I thought the victory engine had a great sound. I don't know how reliable they were, but if they were reliable I don't understand why they didn't make it.
Well, having riden and worked on both, I can say that the Victory engine is head and shoulders better than the Harley engine. You have to spend a TON of money on a Harley motor just for it to MATCH the power of a stock Victory 106, and even after that, you still have the reliability disparity. Name recognition and marketing is the only reason Harley comes out on top...in my opinion.
Well after buying a Victory Magnum in '15 I haven't had anything go wrong on my Victory and wouldn't trade it for a new HD even if it were a even trade! HD is unreliable, friends of mine that have HD's can attest to that!
I have a black victory vision and a black road glide cog. No one looks at the Harley but everyone looks at the vision. It truly is a work of art, timeless beautiful and sounds great with upgraded pipes. Victory is my mind failed in advertising and paint. They needed pearl, metal flake and satin added. Everyone has a Harley, but few have a Victory and now that victory is gone, they are very rare.
It's a real shame the Victory went away, that was a great motor and the design was something different for a change. I agree they could of done a lot more with the paint!
Wait…are you honestly saying that Victory failed because it didn’t sound like a Harley??? C’mon man, you can’t be serious. I’m a bike mechanic and I work on a lot of Harleys, but I own a Victory. The sound is different, but to say that it’s the reason that failed, is a stretch at best. One of the things that attracted me to Victory in the first place was the fact that they never tried to “be” or mimic Harleys. They looked, sounded, and felt different, and that was their strength, not their weakness.
I think these videos are made purposely to create a dialogue between riders. If I had to bet on an actual reason why Polaris pulled the plug on Victory I'd say it all came down to money. Victory wasn't paying its bills and it never makes sense to have competing brands under the same corporate umbrella. Indian was chosen to carry the investor's interests and it appears they made the correct choice, moneywise.
I still own a Victory and here is my take. Always received a lot of compliments and still do to this day. I still get the same question along with the compliment. What kind of bike is that? That tells me that Polaris never marketed the brand to the general public. The dealers also never pushed the brand as they were usually multi brand sellers and carried their own sales agenda. As far as the performance of the engine. The Harley pushrod motor is no match for the 106. For a little money you can make them scream high power and torque. Down side is you have to have it Dino Tuned and there were only a couple of guys that specialized in tuning a Victory. The transmission is smooth as long as you shift in the higher RPM range that the engine was designed for. I still ride the Harley and Victory. A lot of Harley guys I have talked to thought Victory’s were made overseas. LOL
I don't know, bro. I love your channel and most of the stuff you put out is spot on. But I have a few things I'd like to add to this. That Freedom 106 was way ahead of Harley for quite some time and deserves a lot of credit for lighting a fire under them. Now don't get me wrong, I like Harely too. I have a 2014 Ultra Limited. But my 09 Victory is still running solid and stronger, with ZERO issues. My 103 HO has been...let's say....less than solid. When it comes to fit and finish, Harley wins. But that 106 was and still is a beast.
@@bullast2046 Nothing major. Just annoying things like a weeping head gasket, a recent clacking noise coming from the primary, which Harley says is "normal". Don't get me wrong the Harley runs good but I never had leaks or noises from my Victory. And it has better suspension and handling.
Having owned both brands, I couldn't disagree with you more. Victory bikes might have sounded less desirable than the HDs but motor wise you cannot compare them at any level. I owned 2014 Victory Vegas and Crosscountry bagger and both bikes were amazing and way more reliable than any Harley I had previously owned. Maintenance was much simpler to do than a Harley and the reason I came back to Harley-Davidson in 2019 was because I hated how Polaris pulled the plug on Victory just to produce a Harley copycat bikes with Indian badges.
It's a true shame the Victory went away, it was really a solid bike and had stellar reliability. Even those engines were super simple and easy to do the maintenance on. They just didn't have the designer name like Indian or Harley even though they were a excellent product.
Polar-ass knows no loyalty to their customers. That's about as anti biker as it gets. Hopefully a respectable company will own the Indian brand someday. They should have stuck to their 2nd rate snowmobiles.
I bought My victory in 05 and still ride it . Outside of normal ware parts (brakes ,fork seals and a drive belt is all can think of) it has been trouble free.Great bike and so much cheaper than a harley. Victory's biggest problem was a lack of dealers. Nearest to me was 50 miles away.
I remember sitting in a parking lot on the old 1972 electra glide I had at the time , and two older riders walked up getting there bikes one fired up his bike while the other finish his cigarette , he looked at me and said you gotta love Harleys , there'r the only bike that says grab your hat, grab your hat, grab your mother loving hat when you start them up. (I cleaned that up a little bit) Every time I hear someone describe the sound of a Harley I always think of that. Merry Christmas , and happy New Year .
I have a 2015 Victory and love it. I know people who are close to 200k miles on their stock motor. One big reason Victory didn't continue after 2017 is because Polaris (Owner of Victory & Indian) put all its money into the name of Indian. Polaris didn't want to continue supporting two motorcycle lines and decided to continue Indian which had a legendary name.
I have both harley and victory. 13 ultra limited stage 2 and have had 2 cross country's stage 2. Harley needs more maintenance to keep running than victory. I don't see a problem with that because I don't mind keeping it up I like my ultra. I like my victory's less maintenance and better handling more power for the money. I love all three of my american made bikes. I ride harley to cruise and my cross country's to carve the mountains.
I dont really agree hat Harley's need more maintenance to keep running. Like anything, it depends how you ride them, just like a car or truck. I sold my 3 Vic's earlier this year, yeah they were great bikes, 2 have the Freedom 106 and 1 had the Freedom 100. I also have 3 Harley's 09 Rocker C, 14 Wide Glide & 21 Street Glide and they have all been low maintenance but i do no work myself and take all in for their scheduled maintenance. I dont feel the need to crank the throttle wide open, a cruiser is for cruising. If i still wanted to carve the twists and do 120mph down the hwy, i would have kept my 600F4i and ride the way they were meant to ride them.
@@snakebite6511 it ride 20,000 miles a yr on average. My ultra has 45k miles and has cost a lot more than the vic with over 80k and one vic with 35k. Like I said nothing wrong but the maintenance on my ultra is a stater, clutch and had to have the crank replaced because of 15 thousands run out. The Vicks have had oil changes, plugs and batteries.
brilliant synopsis. “It’s all about the sound.” I think you need to get a Magnum X-1, Highball or Vision, and see what they sound and feel like on the road. I just can’t get over the look and feel from the seat. Both Harley and Victory sound iconic to me.
@@chrisbadger282 Styling, lack of support and dealer service, poor after market and price all had something to do with it, if im going to pay the same price for a new Victory as a new Harley, im buying the Harley all day long
The Victory I owned was superior in all aspects except low rpm torque compared to the Twin Cam bikes I own/owned. Harleys sound great and so does a properly exhausted Vic or Indian. My buddy's Vic smokes my HD with ease, numbers be damned.
Ya I agree 💯 my 100-in 09 kingpin can keep up with my buddies 2020 107 and both my 106 bikes will smoke him, my Harley is faster but it's 140 in and absolutely nothing is stock oh and it breaks more often than not LOL
@@robwill9339 realistically has more to do with intake ports, HD has great velocity at low RPM makes good low end power, but that hurts its mid and high-end
O.K. This is absolute fact with no exaggeration. While in Texas I ride a 2014 Victory Cross Roads Classic. Pretty much stock with a dyno and tune by The Vic Shop. The group I ride with, mostly ride Harleys. Everyone in the group, that rides a Harley at some point has told me they would like their bike to sound like mine. Laughing I tell them you cannot get an H.D. to sound like that. The rest of this is purely opinion. I truly believe, the world was not ready for the name, or the unique styling of the Victory. Faster, sleeker and more fuel efficient.
My old friend has a 2003 Victory Cruiser. It's a bagger bike. He is very sick. The bike sat 4yrs and with a new battery and fresh fuel, it dead rolls. He said I have to access the pump inside the tank and remove the injectors, soak the varnish off the injectors and blow the fuel lines clean. Pray the pump is just varnished and not shorted out. Your description of the Victory air intake was exactly what I needed to hear. He said the intake is updraft. Now I understand.
Great explanations and descriptions. I been a HD guy since the first time I saw one when I was 9 looking out the window at a red light standing up on the seat of my dad's '60 Plymouth. I said, "WOW what's that dad?" and he said "That's a Harley Davidson son" and I'll never forget that it. I said, "when I grow up I'm gettin me one of them." I was 9 then and now I'm 70 and I'm on my 10th motorcycle and it's the 3rd of 3 HDs, a 2018 107 FLHX.
Are you sure? Let's check some boxes. 106 Victory engine VS ANY Harley Motor POWER: Honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10 RELIABILITY: Honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10 SOUND: Harley is (debatably) the best sounding motors on the planet ECONOMY: honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10 TECHNOLOGY: honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10 Being better than the varsity football player at math isn't significant if you're not even getting a scholarship for it.
@@chadpunte1731 lol I would have to agree there is Honda, Yamaha or any of the Japanese bikes are better. But that’s like comparing apples to oranges, to compare just theses two companies Victory motorcycles were far superior in every way.
@@flmacphee1158 In a vacuum. It's just when you compare the plethora of options out there, Where do they shine? I looked at victory when I bought my last bike, suzuki boulevard. To be fair, I think I would have been happier with a victory, but not by enough. My next bike will be either an H2, hayabusa, zx14, or a big loud slow heckin' harley bagger.
The problem is that Harley’s distinct sound is going to be the end of them. They’ve been catering to the older crowd, even when they created the v rod. People complained that it was too far from the Harley’s they knew, while victory was a shot at the market, Polaris knew that there’s no point in making two companies for motorcycles and just stuck with name recognition. I know Harley is trying to appeal to the younger generation now, but it maybe too late. Meanwhile indian/ Polaris is experimenting appealing to the younger generation, they’re bread and butter is the FTR, and the scout is for the younger generation. Harley’s sportster s is a start, but what early to mid 20s person has the 18k to blow on a bike? (I’m including taxes and fees for financing) Meanwhile the scout is 12-15k after taxes and fees.
