BTS's success is causing these institutions to panic , wanting to rethink their own charts and rewrite the rules , remove categories to prevent them from winning awards. It is BTS vs the whole industry yet they are losing.The fact that BTS's success is causing the music industry to modify itself to prevent BTS from winning is the biggest 'proof' of their impact.
So basically BB forgot they exist to report metrics and started thinking they are the gatekeepers for what's "good". And because they don't think BTS are good enough to be on top, they decided to sabotage their nomination chances. They think BTS doesn't know their place, when in reality they are the ones who need to step back and remember who they are.
Dude I had calmed down about this, now your video has me riled up again. I think the biggest thing that pisses off Western media conglomerates and Billboard is that BTS is there because of fans- not palm greasing, not money. Actual music listeners making a choice as a collective to put BTS there. If they, meaning Western media/artists don’t take stock into what BTS and ARMY have done with regards to fan-group engagement.., they’ll just be caught off guard in another 10-15 years when another artist does it.
My sister put it very well once: People expect the BB charts to show which songs are most popular at the time. But that's not what they're doing. It would be more accurate to say the the charts show for which songs the most money is being paid for - whether by the fans or by the labels. And I think that's a beautiful (although shady) way of putting it.
At the very least, we can say for certain, BTS' #1s are ALL the work of fans. BH's promotion strategy is tossing us a teaser or two and dipping. ARMY creates the goals and we get to work. We're just a bunch of regular ppl with no central leader and we STILL outdo the organized crime that is the music charts. Who else can make such a boast about their fandom?
SUGA did a weverse magazine where he talked about the freedoms they have under their label. He also spoke about the inappropriate behaviours of the k-pop industry. It was a great article to read.
The part about fans sending radio stations gifts as thanks hit hard because I remember how hard it was to get one damn play on the radio. We had to jump through not just any hoops, but hoops set on fire moving at 100 miles per hour. Ridiculous twitter polls, DJs asking for x number of follows, calling stations for requests non-stop, etc. All for 1 of three things to happen: 1. Got ignored 2. Got publicly ridiculed by GP or the stations themselves or 3. Got ONE play outside of prime listener hours so basically we all waiting until like 10 PM for one...ONE play before we had to the whole song and dance again. I still remember sending my local radio station thank you flowers for playing Mic Drop and they posted it on their twitter. The OP was kind, but a fellow DJ responded with a backhanded comment about how us ARMY were "playing radio stations" to get what we wanted. As if we didnt just do what THEY asked us to do. Same BS with Billboard. We surpass everyone else within the parameters they set up to make it near impossible for us, but we still get shit on for "manipulation"?? Nah. Of course, not every radio station was like that. We had a few who believed in BTS and still do, but man not much has changed sadly.
Well said....I totally agree wtih you that BTS has risen to the top organically through their perseverance and loyal support from ARMY. Not sure if you know about these videos posted by 2 Korean professors who spoke about BTS success and how they fight against prejudice together with ARMY support (mentioned about US radio plays and stores starting to sell BTS CD/Albums) :- 1) "The reason behind BTS successㅣWhat's the difference between them and The Big 3?ㅣProf. Choi Jae Boong" < th-cam.com/video/51XcEduywSU/w-d-xo.html > [Pls turn on CC for Eng sub] 2) BTS and Army Grow Together, Fighting Against Prejudice | JiYoung Lee, Professor < th-cam.com/video/Rhj01Lbuw0I/w-d-xo.html >
Everything about the way BTS is treated in the US is bizarre to me. If millions of Americans alone are spending their own money to buy these albums than how can anyone claim their fame isn’t real. Just because army is smart enough to join forces with each other to figure out the rules and meet their objective, they must be doing something wrong? Sorry that the majority of western artists don’t have fandoms with this same passion or intelligence but that’s not BTS’ fault. 🤦♀️ it’s just like how they can have a number 1 song for 10 weeks but aren’t ever in the artist of the year category for anything, yet those that sit at number 2,3 whatever, are nominated. Nothing makes sense to me.
Your point that "they just want BTS to go away" - that's exactly it, like they were putting forwards these expensive magazine boxes for sale with fairly minimal hype, and my theory is that they didn't care if they made a loss on the sales, because the end game for them is to damage their reputation and reduce their impact in any way that they can.
Like that, yes. "Oh, look, BTS fans aren't buying the BTS mags... guess it's losing it's popularity. Let's do an article on how BTS fans are abandoning it and moving on to other interests. We can find some good quotes on Twitter." (I LOATHE how that article kept calling them 'it'.) "Ok, but, how do we reconcile that with the fact that it's broken enough records to get into the Guinness Hall of Fame?" "... ...Well, we ignore that. Duh." No; no they won't. Not when ARMY has something to say about it.
about the english songs- i have to say, (sorry for my english it's not my first language) first- i believe the english songs woud'nt be released if all the memebers would truly opposed to them. but even if we take the approach that maybe the english singles are maybe less close to their identity, (even tho i there are many things in the songs that you can very much say "this is bts") and maybe it was more pushed by the label to do it, being a top artist you also have to be stratigic and i think it's complitly legitimate. they are in a certain momentum and they want to take advantage of it as much as possible, and doing it with english singles is the most reasonable thing. and they don't hide it, cause it's not a bad thing. the whole "trojan horse" joke- namjoon basically confirmed it, he said these are easy songs to listen to and he hopes it will lead people wou wouldn't have listened to them otherwise to listen to more of their past korean discography. many artist first do more of a "gp standard popular" music to atrackt audience and then have more freedom to maintain their position but move to do more things of their own style. bts didn't even do that, their popularity did came from their korean songs, and they still were one of the bestselling and touring acts before dynamite. they're just using a momentum to get even higher. still all of this doesn't mean it's all stratigic. for dynamite, it's a disco funk song first of all, funk and hip hop are actually very close especially in dance, 'hope world' is full of funk. butter has their rap- NAMJOON'S WRITTEN RAP, and permission to dance message incoprates things bts have said, and a very bts-ish message, and as said by the weverse article, they still had creative imput even if they didn't write the lyrics or music. what i'm trying to say is, language is not the only thing that defines bts' identity. also just to add, i don't see this conversation happening about Maneskin- an italian band that their most popular song right now is in english (and not even their song) and they have more english songs, or with ABBA one of the most popular bands of all time- swedish band that sang in english. i heard nobody saying "they lost their idenity cause the didn't sing in their native language"
Btw, in Germany songs and albums can only be purchased once per credit/debit card number or they won't count towards the charts. Nothing stops BB from putting such a system in place. And BTS are still charting top10 with title tracks here.
How does that work doesn't Germany have banking laws and consumer laws like the UK where a credit/debit card number can't by law be given to a third party? It's referred to a mining and it's against the law here. What happens if you buy a copy for yourself and one as gift for a friend of family members birthday because you know they would like a copy also? What if you buy a copy but you break the CD (I've done that plenty of time's) and gone and bought a second copy? But then I order straight via UK Amazon straight through to South Korea and wait for it to arrive. I'm also protected by the Distance Selling Regulations so my card details etc can not be accessed by a 3rd Party.
And guess what they did that but also introduced bundling and that a against of what people are saying is to stop bulk buying when we can buy some merchandise and it all will counted towards chart
24:20 and *THIS* is what it all comes down to. The reason why BTS are STILL so vilified, targeted, and excluded by this industry is bc BTS/HYBE refuses to give American companies their money. Even when they first entered the west (which they never planned to do) BTS did not sign to an American label and instead partnered with a major American label…to help distribute their music. Since day 1, HYBE has been smart enough to protect BTS’ money and their interest, and with the American music industry being one well known to actively (and legally) steal millions from even the biggest western artists, they’ve never forgiven BTS for becoming so popular and profitable “without them” (or really, without having to pay them). America is, and always will be, all about the money….yay capitalism. Edit: and now that HYBE owns one of americas biggest music labels?? Oh you know the industry MAD mad now 😂😂
“They never got shit for the legitimacy of their popularity” That’s right, Elliot! That’s what’s maddening. The double standards and hypocrisy of it. To think RM had to face this kind of interrogation, and keep his cool. 😡😤🤬
Recently Binboard made a video 'explaining' the Hot 100 chart and not surprisingly, they praised 'fan driven' hits. A certain artist's fans bought and streamed and made a 25 year old song of that artist go number 1 which according to them was highly appreciable. Apparently sales are supposed to be 'chart manipulation' only in the case of BTS. The hypocrisy is real.
