Good to see the reality of camping in the hills - most vids and publications would have you believe it’s a glorious sunrise and sunset every time. My experiences have been more of this type of weather: blowing a hoolie and horizontal rain. My second night in my brand new Hilleberg Soulo ended in the same fashion with a pole breakage so you’re not alone. My experiences have shown that freak gusts are the culprit, you can measure the average wind speed etc. but there’s always a that single damaging gust. Great vid BTW. Richard.
You know what Richard, I love the 'real' weather. Give me some moody cloud over a bright sunny day in the hills any day, I find it a great antidote to the sterility of modern living. Though camp abandonments, I can definitely do without. That's taking the enjoyment too far! Thanks for a brilliantly realistic comment, opposite of much of the bias and pride of many brand followers. Keep camping my friend.
Glad that you both got back to the car safe and sound. Sorry to hear about your loss. Having watched your channel for a while now, I bet you are enjoying reading the comments, as you've opened up a can of worms, after that adventure
Hi Dave, wow, what a night! Firstly, I’m really sorry for your loss, I truly am, had to do the same a few weeks back and escape to the hills after loosing a loved one, big hugs fella x I also wanted to say how much I really love your videos, not just from a fellow wild camping perspective, but just the humour and enthusiasm you have for your subject matter. Lastly, don’t get caught up in what a certain person has said in the last 24 hours, sometimes people just want to make a name for themselves by being controversial, don’t lower yourself to their level. Good People do Good Things for Other People, That’s It, The End! Keep doing what you love ❤️
You are an absolute star. It does feel like people are implying that I went out to destroy the tent for gain, when the opposite is true, I wanted to prove its worth. I really appreciate your words as now,as my channel has grown and I have pushed the envelope a bit, negativity and criticism have grown disproportionately. Then, to add on top, there is certain smugness from fans of certain brands pouring their glee on top. It does make me feel like stepping away. So, I appreciate your words more than you know. I actually had just lost my dad 24 hrs before and wanted to clear my head. Probably explains why I am being a bit over reactive. Again, thank you for you words of support.
hi Graham, thanks for commenting. I guess all have their limits, I confess the vern 2's was a little lower than I had antipicated without double poling, but that is my misjudgement. Cheers buddy.
Great vid Dave, well done for sticking with it as long as you did. Not putting you in this bracket but it did kinda annoy me that the usual suspects making claims the Verns are hilleberg soulo competitors. In my vid I said time would tell. It didnt take much time and now we know the vern series doesnt come close. Its very clear that either the poles or the pole configuration are the weaknesses, possibly a combination of the two. Im gonna move my Vern1 on and will lilely take a hit on it following these videos. Just picked up a Nallo and with the Soulo I dont really need the vern either. Its a shame because there is a lot to like about this new vern series. Thanks for your honest assessments and putting it through its paces. The other guys (im sure you know who) need to follow your lead a bit more instead of making frankly ludicrous claims as soon as they pull it out of the bag. Oh and I want to offer my sincere condolences.
Hi Scott, your comment and perspective is really appreciated. Some on here definitely want to group me with other more sensational channels and attempt to rub my nose in it. I am keeping my faith in the brand and the vern series and hope you might consider keeping yours to see the outcome and Nortents response. Cheers buddy.
Nice one Dave. I'm thrilled "tent fish" made an appearance. Your dog has nerves of steel. This video brings back fond memories/ 2nd hand fun of a tent collapse in the Shetlands.... The winds didn't relent for 4 days. So the local boat club found a caravan for us to stay in until we could cycle tour on as it was uncycleable on loaded touring bicycles.. Many condolences on the loss of someone close to you.
Cheers Damian, that sounds like a 'fun' trip. The dog is cool but perhaps misguidedly trusts me. She is from romanian street dog stock. So despite looking cute, she is 'nails' and will have a go at any dog that runs through our family group.
Good evening, Dave, well done for getting out in those conditions to test the Vern 2, especially after the unfortunate news you shared, wishing you and your family well. It would appear we both experienced similar outcomes in similar conditions. Thank you for putting together this clear and concise video and description of the events. Rowan.
@@Fellmandave1 I would say the operating limit for the Vern 1 is 40mph with an extra 10mph buffer in case it got worse. After that I really wouldn't be comfortable in it, plus I don't think it would survive past that. Nortent did ask me just now if I were willing to take it out again in similar conditions with double poles, however I sadly said to them I could not justify the £102.68 cost just for curiosity, especially when I have tents that can cope with that weather. If I were to reverse this onto you, what would you say the Vern 2 is capable of? Hope this helps. Rowan.
@@Fellmandave1 I think that is a fair assessment, makes sense comparably to the Vern 1 as it has less surface area, so may be stronger. Maybe, I'm not too worried either way, I have bought a replacement so I can carry on using the Vern. Thanks again. Rowan.
My old Vaude space K2 was bombproof in a storm. Handled Sandwood Bay in February with a F7-9 northerly no problem. You could double pole that as well. Mildew got it in the end. Weighed nearly 5kgs 😢. Currently I’m using the Simond Makalu T2. It’s a bit snug to say the least and if you’re over 6’ you have to stick your feet into the vestibule! But that Nortent looks the bees knees. Thanks for the videos. Very informative and I truly appreciate the time and effort that goes into producing them. 👍🏻
Great test vid Dave! Fab dog as always. Sorry for your loss, and sorry for you not to have the restful morning you needed, and time to think. All the best for the future. 😊.
excellent review, and bravo to your lovely dog for being so calm, she really is a lovely companion. I had high hopes that the tent was going to survive. Thank you for filming your experience in very challenging conditions.
My worst nightmare WIND! I was on a scout camp camp with a cheap Halfords pop up tent and mine was the only one left standing. I was so surprised. Thanks for the video Dave so sorry for your loss. I've had a similar sh1tty year.
Enjoyed watching your review which I came to after reading andys comments at backpacking uk. I thought your video was fair and you were clearly prepared... Clearly some channels focus on reviews and endorse products / tents putting them into categories like hilleberg.... You are out there and doing it... Great to see some of the comments / support from some real wildcamping legends on here.... New subscriber
Thanks Chris, I nearly deleted that comment on there this morning. But, if it has meant a genuine person like yourself coming over, then it was worth it. Welcome , my friend.
Sorry to hear about your loss Dave. Going camping by yourself is always good for the soul. I live in Kent and am working towards my ML assessment. I love going to Scotland to get my QMDs and booked my bus tickets last December. When it was time to travel, the wind was blowing 70/80 mph at the Cairngorm summits. I pitched low done on my first night but it was the windiest camp I’ve ever had. Thankfully I was in my BL Soulo and the only thing that went wrong was one of the pegs came out. My ice axe proved to be a great peg! I measured 40 mph at times using my Kestrel but most of the time it was 30-35. It’s definitely hard measuring the wind from your tent door. What was interesting was that I could hear the wind howling high up, it would get louder and louder and then bang, the tent was hit. I would say your tent seemed to be quieter than mine when the wind really hit. Thanks for sharing.
Wow, that was a really well painted picture of your camp Ben. You express yourself well , that bodes well for your ML. Got to be tricky being in Kent though. I was working and living in Leicestershire 30 years ago but leapt at the chance to move to the NE to be nearer the hills. Enjoy!
@@Fellmandave1 Thanks for your kind comments. It was bad enough driving to Dartmoor, the Brecon Beacons and the Peak District when I was working on my HML award but ML is a long drive every time. The overnight buses to Scotland are much better value than driving. My next trip is in July and I will be doing a 4 day bivvy trip to the Ben Nevis, Grey Corries and Mamores area. Im a teacher and I do all this for fun but also to offer the best and cheapest DofE programme I can at school.
I camped in my nortent vern 2 this night. I had exactly the same fault as you did, the tent collapsed and the pole was severely bent. Exactly the same place as your broke. The middle pole also bent, but not more than 20 degree
@@Fellmandave1 we summitcamped near Mannsvatnet in Uskedalen west in Norway. Forecast was wind gust of 16 m/s, but we belive the gust was a bit higher.
Nicely handled, Dave. I'll be 65 later this year. I live seaside and manage property up mountain along California coast. I would swear that the wind past few yrs has turned angry. Not necessaily blowing harder, but more erratic and pummeling. Don't know if others have noticed same, or if I'm the old horse running back to the barn for beer and shelter.
Dave firstly sorry for your loss of a friend. Getting out and up that hill and doing this in that weather is a credit to you…..and jeez I hope that dog gets a big fee. I hope people take the time to read the feedback from Nortent, it’s such a credit to small manufacturers that listen. I had emailed MSR many times about issues I had and never once got an answer. So I would much rather work with someone that cares about its products and the people that use them. Big hug to the dog.
Just to add, I think the answer here from Nortent, should be the option for people that need 4 season tents, to be able to buy stronger poles be that DAC or width, at cost price, based on sending in proof of purchase, this would be a great gesture to people supporting them as customers
@@Fellmandave1 it’s actually quite good that the failures have come together albeit in the types of condition that relatively few people would be expecting to pitch in, most would opt for a less exposed pitch given the forecast, or decide not to pitch but to get off the hill when it’s that poor. For sure they’ll rectify the problem, the only way is up as far as the poles are concerned for now, and this can only be of benefit to end users. 👍🏻
Absolutely fair play Dave, you're out and you're pushing the limits. Enormous credit for that 😊 The verns at either end have a susceptibility for exactly what this has demonstrated. Just based on the design alone.I actually think their real strength would be side winds! For now. It can sit just below the top table I think. Take care, Adge
Thanks for the video Dave, made me feel a bit sad for some reason. But I’m excited to hear in the comments from Nortent they are looking at a tunnel tent version hopefully a lighter 1 man version too along the lines of the Abisko lite 1 and Akto but with great ventilation for year round use and a higher head room. With adjustable interior size and door options🤞😀Thanks J
Sorry to hear of your loss Dave .. And then this happens on the hill....I was surprised at the pole breakage on such a sterling tent... I will be most interested in the outcome of the pole issue .
Hi Dave. Glad to see you and Honey are well. Great work remaining so calm and especially continuing to film - a credit to you! I’ve had a pole failure also at night and had to bail in storm conditions and it’s definitely unsettling and hard to keep a cool head. As with any tent manufacturer who doesn’t wind test their tents publicly unfortunately the only way people know their limits is when they find them in dangerous real world conditions. This tent failing at 40mph or thereabouts puts it more into the 3 season category. I don’t believe larger diameter poles will solve the structural weakness. They will help no doubt but the very sloped angle of those crossing poles mean the guys are less effective in supporting them and that creates significant downward pressure on the hooped side poles. Great entertaining video and as I say happy it all ended well bar some easily replaced poles 👍
Cheers Gary. Even wind tunnel testing has its limitations though as you don't get the gusts that keep restlessness tge materials. I get your point on the angles. A longer guy there or guys in a different location could help. We shall see.
Amazing, you kept your cool throughout. Thanks, Nortent needs to send you a new improved set of poles. I think mine are 9.5 mm on the Kuiu storm star. Please tell puppy stay warm. Please take care of yourself. Jim
@@Fellmandave1 great can't wait to see results. After seeing this I went to a place called tent pole tech. See what you think let me know! Apparently this is a pretty common problem with tents in general. The sound was amazing like gale force winds Jim
I am really shocked that this tent could not withstand those winds. Yes indeed it was an extreme weather event but that tent looked like it could take anything short of a hurricane. But most importantly I'm glad that you and the dog are safe and sound.
Please excuse me for reflection upon myself as I watched. I was once caught on a scotland summit in something that seems similiar to this as best I can judge from your video. I did an emergency phone call at 4.45am to police mtn rescue getting five brave volunteers out of their beds. It was so incredibly humbling. What can you say to those men and women? I know your video was about your experience and technical structure issues encountered, as it should be, but hearing the whirl of the wind and the thump on the tent wall, it was just to vivid even now after two years. You stayed a lot more positive than I did. What broke me was the noise... bang bang bang - like being on the inside of a base drum as its struck. And the damp from lying the sleeping bag along the wall to support the poles. I even ran out of water. Not a time of pride for me.... peaceful camping to you. JMO.
Thank you for sharing that, you learned and grew eh. What helped me here though was that the summit was exposed, but an easy descent to the car. may have been a lot scarier had I been more remote. I actually quite like the wind and all that goes with it. i had my son, wife plus a friuend and sone on a very windy lakes fell on Friday. Winds were up to 35 mph on the summit, i was the only one liking it! OOps!
