224 Valkyrie vs 22-250 Remington - Is .224 Valkyrie irrelevant?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
- Is the .224 Valkyrie exploring new territory, or is it just treading in the footsteps of the .22-250 Remington?
There are two key reasons why the 224 Valkyrie (recently announced by Federal Premium) is unique and desirable. First, it is specifically designed to fit the limitations of the AR 15 platform. It does so even when loaded with gigantic projectiles, like the 90-grain SMK that Federal announced. .22-250 Rem is too long and too fat to work in the AR 15 platform; it needs an AR 10 bolt and magazine.
Of course, that length and girth means more case capacity, so ballistically 22-250 wins the day, right? Not so fast (pun!). 22-250 Rem does indeed move projectiles faster, but factory barrels are set up to handle projectiles ranging from 35 grains to maybe 64 grains. Heavier projectiles simply will not stabilize in a 1:12" twist barrel, and the throat would be prohibitively short anyway. 224 Valkyrie barrels will feature fast twist rates (1:7") and a long leade. Out of the gate it's going to handle projectiles that weigh twice as much as the 22-250's standard 45-grain projectile you see on the shelves.
Does projectile weight really make a difference though, if it's moving 4,000 fps? According to the math, yes it does. .22-250 will fly much faster and flatter within short-to-medium-range distances, but as distances increase, the projectiles slow down quickly and go subsonic long before the 1,000-yard mark. By contrast, the 90-grain SMK moving much slower out of the muzzle will remain supersonic past 1,300 yards. The difference in wind drift is even more stark. The 90-grain Sierra Match King projectile drifts noticeably less than the light and fast 22-250 projectiles.
Does this mean that the 22-250 is now outmoded? Not even close. Varminters depend upon its flat trajectory and inherent accuracy. It's a custom loader's dream cartridge, and the factory ammunition out there works well, too. If, however, you want a semiauto platform or you want to deal with longer distances, .224 Valkyrie looks like it will be the logical choice.
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- The Social Regressive
I'd like to see a comparison of a 22-250 with 1x6.5 twist barrel, 90 grain SMK against the .224 Valkyrie.
Check and see if “Mark and Sam After Work” have done the barrel and ELD bullet.
Did you ever locate your comparison of a 22 250 A.R. 15 compared to a A.R. 15 Valkyrie.???
@@captainamer71 Nope, unfortunately not. I would accept Bolt Action comparison too. Do you happen to know of any?
@@rkba4923 well there used to be a few companies that made AR10’s in 22-250 but since the bolt face is like .470 same as a .308 and 6.5 CM it had to be on a AR10
Many dont understand the appeal of the valkyrie and many of those that have one understand whats special about it for some and for some people it just will not so what they want.
A Valkyrie pushes a heavy bullet with a good BC faster than a 223 can and lower pressures and fits in an
AR15 mag. And it isnt a barrel burner
A 22 creed etc will push a 88gr berger way way faster and burn out is barrel way way faster and will not fit into an AR15 mag.
For a bolt gun their are better options
@@captainamer71 Thanks for response. Have a great day!
22-250 is arguably the best coyote gun and really good for the Prarrie dogs. In my book as a coyote hunter it's max range is about 400 yards because after that you need to do a bunch of wind and elevation calculations. Inside of that it's almost a layup for the good ole 250.
220 swift if you reload
In the 60s I used to hunt marmots with a 220 swift. I’d hand load 50 grain bullets and a 24” barrel.
It would push the bullets out at 4100 FPS. The issue was throat erosion. Barrels had very short lives and they had a terrible problem with yawing under 50 or so yards as well.
I moved to the 22-250 in the 70s and it was more accurate and barrels lasted longer.
I think the 224 Valkyrie is going the right way with heavier bullets. However it’s pushing into the 6mm range with more bullets and very good BC
Holy cow. I used to get 4,000fps with a 45-grain bullet in .22-250. I'd heard those 220 Swifts were fast, but dang!
They were fast but figure 3k rounds for the barrels. Luckily I was working for a gunsmith part time. My 22-250 used to push the 50 grain bullet at 3700. It was much more accurate ( different twist)
The swift is a hell of a good round. 4100fps is worth the price of more throat erosion to me.
No problems with my swift ,I shoot 55 grn Bergers on varmints and 60 grn nosler partions on deer when I come to rebarrel I will go with a 1-8 twist and make it a 220 swift AI ,it's a ruger no 1 with a 26 ins barrel I'm old school , but the 224 Valkyrie is a interesting round, but the next calibre I add to my gun safe will be a 6.5 Grendel in a cz 527
thesheepman220 sounds like a nice setup. I used to shoot the 6.5 Remington mag that was a nice round out of a short action. I suspect that Grendel has similar ballistics. The ballistic coefficient of the 6, 6.5 and 7mm seem to all be excellent.
