So, true story: I had owned this cartridge for well over 17 years as of when this all happened. I moved in with a friend of mine along with another friend of ours and we were all big gamers. 5 months in and I finally decide to pull out the Genesis and he sees my cartridge of Sonic & Knuckles and I tell him about how sad I was that I'd never be able to play it because I didn't have Sonic 3. Just as he hears this he tells me to put it in by itself and nothing attached. Never have I felt SO STUPID in my entire life. Ever.
Yet people forget knuckles knocked out super sonic and beat super mecha sonic, without any emerald powers. The guy is so strong, he can punch the yellow out of sonic!
to be fair it was canonically sonics second over all time ever going super, maybe even first, so sonic was pretty weak and not used to the power. (plus if you go into the knuckles fight with super sonic knuckles cant do shit)
@@ninjawaver Makes you wonder if that was just a normal super form or something more? Sonic used the 7 chaos (and later the super emeralds) but mecha sonic used the master emerald. Are they the same form if knuckles can't hurt it? Or did knuckles punch the emeralds out of sonic instead? Actually you made a good point, has anyone else ever absorbed the master emerald?
People are overly critical of Sonic. All the classic games are awesome. Even labyrinth zone. People just don't like being challenged. But actually changing things up every once in a while is the sign of a great game. I mean, would it really be such a great game if you just had 6 green hill zones? It's the change of pace that makes those levels so sweet.
Simply a brilliant summary. It makes me happy to see others appreciate the visual worldbuilding in the Lava Reef to Sky Sanctuary sequence, especially.
Ah, yes. The moment at 7:02 captured my first experience with S&K perfectly. Also the ending sequence of lava reef is still one of my most favorite moments in Sonic history.
I love the special stages. I didn't get Sonic 3 until later, so this was my first experience with them outside of all of that promotional material. I liked the Sonic 2 half-pipe, but I was never that good at it. Sonic 1 just put you to sleep. Blue Spheres quickly became my favorite special stage, despite the high learning curve. The design looked incredible for the time and the controls, while difficult to master, were remarkably precise. I fiddled with these, slowly getting better. When I finally got Sonic 3 I had 7 more to play with, though I quickly found out those are smaller and (mostly) easier. I always used to have a hard time with the last one (the red/white one) in Sonic 3. It was also nice that you didn't have to have a certain amount of rings to access them, only to ultimately have all of your rings taken away. There are plenty of Super Rings on each level, and have zero cost of entry. Speaking of Super Rings, you get 50 rings from them if you've collected all of the Chaos Emeralds. Does anyone else think they're just paying you back all of the rings they took in Sonic 2?
I always loved the sorta calming and exotic tone in Sandopolis Act 1 then when you hit act 2 you’re on edge as suddenly the music is more intense and nerve wrecking and the ghost don’t help , probably just was me though lol
That comic was the bomb, used to love getting it every fortnight. Downloaded a torrent a while ago with all the issues in cbr, brought back some memories
@@riicky83 ha, finally someone knows what I'm on about. Yeah the brotherhood of metallix, the knuckles version was fairly bad ass too. I think the fleetway comics took more inspiration from the games than Archie. After all it was the official mag I think
@@cathalorourke1 The brotherhood also made a Pig Metallix to trick Sonic into thinking it was his teammate Porker Lewis. I miss those characters, Johnny the Rabbit who used a metal pudgel stick, Amy had a crossbow or a bow and arrow and a completely different look to her, there was the good side of Dr Ivo Robotnik aka Dr Ovi Kintobor who was stuck inside a ring, Shortfuse the Cybernik. Dr Robotnik even went through an apperence change to look more like the cartoonish version of the other Sonic cartoons of the times. those were the days.
I love how you elaborate on these classic Sonic games particularly this one. I remember strongly disliking Sandopolis Zone when I was much younger mainly because of the ghosts hovering over me and that the lights in the second act keeping dimming down every time you turn a switch on to make the ghost go away....but I noticed too how slow paced this zone is compared to the other ones. Although, I did like the background design of this zone level, reminds me so much of Egypt (painfully obvious). Overall, another nostalgic game of my childhood!
9:00 "early on, we see the Death Egg in the distance..." Me: WHAT I'm big enough to admit I never noticed that before. I was so obsessed with going fast that I never looked at the backgrounds as much as I probably should have.
Honestly surprised you didn't mention the mural depicting the final battle, considering all the other lore details you pointed out. Too obvious I guess
One of my favorite memories is getting this game for Christmas in 1994. I played it for most of the day with my cousin in my grandma's basement. My immediate thought was how big S&K was compared to Sonic 1 & 2. The levels were massive and there were plenty of fun new mechanics to play around with just in the first couple levels. I just got to Sandopolis before I had to go home. And yes, I started with Knuckles.
14:33 I'm still learning something new after all these years. I didn't know the island was slowly falling during that fight. I guess the game is letting you know that you're taking too long.
I never really hated any of the zones in this game, Sandopolis never made me mad in any way. I absolutely love the music in the zone, especially act 2.
Fact: Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were one and the same game, but the game was split in half due to time constraints. Standalone Sonic 3 is Sonic 3, Part 1 and Standalone Sonic & Knuckles is Sonic 3, Part 2.
Another thing about the Mecha Sonic fight; as Knuckles the Egg Robo is the villain you are chasing throughout the entire campaign. Then Mecha Sonic appears and destroys him immediately. Pretty shocking moment that made the fight even more epic!
This is my favorite Sonic game to this day. Why is it never included on Mega Drive/Genesis collections when it's one of the best Sonic games of all time? The series at its peak - especially as Sonic 3 & Knuckles!