I saw that and didn’t watch it. Too much coincidence between the magazine and the video. BTS on their magazine cover then creating a box set to make bank on ARMY. Talk about manipulation.
I haven't been a fan since the beginning - in fact, I've been an ARMY for only a few months now - but I heard a lot of fans talking about this whole issue we're dealing with, and saying that it's pretty much history repeating itself. Except now it's not in South Korea, it's in the USA/Western. They started off small. They didn't blow up over night. The industry didn't see them as a competition whatsoever, so they simply didn't care about them, maybe even let them win a few awards here and there, not thinking they would make it in a long term. But then... the boys started getting more and more popular, growing their fanbase, winning more awards, gaining numbers everywhere, and suddenly they became a competition. So the industry tried to bring them down, invalidate their success and popularity, fans of other acts became more vocal and hateful. But we all know how it turned out in the end. BTS ended up outgrowing the Korean industry, they became global. They became untouchable. And it's the same thing happening rn in the west, it's just a matter of time. It's just really painful to see. I can't imagine how tired the guys must be after all those years of getting nonstop hate from both the regular folks (aka fans of other artists) and the media/public figures. They're just normal boys who are passionate about music, trying to spread a good message, making lives of millions of people better every single day. They don't even seem to care about charts and awards anymore - they're here for the music and for their fans. But as long as they are a competition, as long as they are a threat, people will continue to try to bring them down.
Exactly! Thank you for writing down exactly what I was thinking myself. I am also a new army of only seven months but I also see history repeating again - BTS and ARMY against the music establishment, again and again.
lmfao stop engaging with the bot 😭 the james henry smith guy’s been under every kpop/bts video on the platform for the past year (with very VERY terribly structured “arguments” not in the idols or fandoms’ favor), but if you notice, the account creation date is always around a month ago or something like that (again they’re just a spammer with hundreds of accounts. they will NOT stop replying to you if you keep engaging with them). they prob arent even a real person but stop giving them what they want ❤️
LOL Even if they change the rules,what makes them think we won't win?I actually want BB to change the rule or whatever it is. Let's see who will win in the end.
Right? Whatever will the haters do when they can't shove their 50-100 votes a day behind their chosen 'BTS-breaker'? What'll artists say when only the first sale of their album to each fan is counted? What'll everyone say when artists are limited to a single version of their song and any others don't count toward the total? How unpopular will so many artists look, if YT suddenly sorts their views by 'unique' and 'repeated'? BTS won't suffer, and in fact it would take a little pressure off both ARMY and BTS. But the rest of the music industry will screech like banshees. And if they change it up so that, say, US votes or streams count double what other nationalities do, seeing as the Billboards are American... oh, the inferno that would result. They might just be fools enough to do that, too; to utterly shred their own credibility beyond any hope of salvaging. Grammy's almost at that point, BB may just leap off the cliff with them.
I do challenge billboard to change their rules, also would like the Spotify folks to check some other numbers so they would realize we are not just bots. Bots wouldn't fill up concert seats or watch vlives...
i’m glad this video it’s up because i was unable to join the livestream, i always can count with elliot to have the best way to say everything that it’s on my mind! i’m so happy we have someone like you in the fandom
Yes you are the best, so smart and articulate. Thanks for persevering, I know it is the same ol' crap all the time but you still manage to keep the delightful, creative, funny part of Elliot to share with us, that is a strength and I for one admire that. It one of the things I love about BTS too, they get so much bad but it does not kill their inner core of goodness, that must be so hard sometimes.
I find it extremely ironic that both the SK music industry and the American music industry have taken the same issue with BTS, they didn't grow through them, BTS, BH and Hybe, they didn't get support from the "official medium" so their success only undermines the institutions others use to get to where they are now. And so, just like MBC in Korea became petty over they not appearing in their NYE show, Billboard and other industry "tastemakers" in the US of F*cking A are getting incredibly petty because "how could someone become popular in the US if they don't /know/ the American Music Market like we do?" specially when money and ratings are involved, most people get irrationably angry. UGH.
It's already blowing up on BB's face haha They're now so desperate that they're using Rolling Stone's mailing list (both publications are under the same company) to send emails promoting their magazine to see if people will buy it, but it ain't selling. They lowered their original 7.5k copies to 5k and even then, only less than half got sold so far. In a fandom that sells out everything in minutes this shows how bad BB effed up. Hopefully more people will cancel their pre-orders, many outside of twitter are not so well informed or don't realize that BTS does not endorse that article at all. Like none of their official accounts acknowledged it whatsoever, which is a loud statement in of itself, since they always acknowledge interviews (unless they're awful, case in point). The media and the industry have been pushing us a lot lately, but they're not gonna like the results. Pissed off armys work 3x times harder, but these people refuse to understand. They still underestimate us, like BB did, and that will be their undoing.
the vaccination comment pisses me off bc he implied that bts had jumped the line to get vaccinated and then Jimin said that he got the jab last week (well within the age group that they're on now in Korea) 🙄
If they are going as government rep to the UN this month then yes it’s fair for them to now be getting vaccinated. They didn’t demand early access based on being celebrities. Heck poor Enhypen, under BigHit, has 6 of 7 members who got Covid last week. It was such a shady comment and the whole articles tone was snide and negative.
@@MariaChavez-ey5sr just a minor correction Enhypen is under Belift+ not bighit, but they are still under Hybe labels, but the point still applies and enhypen has a member who is immunocompromised too (whose confirmation of having COVID isn’t out yet) so like yeah anyways Billboard is shady and they should sit and think about how “smart” their comments are
Billboard knew that if they put BTS on the cover, Army will buy it. Oh but wait, they did make a box set of the BTS cover for $170, but that’s not using ARMY right. It’s just business. I was going to buy the magazine but NOT ANYMORE. Thanks Billboard, I think I will another BTS album instead!
Oh they can change the rules by saying that their charts and nominations are exclusive only for western artists lmao... But as long as still they include Bts and other artist outside. Of course armys will surely play the game... In the first place they're the first who acknowledge Bts popularity in 2017 and gave a nomination that's why army's hype up... It's not Bts who beg. And now they know it's beyond their control to handle that's why their trying Bts to get out of the way just because western artists are being left out. It's their karma coz before they are interested or wanna ride how popular Bts and devoted their fans are and know they question it coz they can't handle it. (Sorry for bad English, hope shared my opinion on point and you understand it)
BTS' problem is that they don't pay their way to the top, they climb there naturally with the support of their fans(a new concept for the music industry, artists who sell their music and top the charts). If anyone had any doubt about BB not representing POPULAR music, but something else, then there you go. And trying to get ARMYs money for a garbage article is almost hilarious, almost.
armys have been so vocal about the dirt the music industry continues to pull not only to bts but to other artists they don't agree or implicitly choose to be at the top. its so exhausting to have this conversation for /years/ when we know BB wont do sht about it since there are many who would follow and listen to their writing over the criticisms of actual fans or actual artists who defend the concept of the power of a fanbase who willingly choose to consume music, by buying. there's so much to unpack but uve said the general idea already (plus we don't even have to think about why its wrong but here we are trying to continue the conversation bc people choose not to listen).
