ASOIAF Theories: The Valyrians and The Shadow People
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Just sharing my ideas one of my favorite book series, A Song of Ice and Fire by George RR Martin. This video may contain spoilers for those of you who are not up to date with the series. That goes for the HBO show and the books.
I'm just speculating and guessing on some ideas that I have on how future events will transpire in the series. Keep in mind however, I know nothing.
Feel free to leave a comment like and subscribe!
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You build such a tense atmosphere in videos like this, the music, imagery, tone of your voice, it works so damn well, love it.
Jeremiah Kane I agree! He's come a long way since his earlier videos! His voice is awesome!
+Blue Mermaid the voice...the pace..and i always love the Background music as well! your Videos are precious. keep on doing what youre doing and never ever adress who is not liking it.
***** Indeed he has, yes an ideal voice for these kinds of videos, I love this channel.
Your videos are top notch. Great Work!
Shadow People - Shrouded Lord?
Stone Men - Gerion Lannister?
White Walkers - Children Of The Forest?
Merlings - Drowned God Of The Iron Islands?
hope sometime they make another series about the world of ASOIAF but for the other continents,there are places even more interesting then Westeros
Yee new video!
I've seen many compliments regarding your narrative tone, pacing, video editing, etc. - all well deserved. But I would also like to commend you on your writing. I would imagine, following the initial steps of brainstorming and research, that your writing process plays a critical role in the creation of your videos. It shows. Carry on, and thank you for your work.
Connor Griffith his stuff truly is amazing!
Can I also concur. "Dune" brought me here. Lol.
I like the thought of Valyria being sacrificed by the Red God
Sacrificed by the red God? Tell me, are fire God's ussually considered "good"? In the original Song of Ice and Fire, the fire "god" was the one who was going to try and kill us all. In the knockoff version, aka Christianity, the fire "god" was still the one going to end us all. Don't think the original Song of Ice and Fire is important? Well, who gives us the names for the days of the week? If you need guidance the north (Norse) remembers.
KarlbushtheIV the fuck is this comment
What the fuck do you smoke and where can I get some, or at least an explanation?
Jamie Sneed there are no gods only magic
@@infolord79 zoroastrianism?
great video. I'll be honest after asoiaf and dunken egg novellas I want a book outside of westoros. I want a assai or ti Yi based novel
Yi ti*
You can edit or delete your comment by hovering your mouse over it and pressing the "thre grey dots" symbol to the right of it.
Rick West I'll admit. I was driving while writing the comment. Haha I didn't have time finding the 3 dots haha
But yeah I knew you could edit messages
Driving while being on your phone? How's that funny?
Julia Olivero considering I'm watching TH-cam while driving. I wouldn't consider that the smartest thing to do haha.
Something I just noticed about the Sunset Sea being so close to Asshai: Melisandre said that shadows are servants of light, light cast upon an object obviously casts a shadow. A sunset casts light, and Asshai is called Asshai by the Shadow. Pretty darn cool.
I love this
Whenever winds of winter finally comes out, I'm nominating you to do the audiobook
GRRM has said that in ASOIAF dragons have existed all over the world once, wonder if it is really limited to the fire ones: we know there are sea dragons somewhere on the sunset sea and there are legends of ice ones in the north of the shivering sea, wyvens could potentially be considered as “air dragons” and fire worms are the closest thing I can think to an earth dragon without making them actually have the ability to use sorcery and we know for a fact that even during the time of the events of the books there are wyvens in Sotoryos even if we have no such confirmation regarding fire-dragons, so maybe GRRM was speaking about all varieties of dragons, would be the kind of play of words that I would expect from the author who brought us ASOIAF.
This video reminded me of the similarities between the numeanoreans and the valyrians both being advanced civilizations who were destroyed by a higher power except for a select few. Both are also very similar to the story of Atlantis. Great video!!
great video, you may want to consider making your videos slightly longer as i think videos over 10 minutes get better ad revenue. Plus as long as your not waffling for the sake of it im sure everyone would appreciate the extra 3 minutes of content.
great moves, keep it up! Proud of you.
