Cold Ep 4 Find Susan
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.ย. 2024
- Find Susan
Susan Powell was last seen on December 6th, 2009. Her friends and family started to worry after Debbie Caldwell, the Powell family’s daycare provider, sounded the alarm that morning when the boys, Charlie and Braden, failed to arrive at her home as scheduled.
Neither Susan, nor Josh had shown up to their shifts at work that morning, and every call that was placed to either of their cell phones went straight to voicemail.
When the police arrived at their house at the end of a quiet cul-de-sac in West Valley City Utah, in response to a call by Josh’s sister Jennifer, police feared that the whole family had been overcome with carbon monoxide and broke a window to gain access.
But, they didn’t find anyone inside. No vehicle in the garage, toys were scattered around the floor, Susan's purse was even sitting on the bedroom dresser with her ID and all of her credit cards and cash still inside.
What was odd though, was what the responding detectives found in the living room, Box fans, two of them, blowing air at a damp spot on the couch which appeared to have been recently cleaned.
After many continued failed attempts to make contact with either Josh or Susan, finally, Josh answered his phone. He had decided to take his boys on an impromptu camping trip leaving at nearly 2 a.m. that Monday morning, in a snowstorm, and driving out into the Utah Desert with his two young sons.
He claimed that he hadn’t realized that it was Monday, thinking it was still the weekend and, after realizing and figuring that it was too late to call into work and ask forgiveness, decided to make a day out of it with his boys. When he finally returned home after keeping his worried sister and officers waiting, he was taking to the nearby station for questioning.
At the conclusion of his questioning, after Josh provided nothing too helpful, he accepted the request to have his van searched.
Finding what Detective Maxwell described as, “Just ridiculous amounts of unopened camping equipment that you would find in Kmart or Walmart.” along with a dirty tarp covering the carpet in the back of the van. Maxwell’s partner found a pink Motorola cell phone buried deep in the storage area between the front two seats.
“He looked like a deer in the headlights,” Maxwell said. Then he asked “Josh, why do you have Susan’s cell phone?”
Hear how Josh responded in this episode of Cold.
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Episodes:
Episode 1: bit.ly/ColdEp1
Episode 2: bit.ly/ColdEp2
Episode 3:bit.ly/ColdEp3
Episode 4: bit.ly/ColdEp4
Episode 5: bit.ly/ColdEp5
Episode 6: bit.ly/ColdEp6
Episode 7: bit.ly/ColdEp7
Episode 8: bit.ly/ColdEp8
Episode 9: bit.ly/ColdEp9
Episode 10: bit.ly/ColdEp10
Episode 11: bit.ly/ColdEp11
Episode 12: bit.ly/ColdEp12
Episode 13: bit.ly/ColdEp13
Episode 14: bit.ly/ColdEp14
Episode 15: bit.ly/ColdEp15
Episode 16: bit.ly/ColdEp16
Episode 17: bit.ly/ColdEp17
Episode 18: bit.ly/ColdEp18
If Susan’s story sounds familiar in your own life, in other words, if you or someone you know is experiencing domestic abuse in any form, please don’t hesitate to reach out. Support in the US is only a phone call away at the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1−800−799−7233 or online at www.thehotline...
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Susan's story has stuck with me ever since I heard about it. What an awful tragedy, and a waste of an absolutely beautiful spirit. Thank you for helping to keep her memory alive. I hope that she and her boys are at peace.
Yes. There is a group out searching the mine shaft that is believed to hold her body
Thank you for keeping Susan and her beautiful baby boys alive! I don’t really know them but I feel like I do now. I’m also impressed with the work you put in to this podcast..it’s incredible.
Thank you! It's a story that we felt needed to be told and we're glad we have the platform to do so.
It's superb 👌 the only thing that would make it better would be some pictures to look at. Really even just a few pictures on rotation would make a huge difference.
Lori Miller podcasts normally are audio only
@@Elleoaqua sorry but this isn't a podcast it's more like a documentary but definitely not a podcast
@@spllthatwine What do you mean? It’s literally a podcast.
Just started listening to this series and I gotta say this narrator is absolutely fantastic.
All of those messages to Susan make me want to cry. All of those people expressing concern and their love and she's probably out in the desert somewhere. It makes me want to search the entire desert looking for her.
I feel the same.
Yeah I lost it listening to those voicemails. 😢
Those voicemales gave me chills. She had so many ppl who were concerned & worried for her safety the day she went missing. That says alot about what kind of person she was. Its obvious She was a good person. But they gave me chills to hear so many people looking for her. So sad. She just wanted to give her boys a good life & be happy
The name of this episode should have been called, “Finding a job as a Cop with the West Valley Police Department!”
I skipped past that bit. I know that cop said he did his best but his laid back tone just annoys me. He sounds lazy and defeated before it's even begun. I've listened to the entire podcast and I've heard him talk about what's needed to charge a person etc...still, I'm frustrated listening to him. Arresting Josh would have saved those little boys.
The fact that fans are blowing towards a "wet spot, " in the winter, when the air would absorb any moisture on its own...... That alone (oh, yeah, and a missing woman) should have been enough to deem the house a crime scene and close it off immediately. Unreal.
Exactly
KInda wonder how the luminol would have lit up in there.
@@RangerMelB I know, right?
