[APPARENTLY SOLVED : LOOK AT BOTTOM] We had many discussion about the issue between sigma 18-35 f/1.8 and Dual Pixel Autofocus on the 80D. I am affraid this lens dont handle Dual Pixel AF very well. You should have a look here : www.dpreview.com/forums/post/57711593
And I thought, that Canon's video is too soft. Which has failed is the question. DP AF or Sigma's Lens AF accuracy. Hmmm... You forgot to mention 1 card slot, but I guess its because you are not into photography. PS: Is there a camera, that records video to 2 memory cards at the same time?
+pogolas a guy on the forum I quoted above made interesting expermiments suggesting that DPAF oparated too quick for the sigma lens mechanic (which was released before DPAF). I don't remember the details, but it leads to a constant back/front focus.
I believe its the SIGMA 18-35MM F1.8, I have one too, and yeah if we use the combo that is CANON DUAL PIXEL AF + SIGMA HSM SYSTEM its not as perfect as we use CANON DUAL PIXEL AF + CANON STM LENS SYSTEM IF YOU USE THE FACE TRACKING MODE, BUT I SOLVE THAT PROBLEM FOR STILL RECORDING WITH MANUAL SETTING, JUST FOCUS FIRST AT YOUR RANGE AND FACE then just START RECORDING haha. OH and It's happen also with my SIGMA 17-50mm f2.8 THE ACCURACY OF FOCUSING, BUT TO BE HONEST DAMN SIGMA LENS IS JUST SO SHARP AND THAT F1,8 JUST ARGH, NO OTHER BRAND LENS HAVE THAT WIDE LENS AT F1.8 lens YET, correct me if I'm wrong guys!
You said something, that no body cared to think it, or where to busy with gears. This is about Canon not their users. It explain WHY Canon holds back compare to the competition. Canon doesn't care about the need or wants of their client, they only care about their bottom line.
Which is what every company (especially the public ones, with shareholders) must do. I would be the first one to run away from any business entity that doesn't care about their bottom line. The problem with Canon is that protecting their other product lines like that - by constantly releasing artificially dumbed down products, is going to hurt their bottom line in the long term
@@dmitrylee01 Agree! They are keeping the masses from grabbing these new toys. Not everyone is a cine shooter, I believe there are more average consumers for Volume vs a niche.
Exactly the problem. Canon made this camera for Canon. There is the problem. Canon makes cameras for themselves and doesn't care if users want them or not. This is why everyone is on their case. This is a camera built by engineers for a company out of touch with the market. This is a who cares camera. This camera makes them bleed even more. They could have developed the M series rather than another half-baked hardware that is irrelevant from the get-go. Stop making excuses for Canon, they are blind and not listening (nor care) about what the actual everyday users are asking for. Even their marketing sucks. I shot Canon for 12 years until and after selling my 1DX and 5DIII, never looked back. I still have M1 and M3 that I bought for $120 and $200 respectively and stop right there. Nikon at least showing interest in what we want. Canon is not even pretending. Based on your "Canon 3 goals" premise, they failed on all three. Why buy this body? Just stay with 5D4. This offers absolutely no advantage. NO IBIS is a no go from a very beginning and the stupid crop? Whoever gave you that excuse is trying to mask the half-ass design and lazy engineering. They are unwilling to spend money on the processor, cache, and technology to make this happen. I will wait for Panasonic full frame before I ever look into another Canon. Heck, Fujifilm new medium format is more compelling than anything Canon may want to put out. This R unit is an excuse of a camera and with this Canon is asking for the user community to pay for their R&D. Canon has the processing power and the expertise with the dual and quad processors in the 1D series for a decade. They are just too stingy and tight to put them in this camera. They have had this for years and could have smoked everyone out of the water with this by developing the battery technology to power the processor and but chose to stay put. Mirrorless revolution has been around for 10 years. Canon has had the Technology to marry the two for 10 years, but they rested on their laurels and arrogantly refused to see what users are asking for. Sony put out the first FF mirrorless nearly 6 years ago. Canon was the innovator, but with that one camera and the lack of movement by the two giants, they simply lost the race. Nikon is trying; Canon still does not get it. Product line preservation is a lame excuse not to develop what the consumer want. Sony has kept the pro line of the excellent video line along with the mirrorless technology. Please stop making excuses for Canon. I say it this way, the problem with the oil industry is that all the oil is in Texas, bull the dipsticks are in Washington. The problem with Canon is that the user community is everywhere, but the decision makers are in Japan (or who knows where) blind and deaf. The Canon employee cannot tell you that they are not the ones making the marketing decisions. Those decisions are being made by a bunch of fossils sitting in their offices totally out of touch with the market or their product line managers are just simply clueless. They do not dare to step out and see the market as is and turn a blind eye to how it has changed. They simply have refused to adapt to the new market. The void they have created is being gladly filled by other players.
Thank you for replying. Please expand. Do you mean to suggest that they planned the obsolescence of the line they have and to transition to a new line? Or, they failed to plan hence the market drove them to obsolescence? Observing Canon's behavior suggests no plan as they are extremely late and very underwhelming with their reaction tot he market. Did they plan to fall off the lead and rested on their laurels? Personally, I think Canon simply did not think that this mirrorless business is going to succeed the way it has. Surprisingly, after having proof of concept, as it has been demonstrated by Sony, Fujifilm, and M4/3, Canon did not react to it strongly and after the long wait and the anticipation, they left their users with the R version. This is what encourages me to think that Canon simply does not get it. Sony went through a major leadership change a few years ago and corrected course with stronger leadership. All of this, is simply lack of vision, lack of leadership, and lack of touch with the user community.
Rez, Canon currently dominates the mirrorless market : Believe It or Not, Canon Leads the Mirrorless Market in Japan fstoppers.com/gear/believe-it-or-not-canon-leads-mirrorless-market-japan-273240 You Won't Believe Who's The #1 Mirrorless Camera Manufacturer th-cam.com/video/4RJZw721vB0/w-d-xo.html and I expect Canon to clean up, the FF ML market too. If you are serious about video, you will be shooting raw already. Cant afford raw video ? check out the Blackmagic Pocket 4K camera @ $1600 USD that shoots 12bit raw - logs not required. I was shooting raw 2k 14bit 25fps back in 2012, and the IQ still looks killer. Highly compressed H264/H265 just doesn't cut it, and is akin to shooting jpeg stills.
But you cant sell a Camera for 2500$; and market is as "innovative" when you get another camera for 2300$ which has ALL Features of the Canon + IBIS + 4k no crop + Dual SD + 120p FullHD !
+Maxi VL Sony's color are totally fine with their 3rd generation of FF body, please stop acting like canon's color are perfect, because they are not. Red for exemple is so saturated straight out of the camera, its really not flattering for most people. Id argue that Sony AF is better in most situation Sony/Zeiss native lenses are better than Canon EF lenses and they have a great selection You know what, with an adapter, EF lenses actually focus better on an A73 than the entire Canon's lineup. No flip out screen, I will give you that !
You didnt mention some big factors in the comparision of the GH5s vs the EOS R which is 4K/60, 1080/120, and dual card slots... just saying... advantage = GH5s
No 120fps at 1080 is hard pill to swallow. 4K crop doesn't affect me too much as I don't have the storage for 4K and the no IBIS is also a little annoying.
I agree with you, but there is nothing more frustrating than getting shitty AF performance with native sony glass on my A7s2, on the rare occasion one needs AF to really take over... :/
You are naive if you think so. in the world there is no company or corporation that would do something for people. All of them make their products only in order to earn more money. As soon as Sony realizes that they have no competitors left, they will start making the same shitty cameras as Canon
Sir brother but as a Canon user for almost 6 years I was expecting Canon to go all out with this mirrorless camera because they kept it secret for a long time but they really fail for me in my opinion(please don't hate me). In the photographic aspect this camera is a beast yet in the video or film making aspect they lack so many things! 4k is crop, come on. No IBIS, come on. 1080p stock at 60p, f*king come on. Canon is basically doesn't really care at there costumers. Regarding the legacy lineups(Mirrorless, Dslr, C Line) for me it depends on the people's budget and actually c line is still lacking features that is on par with panasonic and Sony. It's just frustrating because I believe Canon can make a processor capable of 4k full frame shooting but they are too lazy to develop it. To be honest I'm ok without IBIS because I use Gimbals and tripods if only they've given us 4k full frame with out crop and 1080p 120fps. Canon Eos R might be a competitor for Gh4 and not with the GH5, Nikon Z6, and Sony A7iii. I hope one day Canon realize how the market works and seriously using the word revolution is not suited with EOS R.
In photo mode this camera shoots a max burst rate in c-raw with AF of 2.2 shots per second. That’s not real “beastly” that’s actually taking a long trip down memory lane and ending up in the 1960’s with film cameras. I don’t know why Canon felt they had to handicap this camera beyond the point of all reason. If I wanted to shoot video on a 1.8X crop, I’d spend $1,300 on the VASTLY better Blackmagic Pocket 4K.
if by right you mean a barely passable competitor to the A7ii then I guess. It doesn't hold a candle to anything Sony is doing right now... and the change in market share proves it. The fact that I'm one of 6 photographers in my circle of shooters that has changed brands in the last 3 years doesn't hurt that evidence.
Just for this once I think you are wrong, the GH5S seems to win over most areas against the canon R, 10bit internal 4k60P, 10bit external, vloggers are not going to buy both cameras, it's mainly for people who like to be behind the camera, like me, I am a cinematographer. Canon should have given this S35 Sensor 4K30P(422 10bit Internal) 4K60P(420 8bit Internal/422 10bit External) (Small Crop) 2K120P 8bit Internal Dual SD I am looking to buy an entire setup now to do wedding films, it feels great as a consumer now, good tech has become so much more affordable, 4 years back I was shooting TVC's with Alexa classic 2K prores and look at where we are now, with cameras like the Fuji XT3/Sony A7III and 2 exciting cameras coming this year A7SIII and another Panasonic, its just incredible that you have so many great options, comparing all this canon definitely feels like its lagging. EOS Cinema Line should be for RAW, the mirrorless lineup should be for everyone, just because everyone else has upped the game, canon seriously needs to, or else they will just become a lens manufacturing company. It already feel like a lost battle to me, I love fuji stocks as much as I do canon colour science, whats the reason for me to buy this camera at this end of this year, with 2 unknown giants yet to be launched.
A9, A73 and A7R3 can all record video to both SD card at the same time... idk for other camera with dual SD card I wouldnt be surprised if the X-T3 and the GH5/G9 can do it too.
So with the GH5s with full-frame glass and a speed booster XL, I get a 1.18x crop. 1.18x on an M43! And this is marketed as a full-frame camera with a 1.7x crop!! Canon can do full-frame 4k they just want you to buy a C700. "if you want full-frame buy the C700, its only $30k", -Canon.
Because you need a mount with a small flange distance for a speedbooster to work. With all the specs you were throwing around you'd think you would understand how cameras actually work.
MikedieONE Even if there is a speed booster (which this camera sadly needs to be usable for video) it’s still not over sampling any pixels- and they’re small pixels- so the result with be iffy low light, soft 4K, and zero electronic capability with adapted lenses. Sony gives away their protocol to third parties, that’s why the Metabones adapter works so well. Canon said they refuse to share that information.
So would they need 3 speed-boosters then? One for EF to EF mount, another for RF to RF and yet another for EF to RF? This camera. Lol Making the Nikon Z6 look better and better.
I will never understand the "well just buy a cinema camera". Panasonic and Sony have better features in their cameras and yet they still sell FS5/7 and EVAs. So that excuse holds no water to me. If I was only shooting in a studio or on sets, I'd absolutely buy a cinema camera. But I'm not, I'm solo Shooting at trade shows, car shows, and tight compact areas. I need a smaller form factor more often. If(when) I could afford it I'd get both, but right now I need the compact.
Heck people still by the C100 despite the 6D MkII having similar if not better features for far less money. Clearly the cinemas have more going for them than just base specs.
I once saw someone said 'red camera is cropped, arri alexa is cropped, etc cinema used super35 anyway'. The flaw of that comment is RED alexa and everything he said use all of the sensor size. If im buying a FF camera I want a ff look. Some people defending their fav brand blindly.
Nor Dic I very likely will for a studio camera. However it's lack of real autofocus and stabilization makes it useless for many of my needs. I'd have to upgrade to a gimbal with follow focus from my current one, and in studio I'd have to manual focus on myself all the time. That's far easier said than done.
But its a photo camera 1st. That's like buying a C200 and expecting it to take great photos. Buy what you know its built to do first. Anything else it does its just bonus
1 SD slot, cropped 1.8x 4k, that’s nearly 2 times crop, horrendous rolling shutter problems and no IBIS. To whoever is responsible for this camera the - R should stand for RESIGN!
Move_I_Got_This Classy brah. Do some research then get agro. Visit EOSHD.com for the 1.8x crop explanation. The EOS R is essentially an MFT camera in video mode. If you’re cool with that then fine. I won’t call you names.
Stop trying to shill for your website. If you are really serious about getting the absolute best video quality (for your money) go out and get a real super 35 cinema camera instead of trying to shoehorn a prosumer stills+video camera into your setup. Seriously, if what you are working on is such a big deal that you can't deal with a crop factor in 4k you ought to be shooting with a Blackmagic Ursa Pro, a Canon C200, or a Sony FS5, or something similar.
Is it me or is the focus slightly off, which makes the whole image appear soft? does it need to be micro-adjusted? I wonder if its an issue with 3rd party lenses or maybe its just a one time thing. Completely agree with you on this camera. Really looking forward to getting one.
12:50 Yeah I dont agree with gh5s comparison. The gh5/s has a ton more video centric features the EOS R lacks. Plus the the EOS R has no autofocus when shooting in C-LOG, its manual mode only!
Why should people have to compromise or shift their perspectives in order to consider this a good camera? It's completely underwhelming and a total disappointment (from a video standpoint, anyway). The only people who aren't saying so are people who Canon flew out to Hawaii for the release party. I mean I understand your points about it being a camera for Canon - because all of Canon's cameras have been cameras for Canon lately - but I don't understand why you think this is a good thing? Has Sony been hurting from making cameras that directly compete with other cameras in their lineup? Has Panasonic suffered from releasing ambitious cameras with future-focused features? Has Nikon had to reverse course after taking user feedback into consideration when planning new cameras? I like Canon, I learned on Canon cameras, and I'm rooting for them. But this camera is a bummer. I don't want to have to squint my eyes and cock my head and use my imagination in order to see a camera as a great value. I use cameras to make a living, it's serious to me. Unless Canon is including a free trip to Hawaii with every EOS R purchase, I don't see anything to be excited about.
AMEN! (I make my living shooting video too) AND I used to be a Canon only guy! So I'm pulling for them also but I think the "head guys" @ Canon are too far gone, I mean really, How many years now since the 5D??
Brad Baerwald 2005 5D or 5DMarkII? Haha. I remember when my friend got his 5D in 2005. I was shooting film while he got to chimp at his shots on the rear LCD. I was so envious.