No AR-15 in 22-250. 1,000 yards with a 22-250? The 224 Valkyrie is irrelevant if you don't want to use an AR-15 and you don't plan to shoot long distances. Of course, every single cartridge on the market -- EVERY SINGLE ONE -- can be made to look 'irrelevant' if you take it out of its intended use. For hard-target sniping in the military, 22 LR is irrelevant. For low-cost plinking without being too disruptive to the neighbors, 50-BMG is irrelevant.
Bottom-line: it's as irrelevant as you want it to be.
TROOPERfarcry see your point there.
its technically an ar-10 but alex pro firearms makes one... made it for a while now
Olympic Arms makes a 22-250 AR15 model. Accepts all other mil spec AR15 components. Just need the 22-250 Mag and 22-250 UMAR lower with the machined Mag well.
Both of which don’t qualify as an AR15. TROOPERfarcey is 100% correct.
Snipers like 300 Rem. Ultra Mag over a 22 calibered round ..
Great discussion! As you mentioned, the biggest advantage of the 224 Valkyrie is that it fits in the AR 15 platforms. On the 22-250, I don't know anybody that shoots one and does not handload, and you can get the same 90gr bullet going at 2900FpS (33gr Hogdon H4350). Having said that, I am looking at building and upper for the Valkyrie and retiring my 243 varmint gun in its favor.
Back in the 70's there was a master gunsmith in Central CA named Gerald Clarke... I had a Sako chambered in his "wildcat" .224 Clarke. It was, like 22-250; based on a larger case, .257 Roberts if I remember right. FLAT SHOOTER! 1000 yards all day shooting ground squirrels for bounty. Barrel lasted about 2500 rounds. My earlier 22-250 didn't last that long. It seems the .224 Valkyrie may solve those issues (at least in the AR platform), I will be interested to see what barrel life will be in future testing. Thanks for sharing!
Yes my man! The .224 Clark is an excellent unknown caliber! One that NEEDS to be more popular! One of my favs.
22-250 R.E.M. Luv it !
22-250 rem can easily handle 60gr bullets and some Boutique brands offer up to 70 grain bullet for 22-250 Remington really good long-range performance.
Many years ago I skipped the 22-250 and purchased a Remington 700 in .243, the smallest center fire caliber most state require to take dear. The 224 Valkyrie is an outstanding varmint load, including coyotes and is very accurate out to 1000 yards. I know it is touted as a 1300 yard round, however, I have never seen it shot that far.
Tikka offers a 1:8 twist rate on the T3x for the 22-250. Ruger does too on their American, and I’ve seen it on sale for less than $280 in stainless.
Ruger American is good that way. My 7mm08 is a half inch shorter twist than most.
Hand load a 90 smk in a fast twist 22-250 and you will smoke the valkyrie all day long.
Exactly. I've built a 7 twist 22-250 with a 26 inch shilen tube on a savage model 12 action. I absolutely love this cartridge with the 90 grain bergers and the 90/95 grain sierras.
Turns a 22-250 into a legit 1000 meter rifle
@@davesweeney871 that sounds like an amazing combo. All because it won't fit in an AR the 22-250 is being missed out on by everyone.
@@gw9853 22 250 is built on an ar platform
@@bwlngod lol no it is not.
@@bmacski
AR 10
A lot of great information buddy, well done! I'm just still not sure if I'm ready to jump on the Valkyrie bandwagon just yet..
The shorter case design of 224 Valkyrie allows you to load the 90gr Berger BC of .551 or the SMK 90gr BC of .535. Can’t come close to those BC’s in 22-250 and keep COL within SAAMI spec
he said guess so I think he's about to try a 22-250 with a real slow twist and a longer throat. But folks he has a point about his comment to consider what you want and real-life use. For me, I bought a 22-250 for punching paper and chuck hunting figuring 500 yds would be the long end and 250-350 the practical range. at that point, the 22-250 will hold it's own quite well.
I believe the fastest twist rate from a factory barrel chambered in 22-250 is a 1-9 twist from savage in the model 12vlp and 12lrpv. Fast enough for the 75 grain bullets.
Now THAT'S cool. I didn't know that!
Ruger made a limited run of American rifles in 22-250 with a 1:8 twist. Similar to the 243, I'd expect to see some 22-250's come in the faster twists now because of the 224 valkyrie. Like he said the advantage of the Valkyrie is that it can fit in an AR. The heavy 22 idea has been around but I had read they were having jacket separation problems when driving the 90's really hard.
Thank you for the superb videos you post on TH-cam. I look forward to them with great anticipation.
