Is Bitcoin Warfare? With Jason Lowery
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 พ.ค. 2023
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Jason Lowery is a Major in the US Space Force and author of Softwar: A Novel Theory on Power Projection and the National Strategic Significance of Bitcoin. In this interview, we discuss how he is building the case within the US Department of Defence that Bitcoin represents a new form of digital warfare that the US government needs to embrace to secure its power projection in cyberspace.
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Poor Jason put on a heroic display of patience in this conversation.
Yes, clearly, like talking to Bitcoin beginners
Agreed. Peter was a bit annoying on trivial matters while Jason explaining his thesis
Jason’s understanding of Bitcoin is on a whole other level.
@@antoniobergamasco7799 Robert Breedlove did him justice on all interviews for softwar!
Where is Jason?
Pete completely missing so many points here.
Yeah come on Pete step up be a more humble listener like Putin 😮
It was super painful to listen to. I had to stop listening after 1 hour of stupid questions about the basic concept of proof of work.
If you don‘t understand how the hashrate protects the network, you have to start from scratch, dude.
Not your best interview Pete.
That’s okay, he is asking honest questions that most people will have
For the people that are dissapointed Jason couldn't really make his points in detail, Robert Breedlove has a more complex interview series with him where they go deeper. I feel like this is great for people to get the basics, but are left with some gaps.
Definitely will do. I cant understand why Peter was so confused. He was holding Jason back from getting more into it.
Peter crapped the bed on this one…
Ta… I’ll check it out
Maybe it's my military experience, but this made WAY more sense to me than it did Peter. I appreciate Peter's patience, but I think the pacifism blocked some understanding. Instead of "War", replace with the word "Competition". The main point is the same as Michael Saylor's point when he talks about energy, which is that Bitcoin is the first time we've been able to move physical power into the digital realm.
Shout out to Jason! Jason makes perfect sense and is easy to understand IMO. I dont get why Peter was so confused. He was confusing me with his confusement. 🤯🤯 I'm so glad to have Jason explaining this to the military. Take advantage of Bitcoin's power or get left behind is SO true.
Jason Lowery is brilliant and appears to be doing profound work for humanity. God bless him.
Agreed
Peter doesn't seem to understand the abstract concept of force
Clearly. Was painful to watch at times.
@Corwin it's so frustrating how often people don't understand this when Jason speaks
There seemed to clear effort in “not getting it”. So disappointing…
I liked the interview, but I wish you were able to hit on more topics about the book and thesis. There were times where I felt Jason was about to explain something valuable but was interrupted. Cheers!
Derailed. Peter obviously does not like what Jason has to say. Conflicts with Peter's "progressive" points of view. Calling it as I see it.
I am amazed why Peter is not getting this even after Jason explained it so clearly. Peter is only seeing Bitcoin as coin (financial) and not as power.The treasury and FED are not qualified to talk about this because they are qualified to talk about money that is being printed by a government. First of all Bitpower is not just money. Even if we consider it as money, it is not printed by a government, so that is why they are not qualified to talk,.....
He’s not too bright
Jason is too smart for these two. It's painful at times. Especially towards the end with the whole twitter blocking explanation at 2:10:50. Even after Jason clearly explains why he did it, which is to prove we are being exploited homophily, Peter's response is basically "but I think it's negative because peoples feelings and stuff and you could have made more sales of the book by marketing it better on podcasts" 🤦🏽♂
I thought that was brilliant on Jason's part on the Twitter thing. I was like, "what, why?" Don't you get it Peter?
Jason takes the understanding of the brilliance of Bitcoin to whole new level. Cellular, Evolutionary, Biological and Sociological. Some people will need more time to understand it than others.
True
I love how the abstract truth Jason is trying to present with first principles goes right over their heads
Way over… they were so focused on ‘your book title offends me cuz it says war…’ that they couldn’t hear him…
It's so frustrating to see Jason try to explain something that they just cant comprehend. I appreciate them trying but holy shit this is frustrating.