When every single cinema Camera I know about has a super 35 sensor (a cropped sensor yes), I don’t really complain about the 4K crop and never will. For me, and I’m sure this relates to so many others too, I can use my Sigma 18-35 f1,8 ( which I loooove) on the 4K crop.The fastest wide zoom in the world. So thank god for the crop.
the shutter closed when changing the lens and the nd filter in the adapter are two great ideas, I don't know why the others haven't thought about it yet. a shame that this EOS R has these downsides...
I'd rather have to blow the dust of my sensor which takes 5 seconds rather than have to swap the shutter because it fails after going up and down so much.
why would it fail? I thnk next cameras from other brands will have this shutter system too. Though I hate Canon's commercial politics to protect their C series...
ThickFreedom Honestly it’s the goldilocks camera. Sensors not too small not too big easy to adapt lenses to it. With the speed booster you get a full frame view. Build quality is top notch. I’m l definitely getting one
Jason Navarrete doesn’t have fully articulating screen tho. And pretty sure Fuji does 2.5mm instead of 3.5mm. Also battery life is atrocious. I’d wait one more gen
WayneMakesThings it’s got 3.5 and yea the batter I not great and I don’t know about you but I’m not a vlogger the screen not fully articulating is ok. Like I said before “Goldilocks”. canon seems to not get it or not care
WayneMakesThings Tell me why do I always see average users like you complain about the battery life on Fuji's flagships? I personally purchased X-T2 + battery grip for my assistants to do BTS( both video and photo) while on set, and I fucking swear I have never seen a single charge other than roughly 2 batteries almost died ( 3 while on grip). Oh yes, for 8-9 hours on set. Stop complaining and actually use it.
A big reason is Canon is cropping in to get a 4K readout. Panasonic and Sony take a 6K sensor and downscale that into a 4K frame. This makes Panasonic and Sony's image look incredibly detailed.
@@dslrvideoshooter Remember when RED were the talk of the town with a 6k sensor? Now, sub-2000 prosumer bodies have 6k sensors. What a time to be a film maker.
First of all Caleb, thank you for all your content. You are level headed gentleman with great insight, knowledge and an articulate delivery. TH-cam needs more like you. My view on the EOS R is exactly the same as the majority here, i.e. its crippled and embarrassing... but I still ordered one. Why did I order one? Serveral reasons: 1) I have a C200 and need a B camera to match it with C-LOG. 2) The ND filter adapter makes it possible to chuck this thing on a gimbal in bright sunlight with any of my existing EF or EF-S lenses 3) It was much cheaper to buy an EOS-R than to sell all my lenses and re-buy into the Sony system... I did think about it a lot though. 4) The flippy screen 5) Once you've experienced the smoothness of DPAF in video, its hard to use anything else... and I tried Sony's but it just isn't as smooth. 6) Colour. I know this is subjective, but I'm used to Canon colour and Iike it. 7) I won't have to buy a separate charger (the A7iii doesn't com with a charger) and I have loads of LP-E6 batteries from owning a 5D. 8) Although the 4K crop is a bummer, I can get around it with a 10-18 EFS lens (which I already own) The biggest problem for me is the lack of 100/120fps. But I've just resigned to the fact that there is no perfect camera and there likely never will be. So for me that means I have a GH5 for its IBIS and high frame rates, a GH5S for low light, a C200 for internal RAW + XLR + DPAF (but not portability), and now an EOS-R for portability and DPAF. IMO, if you want: - great low light - smooth and accurate autofocus - IBIS - great colours - fully articulating screen - 1080 @ 120fps with autofocus - 4K @ 60fps with autofocus - high resolution EVF - Full frame in all modes - built in ND - portability - great battery life - no record limit - onboard XLR audio inputs - all professional video assist features (waveform, vectorscope, peaking, zebras, false colour) - 4:2:2 10 Bit recording - Raw recording ... plus loads of other things I'm sure I've missed, you will have to fork out for other cameras that fill the void left my competing models. Any serious videographer knows this and accepts it. Even the heralded A7iii is still missing alot of things I would need on certain jobs. So whilst the negative press on the EOS R is justified, it doesn't alter the fact that you can't look at any competitor for the perfect camera... it just doesn't exist. The EOS R fills certain criteria that others don't, and in that context is has a place in the market. Caleb, I believe your intentions are honourable. I do not believe that your trip to Hawaii has influenced your judgement, I just think its difficult to convey the merits of certain cameras to an audience who's needs and expectations are all so wildly varied. I'm a self employed videographer, and I've resigned myself to the fact I need a lot of kit to be able to say yes to any job. The EOS R sucks in many ways, but in certain circumstances it would be the right tool for the job. That's just the way the cookie crumbles I'm afraid. I now only hope any future comments do not question your authenticity, and rather consider the above and how your viewpoint fits into it.
I left Canon after the XC10 release. I waited for their answer to Panasonic, and that was it. I am a hybrid shooter with about 50/50 photo and video in 4K. Also, I bike with backpack a lot and wanted to cut down on weight. I have not regretted my decision at all. Wife loves wearing Canon bling, so she lugs it around...
Yep... That is the problem with fanboys, they make dumb excuses for crap products but you know he wants to keep getting those canon invites. Zero credibility on this channel
this camera is not making me switch back to Canon... just makes me glad i sold my canon gear & went to the camera company that is streets ahead of the rest & actually cares about its customers
Canon blew it. Lost the market, in less than a year from today Sony will public their next gen A6500, A7S III, and other companies are ahead of it. Canon's 4K is not as sharp as other systems, looks like HD before compression / upload to youtube. The fact is.... $2,400 for a crippled FF canon camera, or $2,000 for Sony A7III .... well, as a Canon user for ~20 years, bye bye canon.
Blew what? How is the 4K less sharp than other companies? I seriously doubt the 480Mbs 4K video of the EOS R is less sharp than the 100Mbs 4k of Sony. Sony is throwing away 4x the bits. Facts dude.
Wy Lee sony a6500 f.e uses a 6k and downscale it to 4k, that's why. also the sony use a full sensor readout. besides that, canon blew it simply because it's holding back the development.
I totally agree with your perspective here Caleb - although it’s not that exciting it is actually the perfect b cam for c200 and c300 MKII users who want a solid gimbal cam. Also if youre invested in canon glass, like canon colour and want a small super 35 cinema cam with C-Log and decent DR this is your only option. I personally couldn’t care less about FF for video but I can see why a lot of the hybrid users are disappointed with this. Does the cam allow you to reduce all the sharpening and noise reduction to get that C-series look or does it retain the DSLR and mirrorless digital sharpening look?
From my perspective having shot with 7D and 80D bodies mainly for video work, this is a fantastic camera. I've had two 80D's primarily because of how fantastic dual-pixel autofocus is. Seriously nothing else comes close for single shooter work were you are doing interviews and can't pull focus on two cameras. Will be upgrading to the EOS R for sure.
Don't let the haters get you down, Caleb! I love that you find the positives in these new cameras. There was a lot of hate for the 6DmkII and the M50, and over time, you slowly see people falling in love with them. Same will probably happen here for a certain audience.
I don't know how much transparency there is with Canon in this day and age. As far as the crop factor, as a 1DXII owner the crop in 4K is VERY reasonable so I know Canon has the technology. As far as IBIS their smaller point and shoot cameras (M5, M6) have IBIS so the tech is there. Canon HAVE the technology and capability. At the end of the day, if they REALLY cared about their customers and wanted to take back the market they could have easily done it but they chose not to...
No it's not getting paid. @DSLR Video Shooter wasn't in his home town making videos for money for clients that week, and can't use the meals, hospitality to pay for his mortgage, car payments, etc... Yes he does have a free camera to use for a while on paid projects. Also, numerous industries take media, press, influencers on trips like these. It's pretty standard.
I just bought a brand new EOS R, body only -- the price was $1599 from B&H and it included an SD card, a Rode VideoMic microphone, an LED lamp, a nice case, even a copy of Paintshop Pro. At that price, I think you'd agree that this is a nice camera for cinematography. especially video-blogging. I like to use it with EF lenses, so I have two image stabilization systems working together -- physical stabilization in the lens and digital stabilization in the camera.
$ 1500 not because the 6dmII already exists in that price, but if they should be about $ 2000 and still be somewhat expensive if we compare it with what the competition offers
Thomas, if you are going to record in an EOS R in a crop format for $ 2300 it does not make sense, instead the xt3 for $ 1500 with its cut-off sensor has more
It's like most companies' cleaning contractors. The cleaners do as little as possible, but just enough to keep the complaints to a quiet grumble and no more. Not enough complaints to fire them for breach of contract, but only just. Canon does the same - it provides as little as possible, but just enough to keep the complaints to a slight grumble and no more. And Canon provides just enough features to keep a sufficient number of customers to prop up their bottom line. So far this has worked well for Canon but not so well for the consumer.
Canon introduced YET ANOTHER feature deficient product and they are losing more market for it. If this was a $700 camera I could understand this, but $2,300 puts this in competition with MASSIVELY more versatile cameras. Almost nobody in the video community who aren't receiving these for free are legit considering them.
There could only ever be one 4K mode on the EOS R-and it's the one we have now. When people are talking about "full frame 4K", they are either expecting Canon to lower the quality by skipping/binning pixels (that is, not using all the pixels or clumping them together) or what they probably actually mean is "full frame 6.7K, scaled back to 4K for recording". But that is where the rubber hits the road. The EOS R with a single Digic 8 simply doesn't have the power and heat management to successfully manage that. The rolling shutter would also be significant.
It feels like you're saying "lower your expectations" while putting a positive spin on it. It's not an APS-C camera, and it's not charging APS-C prices. When the competition is giving true full frame video in the same price range, trying to reframe it that way is just strange. And while I trust you're not being intentionally biased, and though you might not have been paid directly by Canon, the optics of an all expenses paid trip to Hawaii aren't great. I wish these camera companies would stop doing that, because it's impossible for the experience not to influence people's opinions. The same thing could've been accomplished anywhere, without all the glitz and the exotic locations. Anyway, I look forward to your other videos on the camera.
But you are not using full frame in 4k!!! If you throw speedbooster on GH5 you get smaller crop. And 4k60 and better slowmotion, beter video quality... Also you would need to bring two sets of lenses for Canon R to match FOV in 4k and 1080.
@@buby024 true, and ultimately you're paying for the professional video features in the GH5 that can't be compared to any other camera on the market in the price range.
To be fair, sony did the same when the a73 came out, and nikon did the same with the z7, might not have been all the same youtube reviews, but they flew a lot of people out none the less
I actually sold my a7rii with 24-70 2.8 GM and got this camera. BEST DECISION EVER. I’m having a lot fun shooting editorial shoots with it and got the Canon 24-70 2.8 II. & dont start with that “well 4k crop, or lack IBIS” because guess what? I got a Bmpcc 4k for my serious VIDEO. I also have the Zhiyun crane 2 which is better than ibis. And lastly lack of dual cards?? Well I have had a Canon t6i, 5d mark ii, Sony a7rii, fujifilm xt-1 and NONE of them have dual cards and never ever had I had a problem. So guess what, the EOS R is the best choice on the market for me as I wanted something like the 5div but I fell in love with mirrorless after owning the Sony. I could have opted for the a7iii instead but I like Canon color science and super fast AF. Argue with me im ready for it 😼 BTW I don’t hate Sony or Fuji because I was a user and liked both cameras. But the fact that I can use my canon lenses on the bmpcc4k is a no brainer even the batteries too. I couldn’t use my sony glass on the Blackmagic so 🤷🏻♂️ Plus all you people talking bad about the cameras when some of you take shitty photos to begin with. I’ve seen users proudly take out their 1dx II and damn their editing is horrible and I’ve met cool people shooting with the rebels and their daytime photography angles and editing is BEAUTIFUL. So stfu about the EOS R trash talk.
Caleb? Canon didn't pay you? They just wined and dined you in Hawaii. Please don't become a shill for them. I'm a 5DIV owner but I can admit this camera is disrespectful of the spirit of innovation. This is a mirrorless version of the 5DIV. When did the 5DIV come out? Where is the evolution and innovation? This camera is missing the three basic modern features: (1) cropless 4K, (2) IBIS and (3) 4k at 60p. Even Nikon Z6/Z7 checks off two of the boxes. No excuses for this.
Please don't insult Caleb. In the real world, lots of people conduct themselves with honor and integrity. I believe Caleb is one of them. No, Canon didn't pay him. They invited him to an early view/use event (just like almost every other major camera maker does with almost every other major camera reviewer). If Caleb didn't attend their event he'd have to wait to actually purchase the camera to be able to give any real-world in-hand commentary about it. And you know what you'd do in that case? You'd go watch the video of somebody else who did attend the event to get the early word on the camera.
Many people have commented negatively to your video Caleb, but I would like to thank you! Every user needs to weigh the features most important to them. I have an a7Sii and have struggled with it for my style of vlogging. I feel Sony has compromised to get specs... like putting a corvette engine in a chevette. I wish the R had 120 in 1080, but the overall strength of the package is appealing to anyone who holds the camera out in front of them jumping in and out of a tractor trailer. Thank you!
I'm a Canon user and I experience most of the points you mentioned in terms of new release expectations. Maybe R made for Canon and it's not full-frame 4K video or has no IBIS. But people still run for Canon :) And this is a fact. It doesn't mean it's a bad thing but a smart thing. For me when I want to buy a DSLR it took me a long time in the beginning until I got my first canon body. I went through all known brands but what made Canon is a winner is 1- They give you what you want not everything. 2- as a camera body is so successful in terms of design and volume. 3- Usability of the system and how to process your images and video, which I think personally is one of the best features, to let you return to Canon. In the end, I know that Sony does the best video camera and photography, and Panasonic is the leading brand in the video too, but still, I need to stick to Canon because it gives me all I need with the fun factor and without the complexity in other systems. In the end, this is my personal suggestion.
You know, I said that about the specs on the M50. Canon is smart to target a niche and not battle for sony users. They made a great camera for vlogging. 6D 2 users will really consider this one. I might go with the X-T3 though. That would be a great camera to complement my M50. I don't need a full frame. Great video Caleb.
What's next, Medium Format Vlogging? Sorry, I see _nothing_ in 99.99999999% of all vlogging videos that warrants 4k or full-frame. Honestly, Full-frame is a handicap as the depth of field becomes so narrow it annoyingly switches between face and other objects all the time. APS-c is a good balance for vlogging - sufficient depth of field, and excellent noise ratio + much lighter than full frame so can be hand held. Making a full frame camera aimed at vlogging is just a really wasteful thing to do.
@@mdkooter absolutely agree as I said I don't need 4k or full frame. But that doesn't mean that there are not tons of people that want 4k and full frame for vlogging, ie A7iii vloggers, that is the video people they are targeting, but this is mainly a photo camera. I would prefer a M50 over a Eos R for what I do. And I would rather have a X-T3 over a Eos R as an upgrade.
@@charbax I do not know whether I hate IBIS or not I have never used it. I have no doubt that is is helpful like auto focus. I know that I do care to vlog and think I do a decent job at it without in body image stabilization. Also I know that there were very successful vloggers before we had IBIS, Casey neistat, Peter McKinnon, the latter not using it though it was around. Every tool has its place.