Understood I believe I learnt many things about judgement. One surprising was also learnt. When the rescue team says to you we will put a person on each side of you, and just flat state that this is the descent route we will be taking, they are not really really interested in your original plans! Being able to say you completed the circuit is not their priority. Imagine that.😮 thx for posting.
In rough weather I always take a goretex bivi bag that extra 800 grams is worth it, from a leaking tent to a totally wiped out tent it could save your life. I would personally rather stay put than attempt leaving in the middle of the night cold wet and windy on exposed mountains.
@ashab1 thank you for sharing. In fact based upon that experience my attitude has completely changed. My current view is to collapse down the tent upon myself and just wait it out. All the wind pressure and noise is gone. So I reason it will be possible to relax and sleep which was so much of the problem for me. Yes there would be damp, but I think that is likely manageable compared to the alternative as you describe it. JMO.
Well. Just goes to show that Hilleberg is the way to go. Here in Australia, The Vern 2 is around $1000.00 AUD with footprint The Allak 2 which would be the closest to The Vern 2 is around $2050.00 You pays your money and take your choice I guess Great review btw. Few do this sort of stuff on here 👍👍
Great Video Dave - glad you both got down safe and sound - i think the dog enjoyed the adventure - i can think of no better companion to be with when the going gets tough in life physically and emotionally than a dog - keep your adventures coming I learn a lot from watching - best wishes and many thanks and never lose that sense of humor - 😄
Dave, sorry for your loss Excellent video staying calm in challenging conditions and still filming in such an informative way Glad you and the dog made it safely down
Great extreme testing . You have shown up the light in the 7 series aluminium poles . I have seen a question mark about them . I was hoping 40mph would be well within the poles capabilities . I’m sure Nortent will work it out. Feel a bit sorry for the dog though . I know you were proving the dogs bag as well but you were on the limit . Sorry for your loss it gets us all at some point 😢
Hi Dave, firstly - top video and kudos for getting out and putting this tent through its paces. I do have to say I thought claims that these tents were comparable to Hilleberg - especially the Soulo, despite a lack of testing or history - or in many cases having never even used a Soulo to be questionable. Hilleberg tents are hand made and I've not seen any mass produced tent at the same quality (we live in hope!) - but it's just not possible. I'm no Hilleberg fan boy and I'm not a brand or tent snob - I've used many - but I've now seen two videos showing 1 and 2 person variants being almost destroyed, winds just around 30mph + which you mention at the end, you wouldn't recommend using the tent in winds greater than that. Definitely not a Soulo killer, beater or rival in any way. The Vern is a lovely tent for the right conditions - it has great space and a nice structure and it imitates some features of the Soulo, namely the pole sleeves, cups and clips. I hope people don't head out in conditions that the Soulo could take in its stride and end up in the smelly stuff. 10mm poles would no doubt make a difference, or double poling - but when you add up the cost of this, would it maybe make more sense to stretch that more to a Soulo - which has a demonstrable track record and pedigree in some of the harshest environments on the planet? I ended up putting my Soulo on a credit card after a sh#t life event in 2016 - so never been given one, so have no need to say anything other than the truth about it. My BL version suffered a slightly bent pole after the gust from hell in a storm with 80mph winds nr Blencathra - it was my own idiotic fault for trying to camp in such weather - we live and learn. Again, top video and you've been honest and open here about the limitations of this tent. Great to see Nortent respond in such an open fashion and wanting to evolve the tent based on end user experience. I look forward to testing the Vern 1 and 2 myself soon. Keep on keeping on - ATB 🏕️
@@Camped_on_Dartmooryou remember incorrectly then.... Read what I have written above - I specifically mentioned that the centre pole bent? (in 80mph winds) - what's your point? A bend isn't a failure - a snap is. My tent was still pitched fine and I noticed the bend when I struck camp - so a failure is incorrect. If you're advocating the use of an OEX Bobcat in 80mph winds then good luck to you 🏕️
@@MCMOutdoors I am certainly not saying you should go out in 80mph winds in a bobcat. I was just pointing out that a 50.00 pound tent didn't get any damage. if a tent pole bends beyond its design specs "id" consider that a failure.
Hi Chris and great comment. There is a bit of a general mix in this thread though of interchanging the Vern 1 and vern 2. I agree though that neither is as strong yet, as a soulo ( vern 1), or say allak (vern2) But both of these tents have great qualities. This is a learn and develop moment for them and they are on the case, as you pointed out in your comment. But i have reflected on my somewhat shell shocked statement of up to 30 mph. Based on the winds I measured, the tent was fine up to 40 mph, so i reserve the right to change that statement. However , people camp in strong winds at their own risk! It was the significantly stronger gusts after that, which did it. I would of liked it be have been good up to 50 though to achieve true ' mad conditions' certification, but then again its a big tent. So we will see what happens with the pole development. Thanks for coming on here Chris and putting up a well considered comment. I hear you on your 2016 event, made you stronger mate. I too look forward to you testing the verns on your brilliant channel . Any further comments from you will now be dealt with harshly as Im getting too brown lips here! hahaha
@@Fellmandave1I've also been blocked and had my comments deleted from the other channel in question that pushed this tent as a Soulo beater for making polite, balanced and non personal observations...... So I'd say your integrity in not blocking and silencing anyone with an alternative viewpoint speaks volumes. Hold your head up high and keep going 👍
Sorry for your sad loss Dave ❤ I’ve both the Vern 2 and waiting on the vern 1 to arrive. I’ve just ordered a full set of extra poles for each from Nortent but to be honest I don’t fancy lugging another set of poles up a hillside especially on the vern 2. I’m waiting on a supplier emailing me to say they’ve got the 10.25mm Dac poles in so I can make my own but really shouldn’t be having to do this. The poles that nortent are selling in my opinion simply aren’t fit for purpose and it’s easy to understand when they are selling them for only $28 for the 12 section red ones. That’s works out at $2.33 not included the end caps and shock cord so what are they buying them for. It’s just not the overall thickness that counts but the thickness of the wall of the tubes that’s critical. The Dac ones I’ve found will be twice this price so hopefully will do far better but disappointed I’m spending delivery money with Nortent as well as money on new 9mm poles to double pole to put me on. They advertise as the tent being four season so should supply materials suitable for those seasons without having to buy more poles. I’ve put in comments on my order about both your issues and Rowans and that if they can help with delivery charges I’d appreciate it but will wait and see what becomes. Wonder if they tested them at all in real life conditions as hilleberg and decathlon do to mention just a few. Very disappointing. Hopefully they can help out those that have bought and can make upgrades so the issue goes away on all new stuff going out. Thanks for testing the tents out so we don’t find ourselves in the same situation it’s much appreciated 😀👍 Shame they didn’t get half a dozen of you to test them before release as it’s put a dent in there reputation and potential sales going forwards. Take care of yourself and thanks again at this hard time ❤
Thanks Marc for your thoughtful and detailed comment. I agree on your points. But don't forget to enjoy the tents as they are and don't let my video ruin that. Cheers.
@@Fellmandave1 Hi Dave I’ve put a comment on one of the nortent Facebook groups where one of your videos was shared to see if you’re okay with me direct messaging you. It could be the lightbulb moment 👍
Hello Dave! I'm curious here, are you supposed to double pole everywhere, or double pole from the front (11:39) only, to be able resist winds above 40 mph? Asking since I have none experience whatsoever. Also in the video to me, you looked like you had the short end towards the gust of wind, or is the "short end" in this scenario, the "body" or the large chamber of the tent and not the two entrances? Great video! and I hope they improve the Vern 2 in time, as I do love the features and thinking about buying it. Hope that you make some more videoes with Vern 2 as well! Sincere regards Jan
Hi Jan. Its a goid question.Nortent are sending me new thicker poles and standard poles to trial various scenarios, so I'll be likely publishing that in the not too distant future. The obvious answer is just to double pole where required, but we'll see.
I have a Nortent Vern 2 and was camping at Angle Tarn on the 13th Apr 2024, windy as hell during the night, you could hear the wind before the gusts hit the tent, but I had my tent (red poles) facing into the wind, I know this cannot always be achieved, but my tent survived and so did I 😁 woke up to an amazing sunrise over the tarn 😀
@@Fellmandave1 No need to feel bad, I like the tent and I will be purchasing extra poles after watching your video, I have just uploaded mine from the weekend and if you view it from about 30 seconds in for about 10 seconds, you can see how bad the weather was th-cam.com/video/-GRXFEm_c-c/w-d-xo.html and I agree, hard work putting a tent up in heavy rain and wind 🙄
Sorry to hear about your loss Dave . I hope you dont mind me saying but you still sound a bit under the weather yourself so i hope you are not run down and you are taking care of yourself. Theres a lot more surface area to catch the wind on a 2 man tent over a smaller tent but i would have expected a tent of that weight and type of structure to be able to handle winds of 40mph without much trouble. It will be interesting to see what unfolds in due course with performance and quality control etc ATB
Hi Olan, thanks for your concern and observation. I had a bad cold that became chesty, took 3 weeks. Not like me at all. Yes,I too would of expected the tent to have handled it, but Nortent are handling things responsibly and openly.
Thank you for another informative test camp in this series of tents. As a collection of videos they're very useful in allowing people to make more informed decisions about which tent is for them.
Darn, that's underwhelming tent performance by the Vern2. And only just after I've seen a somewhat similar outcome with the 1 person version, here on TH-cam. I agree that double poling would be suitable for expected >50mph wind/gusts, not just for this tent but almost all. Thanks for this video.
Andrew park outdoors has a good hack for the vern series Achilles heel in high wind. Use a walking stick on guy line on end facing wind. I agree with him not enough arch on two side of tent make them collapse, easy in high wind. They need a little Reengineering. I think double poles it's still gonna be weak on the ends, Use the hack.
I made some comments on the 7 series poles which may have been hasty and having absoulty no design experience in poles it should just be treated as off the hand comment with now sound backing . have just seen another TH-cam video which highlighted some potential pitching issues. To be fair I was so drawn into the intensity of the wind I never really watched the video, which was my fault . Your video which was very informative has highlighted some areas that really needs to addressed such as condition of your tent before pitching wind conditions and direction and changes in those condition through the night and the risks of bailing and the associated hazards of that alone . Still a good channel to watch but I think I’m going to watch all channels a few times now before I even think of what I want to comment on.
Fair play to you Dave for a full disclosure video of the Vern 2 in those kind of conditions. Makes your honest assessment reassuring to see the current safety limitations of the shelter in its current configuration. So hopefully nortent take on your feedback positively and proactively . Atb
That’s great to hear a company responding positively to user feedback. Good work on using your skills to keep calm and focused in that situation. My condolences to your loss aswell Dave. Take care and Atb
Some of those gusts can be very powerful indeed. Now we know the Nortent vern 2's limit on this occasion. Thankyou for sharing! Can the Vern 2 be doubled poled?
@@Fellmandave1 Great look forward to the test. Seen the video with the Kuiu Storm Star 2p with 60 mph plus test and on all sides performed single pole like a bomb shelter. Similar design with poles. The Vern 2 does interior compared to the Kuiu interior seems to flap a lot in wind. The Kuiu interior seems to be pretty stable. Surprized the Vern 2 suffers at a limit of 40 mph.
Yikes, sorry to see this Dave. Not a pleasant night. Good on you for doing valuable work to give us all an idea of the limitations of this tent. Someone mentioned in a message to me that they had concerns about the unbranded poles. The funny thing is, the Vern 2 poles feel quite substantial in hand, and the five poles weigh in at 1 kg. I don't like dismissing things (be it tent poles, lawnmowers or anything really) just because they're not made by big names. Yes, the big names have the reputations, but that doesn't mean that all lesser/newer brands are poor performers by default. That said, it would seem that these poles are the weak point of the Vern tents. As we know, this is a new model of tent that is bound to go undergo some evolution in order to improve it. This is how things work. Perhaps the next step might be to opt for branded poles, or to address the design and make-up of the current poles? I remember commenting on Andrew Park's first video to suggest that the crossing poles could potentially end up weakening themselves in high winds by pressing together and deforming their walls. Perhaps that is the failure mode at play here after all? Good on you for keeping the camera rolling, and I'm very sorry to hear of your loss. I don't suppose this camp was the kind of quiet time you needed at all, but pat on the back for getting the video out nonetheless. Keep doing what you do 👍 James.