As cool as their dragons and advanced civilization was, I think the Valyrians deserved to be destroyed for the atrocities they committed, like slavery blood sorcery etc.. shout out to the faceless Men
5:01
what's Glorfindel doin' here ? xD
Fire, Darkness, Evil Lord, Magic Swords, and Shiny Stones? Seems right up his alley.
Secrets of the Citadel here on TH-cam recently uploaded a couple of videos on The Great Empire of the Dawn. In them, among other things, she talked about how the capital of that legendary empire was probably Asshai and that the people who ruled there might have been ancestors to the Valyrians. This video seems to compliment those theories nicely. Thoughts?
The Channel "Westeros History" made an even better video about this. But it is long (around 2 hours).
I'll have to check that out, thanks!
Rick West I've seen that & was thinking about it while watching this, it is real good & worth the watch even though it's 2 hours long.
Yeah, it was really interesting. George Martin seems to be good at creating mysterious backstories for his fictional world. Some things I knew already, but others I didn't.
But next time Westeros History should maybe cut the session into "pieces". It would attract more views and is easier to watch. ;)
Rick West Yeah that's not a bad idea, split them into four or five parts 20-30 mins each.
ok...but one question...if the Valyrians where such a "simple folk" why would shadowbinders even have an interest in them...why teach them magic and how to tame dragons
This theory actually makes most sense. the whole "shepherds who just happen to discover dragons and come to tame them" sounded pretty fishy on the get go... Well done!
I want to see a spinoff series just about the eastern countries or maybe more specifically asshai and the shadowlands.
Clicked faster than a speeding bullet.
I would love to hear you read horror. You have the perfect, bone chilling voice for it.
I'm obsessed with Asshai. Constantly doing research. Thank you.
not much is there to be researched, i fear. asshai-by-the shadows remains in the shadows (which for me is far better than to reveal all its secrets)
Although one needs a full set of Valyrian tinfoil armor to think about the content of your videos, with your voice, you could probably read a baking recipe and sound frightening...
ScienceTube no tinfoil required. his info is on point. the speculations aren't far off or a stretch at all
ScienceTube He was one of the first Ones to say that the Children couldn't be trusted and that the Children created the White Walkers along with Teflon Tv.
I hope that after the storyline in Westeros is complete, we can get a glimpse of a continent far from both Essos and Westeros (since neither are said to be connected) that has a kingdom that is similar to one of the three gundpowder empires (the Ottoman Empire, the Safavid Empire, or the Mughal Empire) and these people actually have a full map of the world before anyone after the long night and are really advanced compared to Essos and Westeros due to technology and science rather than magic. That would be really cool. And maybe, just maybe, they could have guns and cannons like the Ottomans did early on when Europe was still very Medieval. That would be incredibly interesting to see. And maybe they set out to conquer and colonize Essos and Westeros, and through this ambitious warmongering they (and we) learn a little more of the terrible, dark, and divine powers that have kept Westeros and Essos locked in such turmoil.
This is interesting. If the presence of R'hllor is in the Shadowlands is it possible the Great Other lies in west. Could the children be worshippers of the Great Other and the weirwoods their medium. The Children learned of the dragon glass magic and plunged it through a man's chest and into the a weirwood. Could this be the song of ice and fire? Then you have Jon Snow with the blood of the first men who follow the old gods (weirwoods) and the blood of Old Valyria(who possibly got their magic from R'hllor). What if Jon Snow is the hero made of ice and fire to destroy the villain made of ice and fire? I'd like to know what you think of this. great vid!
Nice!
thanks :)
you are talking of HBO cannon (jon being a targ, and the children makeing the others is not book cannon) while this video is book cannon.
Normally, I don't watch many videos on ASOIAF theories for I'd rather figure things out by myself or be surprised by the books. However, your content is too damn good, from the writing to the editing, narration and imagery. You've got a new sub.
Keep up the good work!
i never bought into the idea of the complete extincition of dragons. i think the possibility of existance in the far east should be entertained. great work.