I think alot of people also see a camera like this as a damn camcorder first. Tips me to bits when people buy a 1d or something then winge and moan about the video! For me this would could be a nice little camera for my needs. As I like to do lots of multiday hikes and carrying the 1d with supporting gear lenses gets a bit overwhelming at times!
Crop for 4k is not so bad. You can use small lenses because EF-S is supported. You do not need lenses with a mega resolution to shoot in 4k. Small lenses with EF-S mounts such as 24mm 2.8 STM, 10-18 STM, 50mm STM make this camera something you can hide in your pocket. The camera with these lenses is light and compact, it can be easily put on the gimbal. He does not tire his hands during long hours of filming. Larger DOF means that there is no effect of pumping autofocus when filming moving objects.
If I had to choose from the 3 new camera's recently released, I would go for the Fuji X-T3 (for photo work) as I really like their film simulation. I wouldn't sell my A7iii though as the only disadvantage of the X-T3 is that it's not a FF sensor. For video I would choose none of the 3 and wait till the A7S3 comes out (or the FF Panasonic) before making a decision. But as I'm not a millionaire, I'll stick to my A7iii and a6300 for the foreseable future. What I find positive on the new Canon R line (despite the price) is the new lens design with control ring as well as the adapter with changeable ND.
"We 'll be a lot happier if it were a cropped -sensor camera" Spot on, Caleb! Canon crippled their M series by putting in mono mic ports. Please do a test with a y-cable or mixer to see if the EOS R allows split audio recording into L-R channels. Then I will consider the EOS R as an 80D with an EVF.
This video is not fact based nor did he say it was. It had facts mixed with speculation, and personal observations. Theres no way he knows Cannons exact reasoning or motivations. Facts are the specs of the camera, speculation and personal feelings is everything else.
OrganicFarmer What’s with people in this “facts don’t matter” era? I guarantee you that Canon’s stated c-raw burst rate of just over 2 frames per second is both a fact and a reality. Rent or buy an EOS R, and if you can shoot Canon’s special raw format photos with autofocus/AE at three frames per second or faster, I’ll buy you that paperweight of a camera. Why do people stand up for blatant liars? Where’s morality gone? It should belong to one brand any more than it should one political party. I’ll buy the best camera at the bet price the same way I will vote for the politician who is not constantly lying and deceiving. Give up your loyalty to liars and cheaters. Loyalty should be earned and maintained when it comes to everything. This is not a conservative or liberal idea.
I think you completely nailed it on the EOS R being "made for Canon". Like Nikon's Z, Canon needed to stop Canon users from experimenting with mirrorless with Sony A7s, and often enough, not coming back. If you have a big investment in Canon glass, you can get your mirrorless jones and still get full functionality from your EF or even EF-S lenses. But for video, with that crop, you're practically a GH4/GH5 anyway. So forget Sony, but if that's what you want, why not buy a Panasonic and get in-body 10-bit?
It sounds like one of those debate whether a glass is half empty/half full. Here is the reason why people should not invest in Canon equipment if they haven't already heavily invested in the Canon glasses. People been saying spec sheet do not carry weight. However, spec sheet does carry weight. When they 1st released the 5D IV, the retail price was at $3500 with crop 4K, mjpeg, no C-log (extra $100), basic CF and SD cards, and no flip screen. Only two years later, their newest EOS R retail priced at $2300, still has crop 4K, mp4 with C-log (no extra $100 charge), fully articulated flip screen, and faster memory card for $1000 less. One must wonder how could Canon justify $3500 for the 5D IV with less features. Did I forget to mention the 6d II? Retail price at over $2000 with DR performance worse than 6D. Anyhow, both 5D IV and 6D II's prices dropped drastically due to the release of the EOS R. In regards to the argument about using current EF lenses with Canon adapter, this is not a good option. Most current EF lenses were designed with a 20ish MP sensor in mind. Although you can still take photos with a 30/50MP sensor, they lack the resolving power per DXO sharpness test results. The R lenses are much sharper but very expensive....This all boils down to the idea of value. For about the same price, you now have at least three others options: Sony, Nikon, Panasonic FF plus XT-3 ($1500) with better 4K functionality. From this perspective, the glass is half empty, not full.
Come back from Sony to Canon for this camera?!?! HAHAHAHAHA I wouldn't want this camera in my camera bag in 2016 and at the end of 2018 it has no place in ANY bag. Seriously would you pull this camera out if you own a GH5 or a Sony A7 III? Why?
I actually sold my a7rii with 24-70 2.8 GM and got this camera. BEST DECISION EVER. I’m having a lot fun shooting editorial shoots with it and got the Canon 24-70 2.8 II. & dont start with that “well 4k crop, or lack IBIS” because guess what? I got a Bmpcc 4k for my serious VIDEO. I also have the Zhiyun crane 2. And lastly lack of dual cards?? Well I have had a Canon t6i, 5d mark ii, Sony a7rii, fujifilm xt-1 and NONE of them have dual cards and never ever had I had a problem. So guess what, the EOS R is the best choice on the market for me. I could afford the a7iii instead but nah I like Canons color science and super fast AF. Argue with me im ready for it? 😼
Thanks for a helpful and sensible video. I'm planning to upgrade from crop to full-frame, and was going to stick with DSRL (5D Mk IV) because it's a fairly comprehensive package. But after watching this, I'm thinking: why not go for the EOS R instead? (1) It has a better sensor. (2) Even with the adapter for my Canon lenses plus a battery grip, it's less expensive than the 5D. (3) It has a totally articulating LCD screen. (4) It has practically the same MPs for still photography. (5) It even takes the same batteries, of which I have a bunch! So what possible incentive do I have to stick with DSLR in upgrading? Any response would be helpful. Thanks again!
People in the comments dropping specs of other cameras, complaining that this model doesn't have absolutely everything, are part of the problem. You mean Canon isn't helping you race to the bottom doing $500 promos for local business or shooting weddings for $1,500 a pop? Boo-hoo. You all are a bunch of rabid bargain shoppers who determine a camera's utility based on the spec sheet, not shooting experience, reliability, workflow, or any of the other factors actual professionals (most of Canon's customer base) care about.
No, these people in the comments don't give a rat's ass about $500 promos or $1,500 wedding shoots. For every "actual professional" out there, there are hundreds of hobbyists and amateurs shooting for their own enjoinment. That's how most of Canon's customer base actually looks like. Both in terms of sheer numbers and in the amount of revenue they generate for Canon. And absolutely, these folks' number one criterion is the amount of features they get per their hard earned dollar. Workflow, shooting experience, all of that is secondary.
Question... That Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 you're using is one of my favorite lenses on my backup camera, the 80D. Does this lens function correctly on the EOS R in 1080p without that 1.7 crop? Or it still has the same issue as if you put it on a full frame DSLR? I assume the latter but I'm hopeful that somehow that lens works...
You hit the nail right on the head at the end in regards to the camera everybody wants that has yet to come into existence (Full frame, high data rate, full flip out/articulating screen, great AF, IBIS, and dual card slots). It will come around eventually, until then, I'm still loving my GH5.
Went to a launch event for the R here in Australia. The Canon guy didn't get an easy ride when questions were asked and at times looked quite uncomfortable. Reasons for 4K crop were if you want better buy a Cine camera. The R is not a professional camera nor is it targeted at prosumers and enthusiasts, but rather at casual users. Pushed harder overheating seemed to be a big concern and that without an inbuilt fan there could be no full frame 4K. The crop enables better picture quality as it means no pixel binning and enables the sweet spot of the lens to be used. There is no IBIS because Canon believe that they are market leaders in image stabilisation and they say lens based is best. There is only one card slot because the R is not a professional camera, but they said using SD cards would future proof it. Quite a few asked about third using third party lenses and the Canon presenter said that they won't work very well as the camera requires data that is stored in the lens to autofocus properly. When pushed really hard about this he conceded that Sigma and Tamron may be able to reverse engineer the protocols and issue a firmware update. The overall message from the presentation is Canon knows what is best for their customers and will only give them that. They sincerely believe that the R is the best MILC on the market at the moment. For printing. Well here in Australia with the basic adapter and body only there won't be much change out of $4000 AUD which really puts the camera at a disadvantage against the Sony A7iii. In fact the Canon rep did say that the best value way for a Canon shooter to get 4K in a mirrorless camera at the moment is to buy an A7iii and a Sigma MC-11 adapter.
Francesco Nicoletti Pure marketing BS. But then Canon don't regard the 5d as a professional camera. According to the the only pro stills cameras they make are the 1d series and the only professional video cameras are the C series.
Paul Amyes who does canon think the rest of it’s cameras are for ? How many people are going to buy a high end cannon when a panasonic or olympus or sony does mote then cannon can at a cheeper price ? This new camera is a suicide note.
An apparent reason for the 1.75 crop in 4K video could be the DualPixel Sensor. For a full sensor readout 60Million Dual Pixels had to be read out, converted to 30Mio Pixels and then sampled down to 4K. That 60MP readout plus combining the dual pixels to 30MP could impose an exessive workload for the Digic 8 processor.
I have too much invested in canon lens but am preparing to switch if canon does not not get on the ball with competing with Sony. my canon lens can work with Sony using adapters and so I use phottix juno flashes.
2 yrs later and I'm here considering buying an eos r to replace my secondary camera Sony a6500 to move back into the Canon camp with all my Canon glass and replace my main a7iii with the new r5 I think the r5 and eos r will make a great team and work well together for 2 camera shoots.
They aren’t bringing people back. The ones who have moved on were sick of Canon being slow to respond to their customer base. Lots of Canon users are still disappointed with them and are moving on even with this release. They keep gimping their cameras and people are sick of it. Like you said they didn’t make this camera for the consumer they made it for Canon as a stop gap. That’s not good enough. People are asking for better.
Amazing!! Thank you so much for your insight! I share pretty much the same views so far.:) Oh and wait till creators like Philip Bloom, Peter and Casey get their hands on them to make every nay sayer get back to their roots about why they started shooting video/photo in the first place. Because in the end, that's what it comes down to. What you can do on set and in the edit room will eventually be the biggest differentiator irrespective of the tools you use. Yes, I wish it was priced better because this means their FF 4k with dual cards and IBIS could be prohibitively expensive but that's something we have to wait and see. But hey having said that I thank each and everyone who is disappointed/happy with this launch. You guys along with the manufacturers have infused so much life into this industry!! Thanks Caleb and all you guys and girls. This is probably the best time to be a creator and/or a gear nerd too. Congratulations to us all!😁
@@richbarrett Thank you for responding. But that's not what I said now did I. He doesn't just shoot slo-mo you know. Check out what Matjoez has done with his 6Dii, another camera that was hammered at launch. Besides no one here is saying that it's going to replace someone's existing Canon cameras.
Actually one more reason for the 4K cropping might be the lack of true mechanical IBIS and the use of electronic IBIS, unless that introduces additional cropping during video.
I love some of the anti-Canon / pro Sony comments here. It makes me believe that few, if any of those folks have ever used a Canon or a Sony. So, compared to Canon, Sony cares about their customers? Is that why their releases are often called Beta releases - with specs that don't work very well, but will be fixed with the next release in two years? So, instead of having a reliable if lesser spec'd camera that is good for 4 or 5 years, you need to buy the Sony every two years to get the "fixed" version. Hmm, wonder which way cares more about the user (and their $$). Last time I looked, buying a Sony every two years costs more than buying a Canon every four. Or the fact that Sony has the worst weather sealed body - yup, that's because they think of the user. How about the fact that Sony designed their FF line to be a crop camera , then changed their mind to take advantage of the fact that no one else was selling a consumer level mirrorless FF. So they ended up with a camera with too short a flange distance compared to the mount diameter. That is why their lenses are longer and heavier (for the most part) then their DSLR competitors. And their kit lenses (because of the short flange distance) have very poor image quality away from the image center. I suppose that was to make their users happy and not to make money. And I'm sure they were thinking of their users when they designed what even many Sony users consider a very poor ergonomic camera. Yes, comfort, ease of use, easy to navigate menus - well, Sony must have just forgotten momentarily about their beloved users on that front. Sure, Sony has more specs - especially on the video side than Canon. If you need them, by all means get the Sony or some other brand that serves your needs. For many users, Canon serves their needs, so why not accept that? Accept that for some photographers, Canon's color science is far superior than Sony, I suppose they made advances in color science purely for themselves and not for the users. I suppose the superior ergonomics of Canon have nothing to so with their users either. How about their superior weather sealing, reliability, and repair service? I guess it is just because of the bottom line.
Don K nailed it! OF COURSE Canon cares about their users. Saying otherwise is just plain stupid. After all they have the most user friendly cameras! Most people have no clue exactly what the specs they’re crying over truly mean. And almost no one is talking about the things this camera does better than ANY mirrorless camera on the market..Focus speed /acquisition and low light focusing are HUGE! Not to mention FV mode, real ergonomics, better weather sealing, fully articulating screen, much much better EVF than a Sony a7iii, a better lens mount than Sony (sorry but Canon and Nikon win with their mounts alone vs Sony).
This is a bit black and white. I totally accept that photographers stay with Canon. I loved my 6D for fotos, it was good enough for me, and yes, the Canon colors and the ease of use rule. But when I entered the video world, the offerings from Canon were not ok anymore. 6D has really bad video, and the Mark II is as shitty. The 1DX Mark II is great, but too big and too expensive. So I went to Sony.
People also forget that there could be future speed boosters for getting back the full frame sensor! Given the comparison that gh5s is virtually the same 4K quality, but canon can auto focus like a boss and also shoot stills in full frame for the same price, yeah it’s going to be a winner. That being said, I think they could (and would like to see them) make an even better all in one camera but I suspect it’ll be in the $3500+ range...