The police let Susan down, I believe they had enough to make an arrest after watching so many trials, her purse being left behind and a missing Susan after JP went camping in a blizzard with 2 small children should have been enough on top of the wet spot and fans in the house. it was her day off on Sunday and that’s the day Susan went missing.. I remember when this case was brand new .. I remember when JP blew up the house with the precious boys .. he should’ve never been allowed to see the boys.
@@RangerMelB This is a momentous occasion!!! Someone else with the same first name as me!!!!
I'm sorry but ELLIS IS WEAK! Josh knew it. He knew they weren't doing shit to him. Ive,seen people convicted with all circumstantial evidence! This police department sucks! They missed their opportunity! Shame on y'all and ain't no one gonna convince me any different. I've heard the whole story! I came back to listen for the 2cnd time to this one. Where's the probable cause to search his van on sight? Y'all search vehicles for less! His wife is missing & he starts off lying to your face about no charger ...u see one plugged in. I'm so angry. Can't imagine how her family feels! That police department has her life and kids on their hands! Sorry. Ive seen people get searched for less, charged with lease evidence!. Y'all know it!
He really dropped the ball. The Cops who wouldn't hire him all those times were right. He doesn't have the temperament to be a Cop. Plus he's an idiot. I really dislike this guy.
And I don’t care about his journey to becoming a cop. It’s inappropriate here. Fast fast forward
You speak as if this were a black man. Welcome to the LDS Church. Welcome to Utah. I wouldn't be surprised if warrants had to be signed off on by a stake president.
Absolutely he could have been convicted on what they had. Those boys would be alive and that social worker wouldn’t have to live with the agony of having to witness it. Terrible terrible police and district attorney work. They should be ashamed!!
I've gone to jail over an unpaid ticket for a month before. Several cops were there to arrest me and they took glee in seeing me cry watching my car/home being towed away with my family heirloom jewelry left on top when they promised to save it as they forced me to take it all off.
He's being so rude and vague in his interview with Ellis. He could have at least pretended to be a little concerned about his missing wife, or act like he cares and give better answers.
The boys should have been taken away from him based on the time and the condition when he took the boys camping with a missing wife around the camping trip time. A clear indication of mental and emotional instability. Serving him with a search warrant the same day after they interviewed him would have been able to save the boys lives.
Tini Samasoni camping isn’t illegal
I don’t even think I heard the policemen say they actually found a tent!! The policemen said he found spikes, 10 of them among other things needed for camping, like blankets etc. but I didn’t hear them even say they found a tent!!
You’d think all of these small lies would become enough to nab him.
Taking toddlers out into a literal blizzard at night to camp is insane
An entire family disappearing in the middle of a blizzard and then returning without the wife/ mother, along with a few family friends expressing concern they believed somthing was wrong- that should have been enough to request a simple search warrant. A simple questioning of evin ONE of Susan's work friends would have led them to the bank vault she had put important video recordings of her suspicions of his intentions and proof of his intent. They would have gotten all the info they needed to lock him up for a few days and uncover his evil plotting that ended up taking them 2 years to unravel. There is NO WAY he should have been left alone with those kids after her disappearance- much less after what came later. They have the kid's blood on thier hands.
The message from the chiropractor's office is chilling. Who calls and says I hope nothing tragic has happened?
I caught that too!
Omg foreshadowing 😱
I thought the same thing
Same moves with Chris Watts. When the cops first showed up to his house, they called Chris and he said he would be right there. Then an hour goes by.
Yup! Another dorky loser who married WAY outta their league.
Another sad case
Yes probably killed her at home then transported etc fans drying carpet purse w ID etc
Christopher Watts had some criminal dumping to do before arriving at his crime scene home with police waiting there to confront a guilty man with 3 murders (4 including baby Nico) under his belt. Crime NEVER pays. Just don't do it.
He was probably similar to Watts and made some stops along the way home to dump evidence.
Detective Ellis annoys me. Seems too inexperienced to have had this case. Very unfortunate.
But at the same time hes not responsible for this not in the gross way.....
@Liara I think you’re right. Unfortunately-
Agree 100%
I’m glad you said that I agree
I agree, he was much more interested in his FRUSTRATION than he was with getting to the meat of the case.
Clean the couch at 10 pm. Take the kids camping at midnight...Riiight...sounds legit.
Susan would fine with Josh taking the kids camping alone and so late when it's cold out when they have to work the next day and she doesn't have a car to get to work. NOT. He can't even talk like he believes his own story.
I know. Why the cops didn't arrest him as soon as it was tested and came back as Susan's blood drying on the carpet is beyond stupid! I don't care if there was no prior record -- it doesn't mean this crime didn't happen. Stupid cops.
The investigators give the impression of being lazy, even the questions that they asked the husband were not thought thru. Was she planning to go anywhere? Why did you leave in the middle of the night to go camping? Are you sure she did not go with you? Any mother would oppose you taking the kids out so late in a freezing cold night, was she dead already? That's why she didn't oppose?
Omg, How in the world can you come up with such a ridiculous story? Couch cleaning at 10pm🙄 camping in the middle of the night. My cousin went to prison for 8 1/2 yrs for something he DID NOT do on eyewitness testimony, that was later proven false, before he was released!!! But this 🤡.
In the snow storm...
