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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- New Harley Evolution Engines? Sort of, Harley didn't have the best patent on the Evo and this allowed the aftermarket to produce engines based on the Evo engine design but without Harley's factory faults. If your current Evo engine is worn out and tired, you could rebuild it and put a little power in it while you're at it. But... you could also just replace the stock engine with a complete replacement that's built for some high horsepower and potentially spend just as much as would with a complete rebuild on your stock engine. Aftermarket crate engines are completely brand new from the cases up, these are designed right from the start for some heavy horsepower and torque. With that design in mind they've engineered out the factory issues, cracked engine cases, cylinder studs pulling out of the cases and over heating. You get the big horsepower and torque without sacrificing the reliability which fades when you put the big power in the factory Harley Evo.
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Would you go all out rebuilding your stock engine or go with a new complete crate engine?
Yep, when my current '88 tc tanks, I will consider a new crate engine. At the moment it has 150K km on it with a dyno run tune giving it 80 hp[no tq info available] so hopefully it will run some more km's😀
If it wasn't for racing I would buya S&S for the performance and reliability aspects. They have done all the work!
I’d probably just gut the existing engine. My evo is a springer and I think the stock evo is a perfect, ‘correct’ fit to a bike like that. If I want something faster, I’d just buy another bike, but these crates are super impressive.
No worries with a new engine, well most times.
@@GixxerFoo Could you suggest a good cam for a 2013 ultra limited, I have a 2 into1 Bassanl exhaust k&n filter vision plus tuner? I am looking to get a good sound at idle and normally ride mid to higher ram the bike has 19000 miles on it never had and engine issues other than compensator noise in primary fixed with Baker attitude manual chain adjuster.
My 103 has 92000 miles...still going strong. Regular fluid changes and rode hard. Cheers brothers👍🍻
That's awesome to hear! That is just proof that not all the TC motors have issues!
Mine is about to roll over 57,000, I swapped my cam chain tensioner shoes at 54,000. Had .0035 crank runout. Still going strong!!
92,000 wow that's a lot of riding
Evo engines are crazy easy (and fairly cheap) to rebuild. I'm perfectly fine with the original horse power. I bought mine to cruise on, not to race.
Parts for Evos are plentiful and cheap, they are everywhere too! I you decide you want a little power bump a Andrews EV27 bolt in cam is a awesome Evo cam!
@@GixxerFoo Music to my ears. I just want to cruise, and do it for a long many years. I don't need a beastly beast, just gotta make the sound of that motor smoother and make sure it can keep going and take me where it's pretty. :)
You Sir are 100%CORRECT!
Absolutely. Stupid people want to keep dumping money into a machine to get more out of it and that starts the domino effect., constantly chasing the weak link.
Nice... I am gaining so much information just reading the replies
👍 ty everyone
Having grown up with my relatives always being loyal to S&S for performance parts it’d be hard for me to choose anything else, not to mention their Knucklehead and Pandemonium engines being the most aesthetically beautiful choices as well as preforming so much better than stock which of course hasn’t been produced in over 50 yrs.
Love your content. I work sales at a Harley dealership, and your videos help me a ton with my knowledge of new and used bikes. I share your videos with a bunch of customers depending on what they're asking.
I bought a brand new S&S Evo engine, complete with no carb around 10/2022. Had it in the bike by 12/2022 and used a nos Cv carb (had to be rebuilt because it was still in the original box from 1997). It runs great. It does need a few minutes to warm up with the choke on when you start it but once it's going I have no problems with it.
Mind me asking how much you pay for the evo s&s?
@@neveragain9380I bought it without a carb just the plain motor at that time it was 4800
@@benzielke7149from where and what size engine?
Try jetying the nos carb correctly
@@theoneracer2716 I actually checked in to that and did put slightly bigger jets in it. Runs even smoother now, and accelerating has no (not sure of the right word) resistance or you don't get that feeling like it's trying to push but it can't... I think it wasn't getting enough gas.
Thanks for the update on Evo’s , I have a ‘97, it’s my youngest bike, the rest are pre ‘56. Sounds like a better way to go when the time comes. The old school bikes I can go through and bring back to life, but all this new stuff and computers, I’m to old 🤪😂😳
That 97 Evo is still pretty easy to work on!
My 1998 Evo cases are stamped with a dash 95 casting number indicative of their upgraded castings due to being EFI era motors. These cases are of a MUCH better quality than their predecessors and aren't known for cracking etc like the others were. Just thought I'd share some of this useless information with you guys. Many folks bore out their spigot holes to accommodate a larger bore with no problems. EFFE (Evo's Forever Forever Evo).
For me the evo is fantastic exactly because it is rebuildable by me. Both by way of ability and wallet. The hobby aspect.
