2023 European Middleweight Naked Bike Shootout
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ธ.ค. 2023
- With the KTM 890 Duke R slated to disappear in favor of the 990 Duke, we felt it was only right to send it off with one final shootout. This time we paired it with its European rivals in the form of the Ducati Streetfighter V2, MV Agusta Brutale 800RR, and Triumph Street Triple 765RS, and rode them hard on both the street and the racetrack to see if the mighty Duke still had what it takes to go out on top before its curtain closes for good.
Don't forget to read the written shootout, too. You can find that over on Motorcycle.com, or copy/paste this link: www.motorcycle.com/bikes/shoo...
Thanks to Kershaw Knives for making this video possible. Use discount code 20Motorcycle23 for 20% off at kershaw.kaiusa.com/ plus free shipping on orders over $50 until December 31st.
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I agree - the Streetfighter should not have been included in this round-up. You should have chosen the Monster instead. Otherwise - great content - as usual 🙂
They did include it in the 900ishcc shootout. Older review though.
The Monster does not stack up to the other bikes, even in SP trim. The other bikes have IMU's and more power plus theyre marketed for racing.
@@nestothepesto5178 Whether the Monster does or doesn't stack up - only including it in the test would answer....
As for power - as the test was carried out on the road - the difference should have been negligible, especially with Monster's extra capacity and torque (by the same token you could say the Streetfighter does not fit here as well, because it has too much power compared to the others).
As for IMU - I am happy to be corrected, but if a bike has the lean-sensitive ABS and anti-wheelie - both of which the Monster does have - it must have an IMU?
As for 'sportiness' of the Monster - you need to watch the track part of the review of the SP by Visordown Motorcycle Videos here on YT.
And yes - I am a fan of the Monster, but do not own one.
Monster is way too "soft" to be included to begin with.
Despite having biggest horsepower, SF still comes 3rd in a racetrack due to weight. Triumph/KTM have less power, but less weight too.
Agreed! Not even in the ballpark
FYI, with the 890 duke the pillion seat and hangers come in a box with the bike. It's quite comfy, too, so my wife says.
I own a 2023 KTM 890 Duke R and I had similar problem with the quickshifter. On my bike the chain was set too tight in the factory. I adjusted the chain according to the owner’s manual and the quickshifter works smoothly now.
I've had a street triple and now own a streetfighter v2. What brings a smile to my face every time I ride it....the streetfighter v2. Love it✌🏽💯
Slower round a track tho. But a great bike
Long live the 890 Duke R. One of the world’s best bikes ever. More than a masterpiece from Mattighofen! 🧡🧡🧡
That's fine don't be so disheartened 990 is much better ..
So ugly though, impressive performance
@@throttlehungry4821how do you know that?
@@chriswest2290 ridden both.
Personally own a 2024 Triumph street tiiple 765 RS in Cosmic Yellow and it's admittedly my second Triumph bike, my first was a 2013 Carribean blue Street Triple ABS named Dory. I am a die hard Triumph fanboy at this point, over 5000 miles and counting on the new bike!!
This was a poor attempt for KTM sales. Put the Triumph in track mode and dial in the suspension, make it a totally different bike. I put a rapid bike fuel tuner, full spark exhaust, d n a air filter, steering damper, and dialed in the suspension. I’m debating on dropping-2 in the rear because gearing is so tall. Lithium battery and the removal of heavy bits had mine under 400lbs wet.
Do you like the 24 or 13 better? Is there enough of a difference to step up? I have a 14 but I like the styling better and the Cosmic Green is awesome.
@@cs1375 you've got the 675 bro. this is a totally different machine. I've got the 18 plate RS and there is no comparison. different engine AND they are all ride by wire.
@ridepastu1418 could this also not be done to the 890r ?
I feel asleep on it and had to sell
It 😂
I think I'd trust the reliability and service costs of the Triumph more too !
It is better. I have had a Ducati scrambler as well although it's not as unreliable as people make it seem but once something goes wrong the service cost is gonna make you not want the bike anymore. So I sold off Ducati even tho it was a really good bike. Rn I have a MT-07 and a street triple.
Upshifts and downshifts sounds the best on quickshifter MV
2024 STR RS with full system exhaust and ecu remap is best in middleweight
My 2023 765 was dead on delivery- dumping oil through the case/oil cooler at 50 miles.
Other new 765 on the floor, was pi$$ing fluid from both fork seals.
@@briand1060I will say this is more a local dealer issue on your end than a Triumph issue. Triumph and the other brands design the bikes but then a lot happens from factory, to freight to finally dealership and show room prep.
