Triumph Trophy, Sprint, Daytona:- "Coil Pack Upgrade" !
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ส.ค. 2022
- "Plug-In Coil Packs". A 'plug-and-play' solution to better ignition !
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Del, would just like to say thanks to you for all of the how to's you share. I have just serviced my 95 tbird with all your advice. Saving up now for a cam cover gasket and pauls coils. ( just spent out at the mo) once again, brilliant easy to follow and confidence building techniques for this old Brickie. P.s..... lots of fun to be had cleaning out a coolant expansion tank 😄. Keep well. 👍
Ha ha.. don;t they get nasty inside aye...! ive had to resot to caustic soada and boiling water in the past... hope you're isn;t that bad.. Thank you for your feedback mate, im glad the videos can help, Good luck with your project.
Greatly informative video!
I'm wondering if the spark plugs have to be re-gapped after doing this mod.
I've got an old-school Yamaha V-max that I'm considering upgrading to stick coils.
Someone on some forum mentioned the spark plugs should be re-gapped to 0.025 inches after these stick coil mods.
I can't seem to find any confirmation for this.
Anyone know?
Can't say enough great things about Paul Messenger. He knows the Triumph brand -Daytona, Speed Triple, Sprint inside and out, all the tricks, tips, suspension, eccentric maintenance dos and don'ts .. Real asset on the Triumph Daytona enthusiast FB groups. He also worked Clive Wood and Jack Lilley Triumph racing the Daytona 955s on closed track and TT. So he knows his stuff. YSS shock dealer UK. Paul had a kind word about Del too ...so no doubt here..... this is a quality coil stick upgrade.
Thank you so much for your input Carl, you're right about Paul, he's a good friend and a true gentleman. We live a fair way apart, but meet up when ever we get the chance.
Hello sir I’ve had my 2001 Triumph Trophy 900 in the dealership service center for two weeks. The dealership cannot tell me why the center cylinder is not getting fire to ignite the center spark plug. They have tried a new igniter box, a new pickup coil, and ran test on the ignition coils, which tested out good. The compression on all cylinders are at 175 psi with minimal bleed down.The mechanical valve timing is good. Is there any common problems you can think of that might be the problem?
Sincerely,
James Blackburn
Springfield, MIssouri. USA
Hi James, we've replied to your message that you sent privately on Facebook... we see you've already contacted Paul, he will be able to help you!
From Springfield too! Own a speed four and dealing with what I think is a misfire and surging at low rpm 😢
Looks like my Toyota coils pack and wires, I didn’t know they make those kind setup that far back… super upgrade!! Should change the spark plugs while you’re at it…. Lol
These bikes didn't upgrade to this setup for another ten years, so it's a great step forward for this old War Horse.! Bike has had a full service including plugs less then 200 miles ago.!
@@Moonfleet41 .. that makes sense.. technology sure change.
Well jealous Del, trouble is i live in an expanding London ULEZ zone, so any bike older that 2008 is not compliant, consequently £12.50 a day 365 days a year to ride, even for taking it off the drive. really pi##ed off that I'm going to have to lose my bandit that i spent neigh on £1k on replacing all bearings, seals, silent running chain an sprockets, discs, lines you get the idea. someone will end up with my pride and joy that i cherished for neigh eight years. I'm hanging onto with the glimmer of hope that because of the cost of living crisis they postpone, or cancel the idea.
Sorry to hear that mate, what a nightmare, all about the politics aye.. seems crazy they penalize bikes that don't contribute to congestion, but are ok with huge electric SUV's and vans ! Lets hope someone sees sense in the end..!
Did I miss the new s/plugs? - or is it a 'read all the immediate differences before making any other changes' jobbie?
Where were these fancy coil packs when I was cursing petulant CDI units on Italian triples 500 years ago? Makes y'weep.
Only Triumph triple I rode were brief trips on an early ('93?) Speed Triple, it went like stink & handled well enough to leave the owner whining about new tyre costs after only two days . . . was fun tho'. . . Really, how are any of us still here?! : )xx
Class prose as always sir.
What's the use of this kit ? I have no idea..
I have a 1996 Trophy 1200. I wish these were available for 4 cylinder bikes!