He doesn't know he's leasing his bit of land. Missed that one
Could you timeline mark the moments. Curious
@@KyleRollinsMammothSolutions not Peter/Danny's best. Jason explained it several times WHY he is framing it as a projection of power. cripes
Jason’s point was very clear and the hosts ruined it by it going right over their heads.
Please do another one and let him expand on his points of view
Yo Peter THIS☝️
Hey, I suggest you watch robert breedloves 6 part series with jason. thats indeepth and fantastic
Appreciated Jason’s patience. It took me quite sometime to follow his logic. This is brilliant reframing of BTC.
Yep… took me a while to get in tune but for real he’s reframe is potent
Definitely felt you two a bit primed to be critical here in a way you aren’t always in interviews. He does not come across close-minded in this case, you two almost do! He’s articulate and I think this line of thinking is instantly a lot more useful to me as a listener and bitcoiner than a lot of the ordinal stuff, etc., and that nonsense seemed to get a fairer shake than Jason. Great interview thank you for the show
Gonna be honest it's weird how Peter and Danny agrees with Jason until he brings up human violence. Then he tries to disagree with him. Also a wall is a projection of force. Just think about the Berlin wall before it came down. If you asked people then how they felt about it, I'm sure they would describe it as force.
Exactly. If you erect a wall, you're increasing the amount of force required to gain access to your resources. Strike "your", replace with "the", because it's only yours if you can defend it.
Seems like he was virtue signaling
Some people are comforted by believing they aren't involved with power projection, Peter didn't want to accept it. I wouldn't say it's a soft mindset but it's naive.
This is perhaps 4th or 5th time I listen to Jason speaking and he's getting better at articulating his views. I think he's into something big regardless of what other people say. And it was truly painful seeing him raising the level of discussions only for Pete to bring it down. I think this needs another go with less interruptions and more open-mindedness.
I agree. Love WBDs work in general but this was painful to watch. Peter just does not get it. Did he really want to?
I was surprised at Peter's ignorance. What Jason was describing is pretty much common sense to me.
Yes I agree. I think the only reason Jason fumbled sometimes is because the questions coming from the two in the middle of his stream of thought were so off base, that Jason had to switch gears, and jump out of his point, and try to figure out "WTF are these guys asking - are they not listening to me? Ok let me try to bring it down to their level - again"
@@CorwinTH-cam Peter did not want to get it lol. I think he feels a little threatened with the military guy butting into BTC bro's territory.
hi Jason
What a great interview. People need to hear him with an open mind that bitcoin is more than just money. As he explains there are more use cases. He just happens to be a military hammer explaining to all us screwdrivers that bitcoin can be a nail as well as a screw. Thanks Peter and Jason.
Great show! I think Jason is right, Bitcoin does not only have to be money.
Blockchain voting needs proof of work, but not based on how much btc you can zap but 1 vote per citizen… let’s see when & how that happens soon
@@KyleRollinsMammothSolutions Well, 1 vote per citizen, means you will have to tie a decentralized ID to a physical person, which is be possible, but then the first thing you would need is that everyone that votes has to be properly identified and as I understand it, that is the biggest issue in the US elections at the moment. Things like mail in voting are obviously easy to manipulate or screw up.
If you would use an electronic ID to vote (like in Belgium) it would be the same thing, you don't need a blockchain for that.
An E-ID uses a secure element to create a digital certificate, which is a combination of a public key and a private key. This can be used to authenticate yourself.
In the end, the link between the digital ID and the physical person has to be established, whether you use a centralized service or decentralized service for the digital ID does not matter, the physical person will always have to be vetted by the centralized authority.
At least that is how I see it, perhaps you have insights I did not think of yet.
I see this based on Jason’s strip back to first principles
Wow, the moral highground Peter takes in this convo makes himself look bad.. dont like it
I really don't understand people's beef with him, other than a superficial reaction to words like "weapon" and his military status. Max Keiser makes accusations of 'ripping him off,' but whatever... even if there's truth to that, Jason is articulating a message that from my perspective will be good for bitcoin.
I have really enjoyed this one and I will buy the book. Peter, it is ok to be lost and ask questions, in those cases it is better to talk less and listen more, give yourself time to think.
