Yes!! This is exactly the test I was waiting for, it was really interesting Leo. For me how the modeller sounds is just as important as how it feels dynamically. Please make more videos like these on other bigger units like Fm3 or Ax8
I love your videos and your playing is insane. Please do a video on how to get the best sounds out of GT-1000. Please do more comparison of GT-1000 against other high end modelers.thank you Leo!
Thanks for this video. Quite insightful. I'm thinking of upgrading to a gt1000 soon. I've been using the gt100 for a couple of years and it's been great.
This video was really good, it's so good I found this channel. I always heard from my friends that the Helix is the best modeler out there, but I just love the kinda dry tone of the Boss.
As always, I enjoyed your very informative video. I think both Modelers performed well, and suspect the differences between them and the real Amp probably fall inside the range one might expect to find between different Amps of the same model. I thought the latency test was an interesting and useful addition. It might help to distinguish between "one way" and "round trip" latency. I'm not surprised the Boss had a shorter latency due to its higher sample rate. Most people don't notice/have problems with latency if it is below about 6ms. The Null Test is another useful way to see and present the differences between the original and processed signals. It is great to read the comments and insights of other viewers as well. It's clear your videos are attracting informed people who really want to understand how well the gear works before purchasing it. It's cool that you were able to partner with Mercuriall to provide a free gift. I would not be surprised if other manufacturers follow. As long as your demos remain honest, unbiased, and thorough, you'll have increasing viewers and happy subscribers. Thanks again for all the great videos you make!
Thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoyed the video!!! I do agree...we re all learning and so the comments are very important and useful, even in order to improve the quality of these videos! I'm also really thankful with Mercuriall...they were very kind providing us with some free licenses! Thank you once more, your support is really important for me!!!
The Helix seems to be the most accurate when emulating the real thing, at least compared to that plexi. It shoul be very interesting to be able to campare them to the whole range of emulated devices. And for a more exact tests, this should be made using recorded lines and reamping them in every case so any change in the playing dynamics between tries doesn't affect the outcome. Anyway, a very comprehensive test. Thanks for a great video.
Thank you Ivan, really appreciated! Yes, it would be interesting...but it would require a lot of time and money to acquire all those amps...In any case in my channel you can find a comparison of 13 amp modeling pedalboards vs the real soldano: th-cam.com/video/m1CglhicbJ8/w-d-xo.html
Oh wow, Leo put so much efforts to do these tests, Thank you so much ❤ It is interesting also to know about latency when we have around 10 effects especially with delays / reverb / pitch, but anyway, thank you. I also know it's not easy to compare effects but there have to be some feeling with effects) like when I switch from valeton gp200 to mooer ge300 - I see the quality of my effects rise so much... After I've tried headrush core - I want to replace ge300 with headrush cause of I also see noticeable difference, especially in delay) The point is some people want to buy these kind of multifx having real tube amp and they not really interested in amp simulations but in high quality guitar effects 😊 Thank you for this hard work. As for me, your channel in #1 for detailed comparison on youtube
My friend Leo, how are you? I loved this video! As allways i prefer Boss GT-1000! Id like that you made more videos like this! More GT-1000 would be awesome, and why not, Pod Go! Cheers from Portugal 🍺🤘🇵🇹
Thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoyed the video!!!! Let's see how the video performs and maybe I will do something similar with other modelers. Thank you!
My Guess: 17:55 The first modeler (0.5ms) is the boss, the second (2ms) is the helix. I love games like this. Ok lets see if I was right! ... Edit: Yay! I do notice latency and it does matter to me, but these numbers are both fantastic and very low. Thanks for doing this test.
Great comparison. I use the Plexi model in the GT as my preferred base tone. I have used a Helix and a real Marshall Origin amp (kinda like a plexi) and in the mix and in IEMs on stage, I can’t tell the difference. Great test and you showed exactly how close the modellers can sound and react to a real amp in isolation. In a mix, no one would be able to tell them apart in a blind test.
Excellent video🍾 you’ve done it once again. I have helix LT and GT core. I like both, I really really really wished the core had Bluetooth. Thanks Leo.
Im trying to work out which modeler to get currently in the sea of choices out there. Thank you for doing a latency test as its something I hardly see others doing. Really appreciate it Leo, keep up the great work.
Great video once again Leo! All sound great and would be hard to tell apart in a mix. The Helix is the winner to my ears, but only by a little bit. Real deal still sounds best. God bless and rock on 😎🎸👍
This may be one of the most important videos comparing these units. The feel and response through the strings is everything! ....... and no one wants to talk about it. Thanks. The GT 1000 may respond a tiny bit better but I sometimes think the Helix sounds a bit more like the real amps it is copying. I'm back to square one ..... undecided.
Hi David, thank you so much, I really appreciate! Actually I also think that videos like these are pretty rare...thank you for noticing it and I'm happy you noticed it and appreciate it!
I have both. Real Amps are not something I deal with, so I can’t say which is more real. I would say that the helix translates low frequencies better. I think the boss is more tuned, in that it has the frequencies where you’d want them for sitting in mixes, or cutting through in a band. But it doesn’t have the thump of the helix. By the way, the boss proprietary amp models sound more dynamic than the real models to my ears. The real difference between the two is in the gain blocks though, which I’ve always found unsatisfactory in the boss, going way back. It’s why I changed. I prefer the helix, though I miss the extra modulation functionality of boss, which is absolutely in a league of its own. By which I don’t mean chorus/flange etc. But lfos ramps and so on. Boss sounds good though, no doubt.
Thank you soooooo much, I'm really happy that you like he videos!!! The Michelangelo is a pretty old video...I'm really honoured that you appreciate the channel since that video! Thank you!
Hi, thank you!!! I'm really happy that you like the video!!! Let's see how it performs and maybe I will be another one...your suggestion is pretty solid!!!
@@ariraphiel39 Hi, so far I have done a video about latency of 13 amp modeling pedalboards, including the FM2 and the Kemper: th-cam.com/video/BpEgHGKPOpA/w-d-xo.html Maybe in the next week I would also do another one focusing about the feel of these two pedalboards. Thank you for your suggestion!
Great video. Always wanted to know how close are modelers to real amp. I think many people will be interesting to compare in this way modelers of different price levels, for example: nux mg300 vs Ampero vs ge300 vs Helix vs FM3 vs Kemper Or the series of same real amp comparing with this devices and then one big comparison of results
Hi, thank you...yes, I do agree...let's see how this video performs, and then we will decide what the next video is going to be! Thank you for your message!
Great video Leo, as always! Latency no longer seems to be an issue. In my home studio I usually record all guitars with software amps and latency has been practically undetectable for a long time now.
Hi, Jaime, I do agree, I also have no problems with latency and amp modelers. I' ve played a lot of midi guitar, so I'm used to adapt to the latency of the rig I'm playing. But some of us is very sensible, and they need instant feedback from their amps. Thank you for your message and your appreciation of the video, which is really important for me!!!
@@LeoGibsonGtr There is never instant feedback from the amp because the sound waves have to travel from the speakers to the player's ears. As the sound moves at 340m/s, a normal situation like 3.4m distance will take 10ms! So form the modelers, with headphones, it will be much faster... From the modelers into analog amplified speakers it will take longer and the time is easy to calculate: t = d/0.34 with t in milliseconds and d in meters (distance from the speakers to player's ears). You should add the intrinsic modeler latency.
My problem with all this new stuff is paying the high price for them and still needing to add IR's for decent tones which usually cost more money. All these companies need to do a better job for the money they're charging.
Hey Leo, another great video - thank you! . I have to say though I was surprised you didn’t touch the sag & resonance nobs.. with GT getting the low & hights right is a balance of resonance, bass & presence... the resonance & presence is really important in order to get close & that just adjusting gain, bass, mids & treble will only give you the results you got in this video.. hope this helps, love your work
Hi thank you so much for appreciating the video! Well, I prefer just to use the standard settings, I mean the ones that are also available in the real amp, even because it already come out a pretty long video...and it would have become too long and complicated if I had started to tweak also that parameters. I prefer to use the knobs available in the real amp, with the only exception of the master volume. Thank you for your question and suggestion!