Regarding this video, I shoot a Savage Model 12 in 22-250with a 1 - 9 twist and have no problems stabilizing 70 grain Berger VLD bullets with velocities reaching over 3300 FPS. After watching your video, I ran a simulation on my Ballistic AE app and found that the 22-250 will out perform the .224 out to 1125 yards when it goes transonic. The data is consistent with my real world experience albeit only through 600 yards. While the 22-250 is a dated cartridge, it still is very shootable over 1000 yards with the right barrel twist and bullet selection.
That's great to hear. I hope folks continue to tweak the .22-250. It's such an excellent cartridge. It's the first rifle cartridge I handloaded for; I made lots of mistakes, but it still shot tight, tiny groups.
I had a custom barrel from Rocky Mountain Rifle works with a 1/8 twist to shoot SMK80 grainers at 3000fps in 22-250. I have shot it out to 2000 yards. With a scope with 140 MOA. Fun cartridge.
Good gravy. That does sound like fun.
That sounds like the ticket
It's very fun and challenging to push the limits of a small caliber. Shooting long distance with them to see just what there capable of can be very surprising. I have a video shooting my .17WSM at 500 yards. I've gone out as far as 615 yards with it but haven't made a video yet. At 615 it was going through a 1/2 thick piece of plywood. Very surprising.
Btw, Tikka offers a 1:12 and 1:8 twist rate on their 22-250 on the new T3x, for those who want to stabilize a heavier bullet.
yeah, I remember when we were taking prairie dogs at 100yds back in dickity three. Good times, open sights and closed minds.
You do a great job with your videos! Very informative!
Glad you liked it, Josh!
So we need a 22-250 barrel with a 1-7 twist and a blumpy
Joe Dirt 22-250 Mach 2, build it and they will come
Criterion makes a remage style barrel that's 22-250 in a 1:7 - Seriously considering it
i want to build a custom 220 swift with a 1 in 6 inch barrel and load it with 80-95 grain bullets
The biggest problem with 22-250 is the lack of faster twist rate barrels which dont allow you to stabilize heavier bullets. Heavier bullets weigh more but they also carry more energy making their drop pretty much the same. The more important part is the heavier bullets do better in windy conditions. Thats why the 224 does well at 1000 yards 90 gr bullet with a .224 diameter is great with wind. Its basically the AR15 versions of the larger cartridge used in the AR10. The 6.5CM. 22-250 on the other hand stops showing its greatness after 500 yards tops. Its made to use 55 gr bullets and with the same .224 caliber their BC is much worse then the 224 Valkyrie. The 22-250 is a close to mid range varmint cartridge and its great for that. The 224 Valkyrie is a ELR cartridge that doubles as a varmint cartridge. I appreciate the 22-250 and of course i have one but the 224 Valkyrie is more versatile.
I got my wife a savage 12 over black Friday of course I had to get the 6.5 creedmoor. $219 is what I paid and couldn't pass it down.
I've been watching your axis build (mostly the pillar and glass bedding videos) and I'm excited to start. Stock comes in on tuesday!
Which stock did you end up buying?
The Social Regressive, ended up getting the pro varmint with the coyote finish and cheeck riser. I wanted boyds because I need to cut it down to 12.75 LOP, any idea how workable the boyds butt pad Is?
You should be able to easily trim the length of the stock. When you reattach the buttpad, it probably won't fit perfectly, but you can use these techniques to re-snug it: th-cam.com/video/xQUTFow61Eg/w-d-xo.html
My rifle: A Remington 700 with a 26 inch 1-9 twist Bartlein Barrel chambered in a 22-250 Ackley Improved (with a 40 degree shoulder). Loaded with a Sierra 69 gr. Match King or Hornady 73 grain ELD bullet, it beats the 22-250 Remington loaded with a 45 to 55 grain bullet and the 224 Valkyrie loaded with a 80 to 90 grain bullet.
Why compare a 55 gr bullet with a 90? Not a practical comparison.
They are completely different cartriges. He said why he didnt. They do not make a 90gr 22-250 or even a 75gr.
You didn’t watch the whole video
Not to long ago you could buy an AR15 with a modified Magazine that shot 22-250 from the factory.
That's awesome. I totally missed that one.
Found it! Olympic Arms UMAR. Weird!
can't find em anymore
I use a 75 grain Berger VLD out of my 22-250 AI. Bullets stability is dependent on twist rate of barrel to the given weight of bullet.
Sounds like a really fun project. How long does it stay supersonic?
How long it stays supper sonic is totally dependent on the atmospherics for that day. Same for the 224 Valkyrie. With today's conditions just over 1350 yards.