I hope you'll bring him again. Conratulations for this episode!
Agreed. There were multiple times where he interrupted Jason's answer with another question, derailing the convo and preventing him from hearing the logical conclusion of what Jason was saying. He got more and more confused each time this happened. He should just jot down his question and ask it after the guest finishes their explanation.
Yes correct ✅
Pete, you’re too stuck on the money part. Yes Bitcoin can transfer value, so can trading a Ferrari. Both of them transfer monetary units, and also do many other things. One of them also builds the most secure information network.
💯…….
So Peters reasoning for not accepting Jason’s framework is because he can’t see how a wall is a form of power projection?!? Also because Peter believes he’s saying the same thing in a different way ? I don’t believe he’s saying the same thing at all. Jason lays out a brilliant view point here and it’s very original.
This guy is even smarter than people realize.
Jason Lowery is brilliant. Love the message AND his framing. The Twitter blocking campaigns were genius demonstrations of the principles he talked about in the book, and seeing him systemically exploit the code in a repeatable way gave me a lot more confidence he knows what he is talking about. If you want a Bitcoin advocate that appeals to most people and ruffles no feathers, we already have Saylor for that. We need someone like Lowery to orange pill a different set of people ... esp those in government.
I'm not familiar with what goes on Twitter. Can you explain what these Twitter blocking campaigns were ? Did he exploit Twitter code ?
@@ce5983 Long story short, he aggressively blocked and unblocked people in the bitcoin community just to get more to talk about him and it worked pretty well. Point was the demonstrate how simple it is to exploit or take advantage of abstract systems
To posterity, he talks about it in the last 10-15 minutes. He just blocked a bunch of people manually that engaged with certain negative posts to demonstrate it would generate a lot of buzz basically.
@@camino15 Bingo. Abstract systems, those relying on human made up rules, software, algorithms and logic are game-able. They rely on trust and human authority. Proof of Work is pure physics; energy, physical power, work. Not human trust, authority, trustless. Proof of Work anchors the abstract - information - to the forces of nature. It's a mind-blowing discovery. A gift to mankind really.
hi Jason
One additional note: This way of thinking is a leap for many, but it is the reality of how the world really works.
Feminine vs Masculine "Energy" is quantifiable, as witnessed in this episode.
This is rich and has to be listened to multiple times. Everytime you listen again you hear something new.
Repetition is of the essence
Please redo this interview… Jason deserves to get his points across… it’s okay to grab things late but I feel it robbed Jason of the chance to expound due to the lag.
Agreed! I'm going to watch Robert Breedlove's interview. I heard he didn't keep holding Jason back on basic understandings of it like Peter did.
@@PatrickN. I love this pod, a reasonable mistake and learning going foward. I am excited about Roberts, I’ll watch it today
@@PatrickN. that's correct
@@byron2099 I do too, and I don't miss many of his podcasts, but this one kind of frustrated me. Nothing against Peter, that's just who he is and this one wasn't his best in my opinion.
Watch the Breedlove interview. Peter is too dense to even scratch the surface of what Jason is talking about and the only thing that’s confusing is why Peter is always confused.
Awesome interview. I now understand him better and I'm happy he is doing what he is doing. Another conversation that would be interesting is a discussion of bitcoin and power, all forms of power including military, economic, legal, political, cultural, emotional, etc.
M. Saylor hit on a bit of that on the latest R. Breedlove WIM podcast. Enjoy.
Peter and Danny's resistance to Lowery's first principles explanation is proof that a non-proof of work consensus system is not reliable and thus the need for power projection to secure any property/right/thought. I'm sorry to say (because I've enjoyed Peter's past interviews) that Peter and Danny getting emotionally hung up on language limited the value of this conversation.
100%
Very much so. Peter's semantic hangups are frustrating in this episode.
Completely agree. Peter and Danny need to familiarize themselves with the concept of 5th generation warfare. Data, bits, 1's and 0's cause revolutions these days.
@@KyleSaxophone it felt like he was doing it to make jest of Lowery's arguments when he couldn't get him hung up.