@@LeoGibsonGtr I hear you but because all the amps in GT are different the resonance is key in setting the amp & if the resonance isn’t set right it doesn’t matter how much you tweak the other nobs nobs it will never match.. why? Coz the actual Plexi comes with this set for you... the GT doesn’t, therefore you have to set it to match it... If resonance isn’t right you can tweak for days& get no-where BUT if it is set right in conjunction with presence you can dial it in in minutes... hope this helps, you’ve help us 🙏🏽
Nailed it! Good thing is that I upgraded my GE300lite to GT1000core. never have regretted. GT1000 sounds much better. the 100+ amp modelers doesn't really help you to make a better tone. those 26? amps in GT1000 are just essentials and they all sound good.
@@armax00 yeah I do miss that interface and the those fx on/off buttons. but what I cared more was all about the sound. and boss has a 4 dividers so I could make a huge parallel chain. also double channel amp which I could mix them together. that's just insane. hearing two different amps at the same time.
Hey @@ch0005649 , did you try profiled amps (MNRS) in the GE300 before you switched to the GT1000 or were you using the normal amps in GE300? I´m curious.
Thanks for a great video as always Leo. I've been trying to decide between the Boss GT and the Helix so this has helped out a lot. I'm still in analysis paralysis, but this gave me a better understanding. Fingers crossed to winning the giveaway!
One thing I notice when comparing my helix to my JCM, is to lower significantly the master. On my JCM, the master really starts to modify the freq @ 6, on the helix it is on 4. One other thing, is the Bias, at 7 on the helix. The dynamic range is small but on the 4 it is much bigger. On your example, i would start by lowering the Bias, and the Master. I would also keep the gain @ 8 as, the in freq curve is differnt @ 8 and 9,5, and would compensate with gain block before the amp.
Line 6 always wins this, just try plugging your gear direct to mixer, here in my country getting a good amp on stage is very difficult. Mostly we go direct to the console, Line 6 just shines crazy when going direct. I still use my HD 500 for smaller gigs, kicks ass of any boss processors till date. If you do not get an Amp to play with please try out Line 6 products, you will be happy!. Awesome video I have tried to study your way of playing, very nice playing indeed!. Keep up the good work!
Both modellers are great, and can achieve some great tones. So I think, it is the effects and the firmware that is the deciding factor. With the 3.0 update, I think the Helix is inching ahead.
Hi, thank yo for sharing your opinion! I do agree: both these units are great options, and if you want to know how they compare in terms of tech characteristics you can check out this video: th-cam.com/video/dIdf4ms2kxg/w-d-xo.html Thank you!
Hi Leo, great video as always! As an Helix owner I think I can really improve the dynamic range of its amp models adjusting SAG and BIAS parameters. I would be curious to know your opinion on that.
Hi, thank you! I simply decided to use for both the units the same set of parameters that were the same available in the amp (also the gt 1000 has a sag and bias), otherwise the test would have become too long and complex...it's already 20m long). Thank you for your message
I love your thorough videos! I have a Helix Floor that I use with my tube amps purely for effects and routing and can tell that there is a liiitle bit of latency when going guitar -> Helix, then Helix fx loop send -> amp input. Enough that I can tell a difference, not enough that I would care about it. To me the Helix in this video sounded much better than the GT1000 plus it has a better UI.
Great Leo! As always, very informative video. I´d say that you left the GT1000 a little below in terms of volume. It´s quite noticeable when you switch between Helix and GT1000 that Helix is louder. It can miselad the listener... volume is very important in terms of sound perception. Maybe this explains that GT1000 sounds thinner to me. Maybe if it was at the same volume I wouldn´t feel that way... I don´t know. Other thing I´ve noticed is the horrible copy of the waves that modelers do! Take a look at the waveform just between both deep valleys (the ones you use to measure latency). It has really little to do with the original form! Also, the first high peak is higher than the second in the real amp, whilst is lower in the modelers... I really get surprised by that. Actually, I don´t know if that has a big impact in perceived sound... but at least it can be said that it´s not a good thing to begin with. Now I´m reaaaaaly curious about these details in profilers and fractal stuff. Do they deform the waves in the same way?? Thank you so much for these reviews, Leo!
Hi, thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoyed the vide! Let me add one thing as regards the volume: the decrease happened mostly when I decreased the high frequency of the GT 1000, and I prefer to leave as it was to let you notice the effect, instead of rising the volume to compensate...but I see you point. Thank you!
@@LeoGibsonGtr I have downloaded the sound of that video and compare volumes of comparisons objectively. I haved used MLaudness analyzer and meter in DAW. I had to increse BOSS volume on 8:42 +2,1dB and decrease Helix volume on 8:45 -1,5dB to match Plexi volume. This is 3,6dB difference between Helix and Boss, and even I am big fan of You, I am also big fan of GTK and this is not fair for BOSS :-). If one matches volumes, BOSS sounds much more full... :-)
I believe that the latency is pretty small as the human ear does not near audio artifacts until it goes towards 100ms (maybe a bit lower than that but around there. The latency test was very interesting and I would love to see more of these tests. An other test that could be interesting is the null test where the audio are overlapped and if they match 100 percent, they cancel out. Is a pretty precise test in my opinion for comparisons.
Hi Armando, thank you! I'm really happy that you like this test...I will probably do more of them in the future. I see what you mean with the phase reversal test...even if it is very very hard to get the exact same sound. Thank you once more!!!
@@picksalot1 probably also the most accurate. It takes away a lot of subjective variables but Id imagine it would be difficult to reproduce the feel, though if recorded, in input signal might be exactly the same
Very very informative indeed. Feel and dynamics are key to liking or disliking an amp or unit. Introducing multifx will always result in added latency because of the a/d conversions, the helix having 4x as much latency as the boss with just 2 effects in the chain (amp + ir loader) is quite a big difference. Would be interesting to know if the difference increases or decreases with adding more effects in the chain. Thanks again Leo, subbed on instagram!
Thank you, really appreciated, I'm happy that you found the video helpful!!! I do agree...I'm also curious to know if the latency increase...😊...maybe in the next video...Thank you also for your instagram sub!!!
Hi, thanks for your premium Vids! Could it be that the Gt1000 sounds somehow hourse when it "breaks up"? Thats very nasty. Are you shure the Boss has a correct Level in the A/D Conversion? The "Boss Sound" sounds for me always a bit overhyped and rough. Somehow like the Kemper. All in my Ears. But it has the best Latency Management..Its not Easy to pick the right one. But your great Vids helped me to pick 2 of the Leader Boards to test it at Home at the same Time. When i pick up my Guiter, and ai can hear and! Feel that the natural Picksound (without Pickups aso..) comes first so that they tech out (because it sounds earlyer) i loos my Feeling instantly. I wish it would be not like this. But on a real Amp, i have no Question, its immidiatly, your connected within the touch of your Strings and the Membran of the Cab, with electrons as sumitter, that can no digital Gear bring ever. BUT! Its mutch easyer to handle and mutch more cheeper to use Didital Stuff. So i have to pu my Eays closed and dont think about. Maybe i test the Line6 and .. i dont know ioiA Comparison with the Neural Plugins and the Hardware would be intersting. With my old RME Hammerfall PCI Multiface i can get 32 S/B so the Plugin shows 0.7ms. And it feels realy fast.
Considering that Line 6 and Boss probably modeled different Plexi’s the results were remarkably similar. Their models may very well be an amalgam of several examples of the amps.
Hi Leo, between the gt1000core (knowing that its the same as the gt1000, just smaller) and the hx stomp. which would you prefer as an upgrade from the pod hd500?
Hi Jev, I did a full video comparison that you can check out here: th-cam.com/video/MZFsoYLg8sI/w-d-xo.html In that video you there is a demo song, a detailed companion chart and my 2 cents at the end! I hope you enjoy! Thank you for your message and your question!
For the longest time I have been using the amp designer in Logic Pro to record and I got used to its "feel" (i.e. latency). I got the Boss GT-1000 Core in the beginning of this year. The first thing I noticed by just playing one note was how astoundingly quick and responsive it was. It was just one of those so-good-it's-weird moments. Now I can't go back.
After trying tonex , helix , and then a real amp.... i'm now in a need of getting gt1000, just waiting for the right price. Tonex sounds great, responds great to playing and all, but it's latency if i remember correctly is somewhere in helix areas. And od course i may be biased, but that small fraction of a second is actually noticible when playing , and it seems to have other conaeqences than just the delay of the sound
I'm not surprised by the lower latency of the Boss. They are probably using similar processors that Roland uses for eDrum kits, a device that demands low latency.