It's awesome how much more inexpensive the Evo parts are these days compared to the Twin Cam!
@@GixxerFoo so I am a car guy and just moved to somewhere where I only have space for a bike so I got edumucated in the dark arts so I would still have something to tinker. So much cheaper and less work it is ridiculous. Fear of death really keeps the band wagon small.
I think I did ok with my Evo for 300 bucks and after chasing down missing parts I have 1200 in it it's the 1998 and my understanding is it is most reliable engine they ever produced,,,I just want a cruiser,, and I fitted it to a 1971 Sportster frame,, wasn't easy but I made it happen
300 bucks isn't bad at all for Sportster engine! They usually want a grand for one that's not even complete.
my dad got the S&S 111 for his heritage springer after it spun a bearing in the bottom end on a stock engine. He had it for less than 1600 miles and it became an expensive paperweight, he contacted S&S and got his warranty and paid to have the second one put in and then 1500 miles later it's already making a ton of noise and has shavings in the oil. S&S told him the second motor didn't get a warranty and kept pushing him around and not honoring an engine with 1500 miles on it. Could just be two bad motors but my dad is religious on break in specs, maintenance, and service on his bike and they basically told him sorry you spent $7000 on two junk motors. Not sure if it's just a problem with the 111 or if my dad just got two duds but it is something definitely worthy of note
Now stories like this scare me. I thought S&S were the best and you paid for them NOT to have that exact problem. Any update?
@@ditchcatiso the update is about the wildest thing, my dad gave me the bike and we went through all the fluids and did an oil and filter change and now it makes no noise and no shavings and it runs like a dream. I’ve been riding it for a year with literally no problems, I put like 5000 on it and now it’s been a great bike
I would just go with the crate engine before rebuilding the old EVO, nicely done brother💯👊🏽😎
Thanks 👍 I think I would too, by the time you bought a set of aftermarket cases, all the high end parts and got it together you'd be right there with the price of a complete engine. Even then you still wouldn't have warranty on the engine itself.
@@GixxerFoo truth brother💯
I agree.After doing some serious reserch it was way cheaper to replace mine in my 98 fat boy over rebuilding the stock motor.And it only had 24k on the motor.I plan to find a classic hard tail for the stock that I took out and make it a project for my grandson and I to build together.I had always enjoyed The late Indian Larry's still and that's kinda what I have a plan for.
Because you don't know how to rebuild an EVO dummy
@@GixxerFoo Are these older frames and drive trains engineered for 100+hp? I think I would just go with the 80in, since, it's already a substantial increase in power over the original. Thanx for the vid/info!
My Bagger originally came with a S&S bottom 88 Stroker probably 1995 vintage end few years later it was making the weirdest noise. dozens of Harley mechanics listened to it & the noise would travel from one side to the other. Ran awesome. One night I stop at a gas station start it back up went 100' & it shut off ,crank, crank ,crank.... nothing!! until I see the oil puddle forming under me. Exploratory Surgery Found the pinion broke from the steel boss in the case where the bearing rides was cracked & flopping around & basically the entire right side of the engines crank shaft was being held up by the pinion bushing on the cam cover UNTIL the pinion broke. NOW its wall art. with the 2 piece pinion shaft.
Oh damn... that sucks. That was one of those hard part failures that isn't common and you wouldn't of caught it unless you tore the bike down and inspected the internals.
@@GixxerFoo yea for sure. Go till it blows. I have a S&S 88 back in there.Just one of those things. Id know that sound if i heard it again!! Lmao.
Ive been taking a hard look at the v111. Almost a no brainer when it comes time. Even the v80 would be a great choice for me.
Those two me are the best options for a Evo replacement. The V80 is very solid motor and produces great power. Lol the V111 that things going to burn through some tires.
S&S all the way up!
I put an SNS110 in a trike what what a job the people were super nice over the phone and walk me through everything. Thank you SNS
S&S stands behind their products, a friend of mine got a bad TC motor from them. Complete engine failure, they sent him a new motor and paid the cost of swapping it over to the new engine. Paid shipping on the new motor and for the failed engine to be sent back, they wanted to know what went wrong in that motor.
I have a 107 ultima in my 87 dresser. after 35k miles a roller lifter seized and damaged the cam. It is very powerful and runs decent. I had a 110k miles on my Harley motor when it went.
That's a hell of a motor to replace the stock one with, sucks about the lifter though. Were you able to replace the cam and lifters to save the motor?
@@GixxerFoo Yes we did, I called Mid west cycle who deals with Ultima They gave me a whole 10% off the parts. I was upset. I did not want a 107, but they said it was the smallest one the made at the time. It was about 8-9 years ago.