I have a 97. Love it
Hi Del, had the good fortune to meet Paul Messenger last weekend at Clive Wood's place - what a privilege! both great blokes :)
is this lovely old warhorse going to develop into a full Delboy's Garage project? fingers crossed! cheers and all the best, Steve
Hi Steve, glad to hear you were there with the chaps, I must get along to a course one day even if only for the social... and you're right, this is a beautiful old war horse, but it won't be a full on project as it needs nothing! It would be a waste to chop it up in to something else, it's beautiful as it is, but will be covering any maintenance work as it's been wonderfully maintained all it's life so I want to keep that going, it's only slight 'weakness' is that after almost 30yrs the bodywork's a bit scruffy and as a buddy of mine has a paint shop, I may re-spray it one day, but it will be back to standard, rather than a custom job... so who knows, but for now it's a rider!
Hi Del. I don't suppose you have any tricks of the trade to remove stuck coils by any chance? I am struggling to remove coils 1 and 4 from my 02 Hayabusa, and it's getting to a point where I'm just going to damage the coils plastics from pulling on them so hard. I have gotten them to twist, but something seems to be sticking.
Thanks for your video, Del. If only I'd seen that about 12 years ago. I had some trouble with the Trident 900 and my mechanic changed all the coils... Costly, but since then old Lady runs perfectly. If the electric gremlins return I know what to do. Thank you,
Günter from Nürnberg/Germany
Glad it helped you out, these beautiful old bikes are pretty reliable, it's just wear and tear that gets them in the end!
@@Moonfleet41 Lovely bike, lovely roar. Watching your video I could feel the plastics and the screws. I had it for 100,000 miles. Still in my garage, is ridden every 4 weeks to keep it going, but now belongs to a friend who lives in the US. I do really care for the old Trident and keep her going. Sometimes he comes over to Europe and rides in the Alps. Cheers, Günter
@@enduromotorradtouren 100k miles?, that is impressive mileage, i have heard that they can do double this with car and respectful riding.! Such well built and reliable engines, what a perfect touring bike. !
Always nice when anything is easy to install. If you don’t mind me asking, is the upgrade mostly added reliability?
Hey buddy, certainly is added reliability, the benefits are twofold, it gives a crisper leap forward with zero lag when you crack the throttle on the road, but more importantly, when you start the bike the engine will fire within 1/2 turn, which is important because with these heavy old motors they're prone to damage their sprag clutch if the compression overcomes the starter due to a lame battery, the motor can then jump backwards and that does the damage, so the more instantly it can fire up, the safer for the starter!
@@Moonfleet41 Nice bit of info there, thanks.
After installing the stick coil upgrade by Messenger, my tach stopped indicating above 500-700 rpm’s. Is there something I can do to correct this problem?
Thanks Jim
Hi Jim. Sorry to hear that mate.. I'm not sure what that could be, all i can suggest is to contact Paul directly and see if he can suggest a help, he's a mine of information on the coils and all things Triumph triple.. Good luck with it mate and hope he can help.! Del.
As I understand, this is indeed a fairly straightforward upgrade on the triple engines, as they have a coil per cylinder. However, with the 4 cylinder engine like on my 94 Trophy, 2 cylinders share a coil in a lost/wasted spark set up, and I think this causes a problem with going to a stick set up as the coil impedances get messed up in some way.
I would love to see if Paul has any info (or kits) for the 4 cylinder engines, but I haven't done Facebook for years.
Anyway, nice to see such a tidy Trophy, hope mine could be considered to be as good!
ETA - when you took the seat panels off, you didn't need to remove the 2 button head screws from the back part, they only hold the front part of the small joining panel. Taking them out means extra load is put on the 2 bolts that go up through the side panels into the joining panel, either side of the tail light. At least, I have never had to take out to remove those panels from the bike.
It is possible but will need an igniter from ignitech that has 4 separate outlets.
@@paulmessenger1006 ok,but is that something you can supply on a kit?
@@antonionunes998No. I dont have a 4cyl to work on.