Given length, not given weight
This is the way to go with a bolt action....... Your rig will outperform the Valkyrie 10 times........ By the way Bullet stability is dependent mostly on twist rate to bullet bearing surface ( the long bearing surface tend to make the bullet heavy !!!! lol )
@@SocialRegressive if it had a 7.5 twist with 80.5 Berger bullets it would be doing just over 1300 feet a second at 1200 feetmines does and with a 30 in barrel using 34 grains cafe great rifle shooting crows at 817 yards
Great video! Could you also compare 6,5 cartridges like 6,5 Creedmoor, 6,5 Swede or 6,5 Grendel?
65 Grendel FTW, deer hunt with it, better long range stability... I can consistently hit the 500 yard steel at my range. But you'll never find ammo or magazines locally. Buy everything online :/
Ryan Trials 6.8 better for hunting
I'll stick with my 308
idlehands333 no sir, 6.5Grendel will do everything the 6.8 can do, better than the 6.8, and more. Better short range ballistics, better long range ballistics, larger range of bullet weights. There's a reason the military never adopted the 6.8 round, yet the 6.5 Grendel is in trials presently for both US service and HAS been adopted by a standing government military.
jimhans1 incorrect. The 6.8 wins within 350-400 yards then the Grendel surpasses it. However, they are both so close in both close and long range performance that the difference is negligible. The reason the Army stuck with the 5.56 is because of the logistics required to change caliber. Too much time, money, effort required to change to a caliber that may or may not be more effective in actual combat. That and nothing beats the 5.56 in weight and carrying capacity while still remaining effective.
jimhans1 6.8 also superior to 6.5 out of a short barrel at any range.
Very interested to see how the 224 Valkyrie performs in real world testing. I'm still thinking about getting a 6.5 Grendel spr together but man if this cartridge does like they say it does, that might change.
Colson Customs Grendel has the advantage of cheap Russian ammo for plinking.
That is does. A budget ar running nothing but steel cased 6.5 would be a pretty awesome plinker, no doubt. Only concern would be eating up a nicer barrel if it has a bi metal jacket. And honestly, I could probably get hand loads down pretty cheap either way.
Colson Customs sadly, there are not any truly cheap bullets for 6.5mm. I've got 4 Grendel's built, and will build a Valk, but it won't replace any of my Grendel's, the bullet weight range I can run (85gr-156gr) in the Grendel and the availability of the steel cased ammo win the day for me.
That is very true. I see the 224v as being a nice upgrade for people wanting to push the limits of 5.56 as far as heavier bullets with higher bc. 6.5 Grendel is something I would feel more comfortable taking a deer with which is far more likely than getting to shoot past 1,000 yards on paper.
Colson Customs I agree.
Best round I personally ever used was the old .25 REM fired from a model 30S Remington last made in 1929......the Enfield action handled very hotttt loads, very accurate at long range and packed a punch....... Why not neck/shoulder down a .30 REM to 223 (not a 30-06 case)
Best explain of 22-360 I've seen. Know the bullet is light but at over 4000ft/sec can't be too much wind drift for first 200 yds. Just not in the air that long. One neg I've found to 22-250 is some indoor gun ranges ban it. Not sure why they just say it's hypervelocity. These ranges do not ban other .223 caliper ammo except for the Swift
At 4000fps it smokes straight through AR500 steel used for the bullet traps. The other rounds can’t generate the needed velocity to damage their bullet traps.
In terms of the AR-15 form factor constraints (magazine length, bolt face) the 224 Valkyrie marries the super high BC SMK 90gr (.534) and even the Berger 90gr (.561) with the larger 6.8SPC case. There is no better performing long range option anywhere for the AR-15 form factor.
Peter Southern Boy I'll still stick with a 6.5 Grendel or if I just NEED a .224" bullet got with the .224LBC, I have a Valk barrel coming to test out, but it won't replace any of my Grendel guns/chamberings.
Olympic arms made a ar 15 in 22-250 and 243wssm. I have both uppers. a 25wssm is also available. One of the uppers is a piston gun with a adj gas block. It also has a proprietary magazine for each caliber to fit longer cartridges in a ar15 lower. The lower is cut out longer for the magazines.
Charles Wittmer while Olympic DOES make the UMAR15, it doesn't fully apply to this as it is only available with a 1:14 twist barrel. Which is great for Bullets up to 50-55gr, it will not stabilize anything past that. So no true long range use out of it. Also a pain for proprietary mags. That only hold 5 rounds
Great vid explanation. Probably 6.5 Creedmor on the Savage in the background although I still like the 7mm-08. REM7600
I got a 7mm-08, absolutely love 7mm
Insane bc's on them.heavier projectiles.
I own a 204, 22.250 and 224 Valkyrie.
The AR platform likes the 204 and loves the Valkyrie. Not so much the 22.250.