EVERY dealership should be checking torque specs and other common areas during unboxing and floor prep but some don't. This is a VERY common red flag for Italian dealerships specifically that sell Moto Guzzi and MV's that are still primarily hand built and have the engine components worked on by no more than a few technicians at most. If you go to a Guzzi or MV specialized dealer the bikes will often be rock solid versus an Italian halo store that likely primarily sells Ducati or Aprilia those MV and Guzzi may not have been given the proper arrival go over and start spurting fluids shortly after purchase. The manufacturers provide the set-up instructions so it's not their fault when dealers fully ignore or rush through them.
The Triumph is an absolute swiss knife. Commuting, weekend trips, track hunting- it does all and the user friendliness of the Street Triple is something that cannot be disagreed upon. Want a KTM to go track only- then why buy a naked in the first place that would be shoving all the wind into you. Also KTMs have that rough fueling characteristic at the bottom end which translates into a stuttering take off and gets more irritating while riding at low speeds. Meanwhile the wail of an inline three is so satisfying and with an aftermarket can- even better. I'd pick the Triumph anyday.
The Trident Street Triples are absolute bargains - especially the 765R at $9,995. I'm completely biased though - I absolutely love mine.
Trident is not a 765.
@@freebehindbars8654 I meant to say: Triumph Street Triples. Fixed it.
2022 890R here and it performs unbelievably in every situation especially extremely tight twisties. I can't say enough good things about it.
Wonder where you like to ride it? You have a local favorite road?
😎❤️
@Porsche996driver a little far from you. I'm on the east coast NJ and NY riding areas.
How many miles does it have and have you had any issues with it?
@@jayrock497 it's still a baby at 4,700 miles. Got it as a leftover April. Noticed some oil moisture around the half moons of the valve cover gasket just recently. Probably could have been prevented if some sealer was used in the corners. Hope this helps
As someone looking to upgrade next year from my current naked to a new middleweight this video came at a pretty good time. I was torn between the Street Triple RS and an 890R but seeing the new 990 - and how hideous it is even as a current KTM Duke owner - and knowing the 890R likely won't be an option the Triumph will be my next bike. Which is great since I was leaning in that direction anyway.
As an RS owner myself definitely sit on the new and the previous model and compare if you can.
I found the newer model, while better in almost every way on paper, feels A LOT more cheap and plasticy while the 2018-22 model just feels much higher quality with the proper metal tank versus plastic and having the touch of carbon on the factory exhaust.
I own a 21 but if I could do it again I'd get a 2020, didn't realize how much of a pain Euro5 updates makes things for light modifications especially the exhaust.
I got mine for an absolute steal of $10.5 when dealerships started taking preorders on the new model and I have seen 2020's for around $9.5 in my local area.
Also if you do go Triumph look into Leiker exhausts they are *chefs kiss*
Larger fuel ⛽ tank on your model also , so big advantage 😊
Fair review - good job breaking things out a bit. Yeah the Triumph has a supple ride that’s bearable. Sounds like that KTM tester suffered some abuse lol. Enjoyed your discussion! ✊🏽✨
The KTM comes set up with the solo seat from the factory but the ear seat and pegs are included with the bike, no need to buy separate.
Thanks again for having me out for this one!
Nice camerawork!
Damn. I miss my KTM. I had to sell it to get a car after my wedding so my wife could drive as well. But next goal is to work and save for a KTM! This is not a bike it’s an emotion ❤ I’d give anything to get my KTM back.
Is it really better than a duc?
@@ForgotToMentionThatI'd rather own a slower duc than a faster ktm
@@radicalkonrad765I'd rather own a reliable Japanese bike than a slower duc.
@@lovelessissimo then you're stuck with boring, only good jap middleweight is the mt09
Advice for me as married man for 10 years. Never married a woman who made us difficult just own a motorcycle. If she really love me, dont bother what i love.
great job guys love the video❤
im looking at the cheaper end of the scale so ktm triumph mt09sp but would love if you put in a wild card like a gsxs1000 same $ just to see where it sits 👊 keep up the great work.
I believe the KTM is an amazing machine however I think me I would also settle for an all rounder like the triumph
But I’ve always loved KTM so I guess it’s tough one😂
Thanks guys
It seems totally undeniable that the 890 is a fast, fun, phenomenal and versatile bike, however... ...no matter how hard I have tried to get over its looks - particularly the headlights - I haven't been able accept it 😔 And the new 990/1390 headlights look even more ridiculous...
Perhaps a good alternative for me is the Monster SP?
Another awesome comaro up there guys. Someone needs to get onto Hinckley and get them to sort the tft format out on the 765RS. They should have stuck with the layout from the MY17-19
Truly, the only screen set-up I find semi-useable is the butterfly wing variation. Curious which mode the boys had it set to.