Brilliant vid and upgrade, Del. That’s quite a pretty old gal for her age. I was waiting for you to say “let’s remove all the furniture” in the beginning! I noticed you gave an excellent bit of advice about getting the body clips off… although I remember getting in trouble back in high school for “sticking my hand in there and having a good grope” with Mrs. Bacciagalupe the young Italian class teacher. I learned some new Italian words that day. Hope you and Penny have a great weekend there!
🏍👍🏍
Tea on laptop again, you do it every time Sir, have a great weekend and keep safe both of you!
@@Moonfleet41 😜
Blooming’ marvellous Del.
I’ve put this into my Technical Files on my IPad.
I’m sure it will come in useful for my T595 that I bought in 1997.
Thanks again.
What about a little Dielectric grease into all the coil connections and a little bit of spiral wrap over the leads where they got zippy tied to the frame?
Thanks Nick, this would be a great upgrade for your Triumph, and it's great to hear you've had your bike for so long.!
Please give us the link because I have and will not have Facebook and it gets complicated to get to the correct Paul. Thanks
What's the benefit of the kit? Why is it better?
Coil packs are more reliable and produce a better spark so they can improve power and efficiency
@@phillipjefferies7443 thanks
But did he not remove the fsvory coils and just replaced them by some (only) wires? How is that better?
@@nenadvrca7730 because the coil are inside the plug caps
Additionally shorten travel the spark to plugs.. in ms… ( probably more hotter) , my own dad always set points in olde days closer gap at the distributor. I see why he carries extras set points !!! Lol 😂
Remarkably clean for a 30 year old bike!
It is indeed, a well maintained example!
By the way I have contacted Paul about purchasing his coil pack upgrade too.
Cracking bit of kit that! Don't see many conversions around for the Triumphs so good to see the older bikes getting some love!
Too right mate, and it makes a huge difference too, more instant throttle response, and instant starting, which on these bikes, if the battery is a little lame, can cause major issue with the starter spragg.!
Good info. Contacted Paul to see if they would work on a 95 1200 Daytona.
I love your videos since I own a 1995 Thunderbird 900 and I‘m always trying to deep-dive into the technical matters.
The one thing I do not get yet is: Why would I want a coil upgrade? Mine are (still) running fine. And why did you upgrade the coils on the Legend and the Trophy?
Hi Tim. The use of coil pack ignition systems and lack of necessity for separate plug wires results in a far more durable system, as well as a more cost-effective one. Better still, COP ignition systems can prevent lean mixtures of fuel from misfiring, and because a coil pack generally creates a much more efficient spark being sat directly on top of the plug, it's also known to provide a slight fuel efficiency improvement over bikes that use standard coils and HT leads. most bikes use COP now, so this is a great way to bring your Triumph's ignition system up to date !
Sorry how do I get in contact with Paul?
Wonderful,of unbelievable quality motorcycles.I had the Sprint model back in 1993 and after thousands of kms in every condition without the slightest problem,the only thing that ever broke down was....a coil.😅😅😅
Thank you for sharing your experience Tasos, they are a known weak point so this is a worthy upgrade as you will know!
1:12 the moment when every Bonneville owner cries😂🤣
Yeah, long overdue is a properly fitted seat..!
Almost the same situation with the Aprilia milles. Sprag clutches. Aprilia performance do a kit for those too.
I have the exact bike and color, i have been toying with the idea of upgrading to these stick coils. Can you actually tell a difference with these fitted? thanks again and great vid. cheers
First time you thumb the start button after fitting them, you'll know!... the engine fires instantly, throttle's more responsive and if all your other servicing is up to scratch it will even improve fuel efficiency via more complete combustion!
I've always been very appreciative of companies/builders that make things that don't require hacking the factory harnesses.
And if you are making them... it really doesn't take much extra time at all to make them better.
Nearly as bad as working on a gold wing..... a two day takedown for a 1 hour fix :)
Gary, My '02 Tundra has its starter mounted, get this, UNDER the intake manifold. The starter solenoid's copper contacts had become pitted, burnt and needed replacing. $10 worth of parts, and took me all day to do a 2 hour job. The Lexus cars w same V8 look like an absolute nightmare to deal with. Starter bolts pinned between the firewall and engine block...