I'm a Canon 70D user and I agree with all your points. For me this camera system is very interesting. Yes, it's not the camera, but the system. Let's think for a moment who Canon and Nikon are: they have been the market leaders for decades. Have both sold over 250 MILLION lenses with EF and F mounts. They are changing their systems! It's huge! Yes, the cameras aren't "great". The fact that they still consider a 2300 dollars/euros camera an "entry level" camera and putting only one SD slot is not (partially) their fault, but it's the fault of us users that buy without reasoning that at that price point is not a camera that we get for the first time, but a camera that give us value, because we value our images. Instead so many users have picked up those cameras as their first one, hence devaluing them. Canon and Nikon just see the sales, nothing less. Instead we, as a community, should try to change the market saying that at that price point cameras are bought because we value our images a lot and don't want to make a chance. The biggest fail was from Nikon Z7 camera that, at a higher price tag, still has one slot. But that's another story. Also I'm not so mad about the crop in 4k, or at least not as much as in the 5D Mark IV, or even the complete lack of it in the 6D Mark II. That's because first of all they dropped the stupid MJPEG codec for an easier and better h.264. This leads me to corroborate my hypothesis that Canon had to rush to put some 4k capability in the Mark IV, well before they indended to do it. I believe that Canon would have brought us 4k not earlier than 2020 (an olympic year, same as in 2008 when they introduced the revolutionary 5D Mark II), if it weren't for the underdogs to release it for relatively cheap earlier than Canon, because Canon would have waited until they would introduce a cinema camera that can shoot up to 8k. All the RED, ARRI, and the biggest guys, have an 8k capable sensor for filming. Yet Canon's top of the cinema line can do only 4k. So of course they need to first seriously update that line of cameras, and then trickle down the 4k into smaller and cheaper bodies. However bodies change, lenses do not. With this we're going to the other big consideration. If they flooded the floor with new, affordable, quality lenses for the RF mount, than all the EF lenses would have become so cheap second handed that their prices would drop also the first hand lenses. That would have happened because people, that were hanging around looking at other systems (cough cough, Sony, cough cough) would have sold their lenses to change to a Sony camera, much more compelling. Instead they made a great freaking move: releasing THREE adapters. But only is really great: the one that allows drop-in filters!!! That's a feature that is present only on the cinema line and it's huge to have it on the cheap camera body of the EOS R! With that not only users have only one filter for all the lenses, but also they can use the APS-C lenses, before impossible to use on a full-frame camera by users that would upgrade to that system. At least on the Canon side. That is also a huge selling point. Also a question that I hope you can cover on one of your videos: how does the adapter work with third party lenses, such as Sigma and Tamron? So yeah, for the body there are obvious deal breakers: for me mostly the single slot. I was burnt once with corrupted files on a card, and if I upgrade the camera I don't want to get that chance again, at least for that price point. Perhaps at the same price point we might see an advanced APS-C with the same mount. But for what this system can do in the future, is definitely convincing for the small people like me to stick with Canon and their ecosystem of lenses and accessories (the same battery is wonderful). Cheers from Italy.
Two things that are keeping me from staying with Canon and why I'm buying an a7iii. 1. Dual card slots (starting to shoot weddings) 2. Video crop, IBIS, 1080 120fps. With those two main points, other benefits of the Sony a7iii include continuous silent shooting, amazing Eye AF, thumbstick for AF points, $400 cheaper. I'm going to keep my 6D and L lenses to adapt with the Sony and maybe Canon can release something down the road that checks off these deal breakers, but for now, my decision is clear.
Hi Caleb, You're totally right, Canon is doing is Canon thing once again. The problem with your story about the EOS R is that it's a Full Frame (FF later in this comment) camera, not a APS-C or what ever other format! If you're a video shouter you may want to shoot in 4K for various reason, even you'll not edit your footage in 4K, right? So why are you going to buy a FF Camera, to shoot 4K when your resolution end up being smaller than an APS-C, almost same as M43. And unlike with APS-C or M43, you cannot use speed booster adapter to give you a similar field of view as the FF. Then you may want to do some slow mo, and again you have to step down to 720p to have 120 fps! Ok I get it this is not a professional Camera! So why releasing this non pro body with a branch of Pro lenses? This does not make sense, until you realise that it is Canon, and anyway they will do what Canon does best (after good glass): protect they numerous products and product lines. Why having the C100 when the 5DMk4 can do more or less the same thing? Why the C200 when the 1DXMk2 can do more or less the same thing? and now you have this EOS R with a new mount, in the picture, positioned in a weird place: not competing with the other Canon product line, and some may argue that this camera is also not competing with Sony, Nikon, Panasonic... The Canon problem: A confusing product line with too many camera doing more or less the same thing but with huge price difference. So Canon created an eco system that profit mainly... Canon! Yes the EOS R system is promising, but this first launch is far from being a home run, and really stop the bleeding. For a while now people are adapting Canon glass on everything, and the EF mount is there to stay for quite some time. Why? Because in the video industry many are using the EF mount lenses on RED, Sony, Panasonic, Fuji, Blackmagic cameras, because they are now not too expensive and very good quality. and this will continue until we start seeing adapter for RF mount to all those brand camera. So in the lenses department, Canon have nothing to worry about. In the Camera side, this first version is already out dated, and we cannot expect Canon to do like Fuji with a firmware update adding thing they're claiming now not possible. I really not seeing this one happening any time soon. Even through this camera EOS R have some very nice features: DPAF and flip out screen, high bit rate in 4K being the primary one, the proposed frame per second: 30 fps in 4K (when the new Fuji X-T3 can do 60 in 4K in 10bit 4:2:0 internally and 4:2:2 externally), 60 fps in full HD 1080p (when you can have 120 on the 1DXMK2, or on the GH5 in 10bit 4:2:2 internally), and 120 fps in HD 720p only! All that why? While talking about Fuji, the new X-T3, is a has a better value feature / price ratio, than the EOS R, and for video shooter, you buy an APS-C sensor (super 35 ich sensor, widely used in Commercial, TV, Cinema today), but like the Canon don't have IBIS, and the body is smaller than the EOS R, but they was still able to put so much in that Camera (dual UHSII card slot, 4K60, 120 fps in 1080p, 10bits 4:2:2 externally, 10bits 4:2:0 internally, F-Log, Eterna film simulation, ...), who is now shadowing the X-H1 the flagship video centric Fuji camera. Why Canon is not listening to they fan and users? Or to the what consumer expect? As you mentioned "at the end cannibalisms win"? I really hope that Canon release other version of this EOS R, cheaper version without this multi function touch slide button, and more Pro (and for sure more expensive) version. Mirrorless is the future. Canon, Nikon, and everybody else know that, so why not step in when it is still time instead of doing this weird move. Other had try it before like Kodak, Polaroid to mentioned only those one in the photo industry, or Nokia, Blackberry in the smart phone industry, and many more in all industry all over the world. If you don't take the right direction, and this at the right time and fast enough, no matter your size, name and reputation, you can go down. I really hope and finger cross for that not happening to Canon!
A cheaper camera and much better "all-rounder" is the Fujifilm X-H1. A true sleeper and has most of what the EOS-R lacks, notably IBIS, film simulation modes (wow once you try them), and a wonderful lens selection.
From a pro SONY user....I think there are a considerable amount of very good ideas and innovations employed in this camera. CANON hasn't included IBIS, but has introduced what seems to be a very impressive in-camera/in-lens stabilization system. It could be that they considered the ever growing gimbal market and saw it as less of a priority. If I wanted a stable shot, I would tend to go for the traditional stabilising methods (i.e. tripod etc) or a gimbal. For a professional shot in my sphere of shooting, a handheld shot would be mostly frowned upon by the director and so IBIS is neither here nor there - your mileage/needs/opinions will of course vary. The assignable ring on the new lenses and on the adapter is FANTASTIC! Also, the filter adapter is great. SONY et al should also develop similar. There is nothing more off-putting when going out to shoot with my little A6300 (for personal video) than having to fiddle with a bloody ND filter (LOL)- especially when I am used to just flicking a switch on my FS7 or FS5. These are all great stuff and CANON certainly does seem to have the best auto-focus out there and YES, pros do use auto-focus although manual focus is the preferred method. However, the 4K crop nonsense is just that. I understand the technical reasoning being put forward, but why go to market with something that hasn't conquered this....seems fishy to me, but I'm cynical. That aside, this crop nonsense is a real pain in the ass when you are doing a professional video shoot and want to shoot in 4K and retain the FF look to match your cine camera(s) that are doing the bulk of the shoot. Yes, it will potentially find it's way to studios and professional shoots simply due to it's size (that is a positive feature shared by all mirrorless) and form factor. So someone may be trying to match it with a C700 in the future. If it is being used in this way, then operator/director may also be using wider focal lengths and the crop could severely hamper that look. Conversely, for people who wish to film wildlife, the crop will be advantageous as you will get an increased focal length on your lenses. Could even be useful for certain journalists too - e.g., paparazzi and news. I will be sticking with SONY for a while, for no other reasons than I don't feel a strong enough pull factor from any other manufacturer (With the exception of ARRI, but they are best rented) and I have invested in the e-mount system which covers me on lesser budget shots and/or when using cine-lenses (primes) are not convenient or practical. That is not to say that SONY cameras are perfect and a push factor to ditch them in favour of a better option does to a degree exist.
Its very simple if you don't like the feature set, don't buy it if you do then do. I personally will consider it since it hits most of the boxes that I am looking for and have tons of Canon glass. Many cameras out there to choose from so make a choice.
Caleb, great video! I really don't think it would matter what Canon would add to this camera. Most people on here would have a complaint. If it had no crop when shooting 4K, 2 card slots 120fps slow motion etc, you would still have people complaining. I shoot with the original C100, XC10 and sometimes a 5DM3 using ML raw and they all work great for me. The bottom line is that I make money using all of them. And no I'm not talking about You Tube blogging where everyone is copying off of each other or where everyone is saying this or that camera is better then the other and they've never used or have any of those cameras. With that being said, do you still have your C100 and if so, would you have anytime to compare the C100 and EOS R shooting in c-log to see how close they would match. Thanks and keep up the good work.
It’s pretty much the exact same as the M50. People shitted on the M50 for the lack of DP AF in 4K, cropped 4K, rolling shutter, no high frame rate in 1080P, no IBIS etc. Save your money and get the m50, a EF- Adapter and get some glass. You’re paying 4K for glass.
you forgot to mention that the GH5s shoots internal 10bit, while canon does not. however, the clog profile does not need that much grading and the color looks a lot better.
I bought a GH5s for video but now Im in love with all its functions. Its small pixel but with solid details. The menu and setups are the best Ive used so far, tons of info and very intuitive. Once Panasonic makes a sports full frame, Im going to ditch my 1DX go Lumix all the way.
I think another deal breaker between the Canon and GH5S would be the recording time. The GH5S has unlimted recording, while the EOSR has 30min record time like all previous DSLRs?
Your side-by-side with the GH5s was compelling and almost brought me around to thinking about the EOS R as an option for my next purchase.. I REALLY want full frame for depth.. However, the unlimited recording and dual card slots in the GH5s pushes it over the top.. I record alot of events (church services, concerts, personal stories, etc) and the 30 minute record limit on the EOS R removes it completely from consideration. GH5s is still at the top of my list. If Panasonic keeps the same options as GH5s in their rumored full-frame, it will be the clear winner!
I'm thinking about buying the R. I won't complain about the crop in 4k as it's useful in wildlife videography. For all else I'll shoot in 1080p and upscale to 4k.
So here's my thing-- Canon made a solid Rebel line replacement. I think we can all agree that it's not suitable for full time use as a pro camera for video and marginally suitable for stills. I see this as a soccer mom camera in terms of features right up until you look at the HUGE glass they released with it. Not sure why they did this.
Just a heads up, either the camera or my sigma 18-35 wasn’t keeping focus on my face. Seemed to favor my shirt 😂 I’ll see which failed me.
I know that Matti seems to have problems with his C300 AF sometimes and he uses the 18-35mm on that.
[APPARENTLY SOLVED : LOOK AT BOTTOM] We had many discussion about the issue between sigma 18-35 f/1.8 and Dual Pixel Autofocus on the 80D. I am affraid this lens dont handle Dual Pixel AF very well. You should have a look here : www.dpreview.com/forums/post/57711593
And I thought, that Canon's video is too soft.
Which has failed is the question. DP AF or Sigma's Lens AF accuracy. Hmmm...
You forgot to mention 1 card slot, but I guess its because you are not into photography.
PS: Is there a camera, that records video to 2 memory cards at the same time?
+pogolas a guy on the forum I quoted above made interesting expermiments suggesting that DPAF oparated too quick for the sigma lens mechanic (which was released before DPAF). I don't remember the details, but it leads to a constant back/front focus.
I believe its the SIGMA 18-35MM F1.8, I have one too, and yeah if we use the combo that is CANON DUAL PIXEL AF + SIGMA HSM SYSTEM its not as perfect as we use CANON DUAL PIXEL AF + CANON STM LENS SYSTEM IF YOU USE THE FACE TRACKING MODE, BUT I SOLVE THAT PROBLEM FOR STILL RECORDING WITH MANUAL SETTING, JUST FOCUS FIRST AT YOUR RANGE AND FACE then just START RECORDING haha. OH and It's happen also with my SIGMA 17-50mm f2.8 THE ACCURACY OF FOCUSING, BUT TO BE HONEST DAMN SIGMA LENS IS JUST SO SHARP AND THAT F1,8 JUST ARGH, NO OTHER BRAND LENS HAVE THAT WIDE LENS AT F1.8 lens YET, correct me if I'm wrong guys!
You said something, that no body cared to think it, or where to busy with gears. This is about Canon not their users. It explain WHY Canon holds back compare to the competition. Canon doesn't care about the need or wants of their client, they only care about their bottom line.
That's every company ever man.
Which is what every company (especially the public ones, with shareholders) must do. I would be the first one to run away from any business entity that doesn't care about their bottom line. The problem with Canon is that protecting their other product lines like that - by constantly releasing artificially dumbed down products, is going to hurt their bottom line in the long term
@@dmitrylee01 Agree! They are keeping the masses from grabbing these new toys. Not everyone is a cine shooter, I believe there are more average consumers for Volume vs a niche.
Juan Lopez yup someone who’s going to pay above $2300 for not really for pro camera.
i’m considering adding it to my arsenal of tons of Canon L glass... for the aforementioned dual pixel autofocus and 480 bit rate +clog...
Exactly the problem. Canon made this camera for Canon. There is the problem. Canon makes cameras for themselves and doesn't care if users want them or not. This is why everyone is on their case. This is a camera built by engineers for a company out of touch with the market. This is a who cares camera. This camera makes them bleed even more. They could have developed the M series rather than another half-baked hardware that is irrelevant from the get-go.
Stop making excuses for Canon, they are blind and not listening (nor care) about what the actual everyday users are asking for. Even their marketing sucks. I shot Canon for 12 years until and after selling my 1DX and 5DIII, never looked back. I still have M1 and M3 that I bought for $120 and $200 respectively and stop right there. Nikon at least showing interest in what we want. Canon is not even pretending.
Based on your "Canon 3 goals" premise, they failed on all three. Why buy this body? Just stay with 5D4. This offers absolutely no advantage. NO IBIS is a no go from a very beginning and the stupid crop? Whoever gave you that excuse is trying to mask the half-ass design and lazy engineering. They are unwilling to spend money on the processor, cache, and technology to make this happen.
I will wait for Panasonic full frame before I ever look into another Canon. Heck, Fujifilm new medium format is more compelling than anything Canon may want to put out. This R unit is an excuse of a camera and with this Canon is asking for the user community to pay for their R&D.
Canon has the processing power and the expertise with the dual and quad processors in the 1D series for a decade. They are just too stingy and tight to put them in this camera. They have had this for years and could have smoked everyone out of the water with this by developing the battery technology to power the processor and but chose to stay put. Mirrorless revolution has been around for 10 years. Canon has had the Technology to marry the two for 10 years, but they rested on their laurels and arrogantly refused to see what users are asking for. Sony put out the first FF mirrorless nearly 6 years ago. Canon was the innovator, but with that one camera and the lack of movement by the two giants, they simply lost the race. Nikon is trying; Canon still does not get it.