@LeoGibsonGtr I am debating if I should get a Helix, Kemper or Quad Cortex. I know Kemper and QC sound a little better but cost a lot more. I am think Helix is the best option. What's your opinion on that?
Well, actually there is not a black and white answer...but the QC may be the more complete solution offering both modelling and profiling (as you are uncertain between modellers and profiles)...If you can...I would save same money and get the QC....
Very important test almost no one does for the public! Most youtubers wanna help to sell the units, because they get paid by the manufacturers. Therefore they play the modelers with the corresponding dynamic and attack and don't tell about the latency feel. In short: They don't show the weaknesses of the units compared to actual amps. That's why so many customers are disappointed and returning to tube amps, despite the great sound of nowadays modelers.
Thank you and I hope this video was of some help. Some modellers have come to pretty good latency value. If you are interested you may want to check out this video: th-cam.com/video/oU0-_3Hub9o/w-d-xo.html In that video I have compared the latency of 23 modellers...and then in the channel there are some deep dives into latency for some specific modellers. Thank you!
@@LeoGibsonGtr Leo, of course I've seen it already :) You and "Max Solo Music" are the only two guitar-gear-latency-testing-guys I know of on youtube. So keep it up. By the way, I have a suggestion for you: Many people use hardware IR loaders as only digital devices on their pedalboards and want to know the latency those devices introduce into their rigs. So it would be great if you could test and compare some cabinet emulators. There are plenty out there nowadays.
I think the latency difference is why so many people say the GT-1000 AIRD has the real feel of playing through a real amp. While I like that the Helix has more amps, I think you can do more with the Boss if you play with the built-in effects. The feel of the amp spawns more creativity. I prefer Boss over Helix just a little. Still, the real deal is best.
I think this demonstrates that the differences between modelers is much narrower than between the modelers and the real deal. Digital circuits produce a square wave, tubes produce a sine wave. Software can attempt to compensate for this but it is a limitation of digital circuits. Modeling is better than it was 10 years ago but still has yet to really produce tube amp dynamics with 100% fidelity. That said, I have gotten good tones with both, just different and approach modelers not as faithful recreations but a pallet to start from to build my own tone.
Would you do a review on the Neural DSP Quad Cortex? Maybe Quad Cortex Vs Helix or Gt-1000. I've really enjoyed all of you Effects Processor vidoes so far!
Hi yes for sure! I've entered my order in January 2020 so I'm gonna be among the first to receive it...so...stay tuned 😊! Thank you and I'm really happy that you enjoyed my videos!!!
i own the GT 1000 core and In My Humble Opinion, the plexi thing on the GT 1000 is not good at first, you have to have time to tweak it. but there is some amp that feel great.
The Suhr reactive load influences the behaviour of the amp, like a cabinet. The amp/cab interaction for the modellers is left out in the test. Could be the reason the dynamics were so different between amp and modellers.
I own helix lt and kemper. I was amazed how much helix sounded like real plex. Pretty amazing. The GT sounds alright, but it clearly sounds different .. Noticeable on little phone speakers
I have the Helix and have been watching all the TH-cam hype around the Marshall SV20 mini plexi. I think with all the added cost of a cabinet and/or load box to play at home audio levels, I'm better off to stay with the Helix. For the minimal benefit of a real amp's better touch responsiveness I don't think spending thousands for the real amp and other bits is worth it. Thanks for helping me make up my mind and save thousands!.
Thanks you for this Leo, excellent information. I've stopped the video before the latency reveal to guess the helix will be the slower of the two modelers.. Let's see what I know ! Edit.. I know now, but won't post a spoiler!
Hi Leo , awesome review ! I prefered the Helix ,although it has a tendency to add mids , i found the boss high frequencies overall less pleasant, a little harsh .And yes i agree the real amp still the best of the batch .Regarding the latency , from my experience it becomes noticeable by 5ms increments , 2 ms is really negligeable. I have a question for you , regardless the price but only considering the tone and the responsiveness, would you choose the boss GT1000 or the Ampero ?
Hi, thank you so much, I'm really happy that you appreciate the review!!! Well, the ampero is really good, but I just slightly prefer the Boss effects, as I'm more used to them. Nevertheless the ampero is a great modeler, and for instance it has a very good Soldano simulation, that is missing in the boss. Thank you once more!
Thank you for this test Leo. Input level of boss does not seems to be set well according indication and overall boss volume is low. It will sound different then. I know it is very difficult to manage. If this will be done, dynamics of BOSS would be better. BUT Helix would sound better. To me Helix just not react right on play style, but it sounds better for one set working point. Lot of magic is in internal IRs, what are more usable, than those in BOSS. And Marshall amp and internal IR is weirdest amp there, I consider it to be the worst there...
Line6 has a tone of its own on their fx. Boss is more "transparent" (although this is not really the right term for it. I actually find Boss fx and drives to be rather "bland" than transparent. "Transparent" fx you find in studio grade stuff like Eventide)
Grandissimo! Test utilissimo e davvero MOLTO interessante. Sarei estasiato se tu potessi fare una cosa analoga per FM3 vs Boss GT-1000 e FM3 vs. Kemper.
Grazie mille!!!! Let's see how this video performs and than we will decide what to do next. Thank you very much for your suggestions and appreciation!!!
Leo, this is very nice comparison again, thank you. I have commented below the volume difference between helix, boss and plexi, what makes difference, but even so, I slightly prefere Helix sound here even it miss some presence and treble and there is some oscilating interference. I have tried Helix native and it was not fun to play it, maybe unit itself is better, but Native was like to play a PC keyboard not a guitar. Maybe I have made something wrong. Helix can deffinitely produce very nice sounds.
Hi Jar, thank you, I'm happy that you found the video interesting! Yes, I see the volume change you are referring to...let me just add that the perceived loudness depends also on the level of gain and on the frequency (we are not equally sensitive to sounds of all frequencies so perceived loudness of a tone in fact depends on frequency as well as intensity), and in this video I was changing pretty intensively both the gain and the frequencies. While doing this I was not compensating the volume so that you can also hear the resulting effect and even because it would have become a nightmare to measure the perceived loudness every time a change in freq or gain was applied. Thank you.
@@LeoGibsonGtr I totally understand what you mean! But every comparison I have made I must always equal volume. If I do not that one signal is more gainy and with bigger treble and bass, what happened here as well. I guess it has something to do, beside other things, with Fletcher Munson curve. Please do not get me wrong, I love your videos and appreciate your work!
That plexi sounds great, but it has no master volume, so I bet not only would my landlord throw me out, the police would be at my apartment door if I played one. :) Glad to see a comparison to modelers.... :)
Latency is important for me. But even more important is the lag between switching full patches. Boss has practically none of those and that is why i own it. For me its less about how many amp model s are there or how accurate they are. I just need a couple of decent sounds and thats it. Regarding dynamics none of them are like a tube amp. Not bad but not nearly the same. Only downside of modelers. Still they are light years ahead of modelers of yesterday. Digital is getting there real fast. Feel and sound are so subjective. weirdly enough i dont like tube amps sound in a room. Mic'ed up are great and smooth but in a room all of them sound brittle and sizzly in my ears. I cant play direct either. It is lifeless. So gt1000 a real tube power amp and a 2x12 works wonders for me. Sorry for the long post.
Hi Leonis, thank you for sharing and no problem at all for the length!!! Yes, I do agree that modelers have done giant steps in the last years...in a full mixed song they are almost indistinguishable from real amps...you really have to stay focused and compare them properly to real tube amps to notice the differences. Thank you!
The Boss NAILS the real Plexi, dynamically speaking. The real amp has a tonal envelope over time that is super hard to emulate. Brite and wide slowly, then quickly, closes down to fundamentals in a really musical manner. Likely for the same reason, the Plexi cleans up beautifully with the guitar volume. I use a real 69 Plexi, lovingly restored to perfection, so I’m intimately familiar with its nuances.
Thank you! Well, unfortunately I don't have an AX8, I have the FM3...I think I will do other videos like this...let's see how this video performs Thank you!
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Leo with Chat GPT 4, now u can upload the sounds and ask the AI to plot a chart of the soud, algo you can upload 10 files and compare each other
I didn't see you mess with the Sag and Resonance and that's where you could have closed the gap between real and digital. Also requires some EQ and other things to get a close match. Really good start by matching by ear though as most people compare settings and they may not always be the same as you pointed out.