That tube is what you call a backbone to a frame. Why did you not put new sparkplugs in after all that messing about with the bodywork ?.
Already fitted mate, bike has had a full service, all fluids and all consumables, this was just a finishing touch!
Is there a kit for the 1997 t595 Daytona?
That has to be the simplist home mechanic job ever?. I never realised you were friends with Paul Messinger, i`l be contacting him for this upgrade for my Daytona1000.
Yes indeed Neil, he's a good friend and great inspiration.. I'm sure he'll be happy to hear from you.
My 1995 Speed Triple .Will on occasion drop a cylinder.Research says stock coils go bad.
Indeed mate, this is a great way to solve many of those old problems!
great video brother ! simply done 👍 thats a good looking triumph ! you are right most of the work was removing and putting back all the plastic pieces than the job it self. Triumph owners will save some money 💰 thanks to your videos brother ! stay safe guys cheers from new york 🍺🍺🍺🥂🥂🥂
Thanks brother 👍, that was the idea, passing forward a little straightforward garage practice to save breakages and also a great upgrade!
Nice video thanks , one question, you power on the bike for test without assembling the fuel tank , how is possible ?
Carburettors!
Dose he do them fore any bike such as zx6r
I own a 2008 sprint and would love to see more videos like this. 👍
More coming next week..
Another awesome video Del.. Simple and easy kit to install. Nice job!!
Sure is easy buddy, it couldn't possibly have been made easier and a great upgrade too!
Hi Del, great video as usual ...you have a very slixk style of working and filming...love it ! Would you know how to wire/connect 4 stick coils to 2 coils on a Kawasaki zzr600...?
These coil pack sets are made by one individual specifically for Triumphs, I wouldn't know of any such conversion available for your bike mate.
Del, do you know if anyone makes a similar upgrade for 2002 Suzuki bandit 1200?
No mate, these are specifically for Triumph Triples! I don't know of other products!
ARRGH...JUST found your page. Amazing tutorials. I'm in the market for this upgrade as well (2000 TBS) as one coil is on the fritz and would rather solve issue long term. Have a message into Paul...hope to hear at some point soon. Thanks again! will follow!
He should reply and be able to sort that out for you Sue.. let me know if not and ill give him a nudge..!
@@Moonfleet41 He was very responsive...have him in the wings...took off carbs and the float levels were way off (which is odd not sure how that happens over time perhaps?)...thinking one cylinder starving for fuel. BUT I will do the conversion anyway and avoid the inevitable breakdown! Thanks for a great channel. Pete
I don't know why, but I really like the sound of the exhaust :)
This is a current model for me! Lovely example . Mine had 1 more cylinder but talking to others who've owned the 9 and the 12 many liked the 9 more.
Any road up , ( whatever that means) 20 plus year old bikes make me happy 😊 Mainly because I can fix them without a degree in IT. That's computers 💻not angry clowns 🤡
PEACE AND LOVE ✌️ 💚
I thought you'd like this one mucker.. painfully standard and going to stay that way.. just maintenance and fresh fluids on demand.. have a great weekend and keep safe you.. Hugs from us both.. D&Pxx
are you the same springy as in the 'i don't know' song???
@@stevewalker2736
Guilty.
✌️💚
Whare can i get these new coil packs, i can only find second hand one's for my 02 sprint rs
Check out 'Paul Messenger' on Facebook, he makes them!
@@Moonfleet41 thanks brother
Great video, Del and Penny. I'm following the Harley project with interest but it is nice to step away for a bit. Nice upgrade, very well done. Take care, both of you!
Thanks buddy👍m yeah it was nice to take s step back for a day and don something different..
From now on i finally get the answers...😎👍🏼tq uncle...
Have looked for the guy you refer to in the video named Paul messenger but a whole list of them come up could you point me in the direction of the right profile or could find out a price for the kit thank you could leave the price by replying to this message.
His profile image is a Yellow Triumph Trident with him standing behind it.!
Where can I find these?
All information in the video. 10:45 onwards
Why not do plugs while you where in there??
Already done Nigel, along with all fluids and consumables.
Hi from Australia.
Is this available for a 91 cbr1000f?