I felt like we heard way too much background of that police officer. It’s not like they got far with this case.
Britta Olson Exactly. I really didn’t need to hear the story about the detective. Really.
Thanks for tip...I'll fast forward! I was thinking...ok this is gonna have a major point...
Yeah but it's more like a book where there's supporting details
Right I was like who the hell is he describing..
Andrea Ellerbee You did have a good point. I like the background you get with books, vs. TV shows. I think the coverage was just disproportionate; if they had fleshed out all the characters like that it would’ve been cool.
They are all cowards these men that kill their wives and kids. Liars, cowards, narcissists, verbal and emotional abusers. And isn’t it funny how they always accuse and trash their spouse? I can’t believe how he answers those questions and yet thinks they are believable. What is scary is at one time these were people in love, supposedly these men would have protected the significant other from any and all harm. I guess it’s true there is a thin line between love and hate.
and they always are males that are severely emotionally stunted. Infantile emotional behavior is a huge red flag. Too bad she didn't just get up and get into that mini van and put that scumbag Josh in the rear view mirror forever. She would still be alive. sad.
Cha Ching, that’s all it is !
It’s breaking my heart just listening to everything poor Susan had to endure from the one person who should have been on her side.
That man never loved Susan . It was all a ruse. I am so sorry that she could not see through the lies. I truly feel for the people that really loved her , her parents ,friends and Josh's sister. Absolutely awful.
She had to endure his whole family, not just him. His dad and sister were/are just as messed up
Why didn't they get a search warrant for the SIM card on him?
Josh says *kills* and *dies* in very quick succession when discussing his 'cell phone' at 39:23 . He wasn't talking about a cellphone when he said "It tries harder and dies" he was talking about Susan. Vocabulary, Tone, Phrasing, Emoting. You don't even need to see the face to hear the truths....
Good points
I have seen cases tried and convicted with less evidence than this- This detective dropped the ball on this case- not writing a search warrant the first night- those boys might be alive has this case been handled more aggressively..so upsetting!!!! :(
💯💯💯💯
I love Ellis voice! This case is just so fucking frustrating, but also a black hole of information. Great job Cold Podcast!
His voice is much better than his police work.
This detective is trash. It’s laziness not inexperience. No telling what he missed that would have saved the two children.
8 Hours of Waiting Go By!!! "My wife is missing, Officer? *turns to children* Hungry, boys? Whaddaya want, Pizza?" No manhunt ensued after one hour? Let alone 8? Unbelievable! Every episode I listen to just smashes my ability to fathom about how low the details in this case can go. There was no end!!
It took some convincing to break the window... WHAT? No way , I would be like , “ oh yes , please officers do what you have to do !”
He had all of them so scared of him even if they didn't conscientiously know it, that when thinking about that they had in the back of their mind that if they were all fine then they would have to deal with josh being mad and how he would then react that they thought so carefully about whether or not to do it. Master manipulator.
Josh was pissed off about that window. Idiot. Self centered in the extreme
I lived in Alabama almost all of my life and after my sociopathic ex got his side thing pregnant, I moved to Idaho to live with my mother at 35 years old bc I allowed a man to take full and all control of my everything and I was sad and miserable when we were together but I slaved for that man and cooked for him 3 times a day with a smile on my face, his underwear were always washed and folded away. On top of it, I have disabilities but I never say around, I was always cleaning, cooking and taking care of my grandparents while he was at work...with her. And he left me without a home, without a car and without any help to even find a place to go. My family are full of narcissistic absent and abusive people. My mom is an alcoholic and has BPD among other things & the stress of everything I went through caused me to gain 100lbs & diagnosed with several neurological issues. All because I allowed a man who I "LOVED" to brainwash, manipulate & USE me and my family's money until side thing got pregnant. And side thing & I have had many heated talks about the situation with me telling her his truths and she doesn't even know him. At all. Ntm- they're 14+ years apart in age which isn't a problem but he's going into his 40's and she's 24...when I told her he was in the methadone clinic she didn't believe me. LMAO... So let the Ms. Know it all have her cake. I tried and I tried to warn her. He is a sociopath if I ever knew one. The way he could be two different people at once for two different families at once is just beyond my comprehension. The Cold Podcost story of Josh ripping that girls fingernails off and her crying at night from the pain of it & Josh Powell only replied " YOU DID IT TO YOURSELF"...1000% FAMILIAR. POOR Susan, I'm in Idaho now and my heart longs to find you. Your family should be with you. The living ones should have Susan with them. I truly hope they find her. Never give up hope.
‘You did it to yourself’. That is the underlying false accusation of every abuser to their victim. Not only do they abuse, they have the nerve to blame their victim for it. They are evil people!
Susan was pleased with her manicure & her sagging spirits were lifted, so "it" (the abuser/Josh 🤢) HAD to INSULT her by saying her nails were ugly/inappropriate (whatever, I don't remember exactly what "it" said). She was so hurt by "it's" comments she tore off the artificial nails and ended up with a painful infection.
Pax et Bonum I thought it was Catherine who got the acrylic nails 🤷🏽♀️
many cases have been succesfully charged with FAR LESS CIRCUMSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAN THIS ONE HAS.sorry but WVC blew this one badly.
