S06E05 | How to Setup & Program More Prototype Locomotives, ESU LokSound Athearn MP15AC & Operations
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 มี.ค. 2022
- #ProtoThrottle #ModelRailroading #Athearn
In this episode, we take a look at an Athearn MP15AC, that had an MRC decoder, but now has an ESU LokSound V5 (Version 5). We take it through the paces and get a good feel for more prototypical paced movements. In a new segment, called "The Archetypal Ops"...looking at the FUTURE of slowing down operations.
In addition to the Athearn Genesis locomotive, we highlight another "Prepping for Ops", with a look at listening to the owner of the RR or fellow operators.
All of this and more, only in this episode of SOO The Milwaukee Road. - บันเทิง
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I have a few rules when friends come over. There’s the usual, don’t run the trains too fast, make sure you download WiThrottle, don’t insult my dog, etc. But the most important rule is to please avoid eating Mexican the night before. The train room doesn’t have any windows and it’s a very tight space. Another great video filled with loads of good information!
So many great points being made, especially the post taco 🌮 warning.
The big question…did ya spot the M&M Rails “Easter Egg”?
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad Lol! Ok, here’s the story. You have time right?
I watched your video Friday night and then decided to comment Saturday. Of course by then I completely forgot what points I was going to comment on but I remembered the “rules” bit so I made the gas joke and thought I hit send/submit. Then when I didn’t hear back I checked in.
15 minutes ago:
Me: Honey, we have to pause Grey’s Anatomy and watch Billiam’s video! He left me an Easter egg and I missed it!
My wife: Ok. But how did you miss it the first time?
Me: I don’t know! I may have turned my head for a second because the puppy did something cute like chewed her paw or said her first word “Rivet.” I always watch his videos start to finish…
Wife: and if you didn’t mention the egg he’ll think you didn’t watch the whole video.
Me: Yes!!
So we watched it again and of course once the Curmudgeon came on I remembered. When I watched it on Friday I thought to myself… good enough… hey, I say that. Haha. I meant to comment on it. I’m thinking of getting t-shirts made. What’s your size? ;)
Jolly good show!!! And I must admit.... nice use of the aarp junk mail cards. 😃
Thanks for the clarification of the cv settings.
You bet! It’s not the only way to go about this, but I’ve found it very helpful.
Another great episode! Slow speed realistic ops are what really enjoy, but I know not everyone does. I think one of the most important settings in a decoder is the speed table and having a locomotive top out at your maximum speed. The flattened speed curve gives you good low end speed while allowing operators to "play the upper notches" without increasing speed. An important note is to set CV29 to activate the speed table and the other configurations that are controlled by CV29. You finally gave me a quiz question I knew the answer too, it must have been too easy. I agree with the curmudgeon, "if it don't run it's no fun".-Tom
Spot on as always Tom.
Thank you & Joe for the shared content, it’s getting things closer and closer to where I like them to be.
Your influences have always been for the better. Your latest blog was excellent, they’re all good, but this one on ops was great: www.thomasklimoski.com/post/operating-sessions-fun-work-or-both
Thank you for churning out such inspirational content, it’s fun stuff to learn.
Bill, I love every video you present! I eat up every second. Please, would you respond to at least one of my responses?
1] 13:30 it's a beautiful sound! I've got the Demonstrator No.115 Athearn Genesis MP15AC and want it to run just like your Soo Bandit 437! I learned from my cousin of the "Bandits" a few weeks after they first got their names. That cousin worked as a fireman for the MILW just before SOO took over... Ironically, that same cousin left the MILW Road to become a fireman in Hastings, MN, to fight fires, (M. Holmes) and eventually retired as Fire Chief!
2] (I've hinted some time ago) I wish to visit your world in the future ( requiring my immigrating "back" to the U.S. from Canada.) I'm 53 now. Yes, I wanna be where you are and have great fun as you describe. First to get back to Bellingham (where I had the most DCC model railroading fun) and get re-established on my feet.
3] Restart in my 50's... is it possible?
4] "Good Enough" 'Track,' Gripe of The Week = PennCentral in declining years (or, did it start that way from the beginning?)