I don't know a single person who has spent a single cent on any of the popular western pop artists since the days of CD's like 20 years ago. How on earth is their popularity more legitimate compared to a group who every single fan has spent tons of money towards, is beyond bonkers.
When I'm angry about something and you make a video about it I know right away that I'm gonna be less angry after watching it cause you always say everything I want to say but not able to put into words, I seriously love your videos
ARMYs are powerful and I'm so proud to be an ARMY. I will love and support BTS forever: fighting side by side with my fellow GLOBAL ARMYs to protect BTS at all costs. 💜
Aren’t Fans, in this case Army, meant to buy the music that their artists put out? If the Fans don’t do it who will? Obviously the US radio stations aren’t going to push BTS when their little favourites might lose out to them. Quality doesn’t count anymore, what does count is what they can get in return. The fact that BTS are winning awards elsewhere in the world doesn’t seem to resonate. If the Boys weren’t so well loved by millions of people all over the world they would not have got as far as they have. Sad, greedy self serving business.
There is and always has been, and will continue to be honor and integrity with BTS and EVERYTHING they do. Western culture like Billboard, don't operate with integrity, it's all about business and money and politics and who you know! GO BTS WE WILL ALWAYS SUPPORT YOU.
I’m late to the party but glad I made it! I find Billboard’s notion of BTS and Big Hit collectively compromising on releasing their first English track rather insidious when discussions between artist and label are standard operating procedure. And they know this is a normal conversation considering Billboard has been covering the entertainment industry since the late 1800s. What I feel they were underhandedly implying is the same narrative of K-pop being a manufactured, slave contract-driven machine that even the biggest group in the world can’t escape. In that, Billboard additionally implied that not only was their first all English release was manufactured through the K-pop machine, but so was their chart success.” Is this to stoke the fear that their white institution is being compromised by sneaky, underhanded Asians? Because that’s some of what it sounds like to me. They are directly aiming at BTS’ integrity and legitimacy as a “REAL” act while simultaneously expecting looking the other way from industry plants, payola, and back scratching. Additionally, the vaccine line jumping turned out to be false. Jimin said in his vlive before they went to NY that he had gotten his shot the prior week, which was well after the Billboard article came out. When his age group was up, he went. Seems like the author pulled that assumption out of their hat like they did those tweets they ridiculously cited in their article. And yet they question BTS’ legitimacy… huh. Also, when are we going to start blurring the lines between ARMY and GP? ARMY had to come from somewhere. I don’t think ARMYs have to meet “stan” levels (based on your scaling) to call themselves ARMY, nor do I think they have to be immersed in idol music culture. There would be no way that those stadiums are getting packed out if it was simply the stans alone (again, based on your scaling) going to concerts. I could be wrong about that, though.
@ 20:39 !!! WAY TO SUM THIS UP! I'm so mad at Billboard again!!! So grateful for the kind of relationship ARMY and BTS have. We definitely got each others back. T-T STREAM BUTTER EVERYONE!
I said that when all this started that it was all about money and the fact that the money was not going to the American music industry is why they want them to go away and why they won’t give them a Grammy that why they brought up the mandatory military issues they have been shitting on BTS from the start
We don't have transparency because they know if they gave it to us we would undoubtedly dominate. Because it's a universal fact that ARMY mobilizes better than any other fandom whether you view that as good or bad.
What is upsetting the industry about this is that... ARMY has showened to be more powerfull than what the insustry wants. Big Companies are not doing this. ARMY's love is doing this. Not Hibe. BTS by being just them. ARMY's love alone. NOW... Why does ARMY do this?... ARMY knows. But non ARMY have no idea what it means. Sad for them :p
@@bbygang awesome ... I recently found you & became a subscriber. This video is straight hard talking facts ... bless you. BTS remix is in tied position right now with 2 other songs for #1 on Hot 100. What's had me laughing is the bb sweetheart dropped down to #5. What thou gets me riled up are radio stations removing Butter from there playlist for spins. All right after bb incident!! Makes a person wonder. Thou facts are artists have been at the American music business standard to change ways. It's why artists went to doing bundles to make money. As they got prophets from the merch added to the music. Causing companies to make less than the artist finally. Just watched news report on this very issue. On MSNBC. Eye opening ...all the way back to Prince this fighting back by artists has been going on. Got to listen to Prince speak out against the crookedness of the system. Media plays, radio stations, & labels all connected to charts... it's what we call payola. Glad to find you. Blessings.
18:15 - 18:30 think it's more that bts isn't willing to play the us industry game (paying for radio and playlisting or aggreeing to some other form of payment) as seen in the thee remix lawsuit. And that by winning while not playing the game these people aren't able to "garantee" hot100 tops to other artist who payed them for it anymore. Makes sense a lot of ppl in the industry are big mad that bts is lowering their carefully curated system's value. PS: I broke the 69 comments count.. I'm so sorry!😌
That's a good point- labels that are doing the pay-to-win game must be quite displeased that someone who's refusing to pay-to-win...is actually winning. Now the players are out a lot of money, but not at the top as they expected. That's where a lot of underhanded behavior and bad attitude springs from, and so much clout-chasing... I'm just glad that many western artists do genuinely appreciate and respect BTS, even if the greedy stooges of the industry don't. It'd be a problem, if it was BTS vs the Entire West.
YES! I really didn't/don't understand why the BIG problem with BTS. They work hard just like others, put in the time, writing, producing, choreograph, putting together a show just like other artists. Is it really about them being Korean or not American? I'm sure the Latino's faced the same discrimination or something similar. Absolutely right, they would not interrogate American/western artists and it was an interrogation. Love it that you emphasize about ARMY getting to know the rules, playing the game and now everybody wants to change the rules. I so appreciate Jin's comment on making music in good faith, listening to music in good faith. When BTS speaks on BTS & ARMY's fight, it's quite a fight, for sure.
really well said, thank you for your insight and research, always love to to hear what you have to say! Also thank you so much for editing this into a shorter video, as someone who can not concentrate on a one hour content and up, this was really appreciated 💜
Here's another angle about BB actually making streaming numbers more significant and I said this on twitter. BB will have further issues because guess who is usually number one monthly with spotify streams: not bts, we're usually two. The number one is bad bunny and we saw last few years how well they treat him as well from industry people.. Remember "Speak english, I can't understand you" after the man won a fucking granny. So if they don't know how to handle bts, how well could they navigate bad bunny. BB has all the power to change their charts but the issue with doing that means they would need to get streaming services to normalize and have some guidelines/transparency. They can't and won't do that because they are probably benefiting from it in some way since money is the door opener.
in conclusion, BTS succeeding despite all the shit they’ve gotten throughout their entire careers and are still getting to this day is just the best slap in the global music industry’s face
Billboard is afraid that everytime BTS WILL RELEASE A NEW SONG IT WILL ALWAYS GO NUMBER ONE AND NOT THEIR FAVORED ARTIST AND BILLBOARD CANNOT IGNORE IT. HOW ABOUT THAT BTS FANDOM LET'S PUT BTS NUMBER ONE IN ALL THEIR RELEASES.
Lmao even certain army communities think we're always overreacting all the time there's no bigger picture no industry wide manipulation going on, there's Definitely no deeper issue just casual racism, nothing systemic here in Ba-sing-se! It's very annoying to look at because these are 100% people in that entitled fan of ~exotic media~ to manti pipeline, seen most of them defended and justified Mr Wall-Ace, have been way too loud about English releases, there's like manti rhetoric coming out of them everyday, but their communities are under such a Mountain nobody even understands what a manti is. Yeah I'm annoyed I've had to deal with them against my wishes last week I usually avoid them for my mental health I hate these people so much..
I refused to buy the magazine because of this I probably would have bought all 7 copies but nope not doing it I will go to Weverse and buy some more Merch there instead.