It’s a shame that 2 children had to lose their lives for this officer to “learn a lesson” I find the officers comments and narrative about this incident as chilling as Josh Powell’s.
It wasn't an officer. It was a 911 operator that delayed dispatching a patrol car. But I think just allowing the visit CPS once again broke policies and allowed this to happen. Let's put the blame where it begins
@@DramaMustRemainOnTheStage the grandparents were pushing(I think successfully) to have cps to prioritize children’s safety over a reunification of abused children back with parents.
Cps in my state still doesn’t prioritize children safety even if the child comes from a abused family. It still happens, Susan’s kids were failed by so many people, cps, 911 callers, etc.
there needs to be a system to help people. Anyone can be an abuser, there could be another Josh or Steve out there and nothing is being done.
This cop sounds like a dope, not suprising he glossed over his troubles getting hired. Having a hard time finding a patrolmen job? Lmao
Susan Loughlin Ellis has a lot to say in this podcast. Does he once admit any fault? Not that I heard. His part in this is whitewashed. Maybe had to to get him to talk at all
No search warrant Ellis???
I love listening to true vrime videos that are several hours long and i really love what you did with giving us a glimse into the life of the officer etc ...different views etc that's brilliant!
Another family annihilator. It’s so tragic. I’ll never get past this case. The show that he put on for Jovanna, is the same show that he put on for the court ordered psychologist that was observing his parenting abilities.
police aren't learning. narcs are so slippery.
@@joydot7620 what?
@@DramaMustRemainOnTheStage the person is over looking how cps is supposed to help children in abused situations. Josh was supposed to have supervised visitations at a controlled location. But because of how troubled Josh was no parent (huge red flag) wanted him to be around them.
Josh should never had ever been allowed to have a supervised visit in his own home.
10:22 reminds me of the Watts case when Shannan's bag, CC wallet, etc were still in the house...Debbie here is the Nicole A (Shannan's friend) who came to give her a ride to the Dr appointment that day and called 911.
Josh lied to their faces & they let him go. You don't get confused or say idk when you tell the truth.. His sister had already told him she wasn't at work, then police asked him and he said she's at work. But they knew he knew. They found her phone so they should've put him under surveillance at least! I never understood how police, CPS & courts failed these kids. He treated cops like crap and lied to their face about many details. Why would he ever be allowed to keep those kids. Esp when he was the main suspect. They didn't take it seriously. They underestimated Josh a lot.
Podcast well done. Like a crime novel documentary.
I have been watching videos because of Heavy D, watched his videos and now yours. This story hits home on so many levels and my heart breaks for her so much.
Me too
I can’t believe all this happened just down a mile away from my house
I lived in Lehi at the time, alot further away than you, but this still felt WAY too close to home. I couldnt believe the ridiculousness of Josh's story & that police hadn't arrested him. When he blew up those boys after they returned from being with grandparents, I cried and cried and cried.
Those boys should've NEVER gone back to him after police caught him in the lie with the phone. They may not have been able to arrest Josh, but they could've kept boys away (while police had time to work out the reasons for the discrepancies) just because of the many psychopathic behaviors Josh displayed.
I hope this case changed the culture within the police dept regarding giving husbands such deference. It's one thing if they cant officially charge him for murdering Susan, but he went on to murder those beautiful boys. When a psychopath has no way out, they will take out whoever they can with them.
I remember the snow storm that came thru.... Its surreal!
@@treesab do you think the snow was intentional for the day that he wanted to make Susan disappear? Or do you think the snow made his alibi hard
@@Kimberly-rj2sc That's a really good question! I'm inclined to think the falling snow helped cover any foot/tire tracks and other activity he would leave in the snow. Normal minds would realize how bizarre it sounds to take two young pre-school aged boys to camp or make s'mores that late at night in the middle of a blizzard.
But, psychopaths like Josh can come up with a ridiculous story about roasting s'mores in a blizzard and believes it sounds normal to others (in that mindset, it doesn't even matter how bizarre it sounds to others because they think others are supposed to automatically accept what he says without question)
I think he probably used the snow to his advantage to aide in the moving of Susan's body. He could've pulled her on a plastic sled to move her, which would have been alot easier of a task instead of trying to drag her on a bare ground (ugh....it's really heart wrenching to imagine) I thought I heard the 1st officer mention there was a plastic sled in back of vehicle, along with the tools he bought at hardware store.
For those reasons, I'm inclined to think he used the snow to his advantage. But on the other hand, it could be snowing like crazy in one spot and skip around a particular area. I do remember the incoming storm was forecast to be pretty widespread though. I'm convinced he had it planned out in advance, I don't know if that meant a specific day that happened to snow, or if perhaps he waited for the opportunity of snow.
You posed an excellent question! I'll have to go back and listen to those first podcasts when she went missing and the time immediately after to see if other details jump out at me, keeping your question in mind.
@@treesab cps is a total joke- they will take children for no good reason and also leave children with abusive people and possible murderers.
Thank you COLD for providing these videos. I grew up knowing Susan at church and at school. I am still in shock of all the things that happened to her and her boys even years later. I wanted to thank you for providing these episodes
First of all: So that we can see that Susan was an amazing women that was being mistreated over and over and yet she always had hope. What a strong person. It is very unfortunate that her strong will and beautiful personality was wasted on someone so selfish and unemotional. She could have had a great life if she could have been with someone that cared for her.