Wow, usually you have a neutral view on things, but this time, I believe you "missed" the mark a bit. 1. 12 gaskets to 65 gaskets is NOT even "close" in horse shoes and hand grenades. You made it sound like it was not a big deal, which it is a very big deal. 2. Unibody construction is a very big deal in strength and "ease of maintenance." The metrics have been doing that since the 50s and it works well. 3. Victory had their transmission failure in 99 and 00, but since 2001, their transmissions were solid. I had a 2004 Touring Cruiser that was perfect for 75,000 miles. No problems with the breaking of the transmissions after 2001. 4. Victory "claimed" their power just like Harley "claimed" their power. You put it as if the "claimed" HP/Torque was the same as Rear Wheel Dyno numbers. Of course, Victory's claimed numbers are not the same as AT the CRANK. 5. Listen to the new M8 motors, they sound just like the Victory motors so either the public is stupid and can't tell the difference or Harley just made the M8 motor to fail in the "ears" of the public. Victory did not just die because of the sales going down, ALL bikes were losing sales when Victory was not making a profit. The difference is Polaris had acquired Indian and instead of "draining" the Indian brand with the Victory, Polaris halted Victory. If Victory was a separated manufacturer from Polaris, Victory would still be with us today. Actually, I have 2 Harleys in my garage now (Evo and Twin Cam), both have 1 thing you failed to show as a truly better Victory design.... The Sportster has it and so does Victory.... Break a belt and see what I mean!!!! Why would you not mention that truly piss poor design by Harley?? Victory was as the TH-cam videos says, "Head and Shoulders above Harley Davidson." Aftermarket is what makes people not buy used Victories right now and Polaris will stop make parts soon so you will have to chose "Harley or Indian." I will chose Harley because of what Polaris did to Victory. If Victory was still making used parts for another 10 years, I would go with it. The Vision and Cross Country were a lot better bikes than Harley's Twin cam waiting to fail motors. It took from 1999 to 2006 (except the dynas) for Harley to fix a fatal design flaw - OUCH.
Victory was really good brand and they just struggled to get a foot hold against Harley. You really can't take anything away from the bikes and Harley could of learned a lot from their engines but Harley is very stuck in tradition. It's sad Victory went away but for Polaris it was wise to not have two brands competing against each other under the same company umbrella. Polaris acquiring the Indian brand was a huge score for them.
@@GixxerFoo I totally agree with you. Too bad someone would not buy the Victory brand name from Polaris and make Victories under their proven engineered designs. Don't get me wrong, I still like my Harleys, but that is because the say, "Potato, potato, potato." The new M8's say, "Purrrrrr." Kawasaki purrrs for a much cheaper price. 1997 Evo and 2003 CVO 103 with the cam chain issue which will cost me $2500 soon (bought it with 9,000 miles on it 2 years ago so it is coming up to change time).
@@ababbit7461 I agree with both your comments as a tc&m8 owner , before I could afford anything big I always wanted that green cross country he showed in the vid but by the time I had the money they were shutting down so it was a no go for me , I will say that the m8 sounds fine once you put a cam in it , not that you should have to but I digress lol 😁
"2. Unibody construction is a very big deal in strength and "ease of maintenance." - that might be the biggest bit of nonsense I've read it quite awhile. Similar to "overhead cams are better than push rod cams, and easier to maintain!" (They.. um... No), or "direct injection is better then any type of fuel system, Like... Ever!" (Jesus Christ, NO). Each has their "thing", but it's still just a piston in a tube. Don't over think it. You obviously don't work on your own bike. You can have your typical twin cam motor apart in 30 minutes. Not so with that over complicated POS Polaris. Good Snow Mobil though.
Dude…..Take a breath of air, before you pass out 😂👍. Victory was a very nice bike, however their bikes never had the “fit and finish” that Harley bikes offered. 💯 Victory couldn’t break themselves away from “Plastachrome Parts”, therefore the bike was not recognized as “being on the same playing field” as Harley Davidson. Victory was more comparable to a Honda, than a Harley.
I keep going on about the one Victory demo day I went to 6-7 years ago but they were great bikes. Comfortable for shortys like me and big bikes for my friends, engines with all the power you want and could ride for days. Even after they closed down I could have other riders who would talk about them. There was one time I passed 4-5 outside a hotel, might have been the owners club. I'm sorry they're gone but I love my Scout
Victory didn't try to sound like a Harley. Victory went the other way with handling and performance over cloning Harley. No victory looks like any harley. That a why I have both.
I feel like I wasted 11 minutes watching that. I own a Victory Kingpin and my attraction was it NOT being a Harley. I love the sound, look, and simplicity of my Victory. I do all my own maintenance. So I have to clean my throttle body and run 100% gas. I have riden several Harleys and they are wonderful bikes but if I every replace my Vic it will be with another Victory or a Indian.. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but you seem like a true Harley fan. I'm definitely not downing Harleys. Some people just want something different. It's funny how people assume every Vtwin wants to be a Harley. I guess all sport bikes want to be a Ducati. No thanks on subscribing here.
Sorry to hear you're not subscribing, Victory was an awesome motorcycle and it's a true shame Polaris shuttered the brand. The design is of the engines is great, I'd love to see it come back some day. But Polaris acquiring Indian and that being a "designer name" I guess you could say I was worried they would axe Victory. I don't know of any other major US manufacturing company that would be able to purchase the rights to Victory but I wish someone would.
Thank you, I really appreciate! It's been for years every manufacturer out there that build a cruiser took a look at Harley and built it around that style.
My harley and victory baggers look nothing alike from the motors to the frames to the suspension. The only way they are similar thing is two tires. That's why I like both they are opposite vtwinn's.
Bought my first harley a few months ago. New 2021 street bob and I absolutely love it. Love the 114 m8 engine. You are correct with the sound IMO. My buddy has a victory 8 ball and the exhaust note just doesn't do it for me. My father's 2009 electra glide to me has the best sounding engine out of all of them. Great video
@@snakebite6511 I actually don't mind the Indian chief bobber. I looked at one and was considering it instead of the harley street bob. The reason I didn't buy the Indian is 2 reasons. 1 the fact there is only 1 dealership in my state even tho its less than 5 miles from my house. 2 I actually brought my ninja 1000 there a few years ago since it's and Indian/suzuki dealership and was up until recently a kawasaki dealership all in one. I didn't buy my kawasaki from there but they are close to my house and I needed it serviced and they could get me in that week. I brought my bike in and they did the service. When I got my bike back I checked it over like I always do and didn't notice anything. Started riding it home and noticed my front cowl seemed a bit raised up. Pulled over and inspected it. They broke my whole cowl off my bike and tried 😤 to glue it back on!! And not tell me!!! Went back and confronted them. They did order me a new one cause they knew they got caught! Shady dealership so I won't be going back there for any services. So buying an Indian from there and having it serviced there as the onky option in my state is a no go for me!!! They lost a customer.
@@jacobhiggins1195 I have a buddy here that got a new Indian Scout bobber, his 1st new bike and was in love with that thing. a few weeks later he took it in for its 1st service and they got it up on the lift did the work, all was good , called him and said the bike was ready, he told them he would pick it up by the end of the day. Gets there and sees the bike is crashed, they didnt tell him they dropped it off the lift, took them 6 weeks to get the parts and the bike repaired and in a state where there is a shortened riding season his season was over. They would not even replace the parts with upgraded for the inconvenience. They were total asshats about it. I understand things happen by accident but this is now a damaged bike, they should have compensated him with upgraded parts. I find many of the Indian dealerships are sketchy because they sell multiple brands and the dealerships have 1 mechanic authorized to work on Indian. This particulate dealership sells Indian, Polaris, KTM & Royal Enfield.
I have a 2009 Harley Davidson Ultra Classic with Vance and Hines slip ons . That exhaust sound causes people to stop and stare when I ride by it's so sweet .
First bike was a 07 Vegas with a 100ci. Holy smokes that thing was fun to ride. Loud, fast, and great looking. Ended up trading it in on an Indian last year. While the Indian is more comfortable, it doesn't have the same effect when I twist the throttle. If the Victory didn't need an unavailable speed sensor, I'd still have it around.
Aw you could of installed a steel frame one and it's really not all that hard. Rylan from Vic shop has a video on how to do it. Come back to the Vic side. you know you would of rather had a 116 big bore Vegas or in your case a 110. oooeeee such fun bikes.
The Victory engine was and is a bullet proof design and I loved it. Victory engines were state of the art with gear drive primary, single hole oil fill and drain, chain drive overhead cams with no pushrods to fail.
Harley owners ain't happy unless they can ''improve'' things. Aftermarket or Screamin' Eagle performance parts , they (we!) for better or worse , just can't leave them alone or stock. There really was not a large high-performance aftermarket for Victory. Plus they were sold and serviced by Polaris dealers who were more into off-road toys than road going motorcycles , and didn't really seem to want 'bikers' in their shops asking questions they couldn't answer. The few Victory owners I know do ride often and far , and are happy at how few problems they have and relatively little maintenance they require compared to a Harley.
That's a really good point I forgot to mention in the video, you didn't see any "Victory Dealers". They were always sold through a power sports dealer under the umbrella of other brands. That was always a red flag to me, the guy who works on side by sides, dirt bikes and 4 wheelers servicing my bagger?
I know several victory mechanics that have never worked on side by sides only victory, also a Harley mechanic that works at a victory dealer which now he is a indian mechanic. Why would that matter, mechanics work on ford, chevy, and dodge
Mine is bone stock other than the seat. Even my exhaust is factory. I learned a long time ago if you want to start breaking things and investing in constant maintenance do an “upgrade”. Other than that the cost for upgrades compared to horsepower gained 1: makes no sense and 2: isn’t needed. With my current bike which is a 2019 road king and the many metric bikes I’ve owned before this one all I’ve had to do is change oil.
Having owned several victory motorcycles and I can tell you they are some of the most amazing machines. The only reason I own a Harley Davidson is because they stop building Victory.
When Victory first came out I did machining on the heads at the company I worked for. Very tight tolerances. No I didn't buy one, even at a discount. I did like the look of the Vargas, which came later. I have a 2011 twin cam and a 1978 Shovel. In my humble opinion nothing beats the exhaust notes of the shovel.
Great video GixxerFoo: I used to have two Victorys. 2013 Vctory Cross Country and a 2013 Victory Judge. Both bikes with Stage 1. I love them. On the Cross Country I put 40,000 miles in 3 years and never an issue. I got it brand new in 2014. After Polaris kill the brand I got very dissapointed and went back to HD. Currently own a 2013 V-ROD Muscle (daily rider) and a 2011 Softail Fatboy (Travels out of town or when the GF is tagging along). I think what kill the brand was not enough PR and Marketing, they new push the brand like they are doing with the Indian. I am afraid they will eventually kill the Indian brand if sales don't pick-up. Also not too many dealerships compared with HD. Love your videos. Keep doing a great job.
I'm getting 80 whp and 103 wtq from a 100ci Stage 1 K&N filter upgraded intake covet, PC5, and RPW slash. Intake upgrade will add a few more. Great video.