AND Be picky when Picking! Not only miss-picking the spring, but be gentle when putting lateral force, not downward force on those couplers.
5] +/- 12:24 wow... that's a lot of CV'ing for one locomotive. I want a Proto throttle. Where do I start? (I learned over 20 years ago Binary and Hexadecimal... and I thought learning HTML was a bunch of 1's and 0's!)
Thanks again, Bill, for your input. I look forward to responses and more videos.
John BC, Canada
John, it’s so great to hear from you…I have another longer reply to make. Your inquiries are great. It just takes me a little longer to respond, while at a desktop computer. Most responses are from my phone and it’s harder to see all your questions the way the phone formats replies. Again, I’ve not forgotten about ya. I’ll be covering the sound in an Ep coming up…
Love the control box and the #437.
Left-back and right/forward with the Reverser handle.
Cool flo with the ops.
You’ve got a keen eye sir, the reserver has since been adjusted, but all this footage had been recorded prior to my change. It’s all about refining and guys like yourself are the ones that help me improve my efforts. I thank you for that.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad Just making sure, thought about that after I posted, might be old footage.
Better make sure.
☺️
@@marktaylor9975 I’m always open to feedback, so never hesitate, as your input is what I use to refine and improve.
Have a nice weekend.
Excellent episode William. Really timely for me.
Now, we’ll just have to apply this info…I know a guy that might be able to help ya.
Hey Wlliam that was a good episode! Learning alot about the back end of decoder work! So go into the Lokprogrammer...yadda yadda yadda...prototypical operation is achieved!!!
Take care!
Andy
One can go cross eyed when it comes to CV’s, but subtle adjustments over time, really bring things to life.
Well, I'm going with D... But that is well before you posted that option... Now all I need is a Trans Am and a Semi full of Coors Beer
😆 It’s great to hear from ya, you always bring a unique take. I hope all is well!
Thanks, good point about the pick....
The pick can be a sore spot for some operators, some dislike it, but it works for most situations.
As always, it’s great to hear from you and I hope all is well.
Another great video Bill. I miss the Milwaukee! When Soo Line took over, everything was fair game. What Soo didn't get, CP did.
True, I’m not a huge fan of mergers, I’d have been okay if they hadn’t merged at all. Especially the BN…to think, the NP, GN, Q, SP&S, etc…all around today!?? That would be neat to see.
Great information on CVs!
It’s great to hear people are liking the backend info…I know it can get boring, but for fellow modelers that would like to attempt the edits? It’s worth a look.
Thanks for tuning in and sharing your take.
Thanks for this. Thinking of buying some bandits. Always appreciate your thought William!
Coolest remote I’ve ever seen. I don’t even have a railroad layout and I want one lol
They’re making some revolutionary products in the model RR industry.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad I know and it also makes locomotive engineers feel at home
Been picking glad hands since I started ops and I find it more consistent than going into the knuckle 😇
Excellent point, once you get good enough at a technique…there’s no need to go about it any other way.
Well done on the realistic engine movement and sounds. I need to adjust my power. Another great thing about smaller, or right-sized layouts, is you only need a few engines. This means you can really detail the decoder response. Thanks for the tips.
I pulled a Klimoski on the sounds…by loading the freight car audio, into another locomotive (parked it next to the camera)…then hitting F5 to make the ambient sounds, as I started the other train to pull away…so the car sounds stayed by the camera and the loco sounds would move away.
Tom uses coupler crashes and stuff, hitting the buttons while he’s moving cars around. It’s truly an art form…I just took it a little further by loading my own audio into another MP15.
It’s all fun and games, until someone gets frustrated trying to get their locomotive to make ALL the sounds. It’s kind of like those people and LED’s!?!
"This experience isn't [exclusive] to the PT..." AMEN! The PT is awesome, no doubt, but realistic ops don't necessarily *require* a $500 investment. Layouts which claim to otherwise be "prototypical" but use 0 momentum or braking have always peeved me to no end...
Needless to say, my favorite episode yet!