Second of all. For you to take the time at the end of the episode to acknowledge if someone is living like this that they should get help. That is huge. I hope other women or men in this type of relationship will see it and realize what is happening and get out as soon as they can.
RIP Susan, Charlie and Braden.
Thank you, she has a story that should be told and absolutely, we wanted to make sure that everyone knows about the help they can get if they are in any form of an abusive relationship.
I am so sorry for the lose of your friend. She and the boys have always had a special place in my heart. I had an Aunt that was murdered by her husband and then he killed himself. He looked for their 4 yr old daughter but she was with a family member. Thank God! My Aunt Linda's story of life and Susan's story are so similar. Sad that beautiful souled women have to be taken from us. They also resemble each other. Gorgeous women! Prayers with you and the family and friends of these 3 precious souls. It is our job to keep them alive. 💗💜💜
@Debbie...While I'm very sorry for your loss I'm a bit perplexed why you post this on EVERY SINGLE VIDEO?... I truly mean no disrespect but the internet is filled with by proxy sympathy/attention seeking loons who pretend to know/be related to victims so if you are serious..I apologize..if not well...it's pathologically gross😉
Why did you copy & paste this comment into the comment section of every single one of these videos so far (and I'm guessing they're on the rest too)? It seems like pretty desperate attention seeking behavior. Ijs. We get it, you knew Susan.
@@Christine-xt8fr I noticed this same comment. I wonder if its attention seeking.
I sincerely hope the Cox family sues Ellis for everything that pathetic excuse of a human-being and officer of the law. He has absolutely no sense of service towards his community. Just punching a clock for 20 years to get a police pension. "I'm just doing my 20 years" "I don't like the smell of dead bodies!" Does this sound like someone who is interested in serving his community?
It’s been 14 years since Susan disappeared and every single one of them counts. She is not forgotten. Wherever her remains may be I hope Susan is at rest in paradise with her sons.
Thank you for this incredible story told so well I for one appreciate the work that has gone into putting this together it is intriguing and fascinating although horrific
This is a well done podcast.
"..All kinds of stuff back there." (In the van) Um you mean, everything you would need to hide and dispose of a body!?! My goodness, and then the phone. The fans on the couch, the messed up story and the stories from friends.. They should have called in help from another agency with more experience. It's not a dig at this officer, but admittedly, it was his first disappearance/homicide to work.
Ellis time and time again tries to be a prosecutor instead of law enforcement. When Josh blatantly lied he should have made an arrest for false statements and let prosecutors handle the logistics. He acts as though he needed evidence for murder, he didn’t! He just needed that scum bag to sit in jail instead of colluding with family and cooking up a scheme to get out of trouble. There are a TON of lesser crimes to get Josh on. Ellis might be a decent person, but he has to be extremely arrogant to not seek guidance after his interview and interaction with Josh. He should’ve consulted with state prosecutors to see how they could lock up Josh for the short term so they could investigate him thoroughly. He botched this up!
He believes he did everything absolutely right 🤔. I have a hard time listening to him
His dismissal of Michael Powell's involvement is too quick
Wait, so the Detective’s name is Ellis? And he gets a job by going in and saying he could care less and doesn’t give a shit? Like Ellis “Red” Redding got his parole in Shawshank Redemption?
Lol! That is hilarious! I never even thought of it that way 🤣
Lol
Good ol' Red!
I just don’t think having a big wet spot in your living room is a normal thing. A family member is missing and her personal items are still in the house, you need to get a search warrant period.
Especially in the dead of winter
@@shaylynneshelley6976 Especially when someone is missing. (We should all worry that when we deep clean our carpets or couches, no body better go missing, cause it looks shady as heck!)
You know how Josh had left a message on Suzans phone saying he had lost track of the days and hoped she'd made it to work, thinking he was taking the boys on a Saturday when it was actually Sunday when he left? I think he actually did lose track of his days, and had planned to get rid of her over that weekend, giving him time to do what he did, and the following day he thought was Sunday he was gonna get rid of any other evidence, hide or stage her purse somewhere else, but since he lost a day and it was already Monday the start of the work week, he got his voicemails and realized what day it actually was, how many people had already become concerned, and he was gonna have to deal with the fact that his sister and the police found her purse with everything she would have needed to go somewhere, the wet carpet which was only wet in the area of the couch with fans pointing in that specific area rather than the whole carpet being cleaned. Anyways my point is he thought he was so smart but completely bungled his plan because he had his days mixed up.
21:25 is when it gets back to the story. The detectives background was unnecessary
Uh, yeah. I thought I had a different podcast on. What was that about? Lol.
@Dana Davison, I don't understand your comment.
Dana Davison YES!!
It shows that the cops that wouldn't hire him all those times were dead on.
