so basically I try doing this against Luigi. When I dair into shine, Luigi gets pushed back out of range everytime after the dair and he grabs me regardless of when I shine. Any help on this?
+templetonbob Either, 1. You're mis-spacing your dair. This really shouldn't happen unless he's lightshielding (in which case he has extra shield stun and shouldn't be able to grab you). Either be more accurate if you have dash momentum or move forward during your short hop to get closer. 2. You're doing an early dair. This is probably what's happening to you. Do it later and closer to him and you should be fine. 3. If he does get pushed back, don't shine if it's not going to hit. Use jab or dtilt or ftilt or dash backwards out of his grab range then punish the grab or something
Yeah so basically If I drop straight down from above him I can never land the shine after the dair no matter how late it is. I have to have momentum from the side like you said. It's not a problem with other characters, but Luigi tends to get pushed more.
What I don't understand is. If shield grabs are considered really bad in this age of smash because people shield pressure so well , and shine out of shields are based on the same timings as shield grabs as Kira stated in this video. Then why do people still shine out of shield? Can't they still get punished for shine oos if they execute proper shield pressure?
Is there any way to practice this shield pressure against a computer in 20XX with him trying to shield grab you? I thought I had my shield pressure down as I've watched this before, but I kept getting shield grabbed and shined out of shield yesterday at a local. I don't know how to change up my practice to prevent it from happening next time.
Same point of attacking anyone's shield. It reduces their options and increases the chance of hitting them. Sure you can guess grab but grabs are easily avoided in many ways, this covers more things they can do to get away
You said I have to do the aerial a lot later in order to not get shield grab, but can't they just grab me while I'm in the air, waiting to do my late aerial?
TSS Studios Falcos shine causes 4 frames of hitlag on shield, and he can only shine again on frame 9. Since the hit box for shine comes out frame 1, you have 4 frames to act OoS. So you can just grab it, or maybe roll away if you're fast enough. Grab takes three frames I think so you're gonna have to be quick. As for other OoS options, any hit box that comes out in 1-4 frames should work
Dair is -2 on sheild. Nair is 0. Not just less landing, more shield stun.
This videos are fantastic!!!! PLEASE KEEP MAKING THESE!!!
hey! thanks for this great, great tutorial! really nice to see beginner-friendly content about ma birdman Falco
These videos are still so helpful. It'd be so cool if you guys came back! Who else will teach me how to smash turn pivot jump?
Thanks Kira! Been struggling with this.
just referred this video to a friend asking about falco aerials on shield, then heard this gem
"all grabs are the same speed"....
have you met zelda?
he addresses this literally like 5 seconds later
great video. if you're still doing these, how about a tutorial on shine bair with falco and fox?
Mario Neutral Game Tutorial would be great !
Awesome video, thanks for the tutorials!
I like these on my newsfeed, great videos
Legitimate question, does bowser's up-b beat this kind of pressure (in the same way as samus up-b)? I heard bowser's up-b also comes out on frame 1
so basically I try doing this against Luigi. When I dair into shine, Luigi gets pushed back out of range everytime after the dair and he grabs me regardless of when I shine. Any help on this?
+templetonbob Either,
1. You're mis-spacing your dair. This really shouldn't happen unless he's lightshielding (in which case he has extra shield stun and shouldn't be able to grab you). Either be more accurate if you have dash momentum or move forward during your short hop to get closer.
2. You're doing an early dair. This is probably what's happening to you. Do it later and closer to him and you should be fine.
3. If he does get pushed back, don't shine if it's not going to hit. Use jab or dtilt or ftilt or dash backwards out of his grab range then punish the grab or something
Yeah so basically If I drop straight down from above him I can never land the shine after the dair no matter how late it is. I have to have momentum from the side like you said. It's not a problem with other characters, but Luigi tends to get pushed more.
Thoughts on nair --> shine grab?
1:38 Is anyone surprised?
Doc up b cancel is a good option against this? ...
Sweet tutorial. Helped me learn some things :-)
if i fade away with dair, will i still get punished for the landing lag, or am i safe bc of the fade away
What I don't understand is. If shield grabs are considered really bad in this age of smash because people shield pressure so well , and shine out of shields are based on the same timings as shield grabs as Kira stated in this video. Then why do people still shine out of shield? Can't they still get punished for shine oos if they execute proper shield pressure?
+Justin Wong Shine oos comes out faster than grab, has less lag, and can sometimes lead to a better punish
Oh i see. Thanks !!
is falcos dair/nair-shine at very low% a true combo? cuz when ever i dair/nair someone they get there shield up
+Koosh Kurtis it is a true combo if you do it correctly
@ssbmtutorials can fox shine oos the fade away nair?
no its out of range before shield stun ends
Is there any way to practice this shield pressure against a computer in 20XX with him trying to shield grab you? I thought I had my shield pressure down as I've watched this before, but I kept getting shield grabbed and shined out of shield yesterday at a local. I don't know how to change up my practice to prevent it from happening next time.
+335841 There is, check out our 20XX guide on our channel!
+SSBM Tutorials Ah, I never caught that video. That's awesome, thanks for the speedy reply!
So what's the point of this? To reduce their shield? Otherwise you're just attacking a shield, aren't you?
Same point of attacking anyone's shield. It reduces their options and increases the chance of hitting them. Sure you can guess grab but grabs are easily avoided in many ways, this covers more things they can do to get away
You said I have to do the aerial a lot later in order to not get shield grab, but can't they just grab me while I'm in the air, waiting to do my late aerial?
yes sir this is how mixups work
Thank you!
What about nair-shine-dair, or dair-shine-nair?
+ChengHorn9 Nair/dair mostly interchangeable at beginner level but i recommend nair
It's a great tutorial for new comers
Is multishining frame perfectly true?
what do you mean
scoreseven
Sorry for not explaining properly. Is a frame perfect multishine on a shield inescapable in terms of hitstun?
TSS Studios Falcos shine causes 4 frames of hitlag on shield, and he can only shine again on frame 9. Since the hit box for shine comes out frame 1, you have 4 frames to act OoS. So you can just grab it, or maybe roll away if you're fast enough. Grab takes three frames I think so you're gonna have to be quick. As for other OoS options, any hit box that comes out in 1-4 frames should work
scoreseven you can grab because grab comes out on frame 7 you have to buffer an option
Ah, cool. thanks
First