5:31 I don't mind Sandopolis. It's my least favorite level in S & K, but that's a REALLY high bar. I might agree that the difficulty is a bit extreme if it was the third level, but it's actually designed to be the 9th level of this complete adventure. Sandopolis almost feels like a different game entirely. The outside feels like a harsh desert that is going to slow you down at times, while the inside is dark and claustrophobic. I feel like people's biggest issue with Sandopolis, particularly the second act, is the difficult level design. While that may be the case, I don't think that's a bad thing. In fact, I think it's the logical approach. Let's go back to the end of Flying Battery. All through the level you're traveling through the sky going wherever Robotnik wants to go. At the end of the level you just happen to end up in a treacherous desert. This feels like the only time in either game that Robotnik truly determined your route. Most of the adventure felt like a natural follow-up, a path that had at least some consideration, or a chosen destination, such as Launch Base or Flying Battery. In either case, the character had at least some choice in the matter. The only exceptions I can think of are Hydrocity, which was Knuckles' doing, and Mushroom Hill, which was completely coincidental. Robotnik didn't plan on his Death Egg being taken down, and it just happened to be Flying over Mushroom Hill. For Sandopolis, Robotnik knew where he was flying. Being the mad genius that he is, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was planning to dump his adversaries off in the middle of the desert since the end of Launch Base Zone. If you think about Sandopolis as a situation that Sonic and Knuckles were forced into, it makes more sense that it feels different from the rest of the game. The second act feels especially different. The whole level is one big trap that Robotnik had set aside in case his enemies made it this far. In this tight, enclosed space Sonic's speed is all but useless. The ghosts and sand traps were designed to take full advantage of this. In fact, the ghosts only show up in the first place because Sonic was funneled right into them. All other routes were sealed. If anything, people should be grateful that there weren't any pathways that led to immediate death. Knuckles has a bit of a better time traversing this level, aside from the fact that Sonic already triggered the Ghost Hazard. I can just imagine Knuckles yelling out at Sonic as he's punching ghosts in the face from the get-go. "Why did you go down the Super Happy Fun Slide of Certain Doom?! There's a Boring Old Staircase of Comfortable Safety right next to it!" Aside from that, Knuckles can avoid the sand traps a bit easier because he can climb up the walls. He can even punch his way into a new pathway eventually.
Fantastic video. I was not disappointed. Excited for the next one! I especially love the bit where you explained Knuckles's transitions and shortcuts. I never thought I could learn more about the game's world building.
Man oh man these 2 videos about Sonic 3 and S&K were amazing. You made me remember SO much about my childhood that I had my eyes watering many times throughout the whole thing. Thanks for the great job on showing the world what a masterpiece these 2 were, both when combined and separated. And yeah, I would "act" out the whole game when I was a kid, like holding down when knuckles got shocked to act like Sonic is sad, double tapping down when Knuckles call us before destroying the door that leads to the teleporter, omg so many fucking memories! Thanks isn't enough for the amount of feelings your work made me feel man. I still got a lot of your other videos lined up to be watched right now, but I had to stop and comment on this one. Keep up the amazing work!
1. Aaah... Good old Doomsday Zone is that moment you realise even debug mode ain't going to save your sorry cheating butt this time. lol 2. Realising that Knuckles story line occurs well after the events of the Sonic playthrough in fact it explains why he was just chilling out in the opening. Thanks Game Apologist. 3.10:17, sometimes I extend it and sometimes if you play the zone right, there are cleverly placed springs in Hidden Palace that allow you to collect just enough rings to open a bonus portal at the checkpoint giving you the oppurtunity to collect enough ring to do a Super/Hyper transform and set Knuckles straight for all the crap he gave you so you can literally put your controller down, fold your arms and laugh maniacally as he fails to damage you. That's payback Knuckles. 4. Knuckles is my 2nd favorite character after sonic, tails is cute but not my preference in playing so no hate for the fox. I sometimes enjoy his playthrough more than Sonic given his unique mechanics. 5. Sandopolis Act 2 was insane and I hated it as much as I hated that bouncy thing in Carnival Night Act 2. 6. Lava Reef Act 1 had an awesome sound track and I would play it non super just to listen to the tune.
all good points minus knuckles being the first to finish. had knuckles been the first to finish the story, the battle with sonic would have been unnecessary, and the two would have never met there, not to mention befriended each other. the part where he's just chilling in the intro is the beginning of the angel island events, dating back to sonic 3; showing his connection to the storyline as a complete game/follow up on why he gut punched the emeralds out of sonic in S3, as he was seen approaching in a super form, and knuckles knowing the power of the emeralds; hence him still seeing sonic as an enemy in the second installment.
@@quotetry8998 eh, well properly understanding a chaotic timeline between games takes a little reading. i suggest either getting a dictionary or a bigger attention span if you wanna keep up. and if this is bad? id stay away from the zelda chronology lmao.
Yeah, you can still cheat the hell out of doomsday zone. I finished it with over 900 rings as scrambled Tails or Knuckles more than a few times when I was a kid.
TH-cam has been recommending your videos to me for the last few days and so far every video it has recommended has been about Sonic and Knuckles. Keep up the good work
I'm honestly glad I found this channel, Not only is it not that old, But it's also pretty underrated, I was honestly expecting more comedic moments but tbh it didn't ruin the fact that the review itself on the story and your opinions on it were all great to listen to, keep up the good work.
I too remember being unreasonably disappointed with the cardboard box when I finally got my pre-order in my hands. Bothered me for months and I went to a lot of trouble to fix it. Also, yes, I too stretched out the knuckles fight. Many times.