Hi James,thanks for your insightful comment. You are better placed than most. Yes ,it was not quite the peaceful time I anticipated, but perhaps was what I needed. Cheers for the encouragement and same to you. Did I win the 'best reviewer' comp we had going?
@@Fellmandave1 I think that was your competition, Dave, and as one of the two entrants in said competition, I hereby withdraw my rights to act as a judge 😉
Very interesting video, and I guess a thanks are in order. 👍You really took one for the team here. I do wonder though, if proper dac poles, either in the same diameter or slightly thicker would make much of a difference, or if it is more of a design problem?
It’s a design issue. I doubt stronger poles will help. What could help is staking out the end guy line (the one which is where the two poles cross) to a trekking pole.
Ah I'm so sorry that your camp for your friend ended this way Dave. But at least you and Honey were safe and back to the car in one piece. You certainly put that tent to the test. I was out in my Kuiu storm star on the weekend and measured gusts of 46mph. It certainly makes you feel alive doesn't it 🤣
I think I am going to cancel my Vern 1, 2024 until it has been out a bit longer. I've now seen the Vern 1 have a pole snap and the Vern 2. I'm wanting mine to set up a work camp/wild camp/ hikes group. Even if you prepare and plan for the weather, it can change suddenly. I don't want to be having to buy stronger poles and have extra expense on a new tent.
I don't usually comment, but feel the need to. First and foremost, my condolences for your loss. Second, how anyone could think you intentionally wanted to break this tent is beyond daft (and more likely speaks to their own modus operandi). Time and again you show yourself to be one one of the most level-headed, rational and non-clickbaity reviewers on this platform, and you certainly don't ever seem to feel the need to be an idiot for the purpose of views/clicks/algorithm-feeding. Long may that continue! The naysayers need to take a good long look at themselves.
Would be hard to sleep in that noise? I wonder how it would fare with double poles all around what the max wind strength would be with the double poles? Great video though and an honest review. Wonder if Nortent intend upgrading the poles or the angle of them?
In future suppiles the poles are upgraded, As regartds sleeping in that noise, with 4 kids, 2 dogs and a demnanding job, a flappy tent is a blessed release.
Interesting top work, but can you double pole it when the attachments are designed for a single pole Gov ? think the tension on the tent works against it puts to much pressure on the poles .
Ive heard these tents compared to hillebergs (not by yourself but on youtube in general) and was considering one. Not the case then 😂😂. Im very sorry for your loss as well mate. My thoughts are with you.
Thank you Greg. Most appreciated. Check out my latest on this tent. Nortent has given some pitching tips, which would have helped and changed the poles. All of which make a big difference. Cheers
Wow, good that you tested that for us! Yeah, for a proper storm 10 mm poles are probably the way to go. Hilleberg and Fjällräven are doing that. But then you will need stronger material for the outer tent.
@@BrokenVikingOutdoors it’s no good if the poles aren’t up to the job though. If they use better poles the price will go up. 📈 it’s tricky for them to get this right.
@@Fellmandave1 I think Dave the issue lies with the hype about the Vern being a competitor for the soulo as everyone claimed. Without testing it. This test you’ve done proves it’s not a competitor. It’s just not in the same league. It’s half the price for a reason. You shouldn’t need to replace poles or seal it or anything. It should come out. Get tested. Then make its claims as to what it can and can’t cope either weather wise. I said nothing during all the hype but it frustrates me to hear people always down on hillebergs because they’re “overpriced they’re noisy condensation heavy etc etc”. I’m experienced but not claiming to be an expert and I’m 100% positive there’s no better manufacture than hilleberg. End of. I’m not a fan boy but yes I own 2. I’ve had 6 in total. The nallo is my least favourite btw they’re not all great. But to come on this platform and make claims like you all have is misleading and pretty much poor sport. There’s people commenting here saying they bought a Vern on hearsay. I dunno. Don’t hate me it’s just my opinion. It’s utterly crazy to make claims about untested products. I’m sure they’ll come back bigger and better. But hopefully they’ll do more research (testing) before puffing out their chests. I’m done now. 👍
Are we going to stop making bold claims that these new tents are hilleberg rivals. ?? They’re nowhere near the same league. My staika in measured 68mph wind on blencathra. I was inside making my tea. 😂 😂 Well done fellman for really testing it out now. Just a shame it failed miserably 😂😂😂😂
Well Andy, there remain parallels and the price is very competitive. But agree, as do Nortent that for those conditions, double poling is indicated, as do Hilleberg for certain conditions. Yes, not as strong as the staika, but changes and development are underway. Nortent are very good at listening and adapting. I know you enjoy your Hillebergs and your loyalty crops up frequently, enjoy and thanks for commenting. Boosh!
@@Fellmandave1 double poling ? I’ve never had to on any of my wild nights mind. It’s only for really extreme conditions hille tell you to double pole. Like 80-90mph. I do like my hillebergs. I paid enough for them. I go out and I always feel safe. I never worry they’ll fail. This is the difference and why they’re expensive. Nortent could use better 10mm dac poles. And stronger rip stop like the kerlon 1800. But then they’ll put the price up. 🤷♂️ and to be honest the pole configuration of this Vern looks wrong. No I’m sorry. It’s not for anything over 30mph that. Hopefully nortent do learn and adapt because I like nowt better than a new tent. Atb 👌
@@GregTheCamper I wanted this tent to work because it’s a good looking shelter. Nice features. But the untested claims were bugging me. Now it’s tested. And it’s back to the drawing board 😂
@Fellmandave1 Sorry but the price being competitive is irrelevant as a Hilleberg and a Nortent aren't designed or capable of handling the same conditions
Hi , was the pole break with the old smaller size poles ? Looking at buying this tent for mountain camping with my wife and dog. Would you recommend this tent with new 9mm poles ? Thanks Ian
@smikedenney222 older poles. The new ones are much better. I am thinking of selling mine as just don't have the space and I mostly go solo.. Interested?
Its highly likely, however pole improvements and pitching improvements have changed things significantly with this tent. See my latest video on it. Thanks for your thoughtful comment.
Quite interested, if it’s the new design of Vern 1,2,3 that stresses the Nortent 7001 poles, or if they have serious quality issues with a new supplier? Will have to adjust my Vern 1 for stronger winds. Otherwise, it’s useless in the mountainous regions of Scandinavia or Greenland.
I feel like Nortent told creators to put the Hilleberg beating stuff in their titles as everyone was doing it. Fellmandave tested the tent properly, well done to you. I mean failing in those winds? wow, just wow.
Hi Martin , I have to correct you, but I can categorically promise that Nortent did not say that to me and I can say with great certainty that they would of not given that guidance to anyone else. Plus not everyone was doing this, certainly not me. As regards those winds, please try pitching a large tent in 40 mph plus (measured), if you have already, you will appreciate just how powerful they are. However, i am sure future pole developments combined if indicated ( as I should of) double poling will see improvements in wind tolerance for the vern 2. Thanks for commenting
@@Fellmandave1 i know you didnt but a lot of other channels have basically the same title. which often happens when companies ask for a specific angle for the videos. My comment was not in any way critical of you or anything you did, i think your approach has been perfect. Im critical of channels that made it like this was going to beat Hillebergs or imply these tents are capable of more without doing these tests like you have done.
Looks to me like a guyline tied, at an upwards angle, to a trekking pole at each end of the vestibule (tied to where the pokes cross (the little triangle area) would help keep the ends from collapsing. In other words, the ends need to have an upwards force to counteract the downward force of the wind.
Hello Elizabeth. You're are absolutely right, this is something I have done on the scarp 1 and will be trying on the Verns. Not ideal but a possible solution.
Not a great situation for reflection, sorry the evening ended on this note for you. Do you think Nortent will strengthen those tent poles anytime time soon, would like to buy this tent but concerned about the fact that several folks have now written about broken or severely bent poles?
Hi Peter, thanks for that, but perhaps what I needed. Nortent is sending me upgraded poles this week for testing. What their plans are, though, I don't know. However the tent is excellent and suitable for most conditions in its current format.
Thank you, Dave. I'd really like to add to the kind wishes regarding your bereavement that your followers have expressed. I am sorry for your loss, mate. So, between you and Rowan, that's two Vern failures reported this week... worrying stuff. I am awaiting my Vern 1, having pre-ordered and paid for it in Feb. I really did think and was seduced into believing this tent might be a rival for the ubiquitous Soulo, it clearly isn't. Good (not great) response from Nortent... But, do I want a tent that I've awaited this long, only to see upgrades shipped as standard weeks later? No, I dont. This is still, after all, a premium tent at a premium price. I'm seriously concerned and considering cancelling my order. A Scandinavian four season tent that will make me nervous when it gets windy? Hmmm, I'd be resentful of having to chase stability, paying even more for double poles and heading towards 5kg, when they should've been DAC from the off, as has been clearly demonstrated. These wind speeds arent extreme and isn't something we should be worrying about.
Hi @MrCMHUDDY , thank you for your condolences. I really did not expect the response, I just wanted to share my head state in case I seemed different.. I do feel because of the flood of youtubers exhibiting these tents, there has been a corresponding rush of interest and perhaps that may of led to testers, including me, pushing the limits, that other new tents may have been subject to. As regards different poles, I cannot speculate, only test and relay. I do trust the company however. Please bare in mind that the conditions that Rowan was out in was storm force and not just 'windy'. In my tests it performed very well.
I'm wary of poles which extend the length of my body and only bought my first Akto, which has shorter, across the body poles, after Chris Townsend used one for his Munros and Tops walk. The body length, cross poles on the Vern 2 are plenty long enough for me to wonder about their strength. Guys help, but above a certain wind strength, they create an inflexible point which could lead to vulnerability. Back when Terry Abrahams was staying out in all weathers to film Scafell, he questioned the stormworthyness of the Soulo, which also has quite lengthy poles. So, if you want an untroubled night in foul weather, I recommend a bothy and, if no bothy is available, go low and seek a sheltered pitch, which is what everyone used to do back in the days before TH-cam. Great effort getting out to film in those conditions.
It'd be really interesting to see a collection of tents, from budget to high end, all pitched together on a night like this to see how they all fair. Budget tents that are low to the ground might do surprisingly well, such as the OEX Phoxx 1. Any tent that wants to give you height and space is going to struggle unless it is very expensive...
First and foremost, excellent video Dave. I don't comment on videos on TH-cam but felt like I needed to here. This is how you put a tent through its paces, on a hill in testing conditions and not just up in the park to do clickbaity advert. I'm being told that this failure happened due to a damaged pole before setting up or you used the wrong door or something like that from that expert Backpacking UK.
Boosh meister! Thanks for commenting. Wardles coolest mate. The debate in question got a bit messy. The door open jobby was a Vern 1 as featured on Rowans wild camps, mine was just plain old force.
Ive said it before and ill say it again.Tents now are over engineered to gain sales. I have a two man two pole 4 season dome tent with a 3000mm HH outer and a 5000mm HH floor and weighs 2.3kg from Aldi that i bought 15yrs ago here in Qld Australia for $25 It has withstood 3 Qld summer storms.For those that know what a Qld storm is and the destruction they leave get an idea of the destructive winds and rain. Ive reproofed this tent once in that time and its still going strong. Their is good solid cheap lightish tents out their that will take a battering.Dont get caught up in marketing.
I think a lot of people just like trying differnt gear, but I have utmost admiration for people that have one well used tent that keeps going for years. Enjoy your season!
Good question David. I tried the 1 in moderate winds up to 30 I recall and it was fine. I never tested the mk I vern 2 in anything above light winds. I will be using it again soon though as it is a great tent.
@@Fellmandave1 I’ve got one myself, had it in moderate wind but nothing that severe. Although I have always been convinced that it would outperform the Allak I had previously. Would love to see a real brutal test of the Kuiu. Really like your vids mate, came across you via your tent peg test. My friends and partner couldn’t believe someone would make such a video. 😂😂
That is pretty shocking having a tent with that sort of 4-season marketing failing at those wind speeds. So you recall if it has been tested in a wind tunnel?
@@Fellmandave1 I have a pretty flimsy Slawea 3 pole dome tent sort of thing that uses fairly thin 8.5mm poles and that is tested to 55mph winds. Going to do a damage overview video?