These comparisons are great to watch
Thanks for the video. Nice company of bikes, engaging reviews , sound could a bit better (sounds a bit mono and distant, at times).
I would prefer a sportier MT09 SP but from this bunch, probably the Triumph , as an all rounder like Tom said.
Tom is missed. Cuts straight to point then elaborates when needed. Hopefully returns for future big comparisons.
Thought you were talking about John at first. He would have been talking the whole time about how the Kawasaki was missing from the Euro shootout and how it was the best bike for the money lol
Hoping this means we'll get a sub 800cc middle weight comparison also. Lots of changes in that category though lack of a US Hornet is tragic.
the Triumph IS a sub 800 ffs 🤦🏻♂️
Love this video but the audio could use a little work. The vocals are sometimes heavily panned towards the right channel, and the volume levels overall are really inconsistent. Great video though!
The best review
The "and I work here" says all I need to hear
An advert for flick knives!!! Very nice 😂
Enjoyed your review with only one suggestion. A good on bike sound bite to verify your suggested ride sensations. I used to have a Speed Triple 955i and still wouldn't be ashamed to ride a Triumph triple again.
Brutale 800rr and Duke 890rr✊🔥🔥
All great bikes, but i love my KTM 890R.
I love the triumph and like the fact it stays close to the 750cc mark unlike a 950 which is totally not a middle weight size and the V2 isn't really apart of this segment
I bought the 765RS the second they rolled it off the truck in 2017. Prior to that I was buying a naked or sporty bike and trading it out every time something new and shiny got hyped up by moto journalists. I have not had the desire for a new sport bike in 6 years. Lots of bikes I would love to demo or track day, or add to my stable if i had the money and space to waste. However I cannot imagine getting rid of the STRS, especially the Euro 4 model that has a true 120hp at the rear wheel and screams to redline like a SS.
@@MechAdv I have a 22 and absolutely love it more than any bike I've ridden, I prefer it over the 23s despite the power upgrade because they got rid of the classic metal tank.......I also wrecked it 3 months ago 😂
It is a middleweight bike
@juicy9592 it's a little more than a middleweight
@@radicalkonrad765 not anymore it isnt. This is a middleweigt bike for todays standard
Duc 🔥🔥🔥
The Triumph is the best all around bike, the KTM is phenomenal, the Ducati is great and the grumble is awesome. The MV has the greatest experience but you’d have to let it sit on a dealer floor for 2 years before you could buy it. I’d take the Triumph now then the MV in 2 years lol.
The only problem with KTM for me is the reliability. Idk how good the 890 is but i've heard scary stories about the 790 on the forums.
Only tried two of these bikes, but when it's close, there's one basic differnece. The Triumph is one of the most beautiful bikes in the world.
Ill take the Triumph. Im just not sold on the KTMs reliability.
Good comparison...mostly. The Ducati Monster 937 would probably have been a better comparison with the other three vs the Streetfighter V2.
Nope... was the right pick. The Triumph doesn't belong.
Was thinking the Monster would probably be more equally matched to the 790 Duke and the 765R, rather than the higher end of these machines. I think MO selected the right combo for the comparison.
As an aside (not European), I couldn't help but think what the '24 MT-09SP would have done in the same caparison.
@@stuartstogdill2406how does the Triumph not belong considering they said it set the second fastest lap time and was only short four thousandths of a second
@@exothermal.sprocket The MT-09 (SP or not), the Ducati Monster 937 (SP or not) BOTH belonged in this comparison.
@@stuartstogdill2406The only thing the Triumph lacked was the comparable displacement. Otherwise BHP, torque, weight, electronic suite and just overall performance, it stacked up very well next to the rest of the "competition".
I have the 890gp ....its such a punchy , thrilling , fast , easy to ride bike.
I do not need more hp for the street!!
The KTM just looks so cheap compared to the others. For me, I need a bike which I like to look at and that just won’t cut it. Say what you will but gosh that Ducati is such a piece of art!
In the UK the KTM rear footrests come in a box and should be given to you on delivery, but very often the dealer 'forgets'
Mine came with a seat as well
In EU, KTM 890 Duke R comes with pillion seat and footpegs as extra package when you buy the bike, no extra charges.
I don't know why people are so into loud obnoxious bikes. to me the Triumph is probably the nicest sounding stock bike I have ever ridden and if I bought it I would never change the pipe. the tones of that stock exhaust are so nice. and it's the perfect volume for me. I don't want to be one of those guys who can be heard coming from a half a mile away. I love the Street Triple 765 Rs but I wish it had a fairing. when I test road it I was being hammered by the wind. I would love to test ride the KTM if I ever get a chance. even though I am not into the Home Depot orange.