I enjoyed the pushback and Jason's calm explanations made his thesis seem even stronger.
Genius. Much respect to Jason. Operating on logic as opposed to emotion. Props to Peter for letting him explain it, even if he still doesn't get it fully.
I bought the book. I really think Jason is spot on with the real design of bitcoin
Hey Peter, saw your comment on Twitter about people being supportive of Jason being bots but let me assure you that I'm not a bot. I enjoyed the interview and I believe Jason has a solid argument. He very clearly explains why it's crucial for the US gov to view bitcoin as power projection in cyberspace.
It was painful listening to you two struggle with the concept of the PHYSICAL cost measured in watts outside of the financial value of bitcoin that enables a new cybersecurity paradigm.. yikes.
Lol
@@WhatBitcoinDid Is this a Lowery bot making these negative comments?
Agreed, love Peter and Danny but I don't understand how they can't seem to wrap their head around this
This is possibly the best WBD ever. Maybe only second to Eric Weinstein's appearance. Jason puts forward a well laid out path to what war has possibly already evolved into. I think the ideas were a bit large for Danny and Pete to immediately get but I predict after they rewatch the show a few times they will absolutely want Jason back on to interrogate his ideas more thoroughly.
Great show by all.
Or they could just be professional and read the damn book before they interview him...
Oh come on you’re just partial to the name Eric.
Lol
I enjoy the show and have huge respect for Peter and Danny.
But both seemed to not understand simple concepts, and I hope I don't sound condescending, plus I'm also not a PHD.
The main point was to show the huge importance of Bitcoin, and not a vulnerability.
Couldn't agree more. I'm glad someone else pointed that out besides me. I cant see why they were so confused at times. And I'm NOT a PHD either. 😁😁
Jason is living the book, he did not waste a single word.
Wow, interesting interview. Awesome job keeping on your game Jason and brilliant insight about Bitcoin! Danny and Peter, both you guys seemed genuinely rattled and confused. I don't think either read Jason's book? You both appeared to resist accepting Jason's insight or afraid of it, or both. Danny sums it up when saying "I just want Bitcoin to be a peaceful thing", but maybe it isn't, time to man up boys. Peter keeps arguing with Jason and attempting to minimize his insight. Maybe it is much more than money. I'm an American and I want my military to buy as much BTC as possible. Forget the Fed and the Treasury - kid's stuff. It's time for the big league, "let's play ball", time for the DOD to get in the game here and beat the Russians and Chinese to ball.
The thesis is tested pete. This was literally a IQ test and Jason earnt another follower. What a bright young man.
Wow, Peter makes me feel so smart. Jason, keep going man. Amazing patience.
Absolutely brilliantly interview!! It really clicked for me 3/4 of the way through. I was finding a little frustrating why Peter wasn't getting the importance of this. It wasn't the same as he has been espousing on more local level. It addresses the powers above us that will ultimately affect the more local levels which form the backbone of the whole system.
I will be going through this again to make sure I haven't missed anything.
Thanks for hosting this intellectual surgeon on such an important aspect of Bitcoins/proof of work utility.
I think my years of delving deep into how our world systems function have helped this make more sense then those who are more recent to platos cave analogy - like our Peter!
I’ve finally got where Jason is coming from. My biggest block was thinking of Bitcoin as a currency while listening to him. It’s hardened data, of course it is, it depends on your use case for it
Patiently waiting for the R. Breedlove episode.
Wasnt there a whole JL series on his pod?
@@21MWTF ya there was, they also recently did an interview, much better than this one
It's better because Jason is allowed to expand on his ideas rather than being interrupted by midwits
This was an extraordinary interview, I loved the thinking, as abstract as it was. Jason has offered a unique perspective on the power of the Bitcoin network, a genuinely new and important news case. I'd love you to have him back. Yes, I have now bought the book!
Appreciate your courage P & D. Jason has a awesome intellect and an original position that is easily misunderstood. Look forward to you having him on the show again. Thanks to All
Sometimes you just know the truth when you hear it. This interview was fire! Changes my perspectives on Bitcoin which I fully didn't expect.