Hi Jeff, I prefer to use the same knobs that are available in the real deal, also because the video was already becoming too long. In any case, this could be a topic for another video: thank you for your suggestion!
Yes, in sound wise i like helix more then boss, boss had piersing hye end and to matsh comression mayby? Put what you think about compere pedal amp like blueguitar or Taurus with the tube amp and modeller? I now Thomas blug from bluguitar has dane it put he is the seller olso
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion! Yes, comparing also the blueguitar and the Taurus would be pretty interesting...I boight by myself these units, so I need to verify if I'm able to find second hand occasions. Thank you!
Hi, Leo. It's a very unique test. I was curious, so repeated this with my Helix LT (I don't have the BOSS). Splitted the guitar signal to two channels and measured the difference between dry and Helix signal using an empty preset (W/O any effect and amp, etc). For me, the measured difference was between 1 and 1.5 ms (visually about 1.2 -> could it be the delay of AD/DA converters?). If I used both DSP channels serial with an amp model and some effetcs, the delay increased to almost 4ms. I dont't know what preset did you use for test but it seems this delay depends on DSP use in the patch.
Hi, interesting! In this video I was using two block, loading a fender deluxe amp in one slot and my IR in the other slot. I'm curious: when you say "splitted the guitar signal to two channels" you mean inside the Helix you did two signal paths or you have split the signal with an external device (something like the Lehle psplit)? Thank you!
@@LeoGibsonGtr I connected the guitar signal to my BOSS TU-3 tuner that has two independent output. The two outputs went to a focusrite sound card and a DAW (Reaper) to check the signals. First I made a record with this configuration and the two vaweforms has completely the same time and level. After that one of signals remains the direct signal (TU-3 out 1 -> sound card input 1 -> DAW track 1) the other was TU-3 out 2 -> Helix input - Helix 1/4 mono output -> sound card input 2 -> DAW track 2. I set levels to the same then recorded the signals.
Thank you! Yes, the test seems right, congrats! Well, the delay should be introduced by both the ADA converters and the DSP...so the more you push the DSP the more latency you should introduce. In my test I was using the same fender amp simulation + IR in the signal chain of both the units and I have set the amps to exactly the same setting (in terms of gain, knobs, etc.). Thank you!
Once you tweaked them, they both sounded really really really close to the plexi. Maybe helix slightly won over boss in sound similarity but boss won the latency test.
Wow!! There's a huge difference between Helix and GT1000. Sorry Boss/Roland, you can't really compete with Helix. From the first time when I heard about GT1000 a few years ago, I was so so happy it's because I've been loving Boss/Roland's stuff. However, the longer I've listened on GT1000, I'm very disappointed. To me, I've always thought Boss was stepped side, rather than competing with Helix. Don't get me wrong...I don't mind getting GT1000, but for ONLY $749. Not for $1000. This is just my opinion. Leo, thank you.
@@spada60 Yes. I don't have a GT1000, but I can hear everything. I do use my quality headphones and mixing monitors when Leo does it. There's no lie.... it seems like, GT1000 loses certain sounds what I'm looking for. If you like it, then great 👍. Keep using it. For me, I will buy Helix - unless there's better. Peace.
18:05 I'd expect the GT1000 to have less latency, given that it is newer and has more raw processing power. But, that doesn't always mean much. EDIT: Yep, that's what I expected. Although 0.5ms vs 2ms of latency is still so small in both cases, it really doesn't matter!
Hi, yes, also for me the latency is not an issue for both these devices. But some of you told that they are very very sensible to latency...so maybe this matter for them. Thank you for your message and for sharing your opinion!
I am a Helix fan, from my perspective the Helix sounds more realistic and offers user-friendly environment, which is really important. Boss has lower latency, which is really important for recording. In general, Helix > Boss for live performance... but Kemper could be a real game changer, best sounds but not so easy to find the sound easily
As far as I know, almost no one does comparisons like Leo. This man deserves much much more likes and subscribers.
Thank you so much, I'm really happy that you appreciate the channel, the comparisons and the work behind these videos! Thank you!
I agree. Subscribing.
Yes!! This is exactly the test I was waiting for, it was really interesting Leo.
For me how the modeller sounds is just as important as how it feels dynamically.
Please make more videos like these on other bigger units like Fm3 or Ax8
Thank you, really appreciated!!! Ok, let's see how this video performs and then we will decide what to do next. Thank you!
I love your videos and your playing is insane. Please do a video on how to get the best sounds out of GT-1000. Please do more comparison of GT-1000 against other high end modelers.thank you Leo!
Thank you so much, I'm super happy that you like the video and the playing!
Thank you also for your suggestions!!!
Sei l'unico TH-camr tecnico-musicale italiano che seguo, e con piacere. Hai un supporter qui!
Ciao Fabio, grazie mille, mi fa veramente piacere!!!
Thanks for this video. Quite insightful. I'm thinking of upgrading to a gt1000 soon. I've been using the gt100 for a couple of years and it's been great.
Thank you!!!
You're doing a great job with all comparison videos - but this one was really interesting (never seen something similar). Keep it coming.
Thank you Herbert, really appreciated, I'm happy that you like the video!
Dear Leo, thanks a lot!!! Boss is much pleasant for ears:)) And also pitch shifting really much better...
You are welcome!!! Thank you for sharing your opinion!
This video was really good, it's so good I found this channel. I always heard from my friends that the Helix is the best modeler out there, but I just love the kinda dry tone of the Boss.
Thank you, your appreciation is really important for me and makes me happy!!!
As always, I enjoyed your very informative video. I think both Modelers performed well, and suspect the differences between them and the real Amp probably fall inside the range one might expect to find between different Amps of the same model. I thought the latency test was an interesting and useful addition. It might help to distinguish between "one way" and "round trip" latency. I'm not surprised the Boss had a shorter latency due to its higher sample rate. Most people don't notice/have problems with latency if it is below about 6ms. The Null Test is another useful way to see and present the differences between the original and processed signals. It is great to read the comments and insights of other viewers as well. It's clear your videos are attracting informed people who really want to understand how well the gear works before purchasing it. It's cool that you were able to partner with Mercuriall to provide a free gift. I would not be surprised if other manufacturers follow. As long as your demos remain honest, unbiased, and thorough, you'll have increasing viewers and happy subscribers. Thanks again for all the great videos you make!
Thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoyed the video!!! I do agree...we re all learning and so the comments are very important and useful, even in order to improve the quality of these videos!
I'm also really thankful with Mercuriall...they were very kind providing us with some free licenses!
Thank you once more, your support is really important for me!!!
The Helix seems to be the most accurate when emulating the real thing, at least compared to that plexi. It shoul be very interesting to be able to campare them to the whole range of emulated devices. And for a more exact tests, this should be made using recorded lines and reamping them in every case so any change in the playing dynamics between tries doesn't affect the outcome. Anyway, a very comprehensive test. Thanks for a great video.
Thank you Ivan, really appreciated! Yes, it would be interesting...but it would require a lot of time and money to acquire all those amps...In any case in my channel you can find a comparison of 13 amp modeling pedalboards vs the real soldano: th-cam.com/video/m1CglhicbJ8/w-d-xo.html
@@LeoGibsonGtr question: did you calibrate the input of your guitar on the gt 1000 ? it seemed to me it had to much input (not shure)
really?
Oh wow, Leo put so much efforts to do these tests, Thank you so much ❤
It is interesting also to know about latency when we have around 10 effects especially with delays / reverb / pitch, but anyway, thank you. I also know it's not easy to compare effects but there have to be some feeling with effects) like when I switch from valeton gp200 to mooer ge300 - I see the quality of my effects rise so much... After I've tried headrush core - I want to replace ge300 with headrush cause of I also see noticeable difference, especially in delay)
The point is some people want to buy these kind of multifx having real tube amp and they not really interested in amp simulations but in high quality guitar effects 😊
Thank you for this hard work. As for me, your channel in #1 for detailed comparison on youtube
You are welcome and I'm really happy that you appreciate the videos!
Thank you also for sharing your findings!
My friend Leo, how are you?
I loved this video!
As allways i prefer Boss GT-1000!
Id like that you made more videos like this! More GT-1000 would be awesome, and why not, Pod Go!
Cheers from Portugal 🍺🤘🇵🇹
Thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoyed the video!!!! Let's see how the video performs and maybe I will do something similar with other modelers.
Thank you!