Here I come, rougher than the rest of them The best of them, tougher than leather You can call me Knuckles, unlike Sonic *and Knuckles* *And Knuckles* rather flex my muscles
Didn't anyone notice that in S&K Robotnik dies? No one ever comments that. In any sonic game, when you finish the credits, Robotnik appears telling you to try again or enraged for losing. Except in S&K when you have all the chaos emeralds as sonic. If you do so, instead a pile of scraps appear and an Eggrobo lits on laughing as Robotnik does! That's also storytelling! It's Robotnik. Probably it transferred his mind or something. That Robotnik is the same that attacks knuckles (whose story happens after Sonic's). Another detail is that the egg mobile is never destroyed in any game, except when it's hit by mecha sonic. It's the sole time in the sonic trilogy where the egg mobile blows up in pieces. Mecha sonic kills eggman.
I first played these games when I was 8 years old and I still play them today, at 37. It’s a thoroughly entertaining series of games and I don’t think I’ll ever tire of them. I will introduce my children to these games.
This game was bundled with the Sega Genesis my father got me for Christmas back in 1996. Took me awhile to beat it before I got the chance to dabble with the "Lock-On Technology". This game was a blast on it's own but when I learned of the two combo games you could get from locking on either Sonic 2 or Sonic 3, I knew I had to try it. Got Sonic 2 while still growing up. Didn't get Sonic 3 for myself till about 8th grade. The combo from locking on Sonic 2 creates "Knuckles the Echidna in Sonic the Hedgehog 2". Which, as it's title suggest, is the whole Sonic 2 game using Knuckles. The perks are as follows: You get to keep the rings you have when you pass a star post, the number of rings you need to get in each Special Stage is reduced(thank god), and you can glide through a number of levels if you get the right height. As for the drawbacks, aside from the usual Sonic 2 glitches, Knuckles's jump height can be problematic especially against the final boss. Learned that the hard way when I actually got to the fight. Locking on Sonic 3 gives "Sonic 3 & Knuckles" which is the TRUE Sonic 3 experience. Loved the Super Emeralds and the transformations that came with it. Got a real kick out of Super Tails and his "Flicky Army of Death"(reference to SomecallmeJohnny). While we're on the subject of that, if you didn't get all the Chaos Emeralds before jumping into a Giant Ring in the second half of the game, you'll be forced to gather the remaining ones before you can access the rest of the Super Emerald stages.
Great video!! Ahh this game is still amazing, and yet it’s the ONE Megadrive game I’ve inexplicably lost over the years... I’d rather play the physical Megadrive version than the PS3 Collection version, but not much choice at the moment...! You’re totally right, the storytelling in this game without any dialogue is incredible. That’s how Sonic games should be, just look at Sonic Mania! I remember playing this with my brother, trying to get all the Super Emeralds for Knuckles, and when I did, I excitedly raced to my brother who was on the phone and wrote on a piece of paper to show him, something like “HYPER KNUCKLES IS IN ACTION!” 😁😁😁
10:14 Actually, it's kinda close to the battle between Sonic and 'silver Sonic' on the Master System version of Sonic 2. The spin-attacks there actually cancel each other out, making an epic fight more possible (although you have to stretch it as well, since it's not that hard (harder than the Knuckles fight though)).
I personally just find the stage a bit....boring I guess? I suppose I didn’t like how much the pace slows down and how it has slow puzzles. But if you love the stage good for you.
I feel you man, even as a kid I loved sandopolis act 2 and all it`s gimmicks, which really added to the tension. I loved the ghosts and the sense of danger they added to where you knew to hurry up when they popped up, you knew to really hurry up when the lights went brown, and you knew to go into ninja mode when the lights went out and they started coming for you. I also really enjoy ripping through sandopolis as super sonic and ignoring or breaking basicly every gimmick of the level Actually I have a bit of a hot take: I actually prefer sandopolis act 2 in terms of aesthetics, level gimmicks AND music, over both acts of lava reef. It`s honestly one of my favourite levels along with flying battery, sky sanctuary, and doomsday zone Also, I`ve been playing S&K on the regular for the last 20 years and i only now noticed that the little pointy thing that grows out the side of the ghosts are their arms, until now i tbought they grew pointy witches noses to help signify they were evil...
Great video, 1st time viewer, now I'm subscribed. I love just how great these titles look, Sonic Team really knew how to get the most outta the Genesis at this point 👏
I never played S3 until after I had already played (to death) S&K. When I finally got the opportunity to play the full S3&K, I was a bit disappointed. I ran through the game, with no challenge, and even unlocked Super Sonic on my FIRST playthrough. I still prefer to play S&K by itself, as the levels are harder, for the extra challenge.
"In critical Moments, you notice that Knuckles can't jump as high as Sonic". Yep... One of those "critical moments" would be the Final Boss of Sonic 2...
One thing I've never been able to unsee since maybe the first time I've played through this game was the little platforms on Lava Reef that descend through the lava waterfall. For some reason they look like they have a face, and due to their color and kinda feline appearance they reminded me of the Pink Panther. 9:18 Just look at them and tell me you cannot unsee them now.
Game Apologist: We get to lava reef which is filled with..umm, hang on I, uhh left my notes here somewhere, I uhh hmm i-s this is uhh, lava reef is filled with...uhh stuff flows, its.. fiery, molten rock! Oh yeah here it is LAVA!!
One thing I wish you would say about Doomsday zone is it has to be the most suspenseful moment Sonic EVER had, sure later on games has super form battles, but this is the only one where Sonic is seen experiencing recoil when hit, even before you catch up to Robotnik himself, despite super Sonic being set as this almighty being that can destroy things simply by touch, these seemingly regular missiles send him flying backwards, it truly shows how serious Robotnik was for this final battle, and how desperate Sonic had to be in this fight despite being in his super form
What's interesting is when Mania was first released, everyone was 100% on board calling it the best Sonic game ever. But only NOW are we starting to see people revise their opinions and go "actually...perhaps it doesn't quite reach 3&K"
when i was younger i used to hop on flashgame websites that had a port sonic 3 and knuckles, when i fight knuckle i let him take turns to fight, it was like when i hit him i let him attack but dont let him hit me unless i have a shield to make the fight better, then in sky sanctuary i spend a bit of time near him, then i continue the game normally.
