe Live and Tesla Time News (Now you know), and other Tesla hangers-on; 4) Encouraged my relatives, friends, associates, people I come into contact with... to do the same.
Isn't this a shame... a needless shame.
For an Engineer to minimize as "political" these feelings is missing a WHOLE lot. For an Engineer to mock this abhorrence is an element of "Gaslighting." Gaslighting is what bullies do to remain powerful (though still an [expletive deleted]).
I wish you all well... well some of you... for I warned you that you would not want to hear this and not to read this message.
Bah bye.
P.S.: You're welcome.
Musk has stated other manufacturers will catch up to their tech but their production costs and speeds will always be ahead. Production line 2.0. Almost totally autonomous 24/7 with less machines and parts.