Pod go is a great idea. !
grazie per il video! sei l'unico youtuber che analizza seriamente il suono e spiega bene
! bravo
Grazie a te, il tuo complimento mi fa veramente piacere!!!
My Guess: 17:55 The first modeler (0.5ms) is the boss, the second (2ms) is the helix. I love games like this. Ok lets see if I was right! ...
Edit: Yay! I do notice latency and it does matter to me, but these numbers are both fantastic and very low. Thanks for doing this test.
You are welcome, and I'm happy that you like the video!
Great comparison. I use the Plexi model in the GT as my preferred base tone. I have used a Helix and a real Marshall Origin amp (kinda like a plexi) and in the mix and in IEMs on stage, I can’t tell the difference. Great test and you showed exactly how close the modellers can sound and react to a real amp in isolation. In a mix, no one would be able to tell them apart in a blind test.
Thank you so much Kent, I'm super happy that you like the video!
Thank you also for sharing your opinion and your findings!
Excellent video🍾 you’ve done it once again. I have helix LT and GT core. I like both, I really really really wished the core had Bluetooth. Thanks Leo.
Thank you, I really appreciate your comment! I do agree, it's a pity that the core does not have the bluetooth connectivity!
Now this is how you do a test comparison. Great video man. Helix all the way
Thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoy the video!!!
I love BOSS and have always been a BOSS fan, but it's worth saying that HELIX was more natural to a real amp. Thank You, Leo! Like!
Thank you both for the like and for sharing your opinion!!!
really?
Sorry but this is just wrong. The boss feels more like a real amp. I’ve played them both extensively.
Im trying to work out which modeler to get currently in the sea of choices out there. Thank you for doing a latency test as its something I hardly see others doing. Really appreciate it Leo, keep up the great work.
You are welcome! There is a video fully dedicated to latency in my channel...it's 1 year old and I should do it again...
Great video once again Leo! All sound great and would be hard to tell apart in a mix. The Helix is the winner to my ears, but only by a little bit. Real deal still sounds best. God bless and rock on 😎🎸👍
Thank you!!! Your appreciation of my videos really make me happy!!! Thank you also for sharing your opinion!!!
This may be one of the most important videos comparing these units. The feel and response through the strings is everything! ....... and no one wants to talk about it. Thanks. The GT 1000 may respond a tiny bit better but I sometimes think the Helix sounds a bit more like the real amps it is copying. I'm back to square one ..... undecided.
Hi David, thank you so much, I really appreciate! Actually I also think that videos like these are pretty rare...thank you for noticing it and I'm happy you noticed it and appreciate it!
I have both. Real Amps are not something I deal with, so I can’t say which is more real. I would say that the helix translates low frequencies better. I think the boss is more tuned, in that it has the frequencies where you’d want them for sitting in mixes, or cutting through in a band. But it doesn’t have the thump of the helix. By the way, the boss proprietary amp models sound more dynamic than the real models to my ears.
The real difference between the two is in the gain blocks though, which I’ve always found unsatisfactory in the boss, going way back. It’s why I changed.
I prefer the helix, though I miss the extra modulation functionality of boss, which is absolutely in a league of its own. By which I don’t mean chorus/flange etc. But lfos ramps and so on.
Boss sounds good though, no doubt.
2ms is completely negligible amount of latency in reality.
Line 6 is fizzy shit emulate real amps you serious?
I really like your videos... very extensive and interesting content. I follow you since a video about the dophix microangelo that was amazing :)
Thank you soooooo much, I'm really happy that you like he videos!!! The Michelangelo is a pretty old video...I'm really honoured that you appreciate the channel since that video!
Thank you!
As always : a VERY USEFUL video ? Thanks Leo !!!!
Thank you Claude, really appreciated!!
I love your videos. This one was very interesting, again. Maybe next up in this “feel” series could be the fm3 versus the Kemper stage ;-).
Hi, thank you!!! I'm really happy that you like the video!!! Let's see how it performs and maybe I will be another one...your suggestion is pretty solid!!!
@@LeoGibsonGtr yes fm3 vs kemper "feel"
@@ariraphiel39 Hi, so far I have done a video about latency of 13 amp modeling pedalboards, including the FM2 and the Kemper: th-cam.com/video/BpEgHGKPOpA/w-d-xo.html
Maybe in the next week I would also do another one focusing about the feel of these two pedalboards. Thank you for your suggestion!
Great video. Always wanted to know how close are modelers to real amp.
I think many people will be interesting to compare in this way modelers of different price levels, for example: nux mg300 vs Ampero vs ge300 vs Helix vs FM3 vs Kemper
Or the series of same real amp comparing with this devices and then one big comparison of results
Hi, thank you...yes, I do agree...let's see how this video performs, and then we will decide what the next video is going to be!
Thank you for your message!
Great video Leo, as always! Latency no longer seems to be an issue. In my home studio I usually record all guitars with software amps and latency has been practically undetectable for a long time now.
Hi, Jaime, I do agree, I also have no problems with latency and amp modelers. I' ve played a lot of midi guitar, so I'm used to adapt to the latency of the rig I'm playing. But some of us is very sensible, and they need instant feedback from their amps.
Thank you for your message and your appreciation of the video, which is really important for me!!!
@@LeoGibsonGtr There is never instant feedback from the amp because the sound waves have to travel from the speakers to the player's ears. As the sound moves at 340m/s, a normal situation like 3.4m distance will take 10ms!
So form the modelers, with headphones, it will be much faster...
From the modelers into analog amplified speakers it will take longer and the time is easy to calculate: t = d/0.34 with t in milliseconds and d in meters (distance from the speakers to player's ears). You should add the intrinsic modeler latency.
Yes sure, thank you for sharing!
My problem with all this new stuff is paying the high price for them and still needing to add IR's for decent tones which usually cost more money. All these companies need to do a better job for the money they're charging.
Hi, actually I think that a good IR does not cost too much...so it should be included in the box.
Thank you for sharing!
Hey Leo, another great video - thank you! . I have to say though I was surprised you didn’t touch the sag & resonance nobs.. with GT getting the low & hights right is a balance of resonance, bass & presence... the resonance & presence is really important in order to get close & that just adjusting gain, bass, mids & treble will only give you the results you got in this video.. hope this helps, love your work
Hi thank you so much for appreciating the video!
Well, I prefer just to use the standard settings, I mean the ones that are also available in the real amp, even because it already come out a pretty long video...and it would have become too long and complicated if I had started to tweak also that parameters. I prefer to use the knobs available in the real amp, with the only exception of the master volume.
Thank you for your question and suggestion!
@@LeoGibsonGtr I hear you but because all the amps in GT are different the resonance is key in setting the amp & if the resonance isn’t set right it doesn’t matter how much you tweak the other nobs nobs it will never match.. why? Coz the actual Plexi comes with this set for you... the GT doesn’t, therefore you have to set it to match it...
If resonance isn’t right you can tweak for days& get no-where BUT if it is set right in conjunction with presence you can dial it in in minutes... hope this helps, you’ve help us 🙏🏽
Nailed it! Good thing is that I upgraded my GE300lite to GT1000core. never have regretted. GT1000 sounds much better. the 100+ amp modelers doesn't really help you to make a better tone. those 26? amps in GT1000 are just essentials and they all sound good.
My only complaint of boss products is their interfaces. I went from a GT1 to a GE300 and from a UI perspective and usability is two different worlds
@@armax00 yeah I do miss that interface and the those fx on/off buttons. but what I cared more was all about the sound. and boss has a 4 dividers so I could make a huge parallel chain. also double channel amp which I could mix them together. that's just insane. hearing two different amps at the same time.
Hey @@ch0005649 , did you try profiled amps (MNRS) in the GE300 before you switched to the GT1000 or were you using the normal amps in GE300? I´m curious.
@@ch0005649 I would say that Mooer ironically "stole" the idea of the FX on/off buttons from Boss since my Boss GT-pro from 2005 has such buttons.
@@dheranYT yes I tried.
Very detailed, as always. Thank You!
You are welcome, I'm happy that you like the video!
Great video as always, but I miss your excellent playing and musicianship in your extended solos.. :)
Thank you! this was a kind of "side" video...:)
Thanks for a great video as always Leo. I've been trying to decide between the Boss GT and the Helix so this has helped out a lot. I'm still in analysis paralysis, but this gave me a better understanding. Fingers crossed to winning the giveaway!
Thank you, I'm really happy to have been of some help!!! Thank you for letting me know!