Something worthy of note is how Angel Island is slowly but surely dropping from the sky during Knuckles' final boss battle, due to the lack of Master Emerald keeping it afloat. By the time 10 minutes is up, the island is completely hidden amongst the clouds.
"BAT MAN'S MASK HAS JOINED THE KLAN!"
Oh my god, I will never be able to see those things the same way again, lol.
"AND IT'S PISSED AS HELL!"
Gengonglike Arbukle oh no
Y'know what? I'll just leave the satisfaction of being the 100th like of this comment. You're welcome in advance. ;)
So was the point that the animals died inside the pods and haunt sonic for not saving them?
@@gamercore5216 yeah... pretty much
So, true story:
I had owned this cartridge for well over 17 years as of when this all happened. I moved in with a friend of mine along with another friend of ours and we were all big gamers. 5 months in and I finally decide to pull out the Genesis and he sees my cartridge of Sonic & Knuckles and I tell him about how sad I was that I'd never be able to play it because I didn't have Sonic 3. Just as he hears this he tells me to put it in by itself and nothing attached. Never have I felt SO STUPID in my entire life. Ever.
To be fair, that thing certainly doesn't look like a game if you don't know it's a game.
That made me really sad.....
F
Think of it as finding a REALLY big Easter egg ;-)
You could have plug in any game and then press A+B+C I think simultaneously to play one of the bonus stage.
So in a sense Lava Reef Zone acts 1 and 2 kind of represents Sonic and Knuckles, act 1 has Knuckles' harsh red and act 2 has Sonic's cool blue.
Yes
How Symbolic.
Like,,,,,,, whoa.
dude I loved this game and sonic 3 because of that reason, all storytelling and no text or talking at all. its beautiful
@@EltonL Yep, and it should have stayed like that
“As Star Wars has taught us, knuckles has the high ground and the advantage”
IT’S OVER SONIC! I HAVE THE HIGH GROUND!
@@notfound2882 YOU UNDERESTIMATE MY SPINDASH
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:knuckles: U BOUT TO DIE BOI
Hand:ITS OVER SANIC, I HAVE THE HIGH GROUND (and this huge rock
Sanic:YOU UNERESTIMATE THE AMOUNT OF RINGS
Hand: YEET!
I remember getting pretty emotional after I finished this game when I was a kid. It's one of the only big games that I completed at that age.
Floating BunnyHead beating the game is so rewarding
That's how you know a game was good. When you feel both happy and sad when you beat it.
and you got the bad ending
Yet people forget knuckles knocked out super sonic and beat super mecha sonic, without any emerald powers.
The guy is so strong, he can punch the yellow out of sonic!
to be fair it was canonically sonics second over all time ever going super, maybe even first, so sonic was pretty weak and not used to the power. (plus if you go into the knuckles fight with super sonic knuckles cant do shit)
yeah but he’s a strong echidna and sonic didn’t expect it at all
Well technically you couldn't actually damage Mecha Sonic until he's in his base form.
@@ninjawaver Makes you wonder if that was just a normal super form or something more?
Sonic used the 7 chaos (and later the super emeralds) but mecha sonic used the master emerald. Are they the same form if knuckles can't hurt it? Or did knuckles punch the emeralds out of sonic instead?
Actually you made a good point, has anyone else ever absorbed the master emerald?
@@lPsychoMax Absorbed no, but in the IDW comics, Metal Sonic used the Master Emerald to power up into Metal Overlord like he did in Sonic Heroes.
I liked the Mural in Hidden Palace fortelling The Doomday Zone, it was a nice touch with background storytelling.
The way you describe all of this makes me want to go play the game again.
It makes me want to go buy a genesis
It makes me want to get a way to play the game because my Wii’s controllers are busted.
12:05 YOU CAN JUST SPINDASH THROUGH HIM??? THAT WOULDVE BEEN SO MUCH QUICKER TO BEAT HIM IF I KNEW THAT
Adventureruler you mean you haven’t figured that out yet?
I never tried that either, but I didn't have to. I had at least 6 hits on him by the time it got to that.
"BATMAN'S MASK HAS JOINED THE KLAN AND IT'S PISSED AS HELL!!!"
"Sandopolis Zone - *WE HATE THIS LEVEL!! WE HATE THIS LEVEL!! WE HATE THIS LEVEL!!* " - SomeCallMeJohnny
TBONE2004 it’s over sonic I got the high ground
@@notaxmarjunior5664 sonic: You underestimate my power.
Steven Drewett knuckles:don’t try it
People are overly critical of Sonic. All the classic games are awesome. Even labyrinth zone. People just don't like being challenged. But actually changing things up every once in a while is the sign of a great game. I mean, would it really be such a great game if you just had 6 green hill zones? It's the change of pace that makes those levels so sweet.
I actually loved this zone
"Batman's mask has joined the clan and it's pissed as hell!" 🤣😭🤣I can't!
17:57 this bit freaked me out as a kid. I thought this was Robotnik's Terminator endoskeleton after you blew off his human outer skin :D
Eggterminator
Eggsterminator
Same
“BATMANS MASK JOINED THE CLAN AND IT’S PISSED!”
Klan*
@@bencastor9207 bruh you a klan member
@@bencastor9207 KKK MEMBER
Simply a brilliant summary. It makes me happy to see others appreciate the visual worldbuilding in the Lava Reef to Sky Sanctuary sequence, especially.