Excelente comparison, you are correct, what killed the Victory was the sound, I have a 2012 Victory Cross country Tour and 2012 Harley CVO ultra classic 110 both with sleep-on mufflers, everything eagle stock. Hands down the Victory in much better all around bike, than the 110 CVO. Thank you for your great videos.
Lol Victory didn't fail. 😂 They outperformed, were far superior in reliability, and mechanically more advanced. They had a poor marketing department and not many people outside of the dealership actually knew about them. The only reason Victory isn't around anymore is because Polaris decided in 2017 to look at sales between the Indian restart (Had Heritage with the name going for it) and the Victory line. The Indian line has a couple percentage points more than the Victory. So Polaris shut it down and they took the Victory R&D, and started putting it into their Indian line. The Indian Challenger with the 108CI is a prime example of this.
Let's face it the name of Harley and status killed victory. You could buy a cross country with more storage than an ultra glide, better handling, more power etc.. even to this day I see people on TH-cam test drive the challenger and say it is better than there road glide as they pull away on there harley because it is a status symbol. The people I run into that are on an indian or victory don't care about fitting in status they just want a better machine out of the box without putting thousands in to make it the same as the competition. Lol
The transmission problem was solved by 2002. The crank breather is very simple to vent. There are eight gaskets in the Victory engine. Put in a free flow intake like Lloyd's Torque Tubes, and a free flowing exhaust, and you dyno at more than the factory advertised numbers. The EPA sucks for both Victory and HD. The stator is in the cover, for better cooling. I can change a drive belt in around an hour. On the side of the road. Victory Six Speeds didn't shell our like Harleys did, and Baker even had problems. I think the problem with Victory is the same type if mindset that calls a Sportster a "girls bike", couldn't accept another American motorcycle, especially one that was faster without having to re-engineer the factory. I love Harleys, but I F'n love Victorys. .lol.
Another great video I owned a victory Vegas Jackpot for me a great bike . One of the issues with them are the throttle bodies they have to cleaned every 2500miles .Asign of this is the idle drops yes you can adjust manually adjust the idle screw but eventually you have have to do the cleaning .keep up the good work please🇬🇧
I’ve owned several Harley’s and about 6 months ago I bought a 2013 Victory Cross Country, when I did the test ride there were a few things I didn’t like but figured I could change them easy enough. I mean who doesn’t make changes when they buy a bike. But there are a few things I haven’t been able to fix to my liking. The Victory CC has wind buffering like crazy. I though it was from the short windshield but that wasn’t it. The wind comes up from below. Everyone you talk to has a different fix - so far it hasn’t worked for me. The throttle is cables and when the cruise is set you can’t hold the grip tight or it will not allow the cruise control to work right. It’s a pain in the mountains! The engine sounds different but it sounds good with aftermarket exhaust or I should say modified stock mufflers. I’m about to my wits end with the Vic and about ready to make the move back to Harley.
Same bike. I'm 6'-0" tall. Fork mounted wind deflectors took care of the buffeting. Witchdoctors sells them in flat black or bare metal. I also installed a Klock Werks flare windshield that may have helped some too, but the deflectors worked in a major way for me!
So, in a nutshell. He basically says the Victory produced more power and was less expensive with a more modern design. But since the bike didn't sound like a Harley people didn't buy it. Sound's like a Harley rider all summed up. Buying a bike for the sound. I also love how he described the Harley sound (to the dump, to the dump, to the dump).
Victory was a great bike, it just didn't catch on widely. It was still pricey but it had it's following. They tried hard to market the bike and they did a great job of doing so, hell it even had great dealer support. Just didn't catch fire and sway the masses. What l didn't like is the way Polaris shut the doors and turned its back on all the owners.
No one can deny the fact that the Victory was a engine that was and still is a bulletproof, low maintenance design. Oil changes are easy, less moving parts, simplified drive belt changes, easy clutch pack replacement, no pushrods. Then Indian came back owning both companies and improved the twin cam, they did it again with their Challenger & scout that are liquid cooled with even more technology. No Harley Davidson has got with the program with their Revolution Max same case transmission and over head cams.
Incorrect on the trans issues with the 99-01, they are loud yes, but all vics change gears loudly, but no, neutral is very easy to find. Their issue was the design of the shaft, and it would actually wear out the casing it slides thru which is part of the case. Another issue were the dogs in the trans, they would break.
You can't beat the lope of the carbed bikes, they sound so good. The FI bikes are easy starting and have their benefits but they still idle at 1,000 to maintain oil pressure.
@@GixxerFoo 2 years late, but your way off, Victory's oil pumps put out "way" more oil pressure than Harleys at Idle and higher RPM's something close to 50psi at Idle and up to 70psi at higher RPM's while Harleys would literally put out less than 10psi at Idle, Yes you heard me right less than 10psi in some cases, Now that is down right pathetic and asking for engine damage on cold starts, especially for those that just crank the bikes up and go without letting them warm up.. I literally just watched a video a couple days ago from a motorcycle mechanic that worked on both Vics and HD.. I will post the link if I can still pull it up on my google history.. th-cam.com/video/KueK_pyJHJE/w-d-xo.html start watching at around 2.5 minutes in until the end for the oil pump talk..
Parts support and horrible dealer experience made me dump my 2016 Victory 106 XC. I bought it because of the promised 10 years of parts support and there isn't any freaking way I'm buying a fake ass wannabe Japanese-Harley V-twin. Now the Victory.... Inverted forks, cast aluminum frame far better motor, power, no leaks, easy low maintenance, change a drive belt in 20 minutes. I could go on for 50 more items. The sound, really. I doubt you could hear it unless you were on the Indian or Harley I just blew by. I say big F U to Polar-ass. I'll never buy a fake Indian brand as long as Polar-ass own's the name because what they did to Victory owners. Go look at the flagship Indian Challenger. Its 100% Victory. Compare it next to an Indian. Then look at a Vic, then you tell me. I'll be at the HD dealer. Unless I'm riding a sport bike. I'm hopefull that will change too. I 👍 and subscribed. Good stuff!
I wouldn’t state that Victory failed. They did a remarkable job with building good bikes, setting up dealers and providing good sales and service support etc. When Polaris obtained The Indian brand it made more sense for them to cease production of the Victory brand and go forward with the Indian brand.
SALES say Victory failed. It was a business and its products were soundly rejected by the buying public. Mechanically they're fine but motorcycles are toys and styling is critical.
@@Comm0ut LOL Victory didn’t fail, far from it. They acquired the Indian brand and basically rebranded under the Indian name. They weren’t rejected and actually had strong enough sales to gain market share from Harley and the Jap cruisers. You’re an idiot.
I currently own 2 HDs but used to own a '13 Victory CCT. I really loved the CCT but love my HDs more. That said, I think Victory's failing was its marketing. I used to subscribe to a bunch of motorcycle magazines and after about 2015 you NEVER saw any ads for Victories in ANY of them. It's as if Polaris just gave up right when Victory seemed like it was catching on. Once Polaris discontinued Victory in late 2016, I sold it (my wife and I ride all over the country, need a good dealer network) and bought my first HD (Ultra Limited). I've enjoyed the sound, yes, but also the nearly infinite performance and other upgrades available. I've done a Stage II on my Ultra Ltd and it pulls like a freight train -- way more than any Victory or Indian I've ridden (including the Thunderstroke 116).
Victory tried hard for years to get people swayed, including a heavy presence at Sturgis. But you're right their advertising really disappeared after 2015. They wonder why it wasn't turning a profit those last few years too.
earlier this year, i have a 15 CCT, 16 Magnum and an 07 Jackpot, sold them all in Marley/April of 2021. They were awesome bikes but the aftermarket was weak to say the least and even Indian isn't much better. I found dealers didnt care because as you said, they are all multi brand dealers and most have 1 mechanic certified to work on a Victory. I still love the look of the Victory and the Harley I have a 09 Rocker C, 14 Wide Gile and 21 Street Glide and i can get any performance part i want with a drive 15 minutes to Harley where they have 15 mechanics on staff.
Thank you for the breakdown! I almost bought one, however, Just that..... I wanted the sound, and after looking into it the dealer support was weak. I've broke down in PoDunk before on a 79 shovel, and low and behold I found parts for it at 7-11. figuratively speaking. The basis for my second reason to stay with Harley. Thank you and Merry Christmas
@@brandonmacon3317 Yeah right. I am always changing fluids on time or early using synthetic oils and greases. What is the excuse for a new bike scissoring its flywheel while being driven at the dealers parking lot? Oh and it was a slow take off.
Harley played Polaris. The Vic engine was far superior to the TC at the time. The Vic had none of the ridiculous vibration at idle and the 4 valve heads made linear power across the rev range. Besides shaking the TCs (and Indians for that matter) get to about 4k rpm and give up the ghost. They make a little more power at low rpm than the Vics, but for riding beyond stoplights, the Vic engine was simply better. HD got Polaris sucked into making that hot, gutless 2 valve engine for that Indian, while they were refining their own engine into a mostly smooth, cool running, 4 valve design. I don't know if that was intentional, but it was quite the coincidence. AFAIC, HD wiped the floor w/ Polaris at that point. Polaris has since had to create another bike to try to save face, but while quicker, it lost simplicity of being a big air cooled bagger.
Victory had some cool looking bikes for sure, But in my humble opinion, No Bike ever made was or is as beautiful as a 2012 HD Fatboy Lo, nothing beats timeless beauty with an old school look that will get a node from Grandpa for sure. And I can tell Grandpa I walked past Ultras and Street Glides to special order it at the time 😎👍
That Fatboy Lol was a start in the lineup, it literally had the new school and old school blended together seamlessly. It could be either depending on how you saw that bike, Victory had a really futuristic spin which was a shame it just didn't take off.
I own a 2013 victory XC and a 2017 road glide special and if im absolutely honest.with the exception of aftermarket parts and the size of the gas tank, the Vic is just a much better bike all around. Polaris discontinued the line to put all of thier r&d behind the indian brand which from a business standpoint is a smart idea. The Resultat of that move is what can be seen in the 2024 hd touring line up.
Victory was a better designed, better built product. The brand dwindled due to a few things; Lack of aftermarket support, Radical designs that turned off most riders, and management's continued pursuit of other brands to pull into its fold forcing Victory to face growing competition from other brands (not just HD) without financial support. If Polaris had not killed it off, it would have come back. Proof of this is simple; aftermarket support finally began to care and we saw it shortly before the big announcement, new designs that took the ride back to basics and gave riders something new that was edgy and not radical (eg High Ball), Indian sales numbers rely heavily on overseas markets success (meaning Americans still want something other than Indian).