One thing I notice when comparing my helix to my JCM, is to lower significantly the master. On my JCM, the master really starts to modify the freq @ 6, on the helix it is on 4.
One other thing, is the Bias, at 7 on the helix. The dynamic range is small but on the 4 it is much bigger.
On your example, i would start by lowering the Bias, and the Master.
I would also keep the gain @ 8 as, the in freq curve is differnt @ 8 and 9,5, and would compensate with gain block before the amp.
Hi, thank you for your suggestions...I wil try!
Line 6 always wins this, just try plugging your gear direct to mixer, here in my country getting a good amp on stage is very difficult. Mostly we go direct to the console, Line 6 just shines crazy when going direct. I still use my HD 500 for smaller gigs, kicks ass of any boss processors till date. If you do not get an Amp to play with please try out Line 6 products, you will be happy!. Awesome video I have tried to study your way of playing, very nice playing indeed!. Keep up the good work!
Thank you for sharing your opinion!!!
I'm really happy that you enjoy my playing...and it's an honour that you study it...really...thank you!
Both modellers are great, and can achieve some great tones. So I think, it is the effects and the firmware that is the deciding factor. With the 3.0 update, I think the Helix is inching ahead.
Hi, thank yo for sharing your opinion! I do agree: both these units are great options, and if you want to know how they compare in terms of tech characteristics you can check out this video: th-cam.com/video/dIdf4ms2kxg/w-d-xo.html
Thank you!
@@LeoGibsonGtr I have watched that and almost all of your videos my man! Keep up the good work!
Thank you, I really appreciate it!!! god bless you!
Hi Leo, great video as always! As an Helix owner I think I can really improve the dynamic range of its amp models adjusting SAG and BIAS parameters. I would be curious to know your opinion on that.
Hi, thank you! I simply decided to use for both the units the same set of parameters that were the same available in the amp (also the gt 1000 has a sag and bias), otherwise the test would have become too long and complex...it's already 20m long).
Thank you for your message
I love your thorough videos! I have a Helix Floor that I use with my tube amps purely for effects and routing and can tell that there is a liiitle bit of latency when going guitar -> Helix, then Helix fx loop send -> amp input. Enough that I can tell a difference, not enough that I would care about it. To me the Helix in this video sounded much better than the GT1000 plus it has a better UI.
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion and experience!!
Great Leo! As always, very informative video.
I´d say that you left the GT1000 a little below in terms of volume. It´s quite noticeable when you switch between Helix and GT1000 that Helix is louder. It can miselad the listener... volume is very important in terms of sound perception. Maybe this explains that GT1000 sounds thinner to me. Maybe if it was at the same volume I wouldn´t feel that way... I don´t know.
Other thing I´ve noticed is the horrible copy of the waves that modelers do! Take a look at the waveform just between both deep valleys (the ones you use to measure latency). It has really little to do with the original form! Also, the first high peak is higher than the second in the real amp, whilst is lower in the modelers... I really get surprised by that. Actually, I don´t know if that has a big impact in perceived sound... but at least it can be said that it´s not a good thing to begin with.
Now I´m reaaaaaly curious about these details in profilers and fractal stuff. Do they deform the waves in the same way??
Thank you so much for these reviews, Leo!
Hi, thank you, I'm really happy that you enjoyed the vide!
Let me add one thing as regards the volume: the decrease happened mostly when I decreased the high frequency of the GT 1000, and I prefer to leave as it was to let you notice the effect, instead of rising the volume to compensate...but I see you point.
Thank you!
Agreed. volume level makes big difference of enjoing the sound.
@@LeoGibsonGtr I have downloaded the sound of that video and compare volumes of comparisons objectively. I haved used MLaudness analyzer and meter in DAW. I had to increse BOSS volume on 8:42 +2,1dB and decrease Helix volume on 8:45 -1,5dB to match Plexi volume. This is 3,6dB difference between Helix and Boss, and even I am big fan of You, I am also big fan of GTK and this is not fair for BOSS :-). If one matches volumes, BOSS sounds much more full... :-)
@@LeoGibsonGtr th-cam.com/video/6wcD6jQvLzw/w-d-xo.html This is video vith ballanced volume.
Come sempre un'ottimo test! In particolare interessante la prova della latenza ( che ho indovinato..). Grazie!
Hi Julian, grazie a te!!! Mi fa veramente piacere ti sia piaciuto il video!!!
I believe that the latency is pretty small as the human ear does not near audio artifacts until it goes towards 100ms (maybe a bit lower than that but around there. The latency test was very interesting and I would love to see more of these tests. An other test that could be interesting is the null test where the audio are overlapped and if they match 100 percent, they cancel out. Is a pretty precise test in my opinion for comparisons.
Hi Armando, thank you! I'm really happy that you like this test...I will probably do more of them in the future. I see what you mean with the phase reversal test...even if it is very very hard to get the exact same sound. Thank you once more!!!
The Null Test is an excellent way to see the differences between the original and processed signals! 👍
@@picksalot1 probably also the most accurate. It takes away a lot of subjective variables but Id imagine it would be difficult to reproduce the feel, though if recorded, in input signal might be exactly the same
I prefer the boss, and I would love to see this test with the boss and the headrush and atomic 6 or 12. Thanks. Great video..
Thank you, I'm happy you like the video!!!
Very very informative indeed. Feel and dynamics are key to liking or disliking an amp or unit.
Introducing multifx will always result in added latency because of the a/d conversions, the helix having 4x as much latency as the boss with just 2 effects in the chain (amp + ir loader) is quite a big difference. Would be interesting to know if the difference increases or decreases with adding more effects in the chain.
Thanks again Leo, subbed on instagram!
Thank you, really appreciated, I'm happy that you found the video helpful!!! I do agree...I'm also curious to know if the latency increase...😊...maybe in the next video...Thank you also for your instagram sub!!!
@@LeoGibsonGtr Here's a good article about latency, geared towards linux users, but still informative: wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/jack_latency_tests
Thank you! Very interesting article!!! Thank you for sharing!!
Hi, thanks for your premium Vids! Could it be that the Gt1000 sounds somehow hourse when it "breaks up"? Thats very nasty. Are you shure the Boss has a correct Level in the A/D Conversion? The "Boss Sound" sounds for me always a bit overhyped and rough. Somehow like the Kemper. All in my Ears. But it has the best Latency Management..Its not Easy to pick the right one. But your great Vids helped me to pick 2 of the Leader Boards to test it at Home at the same Time. When i pick up my Guiter, and ai can hear and! Feel that the natural Picksound (without Pickups aso..) comes first so that they tech out (because it sounds earlyer) i loos my Feeling instantly. I wish it would be not like this. But on a real Amp, i have no Question, its immidiatly, your connected within the touch of your Strings and the Membran of the Cab, with electrons as sumitter, that can no digital Gear bring ever.
BUT! Its mutch easyer to handle and mutch more cheeper to use Didital Stuff. So i have to pu my Eays closed and dont think about. Maybe i test the Line6 and .. i dont know ioiA Comparison with the Neural Plugins and the Hardware would be intersting. With my old RME Hammerfall PCI Multiface i can get 32 S/B so the Plugin shows 0.7ms. And it feels realy fast.
Considering that Line 6 and Boss probably modeled different Plexi’s the results were remarkably similar. Their models may very well be an amalgam of several examples of the amps.
Hi Kenneth, thank you for sharing your opinion!
Hi Leo, between the gt1000core (knowing that its the same as the gt1000, just smaller) and the hx stomp. which would you prefer as an upgrade from the pod hd500?
Hi Jev, I did a full video comparison that you can check out here: th-cam.com/video/MZFsoYLg8sI/w-d-xo.html
In that video you there is a demo song, a detailed companion chart and my 2 cents at the end! I hope you enjoy!
Thank you for your message and your question!
For the longest time I have been using the amp designer in Logic Pro to record and I got used to its "feel" (i.e. latency). I got the Boss GT-1000 Core in the beginning of this year. The first thing I noticed by just playing one note was how astoundingly quick and responsive it was. It was just one of those so-good-it's-weird moments. Now I can't go back.
Hi, thank you for sharing your experience!
After trying tonex , helix , and then a real amp.... i'm now in a need of getting gt1000, just waiting for the right price.
Tonex sounds great, responds great to playing and all, but it's latency if i remember correctly is somewhere in helix areas.