Ah, yes. The moment at 7:02 captured my first experience with S&K perfectly. Also the ending sequence of lava reef is still one of my most favorite moments in Sonic history.
66 likes
That's jontron quality reaction noises right there!
It's Ya Boi Donny
SAMEEEEEE IT WAS SO HARDCORE
also in level select it counts as a benchmark in the adventure, it has 2 phases bruhh
8:33 when he says “lava” he sounds like movie sonic
I love the special stages. I didn't get Sonic 3 until later, so this was my first experience with them outside of all of that promotional material. I liked the Sonic 2 half-pipe, but I was never that good at it. Sonic 1 just put you to sleep. Blue Spheres quickly became my favorite special stage, despite the high learning curve.
The design looked incredible for the time and the controls, while difficult to master, were remarkably precise. I fiddled with these, slowly getting better. When I finally got Sonic 3 I had 7 more to play with, though I quickly found out those are smaller and (mostly) easier. I always used to have a hard time with the last one (the red/white one) in Sonic 3.
It was also nice that you didn't have to have a certain amount of rings to access them, only to ultimately have all of your rings taken away. There are plenty of Super Rings on each level, and have zero cost of entry.
Speaking of Super Rings, you get 50 rings from them if you've collected all of the Chaos Emeralds. Does anyone else think they're just paying you back all of the rings they took in Sonic 2?
Okay okay, I now see that am literally the only person in the entire universe who enjoys Sandopolis.
Relax buddy, you're not alone.
Yup ya ain’t alone
I can’t for the life of me pass act 2 ;-;
One of my fave levels. Hated it as a kid, love it as an adult
The music was SICK. That alone made it a top contender for me.
"BATMAN'S MASK HAS JOINED THE KLAN AND IT'S PISSED AS HELL!" Probably one of the funniest things I ever heard XD
I always loved the sorta calming and exotic tone in Sandopolis Act 1 then when you hit act 2 you’re on edge as suddenly the music is more intense and nerve wrecking and the ghost don’t help , probably just was me though lol
4:15
Poor Sonic, his balls are always blue. 😂
this video made me realize how badass this game is
10:17 Yes, I do it every time.
I don't
I remember fighting the golem the first time, I had a hint on how to beat him thanks to the Fleetway comic "Sonic The Comic".
I really gotta read more of those comics.
That comic was the bomb, used to love getting it every fortnight. Downloaded a torrent a while ago with all the issues in cbr, brought back some memories
@@cathalorourke1 Because of the comic I was more used to calling Metal Sonic Metallix.
@@riicky83 ha, finally someone knows what I'm on about. Yeah the brotherhood of metallix, the knuckles version was fairly bad ass too. I think the fleetway comics took more inspiration from the games than Archie. After all it was the official mag I think
@@cathalorourke1 The brotherhood also made a Pig Metallix to trick Sonic into thinking it was his teammate Porker Lewis. I miss those characters, Johnny the Rabbit who used a metal pudgel stick, Amy had a crossbow or a bow and arrow and a completely different look to her, there was the good side of Dr Ivo Robotnik aka Dr Ovi Kintobor who was stuck inside a ring, Shortfuse the Cybernik. Dr Robotnik even went through an apperence change to look more like the cartoonish version of the other Sonic cartoons of the times. those were the days.
I always liked Sandopolis Zone. Having one of my favorite tracks in the game helped a lot though.
7:12 Batman's mask has joined the clan, man
Oh my God this made me go down laughing
I love how you elaborate on these classic Sonic games particularly this one.
I remember strongly disliking Sandopolis Zone when I was much younger mainly because of the ghosts hovering over me and that the lights in the second act keeping dimming down every time you turn a switch on to make the ghost go away....but I noticed too how slow paced this zone is compared to the other ones.
Although, I did like the background design of this zone level, reminds me so much of Egypt (painfully obvious).
Overall, another nostalgic game of my childhood!
were you also one of the kids who didn't know how to defeat the act 1 boss?
I find making "toot toot Sonic warriors" a thing cute. lol
1:08 "Hey, look! It's those guys! It's those guys with the names!"
How did you know exactly what 7-year old me was thinking?
9:00 "early on, we see the Death Egg in the distance..."
Me: WHAT
I'm big enough to admit I never noticed that before. I was so obsessed with going fast that I never looked at the backgrounds as much as I probably should have.
You can also see Mushroom Hill Zone and the pyramids of Sandopolis Zone in the background, during Act 2 of Launch Base Zone.
Team Train-Wreck - Sweet damn. Never noticed that
@@MyManJFKTV It's a neat little detail that I admittedly didnt pick up on until just a few years back.
Honestly surprised you didn't mention the mural depicting the final battle, considering all the other lore details you pointed out. Too obvious I guess
Yep
In my childhood I couldn't understand what is pictured there. It is drawn too vague to make any assumptions.
this video is so good, it deserves so much more attention
One of my favorite memories is getting this game for Christmas in 1994. I played it for most of the day with my cousin in my grandma's basement.
My immediate thought was how big S&K was compared to Sonic 1 & 2. The levels were massive and there were plenty of fun new mechanics to play around with just in the first couple levels. I just got to Sandopolis before I had to go home.
And yes, I started with Knuckles.
3:50
I would presume with adequate soil depth it could support anything.
14:33 I'm still learning something new after all these years. I didn't know the island was slowly falling during that fight. I guess the game is letting you know that you're taking too long.
Yeah, good point. It's because the Master Emerald is not in the island itself, right?
Imagine if you take 10 minutes long, the island falls and crumbles, would be a nice easter egg.