@@joeharley87 "supposedly" Ultima's quality has gotten better 👌 but I don't believe that. I saw a video on TH-cam from Keenan Tatro that broke down a brand new flywheel assembly and the clearance on the rods wasn't all that, he ended up honing it out and installed oversized rollers. Personally, I'd much rather have a local reputable shop that has all of the appropriate machinery for overhauling it. In my opinion if you desire both power and speed buy a BMW. Just my 2 cents... Here's that "playlist". Go to the 14 minute mark of #101, I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT!!!!
th-cam.com/play/PL-BX_Pc-GUyT6C6WMaGVE4QD7J5gB5TBy.html
S&S has been having LOTS of issues with the V111. They have been farming out local shops to address them. I wouldn't own either of these engines...stock Evo in my opinion
@@kennethwise7108where could I get more info on the S&S problems?
I paid almost 10k for my S&S crate 96 cube but I also added Andrews gears and that is a super strong engine.
HD does it with every motor. Once it's been in production long enough to find and fix all the bug , they replace it with a different motor! Some years had bad castings. The last 3-4 years were the best ones quality wise.
They had that 103 about perfected and traded it for the M8, lol that's got it's own set of pit falls.
103 is perfect my cousin build Harleys I'm trying get into motorcycle 6'3 190
I just purchased a Big Dog Ridgeback Chopper.
It came with an S&S V111, with the 585 cam, 125 HP (as per S&S stat sheet i have) EVO mounted to a JIMS 6 speed. Engine fires right up every time. Transmission just chugs along at 75 mph.
Bike is a blast to drive! Aside from hitting major bumps, of course. 😆
A shovelhead , I like your videos but I still don’t understand why a Two cylinder engine would run on average 5 grand. Evo’s are great I’ve owned a few but I’ll stick with my Shovels.
Iv got two shovelhead bikes myself and I love em
@@bryanmartin2271 I do too!
Me too! Love my shovel! I think the older bike sound badass then the new crap.
@@JohnDoe-mt8rf I agree and people are always commenting on how they sound.
Also if they change the motor, that changes the vin #. So,I just rebuilt,.my,70 shovel and tyranny , and kept it original and keeping the orginin vin, plus the value would be shit if changing the motor
I got a Moco crate ( when they were still available) for my Heritage - the original one had lower end molested too much. Nothing special I must say, esp. comparing to my 98 FLTRI ( converted to a carb of course). That one really pulls - I think later EFI evos were pretty good. Those were dino figures, not just gearing. But hey, it's a softail, doesn't hafta pull hard.
So the moral? Both have been reliable and well prooven, ill just change the rings when needed, rebore when measurements are outa spec, repeat. When Im outta bore sizes - buy new jugs, repeat 😁
Installed S&S in 99 evo whjen the crank bearing gave way. Never looked back. But I wouldn't hesitate to buy the American made Revtech. 75k on 2012 Glide. I plan on getting a lot more. Then discuss crate. Only way to go.
I'm a Harley guy. But I ride a great grandfather of the GXSR. A GS850GX.
Good talk.
I went with the S&S V 111 when I restored my 1993 FXR down to the frame. Runs great & strong throughout the whole power band. Shipped to my house I payed $5k. Was a plug & play install. Installed a Thunderjet on the Super E & a 34 tooth tranny pully & a BDL kevlar clutch & a 2into 1 Hacker War Header.Everything is working together perfectly runs alot cooler than my 96 TC.
That's awesome, I bet that motor is fun in a FXR!
@@GixxerFoo Hell Yeah!🤣
$5,000 for a V111 my ass!! 🤣😂🤣😂
@@TheYammerHammer LOL @ the time, I pulled my 2nd rod on my 80" & called S&S to get some info on their 80". Long story short they told me to get the V111 that they were running a sale on the V111 & would be cheaper vs the 80" in black. So I bought it from a company in Georgia for $4800 plus $250 for shipping.
@@robertrodriguez2412 of course they told you to buy a new motor. They're a business that's what they do. Sorry you were unable to work on your motor that sucks. I guess it's just more business for me
I put an s&s 96 in my flhs and it blitzed 88 and 96 twin cams. Like my mate who bought it. A Ducati powered Harley
I remember when the TC motor replaced the Evo. You could buy a brand new , factory 80in Evo at a dealership for just under $2 grand.
That's crazy to think they were that cheap back then!
If you consult the U.S. Dept. of Labor Statistics' Inflation Calculator, that two grand is $3,510.79 in 2022
So, no, they were actually NOT just $2000.00 - nominally yes, but not two grand in todays dollar value. Maybe we all need to be careful not becoming that old timer who brags about "...back in my day, so and so only cost X" 😁
From southern California ~ Ride Forever!