Lol, @ 6.50 that was my transmission (or whatever was left of it). This was due to a well known issue of the dreaded circlip on the transmission main shaft getting loose. A 20 Cent part causing catastrophic damage. First sign is a clattering noise on left hand turns and bike on side stand. Next it will jump out of gear under heavy acceleration. Then kaboom! Might add Polaris ended up supplying a long motor free of charge after a long battle. The new motor is flawless after 60,000kms.
Some agreements but several disagreements I’ve owned both, my last being a 2015 Magnum Stealth edition and before that, a FLTRXS. My *only* complaint after several trips from TX to lost wages, then west TX to TPA was the less than ideal wind buffeting from the shield. My last trip from Katy to TPA was straight thru; that alone should attest to their comfort. Victory did more to push HD out of their comfort zone, forcing them to step up to the plate. Personally, since Polaris dumped on Vic owners, I’ll never purchase their products again. Considering the bullshit Erik Buell went through, I’ll never own anything HD
Polaris has a history of leaving customers in the cold, they did that watercraft and now with Victory motorcycles. Parts are available for ten years, but good luck finding a shop to work on them. The places I know that sold Victory they will tell you to kick rocks very politely in most cases. I think the dealers got the shaft from Polaris too, it sounds like it was a bad deal.
I like the Victory bikes. Some different art deco designs and American made. Seems like you can buy them relatively cheap. Still like my Road Glide though.
12 gaskets vs 64???? I had a 2013 Victory Cross Country Tour. It was a fantastic bike. I did many trips on that motorcycle including across country and back. It was tremendously reliable, and easy to work on. The only downside was it couldn’t handle hitting a deer. I totaled 2 years ago.
I loved my 03 Vegas v92. Would of never gotten rid of it, if there wasn't a parts issue. Never leaked oil like my 17 sportster 48. Also the transmission was way more responsive. More than likely I'll get a scout once I pay it off. Not feeling the maintenance and the left side forward control wore out at 10,000 miles. That's a little ridiculous if you ask me
Amen; overhead cams have more parabolic friction . I watched a late hells angel movie. Many were riding victories. Got to be American made . Rules - ✊🏻👌👍 Sound is key - 😁 They were kinda funky lookin 👀 Great video: I think you covered all bases .
Around 2015-ish....I was looking for a bagger. I took 4 bikes for test rides at the dealer. A Victory 8-Ball, a Harley Road King and Springer, and a Indian Chief. Of all the bikes, I actually liked the Victory the best, followed by the Indian. The 2 Harleys were just ok. I ended up getting a used 2008 Street Bob. Fast forward to 2020 and now I'm REALLY looking for a bagger. Victory was now gone, so it came down to the Indian and Harley. I walked into the Indian dealership looking for a Chieftan. The sales person says it's MSRP is 26k. I asked the sales person what deals they were doing on them. He said nothing....it's 26k. I go to the Harley dealership and see a nice Street Glide....again 26k. But before I even asked....they tell me they are having a sale on them for 22K. I wanted to trade in my Street Bob...and they were willing to give me $5500 for it.....$500 more than what I paid for it. Needless to say....I now own a Street Glide. Indian may end up going the way of Victory if they don't change their marketing/pricing strategy.
Those are some good looking bikes! Victory was a very solid platform, it's still such a shame they shut that brand down. I would of loved to have the choice of a Victory, Harley or Indian on the show rooms today.
@@GixxerFoo I really have a tough time looking at Indian after getting that letter from Polaris about 10 year factory support in 2017 when the brand closed. I sold my 2010 cross country then and haven't taken a hard look at Indian
People guy HD over other brands for the same reason they might pay double for a Caddie over a GM when, in some models, there's a negligible difference between the two outside of styling. There's an image tied to brands and status. Other brands have been making objectively better bikes than HD for decades, usually for a lower price, and they can't "beat" HD. They've become a cultural icon. That, coupled with their dealers support, solidly keeps them in place. It's tied to the same reasons that any time HD tries to progress with styles or technology, like with the VROD, shit crashes and burns. It's not a "real" HD and not part of that cultural icon. The thing keeping them alive is also the poison that's killing them slowly.
I've had a couple of Victorys both the 100 engine and the 106. Victory just couldn't get Harley owners to try their products which was a shame because even Sonny Barger knew that the Victory was a better bike as he used them in his film Dead in five heartbeats. The Victorys I've owned are at opposite ends of the spectrum too as I first had a Vegas and then a Cross Country. Both were really well engineered and IMO far, far better standard of finish than any Harley that I've ridden including the Sport Glide I rode last year. I've ridden long distances on both marques and the Victorys are better on fuel and have more power.
Victory made some awesome bikes they just struggled to sway people away from Harley. It's hard to get people off of Harley's even though the product is leaps and bounds ahead.
The Victory had it's good points about it, it was a more modern design but they didn't have the fit and finish of the Harley-Davidson. Parts are going to get pretty scarce here in the coming years unfortunately much in the Buell parts are now.
A few reasons why they didn't make in the market. Mainly it was a small dealer network which made it hard to grow. One huge advantage HD has is they carry most of their own financing, and also have an unbelievable repossession rate. Victory was entering into a heavily saturated cruiser market as well. They just couldn't gain a large enough foothold or name was all. They didn't carry most of their own financing and early on the styling wasn't great. They got Arlen Ness in for styling which was great and well received, but if people can't find dealers it doesn't matter. When Polaris was able to buy the Indian name they now owned something with a strong name and needed to put everything into building an entirely new line. Victory was basically doomed from that point. Slowly victory development is being added to the Indian line, like the challenger which was victory's new engine. The scout was built right off the octane. Victory really just didn't grow, so was replaced. Nothing wrong with the bikes really, just too few dealers and getting units out the door.
Great vid Gixer. I ride a carby 2005 Softail, I ride with a number of boys with a mixture of bikes ranging from Victory, Triumph, and even a Honda Fury. All comment on not only how great my bike sounds - but how distinctive the bike sounds. I think you hit the nail on the head in your vid. Merry Christmas from downunder.
Marketing that's what killed Victory. They were a motorcycle company that sold clothing on the side. Harley is an apparel company that sell motorcycles, the were also a bowling company at one point too
I had a new victory in 2001, i felt that the o/h cam engine gave the bike a taller seat height and felt wide in the saddle. The aftermarket was almost non existent at that time as far as exhaust, seats, performance parts. I went to a older high mile evo bagger just for the aftermarket support.
What do you think of the Victory engine and why it couldn't topple Harley-Davidson?
The Victory engine was fantastic! But the dealer network sucked and they didn't sell a ton of bikes. In my opinion Indian isn't doing the best either.
th-cam.com/video/UH4FpjMPsfs/w-d-xo.html
I thought the victory engine had a great sound. I don't know how reliable they were, but if they were reliable I don't understand why they didn't make it.
Well, having riden and worked on both, I can say that the Victory engine is head and shoulders better than the Harley engine. You have to spend a TON of money on a Harley motor just for it to MATCH the power of a stock Victory 106, and even after that, you still have the reliability disparity. Name recognition and marketing is the only reason Harley comes out on top...in my opinion.
Well after buying a Victory Magnum in '15 I haven't had anything go wrong on my Victory and wouldn't trade it for a new HD even if it were a even trade! HD is unreliable, friends of mine that have HD's can attest to that!
I have a black victory vision and a black road glide cog. No one looks at the Harley but everyone looks at the vision. It truly is a work of art, timeless beautiful and sounds great with upgraded pipes. Victory is my mind failed in advertising and paint. They needed pearl, metal flake and satin added. Everyone has a Harley, but few have a Victory and now that victory is gone, they are very rare.
It's a real shame the Victory went away, that was a great motor and the design was something different for a change. I agree they could of done a lot more with the paint!
Wait…are you honestly saying that Victory failed because it didn’t sound like a Harley??? C’mon man, you can’t be serious. I’m a bike mechanic and I work on a lot of Harleys, but I own a Victory. The sound is different, but to say that it’s the reason that failed, is a stretch at best. One of the things that attracted me to Victory in the first place was the fact that they never tried to “be” or mimic Harleys. They looked, sounded, and felt different, and that was their strength, not their weakness.
I think these videos are made purposely to create a dialogue between riders. If I had to bet on an actual reason why Polaris pulled the plug on Victory I'd say it all came down to money. Victory wasn't paying its bills and it never makes sense to have competing brands under the same corporate umbrella. Indian was chosen to carry the investor's interests and it appears they made the correct choice, moneywise.
There was a lot of working parts to it, advertising, money, interest and just people like Harley.
They were great bikes, the masses just weren't swayed away from Harley.
Lmao are you kidding? They all try to look like Harleys man be honest with yourself and you become honest with others 🥰
@@brandonmacon3317 Victorys do not look like Harleys. Get a grip.
I still own a Victory and here is my take. Always received a lot of compliments and still do to this day. I still get the same question along with the compliment. What kind of bike is that? That tells me that Polaris never marketed the brand to the general public. The dealers also never pushed the brand as they were usually multi brand sellers and carried their own sales agenda. As far as the performance of the engine. The Harley pushrod motor is no match for the 106. For a little money you can make them scream high power and torque. Down side is you have to have it Dino Tuned and there were only a couple of guys that specialized in tuning a Victory. The transmission is smooth as long as you shift in the higher RPM range that the engine was designed for. I still ride the Harley and Victory. A lot of Harley guys I have talked to thought Victory’s were made overseas. LOL
Yup yup yup yup yes !
I don't know, bro. I love your channel and most of the stuff you put out is spot on. But I have a few things I'd like to add to this. That Freedom 106 was way ahead of Harley for quite some time and deserves a lot of credit for lighting a fire under them. Now don't get me wrong, I like Harely too. I have a 2014 Ultra Limited. But my 09 Victory is still running solid and stronger, with ZERO issues. My 103 HO has been...let's say....less than solid. When it comes to fit and finish, Harley wins. But that 106 was and still is a beast.
Totally agree but too bad the 106 is gone.
Couldn't agree more, the 106 motor is a beast.
Can you elaborate on the “less than solid” issues with your 103HO? Genuinely curious, I have a 103
@@bullast2046 Nothing major. Just annoying things like a weeping head gasket, a recent clacking noise coming from the primary, which Harley says is "normal". Don't get me wrong the Harley runs good but I never had leaks or noises from my Victory. And it has better suspension and handling.