And od course i may be biased, but that small fraction of a second is actually noticible when playing , and it seems to have other conaeqences than just the delay of the sound
One of your most useful videos , gracie mille Leo!!!
You are welcome!!! I'm rally happy that you enjoyed the video!
I'm not surprised by the lower latency of the Boss. They are probably using similar processors that Roland uses for eDrum kits, a device that demands low latency.
Hi, thank you for sharing! Good point...
This format of vídeos are better than actual in some circunstances. Considering the our sound memory is short
Hi, thank you for sharing!
Excellent video and comparison! Thanks!
You are welcome and I'm happy that you appreciate the video!!!
@LeoGibsonGtr I am debating if I should get a Helix, Kemper or Quad Cortex. I know Kemper and QC sound a little better but cost a lot more. I am think Helix is the best option. What's your opinion on that?
Well, actually there is not a black and white answer...but the QC may be the more complete solution offering both modelling and profiling (as you are uncertain between modellers and profiles)...If you can...I would save same money and get the QC....
@@LeoGibsonGtr Thanks!
You are welcome!
Great video! Thanks you for you time!
You are welcome and I'm really happy that you like the video!!!
Hey Leo, I would like to see the new Boss GX 100 VS Line 6 Pod Go
Hi Dave, for sure it would be a very interesting comparison!
Thank you for your suggestion!
Very important test almost no one does for the public! Most youtubers wanna help to sell the units, because they get paid by the manufacturers. Therefore they play the modelers with the corresponding dynamic and attack and don't tell about the latency feel. In short: They don't show the weaknesses of the units compared to actual amps. That's why so many customers are disappointed and returning to tube amps, despite the great sound of nowadays modelers.
Thank you and I hope this video was of some help.
Some modellers have come to pretty good latency value. If you are interested you may want to check out this video: th-cam.com/video/oU0-_3Hub9o/w-d-xo.html
In that video I have compared the latency of 23 modellers...and then in the channel there are some deep dives into latency for some specific modellers.
Thank you!
@@LeoGibsonGtr Leo, of course I've seen it already :) You and "Max Solo Music" are the only two guitar-gear-latency-testing-guys I know of on youtube. So keep it up.
By the way, I have a suggestion for you: Many people use hardware IR loaders as only digital devices on their pedalboards and want to know the latency those devices introduce into their rigs. So it would be great if you could test and compare some cabinet emulators. There are plenty out there nowadays.
Ok, thank you for your suggestion!
I think the latency difference is why so many people say the GT-1000 AIRD has the real feel of playing through a real amp. While I like that the Helix has more amps, I think you can do more with the Boss if you play with the built-in effects. The feel of the amp spawns more creativity. I prefer Boss over Helix just a little. Still, the real deal is best.
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion!
I think this demonstrates that the differences between modelers is much narrower than between the modelers and the real deal. Digital circuits produce a square wave, tubes produce a sine wave. Software can attempt to compensate for this but it is a limitation of digital circuits. Modeling is better than it was 10 years ago but still has yet to really produce tube amp dynamics with 100% fidelity. That said, I have gotten good tones with both, just different and approach modelers not as faithful recreations but a pallet to start from to build my own tone.
HIi, thank you for sharing your opinion!!!
Would you do a review on the Neural DSP Quad Cortex? Maybe Quad Cortex Vs Helix or Gt-1000. I've really enjoyed all of you Effects Processor vidoes so far!
Hi yes for sure! I've entered my order in January 2020 so I'm gonna be among the first to receive it...so...stay tuned 😊!
Thank you and I'm really happy that you enjoyed my videos!!!
@@LeoGibsonGtr Awesome! Could you possibly do a demo of it profiling amps and pedal individually?
Hi, for sure I will profile some amp...I will see then how the videos perform to verify the next ones.
Thank you!
i own the GT 1000 core and In My Humble Opinion, the plexi thing on the GT 1000 is not good at first, you have to have time to tweak it. but there is some amp that feel great.
Hi, thank you for sharing your experience!
The Suhr reactive load influences the behaviour of the amp, like a cabinet. The amp/cab interaction for the modellers is left out in the test. Could be the reason the dynamics were so different between amp and modellers.
Leo, This would be the same with the LT version of Helix right? I think I´m gonna buy the LT model!
Hi rodrigo, yes, the same.
Thank you for your message!
@@LeoGibsonGtr Thank you! for your time!!
You are welcome!
Excellent video, really well done
Hi Mark, thank you, I'm super happy that you like the video!!!
Same old same old Boss GT range has never cut it, I’d be horrified if I’d paid £800 quid for the Boss but great video
Hi Philip, thank you for sharing and I''m happy that you like the video!
I own helix lt and kemper. I was amazed how much helix sounded like real plex. Pretty amazing. The GT sounds alright, but it clearly sounds different .. Noticeable on little phone speakers
Hi Juan, thank you for sharing you opinion and experience!
I have the Helix and have been watching all the TH-cam hype around the Marshall SV20 mini plexi. I think with all the added cost of a cabinet and/or load box to play at home audio levels, I'm better off to stay with the Helix. For the minimal benefit of a real amp's better touch responsiveness I don't think spending thousands for the real amp and other bits is worth it. Thanks for helping me make up my mind and save thousands!.
You are welcome! Thank you for sharing your opinion and experience!
Thanks you for this Leo, excellent information. I've stopped the video before the latency reveal to guess the helix will be the slower of the two modelers.. Let's see what I know !
Edit.. I know now, but won't post a spoiler!
😊 Thank you, really appreciated!!!!!
Hi Leo , awesome review ! I prefered the Helix ,although it has a tendency to add mids , i found the boss high frequencies overall less pleasant, a little harsh .And yes i agree the real amp still the best of the batch .Regarding the latency , from my experience it becomes noticeable by 5ms increments , 2 ms is really negligeable.
I have a question for you , regardless the price but only considering the tone and the responsiveness, would you choose the boss GT1000 or the Ampero ?
Hi, thank you so much, I'm really happy that you appreciate the review!!!
Well, the ampero is really good, but I just slightly prefer the Boss effects, as I'm more used to them. Nevertheless the ampero is a great modeler, and for instance it has a very good Soldano simulation, that is missing in the boss.
Thank you once more!
@@LeoGibsonGtr thanks for your answer , much appreciated!
You are welcome!
Leo you are amazing!!!
Thank you so much, really super appreciated!!! 😊👍🎸
Thank you for this test Leo. Input level of boss does not seems to be set well according indication and overall boss volume is low. It will sound different then. I know it is very difficult to manage. If this will be done, dynamics of BOSS would be better. BUT Helix would sound better. To me Helix just not react right on play style, but it sounds better for one set working point. Lot of magic is in internal IRs, what are more usable, than those in BOSS. And Marshall amp and internal IR is weirdest amp there, I consider it to be the worst there...
You are welcome and thank you for sharing these tips!
Leo Gibson is a legend
Thank you so much Alkandor! This is a great compliment that really makes me happy!!!
my personal opinion:
1. with roadie i ll bring my plexy
2. no roadie no plexi...
thank you for a good comparison!
You are welcome and thank you for sharing your opinion!
boss gt 1000 work better with internal cab and proprietary tecnology
Line6 has a tone of its own on their fx. Boss is more "transparent" (although this is not really the right term for it. I actually find Boss fx and drives to be rather "bland" than transparent. "Transparent" fx you find in studio grade stuff like Eventide)
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion!
After watching this video, i have decided to buy the Helix, just sound more accruate in my opinon
Hi Jacob, thank you for sharing your opinion and final decision!
Grandissimo! Test utilissimo e davvero MOLTO interessante. Sarei estasiato se tu potessi fare una cosa analoga per FM3 vs Boss GT-1000 e FM3 vs. Kemper.
Grazie mille!!!! Let's see how this video performs and than we will decide what to do next. Thank you very much for your suggestions and appreciation!!!
Thanks for sharing!
You are welcome, my pleasure!
Leo, this is very nice comparison again, thank you. I have commented below the volume difference between helix, boss and plexi, what makes difference, but even so, I slightly prefere Helix sound here even it miss some presence and treble and there is some oscilating interference. I have tried Helix native and it was not fun to play it, maybe unit itself is better, but Native was like to play a PC keyboard not a guitar. Maybe I have made something wrong. Helix can deffinitely produce very nice sounds.