This video showed up on my YT feed today of all days, the release of Billboard charts for week 2 of Jimin's "Face" after YET ANOTHER rule change when he got #1 and all I can say is I was pissed off before I watched it, but now I'm downright irate...They're literally so terrified of 7 boys from Korea, and for what????
ARMY will stand with BTS til the very end. We aren't going away, they just better get used to a new top on their charts. Doesn't matter what sour grapes they spit, or how they change the rules - we will play by those rules and still beat them. They are just upset BTS won't play the industry game, as it shows other artists and fans how outdated and useless they are. We don't need the industry middlemen taking our money. Artists and their fans can band together to subvert an industry geared at supressing them. They can't ignore all of us any longer. That's the facts💜
I said it on twt already but I will say it again - I love smart ppl and I love you, Elliot. You could not have said it better, really. You and Lainey both. Let me share this vid EVERYWHERE.
The fan base is powerful. There are millions of fans; but.. they bought too may copies of their song. I mean they have 60 million + fans and sold like 1 mil in the us. That is such a problem. Do they even hear themselves?
This is so great but it makes me so fucking angry cause people don't listen. I was exploring some kpop Playlists curated by spotify and maybe 1 was with a picture of bts. I think that's telling of how much the western mu wants bts gone
Loved all your points. And I agree that it’s ok to discuss the different considerations BTS has to navigate including commercial, artist, political and cultural. Even an artist dealing with or 1 or 2 is difficult. Also, Please unblock me on Twitter. What did I do?
probably blockchain (maybe you are following a certain problematic account (like a solo/manti/shipper/sasaeng/fansite/fake accounts/...) and he blocked all followers) or megablock (maybe you liked a tweet and he blocked all likes from this tweet)
I hope BTS blocks access to BB forever from now on; just keep releasing Weverse magazine instead. I hope Army will stop engaging BB on all social media (no like, no reposting, no comments) at all. Army was responsible for so much of their engagement these past years. Enough.
Conversation in my living room: Husband (referring to ES sarcastically): Well, he has a great vocabulary. (Not like the man has heard many F**ks out of the mouths of his own progeny) OWL (me): Actually, he does have a very good vocabulary. F-this and F-that are measures of Elliot's temper. He hears and is sensitive to racism. Husband: humph. Then I went off on the Grammys and Billboard. Not to mention the kinds of questions women get: "Who are you going home with tonight?" UGH! The ongoing struggle.
You know I was browsing Spotify the other day and as I checked the global charts and US section BTS wasn’t there. Like did Spotify purposely remove them? It made no sense especially when butter the remix should be there for all intents and purposes…
The US music industry is corrupt at it's core but the average USA citizen has no idea because they are conned all the time. Payola is what get you on the Radio in the USA. So the artist doesn't get paid for a radio station for profiting off their record like in the UK. In the UK it's illegal to not pay an artist song on a your radio station as the record doesn't belong to the radio station so by law they can't profit off it. They even pay more per spin much more than what an artist would get from being played on Spotify.
I cant understand why billboard at first seems like accepting bts craze and doing some research and make a article about them..then another article was release said that one of their albums becomes best selling in western without having any bundles that will help artist to have a biggest chance to top a chart and another article again appear talking about how most of the artist that top that year selling their music with a bundles..and then billboard start to make a change like bundles would not be counted in the chart..and bts is playing fair and now they are trying to make seem like bts has cheated and asked them about the manipulation issue..they have the access of the billboard if they think that there is something wrong in the first place they would be the first one to know..trying to destroy bts without having any concrete evidence well better luck next time..they couldnt believe that bts surpassed some of the biggest artist in western..i came in a country whereas english is our second mostly use languages,,i would rather listen to music that i cant understand but has a positive meaning rather than listening to a music that mostly they talk about drugs,girls,money, and sexual thingy and this topic mostly appear in wester music.
It seems that they are only open to accepting BTS as some novelty until they have proven to not be a temporary trend and surpassed many western artists in like sales, fame and all that, they don’t mind BTS being around only if they don’t rise too high
Well that is because of how they see anything not American as 'exotic'. The people and the industry are fine with something from the rest of the world blowing up and being a trend. The industry will hype it and call it 'wow its such a vibe' 'That's funny and catchy' 'oh look at this thing from Asia' like how people would maybe give hype if you told them an alien has arrived on the earth. The best example for this is Psy-Gangnam Style. And that's what they expected for BTS. A bunch of cute Asian boys who have blown up. But once they realised people actually listen to them and do give fucks about their artistry, then they felt threatened. Its like everyone including locals would want to watch an alien (cause they are new and unique creatures) but if that alien started to become the new normal and started overshadowing the locals, suddenly the locals feel threatened. It is understandable but what is annoying is they won't admit it. Instead they will creative a new false narrative to save their face and make everything that is not about them irrelevant and actively try and downplay the success by not making it about the music and the work and the history and only about a crazy fandom.
BTS if they hated their label they'd never have signed a second 7year contract. They are been given shares in their label how many other artists are given share's in their label mmmmmm non that I know of.
Please drop your yoga mantra to keep breathing while having so much annoyed inside you. Lol. Irritating if you dont know how an article will come out, you know. The writer can come to you nicely, they laugh and drink tea with you, but the output article is vile. Its like being stabbed in the back, and you might blamed yourself for trusting people. And Bts, being guarded by their company, can be harmed too, as same as opening their door to snakes. But I am glad they wrote RM's counter to the issue. They have to, to make the article sound 'balanced'.
![[4K직캠] BABYMONSTER(베이비몬스터) - FOREVER](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/PS3UAFto1z8/mqdefault.jpg)
BTS's success is causing these institutions to panic , wanting to rethink their own charts and rewrite the rules , remove categories to prevent them from winning awards. It is BTS vs the whole industry yet they are losing.The fact that BTS's success is causing the music industry to modify itself to prevent BTS from winning is the biggest 'proof' of their impact.
lmaoo i love ur name
@@kaushikiroy6057 Thanks . Mission accomplished today 😉.
So basically BB forgot they exist to report metrics and started thinking they are the gatekeepers for what's "good". And because they don't think BTS are good enough to be on top, they decided to sabotage their nomination chances. They think BTS doesn't know their place, when in reality they are the ones who need to step back and remember who they are.
Dude I had calmed down about this, now your video has me riled up again.
I think the biggest thing that pisses off Western media conglomerates and Billboard is that BTS is there because of fans- not palm greasing, not money. Actual music listeners making a choice as a collective to put BTS there. If they, meaning Western media/artists don’t take stock into what BTS and ARMY have done with regards to fan-group engagement.., they’ll just be caught off guard in another 10-15 years when another artist does it.
And by put them there, I mean voted with their dollar and steaming for a talented, hard working group of men.
Yup well said
Kpop is only popular because it made a deal with the Devil for fame.
@@JamesSmith-by3qy bruh, what does the devil have to do with this? religion has nothing to do with this entire discussion.
My sister put it very well once:
People expect the BB charts to show which songs are most popular at the time. But that's not what they're doing.
It would be more accurate to say the the charts show for which songs the most money is being paid for - whether by the fans or by the labels.
And I think that's a beautiful (although shady) way of putting it.
At the very least, we can say for certain, BTS' #1s are ALL the work of fans. BH's promotion strategy is tossing us a teaser or two and dipping. ARMY creates the goals and we get to work. We're just a bunch of regular ppl with no central leader and we STILL outdo the organized crime that is the music charts. Who else can make such a boast about their fandom?
@@monimuppet6132 Oooohhhh, I love that take! Yes, we're amazing and all the gaslighting of the industry won't change that fact!
@@kedisheher3716 They don't know us. Our whole life as stans is being gaslit. We're stubborn asf 🤣🤣.
SUGA did a weverse magazine where he talked about the freedoms they have under their label. He also spoke about the inappropriate behaviours of the k-pop industry. It was a great article to read.