I always thought Ducati was the best sounding bike. Just my opinion
@@MrWhitelightning73 I can't argue that since I own a Ducati 939 Supersport. and part of the reason I bought it was I loved the sound of it.
@@photographerjonathan
I had a 1995 900 CR Super Sport
Fun bikes!
My real world pick. TRIUMPH, and then 6 monts later wish I got the KTM. Or vise versa.
All 4 are awesome bikes!!! But if its my $$ you cant go wrong either of those two.
I should also chime in for senor john burns, the ducati (despite being much more expensive) does NOT have cruise control as an option (triumph and ktm both do)
Great comparison, could you guys tell us the lap times?
🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
MV you can look at all day long like a Lambo or Ferrari. Almost as much enjoyment just looking. Its the bike you always take a second look as you walk away. That triple sound like a F1 especially at those higher rpm. MV is moving out. Pulls on my heart strings the most. Triples offer fair torque AND high rpm horsepower. The KTM more streetable rpm. MV keep in your living room.
Curious to know if they were all the same price, which one would you choose?
Bonjella !
Hoped to see an Aprilia RS660 in the mix
Tuono 660 Factory
Good point, they should have used that instead of the MV.
It's always something with a KTM...
Mv any day ❤
Streetfighter v2 isn't a middleweight, things got 150hp. Surely the 937 monster is the middleweight............
Wouldn’t the monster have been a closer match to the street triple and 890?
Price wise the SF matches up with the street triple and hp is closet 150/170.
The 890 Duke R comes stock with both the rear seat and the rear seat cover (as installed in the video). The passenger footpeg brackets come with the bike at no extra charge.
Yeah they should have picked the Monster SP instead
That Triumph face though... hard to swallow. Between KTM and Triumph, which is likely to be more reliable?
The triumph is more reliable.
By a country mile.
QS might need recalibrating on the KTM ?
I own a Red 765 RS and love it!! I think the fit and finish is much better than the KTM and the KTM is kinda ugly.
2024 Triumph Street Triple R owner. Kinda wish i got the RS
This is the kind of review where we know the answer and we all agree..
Street triple? 😂
Great review but IMO it would've made much more sense to have had the Ducati Monster SP instead of the V2, you showed just how good both the KTM and Triumph are which reflects all the major European magazines who tested the KTM, Triumph, MT-09 and Monster SP and in every test the Triumph has been first but only marginally ahead of the 890R, so it seems to be whichever of the two that does it for you and you can't lose.
"in every test"... In Great Britain, I'm sure. But not evrywhere in Europe, I tell you.
Ride the 890 Duke r in the rain loaded up with luggage and loads of water accumulates in the engine, somewhere. I still have no idea where but when you stop and it then all comes out it's genuinely alarming, I thought I'd holed my radiator the first couple of times it happened.
Where the old guy? I love his personality and perspective
MV is an experience. Period. Sounds like a fucking F1 up to reline. Exhilarating. Horrible city bike, however. Would only recommend if you need a weekend ripper. It's like riding a wild bull.
idk about seat on the newer model (2017+), but first gen of 800RR is best city bike ever.
It could be a wild bull, it could be tame as well - that's the beauty of it. Triumph could only be tame.
The mirrors on the Street Triple are backward! Haha. Need to swap them.
I own MV AGusta 800rr Pirelli edition and Super Duke 1290 Evo. The MV is a race bike for the street. Engine easy to work just like the SD. It does not need any mods, ready to go. I have owned 30 motorcycles in my old life, V2’s and triples, are awesome. V4 is similar to a triple with torque and high rpm horsepower but lacks the character of a triple as too smooth. Also V4 very complex and expensive to work on vs V2 and triples where whole engine exposed. I have owned Ducatis in the past. All bikes are great nowadays. They are all winners. Pick the one that pulls on your heart strings. TH-cam influencers can help but the best bike is the bike you decided to purchase. Middle weights are the sweet spot as plenty of horsepower for the street. The halo bike which are too expensive and too much horsepower for the street. Those full size engines are just showing off future tech that will filter down to the other bikes later.
All bikes are reliable cuz of electronics and water cooling for long life. Many have long service intervals almost like a car. Most cars 1 year check or 12,000 mile oil change. Ducati 9000 mile check ups. Hondas still 4000 mile check ups
I picked 765 moto2.
I got the Z900 RS cafe over the Street Triple and it’s the best decisions I made! The Duke felt cheap. Too much plastic on it for me.