I'll take the 204 over the 22.250 for accuracy and speed and certainly the Valkyrie for long range stuff, no contest with the 80.5 gr berger.
expect to see .223 and 22-250 cartridges with the same bullet as the .224 val soon. There are already hand loaders doing 90-100 grain loads.
I wanna say. 224 Valkyrie because of your past few videos... Looking forward to seeing the build
I love my .224. it always makes me smile to hear the rhythm of repeated gong hits on semiauto. If I hunted past 200 yards, I would switch to something stronger, but out to 200, this will do just fine all day
(20", 1:7 twist, with a leupold mark 4 8.5-25x)
I have a older Savage, bolt action, single shot with a 26 inch barrel with a 1 in 7 twist barrel in which I shoot a 90 grain BT hollow point bullet at 2950 FPS. Extremely flat shooting and extremely accurate
I'm surprised they don't make an ar-10 for the 22-250
DPMS used to make one, if I remember correctly.
That would be wonderful if they still did. Or Rock River Arms with a heavy stainless barrel...
APF makes several models in 22-250
We sell the Apfs they are sweet shooters.
John Ganshow - yeah, DPMS tried, nobody wanted it. .308 and Creedmoor is where the demand is at for large frame AR’s.
Food for thought. The Hornady Manual lists hand loads up to 80 Grains for the 22-250 traveling upwards of 3200FPS with a with a ELD .457 BC bullet. I have seen AR-10 uppers listed for sale for the semi-auto AR platform crowd. Given those numbers I would think that the 22-250 should be able to keep pace with the 224 Valkrie to at least 1100 yards before it goes subsonic. Given that the hornady reloading manual tends to be a little conservative with its pressures, you might be able to push that 80grain bullet even faster.
260 in a ar 10 once you leave the ar15 platform. I have a 243 wssm in a ar15 and it shoots win ballistic tips great but it is finicky to load for. the 65 cm can use a longer bullet than the 260 in the ar10
Yeah .224 val is the next 6.5 creed for AR15. Plus a lot of people don’t want to spend the money on an AR10. Hopefully PSA or Anderson will pick it up the round and make some uppers for people who want a budget long range gun. Can’t wait to see what the future has for us!
I get the feeling this one's going to be very popular.
I've been a strong proponent of 22-250 (but not 22-250AI) with heavy bullets for years now. I got into it because i could hand load for them much cheaper than my 308's
I run a Savage model 111 & 12 with pacnor barrels (and chassis systems so i can squeeze every bit of accuracy out of them as possible) with 90gr smk all the way down to 69gr loads
I think people have a lot of misconceptions about heavy 22-250's but a stout load with 90gr will shoot flatter than a 6.5cm with less recoil.
As for barrel life, i have close to 3000 through my model 111 which was my first and so far all is well. My newest built on a Savage model 12 and MPA chassis has a pacnor stainless barrel that i had nitrided so I'm expecting the barrel to last even longer yet but only time will tell
In the Hornady reloading book, they prefer 75-grain ELD-Match with 1:8 twist rate, but I cannot find any off-the-shelf rifles with that twist rate, the closest is 1:9
You might check Savage. They used to make one in 1:8.
Love the .22/250 - under 400 yards it's a laser, but I never use it for long distance with light bullets. I'm always tempted to rebarrel it in 1-7" or less and launch 90gns bullets out of an AI chamber. But that's a project for another year.
How come you aren't comparing it to the 6.5 Creedmoor. It seems these two cartridges will be in direct competition with each other for long-range competition shooting.
I like the way you later that out. I'm a fan of the 22-250 for coyote but love my AR, can't wait to see what 224 will make it it self, also couldn't help making the 224 th comment.
PERFORMANCE UPDATE FOR THE SHOOTING COMMUNITY:
And right on que as expected (because of Federals outlandish hype of the 224Valkyrie), and the fact that the Valkyrie is a slow childs caliber, another company has popped up to give shooters a real choice in performance offerings for the AR platform. You can now get custom match grade barrels for the 224grendel at TacticalCannon dot commmm (and no its not me just passing info along to the shooting community), they even carry the dies, pre made brass, match bolt/barrel sets. Pretty dang cool.
Valkyrie was not designed to be a 22-250 replacement or 22-250 equivalent. It was designed, first, to fit the AR-15 platform and provide for longer bullets for long range shooting. The case capacity on the Valkyrie is only 3.1 grains more than 5.56/223 (34.5 grains vs 31.4 grains). 22-250 holds 44.6 grains. The Valkyrie case is 1.6" in length, the 223 is 1.76". The Valkyrie is .16" shorter for use with long bullets (so the overall length stays within AR-15 specs) and holds a little more powder to make up for those longer bullets also being a bit heavier.