@@GixxerFoo If you consult the U.S. Dept. of Labor Statistics' Inflation Calculator, that two grand is $3,510.79 in 2022
So, no, they were actually NOT just $2000.00 - nominally yes, but not two grand in todays dollar value. Maybe we all need to be careful not becoming that old timer who brags about "...back in my day, so and so only cost X" 😁
From southern California ~ Ride Forever!
That’s one of the problems I had with my S&S 124. It took S&S almost a year to warranty my 124. I took my mostly stock 80 inch EVO out of my Fatboy. I had a 124 put into it. The day we started it up the brand new oil started returning from my engine to my oil bag with silver running all through it. S&S said drain the oil change the filter and flush the system before putting new oil in it. I did all of this and when I started it back up the new oil started to turn silver again.
From that point on it took almost a year to get a new motor and get it installed.
That pretty much made me a bit gun shy of S&S motors….
I would go with an s&s v80 with same nice pipes and a good tune.
The V80 is a solid motor and honestly about the best way to go, the V111 has had some problems.
oh how quickly we forget the facts as it was only 1984 when cycle world magazine ran a special edition featuring the all new FX with the all new evolution 80 cu. in. Gary Bang was the tuner for team Harley racing for the XR750R ..Gary also had done a base line dynomometer run on the Suzuki GSX1100and got 85whp Suzuki claimed 135hp ...with Gary bang nodded heads and various combos of major name brand cams and carbs with a super trapp two in to one the 80 cu. in. factory evolution was making 102whp with stock piston and stock cylinder and amazingly there was no one ever pulling the studs out if the engine cases as the was the big selling point at Sturgis with a cut away of the evo engine showing the half studs with their long stud nuts with a reverse twist on the outside that look much like a reverse drive screw jack that countered the effects of twisting up head studs during assembly and never a subject of failure ... and rev tech engines get high reviews around here especially their 4 valve heads ...and rev tech carbs that where their version of the stock keihin j
Another great informative video. The best value in Harley motors is a Evo crate.
Thank you, Agreed! Crate motors are awesome for Evo engines, they fixed the factory issues and got some power out of them. Still very reliable engines too!
Having grown up with my relatives always being loyal to S&S for performance parts it’d be hard for me to choose anything else
S&S is hard to beat, they've really improved upon the factory motors. Some drag racers prefer Ultima cases but they will generally run S&S components.
I've had a 127 Ultima for 17 years now it has been a good motor I don't abuse it just use it if you thrash any motor well it won't last as long
Richard ignore the haters... i have owned 8 of the 127's in bikes i currently have one in my 1998 bagger which has been in it for 10 years. They run a H beam con rod all the others run an i beam which is weaker.. Bee hive valve springs, Mahle pistons, Johnston lifters, all good gear.. only issues i have seen in 20 years working on these is Lifter failure that can result in cam damage.... People crap on how their factory 80ci ran for 100 thousand miles... the simple fact is its making 40hp has piss weak valve springs and baby cam... The lifter failure is caused by the massive cam and valve springs used in Ultimas which is required to produce the 120+ rear wheel horsepower... I am replacing lifters in a customers bike today as part of routine maintenance engine is 10 years old... Any brand engine will wear lifters if it has a huge cam and strong valve springs... and if you rev the tits off it and bounce the valves your going to kill the lifters sooner... i run my rev limiter at 6000 and ride it pretty hard but i am also going to do lifters in mine pretty soon... small price to pay for triple the HP over 10 years...
@@harryavdoulos4029 curious as to fuel mileage on the 127 for a highway bike, I know there are many variables but big power doesnt neccessarily have to compromise fuel economy
@@thomasborger6548 no idea Thomas it's never crossed my mind as if i wanted Fuel economy i would have kept the original 1340 instead of almost doubling the engine size. i am certainly not filling it every 5 minutes and i believe at times it could use less as it doesn't have to work as hard to move the heavy bagger so light throttle acceleration could be as good if not better but when you keep grabbing and handful it will drink more...
@@harryavdoulos4029 fair enough answer, one of my bikes is an anemic almost stock motor and delivers neither power nor economy, another bike has very good power tho not comparable to your 127 and has quite reasonable fuel mileage hence my strange question directed at you.
I'm currently rebuilding my s&s113ci, dyno a few years ago was 118hp & 124ftlb.. I'm changing the camshaft, lifters, pushrods, rockers and valves to try and push the bike up to 130hp, ish.
Shouldn't be too hard to get there on the S&S platform, you have the piece of mind knowing the cases will handle it too!