Cheers
Lindsay
Unfortunately no. I only make for triumph 900 triples
noice.... Does he do one for the Divi 900 lmao
Sadly not.. just the triple Triumphs..!
Tried to find Paul Messenger on Facebook and no luck. How can I find a contact, as I would like to do the same thing to my 1995 Triumph Thunderbird 900.
He's on there mate, just search the name, it's the picture of a yellow Triumph I believe!
@@Moonfleet41 Did a search three times, no yellow Triumph photo🥺
Just searched it... found it right away.. yellow trident 900 in the picture..!
I am in Canada, and I still can’t see him on Facebook with a Yellow Triumph Photo! Is there another way to reach out and make contact with Paul Messenger?
@@Moonfleet41 Found him - may want to upgrade the wording Paul the Messenger!
Alright Del - been a little while. Hope you and Pen are all good. Lovely to see an old new Trumpet up on the ramp. This was where motorcycling started for me, about 1993. I wanted one of these as my first 'big' bike. Course I went with the VFR in the end but still; it's a handsome old bus. Keep smiling... :o)
Hey Paul, good to hear from you mate, she is a lovely old war horse, and a glorious look back at the past... how bikes have changed over the years!
Great fun to watch this! My personal "Golden Age" of motorcycles is roughly 1979 to 1999, so anything to do with the machines of these times will forever hold a special place in my heart, no matter the brand or model. This was a beautiful example, thank you so much for the start of a day on an enjoyable note. :)
Thank you so much buddy..Glad you enjoyed it! and i agree with you, this is a glorious old war horse from a golden age!
I totally agree . Exactly my era for bikes too .
Peace and love ✌️ 💚
@@springy-2112 Much love in the house tonight! All gentlemen of a certain age aye?!
Nice kit. That was a lot of plastic. Love the Triple sound.
I have to wonder if I was the only person to make a "POP" sound with my finger inside my cheek like you do as a kid with the "Pop! goes the Weasel" song when I heard those plug boots "pop" out of the heads.... I think my mom may have dropped me on my head as a child, perhaps. :) Enjoy your new ignition!
You too aye?! I think that way too but I tend to not say anything lol! We head droppers should stick together... I often make a creaking sound when I bend down to pick something up, but I'm afraid that's not a sound effect, that's just my knees and back wearing out ha ha!
@@Moonfleet41 I remind myself of a bowl of Rice Krispies with all the "Snap! Crackle, and POP" sounds that I make, just going about my day! I make a game of guessing which body part is making which sound. :)
Lovely job Del, I've got a 96 Triumph 900. Unfortunately it won't start, starter spins but doesn't engage, and it also needs alot of loving care and attention. I'll message Paul Messenger for tips too
Sorry to hear that Brian, and yeah, good call, there isn't much he doesn't know about them.!
@@Moonfleet41 is it the Paul that lives in Bristol and went to Rolls Royce tech College
TOP
And a dollop of rubber grease on your bodywork lug grommets, to help the lugs slide in nice and smooth on reassembly 😁 (and keep the grommets from disintegrating)
100 percent in agreement Mr. Burro. Some say the covers will vibrate off, but I have been doing this since the late 70z in dealerships and my own shop as well. Never EVER lost a cover. I specially like the full synthetic grease, you only need a tiny bit.
I have always done the gas tank grommets as well, makes removing the tank super easy for the next service.
T.S. RACING
Classic 👍👍
Lovely bike, and all the better for that mod. Good one!
Thanks Robin. Glad you like it, it's glorious old War Horse..
Great video Del & Penny. Job well done mate, very nice up grade. That's one sweet looking Triumph, Penny and you have a relaxing weekend and stay safe. PS Hope you are getting some better weather now. Cheers
Glad you enjoyed it mate, and yes a beautiful old classic bike aye?! Yes, weather is good and has been for a some time, out enjoying it when we can! Have a great weekend there too, keep safe!
That’s a well used no.10 socket there! 👌🙌 😂
Straight forward, great upgrade. Have a good weekend
Thanks mate you too!
Great !