Product line preservation is a lame excuse not to develop what the consumer want. Sony has kept the pro line of the excellent video line along with the mirrorless technology. Please stop making excuses for Canon. I say it this way, the problem with the oil industry is that all the oil is in Texas, bull the dipsticks are in Washington. The problem with Canon is that the user community is everywhere, but the decision makers are in Japan (or who knows where) blind and deaf. The Canon employee cannot tell you that they are not the ones making the marketing decisions. Those decisions are being made by a bunch of fossils sitting in their offices totally out of touch with the market or their product line managers are just simply clueless. They do not dare to step out and see the market as is and turn a blind eye to how it has changed. They simply have refused to adapt to the new market. The void they have created is being gladly filled by other players.
planned obsolescence. all of this is.
Thank you for replying. Please expand. Do you mean to suggest that they planned the obsolescence of the line they have and to transition to a new line? Or, they failed to plan hence the market drove them to obsolescence?
Observing Canon's behavior suggests no plan as they are extremely late and very underwhelming with their reaction tot he market. Did they plan to fall off the lead and rested on their laurels?
Personally, I think Canon simply did not think that this mirrorless business is going to succeed the way it has. Surprisingly, after having proof of concept, as it has been demonstrated by Sony, Fujifilm, and M4/3, Canon did not react to it strongly and after the long wait and the anticipation, they left their users with the R version. This is what encourages me to think that Canon simply does not get it. Sony went through a major leadership change a few years ago and corrected course with stronger leadership.
All of this, is simply lack of vision, lack of leadership, and lack of touch with the user community.
You are right, this shitty camera is a WHO GIVES A FUCK camera.
Rez, Canon currently dominates the mirrorless market :
Believe It or Not, Canon Leads the Mirrorless Market in Japan fstoppers.com/gear/believe-it-or-not-canon-leads-mirrorless-market-japan-273240
You Won't Believe Who's The #1 Mirrorless Camera Manufacturer th-cam.com/video/4RJZw721vB0/w-d-xo.html
and I expect Canon to clean up, the FF ML market too.
If you are serious about video, you will be shooting raw already. Cant afford raw video ? check out the Blackmagic Pocket 4K camera @ $1600 USD that shoots 12bit raw - logs not required.
I was shooting raw 2k 14bit 25fps back in 2012, and the IQ still looks killer. Highly compressed H264/H265 just doesn't cut it, and is akin to shooting jpeg stills.
This is exactly what I was going to say
But you cant sell a Camera for 2500$; and market is as "innovative"
when you get another camera for 2300$ which has ALL Features of the Canon + IBIS + 4k no crop + Dual SD + 120p FullHD !
i'm not saying you're wrong but the sony doesn't have ALL the features of the canon.
-canon colors -dual pixel -flipout screen -canon full lineup of lenses
Kris Dekker Panasonic
+Maxi VL
Sony's color are totally fine with their 3rd generation of FF body, please stop acting like canon's color are perfect, because they are not. Red for exemple is so saturated straight out of the camera, its really not flattering for most people.
Id argue that Sony AF is better in most situation
Sony/Zeiss native lenses are better than Canon EF lenses and they have a great selection
You know what, with an adapter, EF lenses actually focus better on an A73 than the entire Canon's lineup.
No flip out screen, I will give you that !
how are you sure that EF lenses focus better on sony than on canon? color science is subjective. and no canon still has better lens selection.
You didnt mention some big factors in the comparision of the GH5s vs the EOS R which is 4K/60, 1080/120, and dual card slots... just saying... advantage = GH5s
Jay Woodrum now what?
Tavaris Hamilton you can say that again when Sony and Panny announces theirs new camera. Lol
Plus cheaper lenses
"now what" what?
Jay Woodrum the gh5 has bad af though compared to canon
No 120fps at 1080 is hard pill to swallow. 4K crop doesn't affect me too much as I don't have the storage for 4K and the no IBIS is also a little annoying.
When will we get that perfect camera already??????
You said it: Canon did a camera for Canon. Sony, Fuji and Panasonic make cameras for the user, for the most part.
And that's why users should get Sony, Fuji and Panasonic cameras and Canon should keep their crippled cameras and shove 'em up their a*s.
I agree with you, but there is nothing more frustrating than getting shitty AF performance with native sony glass on my A7s2, on the rare occasion one needs AF to really take over... :/
@@BrotherBloat they say that a7 MK 3 has an amazing af, maybe you should rent it to get an idea of what you can expect in a7s3
@@novakk86 compared to a7s2, the a7r2 and a7m2 also had amazing af, so might not be a direct comparison, we'll see :)
You are naive if you think so. in the world there is no company or corporation that would do something for people. All of them make their products only in order to earn more money. As soon as Sony realizes that they have no competitors left, they will start making the same shitty cameras as Canon
Sir brother but as a Canon user for almost 6 years I was expecting Canon to go all out with this mirrorless camera because they kept it secret for a long time but they really fail for me in my opinion(please don't hate me).
In the photographic aspect this camera is a beast yet in the video or film making aspect they lack so many things! 4k is crop, come on. No IBIS, come on. 1080p stock at 60p, f*king come on. Canon is basically doesn't really care at there costumers. Regarding the legacy lineups(Mirrorless, Dslr, C Line) for me it depends on the people's budget and actually c line is still lacking features that is on par with panasonic and Sony. It's just frustrating because I believe Canon can make a processor capable of 4k full frame shooting but they are too lazy to develop it. To be honest I'm ok without IBIS because I use Gimbals and tripods if only they've given us 4k full frame with out crop and 1080p 120fps. Canon Eos R might be a competitor for Gh4 and not with the GH5, Nikon Z6, and Sony A7iii. I hope one day Canon realize how the market works and seriously using the word revolution is not suited with EOS R.
Earl Marasigan now what?
In photo mode this camera shoots a max burst rate in c-raw with AF of 2.2 shots per second. That’s not real “beastly” that’s actually taking a long trip down memory lane and ending up in the 1960’s with film cameras. I don’t know why Canon felt they had to handicap this camera beyond the point of all reason. If I wanted to shoot video on a 1.8X crop, I’d spend $1,300 on the VASTLY better Blackmagic Pocket 4K.
Tavaris Hamilton Uhh, now it’s probably time you learned how to speak English, so you can use words like a big boy to express ideas. 👍
The 3 reasons Canon made this camera perfectly answers why people are RIGHT about this camera.
if by right you mean a barely passable competitor to the A7ii then I guess. It doesn't hold a candle to anything Sony is doing right now... and the change in market share proves it. The fact that I'm one of 6 photographers in my circle of shooters that has changed brands in the last 3 years doesn't hurt that evidence.
@@10bighikes58 yep agreed - everyone is right about this camera being disappointing.
Just for this once I think you are wrong, the GH5S seems to win over most areas against the canon R, 10bit internal 4k60P, 10bit external, vloggers are not going to buy both cameras, it's mainly for people who like to be behind the camera, like me, I am a cinematographer. Canon should have given this
S35 Sensor
4K30P(422 10bit Internal)
4K60P(420 8bit Internal/422 10bit External) (Small Crop)
2K120P 8bit Internal
Dual SD
I am looking to buy an entire setup now to do wedding films, it feels great as a consumer now, good tech has become so much more affordable, 4 years back I was shooting TVC's with Alexa classic 2K prores and look at where we are now, with cameras like the Fuji XT3/Sony A7III and 2 exciting cameras coming this year A7SIII and another Panasonic, its just incredible that you have so many great options, comparing all this canon definitely feels like its lagging. EOS Cinema Line should be for RAW, the mirrorless lineup should be for everyone, just because everyone else has upped the game, canon seriously needs to, or else they will just become a lens manufacturing company. It already feel like a lost battle to me, I love fuji stocks as much as I do canon colour science, whats the reason for me to buy this camera at this end of this year, with 2 unknown giants yet to be launched.
No 1080p@120fps is a deal breaker for me
Benoit Levesque bye
I hear that 720p is making a comeback with the millennials... as is single SD card failure.
The 720p 120 seemingly doesn't even use continuous/tracking AF...so that's useless as well. Maybe there's a 480 option?
How many cameras do you have that record video to 2 cards simultaneously? Video has always been 1 card slot.
A9, A73 and A7R3 can all record video to both SD card at the same time... idk for other camera with dual SD card
I wouldnt be surprised if the X-T3 and the GH5/G9 can do it too.
So with the GH5s with full-frame glass and a speed booster XL, I get a 1.18x crop. 1.18x on an M43! And this is marketed as a full-frame camera with a 1.7x crop!! Canon can do full-frame 4k they just want you to buy a C700. "if you want full-frame buy the C700, its only $30k", -Canon.
Im sure there will be a speedbooster for the R too. it happened to the M50 already
Really? They don't have one for the 5D mkIV! It suffers from the same issue.
Because you need a mount with a small flange distance for a speedbooster to work. With all the specs you were throwing around you'd think you would understand how cameras actually work.
MikedieONE Even if there is a speed booster (which this camera sadly needs to be usable for video) it’s still not over sampling any pixels- and they’re small pixels- so the result with be iffy low light, soft 4K, and zero electronic capability with adapted lenses. Sony gives away their protocol to third parties, that’s why the Metabones adapter works so well. Canon said they refuse to share that information.
So would they need 3 speed-boosters then? One for EF to EF mount, another for RF to RF and yet another for EF to RF? This camera. Lol Making the Nikon Z6 look better and better.
I will never understand the "well just buy a cinema camera". Panasonic and Sony have better features in their cameras and yet they still sell FS5/7 and EVAs. So that excuse holds no water to me. If I was only shooting in a studio or on sets, I'd absolutely buy a cinema camera. But I'm not, I'm solo
Shooting at trade shows, car shows, and tight compact areas. I need a smaller form factor more often. If(when) I could afford it I'd get both, but right now I need the compact.
Heck people still by the C100 despite the 6D MkII having similar if not better features for far less money. Clearly the cinemas have more going for them than just base specs.
I once saw someone said 'red camera is cropped, arri alexa is cropped, etc cinema used super35 anyway'.
The flaw of that comment is RED alexa and everything he said use all of the sensor size.
If im buying a FF camera I want a ff look.
Some people defending their fav brand blindly.
HotRodHippie , the Blackmagic Pocket shoots 4k 12bit raw and will be $1600 USD. If you want to shoot video, buy one of these.
Nor Dic I very likely will for a studio camera. However it's lack of real autofocus and stabilization makes it useless for many of my needs. I'd have to upgrade to a gimbal with follow focus from my current one, and in studio I'd have to manual focus on myself all the time. That's far easier said than done.
Luke Rooney he means how the out of focus areas look and probably the low light bonus
That EF adapter with built-in ND filter is genius!! too bad it has to be attached to this body..
Benoit Levesque compliment sandwich! Haha
Video cameras have had forever
I hope others will steal the idea ...
Aputure Vari-ND is another interesting solution.
I get the feeling that Sigma and Metabones are going to follow this lead.
Canon didn't even focus on your face right))
Ha! Yeah was surprised by that.
Yes but gh5 or gh5s don't focus at all lol.
Laurențiu Derecichei exactly
RAMusic Corny ass comment
keep in mind third party lenses like the Sigma might not focus as well
Sorry but the justifications that you give for this camera is exactly why everyone else is exactly right.
This.
But its a photo camera 1st. That's like buying a C200 and expecting it to take great photos. Buy what you know its built to do first. Anything else it does its just bonus
1 SD slot, cropped 1.8x 4k, that’s nearly 2 times crop, horrendous rolling shutter problems and no IBIS. To whoever is responsible for this camera the - R should stand for RESIGN!
This is just not a FF camera for video 4k that is the 1.8x crop is no good
PremierReviewer now what?
It's fine when compared to an APS-C camera.
Mark Davis This is closer to a MFT camera for video than it is APS-C. Check out EOSHD.com if you want an explanation.
Move_I_Got_This Classy brah. Do some research then get agro. Visit EOSHD.com for the 1.8x crop explanation. The EOS R is essentially an MFT camera in video mode. If you’re cool with that then fine. I won’t call you names.
Stop trying to shill for your website. If you are really serious about getting the absolute best video quality (for your money) go out and get a real super 35 cinema camera instead of trying to shoehorn a prosumer stills+video camera into your setup. Seriously, if what you are working on is such a big deal that you can't deal with a crop factor in 4k you ought to be shooting with a Blackmagic Ursa Pro, a Canon C200, or a Sony FS5, or something similar.
Is it me or is the focus slightly off, which makes the whole image appear soft? does it need to be micro-adjusted? I wonder if its an issue with 3rd party lenses or maybe its just a one time thing. Completely agree with you on this camera. Really looking forward to getting one.
Sigma lens.. nuff said(not in terms of sharpness, but they are always failfocusing)
U completely ignored the frame rates on the Gh5s vs they eos r
If that's a big deal for you..
@@themjian it is a huge deal more me and many other people but for his projects it isn't
12:50 Yeah I dont agree with gh5s comparison. The gh5/s has a ton more video centric features the EOS R lacks. Plus the the EOS R has no autofocus when shooting in C-LOG, its manual mode only!
Why should people have to compromise or shift their perspectives in order to consider this a good camera? It's completely underwhelming and a total disappointment (from a video standpoint, anyway). The only people who aren't saying so are people who Canon flew out to Hawaii for the release party. I mean I understand your points about it being a camera for Canon - because all of Canon's cameras have been cameras for Canon lately - but I don't understand why you think this is a good thing? Has Sony been hurting from making cameras that directly compete with other cameras in their lineup? Has Panasonic suffered from releasing ambitious cameras with future-focused features? Has Nikon had to reverse course after taking user feedback into consideration when planning new cameras?
I like Canon, I learned on Canon cameras, and I'm rooting for them. But this camera is a bummer. I don't want to have to squint my eyes and cock my head and use my imagination in order to see a camera as a great value. I use cameras to make a living, it's serious to me. Unless Canon is including a free trip to Hawaii with every EOS R purchase, I don't see anything to be excited about.
AMEN! (I make my living shooting video too) AND I used to be a Canon only guy! So I'm pulling for them also but I think the "head guys" @ Canon are too far gone, I mean really, How many years now since the 5D??
Brad Baerwald 2005 5D or 5DMarkII? Haha. I remember when my friend got his 5D in 2005. I was shooting film while he got to chimp at his shots on the rear LCD. I was so envious.
When every single cinema Camera I know about has a super 35 sensor (a cropped sensor yes), I don’t really complain about the 4K crop and never will. For me, and I’m sure this relates to so many others too, I can use my Sigma 18-35 f1,8 ( which I loooove) on the 4K crop.The fastest wide zoom in the world. So thank god for the crop.
the shutter closed when changing the lens and the nd filter in the adapter are two great ideas, I don't know why the others haven't thought about it yet. a shame that this EOS R has these downsides...
I'd rather have to blow the dust of my sensor which takes 5 seconds rather than have to swap the shutter because it fails after going up and down so much.
why would it fail?
I thnk next cameras from other brands will have this shutter system too. Though I hate Canon's commercial politics to protect their C series...