Oh dear. This is the second pole failure on a Nortent (a Vern 1 and a Vern 2) that's been posted in the last couple of days. [EDIT: Another person has also just commented on FB that his Vern 2 also collapsed with bent poles this week!! holy cow]. And interestingly both were of cross-poles. Such wind and rain is not uncommon in Ireland and the UK, and it's wind and rain that's always my biggest concern when camping here. There's even less snow in Ireland than the UK, so that aspect of 4 season tents doesn't interest me at all. Bad weather here is all about wind and rain. I hope Nortent take this on-board and make changes. Reading the response from Nortent - it says that without the long poles then the tent is effectively a tunnel-tent. This is true. They also say that tunnel tents are used by polar explorers. This is also true. They also say that the long poles make the Vern 2 free-standing. Also true. However what they didn't address is why the cross poles broke. I've seen tunnel tents in winds stronger than 50mph and the cross-poles / hoops didn't snap. So why did they snap in this situation here? And the same happened in the video posted by Rowan Wild Camps. Speculation on my part (because I don't have all the facts): is that the long-poles (going the length of the tent) are somehow causing too much loading force on the cross-poles. The design seems to be not suitable for high winds (as we get here in Ireland & UK). I had high hopes for these tents but it seems a redesign is needed to get a tent that can last in high winds and rain. Anyway it was a real life test of the Jerven, lol. Well done on the video Dave. 👍
So why i should use a Tent with 5 Poles and tons of weight? The only answer i have, as a stormshelter. But over 40MPh an roomlost and Polebreak is a shame. For me that Tent makes No Sense. Thanks for inspiration 😊
You are supposed to point the tent towards the wind, this may have had an impact on its strength although winds can come from all angles. I’m concerned what Nortent intend to do about this failure because we all have bought these tents and if they do a have a weakness in the pole then this could cause major problems. I’d be interested to see if the Hilleberg would have performed in these conditions, I suspect it could have suffered a similar problem hence why they offer a Black version. I’m guessing they could supply a heavier duty thicker pole option. Adding additional poles to me just masks a problem and not fix it. Stronger poles should be lighter than extra poles?
@@Fellmandave1 no problem, I like your channel. I find it very useful and informative. Can you tell me if Nortent has asked you to return their poles for their own analysis?
@@marcfisher3417I also find there are quite a few people around the establishment silently waiting for anything like this to discredit this relatively new brand. I would hope a recall and replacement poles are offered to existing customers?
How do you Think the vern 2 would hold up if you had it set up 90⁰ , the side wall look to be stronger than the ends. Get new poles go out in another storm give it a go.
Rowan wild camps took his vern 1 out in that same storm I do believe, same results. I think 40mph is vern 1 n 2 limit with single poles. Although in your vern 2 first look video you leaned on the side it held your weight without guy lines and I do believe the ends will not hold your weight. I still think I'm going to buy one. I only camp in fair weather, woodland and also never have to walk far. So I'm thinking the vern 2 will work perfectly fine. I like your videos keep up the great work.
do you plan on going out in these conditions on a regular basis or are you just testing the tent in case you get caught in these conditions unexpectedly ? with your experience (mountain leader if iam not wrong) I'd expect you not to head out if such conditions are forcast . sorry for your loss 💚
Pitching a tent in those conditions when you're so close to your car shows a serious lack of judgement.. still good for the views I suppose? What exactly are you testing the tent for?🤔
@ExploringForGold you're clearly an experienced high altitude mountaineer with many years experience.... I bow to your superior knowledge and hard won expertise.
It's a tent I still have amongst many, all have different pros and cons. For 2 people, I love the space in the Nortent. I just wish I had time to use them all!
You can double pole the tent, but killed it for me. I like a lot about this tent but dealing with high wind is a major feature when you are away in the Southerm Alps and you don’t want to be a statistic.
The design and weight considered, this is incredibly disappointing sadly. 40mph (~18m/s) is not particularly nasty winds. Any 4-season tunnel tent can with ease withstand 25m/s gusts. Looking forward to see how my Vern 1 will perform in high winds.
Better I am sure. I agree that a better performance could have been anticipated, however the winds that were damaging were definitely above 40 mph. I feel though that 40mph, when you are walking in it, or pitching a tent, are pretty nasty! Good camps Owly.
Watched somebody bail out in winds hitting about 50mph in the vern 1. Not impressive for so called Hilleberg Soulo beater. The windward narrow end was flattening pushing onto his face. Certainly not a 4 season tent as would have trouble in Autumn never mind winter. In comparison the Hilleberg Soulo and Akto been filmed coping with measured 80mph winds which is 4 times the power. Hillebrg film their tents being setup in 60mph winds and showed the nammatj 2 tunnel tent having no issues with a 70mph sidewind. To see what tents can cope with, a german outdoor magazine tested the Hilleberg Katium tunnel tent to destruction. With 80mph sidewinds, a pole broke. Pitched into the wind, a pole broke in winds about 115mph.
@@Fellmandave1 I was just reading the booklet and i noticed them mentioning about doubled polling so there we have it… Vern’s poles don’t cost that much and as you know there are thicker poles out there that would have to be cut to fit but also they are very costly and I think the vern 2 has 4 sets.
Don't worry, despite my words it will be fine to 40 mph. Which is, really blowing some. Just look at the feedback from Nortent too and enjoy, what remains a great tent.
heheh would be fun to try how long this tent last here in iceland in the worst condicions , i doupt i can manage to set it up 😆, i remember in the old days with my papa , we put tent up an later the evening wind comming , we did not have many seconds to escape the tent before tent just did go up to the skyes and dissapear in seconds hahaah, no way in hell to try to hold the tent lol
Wish I never preorderrd my vern 1 after seeing the latest nortent failures. I have a robens starlight 2 which is solid in winds of over 50mph but is a little small. I thought the vern 1 was the answer to my prayers as I can't afford a hillaberg. I'm thinking about selling my vern 1 before I have even received it. Excitement has turned to disappointment unfortunately. Sad times 😢
Its a great tent leeroy. i know about the robens wind tunnel tests. But they are not like real world conditions. None of us should be out camping in 50 mph winds. Its my own daft fault. I have tested thge Vern 1 in strong winds and it was great. Enjoy and domnt be disappointed.
@@AndyWardle I was already looking for a bigger weather proof tent which in my experience the robens 2 is except for the size. The nortent hype definitely influenced my decision to buy the vern 1 as I haven't got hillaberg money. Wind and rain is always on the cards in the UK and I already have the robens which is pretty much weather proof in my experience but is just very small. The nortent was my hillaberg wannabe. I might have to just save up and be patient which is not like me ha
@@leeroy5190 definitely. Sell the Vern say it’s not for high winds 😂 save up you’ll get your hille. That’s what I did. I used other tents until I had the cash. Got my first soulo on eBay £350. 8 years ago. So I’ve had 8 years experience of the soulo tents. I think that’s fair to say I know what I’m on about aye?
@@Fellmandave1 I think I need some time to get over the initial disappointment ha. I'll have a think and see how I feel in a few days. Just recently subscribed and enjoying your content. Keep up the good work!👍
Good to see the reality of camping in the hills - most vids and publications would have you believe it’s a glorious sunrise and sunset every time. My experiences have been more of this type of weather: blowing a hoolie and horizontal rain. My second night in my brand new Hilleberg Soulo ended in the same fashion with a pole breakage so you’re not alone. My experiences have shown that freak gusts are the culprit, you can measure the average wind speed etc. but there’s always a that single damaging gust. Great vid BTW. Richard.
You know what Richard, I love the 'real' weather. Give me some moody cloud over a bright sunny day in the hills any day, I find it a great antidote to the sterility of modern living. Though camp abandonments, I can definitely do without. That's taking the enjoyment too far!
Thanks for a brilliantly realistic comment, opposite of much of the bias and pride of many brand followers. Keep camping my friend.
Blimey Dave, fair play mate, you wouldn’t see me out in conditions like that. The dog was looking at you like were ‘Barking’…..pardon the pun! 🤣🤣
I have a low boredom threshold and an adventurous nature, which probably will be my demise! I am starting to feel sorry for the dog myself!
Glad that you both got back to the car safe and sound. Sorry to hear about your loss. Having watched your channel for a while now, I bet you are enjoying reading the comments, as you've opened up a can of worms, after that adventure
I'm not enjoying all of them to be honest and definitely did not want that to happen to the tent.!
Hi Dave, wow, what a night! Firstly, I’m really sorry for your loss, I truly am, had to do the same a few weeks back and escape to the hills after loosing a loved one, big hugs fella x I also wanted to say how much I really love your videos, not just from a fellow wild camping perspective, but just the humour and enthusiasm you have for your subject matter. Lastly, don’t get caught up in what a certain person has said in the last 24 hours, sometimes people just want to make a name for themselves by being controversial, don’t lower yourself to their level. Good People do Good Things for Other People, That’s It, The End! Keep doing what you love ❤️
You are an absolute star. It does feel like people are implying that I went out to destroy the tent for gain, when the opposite is true, I wanted to prove its worth.
I really appreciate your words as now,as my channel has grown and I have pushed the envelope a bit, negativity and criticism have grown disproportionately. Then, to add on top, there is certain smugness from fans of certain brands pouring their glee on top. It does make me feel like stepping away. So, I appreciate your words more than you know. I actually had just lost my dad 24 hrs before and wanted to clear my head. Probably explains why I am being a bit over reactive. Again, thank you for you words of support.
Still looks like a decent tent but you showed what happens when it’s pushed past it’s limits. Brilliant honest review. Thanks for this one Dave.
hi Graham, thanks for commenting. I guess all have their limits, I confess the vern 2's was a little lower than I had antipicated without double poling, but that is my misjudgement. Cheers buddy.
“Still looks like a decent tent” 😂😂😂😂
Crikey that was hard to watch, you remained incredibly calm and objective. Sorry for your loss.
Thanks Hedley, hope it was not too hard! Happily not my first s**t hitting the fan situation.
Great vid Dave, well done for sticking with it as long as you did. Not putting you in this bracket but it did kinda annoy me that the usual suspects making claims the Verns are hilleberg soulo competitors. In my vid I said time would tell. It didnt take much time and now we know the vern series doesnt come close. Its very clear that either the poles or the pole configuration are the weaknesses, possibly a combination of the two. Im gonna move my Vern1 on and will lilely take a hit on it following these videos. Just picked up a Nallo and with the Soulo I dont really need the vern either. Its a shame because there is a lot to like about this new vern series. Thanks for your honest assessments and putting it through its paces. The other guys (im sure you know who) need to follow your lead a bit more instead of making frankly ludicrous claims as soon as they pull it out of the bag.
Oh and I want to offer my sincere condolences.
Hi Scott, your comment and perspective is really appreciated. Some on here definitely want to group me with other more sensational channels and attempt to rub my nose in it. I am keeping my faith in the brand and the vern series and hope you might consider keeping yours to see the outcome and Nortents response. Cheers buddy.
Nice one Dave. I'm thrilled "tent fish" made an appearance. Your dog has nerves of steel.
This video brings back fond memories/ 2nd hand fun of a tent collapse in the Shetlands.... The winds didn't relent for 4 days. So the local boat club found a caravan for us to stay in until we could cycle tour on as it was uncycleable on loaded touring bicycles..
Many condolences on the loss of someone close to you.
Cheers Damian, that sounds like a 'fun' trip. The dog is cool but perhaps misguidedly trusts me. She is from romanian street dog stock. So despite looking cute, she is 'nails' and will have a go at any dog that runs through our family group.
Top bloke for making sure your dog's sorted and looked after.👍
Thanks Dudley, some have criticised me for taking her at all! She is a really seasoned camper though and just settles in.
Good evening, Dave, well done for getting out in those conditions to test the Vern 2, especially after the unfortunate news you shared, wishing you and your family well.
It would appear we both experienced similar outcomes in similar conditions.
Thank you for putting together this clear and concise video and description of the events.
Rowan.
Hi Rowan, I saw your video of course. If you were going out again in the vern 1, and could choose the wind speed, what would be your upper limit?
@@Fellmandave1 I would say the operating limit for the Vern 1 is 40mph with an extra 10mph buffer in case it got worse. After that I really wouldn't be comfortable in it, plus I don't think it would survive past that.
Nortent did ask me just now if I were willing to take it out again in similar conditions with double poles, however I sadly said to them I could not justify the £102.68 cost just for curiosity, especially when I have tents that can cope with that weather.