So great to hear you’re liking the content…I’m never sure when I start into CV’s and computer screens. At the end of the day, it’s content to help guys have others options to more prototypical results…I’m not saying it is for everyone, cause it’s not. It’s for fellow modelers like yourself. Thanks for tuning in and sharing your feedback…and you’re right, the PT is not for everyone.
Nice episode. I stumbled across your channel a few weeks ago, interesting stuff (less the drama, but that's me). A couple of notes though. I've always used the trim functions to match forward and reverse speeds, ie.. forward set at zero (0) and reverse set at whatever it takes to get the same speed at the same setting. This is useful for speed matching, which is something a person wouldn't do for an MP15 and, the fact that even $300 engines may not run the same both directions. The other note is just a frustration of mine about "notches" for engines like the MP15. I never ran an AC unit but I did several DC units (MP15DC) back in the 80s. They show 4 notches on the shuttle lever however, notch 1 is just idle without any current to the motors. Max speed was (is) notch 4, so ya only got three speeds. I've never found a way to make decoders operate that way. So much for prototypical. Anyhow, great video. Thanks.
You make a number of great points, in the end…we’re trying to get things as close as we can. Who knows, with all the advancements of technology…things get better & better with time. Maybe you’ll get what you’re looking for down the road.
Thanks for tuning in and posting your take, it’s great to hear from you.
Good episode. I got the quiz question right. I think were getting there with the decoder settings, especially with matching the sound to the speed of the engine. I know its a annoyance to a lot of people and a reason some people don't like sound. Keep up the good work!
What about the volume of the bell on the F7 Athearn Genesis units or the dynamics blaring right out of the box!?! I heard your a fan of the louder the better theory!?! “IT’S LIKE WE’RE STANDING NEXT TO A REAL LOCOMOTIVE.”
You can adjust the notch sound settings to match your speed in the sound files if using a lok programmer.
Great episode, I really like that MP15 the lights, especially that underframe light, the MP15 is one of my favorite switchers, they had a very brutish look about them, and from what I've seen they could pull half the yard at once, your behind the scenes with the throttles is great information, the way your engine sounded and responded to your throttle was awesome, very realistic, great tip about when you visit or operate on someone else's layout, definitely some etiquette to be observed there
Thanks Scott. I know this sort of content isn’t for everyone, but I’ve heard a lot of great feedback from so many. Not just here on YT, but getting DM/PM’s and texts from fellow modelers.
I randomly stubble across a gem every now and again.
I’ll see if I can’t share how my audio files are setup. The MP15 was 100% itself…but the freight car sounds were coming from a locomotive that was set just off camera. I mapped “Train Sounds” from a YT video, loaded into one of my other units…then hit the F-function to starts playing the audio. My thought process was, if I load it into my MP15…that sound would carry away from the camera.
Tom Klimoski does videos where he hits his coupler crash, while running and filming. I took that idea to the next level…trying to give as realistic video as possible.
Glad to hear you’re enjoying the videos. Thank you for tuning in and taking the time to post.
Enjoyed! Thanks for the programming tips!
The technical can get dry, but it’s great to hear from a tech guy like yourself…I appreciate the work you put into helping us all out.
PT user here, but mainly have TSU2 with factory Lok5 locos mixed in. I have found that maxing out momentum and making the locomotives slower they are better to control, and I have seen them have higher tractive grip up inclines.
That’s great to hear, all of the above sounds like a Win-Win!
Always looking forward to the next episode can not wait for the next one. Thanks for the step-by-step breakdown. One question, the no trespassing sign in the corner behind you, where did the CM&StP and the PRR share property. And my wife says "nice socks" sorry she was looking over my shoulder LOL
Hey, your wife isn’t the only one that noticed my socks…I’ve had other modelers who watched the video say the same thing, “Nice socks!” 😆
As for the No Trespassing sign, you’ve got a sharp eye and probably know it’s actually CMStP&PRR (Chicago, Milwaukee, St. Paul & Pacific RR). Not sure if ya were just crackin’ wise or if it was a legit inquiry. Either way, that’s the story behind it. I hope all is well and you enjoy the next Ep.