@@richardsmith5738 id say a weeping head gasket is pushing into the “major” category.. thanks
Having owned both brands, I couldn't disagree with you more. Victory bikes might have sounded less desirable than the HDs but motor wise you cannot compare them at any level. I owned 2014 Victory Vegas and Crosscountry bagger and both bikes were amazing and way more reliable than any Harley I had previously owned. Maintenance was much simpler to do than a Harley and the reason I came back to Harley-Davidson in 2019 was because I hated how Polaris pulled the plug on Victory just to produce a Harley copycat bikes with Indian badges.
It's a true shame the Victory went away, it was really a solid bike and had stellar reliability. Even those engines were super simple and easy to do the maintenance on. They just didn't have the designer name like Indian or Harley even though they were a excellent product.
I say go outside the box..how bout a Guzzi?..No?!..😳
Polar-ass knows no loyalty to their customers. That's about as anti biker as it gets. Hopefully a respectable company will own the Indian brand someday. They should have stuck to their 2nd rate snowmobiles.
It's really about maintenance. I'm 35 still pounding the asphalt with my dad's 81 shovel.
I'm sure you are having fun getting parts for those incredible Victorys! Polaris really fd you guys good
I bought My victory in 05 and still ride it . Outside of normal ware parts (brakes ,fork seals and a drive belt is all can think of) it has been trouble free.Great bike and so much cheaper than a harley. Victory's biggest problem was a lack of dealers. Nearest to me was 50 miles away.
I remember sitting in a parking lot on the old 1972 electra glide I had at the time , and two older riders walked up getting there bikes one fired up his bike while the other finish his cigarette , he looked at me and said you gotta love Harleys , there'r the only bike that says grab your hat, grab your hat, grab your mother loving hat when you start them up. (I cleaned that up a little bit) Every time I hear someone describe the sound of a Harley I always think of that. Merry Christmas , and happy New Year .
I have a 2015 Victory and love it. I know people who are close to 200k miles on their stock motor. One big reason Victory didn't continue after 2017 is because Polaris (Owner of Victory & Indian) put all its money into the name of Indian. Polaris didn't want to continue supporting two motorcycle lines and decided to continue Indian which had a legendary name.
That's exactly what happened there!
I have both harley and victory. 13 ultra limited stage 2 and have had 2 cross country's stage 2. Harley needs more maintenance to keep running than victory. I don't see a problem with that because I don't mind keeping it up I like my ultra. I like my victory's less maintenance and better handling more power for the money. I love all three of my american made bikes. I ride harley to cruise and my cross country's to carve the mountains.
I dont really agree hat Harley's need more maintenance to keep running. Like anything, it depends how you ride them, just like a car or truck.
I sold my 3 Vic's earlier this year, yeah they were great bikes, 2 have the Freedom 106 and 1 had the Freedom 100. I also have 3 Harley's 09 Rocker C, 14 Wide Glide & 21 Street Glide and they have all been low maintenance but i do no work myself and take all in for their scheduled maintenance.
I dont feel the need to crank the throttle wide open, a cruiser is for cruising. If i still wanted to carve the twists and do 120mph down the hwy, i would have kept my 600F4i and ride the way they were meant to ride them.
@@snakebite6511 it ride 20,000 miles a yr on average. My ultra has 45k miles and has cost a lot more than the vic with over 80k and one vic with 35k. Like I said nothing wrong but the maintenance on my ultra is a stater, clutch and had to have the crank replaced because of 15 thousands run out. The Vicks have had oil changes, plugs and batteries.
@@russrogers728 the Vic's are also easier to change the oil :)
@@snakebite6511
@@slickwilly1099 Go back to school, you sound like a fool!
brilliant synopsis. “It’s all about the sound.” I think you need to get a Magnum X-1, Highball or Vision, and see what they sound and feel like on the road. I just can’t get over the look and feel from the seat. Both Harley and Victory sound iconic to me.
You failed to mention Victory's reliability and customer satisfaction rating was light years ahead of HD.
Ya I have no idea how vic couldn't build off this I think the biggest failure was advertising
@@chrisbadger282 Styling, lack of support and dealer service, poor after market and price all had something to do with it, if im going to pay the same price for a new Victory as a new Harley, im buying the Harley all day long
@Snake Bite my Victory cost less than the Harley in the same category..
@@snakebite6511 Victorys were about 2/3 the price of Harley.
The Victory I owned was superior in all aspects except low rpm torque compared to the Twin Cam bikes I own/owned. Harleys sound great and so does a properly exhausted Vic or Indian. My buddy's Vic smokes my HD with ease, numbers be damned.
Ya I agree 💯 my 100-in 09 kingpin can keep up with my buddies 2020 107 and both my 106 bikes will smoke him, my Harley is faster but it's 140 in and absolutely nothing is stock oh and it breaks more often than not LOL
You just don't fit in with the HD fan club. Had nothing to do with sound of the engine.
Yeah but it's not a Harley
Harley has that good torque because of that fat Crank in it.
@@robwill9339 realistically has more to do with intake ports, HD has great velocity at low RPM makes good low end power, but that hurts its mid and high-end
O.K. This is absolute fact with no exaggeration. While in Texas I ride a 2014 Victory Cross Roads Classic. Pretty much stock with a dyno and tune by The Vic Shop. The group I ride with, mostly ride Harleys. Everyone in the group, that rides a Harley at some point has told me they would like their bike to sound like mine. Laughing I tell them you cannot get an H.D. to sound like that.
The rest of this is purely opinion. I truly believe, the world was not ready for the name, or the unique styling of the Victory. Faster, sleeker and more fuel efficient.
My old friend has a 2003 Victory Cruiser. It's a bagger bike. He is very sick. The bike sat 4yrs and with a new battery and fresh fuel, it dead rolls. He said I have to access the pump inside the tank and remove the injectors, soak the varnish off the injectors and blow the fuel lines clean. Pray the pump is just varnished and not shorted out. Your description of the Victory air intake was exactly what I needed to hear. He said the intake is updraft. Now I understand.
Great explanations and descriptions. I been a HD guy since the first time I saw one when I was 9 looking out the window at a red light standing up on the seat of my dad's '60 Plymouth. I said, "WOW what's that dad?" and he said "That's a Harley Davidson son" and I'll never forget that it. I said, "when I grow up I'm gettin me one of them." I was 9 then and now I'm 70 and I'm on my 10th motorcycle and it's the 3rd of 3 HDs, a 2018 107 FLHX.
That is awesome, Harley-Davidson really does get in your blood for sure!
My dad said just about the same thing. I looked at the bike then asked him, What's that puddle of oil underneath it?
The 106 victory engine is far superior to anything Harley was making at the time.
Are you sure? Let's check some boxes.
106 Victory engine VS ANY Harley Motor
POWER: Honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10
RELIABILITY: Honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10
SOUND: Harley is (debatably) the best sounding motors on the planet
ECONOMY: honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10
TECHNOLOGY: honestly much better options out there to the point neither of these engines rank in the top 10
Being better than the varsity football player at math isn't significant if you're not even getting a scholarship for it.
@@chadpunte1731 lol I would have to agree there is Honda, Yamaha or any of the Japanese bikes are better. But that’s like comparing apples to oranges, to compare just theses two companies Victory motorcycles were far superior in every way.
@@flmacphee1158 In a vacuum. It's just when you compare the plethora of options out there, Where do they shine? I looked at victory when I bought my last bike, suzuki boulevard. To be fair, I think I would have been happier with a victory, but not by enough. My next bike will be either an H2, hayabusa, zx14, or a big loud slow heckin' harley bagger.
@@chadpunte1731 so of the year what was in the top ten ?
@@chrisbadger282 For which category? there's a whole lot of bikes that do something the best.
The problem is that Harley’s distinct sound is going to be the end of them. They’ve been catering to the older crowd, even when they created the v rod. People complained that it was too far from the Harley’s they knew, while victory was a shot at the market, Polaris knew that there’s no point in making two companies for motorcycles and just stuck with name recognition. I know Harley is trying to appeal to the younger generation now, but it maybe too late. Meanwhile indian/ Polaris is experimenting appealing to the younger generation, they’re bread and butter is the FTR, and the scout is for the younger generation. Harley’s sportster s is a start, but what early to mid 20s person has the 18k to blow on a bike? (I’m including taxes and fees for financing) Meanwhile the scout is 12-15k after taxes and fees.
Wow, usually you have a neutral view on things, but this time, I believe you "missed" the mark a bit. 1. 12 gaskets to 65 gaskets is NOT even "close" in horse shoes and hand grenades. You made it sound like it was not a big deal, which it is a very big deal. 2. Unibody construction is a very big deal in strength and "ease of maintenance." The metrics have been doing that since the 50s and it works well. 3. Victory had their transmission failure in 99 and 00, but since 2001, their transmissions were solid. I had a 2004 Touring Cruiser that was perfect for 75,000 miles. No problems with the breaking of the transmissions after 2001. 4. Victory "claimed" their power just like Harley "claimed" their power. You put it as if the "claimed" HP/Torque was the same as Rear Wheel Dyno numbers. Of course, Victory's claimed numbers are not the same as AT the CRANK. 5. Listen to the new M8 motors, they sound just like the Victory motors so either the public is stupid and can't tell the difference or Harley just made the M8 motor to fail in the "ears" of the public.
Victory did not just die because of the sales going down, ALL bikes were losing sales when Victory was not making a profit. The difference is Polaris had acquired Indian and instead of "draining" the Indian brand with the Victory, Polaris halted Victory. If Victory was a separated manufacturer from Polaris, Victory would still be with us today. Actually, I have 2 Harleys in my garage now (Evo and Twin Cam), both have 1 thing you failed to show as a truly better Victory design.... The Sportster has it and so does Victory.... Break a belt and see what I mean!!!! Why would you not mention that truly piss poor design by Harley?? Victory was as the TH-cam videos says, "Head and Shoulders above Harley Davidson." Aftermarket is what makes people not buy used Victories right now and Polaris will stop make parts soon so you will have to chose "Harley or Indian." I will chose Harley because of what Polaris did to Victory. If Victory was still making used parts for another 10 years, I would go with it. The Vision and Cross Country were a lot better bikes than Harley's Twin cam waiting to fail motors. It took from 1999 to 2006 (except the dynas) for Harley to fix a fatal design flaw - OUCH.
Victory was really good brand and they just struggled to get a foot hold against Harley. You really can't take anything away from the bikes and Harley could of learned a lot from their engines but Harley is very stuck in tradition. It's sad Victory went away but for Polaris it was wise to not have two brands competing against each other under the same company umbrella. Polaris acquiring the Indian brand was a huge score for them.