Good video. Good narration skills. That said, I think it's sci-fi confirmed. Technology/1,000 world's. May even be remnants of Bio-Core seed ship in Ashai. Harangans (spelling?) maybe.
The Valyrians said they were descended from the dragons.... and it seems as if the dragons are warging their humans more than the other way around.... perhaps if they mate with another human while warging their human they could pass down a bit of their "dragon's blood" or genetics or whatever.... But I think it all comes down to how the world of Planetos evolved.... were the animals first? or were men first? OR did the God on Earth create the different races of humanity by "warging" or mating with the beasts that were here? I suppose it will always be a mystery.
I think they did conquer. The great empire of the dawn which actual capital is actually Ashai by the Shadow. Then finally Rhlorr transformed it into what it was always meant to be. Fits into the narrative of grand game because in the north theres a land of always winter. Rhlorr tried to do it again with the valyrian but they stringed away, make up their own god and finally the doom. Kindda like how Numenorean turned on the valar then they just vanished and became 'rare'.
Mere speculation at the moment, but I wonder if this might link up with the prospect of a spinoff series. One comment that has been discussed and debated at length in the community is Arya's question about "what is West of Westeros". If the Shadow Lands and realms of magic are located on a continent opposite Essos and Westeros, and they lie close to the realm of fire, would one need a dragon in order to go there?
Another theme that I have seen discussed at length is the possibility that Arya (who can warg) might ride one of the dragons. I know a lot of people are saying that the three will be Jon Snow, Tyrion and Dany. But if GRRM retains his habit of reflecting the past in events of the future, then the riders ought to be one man who is a recognised leader, and two powerful women who are related to him. Arya, Dany and Jon would fit the mold much more accurately.
Getting to the point, if Arya does play a central role in the conclusion of this series, and then decides to follow through on her dream of seeing what is West of Westeros, you have a perfect setup for a spinoff series -- whether one that involves Arya (and Maisie seems the most well suited to continuing the series after season 8), or one that takes place in the future, and is initiated by something Arya does.
Awesome as usual. Best on TH-cam.
Could the Daynes originate from the shadow???
I really encourage you to make longer videos, this theory especially would benefit from going more in depth. Perhaps this is all you have time for, which I totally understand, but I personally could easily listen to an hour - should you have further information - as almost all of your ideas are interesting enough to handle it. I also feel that people looking for aSoIaF theory videos would be willing to watch for longer than the generic TH-cam clickers. Either way, I'll keep watching and thanks for the content!
As an aside, perhaps do a quick sweep for grammatical and pronunciation errors before posting? There's no way to say something like that without sounding like a dick, but I assure you I mean well :)
Amazing video! I have also wondered if there weren't dragons already in the world since reading Game of Thrones. I can't wait to find out if GRRM will enlighten us on the mysteries of the East!
I love rewatching your videos. I wish you were working on the prequels
The shadow people tricked the valyrians, they gave them magic so that they killed themselves
But if dragons continued to exist, why does Dunc, (or was it Egg?) in the second novella, say that winters have grown longer since the last dragon died ?
valiryian sounds similar to Atlantis
joshua jackson No shit Sherlock...
joshua jackson its inspired by pompeii
Except Valyria actually existed in the aSoIaF universe and can still be visited, whereas Atlantis was a hypothetical theory put forward by Plato to represent how a utopia might fall.
Its possible that magic can be redicovered by man, to take it this far in such short amount of time, they miight as well make lazer guns and spaceships, knowledge can be discovered but not as fast as valriya did.
there are oily stones everywhere, what says that the People of the Shadows hadn't conquered those lands and built the oily stone stuff?
Lore tells us, that there is a legend about the Empire of the Dawn. An old civilization, almost forgotten.
Secrets of the Citadel recently did a video on the Empire of the Dawn. I highly recommend you check it out!
Thanks for another good video. I love hearing more about Asshi.
I'm weird, but I love the way he says shadow.
The entire magic is created by Children of The Forest who have some motivation behind it. Period.
You present your videos and theories very differently from others. They are more clinical with facts instead of telling an intense and passionate story like you do. I really must commend your speaking skill even if your accents can use a little work when reading from the books. You really have me hanging on your every word, especially with that eerie music.
