Deep Space Nine nailed the
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
- Faith Salie discusses the care Star Trek producers took in making sure their character did not come off as a sexual predator! An excerpt form our full length episode on "Favorite Fictional Female Scientists - with our favorite real scientists Moiya McTier, Dr. Karen Soren, Matt O’Dowd, Emily Rice.
New season of full length episodes starts 9/16/18
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I think it's sweet she still calls back to her times on DS9... she was a highlight in those 2 appearances in the later seasons, even if they were not so-called central to the overall show plot.
Annnnd that's why you actually have Star Trek written by people who understand Star Trek.
I think Discovery hasn't been helmed by people who understand Trek...certainly the extra focus on SFX and the flashy shit has shown that to be largely the case.
@@Patrick-vh7sw I couldn't agree more, Star Trek just isn't the same anymore unfortunately, Paramount decided to get into bed with JJ Abrams to make the Kelvin films and wound up catching Alex Kurtzman, and now we're left with STD.
The Orville is the closest thing we have to true Star Trek nowadays, and that's basically a parody lol.
Take Time to Just understand what An incredibly zoomed in, detailed and subjective topic is being dicussed here. Its amazing these people understand each other
That episode was more about autism... not the "Meetoo" thing! Sarina had a sensorial recuperation and passed from a deep state of autism to an Aspeger Syndrome. Every bit of that episode is telling you people about autism. In the Quark's bar scene Sarina also had a sensorial overload when the klingon crashed the glasses on the floor (auditive overload). Jack is the nerd type and the leader, Patrick is very childish (like my father). The lack on empathy bring to a poor develop of the "Mind Theory", as Atwood defined it in his book, the natural capacity of neurotypicals in figuring out what the other person is feeling in a moment of confrontation. A lack in that area would result in pendantic explanation like this one.... :)!
@@adamlevine6700 Along those lines, it could have played into the "Born Beautiful Yesterday" trope. Similar to movies like Splash, etc. where a beautiful woman (anywhere from an amnesiac to an alien learning the complexities of humanity, to a mermaid who knows nothing of the surface world) meets someone who teaches her the ways of the world and they fall in love. Usually in the case of this trope, the partner who has more knowledge (whether IQ or EQ), is more dominant (not to say aggressive but they are the ones making decisions.) These relationships are typically portrayed as Heterosexual and the male partner has a better understanding of the world, whether that is general intelligence or a social intelligence. Other writers would have played into this trope or made Sarina indebted to him, like the actress mentioned. But Bashir is a well-written and three dimensional character; it goes against everything in his moral code but his Hippocratic oath as a doctor as well. Yes, Bashir was developing feelings for Sarina but she was also his patient; it would be crossing an ethical/moral line for him. It's all about agency and most importantly consent; who knows what was done to Sarina between the beginning of her side effects and meeting Bashir.
obviously the episode wasn't ABOUT a movement that wouldn't exist until decades later.
@@eventingirl001 Good comment. I'm just watching the episode and feel kind of horrified at Julian randomly moving in on Sarina just after she's recovered and making her into his girlfriend. It's really violating. I'm glad to see it's not just me who can see that. Also good point about it being a common trope of weird clueless plain woman suddenly becomes beautiful and suddenly the main guy pursues her before she's found her feet.
@@katec9893 I think in the episode if there was a clear delineation of her recovery taking some time, then Bashir and Sarina wouldn’t feel so ick. At the very least have some communication between them or something in the following episodes.
@@eventingirl001 Yeah I agree. If she'd lived a normal life on the station for 6 months or ideally longer they then could have ethically dated (maybe with the approval of sisko/the federation or something). But to date her a day or two after she wakes up from a catatonic state starting off with the way he slept next to her in his room rather than brought her back to her room was just very troubling to see.
yesss, this was a clear narcisistic oriented issue that was "discussed" on that episode, as many that the ds team had the hability to get through to the audience that was a real social and political subject that needed more reach than the mainstream media allowed.👏👏
wait, why is the spacetime guy there? wtf? am I drunk?