I prefer dust on the sensor, than on sensitive shutter blade.
"A $2300 camera that had all those things..." I'll just spend $1500 for an X-T3 and buy a cheap monitor to go with it... I even get 4k 60 lol
ThickFreedom Honestly it’s the goldilocks camera. Sensors not too small not too big easy to adapt lenses to it. With the speed booster you get a full frame view. Build quality is top notch. I’m l definitely getting one
and 2 card slots
Jason Navarrete doesn’t have fully articulating screen tho. And pretty sure Fuji does 2.5mm instead of 3.5mm. Also battery life is atrocious. I’d wait one more gen
WayneMakesThings it’s got 3.5 and yea the batter I not great and I don’t know about you but I’m not a vlogger the screen not fully articulating is ok. Like I said before “Goldilocks”. canon seems to not get it or not care
WayneMakesThings Tell me why do I always see average users like you complain about the battery life on Fuji's flagships? I personally purchased X-T2 + battery grip for my assistants to do BTS( both video and photo) while on set, and I fucking swear I have never seen a single charge other than roughly 2 batteries almost died ( 3 while on grip). Oh yes, for 8-9 hours on set. Stop complaining and actually use it.
The image seems a lot softer on the Canon EOS R. I kind of doubt it's just the 8-bit vs 10-bit on the GH5. Any thoughts?
A big reason is Canon is cropping in to get a 4K readout. Panasonic and Sony take a 6K sensor and downscale that into a 4K frame. This makes Panasonic and Sony's image look incredibly detailed.
6k has around 20mp so that sounds about right
Yes the GH5 has a 6K sensor.
Doesn't it also have an OLPF? That softens it up quite a bit.
@@dslrvideoshooter Remember when RED were the talk of the town with a 6k sensor? Now, sub-2000 prosumer bodies have 6k sensors. What a time to be a film maker.
First of all Caleb, thank you for all your content. You are level headed gentleman with great insight, knowledge and an articulate delivery. TH-cam needs more like you.
My view on the EOS R is exactly the same as the majority here, i.e. its crippled and embarrassing... but I still ordered one.
Why did I order one?
Serveral reasons:
1) I have a C200 and need a B camera to match it with C-LOG.
2) The ND filter adapter makes it possible to chuck this thing on a gimbal in bright sunlight with any of my existing EF or EF-S lenses
3) It was much cheaper to buy an EOS-R than to sell all my lenses and re-buy into the Sony system... I did think about it a lot though.
4) The flippy screen
5) Once you've experienced the smoothness of DPAF in video, its hard to use anything else... and I tried Sony's but it just isn't as smooth.
6) Colour. I know this is subjective, but I'm used to Canon colour and Iike it.
7) I won't have to buy a separate charger (the A7iii doesn't com with a charger) and I have loads of LP-E6 batteries from owning a 5D.
8) Although the 4K crop is a bummer, I can get around it with a 10-18 EFS lens (which I already own)
The biggest problem for me is the lack of 100/120fps. But I've just resigned to the fact that there is no perfect camera and there likely never will be.
So for me that means I have a GH5 for its IBIS and high frame rates, a GH5S for low light, a C200 for internal RAW + XLR + DPAF (but not portability), and now an EOS-R for portability and DPAF.
IMO, if you want:
- great low light
- smooth and accurate autofocus
- IBIS
- great colours
- fully articulating screen
- 1080 @ 120fps with autofocus
- 4K @ 60fps with autofocus
- high resolution EVF
- Full frame in all modes
- built in ND
- portability
- great battery life
- no record limit
- onboard XLR audio inputs
- all professional video assist features (waveform, vectorscope, peaking, zebras, false colour)
- 4:2:2 10 Bit recording
- Raw recording
... plus loads of other things I'm sure I've missed, you will have to fork out for other cameras that fill the void left my competing models.
Any serious videographer knows this and accepts it. Even the heralded A7iii is still missing alot of things I would need on certain jobs.
So whilst the negative press on the EOS R is justified, it doesn't alter the fact that you can't look at any competitor for the perfect camera... it just doesn't exist.
The EOS R fills certain criteria that others don't, and in that context is has a place in the market.
Caleb, I believe your intentions are honourable. I do not believe that your trip to Hawaii has influenced your judgement, I just think its difficult to convey the merits of certain cameras to an audience who's needs and expectations are all so wildly varied.
I'm a self employed videographer, and I've resigned myself to the fact I need a lot of kit to be able to say yes to any job.
The EOS R sucks in many ways, but in certain circumstances it would be the right tool for the job. That's just the way the cookie crumbles I'm afraid.
I now only hope any future comments do not question your authenticity, and rather consider the above and how your viewpoint fits into it.
I left Canon about 4 years ago and I have yet to regret it. This latest lame offering from Canon is further proof that I made the right choice.
I left Canon after the XC10 release. I waited for their answer to Panasonic, and that was it. I am a hybrid shooter with about 50/50 photo and video in 4K. Also, I bike with backpack a lot and wanted to cut down on weight. I have not regretted my decision at all. Wife loves wearing Canon bling, so she lugs it around...
11:30, you mean the 1400$ Fujifilm x-t3 That has a great apsc line up of lenses
No, people are right about the EOS R.
You are making exsuses.
fanboy alert. I've got the A7 he compares it to... it blows the EOS R out of the water
@@10bighikes58 IKR
Yep... That is the problem with fanboys, they make dumb excuses for crap products but you know he wants to keep getting those canon invites.
Zero credibility on this channel
Activate Halo exsuses
this camera is not making me switch back to Canon... just makes me glad i sold my canon gear & went to the camera company that is streets ahead of the rest & actually cares about its customers
Canon blew it. Lost the market, in less than a year from today Sony will public their next gen A6500, A7S III, and other companies are ahead of it. Canon's 4K is not as sharp as other systems, looks like HD before compression / upload to youtube. The fact is.... $2,400 for a crippled FF canon camera, or $2,000 for Sony A7III .... well, as a Canon user for ~20 years, bye bye canon.
less than a year? less than 2 weeks lol
haha.... hope you're right.
Blew what? How is the 4K less sharp than other companies? I seriously doubt the 480Mbs 4K video of the EOS R is less sharp than the 100Mbs 4k of Sony. Sony is throwing away 4x the bits. Facts dude.
Wy Lee sony a6500 f.e uses a 6k and downscale it to 4k, that's why. also the sony use a full sensor readout. besides that, canon blew it simply because it's holding back the development.
ok so you "doubt" and you call that "facts" right? Funny dude
I totally agree with your perspective here Caleb - although it’s not that exciting it is actually the perfect b cam for c200 and c300 MKII users who want a solid gimbal cam. Also if youre invested in canon glass, like canon colour and want a small super 35 cinema cam with C-Log and decent DR this is your only option. I personally couldn’t care less about FF for video but I can see why a lot of the hybrid users are disappointed with this. Does the cam allow you to reduce all the sharpening and noise reduction to get that C-series look or does it retain the DSLR and mirrorless digital sharpening look?
The 1DX mark II has been shooting 4k for so long... why cant they just use that sensor?
That's cropped too at 1.5x
From my perspective having shot with 7D and 80D bodies mainly for video work, this is a fantastic camera. I've had two 80D's primarily because of how fantastic dual-pixel autofocus is. Seriously nothing else comes close for single shooter work were you are doing interviews and can't pull focus on two cameras. Will be upgrading to the EOS R for sure.
Don't let the haters get you down, Caleb! I love that you find the positives in these new cameras. There was a lot of hate for the 6DmkII and the M50, and over time, you slowly see people falling in love with them. Same will probably happen here for a certain audience.
I don't know how much transparency there is with Canon in this day and age. As far as the crop factor, as a 1DXII owner the crop in 4K is VERY reasonable so I know Canon has the technology. As far as IBIS their smaller point and shoot cameras (M5, M6) have IBIS so the tech is there. Canon HAVE the technology and capability. At the end of the day, if they REALLY cared about their customers and wanted to take back the market they could have easily done it but they chose not to...
Glad you added the disclaimer, otherwise people go bananas saying Canon is paying you 😂
right bro
A trip to Hawaii, meals and hospitality and a free camera for an extended period are not getting paid?
No it's not getting paid. @DSLR Video Shooter wasn't in his home town making videos for money for clients that week, and can't use the meals, hospitality to pay for his mortgage, car payments, etc... Yes he does have a free camera to use for a while on paid projects. Also, numerous industries take media, press, influencers on trips like these. It's pretty standard.
Vanguard Media and Entertainment, Inc. Why do you think they do that? Because they are nice guys?
Everhandy you should watch our live show we did today on my channel, it really makes you look ignorant when you're spreading false information.
I just bought a brand new EOS R, body only -- the price was $1599 from B&H and it included an SD card, a Rode VideoMic microphone, an LED lamp, a nice case, even a copy of Paintshop Pro. At that price, I think you'd agree that this is a nice camera for cinematography. especially video-blogging. I like to use it with EF lenses, so I have two image stabilization systems working together -- physical stabilization in the lens and digital stabilization in the camera.
It should be a great camera for 1500 $, but for 2300 it sucks.
$ 1500 not because the 6dmII already exists in that price, but if they should be about $ 2000 and still be somewhat expensive if we compare it with what the competition offers
X-T3 Is only $1500 and it has in body 10 bit 4k60fps 1.18 crop and 1080@120fps...
Thomas, if you are going to record in an EOS R in a crop format for $ 2300 it does not make sense, instead the xt3 for $ 1500 with its cut-off sensor has more
@@Viguileras totally agree with you. I, myself, am saving up for the X-T3. It has all the video features I wanted and more.
It's like most companies' cleaning contractors. The cleaners do as little as possible, but just enough to keep the complaints to a quiet grumble and no more. Not enough complaints to fire them for breach of contract, but only just.
Canon does the same - it provides as little as possible, but just enough to keep the complaints to a slight grumble and no more. And Canon provides just enough features to keep a sufficient number of customers to prop up their bottom line.
So far this has worked well for Canon but not so well for the consumer.
Canon introduced YET ANOTHER feature deficient product and they are losing more market for it. If this was a $700 camera I could understand this, but $2,300 puts this in competition with MASSIVELY more versatile cameras. Almost nobody in the video community who aren't receiving these for free are legit considering them.
$700! lol.. a 77D costs more than 700$
There could only ever be one 4K mode on the EOS R-and it's the one we have now. When people are talking about "full frame 4K", they are either expecting Canon to lower the quality by skipping/binning pixels (that is, not using all the pixels or clumping them together) or what they probably actually mean is "full frame 6.7K, scaled back to 4K for recording". But that is where the rubber hits the road. The EOS R with a single Digic 8 simply doesn't have the power and heat management to successfully manage that. The rolling shutter would also be significant.
It feels like you're saying "lower your expectations" while putting a positive spin on it. It's not an APS-C camera, and it's not charging APS-C prices. When the competition is giving true full frame video in the same price range, trying to reframe it that way is just strange.
And while I trust you're not being intentionally biased, and though you might not have been paid directly by Canon, the optics of an all expenses paid trip to Hawaii aren't great. I wish these camera companies would stop doing that, because it's impossible for the experience not to influence people's opinions. The same thing could've been accomplished anywhere, without all the glitz and the exotic locations.
Anyway, I look forward to your other videos on the camera.
newfoundmass the gh5 and this cost the same. This is full frame. Now what?
But you are not using full frame in 4k!!! If you throw speedbooster on GH5 you get smaller crop. And 4k60 and better slowmotion, beter video quality...
Also you would need to bring two sets of lenses for Canon R to match FOV in 4k and 1080.
@@tavarishamilton the GH5 and GH5s come with tons of professional video features that are unmatched in the price range.
@@buby024 true, and ultimately you're paying for the professional video features in the GH5 that can't be compared to any other camera on the market in the price range.
To be fair, sony did the same when the a73 came out, and nikon did the same with the z7, might not have been all the same youtube reviews, but they flew a lot of people out none the less
I actually sold my a7rii with 24-70 2.8 GM and got this camera. BEST DECISION EVER. I’m having a lot fun shooting editorial shoots with it and got the Canon 24-70 2.8 II. & dont start with that “well 4k crop, or lack IBIS” because guess what? I got a Bmpcc 4k for my serious VIDEO. I also have the Zhiyun crane 2 which is better than ibis. And lastly lack of dual cards?? Well I have had a Canon t6i, 5d mark ii, Sony a7rii, fujifilm xt-1 and NONE of them have dual cards and never ever had I had a problem. So guess what, the EOS R is the best choice on the market for me as I wanted something like the 5div but I fell in love with mirrorless after owning the Sony. I could have opted for the a7iii instead but I like Canon color science and super fast AF.
Argue with me im ready for it 😼 BTW I don’t hate Sony or Fuji because I was a user and liked both cameras. But the fact that I can use my canon lenses on the bmpcc4k is a no brainer even the batteries too. I couldn’t use my sony glass on the Blackmagic so 🤷🏻♂️ Plus all you people talking bad about the cameras when some of you take shitty photos to begin with. I’ve seen users proudly take out their 1dx II and damn their editing is horrible and I’ve met cool people shooting with the rebels and their daytime photography angles and editing is BEAUTIFUL. So stfu about the EOS R trash talk.
Caleb? Canon didn't pay you? They just wined and dined you in Hawaii. Please don't become a shill for them. I'm a 5DIV owner but I can admit this camera is disrespectful of the spirit of innovation. This is a mirrorless version of the 5DIV. When did the 5DIV come out? Where is the evolution and innovation? This camera is missing the three basic modern features: (1) cropless 4K, (2) IBIS and (3) 4k at 60p. Even Nikon Z6/Z7 checks off two of the boxes. No excuses for this.
The Sublime Quest Everything he mentioned in the video now what?
Please don't insult Caleb. In the real world, lots of people conduct themselves with honor and integrity. I believe Caleb is one of them. No, Canon didn't pay him. They invited him to an early view/use event (just like almost every other major camera maker does with almost every other major camera reviewer). If Caleb didn't attend their event he'd have to wait to actually purchase the camera to be able to give any real-world in-hand commentary about it. And you know what you'd do in that case? You'd go watch the video of somebody else who did attend the event to get the early word on the camera.
Was the travel and hotel paid for by Canon? If so Canon paid him.
6 weeks 30Mp Camera rentless is the Payment
This review did not paint canon in a glowing light. It seemed fair. No talk about Canon color and matching with other cameras?
Many people have commented negatively to your video Caleb, but I would like to thank you! Every user needs to weigh the features most important to them. I have an a7Sii and have struggled with it for my style of vlogging. I feel Sony has compromised to get specs... like putting a corvette engine in a chevette. I wish the R had 120 in 1080, but the overall strength of the package is appealing to anyone who holds the camera out in front of them jumping in and out of a tractor trailer. Thank you!
No IBIS is a deal breaker for me. I love having it on my GH5.
And the GH5 is the best IBIS camera of all!
amen to that
You weren’t getting it anyway!!! Nerds!!!