Where would I find this article that SUGA did?
@@WilliamsAK07 weverse magazine. it is web based.
The part about fans sending radio stations gifts as thanks hit hard because I remember how hard it was to get one damn play on the radio. We had to jump through not just any hoops, but hoops set on fire moving at 100 miles per hour. Ridiculous twitter polls, DJs asking for x number of follows, calling stations for requests non-stop, etc. All for 1 of three things to happen: 1. Got ignored 2. Got publicly ridiculed by GP or the stations themselves or 3. Got ONE play outside of prime listener hours so basically we all waiting until like 10 PM for one...ONE play before we had to the whole song and dance again. I still remember sending my local radio station thank you flowers for playing Mic Drop and they posted it on their twitter. The OP was kind, but a fellow DJ responded with a backhanded comment about how us ARMY were "playing radio stations" to get what we wanted. As if we didnt just do what THEY asked us to do. Same BS with Billboard. We surpass everyone else within the parameters they set up to make it near impossible for us, but we still get shit on for "manipulation"?? Nah. Of course, not every radio station was like that. We had a few who believed in BTS and still do, but man not much has changed sadly.
Well said....I totally agree wtih you that BTS has risen to the top organically through their perseverance and loyal support from ARMY.
Not sure if you know about these videos posted by 2 Korean professors who spoke about BTS success and how they fight against prejudice together with ARMY support (mentioned about US radio plays and stores starting to sell BTS CD/Albums) :-
1) "The reason behind BTS successㅣWhat's the difference between them and The Big 3?ㅣProf. Choi Jae Boong" < th-cam.com/video/51XcEduywSU/w-d-xo.html > [Pls turn on CC for Eng sub]
2) BTS and Army Grow Together, Fighting Against Prejudice | JiYoung Lee, Professor
< th-cam.com/video/Rhj01Lbuw0I/w-d-xo.html >
Everything about the way BTS is treated in the US is bizarre to me. If millions of Americans alone are spending their own money to buy these albums than how can anyone claim their fame isn’t real. Just because army is smart enough to join forces with each other to figure out the rules and meet their objective, they must be doing something wrong? Sorry that the majority of western artists don’t have fandoms with this same passion or intelligence but that’s not BTS’ fault. 🤦♀️ it’s just like how they can have a number 1 song for 10 weeks but aren’t ever in the artist of the year category for anything, yet those that sit at number 2,3 whatever, are nominated. Nothing makes sense to me.
Your point that "they just want BTS to go away" - that's exactly it, like they were putting forwards these expensive magazine boxes for sale with fairly minimal hype, and my theory is that they didn't care if they made a loss on the sales, because the end game for them is to damage their reputation and reduce their impact in any way that they can.
Like that, yes. "Oh, look, BTS fans aren't buying the BTS mags... guess it's losing it's popularity. Let's do an article on how BTS fans are abandoning it and moving on to other interests. We can find some good quotes on Twitter." (I LOATHE how that article kept calling them 'it'.) "Ok, but, how do we reconcile that with the fact that it's broken enough records to get into the Guinness Hall of Fame?" "... ...Well, we ignore that. Duh." No; no they won't. Not when ARMY has something to say about it.
about the english songs- i have to say, (sorry for my english it's not my first language) first- i believe the english songs woud'nt be released if all the memebers would truly opposed to them. but even if we take the approach that maybe the english singles are maybe less close to their identity, (even tho i there are many things in the songs that you can very much say "this is bts") and maybe it was more pushed by the label to do it, being a top artist you also have to be stratigic and i think it's complitly legitimate. they are in a certain momentum and they want to take advantage of it as much as possible, and doing it with english singles is the most reasonable thing. and they don't hide it, cause it's not a bad thing. the whole "trojan horse" joke- namjoon basically confirmed it, he said these are easy songs to listen to and he hopes it will lead people wou wouldn't have listened to them otherwise to listen to more of their past korean discography. many artist first do more of a "gp standard popular" music to atrackt audience and then have more freedom to maintain their position but move to do more things of their own style. bts didn't even do that, their popularity did came from their korean songs, and they still were one of the bestselling and touring acts before dynamite. they're just using a momentum to get even higher. still all of this doesn't mean it's all stratigic. for dynamite, it's a disco funk song first of all, funk and hip hop are actually very close especially in dance, 'hope world' is full of funk. butter has their rap- NAMJOON'S WRITTEN RAP, and permission to dance message incoprates things bts have said, and a very bts-ish message, and as said by the weverse article, they still had creative imput even if they didn't write the lyrics or music. what i'm trying to say is, language is not the only thing that defines bts' identity.
also just to add, i don't see this conversation happening about Maneskin- an italian band that their most popular song right now is in english (and not even their song) and they have more english songs, or with ABBA one of the most popular bands of all time- swedish band that sang in english. i heard nobody saying "they lost their idenity cause the didn't sing in their native language"
Btw, in Germany songs and albums can only be purchased once per credit/debit card number or they won't count towards the charts. Nothing stops BB from putting such a system in place. And BTS are still charting top10 with title tracks here.
How does that work doesn't Germany have banking laws and consumer laws like the UK where a credit/debit card number can't by law be given to a third party? It's referred to a mining and it's against the law here. What happens if you buy a copy for yourself and one as gift for a friend of family members birthday because you know they would like a copy also? What if you buy a copy but you break the CD (I've done that plenty of time's) and gone and bought a second copy? But then I order straight via UK Amazon straight through to South Korea and wait for it to arrive. I'm also protected by the Distance Selling Regulations so my card details etc can not be accessed by a 3rd Party.
And guess what they did that but also introduced bundling and that a against of what people are saying is to stop bulk buying when we can buy some merchandise and it all will counted towards chart
@@blossom6693 Billboard are just corrupt through to it's core. Their business practices are disgraceful.
24:20 and *THIS* is what it all comes down to.
The reason why BTS are STILL so vilified, targeted, and excluded by this industry is bc BTS/HYBE refuses to give American companies their money. Even when they first entered the west (which they never planned to do) BTS did not sign to an American label and instead partnered with a major American label…to help distribute their music.
Since day 1, HYBE has been smart enough to protect BTS’ money and their interest, and with the American music industry being one well known to actively (and legally) steal millions from even the biggest western artists, they’ve never forgiven BTS for becoming so popular and profitable “without them” (or really, without having to pay them).
America is, and always will be, all about the money….yay capitalism.
Edit: and now that HYBE owns one of americas biggest music labels?? Oh you know the industry MAD mad now 😂😂
“They never got shit for the legitimacy of their popularity” That’s right, Elliot! That’s what’s maddening. The double standards and hypocrisy of it. To think RM had to face this kind of interrogation, and keep his cool. 😡😤🤬
Recently Binboard made a video 'explaining' the Hot 100 chart and not surprisingly, they praised 'fan driven' hits. A certain artist's fans bought and streamed and made a 25 year old song of that artist go number 1 which according to them was highly appreciable. Apparently sales are supposed to be 'chart manipulation' only in the case of BTS. The hypocrisy is real.
I saw that and didn’t watch it. Too much coincidence between the magazine and the video. BTS on their magazine cover then creating a box set to make bank on ARMY. Talk about manipulation.
@@zbrewed LINK PLEASE
If you don't mind, may I know which artist Billboard praised for?
I haven't been a fan since the beginning - in fact, I've been an ARMY for only a few months now - but I heard a lot of fans talking about this whole issue we're dealing with, and saying that it's pretty much history repeating itself. Except now it's not in South Korea, it's in the USA/Western.
They started off small. They didn't blow up over night. The industry didn't see them as a competition whatsoever, so they simply didn't care about them, maybe even let them win a few awards here and there, not thinking they would make it in a long term. But then... the boys started getting more and more popular, growing their fanbase, winning more awards, gaining numbers everywhere, and suddenly they became a competition. So the industry tried to bring them down, invalidate their success and popularity, fans of other acts became more vocal and hateful.