The ESU decoders are the best thing going these days. I'm going to assume that your version of JMRI is up to date. The LokProgrammer for me is much faster than Decoder Pro with an ESU decoder. I've been able to program with Decoder Pro, but these days I always use the Lok Programmer.
You’re correct, I’ve got the latest JMRI on all machines and even tried going back a version to see if that helped.
Like you stated, I’ve been using the LOK Programmer and it’s doing what we need. So no sleep lost, but it’d be nice to have consistency in being able to use either…the LOK decoders are game changers.
Great episode William
If you have ESU Loksound and NCE Power Cab, it's super easy to adjust for prototype ops here, then use momentum 5 on NCE and it's done: th-cam.com/video/WF6RPaFvCWE/w-d-xo.html
Great point, excellent info.
Great video sir!
Thank you Jason
👍👍👍
Thanks for tuning in Ron 👍
RE JMRI Freezing when working with ESU LokSound : Related to size of "decoder definition" file JMRI refers to. In short, the LokSound decoder has soooooooooo many settings that JMRI frequently chokes when reading it. (Open Windows Task manager to confirm). Thankfully it's not _dead_, just taking a Loooooooong Time to read the Definition file. I have Win7 laptop which takes low single-digit minutes for JMRI to get to "ready-to-program" state when reading a LokSound V5 definition, and a Rasberry Pi rig which can take double-digit minutes! Can also be affected by what USBDCC Programming-track interface you are using. I have tested with both NCE USBPowerCab and Arduino DCC++ interfaces, both suffer the same "lag" in loading a V5 definition file. NB opening a _different_ decoder definition file takes _less_ time, so definitely "definition file" related... Tested and confirmed using JMRI 4.22 (March 2022 current release version) on both Windows (7 and 10) and Linux...
This is interesting…a few other fellow modelers pointed to the possible lag time. The error I get on two of the laptops is a Heap error…I’m learning more about what that entails (it deals with memory), both computers are relatively new…so I wouldn’t figure it’s there, but ya never know.
Thank you for taking the time to share what you think it might be.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad "Heap Error" is indeed a memory management related problem. What version of JMRI and JAVA are you running? Latest Release 4.22 is a tipping point in JMRI development, moving from JAVA 8 to JAVA 11, and from what I hear it's not exactly a walk-in-the-park migration. This combined with any JMRI version newer than 4.22 (Beta Release currently 4.99) could certainly act unstable when challenged. Reccomend reverting to JAVA 8 and JMRI 4.22 at this time, until the JAVA 11 + matching JMRI version is sorted...
@@profklyzlr I believe you’re dialed in on the issue…it was around the time the systems updated and that may have had a Java Update in the mix.
🤔 Thank you for taking the time to help sort out the issue.
Does setting the acceleration and deceleration give you those effects where the engine throttles up before the engine moves and throttles down before the engine stops? Will most layout owners show you how they want you to uncouple if asked? Love your episodes.
Correct, the higher your momentum, the more realistic your sounds…I will be covering braking (for those who can’t stand the slow deceleration). It’s not a fast & hard solution, but I figure, “Why not put a number of options out there and let the user decide?” I’m constantly looking at upgrades/solutions.
Interesting, so the forward and reverse trim sets your maximum speed for those respective directions? And is that a universal standard for other sound decoders (such as Tsunami2?)
I usually set my my CV3 at 180, CV4 at 160 for my Beer Line engines, but after watching what you did here, I may go back and try these settings. I'm looking for ways to make it easier to have full throttle sound while switching cars and other industrial operations. ESU and Tsunami2 both have their own functions to emulate this, but it requires hitting other keys and not necessary having total control while switching. Gave me some ideas! - John
If you have a relatively low maximum speed (10-20mph), you can set notch 2, 3 or 4ish to that maximum speed, so that any successive throttle increases change only the sound, not speed. Basically the speed curve flattens out after the max speed.
@BeerLineModeler you’re right John…I’m not calling this method the be all end all, rather another way to look at the movements of your locos.
It has changed the way I look at getting a more prototypical reaction from a trains movement…but not having it running at high speeds in notch 8.