Great job as always, your explanations and theory crafting is always great! I’m v interested in this topic and how the Valyrians came to control dragons and become so powerful, and I think this theory makes a lot of sense. I’d only add that I also find it slightly more plausible that the Great Empire of Dawn was the first place to tame and ride dragons and the survivors of this empire founded the Freehold or taught the Valyrians about dragons and sorcery
Great video man. I When I read the books and the World of Ice and Fire it seemed wierd that dragons would pop up near goat herders and submit to their will while they roamed free in a place feared by everyone.
so did he actually see Ashai? The true home of magic. It would be cool to see Ashai on the show even in a vision or in Maester Marwin's memory.
You're about to Hit 40,000 Subscribers. I remember when you hit 3000 Its great to see your channel get bigger congrats
Maybe those people were the *Winged Men* which could have had an ancient empire before Ghiscar?
They could have gone to Valyria before the incident that created the Shadowlands and then they faded away until the only *Winged Men* left were the ones in their original city at the shores of the Hidden Sea (Carcosa is also situated there) 🌑
Hey man, loved the video and theory as always. Your theory videos are my favorite. Watching your theory videos is like being drawn into a good book. Thanks.
I would like to know what you think about Jaime's dream in a Storm of Swords.
He fells asleep on a Weirwood stump (!) and dreams that he and Brienne are in some deep dungeon. Cersei says that he belongs there, but later Jaime recalls that it's not Casterly Rock. Something terrible lives here there. They both have flaming swords. I thought maybe if Jaime and Cersei are Mad King's children he might be Azor Ahai. And he will not fight the Others but something beneath earth.
"You think I fear death?" That seemed to amuse him.
"You should. Your crimes will have earned you a place of torment in the deepest of the seven hells, if the gods are just."
"What gods are those, Lady Catelyn? The trees your husband prayed to?"
Man, your vids are the best ASoIaF content on youtube. Thank you for sharing.
Another top tier video!
Wheredid you get this info? Is it your original theory, or did you find this somewhere? It's pretty good. You videos are much better now! Great job, & I like how you go way left field and use this "spookier" dialogue. Ke
Info comes from all of the ASOIAF books including the world of ice and fire. ALL theories on this channel are mine!
It's sad that GRRM is a publicity seeking procrastinator.
Perhaps the people of the Shadow - are shadows.
Stannis has no shadow. Has it gone into the shadow babies, or does it live in Ashai?
Can you do a video about all westeros valyrian steel swords?
Love your theories Q, I hope you come back when winds comes out!
Very informative and a great video. You have a way of piecing everything together nicely. Thanks for you work and efforts. I always enjoy your channel.
Turns out it's just the stone men who are ruled by the shadow lord 😂
Beyond the sunset sea are the islands Aegon, Visenya and Rhaenys
i'm amazed that there are people who don't know that "curtain of light at the end of the world" means the aurora borealis
What makes you think the gods in ASOIAF are real? George Martin is an atheist. Would he create a world where gods do live? Sounds very unrealistic to me.
+Jord Ingenbleek watch my videos: 'they who move the pieces' and 'Asshai and what lies at the heart of the Shadow'
Great video man!
You're so scary, seriously, cheer up mate, you're making everyone uncomfortable
But in the coma dream, Bran is shown many things, some of which haven't happened. He may also be being shown where dragons can me from.
Great vid! A bit late to the game perhaps, but I'd like to add to your theory as to *why* the people of the shadow may have gone west: the Red God's bid for power. You mentioned in your other videos that there is indication of an eldrich struggle between the Red God and the Great Other. Seeing as the Others are clearly the champions of the latter, who would champion the first? Of course, dragons.
But if dragons come from the shadow, created by the Red God, then they are a bit far removed from where they need to be. For sure, they might easily fry anything that comes out of the Grey waste, but even on dragon wings the lands of always winter are far, and as beasts they would have no reason to venture so far from home. So, the knowledge of taming dragons was created, so as to better aim them at the enemy, and then the people of Asshai started moving dragons west. Perhaps they indeed hoped that Valyria would spread out far into even Westeros, so that dragons would be on the frontline, tamed and ready to rumble. I think that Valyria was indeed a power play by the Red God, to expand his fire across the world.