But we all know how it turned out in the end. BTS ended up outgrowing the Korean industry, they became global. They became untouchable. And it's the same thing happening rn in the west, it's just a matter of time.
It's just really painful to see. I can't imagine how tired the guys must be after all those years of getting nonstop hate from both the regular folks (aka fans of other artists) and the media/public figures. They're just normal boys who are passionate about music, trying to spread a good message, making lives of millions of people better every single day. They don't even seem to care about charts and awards anymore - they're here for the music and for their fans. But as long as they are a competition, as long as they are a threat, people will continue to try to bring them down.
Exactly! Thank you for writing down exactly what I was thinking myself.
I am also a new army of only seven months but I also see history repeating again - BTS and ARMY against the music establishment, again and again.
I know .. thankyou for write all down my mind here im mad again 😂
lmfao stop engaging with the bot 😭 the james henry smith guy’s been under every kpop/bts video on the platform for the past year (with very VERY terribly structured “arguments” not in the idols or fandoms’ favor), but if you notice, the account creation date is always around a month ago or something like that (again they’re just a spammer with hundreds of accounts. they will NOT stop replying to you if you keep engaging with them). they prob arent even a real person but stop giving them what they want ❤️
LOL Even if they change the rules,what makes them think we won't win?I actually want BB to change the rule or whatever it is. Let's see who will win in the end.
Right? Whatever will the haters do when they can't shove their 50-100 votes a day behind their chosen 'BTS-breaker'? What'll artists say when only the first sale of their album to each fan is counted? What'll everyone say when artists are limited to a single version of their song and any others don't count toward the total? How unpopular will so many artists look, if YT suddenly sorts their views by 'unique' and 'repeated'? BTS won't suffer, and in fact it would take a little pressure off both ARMY and BTS. But the rest of the music industry will screech like banshees.
And if they change it up so that, say, US votes or streams count double what other nationalities do, seeing as the Billboards are American... oh, the inferno that would result. They might just be fools enough to do that, too; to utterly shred their own credibility beyond any hope of salvaging. Grammy's almost at that point, BB may just leap off the cliff with them.
@@JamesSmith-by3qy dude are you okay seriously don't drag everyone because of one situation .
I do challenge billboard to change their rules, also would like the Spotify folks to check some other numbers so they would realize we are not just bots. Bots wouldn't fill up concert seats or watch vlives...
i’m glad this video it’s up because i was unable to join the livestream, i always can count with elliot to have the best way to say everything that it’s on my mind! i’m so happy we have someone like you in the fandom
Bro, you deserve more views. Only facts spoken.
Yes you are the best, so smart and articulate. Thanks for persevering, I know it is the same ol' crap all the time but you still manage to keep the delightful, creative, funny part of Elliot to share with us, that is a strength and I for one admire that. It one of the things I love about BTS too, they get so much bad but it does not kill their inner core of goodness, that must be so hard sometimes.
I find it extremely ironic that both the SK music industry and the American music industry have taken the same issue with BTS, they didn't grow through them, BTS, BH and Hybe, they didn't get support from the "official medium" so their success only undermines the institutions others use to get to where they are now. And so, just like MBC in Korea became petty over they not appearing in their NYE show, Billboard and other industry "tastemakers" in the US of F*cking A are getting incredibly petty because "how could someone become popular in the US if they don't /know/ the American Music Market like we do?" specially when money and ratings are involved, most people get irrationably angry. UGH.
That was a cathartic rant. Applause!
It's already blowing up on BB's face haha They're now so desperate that they're using Rolling Stone's mailing list (both publications are under the same company) to send emails promoting their magazine to see if people will buy it, but it ain't selling. They lowered their original 7.5k copies to 5k and even then, only less than half got sold so far. In a fandom that sells out everything in minutes this shows how bad BB effed up.
Hopefully more people will cancel their pre-orders, many outside of twitter are not so well informed or don't realize that BTS does not endorse that article at all. Like none of their official accounts acknowledged it whatsoever, which is a loud statement in of itself, since they always acknowledge interviews (unless they're awful, case in point). The media and the industry have been pushing us a lot lately, but they're not gonna like the results. Pissed off armys work 3x times harder, but these people refuse to understand. They still underestimate us, like BB did, and that will be their undoing.
the vaccination comment pisses me off bc he implied that bts had jumped the line to get vaccinated and then Jimin said that he got the jab last week (well within the age group that they're on now in Korea) 🙄
If they are going as government rep to the UN this month then yes it’s fair for them to now be getting vaccinated. They didn’t demand early access based on being celebrities. Heck poor Enhypen, under BigHit, has 6 of 7 members who got Covid last week. It was such a shady comment and the whole articles tone was snide and negative.
@@MariaChavez-ey5sr just a minor correction Enhypen is under Belift+ not bighit, but they are still under Hybe labels, but the point still applies and enhypen has a member who is immunocompromised too (whose confirmation of having COVID isn’t out yet) so like yeah anyways Billboard is shady and they should sit and think about how “smart” their comments are
Billboard knew that if they put BTS on the cover, Army will buy it. Oh but wait, they did make a box set of the BTS cover for $170, but that’s not using ARMY right. It’s just business. I was going to buy the magazine but NOT ANYMORE. Thanks Billboard, I think I will another BTS album instead!
In the Soop 2 has some merch going... :)
Hope that Namjoon sees this. ARMYs always behind yall when you say so, Mr. President.
this james henry smith person gave me a good laugh thanks stay pressed 🤍
If they change the rules, the rules would have to be openly xenophobic to stop bts from being on the top and that would show their true colours
Oh they can change the rules by saying that their charts and nominations are exclusive only for western artists lmao... But as long as still they include Bts and other artist outside. Of course armys will surely play the game... In the first place they're the first who acknowledge Bts popularity in 2017 and gave a nomination that's why army's hype up... It's not Bts who beg. And now they know it's beyond their control to handle that's why their trying Bts to get out of the way just because western artists are being left out. It's their karma coz before they are interested or wanna ride how popular Bts and devoted their fans are and know they question it coz they can't handle it.
(Sorry for bad English, hope shared my opinion on point and you understand it)
BTS' problem is that they don't pay their way to the top, they climb there naturally with the support of their fans(a new concept for the music industry, artists who sell their music and top the charts). If anyone had any doubt about BB not representing POPULAR music, but something else, then there you go. And trying to get ARMYs money for a garbage article is almost hilarious, almost.
armys have been so vocal about the dirt the music industry continues to pull not only to bts but to other artists they don't agree or implicitly choose to be at the top. its so exhausting to have this conversation for /years/ when we know BB wont do sht about it since there are many who would follow and listen to their writing over the criticisms of actual fans or actual artists who defend the concept of the power of a fanbase who willingly choose to consume music, by buying. there's so much to unpack but uve said the general idea already (plus we don't even have to think about why its wrong but here we are trying to continue the conversation bc people choose not to listen).
“Are you Fn kidding me” you preach it bro. Mic drop. Billboard really did BTS dirty on this one.
I don't know a single person who has spent a single cent on any of the popular western pop artists since the days of CD's like 20 years ago. How on earth is their popularity more legitimate compared to a group who every single fan has spent tons of money towards, is beyond bonkers.
When I'm angry about something and you make a video about it I know right away that I'm gonna be less angry after watching it cause you always say everything I want to say but not able to put into words, I seriously love your videos
ARMYs are powerful and I'm so proud to be an ARMY. I will love and support BTS forever: fighting side by side with my fellow GLOBAL ARMYs to protect BTS at all costs. 💜
I may buy 1 album, another may buy 10. I don´t care! We both love BTS and aren´t forced to spend money.
Thank you, Eliot. Now I'm shaking with rage, again.