If I were to reverse this onto you, what would you say the Vern 2 is capable of?
Hope this helps.
Rowan.
@@RowanWildCamps Hi Rowan, i would say 30 with a buffer to 40 mph. Perhaps they would send you the poles anyway, i would check with them.
@@Fellmandave1 I think that is a fair assessment, makes sense comparably to the Vern 1 as it has less surface area, so may be stronger. Maybe, I'm not too worried either way, I have bought a replacement so I can carry on using the Vern. Thanks again. Rowan.
@RowanWildCamps Going to get some slinky 10mm poles for the Vern 1?
Dog is like. Ffs here we go again 😂😂😂😂😂
It is getting a bit like that. Still sticks buy me though! Just been hiking in France for a week. Can't wait to see her!
My old Vaude space K2 was bombproof in a storm. Handled Sandwood Bay in February with a F7-9 northerly no problem.
You could double pole that as well. Mildew got it in the end. Weighed nearly 5kgs 😢.
Currently I’m using the Simond Makalu T2. It’s a bit snug to say the least and if you’re over 6’ you have to stick your feet into the vestibule!
But that Nortent looks the bees knees.
Thanks for the videos. Very informative and I truly appreciate the time and effort that goes into producing them. 👍🏻
Thank you my friend and for sharing the happy memories. I have the makalu t2 as well, coolest looking tent around!
Great test vid Dave! Fab dog as always. Sorry for your loss, and sorry for you not to have the restful morning you needed, and time to think. All the best for the future. 😊.
Thank you Jason,very thoughtful.
excellent review, and bravo to your lovely dog for being so calm, she really is a lovely companion. I had high hopes that the tent was going to survive. Thank you for filming your experience in very challenging conditions.
Me too Terry, I was in it. Upgraded poles and pitching improvements make a massive difference though.
My worst nightmare WIND! I was on a scout camp camp with a cheap Halfords pop up tent and mine was the only one left standing. I was so surprised. Thanks for the video Dave so sorry for your loss. I've had a similar sh1tty year.
Thanks Wayne. I hope it improves significantly.
@@Fellmandave1 same to you Dave. 👍
Enjoyed watching your review which I came to after reading andys comments at backpacking uk. I thought your video was fair and you were clearly prepared... Clearly some channels focus on reviews and endorse products / tents putting them into categories like hilleberg.... You are out there and doing it... Great to see some of the comments / support from some real wildcamping legends on here.... New subscriber
Thanks Chris, I nearly deleted that comment on there this morning. But, if it has meant a genuine person like yourself coming over, then it was worth it. Welcome , my friend.
Sorry to hear about your loss Dave. Going camping by yourself is always good for the soul. I live in Kent and am working towards my ML assessment. I love going to Scotland to get my QMDs and booked my bus tickets last December. When it was time to travel, the wind was blowing 70/80 mph at the Cairngorm summits. I pitched low done on my first night but it was the windiest camp I’ve ever had. Thankfully I was in my BL Soulo and the only thing that went wrong was one of the pegs came out. My ice axe proved to be a great peg! I measured 40 mph at times using my Kestrel but most of the time it was 30-35. It’s definitely hard measuring the wind from your tent door. What was interesting was that I could hear the wind howling high up, it would get louder and louder and then bang, the tent was hit. I would say your tent seemed to be quieter than mine when the wind really hit. Thanks for sharing.
Wow, that was a really well painted picture of your camp Ben. You express yourself well , that bodes well for your ML. Got to be tricky being in Kent though. I was working and living in Leicestershire 30 years ago but leapt at the chance to move to the NE to be nearer the hills. Enjoy!
@@Fellmandave1 Thanks for your kind comments. It was bad enough driving to Dartmoor, the Brecon Beacons and the Peak District when I was working on my HML award but ML is a long drive every time. The overnight buses to Scotland are much better value than driving. My next trip is in July and I will be doing a 4 day bivvy trip to the Ben Nevis, Grey Corries and Mamores area. Im a teacher and I do all this for fun but also to offer the best and cheapest DofE programme I can at school.
Good on you Ben!
I camped in my nortent vern 2 this night. I had exactly the same fault as you did, the tent collapsed and the pole was severely bent. Exactly the same place as your broke. The middle pole also bent, but not more than 20 degree
oh, sorry to hear that. What were the wind speeds and where were you out of interest?
@@Fellmandave1 we summitcamped near Mannsvatnet in Uskedalen west in Norway. Forecast was wind gust of 16 m/s, but we belive the gust was a bit higher.
@@Fellmandave1 Nortent will replace the bent poles
Nicely handled, Dave. I'll be 65 later this year. I live seaside and manage property up mountain along California coast. I would swear that the wind past few yrs has turned angry. Not necessaily blowing harder, but more erratic and pummeling. Don't know if others have noticed same, or if I'm the old horse running back to the barn for beer and shelter.
The wind is like the sea Curt, it is stronger than us so we have to move and bend with it. Thank you for your perspective again my friend
Dave firstly sorry for your loss of a friend. Getting out and up that hill and doing this in that weather is a credit to you…..and jeez I hope that dog gets a big fee. I hope people take the time to read the feedback from Nortent, it’s such a credit to small manufacturers that listen. I had emailed MSR many times about issues I had and never once got an answer. So I would much rather work with someone that cares about its products and the people that use them. Big hug to the dog.
Well said. Honey is getting a scratch and extra food right now! Thank you for the sorry too. Actually was my Dad.
Just to add, I think the answer here from Nortent, should be the option for people that need 4 season tents, to be able to buy stronger poles be that DAC or width, at cost price, based on sending in proof of purchase, this would be a great gesture to people supporting them as customers
Jeez Dave, I am so very sorry you lost your Dad must have been an inspiring man.
What was the feedback from Nortent?
@@davegalloway7531 Its in the description.
I’m so sorry for your loss Dave, I hope you managed to find some time to yourself to think & process things in the end. Take care 💚
Thanks, Sarah.Not sure when that will be, but I appreciate your words.
The ‘Hilleberg Killer’ epithet became its epitaph, hoist with its own petard! Never mind Wally, where’s ‘BPUK’ Andy?? 😂
Not something I ever said FF. But be assured Nortent will learn, develop and improve.
@@Fellmandave1 it’s actually quite good that the failures have come together albeit in the types of condition that relatively few people would be expecting to pitch in, most would opt for a less exposed pitch given the forecast, or decide not to pitch but to get off the hill when it’s that poor. For sure they’ll rectify the problem, the only way is up as far as the poles are concerned for now, and this can only be of benefit to end users. 👍🏻
the myth of being a serious competetor for HB was having a short halftime - truth & veracity ! Thank you very much for your efforts!
Well. This story and development is not over yet old chap.
... which remains to be proven of course... again, thank you very much for your continued efforts.... great job, I must say.
Absolutely fair play Dave, you're out and you're pushing the limits. Enormous credit for that 😊
The verns at either end have a susceptibility for exactly what this has demonstrated. Just based on the design alone.I actually think their real strength would be side winds!
For now. It can sit just below the top table I think.
Take care,
Adge
Thanks for the video Dave, made me feel a bit sad for some reason. But I’m excited to hear in the comments from Nortent they are looking at a tunnel tent version hopefully a lighter 1 man version too along the lines of the Abisko lite 1 and Akto but with great ventilation for year round use and a higher head room. With adjustable interior size and door options🤞😀Thanks J
Yes, me too, I hate to see a good tent damaged. Watch this space.
Sorry to hear of your loss Dave .. And then this happens on the hill....I was surprised at the pole breakage on such a sterling tent... I will be most interested in the outcome of the pole issue .
Yes, watch this space and thanks for the message of support.
Hi Dave. Glad to see you and Honey are well. Great work remaining so calm and especially continuing to film - a credit to you! I’ve had a pole failure also at night and had to bail in storm conditions and it’s definitely unsettling and hard to keep a cool head. As with any tent manufacturer who doesn’t wind test their tents publicly unfortunately the only way people know their limits is when they find them in dangerous real world conditions. This tent failing at 40mph or thereabouts puts it more into the 3 season category. I don’t believe larger diameter poles will solve the structural weakness. They will help no doubt but the very sloped angle of those crossing poles mean the guys are less effective in supporting them and that creates significant downward pressure on the hooped side poles. Great entertaining video and as I say happy it all ended well bar some easily replaced poles 👍
Cheers Gary. Even wind tunnel testing has its limitations though as you don't get the gusts that keep restlessness tge materials. I get your point on the angles. A longer guy there or guys in a different location could help. We shall see.
Amazing, you kept your cool throughout. Thanks, Nortent needs to send you a new improved set of poles. I think mine are 9.5 mm on the Kuiu storm star. Please tell puppy stay warm. Please take care of yourself. Jim
Thanks Jim, as well as doing their own research, Nortent are sending me new poles to try in different configurations.
@@Fellmandave1 great can't wait to see results. After seeing this I went to a place called tent pole tech. See what you think let me know! Apparently this is a pretty common problem with tents in general. The sound was amazing like gale force winds Jim
Cheers Jim, let us know how you find the poles.
I am really shocked that this tent could not withstand those winds. Yes indeed it was an extreme weather event but that tent looked like it could take anything short of a hurricane. But most importantly I'm glad that you and the dog are safe and sound.
Thanks Mad, but look at the new video. There were pitching errors and the poles have been upgraded.
Glad you both made it down unscathed Dave
Thanks Andy, though it was an easy route down.
Please excuse me for reflection upon myself as I watched. I was once caught on a scotland summit in something that seems similiar to this as best I can judge from your video. I did an emergency phone call at 4.45am to police mtn rescue getting five brave volunteers out of their beds. It was so incredibly humbling. What can you say to those men and women? I know your video was about your experience and technical structure issues encountered, as it should be, but hearing the whirl of the wind and the thump on the tent wall, it was just to vivid even now after two years. You stayed a lot more positive than I did. What broke me was the noise... bang bang bang - like being on the inside of a base drum as its struck. And the damp from lying the sleeping bag along the wall to support the poles. I even ran out of water. Not a time of pride for me.... peaceful camping to you. JMO.
Thank you for sharing that, you learned and grew eh. What helped me here though was that the summit was exposed, but an easy descent to the car. may have been a lot scarier had I been more remote.
I actually quite like the wind and all that goes with it. i had my son, wife plus a friuend and sone on a very windy lakes fell on Friday. Winds were up to 35 mph on the summit, i was the only one liking it! OOps!
Understood I believe I learnt many things about judgement. One surprising was also learnt. When the rescue team says to you we will put a person on each side of you, and just flat state that this is the descent route we will be taking, they are not really really interested in your original plans! Being able to say you completed the circuit is not their priority. Imagine that.😮 thx for posting.
In rough weather I always take a goretex bivi bag that extra 800 grams is worth it, from a leaking tent to a totally wiped out tent it could save your life. I would personally rather stay put than attempt leaving in the middle of the night cold wet and windy on exposed mountains.
@ashab1 thank you for sharing. In fact based upon that experience my attitude has completely changed. My current view is to collapse down the tent upon myself and just wait it out. All the wind pressure and noise is gone. So I reason it will be possible to relax and sleep which was so much of the problem for me. Yes there would be damp, but I think that is likely manageable compared to the alternative as you describe it. JMO.
Well. Just goes to show that Hilleberg is the way to go. Here in Australia, The Vern 2 is around $1000.00 AUD with footprint
The Allak 2 which would be the closest to The Vern 2 is around $2050.00
You pays your money and take your choice I guess
Great review btw. Few do this sort of stuff on here 👍👍
Have a look at my update. The Vern 2is capable of so much better if you pitch it properly.
My sincere condolences for your loss Dave. Best wishes, Jiffy 👍🏻
Cheers Jiffy, very kind comments on here. It was just 24 hrs before this camp and was my Dad. Still can't process it.
@@Fellmandave1 Sorry to hear about this Dave. I wish you and your family all the very best ❤️
Great Video Dave - glad you both got down safe and sound - i think the dog enjoyed the adventure - i can think of no better companion to be with when the going gets tough in life physically and emotionally than a dog - keep your adventures coming I learn a lot from watching - best wishes and many thanks and never lose that sense of humor - 😄
Thanks 👍 Billy, she is sitting next to me now. Cheers for the encouragement, its appreciated.😊
Dave, sorry for your loss
Excellent video staying calm in challenging conditions and still filming in such an informative way
Glad you and the dog made it safely down
Thanks, Bill, you absolute star.