Hi Jar, thank you, I'm happy that you found the video interesting! Yes, I see the volume change you are referring to...let me just add that the perceived loudness depends also on the level of gain and on the frequency (we are not equally sensitive to sounds of all frequencies so perceived loudness of a tone in fact depends on frequency as well as intensity), and in this video I was changing pretty intensively both the gain and the frequencies. While doing this I was not compensating the volume so that you can also hear the resulting effect and even because it would have become a nightmare to measure the perceived loudness every time a change in freq or gain was applied.
Thank you.
@@LeoGibsonGtr I totally understand what you mean! But every comparison I have made I must always equal volume. If I do not that one signal is more gainy and with bigger treble and bass, what happened here as well. I guess it has something to do, beside other things, with Fletcher Munson curve. Please do not get me wrong, I love your videos and appreciate your work!
That plexi sounds great, but it has no master volume, so I bet not only would my landlord throw me out, the police would be at my apartment door if I played one. :) Glad to see a comparison to modelers.... :)
Hi, thank you for sharing!
Nice review keep up !
Thank you, really appreciated!
Latency is important for me. But even more important is the lag between switching full patches. Boss has practically none of those and that is why i own it. For me its less about how many amp model s are there or how accurate they are. I just need a couple of decent sounds and thats it. Regarding dynamics none of them are like a tube amp. Not bad but not nearly the same. Only downside of modelers. Still they are light years ahead of modelers of yesterday. Digital is getting there real fast. Feel and sound are so subjective. weirdly enough i dont like tube amps sound in a room. Mic'ed up are great and smooth but in a room all of them sound brittle and sizzly in my ears. I cant play direct either. It is lifeless. So gt1000 a real tube power amp and a 2x12 works wonders for me. Sorry for the long post.
Hi Leonis, thank you for sharing and no problem at all for the length!!! Yes, I do agree that modelers have done giant steps in the last years...in a full mixed song they are almost indistinguishable from real amps...you really have to stay focused and compare them properly to real tube amps to notice the differences.
Thank you!
The Boss NAILS the real Plexi, dynamically speaking. The real amp has a tonal envelope over time that is super hard to emulate. Brite and wide slowly, then quickly, closes down to fundamentals in a really musical manner. Likely for the same reason, the Plexi cleans up beautifully with the guitar volume. I use a real 69 Plexi, lovingly restored to perfection, so I’m intimately familiar with its nuances.
Good one. I prefer the Helix. Seems less dry than the Boss.
Also, can you make a video comparing the Fractal AX8 with other modellers?
Thank you!
Well, unfortunately I don't have an AX8, I have the FM3...I think I will do other videos like this...let's see how this video performs
Thank you!
Leo with Chat GPT 4, now u can upload the sounds and ask the AI to plot a chart of the soud, algo you can upload 10 files and compare each other
Hi, thank you for your suggestion!
Boss < Helix < Axe FX< Quad Cortex
Hi, thank you for sharing your ranking
I didn't see you mess with the Sag and Resonance and that's where you could have closed the gap between real and digital. Also requires some EQ and other things to get a close match. Really good start by matching by ear though as most people compare settings and they may not always be the same as you pointed out.
Hi Jeff, I prefer to use the same knobs that are available in the real deal, also because the video was already becoming too long. In any case, this could be a topic for another video: thank you for your suggestion!
Yes, in sound wise i like helix more then boss, boss had piersing hye end and to matsh comression mayby? Put what you think about compere pedal amp like blueguitar or Taurus with the tube amp and modeller? I now Thomas blug from bluguitar has dane it put he is the seller olso
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion! Yes, comparing also the blueguitar and the Taurus would be pretty interesting...I boight by myself these units, so I need to verify if I'm able to find second hand occasions.
Thank you!
what r u talking about Boss has a great Marshall tone
Hi, Leo. It's a very unique test. I was curious, so repeated this with my Helix LT (I don't have the BOSS). Splitted the guitar signal to two channels and measured the difference between dry and Helix signal using an empty preset (W/O any effect and amp, etc). For me, the measured difference was between 1 and 1.5 ms (visually about 1.2 -> could it be the delay of AD/DA converters?). If I used both DSP channels serial with an amp model and some effetcs, the delay increased to almost 4ms. I dont't know what preset did you use for test but it seems this delay depends on DSP use in the patch.
Hi, interesting! In this video I was using two block, loading a fender deluxe amp in one slot and my IR in the other slot.
I'm curious: when you say "splitted the guitar signal to two channels" you mean inside the Helix you did two signal paths or you have split the signal with an external device (something like the Lehle psplit)?
Thank you!
@@LeoGibsonGtr I connected the guitar signal to my BOSS TU-3 tuner that has two independent output. The two outputs went to a focusrite sound card and a DAW (Reaper) to check the signals. First I made a record with this configuration and the two vaweforms has completely the same time and level. After that one of signals remains the direct signal (TU-3 out 1 -> sound card input 1 -> DAW track 1) the other was TU-3 out 2 -> Helix input - Helix 1/4 mono output -> sound card input 2 -> DAW track 2. I set levels to the same then recorded the signals.
Thank you! Yes, the test seems right, congrats! Well, the delay should be introduced by both the ADA converters and the DSP...so the more you push the DSP the more latency you should introduce. In my test I was using the same fender amp simulation + IR in the signal chain of both the units and I have set the amps to exactly the same setting (in terms of gain, knobs, etc.).
Thank you!
Exquisite video Leo😊👏👏👏 loved it,
Because I only have helix, so I cheat myself. GT1000 vs Helix，Helix is better 😭
Thank you!!! I'm really happy that you like the video!!!
There is something really nasty in the high end distortion in the Boss. Line6 deals with it much nicer.
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion!
Absolutely right on the smooth gentle curve of dynamics of a real amp. That is what I miss on a modeler.
Hi, thank you for sharing...yes, it's pretty hard to simulate it properly...
Stock Cabs on Helix have better dynamics and responce than any IR
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion!
AHA ur funny
Once you tweaked them, they both sounded really really really close to the plexi. Maybe helix slightly won over boss in sound similarity but boss won the latency test.
Hi Ray, thank you for sharing your opinion and considerations!!!
The bass ring on a real amp cannot be replicated.
GT 1000 Flawless Victory 😎
😊 Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion!
nice demo!
Thank you Moreno, really appreciated!!!
El ampli real suena mil veces mejor, y eso que tengo la stomp, peo es que no hay color.
Hi, thank you for sharing your opinion!
Boss GT-100 is the fastest pedal. The delay is less than 1 ms and is 0.44 😀
Hi, thank you for sharing! If you are talking about latency, I have measured around 0.7-0.9 milliseconds.
Wow!! There's a huge difference between Helix and GT1000. Sorry Boss/Roland, you can't really compete with Helix. From the first time when I heard about GT1000 a few years ago, I was so so happy it's because I've been loving Boss/Roland's stuff. However, the longer I've listened on GT1000, I'm very disappointed. To me, I've always thought Boss was stepped side, rather than competing with Helix. Don't get me wrong...I don't mind getting GT1000, but for ONLY $749. Not for $1000. This is just my opinion. Leo, thank you.
You are welcome and thank you for sharing your opinion and experience!
huge difference? time to get that wax out ur ears
@@spada60 Yes. I don't have a GT1000, but I can hear everything. I do use my quality headphones and mixing monitors when Leo does it. There's no lie.... it seems like, GT1000 loses certain sounds what I'm looking for. If you like it, then great 👍. Keep using it. For me, I will buy Helix - unless there's better. Peace.
Still prefer Helix, Boss is good but sounds to harsh to my ears.
Saludos desde México Leo!
Thank you for sharing your opinion!!!!
harsh? Helix is fizz city
Clean your ears.
18:05 I'd expect the GT1000 to have less latency, given that it is newer and has more raw processing power. But, that doesn't always mean much. EDIT: Yep, that's what I expected. Although 0.5ms vs 2ms of latency is still so small in both cases, it really doesn't matter!
Hi, yes, also for me the latency is not an issue for both these devices. But some of you told that they are very very sensible to latency...so maybe this matter for them.
Thank you for your message and for sharing your opinion!
I am a Helix fan, from my perspective the Helix sounds more realistic and offers user-friendly environment, which is really important. Boss has lower latency, which is really important for recording. In general, Helix > Boss for live performance... but Kemper could be a real game changer, best sounds but not so easy to find the sound easily
Hi, thank you for your message and for sharing your opinion! Yes, with the Kemper you need very well done profiles.
Too much GAIN... never heard of that.