@@GixxerFoo I totally agree with you. Too bad someone would not buy the Victory brand name from Polaris and make Victories under their proven engineered designs. Don't get me wrong, I still like my Harleys, but that is because the say, "Potato, potato, potato." The new M8's say, "Purrrrrr." Kawasaki purrrs for a much cheaper price. 1997 Evo and 2003 CVO 103 with the cam chain issue which will cost me $2500 soon (bought it with 9,000 miles on it 2 years ago so it is coming up to change time).
@@ababbit7461 I agree with both your comments as a tc&m8 owner , before I could afford anything big I always wanted that green cross country he showed in the vid but by the time I had the money they were shutting down so it was a no go for me , I will say that the m8 sounds fine once you put a cam in it , not that you should have to but I digress lol 😁
"2. Unibody construction is a very big deal in strength and "ease of maintenance." - that might be the biggest bit of nonsense I've read it quite awhile. Similar to "overhead cams are better than push rod cams, and easier to maintain!" (They.. um... No), or "direct injection is better then any type of fuel system, Like... Ever!" (Jesus Christ, NO). Each has their "thing", but it's still just a piston in a tube. Don't over think it. You obviously don't work on your own bike. You can have your typical twin cam motor apart in 30 minutes. Not so with that over complicated POS Polaris.
Good Snow Mobil though.
Dude…..Take a breath of air, before you pass out 😂👍.
Victory was a very nice bike, however their bikes never had the “fit and finish” that Harley bikes offered. 💯
Victory couldn’t break themselves away from “Plastachrome Parts”, therefore the bike was not recognized as “being on the same playing field” as Harley Davidson.
Victory was more comparable to a Honda, than a Harley.
I keep going on about the one Victory demo day I went to 6-7 years ago but they were great bikes. Comfortable for shortys like me and big bikes for my friends, engines with all the power you want and could ride for days. Even after they closed down I could have other riders who would talk about them. There was one time I passed 4-5 outside a hotel, might have been the owners club. I'm sorry they're gone but I love my Scout
Harley is Harley.
Nothing else is like a Harley no matter how hard they try
Victory didn't try to sound like a Harley. Victory went the other way with handling and performance over cloning Harley. No victory looks like any harley. That a why I have both.
@@russrogers728 Polaris made a mistake they should have stuck with victory instead of trying to build Indian as a competitive brand
Thats right, no one else builds crap motorcycles like Harley
Harley Davidson is a Tee-Shirt company. Nothing more.
@@dt3992 while it is true they are a very famous fashion designer they also sell some very fine motorcycles if you like that sort of thing
Merry Christmas and thanks for the great videos, plus all your followers.
We have some awesome subscribers on this channel! Merry Christmas and I hope you have a wonderful holiday!
I feel like I wasted 11 minutes watching that. I own a Victory Kingpin and my attraction was it NOT being a Harley. I love the sound, look, and simplicity of my Victory. I do all my own maintenance. So I have to clean my throttle body and run 100% gas. I have riden several Harleys and they are wonderful bikes but if I every replace my Vic it will be with another Victory or a Indian.. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but you seem like a true Harley fan. I'm definitely not downing Harleys. Some people just want something different. It's funny how people assume every Vtwin wants to be a Harley. I guess all sport bikes want to be a Ducati. No thanks on subscribing here.
Sorry to hear you're not subscribing, Victory was an awesome motorcycle and it's a true shame Polaris shuttered the brand. The design is of the engines is great, I'd love to see it come back some day. But Polaris acquiring Indian and that being a "designer name" I guess you could say I was worried they would axe Victory. I don't know of any other major US manufacturing company that would be able to purchase the rights to Victory but I wish someone would.
My Cross country is my go to for touring, stone reliable, low maintenance, and very well made.
Victory had a very solid engine and a good design, really a shame they shut down.
117k milage my 06 victory king still rockin and rolling.
Still love when people come up to me and ask wow wtf is that!
I really enjoy these comparisons you've been doing very interesting for me
Thank you, I really appreciate! It's been for years every manufacturer out there that build a cruiser took a look at Harley and built it around that style.
My harley and victory baggers look nothing alike from the motors to the frames to the suspension. The only way they are similar thing is two tires. That's why I like both they are opposite vtwinn's.
Just want to thank you for all the helpful reviews on the legendary HARLEY brand. Great tips and helpful mods. Have a great New Years!
Happy new year! Thank you for watching, I appreciate the support!
Still have my Victory just sold my Street Glide and bought a 2016 Yahama Raider looking like I'm going to sell the 8 Ball soon.
Victory didn’t fail. I love my 2016 highball.
Bought my first harley a few months ago. New 2021 street bob and I absolutely love it. Love the 114 m8 engine. You are correct with the sound IMO. My buddy has a victory 8 ball and the exhaust note just doesn't do it for me. My father's 2009 electra glide to me has the best sounding engine out of all of them. Great video
Right on!
ever listen to a Victory or Indian start up? Sounds like a high pitch whine
@@snakebite6511 I actually don't mind the Indian chief bobber. I looked at one and was considering it instead of the harley street bob. The reason I didn't buy the Indian is 2 reasons. 1 the fact there is only 1 dealership in my state even tho its less than 5 miles from my house. 2 I actually brought my ninja 1000 there a few years ago since it's and Indian/suzuki dealership and was up until recently a kawasaki dealership all in one. I didn't buy my kawasaki from there but they are close to my house and I needed it serviced and they could get me in that week. I brought my bike in and they did the service. When I got my bike back I checked it over like I always do and didn't notice anything. Started riding it home and noticed my front cowl seemed a bit raised up. Pulled over and inspected it. They broke my whole cowl off my bike and tried 😤 to glue it back on!! And not tell me!!! Went back and confronted them. They did order me a new one cause they knew they got caught! Shady dealership so I won't be going back there for any services. So buying an Indian from there and having it serviced there as the onky option in my state is a no go for me!!! They lost a customer.
@@jacobhiggins1195 I have a buddy here that got a new Indian Scout bobber, his 1st new bike and was in love with that thing. a few weeks later he took it in for its 1st service and they got it up on the lift did the work, all was good , called him and said the bike was ready, he told them he would pick it up by the end of the day. Gets there and sees the bike is crashed, they didnt tell him they dropped it off the lift, took them 6 weeks to get the parts and the bike repaired and in a state where there is a shortened riding season his season was over.
They would not even replace the parts with upgraded for the inconvenience. They were total asshats about it.
I understand things happen by accident but this is now a damaged bike, they should have compensated him with upgraded parts. I find many of the Indian dealerships are sketchy because they sell multiple brands and the dealerships have 1 mechanic authorized to work on Indian. This particulate dealership sells Indian, Polaris, KTM & Royal Enfield.
I have a 2009 Harley Davidson Ultra Classic with Vance and Hines slip ons . That exhaust sound causes people to stop and stare when I ride by it's so sweet .
A fellow i work with has a big Victory. He loves it and won't be going back to HD.
I swear this is the best channel on TH-cam.
Thank you, I appreciate it!
First bike was a 07 Vegas with a 100ci. Holy smokes that thing was fun to ride. Loud, fast, and great looking. Ended up trading it in on an Indian last year. While the Indian is more comfortable, it doesn't have the same effect when I twist the throttle. If the Victory didn't need an unavailable speed sensor, I'd still have it around.
Victory build one hell of a motor, that's the bad part now is they are still selling parts but not all of them are available anymore.
Aw you could of installed a steel frame one and it's really not all that hard. Rylan from Vic shop has a video on how to do it. Come back to the Vic side. you know you would of rather had a 116 big bore Vegas or in your case a 110. oooeeee such fun bikes.
The Victory engine was and is a bullet proof design and I loved it. Victory engines were state of the art with gear drive primary, single hole oil fill and drain, chain drive overhead cams with no pushrods to fail.
Harley owners ain't happy unless they can ''improve'' things. Aftermarket or Screamin' Eagle performance parts , they (we!) for better or worse , just can't leave them alone or stock. There really was not a large high-performance aftermarket for Victory. Plus they were sold and serviced by Polaris dealers who were more into off-road toys than road going motorcycles , and didn't really seem to want 'bikers' in their shops asking questions they couldn't answer. The few Victory owners I know do ride often and far , and are happy at how few problems they have and relatively little maintenance they require compared to a Harley.
That's a really good point I forgot to mention in the video, you didn't see any "Victory Dealers". They were always sold through a power sports dealer under the umbrella of other brands. That was always a red flag to me, the guy who works on side by sides, dirt bikes and 4 wheelers servicing my bagger?
Nailed it. They even brought in Arlen Ness to try and get some of that "build MY bike" fever.
I know several victory mechanics that have never worked on side by sides only victory, also a Harley mechanic that works at a victory dealer which now he is a indian mechanic. Why would that matter, mechanics work on ford, chevy, and dodge
Mine is bone stock other than the seat. Even my exhaust is factory. I learned a long time ago if you want to start breaking things and investing in constant maintenance do an “upgrade”. Other than that the cost for upgrades compared to horsepower gained 1: makes no sense and 2: isn’t needed. With my current bike which is a 2019 road king and the many metric bikes I’ve owned before this one all I’ve had to do is change oil.
Having owned several victory motorcycles and I can tell you they are some of the most amazing machines. The only reason I own a Harley Davidson is because they stop building Victory.
When Victory first came out I did machining on the heads at the company I worked for. Very tight tolerances. No I didn't buy one, even at a discount. I did like the look of the Vargas, which came later. I have a 2011 twin cam and a 1978 Shovel. In my humble opinion nothing beats the exhaust notes of the shovel.
Absolutely nothing beat the sound of the Shovel, Victory was a very tight engine which was impressive being air cooled.
I prefer the notes.of a knuckle, but reliability it's a Shovel for sure
Great video GixxerFoo: I used to have two Victorys. 2013 Vctory Cross Country and a 2013 Victory Judge. Both bikes with Stage 1. I love them. On the Cross Country I put 40,000 miles in 3 years and never an issue. I got it brand new in 2014. After Polaris kill the brand I got very dissapointed and went back to HD. Currently own a 2013 V-ROD Muscle (daily rider) and a 2011 Softail Fatboy (Travels out of town or when the GF is tagging along). I think what kill the brand was not enough PR and Marketing, they new push the brand like they are doing with the Indian. I am afraid they will eventually kill the Indian brand if sales don't pick-up. Also not too many dealerships compared with HD. Love your videos. Keep doing a great job.
I'm getting 80 whp and 103 wtq from a 100ci Stage 1 K&N filter upgraded intake covet, PC5, and RPW slash. Intake upgrade will add a few more. Great video.