@@GixxerFoo the worry isn't the engine, its wether the old trans will take it
Being a new build 90 Electra glide Evo s&s trans fabric( Midwest cycle new nos 2003) fxst Softail, nos parts for shocks etc, etc. Putting it together at Christmas for my Nephew to ride with me think it will be alright, may have to ask about an issue hope not, been doing my homework, it's from the ground up,,, thanks for all all the great info have a Great Christmas, I listen to your every word for the wisdom you choose to share, thank's
For all of the custom bikes my partner and I built, we exclusively used the RevTech from Custom Chrome. And we used the 4X4 exclusively, and swapped out the garbage Mikuni for the S&S Super 'G'. And of course we would rejet the carb accordingly. NEVER a problem with the RevTech. The S&S engines we tried weren't balanced as good as the RevTechs are. Just some fyi.
That's awesome to hear some positive about the RevTech engines! They all have their good and bad points but in the end they are pretty reliable. S&S carbs are a lot better than the Mikuni, just some aren't willing to pay the price for the S&S.
@@GixxerFoo Mr. GixxerFoo, Sir,
Why do you say that the S&S is better than the Mikuni? Are you speaking of a CV Mikuni or the HSR compared to an S&S? I have the 42mm Mikuni HSR on my 98" Road Star and it's resulted in INSTANT throttle response compared to the stock CV Mikuni took out. And yes, I understand that that is not an S&S to Mikuni comparison. But that said, I've pretty much always heard that the Flat Slide Mikuni is superior to any of the S&S carbs for Harley applications, whether Evo or Twin Cam. I even have a direct quote from a truly legendary CNC motor builder and racer saying that the S&S is "a good tomato soup can compared to the Mikuni HSR." Would you care to elaborate on your thoughts on the above and why you prefer the S&S?
Thanks as always for superb analysis videos!
From southern California ~ Ride Forever!
Exactly. My 96 Electra glide 46k. It has a Andrew's ev27 cam and screaming Eagle true duels on it. The best balanced big ass bike I rode. Ever. Love it
I suspect getting warranty work done is dicey ...it can be even on Harleys.
S&S is usually pretty good about warranty work on their engines, especially going through a authorized dealer. Revtech is pretty good from what I've seen as well, not too sure about Ultima though.
I have an 99 fxst softail standard, 80 inch, 13k miles on it, is there any upgrade options avalible except replacing it with an new motor?
Absolutely, there are cam swaps and big bore kits available for Evo engines. The parts are really inexpensive compared to the new stuff!
I recommend from experience, the Ultima El Bruto 127. Best bang for your buck crate motor out there. 😎
That's a hell of a lot of motor for the money hands down!
@@GixxerFoo if well maintained is the Ultima a reliable motor?
I have an 06 Softail Night Train. Looks like S&S does not have a complete engine for the Softails. Do you know why? Is there anyone who makes one?
If you can get past not having the original vin on the original left side case, I contend an aftermarket Evo engine with stronger cases is the best Harley air cooled big twin engine ....ever.
But then again you can go down the slippery slope of whats original? How many part changes before its no longer original?
That is the pitfall of a aftermarket engine, best thing you can do is document and save all the receipts. That way someone can start at the front of the bike and follow the paper trail to the back.
Anyone thinking about going with s&s should check out scooter tramp Scotty 's experience
Yeah he didn't have the greatest experience with the 111. I would go with the V80 for a replacement engine, nice bump over stock and still reliable.
I have a question, Make that several. Did the Evo motor use caged roller bearings or plane on the crank shaft? Did the Evo use timken bearing on the output shaft and pinion shaft? How about the Rev-tech and Ultima. Also what happened to s&s's X motor witch if I remember didn't fit directly into a Harley frame. I am a little disappointed that you didn't mention my V-rod motor as the best. I know Harley doesn't make them any more ether cause they don't wear out! Another great video Thanks
All the 45 degree Harleys use the roller bearing bottom ends, before 2003 the bottom ends were timken tapered roller bearings on the pinion and output shafts. Revtech and Ultima use a tapered roller bearing bottom end, that's the strongest you can get for a Harley Vtwin. I believe S&S discontinued those motors a while ago, they've done a lot of changes to their engine line up. I've got some videos on the Vrod in the works, it's a solid engine platform that actually came out of the late 80's.
@@GixxerFoo Kool I'll be waiting on those V-rod videos. I'm planning on changing the triple tree on my 03 VRSC-A model from a 4% to a 2%. I purchased one off of a wrecked 06-D model that I located this last spring I believe this should make it more stable at speed and more nimble in turns. But that's a project for this winter. Mike from Maryland
@@michaelmorgan5714 That will for sure tighten up your handling, my dad ride 2012 nightrod. That bike is comfortable and it handles very well.