Aren’t Fans, in this case Army, meant to buy the music that their artists put out? If the Fans don’t do it who will? Obviously the US radio stations aren’t going to push BTS when their little favourites might lose out to them. Quality doesn’t count anymore, what does count is what they can get in return. The fact that BTS are winning awards elsewhere in the world doesn’t seem to resonate. If the Boys weren’t so well loved by millions of people all over the world they would not have got as far as they have. Sad, greedy self serving business.
There is and always has been, and will continue to be honor and integrity with BTS and EVERYTHING they do. Western culture like Billboard, don't operate with integrity, it's all about business and money and politics and who you know! GO BTS WE WILL ALWAYS SUPPORT YOU.
Thanks for always putting the thought in words Elliot💜
I’m late to the party but glad I made it! I find Billboard’s notion of BTS and Big Hit collectively compromising on releasing their first English track rather insidious when discussions between artist and label are standard operating procedure. And they know this is a normal conversation considering Billboard has been covering the entertainment industry since the late 1800s.
What I feel they were underhandedly implying is the same narrative of K-pop being a manufactured, slave contract-driven machine that even the biggest group in the world can’t escape. In that, Billboard additionally implied that not only was their first all English release was manufactured through the K-pop machine, but so was their chart success.” Is this to stoke the fear that their white institution is being compromised by sneaky, underhanded Asians? Because that’s some of what it sounds like to me. They are directly aiming at BTS’ integrity and legitimacy as a “REAL” act while simultaneously expecting looking the other way from industry plants, payola, and back scratching.
Additionally, the vaccine line jumping turned out to be false. Jimin said in his vlive before they went to NY that he had gotten his shot the prior week, which was well after the Billboard article came out. When his age group was up, he went. Seems like the author pulled that assumption out of their hat like they did those tweets they ridiculously cited in their article. And yet they question BTS’ legitimacy… huh.
Also, when are we going to start blurring the lines between ARMY and GP? ARMY had to come from somewhere. I don’t think ARMYs have to meet “stan” levels (based on your scaling) to call themselves ARMY, nor do I think they have to be immersed in idol music culture. There would be no way that those stadiums are getting packed out if it was simply the stans alone (again, based on your scaling) going to concerts. I could be wrong about that, though.
quality content as always!
@ 20:39 !!! WAY TO SUM THIS UP! I'm so mad at Billboard again!!!
So grateful for the kind of relationship ARMY and BTS have. We definitely got each others back. T-T STREAM BUTTER EVERYONE!
Thanks for covering bb article It’s been on my mind way too long Listening to you I’m able to let it go and refocus. ♥️🇨🇦
I said that when all this started that it was all about money and the fact that the money was not going to the American music industry is why they want them to go away and why they won’t give them a Grammy that why they brought up the mandatory military issues they have been shitting on BTS from the start
We don't have transparency because they know if they gave it to us we would undoubtedly dominate. Because it's a universal fact that ARMY mobilizes better than any other fandom whether you view that as good or bad.
I am so disappointed on the way America treats BTS
BTS deserve way more recognition they are very talented
They can't stand that our money is going to South Korea! 😄
What is upsetting the industry about this is that... ARMY has showened to be more powerfull than what the insustry wants. Big Companies are not doing this. ARMY's love is doing this. Not Hibe. BTS by being just them. ARMY's love alone. NOW... Why does ARMY do this?... ARMY knows. But non ARMY have no idea what it means. Sad for them :p
I'm waiting for Cypher 5 focuses on xenophobic treatment they encounter.
me too!!!! 💜
Elliot, that's 2 am for me 😭 Any indication that this video might stay up for a day or so?
it will stay up indefinitely
@@bbygang awesome ... I recently found you & became a subscriber.
This video is straight hard talking facts ... bless you.
BTS remix is in tied position right now with 2 other songs for #1 on Hot 100.
What's had me laughing is the bb sweetheart dropped down to #5.
What thou gets me riled up are radio stations removing Butter from there playlist for spins. All right after bb incident!! Makes a person wonder.
Thou facts are artists have been at the American music business standard to change ways. It's why artists went to doing bundles to make money. As they got prophets from the merch added to the music. Causing companies to make less than the artist finally. Just watched news report on this very issue. On MSNBC.
Eye opening ...all the way back to Prince this fighting back by artists has been going on. Got to listen to Prince speak out against the crookedness of the system. Media plays, radio stations, & labels all connected to charts... it's what we call payola.
Glad to find you. Blessings.
18:15 - 18:30 think it's more that bts isn't willing to play the us industry game (paying for radio and playlisting or aggreeing to some other form of payment) as seen in the thee remix lawsuit. And that by winning while not playing the game these people aren't able to "garantee" hot100 tops to other artist who payed them for it anymore. Makes sense a lot of ppl in the industry are big mad that bts is lowering their carefully curated system's value.
PS: I broke the 69 comments count.. I'm so sorry!😌
That's a good point- labels that are doing the pay-to-win game must be quite displeased that someone who's refusing to pay-to-win...is actually winning. Now the players are out a lot of money, but not at the top as they expected. That's where a lot of underhanded behavior and bad attitude springs from, and so much clout-chasing...
I'm just glad that many western artists do genuinely appreciate and respect BTS, even if the greedy stooges of the industry don't. It'd be a problem, if it was BTS vs the Entire West.
YES! I really didn't/don't understand why the BIG problem with BTS. They work hard just like others, put in the time, writing, producing, choreograph, putting together a show just like other artists. Is it really about them being Korean or not American? I'm sure the Latino's faced the same discrimination or something similar. Absolutely right, they would not interrogate American/western artists and it was an interrogation. Love it that you emphasize about ARMY getting to know the rules, playing the game and now everybody wants to change the rules. I so appreciate Jin's comment on making music in good faith, listening to music in good faith. When BTS speaks on BTS & ARMY's fight, it's quite a fight, for sure.
I wish I was as eloquent as you speaking all these facts
Stumbled upon this video just now. Thank you for taking your time in refining the details behind the Billboard article.
really well said, thank you for your insight and research, always love to to hear what you have to say! Also thank you so much for editing this into a shorter video, as someone who can not concentrate on a one hour content and up, this was really appreciated 💜
Here's another angle about BB actually making streaming numbers more significant and I said this on twitter. BB will have further issues because guess who is usually number one monthly with spotify streams: not bts, we're usually two. The number one is bad bunny and we saw last few years how well they treat him as well from industry people.. Remember "Speak english, I can't understand you" after the man won a fucking granny. So if they don't know how to handle bts, how well could they navigate bad bunny. BB has all the power to change their charts but the issue with doing that means they would need to get streaming services to normalize and have some guidelines/transparency. They can't and won't do that because they are probably benefiting from it in some way since money is the door opener.
Billboard did BTS and Army dirty. Down with Billboard.
in conclusion, BTS succeeding despite all the shit they’ve gotten throughout their entire careers and are still getting to this day is just the best slap in the global music industry’s face
The fact that BB is explaining says a lotXD
Thanx for being my mornnin broadcast🗣🗣
Billboard is afraid that everytime BTS WILL RELEASE A NEW SONG IT WILL ALWAYS GO NUMBER ONE AND NOT THEIR FAVORED ARTIST AND BILLBOARD CANNOT IGNORE IT. HOW ABOUT THAT BTS FANDOM LET'S PUT BTS NUMBER ONE IN ALL THEIR RELEASES.
Lmao even certain army communities think we're always overreacting all the time there's no bigger picture no industry wide manipulation going on, there's Definitely no deeper issue just casual racism, nothing systemic here in Ba-sing-se! It's very annoying to look at because these are 100% people in that entitled fan of ~exotic media~ to manti pipeline, seen most of them defended and justified Mr Wall-Ace, have been way too loud about English releases, there's like manti rhetoric coming out of them everyday, but their communities are under such a Mountain nobody even understands what a manti is. Yeah I'm annoyed I've had to deal with them against my wishes last week I usually avoid them for my mental health I hate these people so much..