Excelente comparison, you are correct, what killed the Victory was the sound, I have a 2012 Victory Cross country Tour and 2012 Harley CVO ultra classic 110 both with sleep-on mufflers, everything eagle stock.
Hands down the Victory in much better all around bike, than the 110 CVO.
Thank you for your great videos.
Lol Victory didn't fail. 😂 They outperformed, were far superior in reliability, and mechanically more advanced. They had a poor marketing department and not many people outside of the dealership actually knew about them. The only reason Victory isn't around anymore is because Polaris decided in 2017 to look at sales between the Indian restart (Had Heritage with the name going for it) and the Victory line. The Indian line has a couple percentage points more than the Victory. So Polaris shut it down and they took the Victory R&D, and started putting it into their Indian line. The Indian Challenger with the 108CI is a prime example of this.
Thank you for making this comparison. HappY Holidays to you and your family.
Let's face it the name of Harley and status killed victory. You could buy a cross country with more storage than an ultra glide, better handling, more power etc.. even to this day I see people on TH-cam test drive the challenger and say it is better than there road glide as they pull away on there harley because it is a status symbol. The people I run into that are on an indian or victory don't care about fitting in status they just want a better machine out of the box without putting thousands in to make it the same as the competition. Lol
The transmission problem was solved by 2002. The crank breather is very simple to vent. There are eight gaskets in the Victory engine. Put in a free flow intake like Lloyd's Torque Tubes, and a free flowing exhaust, and you dyno at more than the factory advertised numbers. The EPA sucks for both Victory and HD. The stator is in the cover, for better cooling. I can change a drive belt in around an hour. On the side of the road. Victory Six Speeds didn't shell our like Harleys did, and Baker even had problems. I think the problem with Victory is the same type if mindset that calls a Sportster a "girls bike", couldn't accept another American motorcycle, especially one that was faster without having to re-engineer the factory. I love Harleys, but I F'n love Victorys. .lol.
A very nice job of explaining the Victory engine and comparing it to the Harley V-Twin. I laughed at you use of the term “metric manufactures.” lol
Lol well I am trying to be nice, the metric bikes just couldn't quite get there.
Another great video I owned a victory Vegas Jackpot for me a great bike . One of the issues with them are the throttle bodies they have to cleaned every 2500miles .Asign of this is the idle drops yes you can adjust manually adjust the idle screw but eventually you have have to do the cleaning .keep up the good work please🇬🇧
Just got my 2016 victory cross country 2weeks ago hands down best bike
I’ve owned several Harley’s and about 6 months ago I bought a 2013 Victory Cross Country, when I did the test ride there were a few things I didn’t like but figured I could change them easy enough. I mean who doesn’t make changes when they buy a bike. But there are a few things I haven’t been able to fix to my liking. The Victory CC has wind buffering like crazy. I though it was from the short windshield but that wasn’t it. The wind comes up from below. Everyone you talk to has a different fix - so far it hasn’t worked for me. The throttle is cables and when the cruise is set you can’t hold the grip tight or it will not allow the cruise control to work right. It’s a pain in the mountains!
The engine sounds different but it sounds good with aftermarket exhaust or I should say modified stock mufflers.
I’m about to my wits end with the Vic and about ready to make the move back to Harley.
Same bike. I'm 6'-0" tall. Fork mounted wind deflectors took care of the buffeting. Witchdoctors sells them in flat black or bare metal. I also installed a Klock Werks flare windshield that may have helped some too, but the deflectors worked in a major way for me!
I had a vulcan 1600 that sounded more harley than some Harleys. Great bikes.
Lol yup me to 08 nomad sounds awesome
So, in a nutshell. He basically says the Victory produced more power and was less expensive with a more modern design. But since the bike didn't sound like a Harley people didn't buy it. Sound's like a Harley rider all summed up. Buying a bike for the sound. I also love how he described the Harley sound (to the dump, to the dump, to the dump).
Victory was a great bike, it just didn't catch on widely. It was still pricey but it had it's following. They tried hard to market the bike and they did a great job of doing so, hell it even had great dealer support. Just didn't catch fire and sway the masses. What l didn't like is the way Polaris shut the doors and turned its back on all the owners.
No one can deny the fact that the Victory was a engine that was and still is a bulletproof, low maintenance design. Oil changes are easy, less moving parts, simplified drive belt changes, easy clutch pack replacement, no pushrods. Then Indian came back owning both companies and improved the twin cam, they did it again with their Challenger & scout that are liquid cooled with even more technology. No Harley Davidson has got with the program with their Revolution Max same case transmission and over head cams.
Victory and Indian are some awesome engines for sure, I am waiting a few years to see how this new Harley platform plays out.
Merry Christmas, and have a great and safe new year!
Incorrect on the trans issues with the 99-01, they are loud yes, but all vics change gears loudly, but no, neutral is very easy to find. Their issue was the design of the shaft, and it would actually wear out the casing it slides thru which is part of the case. Another issue were the dogs in the trans, they would break.
All that stuff he talked about in the video....yeah, I didn't look at any of that when I bought my Vic. Love my Vic.
Merry Christmas. Thank you for all the awesome videos.
Merry Christmas! You're welcome and thank for your support on the channel!
I owned 2 Vic Cross Country bikes. Wonderful bikes. Never an issue. Indian is the new Victory.
I sat my FI RK next to my Carb RK idling and the carb sound was better for sure
You can't beat the lope of the carbed bikes, they sound so good. The FI bikes are easy starting and have their benefits but they still idle at 1,000 to maintain oil pressure.
@@GixxerFoo 2 years late, but your way off, Victory's oil pumps put out "way" more oil pressure than Harleys at Idle and higher RPM's something close to 50psi at Idle and up to 70psi at higher RPM's while Harleys would literally put out less than 10psi at Idle, Yes you heard me right less than 10psi in some cases, Now that is down right pathetic and asking for engine damage on cold starts, especially for those that just crank the bikes up and go without letting them warm up.. I literally just watched a video a couple days ago from a motorcycle mechanic that worked on both Vics and HD.. I will post the link if I can still pull it up on my google history..
th-cam.com/video/KueK_pyJHJE/w-d-xo.html start watching at around 2.5 minutes in until the end for the oil pump talk..
I always heard "potato, potato, potato" but "to the dump, to the dump, to the dump" is funnier.
Lol right?!
Parts support and horrible dealer experience made me dump my 2016 Victory 106 XC. I bought it because of the promised 10 years of parts support and there isn't any freaking way I'm buying a fake ass wannabe Japanese-Harley V-twin. Now the Victory.... Inverted forks, cast aluminum frame far better motor, power, no leaks, easy low maintenance, change a drive belt in 20 minutes. I could go on for 50 more items. The sound, really. I doubt you could hear it unless you were on the Indian or Harley I just blew by. I say big F U to Polar-ass. I'll never buy a fake Indian brand as long as Polar-ass own's the name because what they did to Victory owners. Go look at the flagship Indian Challenger. Its 100% Victory. Compare it next to an Indian. Then look at a Vic, then you tell me. I'll be at the HD dealer. Unless I'm riding a sport bike. I'm hopefull that will change too. I 👍 and subscribed. Good stuff!
Thank you for the sub! Victory parts are already getting hard to come by and the dealers that originally sold Victory won't work on them anymore.
I wouldn’t state that Victory failed. They did a remarkable job with building good bikes, setting up dealers and providing good sales and service support etc. When Polaris obtained The Indian brand it made more sense for them to cease production of the Victory brand and go forward with the Indian brand.
SALES say Victory failed. It was a business and its products were soundly rejected by the buying public. Mechanically they're fine but motorcycles are toys and styling is critical.
@@Comm0ut LOL Victory didn’t fail, far from it. They acquired the Indian brand and basically rebranded under the Indian name. They weren’t rejected and actually had strong enough sales to gain market share from Harley and the Jap cruisers. You’re an idiot.
@@Comm0ut No they don’t. Victory was a success. Only an idiot would think otherwise.
I currently own 2 HDs but used to own a '13 Victory CCT. I really loved the CCT but love my HDs more.
That said, I think Victory's failing was its marketing. I used to subscribe to a bunch of motorcycle
magazines and after about 2015 you NEVER saw any ads for Victories in ANY of them. It's as if
Polaris just gave up right when Victory seemed like it was catching on. Once Polaris discontinued
Victory in late 2016, I sold it (my wife and I ride all over the country, need a good dealer network)
and bought my first HD (Ultra Limited). I've enjoyed the sound, yes, but also the nearly infinite
performance and other upgrades available. I've done a Stage II on my Ultra Ltd and it pulls like a
freight train -- way more than any Victory or Indian I've ridden (including the Thunderstroke 116).
Victory tried hard for years to get people swayed, including a heavy presence at Sturgis. But you're right their advertising really disappeared after 2015. They wonder why it wasn't turning a profit those last few years too.
earlier this year, i have a 15 CCT, 16 Magnum and an 07 Jackpot, sold them all in Marley/April of 2021. They were awesome bikes but the aftermarket was weak to say the least and even Indian isn't much better.
I found dealers didnt care because as you said, they are all multi brand dealers and most have 1 mechanic certified to work on a Victory.
I still love the look of the Victory and the Harley
I have a 09 Rocker C, 14 Wide Gile and 21 Street Glide and i can get any performance part i want with a drive 15 minutes to Harley where they have 15 mechanics on staff.
Thank you for the breakdown! I almost bought one, however, Just that..... I wanted the sound, and after looking into it
the dealer support was weak. I've broke down in PoDunk before on a 79 shovel, and low and behold I found parts for it
at 7-11. figuratively speaking. The basis for my second reason to stay with Harley.
Thank you and Merry Christmas
That is because HDs are more likely to breakdown. I know I own one.
@@fogit4668 most of the time it's due to poor maintenance 👍
@@brandonmacon3317 Yeah right. I am always changing fluids on time or early using synthetic oils and greases. What is the excuse for a new bike scissoring its flywheel while being driven at the dealers parking lot? Oh and it was a slow take off.
Harley played Polaris. The Vic engine was far superior to the TC at the time. The Vic had none of the ridiculous vibration at idle and the 4 valve heads made linear power across the rev range. Besides shaking the TCs (and Indians for that matter) get to about 4k rpm and give up the ghost. They make a little more power at low rpm than the Vics, but for riding beyond stoplights, the Vic engine was simply better.
HD got Polaris sucked into making that hot, gutless 2 valve engine for that Indian, while they were refining their own engine into a mostly smooth, cool running, 4 valve design.