My brain in hurting - watching/listening to Jason and I'm not even done yet: LOL
Jason is referring to the implications of bitcoin outside of finance. In a world of emerging AI, it's going to very difficult for people to distinguish what's real. Bitcoin is digital truth and can be leveraged in ways to secure the stability of a nation, among other things.
Brilliant convo guys!!
Breedlove's podcast with Jason is 100x more distilled.
An excellent conversation, and a very powerful explanation of a well thought out world view; proof of work is an incredible and powerful thing and Jason makes an excellent argument!
Fantastic job Peter and Jason…and Danny! Jason’s mission is INCREDIBLY important.
Excellent interview. Jason’s ability to break down his complex thesis into easily digestible bites is phenomenal. That hammer-nail-screwdriver analogy was brilliant🤯! I've gained a much deeper understanding of the softwar thesis. Keep crushing it 👊
Cheers! John
Amazing interview! Thanks!
Awesome episode! I'm glad you guys invited him to your show, his thesis is incredibly interesting.
The cryptographic wall is the defense, the sting is 900 coins a day . Everyday.
Brilliant take.
Fantastic guest!
This was absolutely brilliant!
Best Bitcoin interview I have seen, and I have watched a lot of Bitcoin interviews 😅😂
Thank you for this amazing 2h show 🙏❤️
Awesome interview
Will check out. Thks.
Learned a lot, Jason makes a good point
I think Jason is spot on. I also love Pete and Danny, and have listened since 2018.
I learned an important lesson having been surrounded by veterans & active servicemen for decades. They fundamentally understand the distinction between knowing what war/active duty or combat means, vs the average civilian. The framing of War, vs a peaceful revolution is easier understood when you look at it through a lens of veteran/active duty that has experienced real war-time decision making, as compared to civilian with much less familiarity/knowledge-base or comfort with these notions. I see Jason's PoV as extremely necessary/important.
Thanks for sharing
Fantastic interview.
Very enjoyable show guys
enjoyed this immensely
F = MA ….. Power = w/t……Jason explains his concepts very well from a technical standpoint - it’s a matter of conceptualizing what he has to say as it does apply to btc
The core reason for a community to adopt a governance structure is to establish, enforce, and defend private property rights. Bitcoin can do it better - but the only property it can affect is bitcoin -- and to participate, you have to grant all other participants the same property rights.
This was brilliant 👏
Thanks for doing what you do, Jason
That was awesome. Thank you for this. A great thinker talking about a brilliant theory.
Came back here after the junseth episode. I watched this and absolutely loved it. I could care less about about his Twitter campaign. Keep up the great work.
Pete, I love you, and watch so many hours of your content, but you really BLEW IT with this interview. I can’t believe you got a true Bitcoiner from inside the Government, an insider! who is selling the value of Bitcoin to the highest levels of the US government, AND has unique ideas on how to do this…AND YOU WERE TOTALLY DISMISSIVE. WTF??? We need people like Jason working from the inside!
AND OMG, I can’t believe you guys treated him with such disrespect. Jason graciously told you with kindness that he loved how you invited him to a steak dinner, and you interrupted him and acted like you didn’t really mean to invite him, almost like you were embarrassed to have had dinner with him, WTF?!
You need to invite him back and kiss his ass to make up for this. (And remember, I believe you have the BEST show on TH-cam and on TV…you normally Rock!)
What an amazing conversation with so much ALPHA information
Brilliant. Way to go Jason.
I think Jason should give digital cryptography a little more credit, at least in this interview. Computer scientists sometimes speak of digital cryptography as "applying entropy to data" because that's actually what things like SHA256 are doing. A few times Jason characterizes encrypted-but-not-backed-by-PoW things (like Peter's phone) as "merely protected by logic" but they're actually protected by the 2nd law of thermodynamics: the arrow of entropy is one-directional. Someone who wants to crack that kind of cryptography is at the mercy of physics just as you are in physical security frameworks.
There are lots of people presenting their viewpoints on Bitcoin to the people in power in our country. Thank you Jason for your pragmatic insights.