I'm a Canon user and I experience most of the points you mentioned in terms of new release expectations. Maybe R made for Canon and it's not full-frame 4K video or has no IBIS. But people still run for Canon :) And this is a fact. It doesn't mean it's a bad thing but a smart thing. For me when I want to buy a DSLR it took me a long time in the beginning until I got my first canon body. I went through all known brands but what made Canon is a winner is 1- They give you what you want not everything. 2- as a camera body is so successful in terms of design and volume. 3- Usability of the system and how to process your images and video, which I think personally is one of the best features, to let you return to Canon. In the end, I know that Sony does the best video camera and photography, and Panasonic is the leading brand in the video too, but still, I need to stick to Canon because it gives me all I need with the fun factor and without the complexity in other systems. In the end, this is my personal suggestion.
You know, I said that about the specs on the M50. Canon is smart to target a niche and not battle for sony users. They made a great camera for vlogging. 6D 2 users will really consider this one. I might go with the X-T3 though. That would be a great camera to complement my M50. I don't need a full frame. Great video Caleb.
What's next, Medium Format Vlogging? Sorry, I see _nothing_ in 99.99999999% of all vlogging videos that warrants 4k or full-frame. Honestly, Full-frame is a handicap as the depth of field becomes so narrow it annoyingly switches between face and other objects all the time. APS-c is a good balance for vlogging - sufficient depth of field, and excellent noise ratio + much lighter than full frame so can be hand held. Making a full frame camera aimed at vlogging is just a really wasteful thing to do.
@@mdkooter absolutely agree as I said I don't need 4k or full frame. But that doesn't mean that there are not tons of people that want 4k and full frame for vlogging, ie A7iii vloggers, that is the video people they are targeting, but this is mainly a photo camera. I would prefer a M50 over a Eos R for what I do. And I would rather have a X-T3 over a Eos R as an upgrade.
You really hate IBIS don't you. If you care to video-blog, you need IBIS, you really really need IBIS, unless you love your Tripod.
@@charbax I do not know whether I hate IBIS or not I have never used it. I have no doubt that is is helpful like auto focus. I know that I do care to vlog and think I do a decent job at it without in body image stabilization. Also I know that there were very successful vloggers before we had IBIS, Casey neistat, Peter McKinnon, the latter not using it though it was around. Every tool has its place.
I think alot of people also see a camera like this as a damn camcorder first. Tips me to bits when people buy a 1d or something then winge and moan about the video!
For me this would could be a nice little camera for my needs. As I like to do lots of multiday hikes and carrying the 1d with supporting gear lenses gets a bit overwhelming at times!
I honestly will never understand why you get so many dislikes for absolutely no reason. You hit the nail on the head with this one in every way.
Really had better hopes for the Canon! Time to wait for Sony a7s III
still waiting...
Lets pretend for a moment that this camera was made as a photo camera first......talk about changing perspective.
gh5s has 60fps 4k
Andrei Pich now what?
but sucks at taking pictures.
he forgot to add this to the advantages
Tavaris Hamilton Now, how about we start taking English language classes so you can participate in conversations online with people!
Crop for 4k is not so bad. You can use small lenses because EF-S is supported. You do not need lenses with a mega resolution to shoot in 4k. Small lenses with EF-S mounts such as 24mm 2.8 STM, 10-18 STM, 50mm STM make this camera something you can hide in your pocket. The camera with these lenses is light and compact, it can be easily put on the gimbal. He does not tire his hands during long hours of filming. Larger DOF means that there is no effect of pumping autofocus when filming moving objects.
If I had to choose from the 3 new camera's recently released, I would go for the Fuji X-T3 (for photo work) as I really like their film simulation. I wouldn't sell my A7iii though as the only disadvantage of the X-T3 is that it's not a FF sensor. For video I would choose none of the 3 and wait till the A7S3 comes out (or the FF Panasonic) before making a decision. But as I'm not a millionaire, I'll stick to my A7iii and a6300 for the foreseable future. What I find positive on the new Canon R line (despite the price) is the new lens design with control ring as well as the adapter with changeable ND.
"We 'll be a lot happier if it were a cropped -sensor camera" Spot on, Caleb! Canon crippled their M series by putting in mono mic ports. Please do a test with a y-cable or mixer to see if the EOS R allows split audio recording into L-R channels. Then I will consider the EOS R as an 80D with an EVF.
Dude,stop making excuses for these companies pathetic attempt at mirrorless. You are losing respect from many here. Smh
He's not making excuses, he stating facts. This is one of the most unbiased and best video review channels I have run across.
@@mauibuilder1239 facts are subjective from person to person. Spmeone will say one thing and that might even be a fact.
This video is not fact based nor did he say it was. It had facts mixed with speculation, and personal observations. Theres no way he knows Cannons exact reasoning or motivations. Facts are the specs of the camera, speculation and personal feelings is everything else.
Go home
OrganicFarmer What’s with people in this “facts don’t matter” era? I guarantee you that Canon’s stated c-raw burst rate of just over 2 frames per second is both a fact and a reality.
Rent or buy an EOS R, and if you can shoot Canon’s special raw format photos with autofocus/AE at three frames per second or faster, I’ll buy you that paperweight of a camera. Why do people stand up for blatant liars? Where’s morality gone? It should belong to one brand any more than it should one political party. I’ll buy the best camera at the bet price the same way I will vote for the politician who is not constantly lying and deceiving. Give up your loyalty to liars and cheaters. Loyalty should be earned and maintained when it comes to everything. This is not a conservative or liberal idea.
I think you completely nailed it on the EOS R being "made for Canon". Like Nikon's Z, Canon needed to stop Canon users from experimenting with mirrorless with Sony A7s, and often enough, not coming back. If you have a big investment in Canon glass, you can get your mirrorless jones and still get full functionality from your EF or even EF-S lenses. But for video, with that crop, you're practically a GH4/GH5 anyway. So forget Sony, but if that's what you want, why not buy a Panasonic and get in-body 10-bit?
I should probably give you the same warning I have given others who attend these events. Let me know if you want to discuss offline.
It sounds like one of those debate whether a glass is half empty/half full. Here is the reason why people should not invest in Canon equipment if they haven't already heavily invested in the Canon glasses. People been saying spec sheet do not carry weight. However, spec sheet does carry weight. When they 1st released the 5D IV, the retail price was at $3500 with crop 4K, mjpeg, no C-log (extra $100), basic CF and SD cards, and no flip screen. Only two years later, their newest EOS R retail priced at $2300, still has crop 4K, mp4 with C-log (no extra $100 charge), fully articulated flip screen, and faster memory card for $1000 less. One must wonder how could Canon justify $3500 for the 5D IV with less features.
Did I forget to mention the 6d II? Retail price at over $2000 with DR performance worse than 6D. Anyhow, both 5D IV and 6D II's prices dropped drastically due to the release of the EOS R.
In regards to the argument about using current EF lenses with Canon adapter, this is not a good option. Most current EF lenses were designed with a 20ish MP sensor in mind. Although you can still take photos with a 30/50MP sensor, they lack the resolving power per DXO sharpness test results. The R lenses are much sharper but very expensive....This all boils down to the idea of value. For about the same price, you now have at least three others options: Sony, Nikon, Panasonic FF plus XT-3 ($1500) with better 4K functionality. From this perspective, the glass is half empty, not full.
Come back from Sony to Canon for this camera?!?! HAHAHAHAHA I wouldn't want this camera in my camera bag in 2016 and at the end of 2018 it has no place in ANY bag. Seriously would you pull this camera out if you own a GH5 or a Sony A7 III? Why?
😂😂😂 Hahahaha! I enjoyed this comment Soo much!
I have it in my bag and I love it. The guy behind is way more important than what you're shooting with.
I actually sold my a7rii with 24-70 2.8 GM and got this camera. BEST DECISION EVER. I’m having a lot fun shooting editorial shoots with it and got the Canon 24-70 2.8 II. & dont start with that “well 4k crop, or lack IBIS” because guess what? I got a Bmpcc 4k for my serious VIDEO. I also have the Zhiyun crane 2. And lastly lack of dual cards?? Well I have had a Canon t6i, 5d mark ii, Sony a7rii, fujifilm xt-1 and NONE of them have dual cards and never ever had I had a problem. So guess what, the EOS R is the best choice on the market for me. I could afford the a7iii instead but nah I like Canons color science and super fast AF.
Argue with me im ready for it? 😼
auto focus. fully articulating screen.
Thanks for a helpful and sensible video.
I'm planning to upgrade from crop to full-frame, and was going to stick with DSRL (5D Mk IV) because it's a fairly comprehensive package. But after watching this, I'm thinking: why not go for the EOS R instead? (1) It has a better sensor. (2) Even with the adapter for my Canon lenses plus a battery grip, it's less expensive than the 5D. (3) It has a totally articulating LCD screen. (4) It has practically the same MPs for still photography. (5) It even takes the same batteries, of which I have a bunch! So what possible incentive do I have to stick with DSLR in upgrading?
Any response would be helpful. Thanks again!
People in the comments dropping specs of other cameras, complaining that this model doesn't have absolutely everything, are part of the problem. You mean Canon isn't helping you race to the bottom doing $500 promos for local business or shooting weddings for $1,500 a pop? Boo-hoo. You all are a bunch of rabid bargain shoppers who determine a camera's utility based on the spec sheet, not shooting experience, reliability, workflow, or any of the other factors actual professionals (most of Canon's customer base) care about.
No, these people in the comments don't give a rat's ass about $500 promos or $1,500 wedding shoots. For every "actual professional" out there, there are hundreds of hobbyists and amateurs shooting for their own enjoinment. That's how most of Canon's customer base actually looks like. Both in terms of sheer numbers and in the amount of revenue they generate for Canon. And absolutely, these folks' number one criterion is the amount of features they get per their hard earned dollar. Workflow, shooting experience, all of that is secondary.
Question... That Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 you're using is one of my favorite lenses on my backup camera, the 80D. Does this lens function correctly on the EOS R in 1080p without that 1.7 crop? Or it still has the same issue as if you put it on a full frame DSLR? I assume the latter but I'm hopeful that somehow that lens works...
Video title: "Why people are wrong about EOS R"
Video: tells us why people are right 😂
You hit the nail right on the head at the end in regards to the camera everybody wants that has yet to come into existence (Full frame, high data rate, full flip out/articulating screen, great AF, IBIS, and dual card slots). It will come around eventually, until then, I'm still loving my GH5.
Canon eos R is pathetic when compared to Sony's a7 mk3, so much for Canon's first goal. I'm sure this camera will push even more users to Sony.
Went to a launch event for the R here in Australia. The Canon guy didn't get an easy ride when questions were asked and at times looked quite uncomfortable. Reasons for 4K crop were if you want better buy a Cine camera. The R is not a professional camera nor is it targeted at prosumers and enthusiasts, but rather at casual users. Pushed harder overheating seemed to be a big concern and that without an inbuilt fan there could be no full frame 4K. The crop enables better picture quality as it means no pixel binning and enables the sweet spot of the lens to be used. There is no IBIS because Canon believe that they are market leaders in image stabilisation and they say lens based is best. There is only one card slot because the R is not a professional camera, but they said using SD cards would future proof it. Quite a few asked about third using third party lenses and the Canon presenter said that they won't work very well as the camera requires data that is stored in the lens to autofocus properly. When pushed really hard about this he conceded that Sigma and Tamron may be able to reverse engineer the protocols and issue a firmware update. The overall message from the presentation is Canon knows what is best for their customers and will only give them that. They sincerely believe that the R is the best MILC on the market at the moment.
For printing. Well here in Australia with the basic adapter and body only there won't be much change out of $4000 AUD which really puts the camera at a disadvantage against the Sony A7iii. In fact the Canon rep did say that the best value way for a Canon shooter to get 4K in a mirrorless camera at the moment is to buy an A7iii and a Sigma MC-11 adapter.
Paul Amyes $4000 Australian for a camera for the casual user. A casual user uses the camera in her phone. Pure marketing speak.
Francesco Nicoletti Pure marketing BS. But then Canon don't regard the 5d as a professional camera. According to the the only pro stills cameras they make are the 1d series and the only professional video cameras are the C series.
Paul Amyes who does canon think the rest of it’s cameras are for ? How many people are going to buy a high end cannon when a panasonic or olympus or sony does mote then cannon can at a cheeper price ? This new camera is a suicide note.
Canon: “The company I want to love, but I’m forced to hate.”
An apparent reason for the 1.75 crop in 4K video could be the DualPixel Sensor. For a full sensor readout 60Million Dual Pixels had to be read out, converted to 30Mio Pixels and then sampled down to 4K. That 60MP readout plus combining the dual pixels to 30MP could impose an exessive workload for the Digic 8 processor.
How is it cheap? 2300 for just the body!
I have too much invested in canon lens but am preparing to switch if canon does not not get on the ball with competing with Sony. my canon lens can work with Sony using adapters and so I use phottix juno flashes.
2 yrs later and I'm here considering buying an eos r to replace my secondary camera Sony a6500 to move back into the Canon camp with all my Canon glass and replace my main a7iii with the new r5 I think the r5 and eos r will make a great team and work well together for 2 camera shoots.
Great camera, just overpriced, let’s be honest
They aren’t bringing people back. The ones who have moved on were sick of Canon being slow to respond to their customer base. Lots of Canon users are still disappointed with them and are moving on even with this release. They keep gimping their cameras and people are sick of it. Like you said they didn’t make this camera for the consumer they made it for Canon as a stop gap. That’s not good enough. People are asking for better.
crap tech from 2014...canon is a dinosaur !
Eos r or Sony a7iii ?
Amazing!! Thank you so much for your insight! I share pretty much the same views so far.:)
Oh and wait till creators like Philip Bloom, Peter and Casey get their hands on them to make every nay sayer get back to their roots about why they started shooting video/photo in the first place. Because in the end, that's what it comes down to. What you can do on set and in the edit room will eventually be the biggest differentiator irrespective of the tools you use.
Yes, I wish it was priced better because this means their FF 4k with dual cards and IBIS could be prohibitively expensive but that's something we have to wait and see.
But hey having said that I thank each and everyone who is disappointed/happy with this launch. You guys along with the manufacturers have infused so much life into this industry!! Thanks Caleb and all you guys and girls. This is probably the best time to be a creator and/or a gear nerd too.
Congratulations to us all!😁
So Peter is going to give up his "buttery" 120p? Or start shooting in 720? I think not.
@@richbarrett Thank you for responding. But that's not what I said now did I. He doesn't just shoot slo-mo you know. Check out what Matjoez has done with his 6Dii, another camera that was hammered at launch.
Besides no one here is saying that it's going to replace someone's existing Canon cameras.
Actually one more reason for the 4K cropping might be the lack of true mechanical IBIS and the use of electronic IBIS, unless that introduces additional cropping during video.
I love some of the anti-Canon / pro Sony comments here. It makes me believe that few, if any of those folks have ever used a Canon or a Sony. So, compared to Canon, Sony cares about their customers? Is that why their releases are often called Beta releases - with specs that don't work very well, but will be fixed with the next release in two years? So, instead of having a reliable if lesser spec'd camera that is good for 4 or 5 years, you need to buy the Sony every two years to get the "fixed" version. Hmm, wonder which way cares more about the user (and their $$). Last time I looked, buying a Sony every two years costs more than buying a Canon every four.