Great extreme testing . You have shown up the light in the 7 series aluminium poles . I have seen a question mark about them . I was hoping 40mph would be well within the poles capabilities . I’m sure Nortent will work it out. Feel a bit sorry for the dog though . I know you were proving the dogs bag as well but you were on the limit . Sorry for your loss it gets us all at some point 😢
I think the poles became a question mark shape at one point too. Don't worry about honey, she's a lot tougher than she looks.
Hi Dave, firstly - top video and kudos for getting out and putting this tent through its paces. I do have to say I thought claims that these tents were comparable to Hilleberg - especially the Soulo, despite a lack of testing or history - or in many cases having never even used a Soulo to be questionable. Hilleberg tents are hand made and I've not seen any mass produced tent at the same quality (we live in hope!) - but it's just not possible. I'm no Hilleberg fan boy and I'm not a brand or tent snob - I've used many - but I've now seen two videos showing 1 and 2 person variants being almost destroyed, winds just around 30mph + which you mention at the end, you wouldn't recommend using the tent in winds greater than that. Definitely not a Soulo killer, beater or rival in any way.
The Vern is a lovely tent for the right conditions - it has great space and a nice structure and it imitates some features of the Soulo, namely the pole sleeves, cups and clips. I hope people don't head out in conditions that the Soulo could take in its stride and end up in the smelly stuff.
10mm poles would no doubt make a difference, or double poling - but when you add up the cost of this, would it maybe make more sense to stretch that more to a Soulo - which has a demonstrable track record and pedigree in some of the harshest environments on the planet? I ended up putting my Soulo on a credit card after a sh#t life event in 2016 - so never been given one, so have no need to say anything other than the truth about it. My BL version suffered a slightly bent pole after the gust from hell in a storm with 80mph winds nr Blencathra - it was my own idiotic fault for trying to camp in such weather - we live and learn.
Again, top video and you've been honest and open here about the limitations of this tent. Great to see Nortent respond in such an open fashion and wanting to evolve the tent based on end user experience. I look forward to testing the Vern 1 and 2 myself soon.
Keep on keeping on - ATB 🏕️
if I remember correctly your fellow camper in his bobcat didn't suffer any damage in a £50.00 tent. when you suffered a pole failure?
@@Camped_on_Dartmooryou remember incorrectly then.... Read what I have written above - I specifically mentioned that the centre pole bent? (in 80mph winds) - what's your point? A bend isn't a failure - a snap is. My tent was still pitched fine and I noticed the bend when I struck camp - so a failure is incorrect.
If you're advocating the use of an OEX Bobcat in 80mph winds then good luck to you 🏕️
@@MCMOutdoors I am certainly not saying you should go out in 80mph winds in a bobcat. I was just pointing out that a 50.00 pound tent didn't get any damage. if a tent pole bends beyond its design specs "id" consider that a failure.
Hi Chris and great comment. There is a bit of a general mix in this thread though of interchanging the Vern 1 and vern 2. I agree though that neither is as strong yet, as a soulo ( vern 1), or say allak (vern2) But both of these tents have great qualities. This is a learn and develop moment for them and they are on the case, as you pointed out in your comment. But i have reflected on my somewhat shell shocked statement of up to 30 mph. Based on the winds I measured, the tent was fine up to 40 mph, so i reserve the right to change that statement. However , people camp in strong winds at their own risk!
It was the significantly stronger gusts after that, which did it. I would of liked it be have been good up to 50 though to achieve true ' mad conditions' certification, but then again its a big tent. So we will see what happens with the pole development. Thanks for coming on here Chris and putting up a well considered comment. I hear you on your 2016 event, made you stronger mate.
I too look forward to you testing the verns on your brilliant channel . Any further comments from you will now be dealt with harshly as Im getting too brown lips here! hahaha
@@Fellmandave1I've also been blocked and had my comments deleted from the other channel in question that pushed this tent as a Soulo beater for making polite, balanced and non personal observations...... So I'd say your integrity in not blocking and silencing anyone with an alternative viewpoint speaks volumes. Hold your head up high and keep going 👍
Sorry for your sad loss Dave ❤ I’ve both the Vern 2 and waiting on the vern 1 to arrive. I’ve just ordered a full set of extra poles for each from Nortent but to be honest I don’t fancy lugging another set of poles up a hillside especially on the vern 2. I’m waiting on a supplier emailing me to say they’ve got the 10.25mm Dac poles in so I can make my own but really shouldn’t be having to do this. The poles that nortent are selling in my opinion simply aren’t fit for purpose and it’s easy to understand when they are selling them for only $28 for the 12 section red ones. That’s works out at $2.33 not included the end caps and shock cord so what are they buying them for. It’s just not the overall thickness that counts but the thickness of the wall of the tubes that’s critical. The Dac ones I’ve found will be twice this price so hopefully will do far better but disappointed I’m spending delivery money with Nortent as well as money on new 9mm poles to double pole to put me on. They advertise as the tent being four season so should supply materials suitable for those seasons without having to buy more poles. I’ve put in comments on my order about both your issues and Rowans and that if they can help with delivery charges I’d appreciate it but will wait and see what becomes. Wonder if they tested them at all in real life conditions as hilleberg and decathlon do to mention just a few. Very disappointing. Hopefully they can help out those that have bought and can make upgrades so the issue goes away on all new stuff going out. Thanks for testing the tents out so we don’t find ourselves in the same situation it’s much appreciated 😀👍 Shame they didn’t get half a dozen of you to test them before release as it’s put a dent in there reputation and potential sales going forwards. Take care of yourself and thanks again at this hard time ❤
Thanks Marc for your thoughtful and detailed comment. I agree on your points. But don't forget to enjoy the tents as they are and don't let my video ruin that. Cheers.
@@Fellmandave1 Hi Dave I’ve put a comment on one of the nortent Facebook groups where one of your videos was shared to see if you’re okay with me direct messaging you. It could be the lightbulb moment 👍
@@marcfisher3417 see my Instagram in the description and message there Marc
Hello Dave!
I'm curious here, are you supposed to double pole everywhere, or double pole from the front (11:39) only, to be able resist winds above 40 mph?
Asking since I have none experience whatsoever.
Also in the video to me, you looked like you had the short end towards the gust of wind, or is the "short end" in this scenario, the "body" or the large chamber of the tent and not the two entrances?
Great video! and I hope they improve the Vern 2 in time, as I do love the features and thinking about buying it. Hope that you make some more videoes with Vern 2 as well!
Sincere regards
Jan
Hi Jan. Its a goid question.Nortent are sending me new thicker poles and standard poles to trial various scenarios, so I'll be likely publishing that in the not too distant future. The obvious answer is just to double pole where required, but we'll see.
Looks like my recent 10.25mm DAC pole change in my Vern 1 was quite timely.
Where did you get the DAC poles from, sounds like a good idea!
You were well prepared for the outcome and handled it excellently. Props for going out in that squal too.
I'm a scout Will, Be prepared! Thanks for commenting.
I have a Nortent Vern 2 and was camping at Angle Tarn on the 13th Apr 2024, windy as hell during the night, you could hear the wind before the gusts hit the tent, but I had my tent (red poles) facing into the wind, I know this cannot always be achieved, but my tent survived and so did I 😁 woke up to an amazing sunrise over the tarn 😀
Good to see some positivity about the tent here. I feel bad about what happened.
@@Fellmandave1 No need to feel bad, I like the tent and I will be purchasing extra poles after watching your video, I have just uploaded mine from the weekend and if you view it from about 30 seconds in for about 10 seconds, you can see how bad the weather was th-cam.com/video/-GRXFEm_c-c/w-d-xo.html and I agree, hard work putting a tent up in heavy rain and wind 🙄
@@intuthegreatoutdoors Yes nice , just watched, some great aerial shots!
Sorry to hear about your loss Dave . I hope you dont mind me saying but you still sound a bit under the weather yourself so i hope you are not run down and you are taking care of yourself. Theres a lot more surface area to catch the wind on a 2 man tent over a smaller tent but i would have expected a tent of that weight and type of structure to be able to handle winds of 40mph without much trouble. It will be interesting to see what unfolds in due course with performance and quality control etc ATB
Hi Olan, thanks for your concern and observation. I had a bad cold that became chesty, took 3 weeks. Not like me at all. Yes,I too would of expected the tent to have handled it, but Nortent are handling things responsibly and openly.
@@Fellmandave1 I hope you feel 100% very soon and Nortent resolve the tent issues GWS ;)
Sorry for your Loss Dave.
Thank you for another informative test camp in this series of tents. As a collection of videos they're very useful in allowing people to make more informed decisions about which tent is for them.
Glad it was helpful!
Never watch your channel before but nice to see u sort the dog out 1st he or she can't but they are so loyal
Come back again Gary! Thanks for watching
Darn, that's underwhelming tent performance by the Vern2.
And only just after I've seen a somewhat similar outcome with the 1 person version, here on TH-cam.
I agree that double poling would be suitable for expected >50mph wind/gusts, not just for this tent but almost all.
Thanks for this video.
Cheers buddy.
I thought you were going to tie your tent to the dogs blanket thing.. whoosh.. weee.. "where's the dog" 😂
No way!
Andrew park outdoors has a good hack for the vern series Achilles heel in high wind. Use a walking stick on guy line on end facing wind. I agree with him not enough arch on two side of tent make them collapse, easy in high wind. They need a little Reengineering. I think double poles it's still gonna be weak on the ends, Use the hack.
Will try all options!
I made some comments on the 7 series poles which may have been hasty and having absoulty no design experience in poles it should just be treated as off the hand comment with now sound backing . have just seen another TH-cam video which highlighted some potential pitching issues. To be fair I was so drawn into the intensity of the wind I never really watched the video, which was my fault . Your video which was very informative has highlighted some areas that really needs to addressed such as condition of your tent before pitching wind conditions and direction and changes in those condition through the night and the risks of bailing and the associated hazards of that alone . Still a good channel to watch but I think I’m going to watch all channels a few times now before I even think of what I want to comment on.
Seems like a sensible approach, Steve.
Fair play to you Dave for a full disclosure video of the Vern 2 in those kind of conditions. Makes your honest assessment reassuring to see the current safety limitations of the shelter in its current configuration. So hopefully nortent take on your feedback positively and proactively . Atb
They absolutely are William.
That’s great to hear a company responding positively to user feedback. Good work on using your skills to keep calm and focused in that situation. My condolences to your loss aswell Dave. Take care and Atb
Some of those gusts can be very powerful indeed. Now we know the Nortent vern 2's limit on this occasion. Thankyou for sharing! Can the Vern 2 be doubled poled?
Hi, thanks for your reasoned comment. Yes it can be double poled. They aere sending me some, along with an upgraded pole set for testing. Cheers
@@Fellmandave1 Great look forward to the test. Seen the video with the Kuiu Storm Star 2p with 60 mph plus test and on all sides performed single pole like a bomb shelter. Similar design with poles. The Vern 2 does interior compared to the Kuiu interior seems to flap a lot in wind. The Kuiu interior seems to be pretty stable. Surprized the Vern 2 suffers at a limit of 40 mph.
Yikes, sorry to see this Dave. Not a pleasant night. Good on you for doing valuable work to give us all an idea of the limitations of this tent. Someone mentioned in a message to me that they had concerns about the unbranded poles. The funny thing is, the Vern 2 poles feel quite substantial in hand, and the five poles weigh in at 1 kg. I don't like dismissing things (be it tent poles, lawnmowers or anything really) just because they're not made by big names. Yes, the big names have the reputations, but that doesn't mean that all lesser/newer brands are poor performers by default. That said, it would seem that these poles are the weak point of the Vern tents. As we know, this is a new model of tent that is bound to go undergo some evolution in order to improve it. This is how things work. Perhaps the next step might be to opt for branded poles, or to address the design and make-up of the current poles? I remember commenting on Andrew Park's first video to suggest that the crossing poles could potentially end up weakening themselves in high winds by pressing together and deforming their walls. Perhaps that is the failure mode at play here after all? Good on you for keeping the camera rolling, and I'm very sorry to hear of your loss. I don't suppose this camp was the kind of quiet time you needed at all, but pat on the back for getting the video out nonetheless. Keep doing what you do 👍 James.