I refused to buy the magazine because of this I probably would have bought all 7 copies but nope not doing it I will go to Weverse and buy some more Merch there instead.
This video showed up on my YT feed today of all days, the release of Billboard charts for week 2 of Jimin's "Face" after YET ANOTHER rule change when he got #1 and all I can say is I was pissed off before I watched it, but now I'm downright irate...They're literally so terrified of 7 boys from Korea, and for what????
commenting for the algorithm
ARMY will stand with BTS til the very end. We aren't going away, they just better get used to a new top on their charts. Doesn't matter what sour grapes they spit, or how they change the rules - we will play by those rules and still beat them. They are just upset BTS won't play the industry game, as it shows other artists and fans how outdated and useless they are. We don't need the industry middlemen taking our money. Artists and their fans can band together to subvert an industry geared at supressing them. They can't ignore all of us any longer. That's the facts💜
This was 🔥🔥🔥💯
Great analysis I actually hadn't thought of many of these points as an army myself
I said it on twt already but I will say it again - I love smart ppl and I love you, Elliot. You could not have said it better, really. You and Lainey both.
Let me share this vid EVERYWHERE.
This is exactly why I did not get the magazine! The hypocrisy was just 🤬!
I'm glad you brought up bundles. I'd like to know, are other artists still doing this?
nailed it.............👏👏👏👏
Great essay! Excellent
The fan base is powerful. There are millions of fans; but.. they bought too may copies of their song. I mean they have 60 million + fans and sold like 1 mil in the us. That is such a problem. Do they even hear themselves?
Saw this video now when everything calmed down. But this just triggered me vote for BTS in VMAs the whole time
I´m just sad for the members since they already went through this shit back during I NEED U in Korea. US media really think BTS came out of nowhere
This is so great but it makes me so fucking angry cause people don't listen. I was exploring some kpop Playlists curated by spotify and maybe 1 was with a picture of bts. I think that's telling of how much the western mu wants bts gone
Loved all your points. And I agree that it’s ok to discuss the different considerations BTS has to navigate including commercial, artist, political and cultural. Even an artist dealing with or 1 or 2 is difficult. Also, Please unblock me on Twitter. What did I do?
Dw maybe a blockchain. Happens a lot.
probably blockchain (maybe you are following a certain problematic account (like a solo/manti/shipper/sasaeng/fansite/fake accounts/...) and he blocked all followers) or megablock (maybe you liked a tweet and he blocked all likes from this tweet)
People are tired of alot of things related to the industry that is "supposed" to cater to freedom of expression and fair competition.
this is all mafia, the music industry, listeners making a choice as a collective to put BTS there,
When I see them explaining billboard hot 100 and wat they asked bts I mean......wat
Can you explain what is up with Drake song on Spotify being offered free Is this normal or is something different up?
I hope BTS blocks access to BB forever from now on; just keep releasing Weverse magazine instead. I hope Army will stop engaging BB on all social media (no like, no reposting, no comments) at all. Army was responsible for so much of their engagement these past years. Enough.
Billboard actually went in person into the HYBE building and was disrespectful to BTS and wrote that kinda article. wack
very logical Sir . . . very logical indeed
I love Army! (And BTS and Elliot)
Facts
Conversation in my living room:
Husband (referring to ES sarcastically): Well, he has a great vocabulary. (Not like the man has heard many F**ks out of the mouths of his own progeny)
OWL (me): Actually, he does have a very good vocabulary. F-this and F-that are measures of Elliot's temper. He hears and is sensitive to racism.
Husband: humph.
Then I went off on the Grammys and Billboard. Not to mention the kinds of questions women get: "Who are you going home with tonight?" UGH! The ongoing struggle.
Everyone forgets about the payola hearing of the 1960.
Spotify cuts streams from BTS and BTS members.
Right but earphones are so cute
Put BTS IN CONTROVERSY AND THE MORE THEY GET POPULAR, THEY HAVE BEEN THE UNDERDOG AND THEY SUCCEEDED. HYBE, BTS FANDOM BEHIND BTS, BTS DON'T LOSS.
You know I was browsing Spotify the other day and as I checked the global charts and US section BTS wasn’t there. Like did Spotify purposely remove them? It made no sense especially when butter the remix should be there for all intents and purposes…
1:05. 4:03 4:54 5:19 5:50 f 7:04. 8:47 9:53. 11:36 12:49. 14:15. 15:02 16:33 😮
18:56 20:19. 22:00. 22:41 ignored 23:30 24:12 ,27:37. 31:50 lol 32:26 bot
👏👏👏
The US music industry is corrupt at it's core but the average USA citizen has no idea because they are conned all the time. Payola is what get you on the Radio in the USA. So the artist doesn't get paid for a radio station for profiting off their record like in the UK. In the UK it's illegal to not pay an artist song on a your radio station as the record doesn't belong to the radio station so by law they can't profit off it. They even pay more per spin much more than what an artist would get from being played on Spotify.
I cant understand why billboard at first seems like accepting bts craze and doing some research and make a article about them..then another article was release said that one of their albums becomes best selling in western without having any bundles that will help artist to have a biggest chance to top a chart and another article again appear talking about how most of the artist that top that year selling their music with a bundles..and then billboard start to make a change like bundles would not be counted in the chart..and bts is playing fair and now they are trying to make seem like bts has cheated and asked them about the manipulation issue..they have the access of the billboard if they think that there is something wrong in the first place they would be the first one to know..trying to destroy bts without having any concrete evidence well better luck next time..they couldnt believe that bts surpassed some of the biggest artist in western..i came in a country whereas english is our second mostly use languages,,i would rather listen to music that i cant understand but has a positive meaning rather than listening to a music that mostly they talk about drugs,girls,money, and sexual thingy and this topic mostly appear in wester music.
It seems that they are only open to accepting BTS as some novelty until they have proven to not be a temporary trend and surpassed many western artists in like sales, fame and all that, they don’t mind BTS being around only if they don’t rise too high
Well that is because of how they see anything not American as 'exotic'. The people and the industry are fine with something from the rest of the world blowing up and being a trend. The industry will hype it and call it 'wow its such a vibe' 'That's funny and catchy' 'oh look at this thing from Asia' like how people would maybe give hype if you told them an alien has arrived on the earth. The best example for this is Psy-Gangnam Style. And that's what they expected for BTS. A bunch of cute Asian boys who have blown up. But once they realised people actually listen to them and do give fucks about their artistry, then they felt threatened. Its like everyone including locals would want to watch an alien (cause they are new and unique creatures) but if that alien started to become the new normal and started overshadowing the locals, suddenly the locals feel threatened.
It is understandable but what is annoying is they won't admit it. Instead they will creative a new false narrative to save their face and make everything that is not about them irrelevant and actively try and downplay the success by not making it about the music and the work and the history and only about a crazy fandom.
As much as bts sales, potential sales of US music industry is punished.
There must be bonus money given to billboard when hot100 no1 to US industry.
This makes me really mad. I liked hearing your opinion and what you had to say. The fact that this system is so rigged makes me SO. MAD.
BTS if they hated their label they'd never have signed a second 7year contract. They are been given shares in their label how many other artists are given share's in their label mmmmmm non that I know of.
Please drop your yoga mantra to keep breathing while having so much annoyed inside you. Lol. Irritating if you dont know how an article will come out, you know. The writer can come to you nicely, they laugh and drink tea with you, but the output article is vile. Its like being stabbed in the back, and you might blamed yourself for trusting people. And Bts, being guarded by their company, can be harmed too, as same as opening their door to snakes. But I am glad they wrote RM's counter to the issue. They have to, to make the article sound 'balanced'.