Or the fact that Sony has the worst weather sealed body - yup, that's because they think of the user. How about the fact that Sony designed their FF line to be a crop camera , then changed their mind to take advantage of the fact that no one else was selling a consumer level mirrorless FF. So they ended up with a camera with too short a flange distance compared to the mount diameter. That is why their lenses are longer and heavier (for the most part) then their DSLR competitors. And their kit lenses (because of the short flange distance) have very poor image quality away from the image center. I suppose that was to make their users happy and not to make money.
And I'm sure they were thinking of their users when they designed what even many Sony users consider a very poor ergonomic camera. Yes, comfort, ease of use, easy to navigate menus - well, Sony must have just forgotten momentarily about their beloved users on that front.
Sure, Sony has more specs - especially on the video side than Canon. If you need them, by all means get the Sony or some other brand that serves your needs. For many users, Canon serves their needs, so why not accept that? Accept that for some photographers, Canon's color science is far superior than Sony, I suppose they made advances in color science purely for themselves and not for the users. I suppose the superior ergonomics of Canon have nothing to so with their users either. How about their superior weather sealing, reliability, and repair service? I guess it is just because of the bottom line.
Don K nailed it! OF COURSE Canon cares about their users. Saying otherwise is just plain stupid. After all they have the most user friendly cameras! Most people have no clue exactly what the specs they’re crying over truly mean. And almost no one is talking about the things this camera does better than ANY mirrorless camera on the market..Focus speed /acquisition and low light focusing are HUGE! Not to mention FV mode, real ergonomics, better weather sealing, fully articulating screen, much much better EVF than a Sony a7iii, a better lens mount than Sony (sorry but Canon and Nikon win with their mounts alone vs Sony).
This is a bit black and white. I totally accept that photographers stay with Canon. I loved my 6D for fotos, it was good enough for me, and yes, the Canon colors and the ease of use rule. But when I entered the video world, the offerings from Canon were not ok anymore. 6D has really bad video, and the Mark II is as shitty. The 1DX Mark II is great, but too big and too expensive. So I went to Sony.
The Sony ergonomics are perfect as it is. Any bigger it would be another stupid size dslr.
You for got the slow mo issue. The Panasonic kills that cannon when it come to frame rates.
poopy lol
People also forget that there could be future speed boosters for getting back the full frame sensor!
Given the comparison that gh5s is virtually the same 4K quality, but canon can auto focus like a boss and also shoot stills in full frame for the same price, yeah it’s going to be a winner.
That being said, I think they could (and would like to see them) make an even better all in one camera but I suspect it’ll be in the $3500+ range...
you explained it well. Its a APS-C video camera that doesn't exist yet in the market and it's a full frame photo camera
I'm a Canon 70D user and I agree with all your points. For me this camera system is very interesting. Yes, it's not the camera, but the system. Let's think for a moment who Canon and Nikon are: they have been the market leaders for decades. Have both sold over 250 MILLION lenses with EF and F mounts. They are changing their systems! It's huge!
Yes, the cameras aren't "great". The fact that they still consider a 2300 dollars/euros camera an "entry level" camera and putting only one SD slot is not (partially) their fault, but it's the fault of us users that buy without reasoning that at that price point is not a camera that we get for the first time, but a camera that give us value, because we value our images. Instead so many users have picked up those cameras as their first one, hence devaluing them. Canon and Nikon just see the sales, nothing less. Instead we, as a community, should try to change the market saying that at that price point cameras are bought because we value our images a lot and don't want to make a chance. The biggest fail was from Nikon Z7 camera that, at a higher price tag, still has one slot. But that's another story.
Also I'm not so mad about the crop in 4k, or at least not as much as in the 5D Mark IV, or even the complete lack of it in the 6D Mark II. That's because first of all they dropped the stupid MJPEG codec for an easier and better h.264. This leads me to corroborate my hypothesis that Canon had to rush to put some 4k capability in the Mark IV, well before they indended to do it. I believe that Canon would have brought us 4k not earlier than 2020 (an olympic year, same as in 2008 when they introduced the revolutionary 5D Mark II), if it weren't for the underdogs to release it for relatively cheap earlier than Canon, because Canon would have waited until they would introduce a cinema camera that can shoot up to 8k. All the RED, ARRI, and the biggest guys, have an 8k capable sensor for filming. Yet Canon's top of the cinema line can do only 4k. So of course they need to first seriously update that line of cameras, and then trickle down the 4k into smaller and cheaper bodies. However bodies change, lenses do not. With this we're going to the other big consideration.
If they flooded the floor with new, affordable, quality lenses for the RF mount, than all the EF lenses would have become so cheap second handed that their prices would drop also the first hand lenses. That would have happened because people, that were hanging around looking at other systems (cough cough, Sony, cough cough) would have sold their lenses to change to a Sony camera, much more compelling. Instead they made a great freaking move: releasing THREE adapters. But only is really great: the one that allows drop-in filters!!! That's a feature that is present only on the cinema line and it's huge to have it on the cheap camera body of the EOS R! With that not only users have only one filter for all the lenses, but also they can use the APS-C lenses, before impossible to use on a full-frame camera by users that would upgrade to that system. At least on the Canon side. That is also a huge selling point. Also a question that I hope you can cover on one of your videos: how does the adapter work with third party lenses, such as Sigma and Tamron?
So yeah, for the body there are obvious deal breakers: for me mostly the single slot. I was burnt once with corrupted files on a card, and if I upgrade the camera I don't want to get that chance again, at least for that price point. Perhaps at the same price point we might see an advanced APS-C with the same mount. But for what this system can do in the future, is definitely convincing for the small people like me to stick with Canon and their ecosystem of lenses and accessories (the same battery is wonderful).
Cheers from Italy.
Two things that are keeping me from staying with Canon and why I'm buying an a7iii.
1. Dual card slots (starting to shoot weddings)
2. Video crop, IBIS, 1080 120fps.
With those two main points, other benefits of the Sony a7iii include continuous silent shooting, amazing Eye AF, thumbstick for AF points, $400 cheaper. I'm going to keep my 6D and L lenses to adapt with the Sony and maybe Canon can release something down the road that checks off these deal breakers, but for now, my decision is clear.
Hi Caleb, You're totally right, Canon is doing is Canon thing once again.
The problem with your story about the EOS R is that it's a Full Frame (FF later in this comment) camera, not a APS-C or what ever other format! If you're a video shouter you may want to shoot in 4K for various reason, even you'll not edit your footage in 4K, right? So why are you going to buy a FF Camera, to shoot 4K when your resolution end up being smaller than an APS-C, almost same as M43. And unlike with APS-C or M43, you cannot use speed booster adapter to give you a similar field of view as the FF. Then you may want to do some slow mo, and again you have to step down to 720p to have 120 fps!
Ok I get it this is not a professional Camera! So why releasing this non pro body with a branch of Pro lenses? This does not make sense, until you realise that it is Canon, and anyway they will do what Canon does best (after good glass): protect they numerous products and product lines. Why having the C100 when the 5DMk4 can do more or less the same thing? Why the C200 when the 1DXMk2 can do more or less the same thing? and now you have this EOS R with a new mount, in the picture, positioned in a weird place: not competing with the other Canon product line, and some may argue that this camera is also not competing with Sony, Nikon, Panasonic... The Canon problem: A confusing product line with too many camera doing more or less the same thing but with huge price difference. So Canon created an eco system that profit mainly... Canon!
Yes the EOS R system is promising, but this first launch is far from being a home run, and really stop the bleeding. For a while now people are adapting Canon glass on everything, and the EF mount is there to stay for quite some time. Why? Because in the video industry many are using the EF mount lenses on RED, Sony, Panasonic, Fuji, Blackmagic cameras, because they are now not too expensive and very good quality. and this will continue until we start seeing adapter for RF mount to all those brand camera. So in the lenses department, Canon have nothing to worry about.
In the Camera side, this first version is already out dated, and we cannot expect Canon to do like Fuji with a firmware update adding thing they're claiming now not possible. I really not seeing this one happening any time soon. Even through this camera EOS R have some very nice features: DPAF and flip out screen, high bit rate in 4K being the primary one, the proposed frame per second: 30 fps in 4K (when the new Fuji X-T3 can do 60 in 4K in 10bit 4:2:0 internally and 4:2:2 externally), 60 fps in full HD 1080p (when you can have 120 on the 1DXMK2, or on the GH5 in 10bit 4:2:2 internally), and 120 fps in HD 720p only! All that why? While talking about Fuji, the new X-T3, is a has a better value feature / price ratio, than the EOS R, and for video shooter, you buy an APS-C sensor (super 35 ich sensor, widely used in Commercial, TV, Cinema today), but like the Canon don't have IBIS, and the body is smaller than the EOS R, but they was still able to put so much in that Camera (dual UHSII card slot, 4K60, 120 fps in 1080p, 10bits 4:2:2 externally, 10bits 4:2:0 internally, F-Log, Eterna film simulation, ...), who is now shadowing the X-H1 the flagship video centric Fuji camera.
Why Canon is not listening to they fan and users? Or to the what consumer expect? As you mentioned "at the end cannibalisms win"? I really hope that Canon release other version of this EOS R, cheaper version without this multi function touch slide button, and more Pro (and for sure more expensive) version.
Mirrorless is the future. Canon, Nikon, and everybody else know that, so why not step in when it is still time instead of doing this weird move. Other had try it before like Kodak, Polaroid to mentioned only those one in the photo industry, or Nokia, Blackberry in the smart phone industry, and many more in all industry all over the world. If you don't take the right direction, and this at the right time and fast enough, no matter your size, name and reputation, you can go down. I really hope and finger cross for that not happening to Canon!
A cheaper camera and much better "all-rounder" is the Fujifilm X-H1. A true sleeper and has most of what the EOS-R lacks, notably IBIS, film simulation modes (wow once you try them), and a wonderful lens selection.
From a pro SONY user....I think there are a considerable amount of very good ideas and innovations employed in this camera. CANON hasn't included IBIS, but has introduced what seems to be a very impressive in-camera/in-lens stabilization system. It could be that they considered the ever growing gimbal market and saw it as less of a priority. If I wanted a stable shot, I would tend to go for the traditional stabilising methods (i.e. tripod etc) or a gimbal. For a professional shot in my sphere of shooting, a handheld shot would be mostly frowned upon by the director and so IBIS is neither here nor there - your mileage/needs/opinions will of course vary. The assignable ring on the new lenses and on the adapter is FANTASTIC! Also, the filter adapter is great. SONY et al should also develop similar. There is nothing more off-putting when going out to shoot with my little A6300 (for personal video) than having to fiddle with a bloody ND filter (LOL)- especially when I am used to just flicking a switch on my FS7 or FS5. These are all great stuff and CANON certainly does seem to have the best auto-focus out there and YES, pros do use auto-focus although manual focus is the preferred method.
However, the 4K crop nonsense is just that. I understand the technical reasoning being put forward, but why go to market with something that hasn't conquered this....seems fishy to me, but I'm cynical. That aside, this crop nonsense is a real pain in the ass when you are doing a professional video shoot and want to shoot in 4K and retain the FF look to match your cine camera(s) that are doing the bulk of the shoot. Yes, it will potentially find it's way to studios and professional shoots simply due to it's size (that is a positive feature shared by all mirrorless) and form factor. So someone may be trying to match it with a C700 in the future. If it is being used in this way, then operator/director may also be using wider focal lengths and the crop could severely hamper that look. Conversely, for people who wish to film wildlife, the crop will be advantageous as you will get an increased focal length on your lenses. Could even be useful for certain journalists too - e.g., paparazzi and news.
I will be sticking with SONY for a while, for no other reasons than I don't feel a strong enough pull factor from any other manufacturer (With the exception of ARRI, but they are best rented) and I have invested in the e-mount system which covers me on lesser budget shots and/or when using cine-lenses (primes) are not convenient or practical. That is not to say that SONY cameras are perfect and a push factor to ditch them in favour of a better option does to a degree exist.
not bias at all....
GH5s does 240 fps at 1080p vs 60fps on canon
and 10 bit 4:2.2 internal vs 8 bit 4.0.0
Dual iso on gh5s and the list go on and on
GH5S probably sold less than 10% as much as the GH5, just proves that lack of IBIS made GH5S a big failure.
Its very simple if you don't like the feature set, don't buy it if you do then do. I personally will consider it since it hits most of the boxes that I am looking for and have tons of Canon glass. Many cameras out there to choose from so make a choice.
Caleb, great video! I really don't think it would matter what Canon would add to this camera. Most people on here would have a complaint. If it had no crop when shooting 4K, 2 card slots 120fps slow motion etc, you would still have people complaining.
I shoot with the original C100, XC10 and sometimes a 5DM3 using ML raw and they all work great for me. The bottom line is that I make money using all of them. And no I'm not talking about You Tube blogging where everyone is copying off of each other or where everyone is saying this or that camera is better then the other and they've never used or have any of those cameras.
With that being said, do you still have your C100 and if so, would you have anytime to compare the C100 and EOS R shooting in c-log to see how close they would match. Thanks and keep up the good work.
It’s pretty much the exact same as the M50. People shitted on the M50 for the lack of DP AF in 4K, cropped 4K, rolling shutter, no high frame rate in 1080P, no IBIS etc. Save your money and get the m50, a EF- Adapter and get some glass. You’re paying 4K for glass.
you forgot to mention that the GH5s shoots internal 10bit, while canon does not. however, the clog profile does not need that much grading and the color looks a lot better.
480 MBS at 420. It doesn’t matter if it’s a higher data rate if it isn’t 422. Look at wolfcrows video on this subject.
I bought a GH5s for video but now Im in love with all its functions. Its small pixel but with solid details. The menu and setups are the best Ive used so far, tons of info and very intuitive. Once Panasonic makes a sports full frame, Im going to ditch my 1DX go Lumix all the way.
I think another deal breaker between the Canon and GH5S would be the recording time. The GH5S has unlimted recording, while the EOSR has 30min record time like all previous DSLRs?
Your side-by-side with the GH5s was compelling and almost brought me around to thinking about the EOS R as an option for my next purchase.. I REALLY want full frame for depth.. However, the unlimited recording and dual card slots in the GH5s pushes it over the top.. I record alot of events (church services, concerts, personal stories, etc) and the 30 minute record limit on the EOS R removes it completely from consideration. GH5s is still at the top of my list. If Panasonic keeps the same options as GH5s in their rumored full-frame, it will be the clear winner!
I'm thinking about buying the R. I won't complain about the crop in 4k as it's useful in wildlife videography. For all else I'll shoot in 1080p and upscale to 4k.
So here's my thing-- Canon made a solid Rebel line replacement. I think we can all agree that it's not suitable for full time use as a pro camera for video and marginally suitable for stills. I see this as a soccer mom camera in terms of features right up until you look at the HUGE glass they released with it. Not sure why they did this.