Damn, 20% off a Kershaw knife. That shit is still too damn expensive 😅
890 Duke R gets delivered to the dealer with both that rear cowl and passenger seat/pegs... You don't have to buy, just install.
Reckon 80% of people would say the monster is a natural competitor to the Duke.
Putting in the streetfighter is just weird.
Where's the Tuono 660 factory?
It's on the lower-end of the scale performance wise. Wouldnt be a fair comparison
Y'all riding the 890 for a very long time, i just have one question...is it reliable..??????
That extreme stereo sound (with flipped channels) is really hard to listen to.
Got a 2023 duke 890r for $10k otd!!! Get one before theyre gone
"Your inputs are valid"
That's what she said...
What happened to Burns? I miss his perspective.
my 890 transmission sucks too
@15:55 not mounted stock, but come with the bike.
I've rode 3 of them. V2, street and Brutale.
Honeslty the best is the MV imo.
The v2 feeling with the front feels weird to me, dislike the genre changing and this v2 want to go in high revs wich is also weird. . + it get really hot.
The street is good but lack too much torque... smallest one of the category.. no need to say more.
The MV is really nice.. engine, gear, brakes etc
But has huge issues... unreliable, poor aids and lack a bit of torque as well.
On this segment best bikes are for sure new Mt09 and duke 990.
❤❤❤❤I love you
Agree with TOM, Ducati Streetfighter are not naked bikes more like semi naked. I love seeing the whole engine like a Ferrari or Lambo. One reason I bought a KTM 1290 evo over streetfighter V4. Ducati hides that V4 or V2.
Imo Ducati (like other Italian brands) excel in the design department. They chose to add additional fairing and Aero because of how sexy the bikes look- KTM is not known or well regarded for its design lol
should have mirrored the sound from the static discussion camera. sterio imaging is great but shoud have been mirrored.
Idk how you managed to put a 150+ bhp bike as Streetfighter v2, instead of going for monster or something so that it is more comparable to the rest of them.
Where is Mr Burns?
KTM is a jewel!
Not much about these bikes could be described as middleweight. The displacement creep the past few years has been crazy. The Street Triple always used to be the "big" bike in the middleweight category and yet here it's the smallest by a bit. Manufacturers are gonna find themselves in the same place as the previous 750 class, anyone who can afford the big bike won't buy these and anyone who wants a smaller or "beginner" bike wont buy them either.
Agusta wins. ❤
Why not the Monster?!?
Duke 890 feels to small , Streetfighter feels bigger and a lot faster✊🔥🔥
It’s pretty sad that KTM stopped selling the bike that is widely considered to be the best naked sports bike on the market. That 990 has some big shoes to step into.
Every duke always wins in the fun factor
@@Box-ride-repeat Yeah but the 890 R was a perfect balance between power, torque, weight and handling. Hopefully the 990 will be the same. I’m relatively new to motorcycling with a couple of years experience. I’m riding a duke 390 right now and I used to have a LAMS MT07 (power limited version of the MT07 for the Australia/New Zealand market). I’m currently shopping for my next bike and currently the 790/890 was at the top of my list. So far it doesn’t look like the “new” 790 is coming to New Zealand so there’s a big jump from the 390 to the 990 and I think it might be too much bike for me. I could buy a second hand 790 from the first batch or otherwise I’ll have to shop around for a different brand because I think the 990 is more bike than I want/need.
Streetfighter is beautifull, but impossible for short riders :S
You've added Ducati V2 with engine displacemtn - 955 cc...why not bmw s1000r at this point?
Because the S1000R is the SFV4’s competitor. Blame Ducati for categorizing their V2 as a “middleweight”. It would have made sense for them to have the Monster SP instead, but this still fits.
@@spktylrs1000r does not compare to Ducati v4, the m1000r does. S1000r and Ducati v2 are both 20k ish bikes and make similar power numbers, So they are very comparable.
KTM is good WHEN it’s working 😂
I'd probably take an XSR900 before any of these bikes.
Sad to see no timestamps 😏
where is the Mickey Mouse hat !!???
These are all naked street bikes, so they all should be evaluated by their performance on the street, not on the track. If a model also does well on the track should only be secondary or shouldn't really matter
KTM is far superior to my Ducati 1100 EVO monster (which was not tested). The monster is more the competition tham the Ducasti in this test. Just brought a Duke 890. The low weight is a good thing.
Real level of credibility here when the article doesn't even align with the video, altering the entire outcome of the winner of the test.
Video Winner: Triumph
Article Winner: KTM
"In fact, in the time between filming our video above, where Tom (narrowly) picked the Triumph and filling out his scorecard, he actually flipped sides and declared the KTM his choice according to the scores."