Hi James,thanks for your insightful comment. You are better placed than most. Yes ,it was not quite the peaceful time I anticipated, but perhaps was what I needed. Cheers for the encouragement and same to you. Did I win the 'best reviewer' comp we had going?
@@Fellmandave1 I think that was your competition, Dave, and as one of the two entrants in said competition, I hereby withdraw my rights to act as a judge 😉
Very interesting video, and I guess a thanks are in order. 👍You really took one for the team here.
I do wonder though, if proper dac poles, either in the same diameter or slightly thicker would make much of a difference, or if it is more of a design problem?
Well, we'll soon be finding out!
It’s a design issue. I doubt stronger poles will help. What could help is staking out the end guy line (the one which is where the two poles cross) to a trekking pole.
Ah I'm so sorry that your camp for your friend ended this way Dave. But at least you and Honey were safe and back to the car in one piece. You certainly put that tent to the test. I was out in my Kuiu storm star on the weekend and measured gusts of 46mph. It certainly makes you feel alive doesn't it 🤣
Thanks Charlene.
How was the SS in those winds?
@Fellmandave1 it didn't budge to be fair. It's really impressive in strong winds and make you feel very safe 👍
Thank you, I've found it now.
Glad I could help
I think I am going to cancel my Vern 1, 2024 until it has been out a bit longer. I've now seen the Vern 1 have a pole snap and the Vern 2.
I'm wanting mine to set up a work camp/wild camp/ hikes group. Even if you prepare and plan for the weather, it can change suddenly. I don't want to be having to buy stronger poles and have extra expense on a new tent.
I don't usually comment, but feel the need to. First and foremost, my condolences for your loss. Second, how anyone could think you intentionally wanted to break this tent is beyond daft (and more likely speaks to their own modus operandi). Time and again you show yourself to be one one of the most level-headed, rational and non-clickbaity reviewers on this platform, and you certainly don't ever seem to feel the need to be an idiot for the purpose of views/clicks/algorithm-feeding. Long may that continue! The naysayers need to take a good long look at themselves.
Too kind, but mightily appreciated. Peace to you. Dave
Thanks for the video it clearly not the tent for me for my adventures ..saved me money cheers
No worries. But look at my update video
@@Fellmandave1 link
th-cam.com/video/5PurfvfUP74/w-d-xo.htmlsi=srF2U7EgZoZ-Cf_-
Would be hard to sleep in that noise? I wonder how it would fare with double poles all around what the max wind strength would be with the double poles? Great video though and an honest review. Wonder if Nortent intend upgrading the poles or the angle of them?
In future suppiles the poles are upgraded,
As regartds sleeping in that noise, with 4 kids, 2 dogs and a demnanding job, a flappy tent is a blessed release.
How are the poles being upgraded and is there a date for the release of the updated poles?
Interesting top work, but can you double pole it when the attachments are designed for a single pole Gov ? think the tension on the tent works against it puts to much pressure on the poles .
@@Lambert-k8u you just clip on every other one. Works fine.
@@Fellmandave1 thx
Ive heard these tents compared to hillebergs (not by yourself but on youtube in general) and was considering one. Not the case then 😂😂.
Im very sorry for your loss as well mate. My thoughts are with you.
Thank you Greg. Most appreciated. Check out my latest on this tent. Nortent has given some pitching tips, which would have helped and changed the poles. All of which make a big difference. Cheers
Wow, good that you tested that for us! Yeah, for a proper storm 10 mm poles are probably the way to go. Hilleberg and Fjällräven are doing that. But then you will need stronger material for the outer tent.
The ARCX-N300 fabric which is used in the Vern 1, 2 and 3 is (ISO 13937-4) tested with a minimum tear strength of 16KG.
Stronger material 🤣 what like stainless steel.
@@BrokenVikingOutdoors it’s no good if the poles aren’t up to the job though. If they use better poles the price will go up. 📈 it’s tricky for them to get this right.
As with any tent, all have a compromise. But I have absolute faith this will come good.
@@Fellmandave1 I think Dave the issue lies with the hype about the Vern being a competitor for the soulo as everyone claimed. Without testing it. This test you’ve done proves it’s not a competitor. It’s just not in the same league. It’s half the price for a reason. You shouldn’t need to replace poles or seal it or anything. It should come out. Get tested. Then make its claims as to what it can and can’t cope either weather wise. I said nothing during all the hype but it frustrates me to hear people always down on hillebergs because they’re “overpriced they’re noisy condensation heavy etc etc”. I’m experienced but not claiming to be an expert and I’m 100% positive there’s no better manufacture than hilleberg. End of. I’m not a fan boy but yes I own 2. I’ve had 6 in total. The nallo is my least favourite btw they’re not all great.
But to come on this platform and make claims like you all have is misleading and pretty much poor sport. There’s people commenting here saying they bought a Vern on hearsay. I dunno. Don’t hate me it’s just my opinion. It’s utterly crazy to make claims about untested products. I’m sure they’ll come back bigger and better. But hopefully they’ll do more research (testing) before puffing out their chests.
I’m done now. 👍
Are we going to stop making bold claims that these new tents are hilleberg rivals. ?? They’re nowhere near the same league. My staika in measured 68mph wind on blencathra. I was inside making my tea. 😂 😂
Well done fellman for really testing it out now.
Just a shame it failed miserably 😂😂😂😂
Well Andy, there remain parallels and the price is very competitive. But agree, as do Nortent that for those conditions, double poling is indicated, as do Hilleberg for certain conditions. Yes, not as strong as the staika, but changes and development are underway. Nortent are very good at listening and adapting. I know you enjoy your Hillebergs and your loyalty crops up frequently, enjoy and thanks for commenting. Boosh!
@@Fellmandave1 double poling ? I’ve never had to on any of my wild nights mind. It’s only for really extreme conditions hille tell you to double pole. Like 80-90mph.
I do like my hillebergs. I paid enough for them. I go out and I always feel safe. I never worry they’ll fail. This is the difference and why they’re expensive. Nortent could use better 10mm dac poles. And stronger rip stop like the kerlon 1800. But then they’ll put the price up. 🤷♂️ and to be honest the pole configuration of this Vern looks wrong. No I’m sorry. It’s not for anything over 30mph that. Hopefully nortent do learn and adapt because I like nowt better than a new tent. Atb 👌
Wish I'd gone Hilleberg. Out of my 14 day return window now. Ah well, lesson learned. Don't jump on the hype train until tested! @@AndyWardle
@@GregTheCamper I wanted this tent to work because it’s a good looking shelter. Nice features. But the untested claims were bugging me. Now it’s tested. And it’s back to the drawing board 😂
@Fellmandave1 Sorry but the price being competitive is irrelevant as a Hilleberg and a Nortent aren't designed or capable of handling the same conditions
Hi , was the pole break with the old smaller size poles ?
Looking at buying this tent for mountain camping with my wife and dog. Would you recommend this tent with new 9mm poles ? Thanks Ian
@smikedenney222 older poles. The new ones are much better. I am thinking of selling mine as just don't have the space and I mostly go solo.. Interested?
@@Fellmandave1was it the end blue pole followed by the two long crossing red poles that broke?
@andrewg9677 It was just three blue poles that went I think. The long red crossing poles were OK.
@@Fellmandave1so the two blues and central black one that go across the tent first and you take off last. The reds go longways and cross over.
@andrewg9677 as per my first video
Hi, If the tent was standing sideways to the wind, would it withstand the load?
Its highly likely, however pole improvements and pitching improvements have changed things significantly with this tent. See my latest video on it. Thanks for your thoughtful comment.
Quite interested, if it’s the new design of Vern 1,2,3 that stresses the Nortent 7001 poles, or if they have serious quality issues with a new supplier?
Will have to adjust my Vern 1 for stronger winds. Otherwise, it’s useless in the mountainous regions of Scandinavia or Greenland.
Hi Lars,Thanks for commenting . All the best with your trips. The vern 1 is great tent.
I feel like Nortent told creators to put the Hilleberg beating stuff in their titles as everyone was doing it. Fellmandave tested the tent properly, well done to you. I mean failing in those winds? wow, just wow.
Hi Martin , I have to correct you, but I can categorically promise that Nortent did not say that to me and I can say with great certainty that they would of not given that guidance to anyone else. Plus not everyone was doing this, certainly not me. As regards those winds, please try pitching a large tent in 40 mph plus (measured), if you have already, you will appreciate just how powerful they are. However, i am sure future pole developments combined if indicated ( as I should of) double poling will see improvements in wind tolerance for the vern 2. Thanks for commenting
@@Fellmandave1 i know you didnt but a lot of other channels have basically the same title. which often happens when companies ask for a specific angle for the videos. My comment was not in any way critical of you or anything you did, i think your approach has been perfect. Im critical of channels that made it like this was going to beat Hillebergs or imply these tents are capable of more without doing these tests like you have done.
my comment was more like, after all the hype on a lot of channels it failed in those winds. hope that clarifies.
Yes appreciate you taking the time. There has generally been a bit too much mud flinging now though. Stops the fun.
Looks to me like a guyline tied, at an upwards angle, to a trekking pole at each end of the vestibule (tied to where the pokes cross (the little triangle area) would help keep the ends from collapsing. In other words, the ends need to have an upwards force to counteract the downward force of the wind.
Hello Elizabeth. You're are absolutely right, this is something I have done on the scarp 1 and will be trying on the Verns. Not ideal but a possible solution.
Not a great situation for reflection, sorry the evening ended on this note for you. Do you think Nortent will strengthen those tent poles anytime time soon, would like to buy this tent but concerned about the fact that several folks have now written about broken or severely bent poles?
Hi Peter, thanks for that, but perhaps what I needed.
Nortent is sending me upgraded poles this week for testing. What their plans are, though, I don't know. However the tent is excellent and suitable for most conditions in its current format.
Thank you, Dave. I'd really like to add to the kind wishes regarding your bereavement that your followers have expressed. I am sorry for your loss, mate.
So, between you and Rowan, that's two Vern failures reported this week... worrying stuff.
I am awaiting my Vern 1, having pre-ordered and paid for it in Feb. I really did think and was seduced into believing this tent might be a rival for the ubiquitous Soulo, it clearly isn't.
Good (not great) response from Nortent... But, do I want a tent that I've awaited this long, only to see upgrades shipped as standard weeks later? No, I dont. This is still, after all, a premium tent at a premium price. I'm seriously concerned and considering cancelling my order.
A Scandinavian four season tent that will make me nervous when it gets windy? Hmmm, I'd be resentful of having to chase stability, paying even more for double poles and heading towards 5kg, when they should've been DAC from the off, as has been clearly demonstrated. These wind speeds arent extreme and isn't something we should be worrying about.
Hi @MrCMHUDDY , thank you for your condolences. I really did not expect the response, I just wanted to share my head state in case I seemed different..
I do feel because of the flood of youtubers exhibiting these tents, there has been a corresponding rush of interest and perhaps that may of led to testers, including me, pushing the limits, that other new tents may have been subject to.
As regards different poles, I cannot speculate, only test and relay. I do trust the company however. Please bare in mind that the conditions that Rowan was out in was storm force and not just 'windy'. In my tests it performed very well.
I'm wary of poles which extend the length of my body and only bought my first Akto, which has shorter, across the body poles, after Chris Townsend used one for his Munros and Tops walk. The body length, cross poles on the Vern 2 are plenty long enough for me to wonder about their strength. Guys help, but above a certain wind strength, they create an inflexible point which could lead to vulnerability. Back when Terry Abrahams was staying out in all weathers to film Scafell, he questioned the stormworthyness of the Soulo, which also has quite lengthy poles. So, if you want an untroubled night in foul weather, I recommend a bothy and, if no bothy is available, go low and seek a sheltered pitch, which is what everyone used to do back in the days before TH-cam.
Great effort getting out to film in those conditions.
Yes , I did plave myself deliberately in 'winds way'. I do love a good bothy night though.
brilliant video keep up the hard work and sorry for you're loss
Thanks Will.
It'd be really interesting to see a collection of tents, from budget to high end, all pitched together on a night like this to see how they all fair. Budget tents that are low to the ground might do surprisingly well, such as the OEX Phoxx 1. Any tent that wants to give you height and space is going to struggle unless it is very expensive...
Me too Kev, but they would have to be same design type.