It is for this reason that I do *not* think the Doom was brought about by the Red God. By all accounts, his bid for power was going well. And as we know, 'waking giants from the Earth' as the children of the forest did to shatter the arm of Dorne, is something theoratically anyone who is willing to make the needed sacrifice can do. Perhaps they are a fourth force, aside from the Red God, the Great Other and the Deep Ones? Speculation. In any event, if anything deliberately destroyed Valyria (and that is still a big 'if') I doubt it was the Red God that paid the price to wake the giants of the earth.
Heck, mayhaps the whole religious thing the Red priests are doing is their *second* attempt at the Red God's bid for power. Thoughts?
I believe that the shadowpeople were either a bransch of the essosi children of the forest from beyond the grey waste or mossovy that swore themselves to r'hllor
We know There were children of the forest in the lands of ifequevron. Perhaps they had existed over the entire world at one point. If the theory that the others are children is true, and if the shadow people are also children, wouldnt this make the others "those who sing the song of ice" and the shadow people "those who sing the song of fire"?
They could indeed well be, or something altogether different. Between the children, Others, humans, giants, deep ones etc there's plenty of humanoids to go around.
I doubt that the Others are outirght children, but perhaps they were made by them, or were meant to control them (as I would suggest the shadow peoples' purpose had been to control the dragons). Clearly the arrival of men threw things for a loop. Perhaps the long night was the result of the children, now diminished, being unable to control the others.
@@alexgroot2508 most likely, the elder races like the children and the giants are the natural inhabitants of planetos. As neither is affiliated with ice or fire and doesnt strive for mastery, but balance. This makes them very unlike men, who are said to be fire made flesh. Much like dragons.
In almost all theories i have seen, the children are placed on the side of ice and men in the middle. But if you think about it, man is by far the greatest minion of R'hllor, even more so than dragons. In the Thousands of years that dragons existed, they never managed to wipe out a species. Now look at men. Lions, mammoths, direwolves, giants, unicorns and even Dragons were consumed by the fire that is humanity. This also explains why the others despise men. Being on oposing sides.
All very true. Though I would add that I'm not certain whether this eldrich struggle is altogether limited to R'hllor and the Great Other. The Deep Ones and the 'Giants of the Earth' are also a thing. The Children do not need to be alligned with the Others, they could just as well be alligned with the Giants that the invoked once to shatter the arm of Dorne.
But on account of humans, you seem to be quite right. They, and the Dragons made in tandem with them, are of great destructive capacity to any and all other factions. Though the Others, which according to Martins are 'just another form of life', are hardly any better I would wager.
Were the Valyrians so keen for gold and silver because they had to pay back the shadow people for the magic? Or could the shaow people seen that they got out of control and wiped them out ?
I thought the video said "The Valyrians ARE the Shadow people"
I miss your videos like these.
im beginning to think that the "black stone" is actually the secret ingredient to creating valerian steel, not obsidian..
Awesome video. I've always been fascinated by the Shadowlands lore.
Explain the red meteor appearing after the three dragon eggs hatched plox!!!!!!!!!!!!
5 thumbs down? I'll never understand people.
Awesome video, i really liked that new sound at the very beginning
Love your channel man and i think iv comment this before but the art you use is on point!
Do you think there could be some dragons in Stygai?
5:00 - Painting of Glorfindel (LOTR) ;)
cristão ..
Do U think Daenerys and her dragons will have to go 2 the shadow and the corpse city? Please reply I have read the books. In the show when we see the cat's paw dagger I read the writing and the working of black stone was obsidian melted by Dragonfire and it made the stone pliable, Dragonstone was built-in this manner. In the books Dragonstone looks even more badass! Gargoyles everywhere.
Tito Jr George Martin said no one is going there
I wish you'd make new videos (sighs)
Let's take a moment to appreciate these videos.
bran could go back in the past and 🔍 out! now that would explain a lot! what u 💡 about that? ??