What a nice vintage bike ! Very impressed with the quality of the kit and the ease of the install. Paul is obviously a perfectionist who cares about the product. Sounds like two other people whose videos I have become totally hooked on. 😁 Thank you Del and Penny. God bless and be well my friends. ❤👍👍
Certainly is Rick, it's beautifully made to an incredibly high standard and certainly as good as the factory equipment, or better!... Take care and have a wonderful weekend, D&Px
Brought back dome memories that bike! was the first bike i ever remember being on as a kid with my dad and first bike i was allowed to clean 😂 always have a soft spot for triumphs
Very cool, they're pretty indestructible, and lots of them still on the roads, they're capable of space ship mileage with no real problems as long as they're maintained.. great to have those memories aye.
More awesome friends from the brotherhood, one highly skilled Paul Messenger take a bow my friend you are a God send.
Another amazing TH-cam video for the channel, another great go-to video.
God bless you all x
Hi Marc, you're absolutely right, it is a privilege to have Paul as a friend and great to be part of it all! God bless you and have a great weekend Sir!
Great upgrade Del, well demonstrated and explained, as always 👍
Thanks mate👍
Great upgrade Mate👍,,
And thanks for the referral🙏.
I'm doing a service on a mate's 955i Tiger.
The fuel gage is not functioning,,
but the low level lamp is working. Maybe he can advise how it rectify this wonky issue 🤔.
The float sensor failed?
I'm not sure. 🤷♂️.
Have a good weekend.
Cheers 🍻, G.
No problem 👍 Good luck with your project there.
@@Moonfleet41 ,, yeah, a bit of a head scratcher..
I searched for Paul Messenger and found dozens. Any help narrowing that down?
Please 🙏.
I have a Tiger 955i with the same problem. I replaced the sender unit and it works perfectly now. Apparently it’s known issue on these. Maybe this helps. Also if you find the Triumph T300 group on Facebook, you will find Paul.
@@andrewjennings6669,, 🙏 Thank you for reading and your reply and confirmation.
After much testing I narrowed it down to the sender also. Absolutely no continuity through the unit,, hence no reading for resistance transmitted to the fuel gage.
There is power to both circuits.
I've consulted with the owner on this. He is going to order the new sender and seal directly from the UK when he returns from holiday.
Thanks again and cheers 🍻 to you and Del &Penny. Ride safe. G, In beautiful Boulder City, Nv. USA 🇺🇲
Such an industrial old beast! She’ll feel better for receiving them 🙌🏻 well done Pen with the camera 👏🏻
Great description mate, it is a heavy old war Horse, and for that i love it.!
Thank you
Miss these how too videos👍👍
What a well-made kit...a nice upgrade, and a bit of weight savings too! LOL
Sure thing buddy, makes it a little less cluttered under the tank too, and a definite improvement in performance!
Great segment Del! Loads of tips and advice. Thanks and a great weekend to you and Penny. Cheers mate.
Cheers Shaun, it's always so good to hear from you mate, thanks for your constant support! D&Px
Fantastic retrofit setup. In stark contrast to some of the LED headlight "upgrades" I've seen on the market that require butchering wiring harnesses and everything else.
Yes mate, Paul does a fantastic job of making sure this is an easy fit and total plug in install, just how it should be!
I wish you were my local mechanic Del. I'd know my bike was cared for.
Do you feel the difference, thanks for the video
Yes mate, very much so, first of all the engine fires up more instantly instead of maybe 2-3 turns before it fires, it now fires up on the first turn, which is important on these bikes as a weak battery and a lazy attempt at starting can cause it to run backwards and damage the sprag clutch so they always need a perfectly healthy battery, preferably one with higher cca as a safety net, and with this upgrade, you can almost eliminate that problem for good... plus on the road, it pulls away more instantly if you snap the throttle suddenly without that usual slight lag, definitely makes a difference and well worth the money.
Nice sensible upgrade with a quality piece of kit
Nice job Del
Nick Australia
Thanks Nick 👍, glad you approve, have a safe weekend mate!
The mouth is not going to approve, another impeccable video excellent content, you do have the knack of making it look easy 😉
has paul got a business contact theres loads of paul messengers on facebook
No mate, no business contact, you're looking for a profile photo with a yellow Triumph Trident in it and him standing behind it..!
@@Moonfleet41 yeah i just found mate thanks.