@@GixxerFoo They started changing the angle of the trees in the 06 D model from 4 degree to 2 degree. I'm guessing you know the trail increases with each degree in the frame neck and is decreased by each degree added to the triple tree. There were various combinations after that but they started with 34 degrees in the frame and 4 degrees in the tree effectively giving it a slow versachieve a nimble bike that's stable at 140 mph. Thanks again Mike from Maryland. P.S. I'll be able to fill you in next spring.
Let me know how that turns out! I might give it a try myself and see what happens.
The ONLY reason my chopper doesnt have an s&s sh93 is because my case is titled.
usually with a evo thats got 80 -100k on it your fitst rebuild ( if you keep it stock ish) you can just plain the heads bore the cylinders , lap the valve and put a new carb on. then youll get another 60- 80k before you have to split the cases but after that a crate engine isnt a bad idea cause your buying cases / crank anyway.
I'd like to put one these EVO crates in a new M8 style frame.
That would be a really neat project! Put one of those in a new softail frame like the Low Rider S with the short rake and inverted forks.
One of my techs is planning this, evo in late model frame with Delphi fuel injection, throttle by wire, Infotainment system the whole 9 yards
You live in a pipe dream dude shut up
@@barrybarnes96 go play with your twunt hole,Karen!
Did the 113 ultima in a night train. The shop that did it couldn't get it right.after a year of messing with it, traded it off for a twin cam dyna and redid the motor twice. Come to find out the ultima head was not machined correctly, and the warranty ran out. On the upside I did the screaming eagle crank in the dyna turning the 88 into a 103 and all the headaches are forgotten!
I have had great luck with Ultima engines , my 140 has 100k now , still pulls hard .
S&S V Series (Sidewinder) Engine >> than any Harley Engine
For sure, S&S engineered out all the factory issues.
What ever happened to the TP (Total Performance) engines are they still being produced?
I haven't heard anything about them a long time, far as I can they are still in business. Haven't seen one of those motors in a while.
I thought that the RevTech were assembled in Korea.
I have heard that myself too, I think they used to be at one point.
Just wondering if a water injection can be put into a harley to clean the carbon out of the combustion chamber aka top of piston and head
There's actually a lot of people that do that, you use a top cylinder cleaner now and again to clean the top of the pistons.
Anyone know if Harley still has the rebuild program for the evo's ?
I just asked Harley about this. No longer available for the Evo.
They ended it in 2013 or 2014 unfortunately.
Harley finally came into the 21 century !!! They finally have a powerful engine !! And water cooled so you don't get cooked, or sitting waiting to cool off.. Put it in all HD'S !!!
They made some great strides with that liquid cooled head but I think the Revolution Max is going to eventually take over everything.
@@GixxerFoo Good. Most Big Twin Paperweight.
Nice! I may be interested in a bike with the Revolution engine eventually. Any chance in hell the Revolution may fit in the existing sportsters?
I am pretty interested in those myself too, I am going to wait and see if any issues come out of the motors first though. As for a existing Sportster you'd need one heck of a fabricator, those new motors are designed as structural member of the frame. Could be pulled off though!
Hi.. how do I identify which make aftermarket evo engine I have. It's definately not a harley.. I can't find any branding stamped on the motor. Can someone please help me identify what make motor I have. Thanks man .
I would try running a quick good search on the engine VIN and see what pops up there. Should be some numbers on the cases, there's a lot of possibilities there if it's an aftermarket engine or maybe built with some aftermarket cases.
Where do you go to get parts for an 85 Evo? Seems like everything older than the late '90s disappeared from history.
Stay away from revtech several have come thru my shop with head broken off valve ! Ultima engines are better only issue I have seen were sprocket shaft that came loose .I have used their flywheels I just take them apart loctite all the shaft nuts & retrue them no issues ! Also the Ultima 120 is almost an exact copy off the old Merch 120 the parts will interchange ! 140 horsepower is possible with the right parts put into a Ultima 120 ! S &S is absolutely the highest quality of all ! I still get alot of EVO engines to rebuild guess there is not many guys out here like me that can rebuild all the old motors !
It sure seems like Ultima and Revtech have gone back and forth on which one is better over the years. Thank you for sharing this, I haven't seen or heard anything about Ultima in a long time as far as their quality.
If I decide to go above stock crate engine, how much change to you have to do with the compensator, clutch, tranny, etc. Long haul road worthy.
If you went with a high powered crate engine a high performance compensator or eliminator would be a good idea. You'd also want to upgrade to a performance clutch as well, transmissions will handle a lot if you're just cruising and getting in the throttle time to time. That's a great question, getting those items upgraded will make the setup a lot more reliable.
Is Revtech still in business???? I can't seem to find parts for a 1st gen. 100cid.
I believe they are still active, I think they shut down for a bit in 2020 but I haven't heard anything about them closing up shop.