First and foremost, excellent video Dave. I don't comment on videos on TH-cam but felt like I needed to here. This is how you put a tent through its paces, on a hill in testing conditions and not just up in the park to do clickbaity advert. I'm being told that this failure happened due to a damaged pole before setting up or you used the wrong door or something like that from that expert Backpacking UK.
Boosh meister! Thanks for commenting. Wardles coolest mate. The debate in question got a bit messy. The door open jobby was a Vern 1 as featured on Rowans wild camps, mine was just plain old force.
@@Fellmandave1 Aye, I figured that out after watching Rowans latest video. Next time time a Hilleberg 😂 the dog will thank you for it
Ive said it before and ill say it again.Tents now are over engineered to gain sales.
I have a two man two pole 4 season dome tent with a 3000mm HH outer and a 5000mm HH floor and weighs 2.3kg from Aldi that i bought 15yrs ago here in Qld Australia for $25
It has withstood 3 Qld summer storms.For those that know what a Qld storm is and the destruction they leave get an idea of the destructive winds and rain.
Ive reproofed this tent once in that time and its still going strong.
Their is good solid cheap lightish tents out their that will take a battering.Dont get caught up in marketing.
I think a lot of people just like trying differnt gear, but I have utmost admiration for people that have one well used tent that keeps going for years. Enjoy your season!
@@Fellmandave1 I just find it saddening to see expensive gear fail where it should'nt.
Love the vids though Dave and keep em coming 👍
Me too.
Be interested to hear your thoughts on the original Vern 1&2 as far was standing up to wind compared to the newer models?
Good question David. I tried the 1 in moderate winds up to 30 I recall and it was fine. I never tested the mk I vern 2 in anything above light winds. I will be using it again soon though as it is a great tent.
@@Fellmandave1 great stuff. Interesting with the new design and more poles! Yes really liked your review of the old model Vern 2
Cheers David with the highly appropriate surname.
@@Fellmandave1 😂
Hi Dave, I’m interested to get view on wether you think the Kuiu would have fared better in those conditions?
You know I have never tested the storm star in strong winds, but it's about time I did.
@@Fellmandave1 I’ve got one myself, had it in moderate wind but nothing that severe. Although I have always been convinced that it would outperform the Allak I had previously. Would love to see a real brutal test of the Kuiu. Really like your vids mate, came across you via your tent peg test. My friends and partner couldn’t believe someone would make such a video. 😂😂
What the tent peg one? Perfectly normal behavior surely!
id love to see any wind tunnel videos Nortent have produced. the Vern 1 and 2 poles broke in nearly the same place.
me too.
That is pretty shocking having a tent with that sort of 4-season marketing failing at those wind speeds. So you recall if it has been tested in a wind tunnel?
I don't know about their testing procedures, however they did advocate double poling for certain conditions. Now we know what they are!
@@Fellmandave1 I have a pretty flimsy Slawea 3 pole dome tent sort of thing that uses fairly thin 8.5mm poles and that is tested to 55mph winds. Going to do a damage overview video?
Oh dear. This is the second pole failure on a Nortent (a Vern 1 and a Vern 2) that's been posted in the last couple of days. [EDIT: Another person has also just commented on FB that his Vern 2 also collapsed with bent poles this week!! holy cow]. And interestingly both were of cross-poles. Such wind and rain is not uncommon in Ireland and the UK, and it's wind and rain that's always my biggest concern when camping here. There's even less snow in Ireland than the UK, so that aspect of 4 season tents doesn't interest me at all. Bad weather here is all about wind and rain. I hope Nortent take this on-board and make changes.
Reading the response from Nortent - it says that without the long poles then the tent is effectively a tunnel-tent. This is true. They also say that tunnel tents are used by polar explorers. This is also true. They also say that the long poles make the Vern 2 free-standing. Also true. However what they didn't address is why the cross poles broke. I've seen tunnel tents in winds stronger than 50mph and the cross-poles / hoops didn't snap. So why did they snap in this situation here? And the same happened in the video posted by Rowan Wild Camps. Speculation on my part (because I don't have all the facts): is that the long-poles (going the length of the tent) are somehow causing too much loading force on the cross-poles. The design seems to be not suitable for high winds (as we get here in Ireland & UK). I had high hopes for these tents but it seems a redesign is needed to get a tent that can last in high winds and rain.
Anyway it was a real life test of the Jerven, lol. Well done on the video Dave. 👍
Cheers buddy. That is my feeling on the loading stress too. But I'm no engineer. Things will be learnt and changed
So why i should use a Tent with 5 Poles and tons of weight?
The only answer i have, as a stormshelter.
But over 40MPh an roomlost and Polebreak is a shame.
For me that Tent makes No Sense.
Thanks for inspiration 😊
Double poling is recommended above 40 mph, plus new poles are in development. it remains an excellent tent.
Hahahaha I don't know about the tent been depressed but the dog certainly did 😂
I do feel I owe her some easy camps after the last few!
You are supposed to point the tent towards the wind, this may have had an impact on its strength although winds can come from all angles. I’m concerned what Nortent intend to do about this failure because we all have bought these tents and if they do a have a weakness in the pole then this could cause major problems.
I’d be interested to see if the Hilleberg would have performed in these conditions, I suspect it could have suffered a similar problem hence why they offer a Black version. I’m guessing they could supply a heavier duty thicker pole option. Adding additional poles to me just masks a problem and not fix it. Stronger poles should be lighter than extra poles?
Hi Scott, it was definitely pitched end on to wind. Thanks for adding to the debate.
@@Fellmandave1 no problem, I like your channel. I find it very useful and informative. Can you tell me if Nortent has asked you to return their poles for their own analysis?
Thanks Scott, not yet....
@@marcfisher3417I also find there are quite a few people around the establishment silently waiting for anything like this to discredit this relatively new brand. I would hope a recall and replacement poles are offered to existing customers?
Way above my (no pay) grade.
How do you Think the vern 2 would hold up if you had it set up 90⁰ , the side wall look to be stronger than the ends. Get new poles go out in another storm give it a go.
It's a good point but I think I'll be giving the wind a rest for a while.
Rowan wild camps took his vern 1 out in that same storm I do believe, same results. I think 40mph is vern 1 n 2 limit with single poles. Although in your vern 2 first look video you leaned on the side it held your weight without guy lines and I do believe the ends will not hold your weight. I still think I'm going to buy one. I only camp in fair weather, woodland and also never have to walk far. So I'm thinking the vern 2 will work perfectly fine. I like your videos keep up the great work.
Thanks buddy.
do you plan on going out in these conditions on a regular basis or are you just testing the tent in case you get caught in these conditions unexpectedly ? with your experience (mountain leader if iam not wrong) I'd expect you not to head out if such conditions are forcast . sorry for your loss 💚
Purely for tent testing to inform watchers and myself. Otherwise shelter must be sought!
@@Fellmandave1 👍
To be honest, I like the adventure of it too.
@@Fellmandave1 hey fair comment.we all have a different concept of adventure 👍
Pitching a tent in those conditions when you're so close to your car shows a serious lack of judgement.. still good for the views I suppose?
What exactly are you testing the tent for?🤔
Hello and thanks for your perspective. It was about testing the tent to prove its worth against much criticism. Didn't quite work out though.
@ExploringForGold you're clearly an experienced high altitude mountaineer with many years experience.... I bow to your superior knowledge and hard won expertise.
I rest my case. But you were near your car. Imagine if you were miles from anywhere. Anyway, great videos. Regards
'Twas and adventure for sure!
What have Nortent said in response? I think some DAC poles 10mm) would be the answer!
Please see description. Cheers
Not the way those poles cross it’s not. It’s a poor design for high winds
I totally agree.@@AndyWardle
Great vid dude calm and collected !
Though I walk through the shadow of the valley of death, I fear no evil, for I know that thou, other wildcampers, are with me.
Maybe time to switch back to the storm star?
It's a tent I still have amongst many, all have different pros and cons. For 2 people, I love the space in the Nortent. I just wish I had time to use them all!
What size dog bag do you have?
Medium Gaz, please see the 'survive' full review. Cheers Bud
@@Fellmandave1 yeah I've just seen that you said in the video that you'll do a full review. I'll check it out thanks 👍
I think your dog definitely deserves one Gaz.
@@Fellmandave1 🤣🤣🤣 she's a trooper!
You can double pole the tent, but killed it for me. I like a lot about this tent but dealing with high wind is a major feature when you are away in the Southerm Alps and you don’t want to be a statistic.
Pitching faults on my part mainly. Plus nortent have now upgraded the poles. Have a look at my latest, what did I learn video.
The design and weight considered, this is incredibly disappointing sadly. 40mph (~18m/s) is not particularly nasty winds. Any 4-season tunnel tent can with ease withstand 25m/s gusts. Looking forward to see how my Vern 1 will perform in high winds.
Better I am sure. I agree that a better performance could have been anticipated, however the winds that were damaging were definitely above 40 mph. I feel though that 40mph, when you are walking in it, or pitching a tent, are pretty nasty! Good camps Owly.
Watched somebody bail out in winds hitting about 50mph in the vern 1. Not impressive for so called Hilleberg Soulo beater. The windward narrow end was flattening pushing onto his face. Certainly not a 4 season tent as would have trouble in Autumn never mind winter.
In comparison the Hilleberg Soulo and Akto been filmed coping with measured 80mph winds which is 4 times the power. Hillebrg film their tents being setup in 60mph winds and showed the nammatj 2 tunnel tent having no issues with a 70mph sidewind.
To see what tents can cope with, a german outdoor magazine tested the Hilleberg Katium tunnel tent to destruction. With 80mph sidewinds, a pole broke. Pitched into the wind, a pole broke in winds about 115mph.
Have a look at my pole testing follow up videos demi
Maybe you should have bought some more poles and double polled it as it does mention in booklet
You are absolutely right with hindsight.
@@Fellmandave1 I was just reading the booklet and i noticed them mentioning about doubled polling so there we have it… Vern’s poles don’t cost that much and as you know there are thicker poles out there that would have to be cut to fit but also they are very costly and I think the vern 2 has 4 sets.
Im gutted. I bought this after getting on the hype train. It was supposed to be the one I'd take if there was strong wind potential. What a shame :(
Don't worry, despite my words it will be fine to 40 mph. Which is, really blowing some. Just look at the feedback from Nortent too and enjoy, what remains a great tent.
heheh would be fun to try how long this tent last here in iceland in the worst condicions , i doupt i can manage to set it up 😆, i remember in the old days with my papa , we put tent up an later the evening wind comming , we did not have many seconds to escape the tent before tent just did go up to the skyes and dissapear in seconds hahaah, no way in hell to try to hold the tent lol
Somewhere I would love to go.
Wish I never preorderrd my vern 1 after seeing the latest nortent failures. I have a robens starlight 2 which is solid in winds of over 50mph but is a little small. I thought the vern 1 was the answer to my prayers as I can't afford a hillaberg. I'm thinking about selling my vern 1 before I have even received it. Excitement has turned to disappointment unfortunately. Sad times 😢
What made you pre order the Vern? Just wondering. Hype of the testers or you just fancied it? Genuinely interested
Its a great tent leeroy. i know about the robens wind tunnel tests. But they are not like real world conditions. None of us should be out camping in 50 mph winds. Its my own daft fault. I have tested thge Vern 1 in strong winds and it was great. Enjoy and domnt be disappointed.
@@AndyWardle I was already looking for a bigger weather proof tent which in my experience the robens 2 is except for the size. The nortent hype definitely influenced my decision to buy the vern 1 as I haven't got hillaberg money. Wind and rain is always on the cards in the UK and I already have the robens which is pretty much weather proof in my experience but is just very small. The nortent was my hillaberg wannabe. I might have to just save up and be patient which is not like me ha
@@leeroy5190 definitely. Sell the Vern say it’s not for high winds 😂 save up you’ll get your hille. That’s what I did. I used other tents until I had the cash. Got my first soulo on eBay £350. 8 years ago. So I’ve had 8 years experience of the soulo tents. I think that’s fair to say I know what I’m on about aye?
@@Fellmandave1 I think I need some time to get over the initial disappointment ha. I'll have a think and see how I feel in a few days. Just recently subscribed and enjoying your content. Keep up the good work!👍
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Wow kept cool head
I actually quite like the wind marty, good thing was it wasnt cold, so wasn't worried. Was more concerned for the dog TBH.