It shows Ellis barely made it into police department. I guess Ellis proves the Peter Principle. You rise to the highest level of your incompetence then stay there. He flunked the psych eval. Yet he accepts no responsibility for this tragedy. None. He is a true POS
This coverage of Susan's case is really fascinating. I so, so hope Susan is found one day. She seemed like such a good person, and she didn't deserve what happened to her and her boys. I honestly don't know what she saw in Josh. He is annoying to listen to, has no real feeling, is selfish and self-absorbed. I can't see what any woman saw in him, I really can't. I do feel bad for him that he had such a disgusting man for a Father, and clearly his parent's relationship and divorce was traumatic for him. But his subsequent decisions and behaviours were awful. He turned in to a truly dreadful person. I wish Susan had never met him, but perhaps the same fate would have befallen someone else in her place. I appreciate this insight into who Susan was as a person. She is a really impressive lady and Josh did not deserve her. I really admire and respect her and will remember her for her decency, kindness, willingness to make sacrifices for others, hard work and intelligence 💖.
I think Steve, was encouraging Josh to be horrible on phone to Susan to “manipulate” him to break up their marriage. Instead it fueled Josh to hate Susan. I have no doubt Josh killed his wife. I’m not sure if his dad knew before the fact but found out at least afterwards.
Josh was terrible, he was lazy and a coward. He wanted to kill the goose who laid the golden eggs. He ruined his own life when he had everything, a hard working beautiful wife who did everything for him. And two healthy bouncy boys. The only thing that’s F up was Josh, he was a loser!
Poor families.
This investigation was an epic fail. The investigators failed that woman who is still not found in 2020 and the two children that died at the hands of their father. Who was so obviously guilty.
Michael coached his brother well to give vague answers. Michael (josh's brother) studied human intelligence in the military and Michael was also on the road to getting a PhD. The Powell family disgust me
They should make a movie about this tragic incident; Wife and mother Susan Powell goes missing, the husband Josh Powell, whom everybody later suspected that he had something to do with her disappearance, but he claimed he had nothing to do with it. But Josh refuse to help search for his wife, didn't ask about where she's at, and didn't give any information about where she might be. And then Josh Powell commits a murder-suicide of his sons and himself.
Like other real life incidents that happened before and years later there were movies made about them that happened, I like to see this be made into a movie too.
So this "cop" didn't even give a shit to b hired or not he just hanging in for a pension. BTW: th narrator's tone nd inflection lets you know just when he's calling bullshit on this ppl
Couldn't they have arrested him for lying to the detective about not having Susan's phone, when in fact, it was in his car?
That was explained a court would not be able to make a case out of a husband having his wife's phone or vice versa.
And her sim card was not in there even though she used it the day before! Wth he should have been arrested
Criminals are not usually intelligent, but he is like the other parents named him, "Rocks for Brains."
Rocks for brains makes me ill! I pray we find Susan’s body and lay her to rest with her boys
I love Jovanna's voice, she sounds kinda like Janice from the Muppets lol
No wonder Det Ellis failed 2-3 times to get a job with that Police Department, he seems ignorant and arrogant to me.
She was MISSING, he came back from a trip without her, had her CELLPHONE in his car and had cleaned the couch? How is none of that reason enough to search the house??
Josh was clearly not helpful. The investigator should have asked more specific questions regarding things like the roads he took to the car wash and other specific questions. While searching the van, no remnants of used camping items were found. Also why didn’t josh take the officers to the camping site to prove he was there. I’m sure remnants were left there. The couch, was it tested?. A search warrant would have definitely made a difference. I think with all the circumstantial evidence they had, a jury would have put the pieces together for a conviction
Omg him talking to the cop shows how guilty he is. He isn’t even worried about his wife missing. He has asked nothing about her or where she is. I mean crazy guilty looking. And he didn’t expect to be questioned that fast. So he was mot at all prepared for it.
New viewer here. Compelling stuff, can't wait to listen to all of your podcasts. Thanks for the great content and research.
44:29 ...Josh's logic :
He supposedly thought it was Sat night not Sunday night when he spontaneously went camping after cleaning the couch at 10pm... but only goes camping with the 2 boys not Susan?
Yet Josh knew it was Sunday because Susan had earlier been at church. After church Susan had called Jovanna to help untangle wool for a blanket.
So Josh, out-of-character, makes pancakes for Susan & Jovanna Sunday 2:45pm ish, but perhaps drugs Susan's food/drink because she gets tired.
Then Josh takes the 2 boys sledding at 5.30pm that same afternoon?
Later that night we're asked to believe a dedicated mother like Susan is going to allow her 2 pre-schoolers to be woken from their sleep...the night before creche...to go spontaneously camping...& she agrees to be left behind?
Then on Monday when Josh realises the actual day, he does NOT call Susan, who'd be worried sick the children weren't home in time, & to reassure her they hadn't fallen off a cliff?
He also decides NOT to call his job about being absent on Monday... but insteads drives aimlessly.
Even if his made-up excuse of being out of cell ph range were true ...at some point on Mon he would've been within coverage to at least send a reassuring text to Susan - a frantic mother without her sons.
Yet when the cop finally gets to ask Josh late Mon, where is he & where is Susan...Josh says Susan's at work.
If I woke up & my family weren't there I don't know if I'd go happily off to work.
Everyone can see through Josh's lies.
He was such a liar!
He could play he didn't know it was Sunday...but why did the detective not catch that if Susan was aware he was taking the kids camping that SHE would have known it was Sunday, she was supposed to work Monday...if Josh had suggested to her they were going camping she would have said why? We both have to work tomorrow Josh, it's Sunday...it's one thing if Josh forgot it was Sunday but Susan wouldn't have
Susan has just been reported missing, now we are going to move forward with this but first let me tell you about what the detective has done prior in his life
@Dana Davison lets also take into account how the police department was back than. There policy, procedures etc
@@OurBob775 And while we are at it let's include the history of American police departments and how they were formed. And then we can look at the history of Homicide investigations. And how about all the forms that need to be filled out to become an officer....and all the forms needed to process and request a warrant......and....and....