@@GixxerFoo thank you. I will try looking them up yet again.
very good advice , = to photo and record engine swops .. for legal and warranty claims .
$6200.00 for a V111 2 years ago….
Today, the V111 sells for 8k (on sale)
Damn. Inflation sucks :(
I love your channel, learning so much. Thanks for your infomation.
You are so welcome!
If a much bigger engine is added to a standard, evo bike say a 1987 FLHTC that I have, how does the stock powertrain hold up?
do these crate engines come in a balanced types for softail bikes ?
Ultima 120 is a beast
Evo motors are awesome! I hate tc and m8, and cone shovels are junk. However, I do like generator shovels.
What about the TP motor
Total Performance, I haven't seen many of those engines out there. It's another great option and they do use top shelf components in their engines.
Find Delkron pre 2000 made , 92 to 99, . Top breather cases , the best ,designed , strongest, beefy cases made, ,,
That's a name I haven't heard in a long time!
Answered my own question after reading comments,,,going with crate motor👍
Crate motor can save you a lot of money over buying components and having it built.
So the next question is can one swap out an early twin-cam with a 'legacy' EVO to regain reliability?
It would require a lot of fabrication, the Twin Cam engines have the tranny bolted to the engine where the Evo engine does not. The mounting points are quite a bit different.
@@GixxerFoo Dang! Was afraid of that... I have not ridden my 99 Ultra now for a year except for a couple of runs because I do not like the twin-cam fuel injection system (first year) and the bike is just clunky.. not like my 92 Ultra which was under powered but extremely reliable.
so would a Evo style tyranny and Evo style engine fit in a twin cam frame with minimal fabrication...my TC has about 90k on it.
So aftermarket evo motors are equivalent to a Dart Small Block Ford vs an OEM Ford Small Block is what you're saying
I've been reading that S&S's quality has been lacking lately. Is there any truth to that? Leaking base gaskets in less that 1000 miles. Compression releases breaking, and high oul consumption. Also, i read their own warranty terms and it only covers parts, not labor. You'd think for being so much more expensive than Ultima and revtech that they would at leasr cover labor when their products fail
Given the cost of a quality rebuild you may as well just bite the bullet and buy a crate. Buy once, cry once. I'd probably try to save some coin and buy all the parts over time and piece it together myself.
Crates are a lot of money up front but buying all your parts over time is a great way to do it yourself. Just replace all your bearings in the cases and replace or have your crank rebuilt by a shop. Also your heads would need to be gone through by a shop unless you replace them too.
@@GixxerFoo I would start from scratch with a new block, cylinders, crank and everything. The old cases aren't strong enough, as you mentioned 🤘
Great info and keep the videos coming.
S,s would be my choice, But would keep stock motor on my bench..94 dwg.
Hey. Fizzed. How concerned should I be with my 2007 softailfatboy with the timing chain adjuster pads
2007 has the hydraulic setup which is much more reliable, I'd be inspecting around the 30K mile range and plan on a replacement around 40k miles. Some bikes need replacement and others go some insane miles without needing replacement. Always better safe than sorry when it comes to the tensioner system.
I had a 02 Fatboy, my cam chain followers went @ 40k. installed a s,s 510 gear drive cams. With adj.push rods. Best choice I ever made ..Now your cam chest is bullet proof.
Stay with the short stroke Ultima 120,lots of power with less vibration
How much compression can a 80' Evo factory case handle?
The patent issue is due to the fact that the Evo is AMF's last motor, AMF owned the patent and didn't care about keeping it close to their pocket when they sold back to the Davidson family.
What do you think of andrews 21n cams
Your vids are the bomb!
Have you ever looked into the orca engine?
The Revtech‘s were popular back in the chopper area because they were built in the USA! after the chopper area died they sold it to some company overseas, now they’re junk!
What is the best motor swap for an 88 twin cam?
Twin cams are a bit harder to get due to the fact Harley had a better patent on the Twin Cam. S&S and Ultima have twin cam crate engines though, here's a video on the twin cam crates th-cam.com/video/sXYELxFECyY/w-d-xo.html
The new videos for the 88 twin cam fix is a good look I'm doing my 2004 88 twin cam 07 and up cam chest and oil pump swap with the 103 cams and timkin bearings on spracket shaft and weld the crank pin and run it
all these engines are Evo technology, all good for the right bike. it's an amazing good design, merican, get em ride em.
My 2016 roadster is awesome
I loved those new Roadsters! That's a neat bike!
Let’s see the same video for twin cams.
Twin Cams are a bit more sparse but here is the video th-cam.com/video/sXYELxFECyY/w-d-xo.html
stock to rebuild,,I dont want a nonauthentic motor made by someone else
Pretty sure after 140000 + miles there isn't any factory defects in my 1988 motor , but you keep talkin
The Evo varied quite a bit across the years, there were some bad castings and issues but it didn't happen on every bike.