*wait it’s actually here* holy SHI-
I never really hated any of the zones in this game, Sandopolis never made me mad in any way. I absolutely love the music in the zone, especially act 2.
Didn't notice Angel Island slowly descending during the Super Mecha Sonic fight until now.
Something new every year with this game I swear.
theses videos are well made, for someone that has 5k subs, this is masterpiece
I had 2k just last week! Thank you guys for the support!
@@GameApologist dang, impressive!!
Fact: Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were one and the same game, but the game was split in half due to time constraints. Standalone Sonic 3 is Sonic 3, Part 1 and Standalone Sonic & Knuckles is Sonic 3, Part 2.
Most of us already knew that, but I guess thanks anyway
I NEVER noticed the Death Egg in the background of Lava Reef act 1, and I played the game like a million times.
That is _so cool._
Another thing about the Mecha Sonic fight; as Knuckles the Egg Robo is the villain you are chasing throughout the entire campaign. Then Mecha Sonic appears and destroys him immediately. Pretty shocking moment that made the fight even more epic!
This game is why sonic will go down in gaming history as one of the most memorable gaming characters ever
When I was young me and a friend created the Tails fan club. We are chili dogs
7:02 is so god damn perfect
This is my favorite Sonic game to this day. Why is it never included on Mega Drive/Genesis collections when it's one of the best Sonic games of all time? The series at its peak - especially as Sonic 3 & Knuckles!
5:31 I don't mind Sandopolis. It's my least favorite level in S & K, but that's a REALLY high bar. I might agree that the difficulty is a bit extreme if it was the third level, but it's actually designed to be the 9th level of this complete adventure.
Sandopolis almost feels like a different game entirely. The outside feels like a harsh desert that is going to slow you down at times, while the inside is dark and claustrophobic.
I feel like people's biggest issue with Sandopolis, particularly the second act, is the difficult level design. While that may be the case, I don't think that's a bad thing. In fact, I think it's the logical approach.
Let's go back to the end of Flying Battery. All through the level you're traveling through the sky going wherever Robotnik wants to go. At the end of the level you just happen to end up in a treacherous desert. This feels like the only time in either game that Robotnik truly determined your route. Most of the adventure felt like a natural follow-up, a path that had at least some consideration, or a chosen destination, such as Launch Base or Flying Battery. In either case, the character had at least some choice in the matter. The only exceptions I can think of are Hydrocity, which was Knuckles' doing, and Mushroom Hill, which was completely coincidental. Robotnik didn't plan on his Death Egg being taken down, and it just happened to be Flying over Mushroom Hill.
For Sandopolis, Robotnik knew where he was flying. Being the mad genius that he is, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was planning to dump his adversaries off in the middle of the desert since the end of Launch Base Zone.
If you think about Sandopolis as a situation that Sonic and Knuckles were forced into, it makes more sense that it feels different from the rest of the game.
The second act feels especially different. The whole level is one big trap that Robotnik had set aside in case his enemies made it this far. In this tight, enclosed space Sonic's speed is all but useless. The ghosts and sand traps were designed to take full advantage of this. In fact, the ghosts only show up in the first place because Sonic was funneled right into them. All other routes were sealed. If anything, people should be grateful that there weren't any pathways that led to immediate death.
Knuckles has a bit of a better time traversing this level, aside from the fact that Sonic already triggered the Ghost Hazard. I can just imagine Knuckles yelling out at Sonic as he's punching ghosts in the face from the get-go. "Why did you go down the Super Happy Fun Slide of Certain Doom?! There's a Boring Old Staircase of Comfortable Safety right next to it!"
Aside from that, Knuckles can avoid the sand traps a bit easier because he can climb up the walls. He can even punch his way into a new pathway eventually.
Remember when this was in literally everyone's recommended?
It still is.
Ah, so I wasn't crazy thinking that knuckles was slower than sonic
Fantastic video. I was not disappointed. Excited for the next one! I especially love the bit where you explained Knuckles's transitions and shortcuts. I never thought I could learn more about the game's world building.
Man oh man these 2 videos about Sonic 3 and S&K were amazing. You made me remember SO much about my childhood that I had my eyes watering many times throughout the whole thing. Thanks for the great job on showing the world what a masterpiece these 2 were, both when combined and separated. And yeah, I would "act" out the whole game when I was a kid, like holding down when knuckles got shocked to act like Sonic is sad, double tapping down when Knuckles call us before destroying the door that leads to the teleporter, omg so many fucking memories!
Thanks isn't enough for the amount of feelings your work made me feel man. I still got a lot of your other videos lined up to be watched right now, but I had to stop and comment on this one. Keep up the amazing work!
"this thick black mushroom head..."
Uhh, phrasing?
What's wrong? The phrasing.... Or your imagination? 🤣
1. Aaah... Good old Doomsday Zone is that moment you realise even debug mode ain't going to save your sorry cheating butt this time. lol
2. Realising that Knuckles story line occurs well after the events of the Sonic playthrough in fact it explains why he was just chilling out in the opening. Thanks Game Apologist.
3.10:17, sometimes I extend it and sometimes if you play the zone right, there are cleverly placed springs in Hidden Palace that allow you to collect just enough rings to open a bonus portal at the checkpoint giving you the oppurtunity to collect enough ring to do a Super/Hyper transform and set Knuckles straight for all the crap he gave you so you can literally put your controller down, fold your arms and laugh maniacally as he fails to damage you. That's payback Knuckles.
4. Knuckles is my 2nd favorite character after sonic, tails is cute but not my preference in playing so no hate for the fox. I sometimes enjoy his playthrough more than Sonic given his unique mechanics.