@@user-jy3zl2vp4b LOL
makes me nauseous ..he gave no precise or definitive answers (maybe, pretty much, etc) thinks he’s smarter than the detective !!!
Why do “these type” of men who are capable of this, why don’t they just leave? I get the whole, they don’t want anyone else to have their family. Very selfish, but ok, that’s there dumb motive? You completely lose your family if you do the horrific act of killing their family. They dont get their family back. What the worst part of this is to me is.....other than the obvious tragedy of them being killed, is these psychopaths never truly looked at their family with love, they only look at their family as property. Because if there were true love
m, then they wouldn’t be able to do what they did. They are just narcissistic psychopaths. How can these creeps be stopped. Surely in this day and age they can’t be stopped. There’s no way or very certain jail isn’t a better place??
VioletBlue They don’t want any financial responsibility for people they can’t control completely. They feel that they own their wife and children, that they either exist to serve them, or they should not. They are total misogynysts. I used to be married to one. I fully believe the only reason I am alive (and my son, too) is because I didn’t fight for any money or property, and he still disposed of my sentimental things, and my son’s.
MONEY
Arrogance
@@brittaolson6550 You are so right. I hadn't thought about them having to pay for people they can't control. Sounds like you went through the same thing my mother did. I am sorry for your lost items...that was a horrible thing for him to do. My mother still can list the things my father kept/destroyed. Such despicable behavior....I wish it were criminally punishable behavior.
You can't understand a narcissist like that
i wish someone would have told josh "look we know you killed susan""we have a mountain of evidence showing you did this" you fit the profile of at least a sociopath but more likely a psychopath."'here this is a list of traits of the conditions with check marks where you fit in" you dont have anyone fooled."i realize people with your personality are cold blooded.thats why you arent phased by what you've done to your sweet wife who gave you 2 beautiful sons".you know shes dead and you did it but you just dont care.if you ever have had a chance to do just 1 honorable act in your pathetic life admit what you did.i know you wont do it because you care about susan,her family,her friends,your sons because you as a psychopath dont care but if you want to have at least one good thing said about you let it be telling people where susan is"remember EVERYONE KNOWS YOU DID IT,you arent fooling anyone.but for your own legacy do 1 descent thing and admit what you've done.
Amen, Joan!
Ellis was completely incompetent
His sister told him exactly that on a wire tap. Shes a heroe in this.
“Why would Susan walk away without her Temple Recommend and Sams Club Card...that’s just not normal...”
OK, serious question....does everyone from the NW sound like a woman/flaming homosexual? I mean the women even sound extra meek and then Josh hahaha that should go without saying!!! Josh was a closet homosexual IDC what he claimed, between his meek little voice, his lack of ANY physical strength and his overall fragile ness are all signs
My main question is: Why didn't WVC PD do a luminol test?? On ANYTHING?
Amanda Stephens they did. It showed Susan's blood on the floor and couch i think. This wasn't enough evidence for them apparently
Great job
PS. Y'all really need to give Ellis a break, it wasn't up to him to charge Josh with murder/conspiracy or whatever, it was up to the State of Utah, and they didn't charge him on lack of evidence. It wasn't until AFTER Josh did what he did in 2011, that prompted the state to actually release the investigation to the public
But Ellis did not question him on all the lies he was making. He was so incompetent
Josh had called his father, Steve on. Saturday the 6th, asking for a pancake recipe...hmmmm...I wonder what they found in the dishwasher or sink? Yeah right.
Hopefully someone will have their eyes opened to the danger they are in listening to this podcast. Thank you, the time and effort put into this surely will help others.
Damn.. THE CELL PHONE EXCUSE ALONE WOULD HAVE BEEN ENOUGH TO SAY.. YOU ARE BEING CHARGED ASSHOLE!! If I were that detective I would been pissed that Josh LIED knowing his wife's disappearance would cost them money and the FACT HE HAD ALREADY CALLED HIS WIFE'S PHONE ACTING LIKE HE WAS TRYING TO PICK HER UP FROM WORK ON A SUNDAY🤦🤦🤦🤷🤷🤷
Wish we KNEW what he did to Susan that led to her death💔
He maxe her think that thier marriage was gonna work.. The last week or so. Making her let her gaurd down. I'm pretty sure thats how he sedated or whatever he did to her that is NOW what led too all of their demise😢😢
I think he went the opposite way of the storm
I think he was relying on the snow storm to cover the evidence.
It’s so sad he killed the boys and him
Yep! All those secrets died with all four of them- Josh, The Boys and Steve. He’ll, even Josh’s brother, Michael suicided too!
I believe what you wanted to say was the boys and their mother.
Ellis was not passionate about joining major crimes...he lacked the passion and drive needed for Susans case. Sounds like he just wanted to retire behind a desk and grab his benefits.
It’s probably standard but I can’t help but think if those policemen didn’t tell Josh that his boys were saying that Susan went with them but didn’t come back with them, maybe this whole tragedy could have turned out differently.