This isn't rewriting history at all. Gene Roddenberry and Rick Berman were both notorious. Please, spare me.
I mean I guess this is better than Melora in Season 2 DS9 . But as a Disabled woman who has always loved DS9. I didn’t love the Serena arc either, it was better than initial Bashir fetishizing, but infantilism didn’t seem like much of an improvement
A “fatherly” kiss in a romance scene? I think that just ruined that episode for me in a very wrong, wrong way.
it wasn't a romantic scene. that's the whole point of the episode, don't fall in love with your patients / use positions of power to make people, in this case a young woman just beginning to live again, do what you want.
It's weird seeing her on CBS This Morning.
Make him 'not so predatory' and what happens? She still left him! 🤣
Because she doesnt know how to deal with feelings of love or even if she feels it for him?
She’s not required to fall in love with him because he’s not a predator lmao, I’d say that’s just a base requirement for most relationships
Where’s that Picard Facepalm gif..
I loved her in those episodes. The episode was sweet but sad in the end, where she felt indebted to Dr. Bashir, but couldn’t reciprocate those romantic feelings.
So what the heck happened with Melora Pazlar? Was it Rick Berman? I'm going to blame it on Rick Berman.
all rick bermans are trash
Nailed
The misandry in the comment thread!!!🤮
Overtalked and buzzword laden tripe to describe what we used to call normal.
What is this woke garbage?
Star Trek -- perhaps you've heard of it?
If Bashir "modelled appropriate male behavior" he did it belated and still seemed "predatory" (and pathetic) throughout. Very troubling episode that is ONLY made partially acceptable by Bashir realizing his serious ethical breach at the end.
Don't you think it's a better commentary to show someone making a mistake and realising it, rather than some one acting perfectly from the start? It helps show that even good people can do bad or predatory things with out even realising what they're doing. There is an important lesson to men in this episode: that you can't win a woman just by doing something for her, even if you do something huge. Thats something a lot of people need to learn i think.
He is still human and learns. That’s Star Trek
You made a perfect moment in star trek all we see now is make men look weak and talk really fast to make someone seem intelligent it used to be equal for both sexs
I think her closeness to the situation doesn't allow her to see the episode she's referring to (DS9 Chrysalis S7E5) as it is- extremely creepy, predatory, and inappropriate. It is about a doctor helping a patient overcome a catatonic illness- a patient who because of this illness has the maturity of a little girl despite being an adult woman. And what does the doctor then do now that she's recovered? He immediately pursues a romantic relationship with her, despite his best friend flat out telling him that its inappropriate. The woman is then so overwhelmed and uncomfortable with this she nearly regresses back into her catatonic state.
The behavior modeled in this episode by the doctor is absolutely disgusting; the show runners at the time even knew it was which is why they refilmed the kissing scene referred to.
You missed the point of the episode. If Bashir had acted properly from moment 1 there would be no story to resolve, no realization at the end.
I totally agree, couldn't have written it better myself. It's a really shocking storyline, the Dr is totally crossing ethical boundaries and violating his patient. Women in vulnerable states like Sarina's character have often historically been preyed upon so to see this happen in star trek and presented as normal and acceptable is quite surreal.
You are overstating things. Dr. Bashir's actions towards her were technically professionally inappropriate, but it was never malicious. It stemmed from his own sense of loneliness, but once he understood what Serena was feeling he immediately backed off realizing his mistake. He was taken in by her charm and only wanted to have someone in his life who he could relate with. Serena, while grateful to Bashir, just didn't share his feelings. Once this was understood, they parted ways without hard feelings even if Bashir was disappointed by the outcome. Bashir was never a predator in this story. Just a lonely man who was charmed by a lovely woman and failed to make the connection he was hoping for.
You miss the point of the episode: highlighting the difference between feeling something and acting on those feelings. Star Trek is about humanity, in its strengths, but weaknesses as well. Ultimately it's about how we advance by overcoming our weaknesses.