Kathy Byrd I agree. bran was there in the mines when something happened, something was stirred or awoken. he then visited daneys the dreamer in her dream to warn her to leave, some years later doom of valryia
now THIS is a good video my man
Really liked the intro
Fantastic video so eerie!
Very well done video!
The was Epic as all hell!
great work as usual
I've kinda thought that there aren't any gods in GOT
You are correct. These people are foolish to chase God's in a story written by an atheist. They now know that the tree God's are just the children yet they expect a saviour from a being that has people burnt alive?
Seems like Martin is making an example out of the gullibleness.
1.57 the whistle
What does this mean ??
Great video
great content
SHA DOW
Well if burned sacrifices to Rhllor give him some sort of lifeforce that he needs Dragons would be a pretty sweet way for him to obtain mass amount of it. While the great other uses ice to obtain his lets say souls, Rhllor could use fire.
Burnt sacrifices, aka, halocausts. Hmmm, your red god sounds like a piece of shit. GRRM is anti religious, why would some people think he'd make a hero figure out of the idea of a human burning monster?
I never said he's good or evil. If Gods in Planetos are inspired by Lovecraft than they are being that manipulate humans for their own purposes. Humans are inconsequential pawns simply being used for their own means. It's obvious that people sacrificed to weirwoods get absorbed into the net, people who drown possibly get absorbed by the deep one, Dragons would be a perfect tool for a God that absorbs souls or life force, or w/e you want to call it, through fire.
GRRM isnt so much "antireligious" as he is "skeptical/ curious" -- he takes the view that Gods are based on something that can be understood rationally, and therefore, unquestioning "faith" is dangerous, but that doenst imply rejecting Gods altogether. His most effective characters are the ones that accept and "deal with" religion and magic but do not blindly follow or surrender to it.
Whats with the melodramatic voice?
It came to me as a lightning, valyrians were the Nazis of their world. They thought themselves superior, their skin was fare, their hair was beyond blonde (silvery) and their eyes purple (similar to the "master race", proposed by Adolf Hitler) They developed state-of-the-art technology (well, they used magic, but that's still pretty similar) and managed to conquer many regions. To conclude, they did use people against their will to work for them in the mines (_arbet macht frei_ maybe?)
Good God, you believe that stupidity? So, the people who've called themselves "God's chosen tribe" for thousands of years sell you a stupid story and you swallow it down, balls and all?
Ha, "God's chosen people" get their "holy land" from a ridiculous story of a "burnt sacrifice" and you consider it worth believing?
KarlbushtheIV I do not believe that to be true, the problem is that THEY did so.
The Nationalsocialists weren't the first people who have claimed to be part of a "chosen kin".
And even without comparing them to the Nationalsocialists, it should be pretty obvious, that the Valyrians were ruthless and cruel conquerors. George R.R. Martin himself compared them to the Romans, btw (never ending conquest, highly militarized society, state de facto governed by the aristocracy, enslavement, colonization etc.).
it was bad but far from the worst, only 5.7 million deaths, thats rather small when you consider Mao killed about 70 million, ghengis kan killed 40 million and stalin killed 20 million. just saying. also the valyrians are far closser to the romans (conquerors, users of slaves, sheep farmers to very powerful in a veryshort amount of time, don't care too much about the relgion of the conquered people [the romans only persecuted religions they thought threatened them even christianity wasn't orginally persecutted by romans], militaristic, etc) and not nazi (there is no evidence they were racist, no did they try to exterminate any populations, if anything the andals are the nazis (the nazis had a reich church they used to try and control people through religion (just like the septs of the 7), they used biased scientitists to control how people thought (just like the andal maesters, the pyromansers were the first men equvilent, they persecutted multiple people they thought inferior and saw themselves as pure (the andals often refer to themselves as the purest andal blood, they persecutted the firstmen and the children of the forest, etc)
You are not wrong
Good video, strange reading voice lol.
for the love of novels... someone get this gentleman a job as an audio book voice actor! the way your read, combined with your voice... you'd be amazing in narrating books/documentaries.