I know they used that info to push Josh and let him know they were really onto him but I feel that he killed his boys because he was afraid of what they might say to put him in jail and then, prison.
What if those boys wouldn’t have gone with him and seen what they saw? Would Josh have just suicided himself and not harmed the boys? I guess we’ll never know.
I doubt he cleaned the carpet. I imagine if that were the case he would have seen the blood spatter on the tile.
There was blood on the tile, it was Susan's
Just my opinion but in the hands of a skilled interrogator Powell woulda gotten steamrolled and fallen apart
THE COP SHOULD HAVE KEPT HIM....AND INTERROGATED HIM FOR 24 HOURS IF NEEDED!!
COPS SHOULD HAVE .......CALLED TO HAVE .......JENNIFER PICK UP THE KIDS!!
JOSH IS...MAKING THIS UP...AS HE GOES ALONG....IT WILL BE EASY TO SCREW UP....HIS STORIES LATER!!
WHAT A CONTROL FREAK....WATCHING COPS SEARCHING HIS VAN!!!
SEARCH WARRANTS FOR EVERYTHING...BUT, SCREWED UP!!!
Cause, everybody covers the interior of their minivan with a tarp, and takes blue nitrile gloves with them camping......in a snowstorm.....in the winter.......on a Monday when they are supposed to be at work.......nothing suspicious there!
Missing wife's cellphone in the console? Not at all unusual......
Absolute tragedy the man was not arrested. And with such serious suspicions that he may have done something violent to his wife, unbelievable that the supervised visits with his children were at his home and on his terms
This “Detective “ seems extremely intoxicated
The “right?” that he throws in behind practically every sentence he says. 🙄
He seen her at midnight but went camping at 10pm etf
He probably made up the camping in the desert excuse; he knew that he killed her and hid her body where nobody would ever think to find her; and then he quickly made up a lie about camping in the desert. Ridiculous!
The DV advocate could have said something so having the kids there is better than leaving them. Cause he wouldn’t have left the kids.
Did anyone ask Jovanna if the scarf (that was found in the vehicle search) happened to be what Susan was working on at the time she was last seen?
Look. Well done, But heck...maybe just put his history on a podcast about law enforcement officers.
Fast forward through a third of the podcast. And it makes him come across as stuck up.
Sons in an interview, no search warrant...a woman is missing and husband is acting weird! Too many chances taken here.
Detective Ellis is a very good officer. I love this podcast, really helps understand things more.
I really think that Josh thought that it was Saturday night when he killed Susan and not Sunday night. It just seems like he had this whole story of going camping all planned in his head, but forgot about work for both of them and kids going to daycare. I think if they had really put pressure on him at the very beginning he probably would have cracked, because he already knew he screwed up with it being Monday morning when everyone was looking for them. AND THE FAN BLOWING????!!!!!! on a wet spot on the living room floor for over 12 hours? come on !!!! (I made this comment before I heard that he did get the days wrong and thought it was Saturday night when he killed her)........I just want to reach through the computer screen and smack him during the interview.
good point
Clearly, Josh was not the most adept liar, and he obviously didn't think out his "alibi" too well in advance, but I do believe there is some truthful information to be gleaned from his spotty timeline during his initial interview, as is typically the case with most compulsive liars. His subsequent actions with him and the boys offer a glimpse into his cowardice nature, as well as the fact that he is hardly criminally sophisticated. I believe it is highly likely that he poisoned Susan and left her to die, which is why he chose to leave the house for several hours that day, then he likely came home to find her deceased on the couch, at which point he left again to dispose of her. This would also explain why he took her phone, so she would be unable to call for help. I find it difficult to believe that he was able to successfully pull off the disposal without assistance, however she has never been found to this day, and the items found inside of the van would be conducive to dismembering and burning a body and any evidence. He most definitely had help later moving and/or further desecrating her remains. I just can't reconcile his actions and pattern of behavior with the level of criminal sophistication necessary to ultimately commit what was committed.
New here and new to this case. Is it believed Josh poisoned Susan the day he made her and the daycare lady pancakes? Susan went to bed shortly after that and was never seen again correct?
They think he put sleeping pills in her food to make her knock out while the friend was over.
Also Josh made tons of weird health goop smoothies with kiefer and other crap according to friends.
I think he was trying to poison her for months before he went with the murder. She was sick constantly if she didn't have food in her stomach. I wonder what he was using. Maybe antifreeze or eye drops
Well it’s more obvious now how the police dropped the ball. This guy sounds so inexperienced.. They should have arrested Josh.
Life 360 might be a good idea for these type of situations.
This is year 2020 any recent updates? Was that Susan ‘s remains they found on topez mountain????
Robin Bond nope. It wasn't Susan. She's still never been found
Bullshit. The fact he wasn’t worried about his wife’s whereabouts doesn’t faze him is suspicious enough. That in itself was reason enough to give him a polygraph
Yess. He doesn't worry about his wife. If that is not suspicious what is?!
I think he killed susan in the house then carried her into the car drove them camping and got rid of susan while the kids were sleeping but I hate to say I think he cremated her so she would never be found.He hurried cleaning the couch and carpet with that machine put the fans on and left.just my thoughts.
Cremated her? Where?