5. Sandopolis Act 2 was insane and I hated it as much as I hated that bouncy thing in Carnival Night Act 2.
6. Lava Reef Act 1 had an awesome sound track and I would play it non super just to listen to the tune.
all good points minus knuckles being the first to finish. had knuckles been the first to finish the story, the battle with sonic would have been unnecessary, and the two would have never met there, not to mention befriended each other. the part where he's just chilling in the intro is the beginning of the angel island events, dating back to sonic 3; showing his connection to the storyline as a complete game/follow up on why he gut punched the emeralds out of sonic in S3, as he was seen approaching in a super form, and knuckles knowing the power of the emeralds; hence him still seeing sonic as an enemy in the second installment.
Too many words, so little time..
@@quotetry8998 eh, well properly understanding a chaotic timeline between games takes a little reading. i suggest either getting a dictionary or a bigger attention span if you wanna keep up. and if this is bad? id stay away from the zelda chronology lmao.
Yeah, you can still cheat the hell out of doomsday zone. I finished it with over 900 rings as scrambled Tails or Knuckles more than a few times when I was a kid.
@@V.is.for.Vae.Victus such w o w
I respect your love for the game so much bro. The nostalgia I get from coming here I had to sub
I love this series! So glad I found this channel
TH-cam has been recommending your videos to me for the last few days and so far every video it has recommended has been about Sonic and Knuckles.
Keep up the good work
I'm honestly glad I found this channel,
Not only is it not that old,
But it's also pretty underrated, I was honestly expecting more comedic moments but tbh it didn't ruin the fact that the review itself on the story and your opinions on it were all great to listen to, keep up the good work.
Thanks for this. It evoked some nostalgic memories.
7:11 Now I'll never see Batman the same way again. This is for the best.
I too remember being unreasonably disappointed with the cardboard box when I finally got my pre-order in my hands. Bothered me for months and I went to a lot of trouble to fix it.
Also, yes, I too stretched out the knuckles fight. Many times.
Here I come, rougher than the rest of them
The best of them, tougher than leather
You can call me Knuckles, unlike Sonic *and Knuckles*
*And Knuckles* rather flex my muscles
Coming never
Knuckles and knuckles
Introducing knuckles
Didn't anyone notice that in S&K Robotnik dies? No one ever comments that. In any sonic game, when you finish the credits, Robotnik appears telling you to try again or enraged for losing. Except in S&K when you have all the chaos emeralds as sonic. If you do so, instead a pile of scraps appear and an Eggrobo lits on laughing as Robotnik does! That's also storytelling! It's Robotnik. Probably it transferred his mind or something.
That Robotnik is the same that attacks knuckles (whose story happens after Sonic's). Another detail is that the egg mobile is never destroyed in any game, except when it's hit by mecha sonic. It's the sole time in the sonic trilogy where the egg mobile blows up in pieces. Mecha sonic kills eggman.
This isn’t true at all.
1. Eggrobo is just super intelligent.
2. If Robotnik was killed, he wouldn’t be in any of the games we got after S&K.
I first played these games when I was 8 years old and I still play them today, at 37. It’s a thoroughly entertaining series of games and I don’t think I’ll ever tire of them. I will introduce my children to these games.
“Batman’s Mask has Joined the the Klan and it’s pissed as hell”
How did I not notice this until 2 years later
This game was bundled with the Sega Genesis my father got me for Christmas back in 1996. Took me awhile to beat it before I got the chance to dabble with the "Lock-On Technology". This game was a blast on it's own but when I learned of the two combo games you could get from locking on either Sonic 2 or Sonic 3, I knew I had to try it. Got Sonic 2 while still growing up. Didn't get Sonic 3 for myself till about 8th grade. The combo from locking on Sonic 2 creates "Knuckles the Echidna in Sonic the Hedgehog 2". Which, as it's title suggest, is the whole Sonic 2 game using Knuckles. The perks are as follows: You get to keep the rings you have when you pass a star post, the number of rings you need to get in each Special Stage is reduced(thank god), and you can glide through a number of levels if you get the right height. As for the drawbacks, aside from the usual Sonic 2 glitches, Knuckles's jump height can be problematic especially against the final boss. Learned that the hard way when I actually got to the fight. Locking on Sonic 3 gives "Sonic 3 & Knuckles" which is the TRUE Sonic 3 experience. Loved the Super Emeralds and the transformations that came with it. Got a real kick out of Super Tails and his "Flicky Army of Death"(reference to SomecallmeJohnny). While we're on the subject of that, if you didn't get all the Chaos Emeralds before jumping into a Giant Ring in the second half of the game, you'll be forced to gather the remaining ones before you can access the rest of the Super Emerald stages.
Great video!! Ahh this game is still amazing, and yet it’s the ONE Megadrive game I’ve inexplicably lost over the years... I’d rather play the physical Megadrive version than the PS3 Collection version, but not much choice at the moment...!
You’re totally right, the storytelling in this game without any dialogue is incredible. That’s how Sonic games should be, just look at Sonic Mania!
I remember playing this with my brother, trying to get all the Super Emeralds for Knuckles, and when I did, I excitedly raced to my brother who was on the phone and wrote on a piece of paper to show him, something like “HYPER KNUCKLES IS IN ACTION!” 😁😁😁
The lava reef joke got me, another great video
So awesome to see someone as passionate about Sonic as me. Me and my brother used to play these games so much as kids and they still hold up today
“It’s those ni.....”
Either we have great minds or selective hearing
hmm
When he sais that?
“BATMAN’S MASK HAS JOINED THE KLAN AND IT’S PISSED AS HELL!”
Luiz___ MK 1:10
I am currently soldering my Mega Drive back together but this is what Im gonna play when its back together. Great video.
I love the fact that your channel is getting the hype it deserves... well done on creating entertaining content 🙌🏼
8:17
This is such a good bit.