If anything, the Val is more of a 5.56/223 replacement than anything.
Well put. I'm a fan of the 22-250 and had one built about 5 yrs ago that is stupid accurate. I totally agree with your long range comparison of bullets. I limit mine to 500 yds. So for long range, I'm going to have another build in the near future but this time it will be in .260 Remington.....just as accurate as the Creed but 200 fps velocity edge.
I’ve had the 224 Valkyrie since it came out. It has disappointed time and time again. 90gr, doesn’t shoot for crap, loading with ELDM has been very finicky, and brass is horrible. With the 22-250ai or a 223ai they’re easy to load for and easy to find nodes for.
I've been hearing more comments along those lines.
The Social Regressive - I’d love for the Valkyrie to do great but not until a premium brass manufacturer comes out with match quality brass. Believe it or not all 3 brass manufacturers, Federal, Hornady, and Starline require major case prep to get right but the Federal brass has the best case capacity and after weeding out the loose primer pocket pieces, they’re gtg and I’ve been getting the best accuracy with the Federal brass once it goes through prep.
My 22.250 imp Rem 700 VSSF, with 70 gr Speers pushed along by 34 grn's ADI 2208 Australian powder, (exported to America & called Varget), shoots around .5 to .75 moa all day. I'm happy enough,, Cheers mates. :) .
Barrel a rifle in the Ackley improved .22-243, it will beat the pants off the .224 Valkyrie from either a bolt gun or an AR-10. Down side is that currently you still have to make your own brass for it, thankfully the parent case (.243 Winchester) is very plentiful.
Great job on this review... 👍
Hey man, I forgot who built it and put it out but I'm sure a quick Google search will tell you who , but there is an AR-15 chambered in 22-250 that you can buy.
I know that centerfire ammo under .25 were not leagle for big game animals in the state where I live when I last hunted as they were considered to be for varmet hunting only
That's pretty common.
Not to rain on your parade but you're forgetting about the .223 WSSM. The cartridge very few work around but can be outfitted in an AR15 and has. There are no limitations in bullet weight and has superior case capacity.
Having a custom 22-250 barrel made to a longer throat witha 1 in 7 twist is child's play for barrel makers these days and one could easily have several made for a Ackley Improved version of the 22-250 Heavy Bullet Special and wax the Valkyrie until the cows come home..... Just because you have one in an AR and you have "fire power", what do you really have in the real world against a good Bolt Gun? Not much. Besides, I doubt that the .22 will get enough interest with the 6.5 CM taking off as it has to gain much but a small and specialized following in the Valk. The 22-250 on the other hand has a well established and loyal following from the 1930s!
Oh if I were to choose anything outside of the AR-15 form factor constraints (magazine, bolt) then for PRS gas gun it would be 6mm Creedmoor and for LR hunting it would be 6.5 SAUM GAP 4S - but that’s not the OP’s thread. OP is about the AR-15 form factor constraints
I want to have a .224 with a wider case and maybe some more weight like 120 grains. I love it, but I want just a little more energy. I guess what I'm saying is that I want it to have energy of the more powerful 6.5 Grendel while keeping its excellent ballistic performance.
well done , very concise explanation.
22-250 is a great Vermont round. Great for small game where sometimes you need to reach right out there to them.
This is off topic but i am from Ireland and noticed that you sound a little irish in your accent......Anyway love the detail on your ballistic info.
In my opinion if you want bullets of 90 to 100 grains, move up to .24 of .25 caliber.
They don't have the same BC in that caliber, they would have to be heavier.
If you are going to use an ar15 platform the Valkyrie is the way to go but just for comparison I have a custom 22-250 rem with a 27" bartlein barrel with 1 in 7.75 twist rate. With a 75grn A-max muzzle velocity is 3400fps and with a 200 yrd zero my drop at 1000yrds is only 220 inches. The longest groundhog kill with this rifle is 1026yrds.
Thank You...great video, from Italy....ciaooo
Do a video on .204! :) probably my favorite I feel like it would fit in between these two! How about you?
Just about any out of the box 22-250 with federal premium 60 grain Nosler Partition store box ammo are absolutely lethal on whitetail from 400 yards on in. The Mighty little 250 is a straight up Monster in hiding with the right load and in capable hands. The behind the shoulder exits are unbelievable for such a small caliber. I have yet to have a deer take as much as 1 step either. Seeing people using 338 rums on whitetail is just ridiculous and wasting a lot of good meat that many people need. Ballistics are nice, but just like in sports, paper champs are not field proven like the venerable old 250 is.
i have a browning x-bolt in 22-250 with factory 1:9 twist rate, heaviest factory load i can get my hands on at the moment is 64 grain winchester which is helpful for longer shots. looking forward to experimenting with some heavier hand loads though
Try the Berger 80.5 yellow boxes they are a great bullet
I love and have several Savage 12 LRPV guns, 2 of those chambered in 22-250 with a 1 in 9 and 1 in 12 twist and that 1 in 9 twist gun is impressive with 70-75gr bullets out to 700 yards, which is long past the capabilities of most shooters anyway. I REALLY wish Savage would chamber this model in 6mm ARC but we are going to have to see lighter bullets offered to the public for that to happen. Why they have not offered the 12 LRPV in 224 Valkyrie is beyond me.