Good conversation
Fantastic!!!
Always LOVE your willingness to consider new ideas and opinions with kindness.
Personally, I found this EXTREMELY helpful in deepening my love for what BTC can do to ultimately insist on personal sovereignty and I believe eventually a peaceful world for those who choose to participate.
OMG.....I soooo want to be in Miami.
Anyhow ~ another great show! BTW, I really really appreciate your boots on the ground investigative interviews~2 of which brought tears in a beautiful way. So, again..thank you for all that you are doing.
Oh, I happen to think his experiment might help wake people up to the mind control social media has on people. Idk since this is the only one I am on and I like what my algorithm does (so far).
Namaste'
So intrigued by how this guy thinks
I generally appreciate Pete’s plain spoken/ everyman approach to unpacking complex topics, but in this one he seems unprepared. The military has its own logical paradigms which, if you haven’t served or read books on the history of warfare, can seem quite foreign. I would love to hear jason run his ideas by Patraeus or one of the joint chiefs. Someone as immersed in these concepts as he is that can actually reason about his arguments. We are but humble bitcoiners over here
Thank you guys for aksing the this "man" the right questions, i did not get lost, which is really reaaaally good!!!
So refreshing people thinking from first principles
Peter’s opinions are getting in the way of running a good interview. I don’t want to know what the interviewer thinks!
Perhaps after having to sit quietly while Saylor ran through an incredible monologue, Peter felt the need to control another high profile bitcoiner. Peter doesn’t understand as much as he believes he does.
This is mind blowing.... somewhat independent of the value of bitcoin from a monetary perspective, it is a system that will be used to secure all of the most important information, and information systems in the world, potentially.
Any idea why the video pod is not available on Spotify?
What a great interview. Interesting guy with a great argument that might get the right people to listen.
Don’t be afraid of power projection. It also creates safety.
This was a great conversation. Definitely going to pick up the book. In my conversations I have always tried to seperate the big B and the little b in bitcoin. As a currency or monetary vehicle its really great, as a technology (or the network as a technology) there less out there about alternative use cases. As much as I'm excited about fixing our money, I'm also excited to see the other sides of this coin and where others find value and use cases. Good shit.
Watched the whole thing. Great of you to give Jason the platform Peter. So aside from a monetary perspective, what data is Jason talking about other than ordinals and inscriptions, which could be usefully stored and protected and transmitted on the BTC Blockchain?
Different facets of the same thing. The great paradox of life. We all see things differently from different angles. Great conversation thanks for sharing.
The best guest ever ❤🎉
Much needed perspective here, sell done Peter for having him on despite not fully connecting with what he was explaining.
Warfare is the same thing as money.
Warfare is not just “offense”. It is “defense”.
Think of Bitcoin as an incorruptible foundation network to turn the physical world into bits.
Money is just a tool. The first use case identified for the Bitcoin network. Jason is telling us that money is not the only use case. It’s not the only tool that the network enables.
Bitcoin allows an open and free network we all can engage on and build without the fear of manipulation. There is now a significant cost to try and fail to manipulate the network and be a bad actor. It is currently free.
Jason gets it. Life is a power projection. Building wealth. Building a wall. Building muscles. This is all power projection to secure your spot and reduce your risks in your life.
Honestly, I think Jason is incredibly thoughtful, direct, honest, and insightful. I can only hope more people like him end up in positions of authority to influence the right principals that our world should be founded on.
We are in a shit system and it’s tearing our world apart. The human race is becoming suicidal and it’s only going to get worse unless our foundation updates.
And yes, Jason, please make an audible version.
Thanks for the great episode! I really enjoyed and appreciate it! What Bitcoin surprised me most is that it finds its application in almost every areas. I think because it's so fundamental and first principle based, it's making all dots connecting together. I can keep listening to your discussion all day long even this is a 10 hour episode, lol. That's how much I like it.👍
Two pacifists and a soldier. Surprised there was so much confusion on this topic from Peter and Danny. I’m still trying to understand all of this but Mr. Space Force makes perfect sense.