You have an amazing layout, which is perfect for the slower pace and pulling those reefers…it’ll be cool to see your SW1200 crank up, moving that precious beer. Keep up the great work and do share your findings, if you tweak anything to your liking.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad ok, thanks! I believe I have a comprehensive listing of all the Taunami2 CVs in my ‘DCC drawer. I’d like to apply this to my FM switchers as well, as that’s what those decoders are. I will get back to you on this…
@@beerlinemodeler I’m not sure if you use JMRI or program each CV one by one on a throttle…none the less, if ya use JMRI, generally, you’d seek out the common “concept”.
I’d really be intrigued to see/hear your findings. As you model and operate as a pace like myself. Keep up with the great work and I can’t wait to see your FM’s rev-up.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad so my Rapido SW1200 with ESU, my CVs 66 and 95 go at 100. If I program to 12 it’s still racey even with your speed curve. But now she really revs while moving much slower. On my FMs (all Walthers Protos), CV6 i set at 66 (88 is too fast), and the CVs 66 and 95 inset at 50. This has been a fun discovery.
👍
Thanks Tom! I’m glad ya liked it, have a great weekend.
Excellent episode have screen shot your cv setting as I’m still struggling with braking cv179 must be the issue
@Paul C, I’ve found the braking is an art form…I’ve found myself tweaking it more and more. Recently recorded a segment on braking…its more or less a look at it, but not a hard and fast “only way to do it.” As you know, we can always find new ideas and continue to learn what works best.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad so far I have not been able to use braking with F10 only with F4 dynamic brakes on the loksound 5 decoders
@@paulc1964, I remapped my brake on the decoder to F6 (I don’t use ditch lights)…as well as set that F6 Brake to Brake 3 (ESU’s have three levels of braking 1-2-3)…three is probably slightly more aggressive that I need, but I want guys to know they can stop on a dime is needed.
Shoot me a DM/PM and I’ll try and send you a photo…to show the braking. I do have a video coming up to show the various PT brake options to help understand what they’re doing.
More soon, I hope all is well. It’s always great to see and hear from you. Stay upright, down under.
Great episode William 👏 👌 👍. I now have my SW1200 with LokSound 5 almost dialed in how I want it. Struggling on the braking. I have brakes set to mode 3 and CV 179 set to 90 but still stops way too fast. Suggestions?
You may try Mode 1 or 2…I use Brake 3 (which is more aggressive than I’d like, but the operators I’ve had trying it, like Brake 3 for reliable stopping on mags).
That business of ESU having to use their proprietary programmer is the main reason that I shy away from their decoders! That's sad because ESU decoders come in many fine models. I am not in this hobby to become a German electrical engineer, I just want to run trains with decent sound.
You’ve got a valid point, I get tired of all the tweaking and editing that needs to be done at times. However, the variety, flexibility and options we have these days is insane…this is the best time to be in this hobby, but I’d agree…a well running loco out of the box is a reasonable request.
Is this an Athearn switcher unit? You must have installed cab and ground lighting.
It is, an old Athearn MP15AC…I added the beacon, ground lights and upgraded the headlights. Scale Sound System speakers.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoadthanks for the info. I was thinking of getting one. Did you end up having to install a capacitor?
Update your decoder pro version and decoder definition files ?
Been there, done that…attempted on three different computers and tried reaching out to the JMRI groups, no resolve yet, but the ESU Programmer is keeping things running.
Thank you for the possible solution, we’ll keep trying.
@@SootheMilwaukeeRoad OOh, this sounds like a challenge, ACCEPTED ! OK, what is the core issue? CV's not writting/Reading ? Or you program one thing, and it does something else ? Does it brick the decoder ?
@@KingTrump2024 Still no resolve, but I’ve not tried to update the computer on the GN in 1970 (Willmar Sub)…as we’ve had ops scheduled over the past few weeks. Things are working on the RR, so we weren’t going to mess with that computer.
do you not use fuction 9 "drive hold"?
Thanks for asking the question about Drive Hold, the answer? No, I do not use drive hold.
was just wondering. would make things much easier using drive hold then changing cv's for a heavy train then to light power. nice video by the way!