I'm tempted to build a 1:9 twist .22-250. I still have my dies and a gob-lot of heavy 224 bullets. What a fun rig you have.
@@SocialRegressive just keep doing your thang as all of your content is good. I'm still catching up on your videos but I'm very impressed with everything so far.
@@ArkansasBadBoy Thanks, ABB!
224 valk has been haveing trouble with 90 grain bullets even with 1:7 twist. My Savage msr15 did not like anything over 75 grains bullet. I am a reloader and a gunsmith so everything was inspected. I got good accuracy in the .486 in with 60 grain pills.
I have a bergara b14 hunter 22-250 with a 1in9 twist barrel and I load the 75gr bthp match hornady bullet and can get between 3250 and 3350fps. I don't have but 500 yards to shoot it but it drops about an inch less than the 55grn vmax at that range. And it stabilizes great.
Don't sell that rifle. Or sell it to me. 😍
I launch 75 gr eld match out of my Bergara 22 250 with a 9 twist. It smokes my sons Valerie, 22 arc, 6 dasher et al. Almost nothing is thus flat to 1k. Thing is nobody is shooting pdogs at 1k. 750 is about the limit unless you waste 20 rnds per splat. If yoy are shooting paper, its just a scope adj.
It probably really comes down to not being able to get a standard .22-250 with proper twist rate for heavier bullets, where it likely would perform similarly or better than .224 Valkyrie. Personally, I'm really eyeing an AR-15 in 6.5 Grendel, but .22 Nosler seems like a serious contender as well. So many choices, it gets pretty overwhelming.
The Ruger American .22-250 has a 1:10 twist. I have one in a Boyd's stock using 62gr TSXs for PA deer & coyotes. 1:10 is borderline for a long 62gr copper bullet, 1:9 would be better. I don't get sub-1" groups, but 1"-ish @ 100yds. Which in PA is plenty since 99% of everything is shot inside 150yds anyway.
I've seen a couple of comments about .243 and 6mm x 47 here and I have a 6x45mm AR that will shoot a 75gr out to a 1000. So maybe a 6mm Valkyrie with a 105 some day? Thoughts?
Absolutely. I'll bet right now someone's already testing that wildcat. There are 115-grain bullets out there, too.
Update... I finally found what it's called, plenty of wildcatters are working on the 6x6.8 SPC. Ballistics calculators comparing the 90gr 224 Valkyrie to a 107gr 6mm indicate about 25% more terminal power with about 5% more drop, so long range and bullet options for hunting.
Gary Carroll - you can’t run 107gr in a 6x6.8 at PRI mag length (2.3” coal) and it’s throated for bullets under 90gr... this comes from Ritch of Ritch’s Precision Guns. The more appropriate comparison is a 243 LBC which is. I had one with a 20” and could only get accuracy nodes around 2750 fps with a 95gr VLD. A 22 Grendel or 224 LBC would be the better option if high BC being pushed at AR15 pressures is what you want.
Ive got a 24" cmmg 22nosler- & i shoot rings around my buddy out to 500 yds. With 200fps more vel.Over his Valkrie! Hogs & coyotes definitely know the difference!
Great video. Well spoken and informative. Liked and subbed.
Thanks for subscribing! See you 'round!
Great video and data information! For that you get a new subscriber.
I would like to see 36 gr on 22-250R .. everything.. about
Reloading.. precision .. ballistic gel test ..
You can do it .. I know
I'm gonna guess it is chambered in 22-250.
The only offerings in the FV are 22-250 Rem, .223 Rem, .308 Win, 6.5 Creed, and 204 Ruger.
22-250 isn’t irrelevant for long range. Savage makes a factory 1:9 twist rifle in the BVSS or VLP model that will shoot 69gr-75gr bullets in most conditions. Beyond that, rebarreling a Savage is very easy with the right tools. So is building an AR. So if I wanted to shoot a .224 long range, I’m doing a 22-250 bolt gun hands down. That’s exactly what I did. Shooting a 1:7 twist 24” barrel with 80gr A-Max’s at 3,100fps. It’s a lazer, has virtually zero recoil, and hits consistently out 700 yards (furthest I have available) sub moa with my handloads if I do my part. Been shooting it for over 3 years now and loved every minute of it. Even made it to the finals of a local PRS series. My AR-15 is a 6.5 Grendel and that might be getting a .243 LBC barrel by next year.