I don't know if that was intentional, but it was quite the coincidence. AFAIC, HD wiped the floor w/ Polaris at that point. Polaris has since had to create another bike to try to save face, but while quicker, it lost simplicity of being a big air cooled bagger.
Man I know you ain't knocking them sweet vibrations! Sounds like you need a gold wing
@@brandonmacon3317 I like the thrum of a twin going down the road, but don't care a thing for be shaken a mixed drink sitting at stop lights.
Thanks! Have a nice Christmas.
Merry Christmas! I hope you have a wonderful holiday!
Victory had some cool looking bikes for sure, But in my humble opinion, No Bike ever made was or is as beautiful as a 2012 HD Fatboy Lo, nothing beats timeless beauty with an old school look that will get a node from Grandpa for sure. And I can tell Grandpa I walked past Ultras and Street Glides to special order it at the time 😎👍
That Fatboy Lol was a start in the lineup, it literally had the new school and old school blended together seamlessly. It could be either depending on how you saw that bike, Victory had a really futuristic spin which was a shame it just didn't take off.
I own a 2013 victory XC and a 2017 road glide special and if im absolutely honest.with the exception of aftermarket parts and the size of the gas tank, the Vic is just a much better bike all around. Polaris discontinued the line to put all of thier r&d behind the indian brand which from a business standpoint is a smart idea. The Resultat of that move is what can be seen in the 2024 hd touring line up.
They failed because they picked Indian end of story. I'm keeping my X1 until it's done. 👍💪
Victory was a better designed, better built product. The brand dwindled due to a few things; Lack of aftermarket support, Radical designs that turned off most riders, and management's continued pursuit of other brands to pull into its fold forcing Victory to face growing competition from other brands (not just HD) without financial support. If Polaris had not killed it off, it would have come back. Proof of this is simple; aftermarket support finally began to care and we saw it shortly before the big announcement, new designs that took the ride back to basics and gave riders something new that was edgy and not radical (eg High Ball), Indian sales numbers rely heavily on overseas markets success (meaning Americans still want something other than Indian).
I say GixxerFoo has one of the best MC channels on u tube .
Thank you, I appreciate it!
The Victory was by far the better motorcycle, tradition and name is what keeps Harley alive.
As a three Victory owner. They only sound different at idle.
Victory are a better product then harley in my opinion , the Indian challenger was going to be the latest victory so it still live on
Saw a Victory bagger at the shop the other day and it looked like a cross between a UFO and a jetski!
They had some unique style for sure... I can't say I disagree though lol
Love the video. Merry Christmas fellow Okie.getting ready to go for a ride before the kids show up. The weather is beautiful here!
Merry Christmas! The weather has been amazing here lately, now Saturday it's supposed to go to crap!
Lol, @ 6.50 that was my transmission (or whatever was left of it). This was due to a well known issue of the dreaded circlip on the transmission main shaft getting loose. A 20 Cent part causing catastrophic damage. First sign is a clattering noise on left hand turns and bike on side stand. Next it will jump out of gear under heavy acceleration. Then kaboom! Might add Polaris ended up supplying a long motor free of charge after a long battle. The new motor is flawless after 60,000kms.
Merry Christmas!
Some agreements but several disagreements
I’ve owned both, my last being a 2015 Magnum Stealth edition and before that, a FLTRXS.
My *only* complaint after several trips from TX to lost wages, then west TX to TPA was the less than ideal wind buffeting from the shield. My last trip from Katy to TPA was straight thru; that alone should attest to their comfort.
Victory did more to push HD out of their comfort zone, forcing them to step up to the plate.
Personally, since Polaris dumped on Vic owners, I’ll never purchase their products again. Considering the bullshit Erik Buell went through, I’ll never own anything HD
Polaris has a history of leaving customers in the cold, they did that watercraft and now with Victory motorcycles. Parts are available for ten years, but good luck finding a shop to work on them. The places I know that sold Victory they will tell you to kick rocks very politely in most cases. I think the dealers got the shaft from Polaris too, it sounds like it was a bad deal.
Unfortunately Polaris ruined Victory. The victory 106 is hands down 100% better than the Harley engine.
I like the Victory bikes. Some different art deco designs and American made. Seems like you can buy them relatively cheap. Still like my Road Glide though.
12 gaskets vs 64????
I had a 2013 Victory Cross Country Tour. It was a fantastic bike. I did many trips on that motorcycle including across country and back. It was tremendously reliable, and easy to work on. The only downside was it couldn’t handle hitting a deer. I totaled 2 years ago.
I loved my 03 Vegas v92. Would of never gotten rid of it, if there wasn't a parts issue. Never leaked oil like my 17 sportster 48. Also the transmission was way more responsive. More than likely I'll get a scout once I pay it off. Not feeling the maintenance and the left side forward control wore out at 10,000 miles. That's a little ridiculous if you ask me
Hi Gixxer great info as usual.
Merry Christmas to you and your family all the best from NZ 🇳🇿.
Harley forever
Thank you, Merry Christmas!
I love my 2006 Vegas! I hope and pray some day Victory will come back on a smaller scale or Indian will make a similar bike with the same tooling.
Victory are some really cool bikes, it's a shame they killed it off. I would love to see Victory come back myself too, it was a great platform.
@@GixxerFoo I have a bad habit of collecting motorcycles that no longer exist.
2002 Honda VTX 1800
2003 Yamaha Roadstar Warrior
2006 Victory Vegas
Yes I think if indian or Polaris made a very similar platform as the CCT it would do well and maybe mend some of the hard feelings to !
At two o clock in the morning that's all pretty funny stuff right there..
Amen; overhead cams have more parabolic friction . I watched a late hells angel movie. Many were riding victories. Got to be American made . Rules -
✊🏻👌👍
Sound is key - 😁
They were kinda funky lookin 👀
Great video: I think you covered all bases .
Around 2015-ish....I was looking for a bagger. I took 4 bikes for test rides at the dealer. A Victory 8-Ball, a Harley Road King and Springer, and a Indian Chief. Of all the bikes, I actually liked the Victory the best, followed by the Indian. The 2 Harleys were just ok. I ended up getting a used 2008 Street Bob. Fast forward to 2020 and now I'm REALLY looking for a bagger. Victory was now gone, so it came down to the Indian and Harley. I walked into the Indian dealership looking for a Chieftan. The sales person says it's MSRP is 26k. I asked the sales person what deals they were doing on them. He said nothing....it's 26k. I go to the Harley dealership and see a nice Street Glide....again 26k. But before I even asked....they tell me they are having a sale on them for 22K. I wanted to trade in my Street Bob...and they were willing to give me $5500 for it.....$500 more than what I paid for it. Needless to say....I now own a Street Glide. Indian may end up going the way of Victory if they don't change their marketing/pricing strategy.
the victory was twice the cycle of any Harley ever made.
Victory had a very nice design and they were headed in a great direction, just a shame Polaris canned it.
Hey that’s why they sold so many of them.
Still rolling my 2007 100 cu inch victory Arlen Ness Jackpot in black with green flames. Trouble free.
Those are some good looking bikes! Victory was a very solid platform, it's still such a shame they shut that brand down. I would of loved to have the choice of a Victory, Harley or Indian on the show rooms today.
@@GixxerFoo I really have a tough time looking at Indian after getting that letter from Polaris about 10 year factory support in 2017 when the brand closed. I sold my 2010 cross country then and haven't taken a hard look at Indian
People guy HD over other brands for the same reason they might pay double for a Caddie over a GM when, in some models, there's a negligible difference between the two outside of styling. There's an image tied to brands and status. Other brands have been making objectively better bikes than HD for decades, usually for a lower price, and they can't "beat" HD. They've become a cultural icon. That, coupled with their dealers support, solidly keeps them in place. It's tied to the same reasons that any time HD tries to progress with styles or technology, like with the VROD, shit crashes and burns. It's not a "real" HD and not part of that cultural icon. The thing keeping them alive is also the poison that's killing them slowly.
I've had a couple of Victorys both the 100 engine and the 106.
Victory just couldn't get Harley owners to try their products which was a shame because even Sonny Barger knew that the Victory was a better bike as he used them in his film Dead in five heartbeats.
The Victorys I've owned are at opposite ends of the spectrum too as I first had a Vegas and then a Cross Country. Both were really well engineered and IMO far, far better standard of finish than any Harley that I've ridden including the Sport Glide I rode last year. I've ridden long distances on both marques and the Victorys are better on fuel and have more power.
Victory made some awesome bikes they just struggled to sway people away from Harley. It's hard to get people off of Harley's even though the product is leaps and bounds ahead.
Thanks I have a friend with a victory always claiming his bike is superior to my Harley and ol Buell
The Victory had it's good points about it, it was a more modern design but they didn't have the fit and finish of the Harley-Davidson. Parts are going to get pretty scarce here in the coming years unfortunately much in the Buell parts are now.
A few reasons why they didn't make in the market. Mainly it was a small dealer network which made it hard to grow. One huge advantage HD has is they carry most of their own financing, and also have an unbelievable repossession rate. Victory was entering into a heavily saturated cruiser market as well. They just couldn't gain a large enough foothold or name was all. They didn't carry most of their own financing and early on the styling wasn't great. They got Arlen Ness in for styling which was great and well received, but if people can't find dealers it doesn't matter. When Polaris was able to buy the Indian name they now owned something with a strong name and needed to put everything into building an entirely new line. Victory was basically doomed from that point. Slowly victory development is being added to the Indian line, like the challenger which was victory's new engine. The scout was built right off the octane. Victory really just didn't grow, so was replaced. Nothing wrong with the bikes really, just too few dealers and getting units out the door.
Merry Christmas Dude.
Merry Christmas! I hope you have a wonderful holiday!
Great vid Gixer. I ride a carby 2005 Softail, I ride with a number of boys with a mixture of bikes ranging from Victory, Triumph, and even a Honda Fury. All comment on not only how great my bike sounds - but how distinctive the bike sounds. I think you hit the nail on the head in your vid. Merry Christmas from downunder.
Far from it.
I have a victory note. It takes one oil and one filter --- owe by the way it has 4 valves per cyclinder
Marketing that's what killed Victory. They were a motorcycle company that sold clothing on the side. Harley is an apparel company that sell motorcycles, the were also a bowling company at one point too
Great history lesson! Love your channel!! 🤟
Thank you, I appreciate it!
Thank you again! Another very informative video.
My pleasure!
I had a new victory in 2001, i felt that the o/h cam engine gave the bike a taller seat height and felt wide in the saddle. The aftermarket was almost non existent at that time as far as exhaust, seats, performance parts. I went to a older high mile evo bagger just for the aftermarket support.
Love your take on this