10:14 Actually, it's kinda close to the battle between Sonic and 'silver Sonic' on the Master System version of Sonic 2. The spin-attacks there actually cancel each other out, making an epic fight more possible (although you have to stretch it as well, since it's not that hard (harder than the Knuckles fight though)).
"oh yeah, here it is. LAVA" Game Apologist 2019
Even by itself, I REALLY love this game.
i love sandoplis is my favorite stage love playing act 2 with the lights off, shame everyone hates it
I think it's just stressful for newbies and just a bit tiring for veterans. I think it's a brilliant diversion from the rest of the game.
Well funny cuz when I first played (10 years) it with my brother (6 years old) we loved how frustrating sandopolis was (despite being newbies)
I personally just find the stage a bit....boring I guess? I suppose I didn’t like how much the pace slows down and how it has slow puzzles. But if you love the stage good for you.
I feel you man, even as a kid I loved sandopolis act 2 and all it`s gimmicks, which really added to the tension. I loved the ghosts and the sense of danger they added to where you knew to hurry up when they popped up, you knew to really hurry up when the lights went brown, and you knew to go into ninja mode when the lights went out and they started coming for you. I also really enjoy ripping through sandopolis as super sonic and ignoring or breaking basicly every gimmick of the level
Actually I have a bit of a hot take: I actually prefer sandopolis act 2 in terms of aesthetics, level gimmicks AND music, over both acts of lava reef. It`s honestly one of my favourite levels along with flying battery, sky sanctuary, and doomsday zone
Also, I`ve been playing S&K on the regular for the last 20 years and i only now noticed that the little pointy thing that grows out the side of the ghosts are their arms, until now i tbought they grew pointy witches noses to help signify they were evil...
As a kid (and to be honest, even now) I thought the evil ghosts in Sandopolis looked like Mr Burns from the Simpsons. I still call them Mr Burns
I can see that. It's all in the nose.
@@mistersp3753 yep, it's the nose
Great video, 1st time viewer, now I'm subscribed. I love just how great these titles look, Sonic Team really knew how to get the most outta the Genesis at this point 👏
fantastic video bro
THOUGH HOW DID YOU MISS TALKING ABOUT HOW THE MUSIC SPEEDS UP IN DOOMSDAY ZONE WHEN YOU'RE LOW ON RINGS ITS SOO GOOD FOR THE DRAMA
I never played S3 until after I had already played (to death) S&K. When I finally got the opportunity to play the full S3&K, I was a bit disappointed. I ran through the game, with no challenge, and even unlocked Super Sonic on my FIRST playthrough. I still prefer to play S&K by itself, as the levels are harder, for the extra challenge.
The lava reef notes bit extracted a good laugh from me, the algorithm was right.
What a good idea to watch this before I even buy a game I've never played before. I am such a genius.
"In critical Moments, you notice that Knuckles can't jump as high as Sonic". Yep... One of those "critical moments" would be the Final Boss of Sonic 2...
Red Knuckles can't jump.
7:34 " I hate sand it's tough corse and gets everywhere "
"Anyone else stretch this fight out on purpose just to make it feel more epic?" 100% yes
I knew I always liked sonic and knuckles but I haven't played it in forever. nostalgia, mai boi
Love the music in the lava level reminds me of being aged 12 and playing this
just watching to get it out of my recommended, good video
3:55 That because it was originally called Mushroom Valley.
I have a love for this game in particular,Since it and sonic 1 were my first tastes of sonic games
One thing I've never been able to unsee since maybe the first time I've played through this game was the little platforms on Lava Reef that descend through the lava waterfall. For some reason they look like they have a face, and due to their color and kinda feline appearance they reminded me of the Pink Panther.
9:18 Just look at them and tell me you cannot unsee them now.
That graphic art imo is top 5 video game art of all time. Its simple, but it was everything
Game Apologist: We get to lava reef which is filled with..umm, hang on I, uhh left my notes here somewhere, I uhh hmm i-s this is uhh, lava reef is filled with...uhh stuff flows, its.. fiery, molten rock! Oh yeah here it is LAVA!!
I died
(it's actually magma when it's still within the earth, but don't tell him that)
One thing I wish you would say about Doomsday zone is it has to be the most suspenseful moment Sonic EVER had, sure later on games has super form battles, but this is the only one where Sonic is seen experiencing recoil when hit, even before you catch up to Robotnik himself, despite super Sonic being set as this almighty being that can destroy things simply by touch, these seemingly regular missiles send him flying backwards, it truly shows how serious Robotnik was for this final battle, and how desperate Sonic had to be in this fight despite being in his super form
What's interesting is when Mania was first released, everyone was 100% on board calling it the best Sonic game ever.
But only NOW are we starting to see people revise their opinions and go "actually...perhaps it doesn't quite reach 3&K"
Troy Wright same. To me it’s sonic 3 and knuckles version 1.1
Honestly, Mania is held back by it's overuse of zones. I rank it as:
1. CD
2. 3K
3. 2
4. Mania
5. 1
Never made it far in any classic Sonic games but I love them to death. Also HOLY CRAP, Knuckles taking out a Super Mecha Sonic. Pretty cool!
when i was younger i used to hop on flashgame websites that had a port sonic 3 and knuckles, when i fight knuckle i let him take turns to fight, it was like when i hit him i let him attack but dont let him hit me unless i have a shield to make the fight better, then in sky sanctuary i spend a bit of time near him, then i continue the game normally.
This was my favorite entry in the classic series.
Something worthy of note is how Angel Island is slowly but surely dropping from the sky during Knuckles' final boss battle, due to the lack of Master Emerald keeping it afloat. By the time 10 minutes is up, the island is completely hidden amongst the clouds.