Thank you for another great video on the Evo!!
Quick question: running a stock EVO FXR with HSR carb, Andrews Cam and 2-1 exhaust. Would the Mikuni manifold add anymore power?
Maybe a new video idea on headwork and manifold .... thanks in advance for the answer!
In theory with proper tuning adjustments it might pick you up a bit on the butt dyno. Hammer Performance has actually proved it can with their intake manifolds on carbed bikes. But not all of us have a dyno in the garage to perfect the tuning.
S S only pay for parts if there's a problem not labor which is the expensive part
Aren't these after-market engines supplied by the chinese ? Seems I read this somewhere ???
I guess my budget means Revtech. I could even get an aftermarket frame and cut out Harley altogether
Revtech isn't a bad motor at all, I'd go with it over the Ultima if I wasn't going S&S.
@@GixxerFoo Had a look through S&S and they have a panhead that's a bit out of my range for now but would work in cheap a 70's frame. The AMC bikes were junk but they did look good
@@simonkennedy6116 My late 70s Super Glide did have a look that I liked! You typed "AMC bikes".
I'm thinking you intended to type "AMF bikes".
@@BigFiveJack ... Yep
S&S makes better parts and last a lot longer than stock .you get what you pay for 👌
There's a reason why they cost more and that's quality.
How about sportster motors.
yeah but like me if you dont give a shit about " more power" you dont have to split the cases on an evo. you can put the heads lap the valves ,hone the cylinders, and throw in a set of rings. and get another 75k out of the bike. thats the number one reason to own an evo is les money spent on your ride and more on the ride itself. for 6 or 7k i can go buy a bike that has less than 20k miles on it. like a 103 or 107 but for a few hundred dollars i can rebuild my top end on my shovel or evo and be happy that im not in debt and know my manhood doesn't revolve around " more power". ps i see ive watch this video before and said the same thing. however its crossed out.
I bought a used 1992 Fatboy near 20 years ago with around 60,000 miles on it. It ran good for another 10,000 to 15,000 miles. About 10 years ago while in Sturgis during the August Rally, the cylinder studs on the front barrel pulled out. While camping at the Deadwood KOA campground, I pulled the head and barrel off using the picnic table as a workbench. Located a set of Keen inserts, drill and tap for the inserts I re-drilled and taped the cases for the inserts. After installing the inserts firmly in the cases & reassembly I was able to enjoy the last 5 days of the Sturgis Rally. Returning home months later on a short weekend ride with the Wife on the back, The studs pulled out again. We were about 15 miles from home and I removed the front spark plug we turned around and rode the bike back home on the one back cylinder, slow but surely we made it home. After that I simply ordered a brand new EVO crate engine from Harley Davidson and for only $2,999. Dropped that motor in with no problems and it ran perfect then as it does today in 2022. The silver lining to this story is that I sold all of the old engine parts including the cases for $2,500!
Gotta 89 Softail custom had the same break down ,drilled the case and put a roller pin in it? Held up for awhile, then it split to the rear cylinder. J.B. weld and still got a another year, motor had 92,000. Gotta REV-TEC. 100 in. Going on 10 years, 💪🤠
Having grown up with my relatives always being loyal to S&S for performance parts it’d be hard for me to choose anything else
I currently have S&S cases on my 97 Evo, the previous owner put them on when the head bolts pulled out. I would probably rebuild and upgrade what I have if ever needed, but the S&S 111 does sound like the most appropriate choice for a new engine. Reliability beats the increased power on the biggest engines.
"New Harley Evolution bikes are better than the original", I wonder...
Never met anyone with a high mileage aftermarket engine.
I would rather overhaul the original engine block and keep it a Harley.
bingo
Just another social media BS sales pitch funded by companies trying to sell their junk.
Give away one engine to a guy like this and he’ll hammer out video after video of how good this product really is. When in reality, it’s pure garbage.
Most affordable marketing scheme in our world today.
I'm not paid by any company, the Evo cases really do have some issues when you start bumping compression and putting some power in them. Case failures are more common on the drag strip when you're really pushing limits. Getting up to about 90 horse on an Evo is good stopping point, to push above that after market cases are highly recommended. As with anything there are good and bad experiences with aftermarket engines, but at the race track the crate motors have held up pretty well being beat on.
I fully agree for the street with a bike you ride every day and for longevity keeping the factory engine with mild upgrades is the way to go. You wouldn't want to build a 100+ horsepower Evo on the stock cases though, Ultima has stout cases and see them used quite a bit at the drag strip.
@@GixxerFoo Not a lot of miles are ridden on racing tracks and drag strips.