Asah E. look at the .224LBC, beats the Valk in ballistics, still has inexpensive .224" bullets that can be used.
Hullo Buddies, please, what about the barrel's longevity using the .224 Valkyrie?
55gr 22-250 is old school. We've got slower twists and heavier bullets now
You meant faster twists not slower twists 1 in 12 is faster than 1 in 14. And I am sure you can get them faster. A 1 in 12 works great with a 62 grain boat tail. I have not tried higher, but I don't shoot beyond 300 yd anyway.
It is currently still in production might I add
224 Valkyrie is ok for target shooting, I don’t see that it has a place in the hunting world though. I also don’t see a plethora of bolt action rifles coming out in this chambering so a custom job may as well be a fast twist 22-250 vs a 224
Kinda reminds me of the failed 223 wssm with a faster twist rate. If I’m shooting past 300 yds it won’t be a 22. If I’m playing around in the 90 gr world I’ll stick to my 243. I love the fact that they keep developing new ideas just not sure that will catch on. Hopefully they will neck that case up to 6mm
Somebody's gonna do it. I just hope it ends up an official SAAMI round.
good data explained.................... thanks
Good stuff!
Especially the comments,
The distance and the grain is so AWSOME!
My two are 2506&7STW hand load. Not to so the 6.5 is overrated, it's all a matter of how you build what you have .
I would love to see a varmint that can reach out!
Thinking a 240 weatherby 85gr?
That's a great combo for pretty much every game out there. I know a guy who uses his 7STW for Alaskan brown bear. And the 2506 is great for yotes through mule deer.
Those 1300 yd figures are pretty impressive but I think i will stick with the 80 yr old 22-250 which does the business out to 300 to 350 max for me.
I never considered the .224 Valkyrie a hunting cartridge. I thought it was used strictly for target shooting.
I'll stick with my 22-250. I've got my AR, don't need a pretender.
Love my valkyrie!! Super loud though. Also love my 22-250.
I honestly don't like to judge new things that much but having said that (lol) I think it would be smarter to stick with a 243... it will be easier to get the ammo for and has been around for a long time so you know it's not going anywhere
been thinking of this. a lot of gimmicky calibers coming out, don't get me wrong they're cool but at the end of the day reality sets in. if I wanted super fast 22 cal I'd get a faster twist 22-250 barrel for a bolt gun. that's just me.
You are a smart cookie. The idea of this cartridge was to give you something special in an AR-15 platform. It does that for sure. I'm like you though with my 22-250 I have no real need for this cartridge myself either. But those long range want everything guys are wanting it. Sure looks good!
I did the stats for factory loads . The 224 outperforms the 22-250.
At 200 yds, the federal 75gr fmj 224 is better than the federal 60 gr NP 22-250 in every cat. but speed
That's the magic of ballistic efficiency for ya!
I'm building a long range/ coyote rig. I was thinking 6.5 cm. but I just might go with a 22-250 with a 1-8 or 1-9 twist. A 90g plus the 75g VLD would be a blast. Plus I could load up 55 grainers for the yotes. Or maybe not. Uggh. Decisions decisions. I'll be ordering the barrel in the new year from JC customs in Canada. He makes great barrels. Plus his price point is decent and not a long wait.
I'm shocked at how good those 75-grain bullets are. Even out of my little 16" AR, they stay supersonic past 1,000 yards. That's bonkers.
Kman31ca
22 250 .......
You can shoot heavy bullets in a slow twist, just have hand load for it. Do some research on tanks, howitzers, other artillery pieces, twist lengths and firing solutions. It’s quite different than the usual train of thought.
The 22-250 is for those who want the most out of a 224 bullet. And a bolt action or single shot action will eek the most out of it, not a semi-auto. It's silly to even stick a 22-250 into any semi-auto platform. I doubt it would be economically viable for a company to do so because the demand won't support it because the 22-250 is geared to a different shooter. (Didn't we go through a similar debate when the 22-250 came out and we already had the 220 Swift?) As for the Valkerie, personally, I'd rather chamber my AR in 243 or 6.5 if I was to go that way. But, whatever floats your boat, go for it. Being free to experiment this way and make one's own choice is way to cool.
[Edit] I just ran across an AR chambered i. 22-250. Eat my dust Val!
You can get a 22-250 in the AR15 platform. Olympic arms called an UMAR
Sooooooo, if I get a new barrel (with the proper twist) for my 22/250 and I decide to shoot the same 90 grain bullets, then . . .
But as others have noted, when shooting at 800 + yards, then there are better cartridges.