This really was to test body mocap. I am looking for any hints and tips? So far am not pleased with smartsuit pro 2 with walking or turning etc. Jerky and fake looking to me, for cinematics. See description for info.
Thank you for posting this test. When they stand still, the results are pretty neat. But you are right that, when they walk or turn, the results seem unusable (to me at least). If the suit is showing 100% green indicators in Rokoko Studio, as you say in your description, there is nothing else you can do to fix this?
@@phoenixstudios7520 In Rokoko Studio turn off locomotion and the other filters, and you’ll see the core issue. The suit isn’t getting any data at all about movement in 3d space, it’s purely getting rotation data of the sensors. So it’s then using maths to figure out where the suit is in 3d space, and yeah it’s not… good. It’s better than nothing but not good. There are two options to improve it: option 1: you can get gloves and coil pro. The coil pro helps the math because it at least has a reference to where your hands are, but it’s still not amazing. Option 2: get a Vive tracker and base stations. but there’s no easy way to feed its 3d location and rotation into Rokoko studio. You have to make your own custom api program (!) to feed the location of the tracker in. And it only can be assigned to hip bone. Thats it.
@@virtualfilmer Thanks for this detailed reply. I am thinking about getting a rokoko smartsuit, but now I am having some doubts. Maybe its best to save some money and buy a more expensive suit
Rokoko is fantastic for single motions for games and short animations. I only have issues because I’m trying to record actual acting scenes. So check out all of Sam’s great Rokoko videos - and he shows off the suit etc, and if his recordings are enough for you then buy. They are great people and trying hard. And there’s nothing at this cheap price point that comes close. But yeah it’s not good for actual performance capture for dialogue scenes
@@virtualfilmer I want to make animated films using UE, so our purposes are similar. I need solid mocap performance. I actually think that, as AI suitless mocap is developing, suits will gradually become cheaper. Maybe I will wait a while and go with the flow.
@@PainnGames The best thing to do is to make a video of the mocap you’re getting and contact support. They take a few days and are on Greek time (which from USA can be very frustrating) but it’s worth it to just step through it with them. It’s never going to be “perfect”, but definitely can be improved with their help. Do you have gloves and coil pro? Both are necessary for better results because then there is some sort of positioning for the maths to work from. (The suit otherwise is just using math to work out how you’re moving)
@@PainnGames also it’s vital to learn how to use the cleanup features in the Rokoko studio program. You’ll notice that every time he captures, Sam always goes through and adjusts lots of foot movement etc in the software. It really makes a big difference.
@@virtualfilmer thanks for your reply, I have the suit and gloves. I heard the coil pro is ONLY for the gloves and has little to no influence on the suit. I'll record a side by side comparison of my mocap recording and send it to them for help
@PainnGames The coil pro, you’re correct, is only for the gloves. However; once Rokoko studio “knows” where the gloves are, it really massively improves the suit in my opinion. I’ve seen a big difference. It’s not perfect but it’s good. I think inertial mocap suits always need a lot of cleanup. I use “Cascadeur” mostly for that, and it makes a big difference to the result.
thank you for your test! you are right the hand gesture looks creepy, I prefer to use the hand gesture library or puppet-like in Iclone. Also, the balance of the character while wavering looks bad. I think Rokoco is more into marketing their product than support and development, they should use AI to clean and balance the mocap like in Casscadeure
Hi Tobby. I participated in their kickstarter at the time and was able to buy a suit for $700. I find it extremely complex to implement (wifi connection is PITA). I have never managed to get a usable result. I posted a video on the Reallusion forum and Rokoko asked me to remove it. I have 2 Neuron mocap Gen1 suits and I am satisfied, however it still requires cleaning work.
Hello there, I am in the process of deciding if I should buy a rokoko or a perception neuron suit. Can you please elaborate on the part that it needs cleaning work? You mean it's jittery? Or it has other problems as well?
Have you looked at the electromagnetic interference at the place you're recording at? There's a video on the rokoko channel that recommends some apps on iphone and android and they recommend values < 4 on the unit the app uses. Apparently anything more than that and it starts messing with the IMUs of the suit.
@@npatch I tested the em but yeah it was aok. For me, the bottom line is that I didn’t understand how “approximate” intertial mocap is. It has no idea where you “are” in a space, it only knows the rotations of individual sensors. The rest is math. The Rokoko algorithm is fine but not great. It is trying hard to guess where the suit “is” but of course it’s only approximate; so it gets it wrong a lot.
@@virtualfilmer yeah. I think I heard somewhere are relative to router but I haven't verified it. That said, accuracy is the whole reason they added the coil pro. Also for interactions between multiple suits which seeingly have problems when touching (handshake) etc.
Exactly. I have the coil pro now (since I recorded the video) and I don’t know why my hands don’t “match” accurately for hand touch. They still don’t clap together accurately for example. And it doesn’t really help much with walking etc.
Did you contact rokoko? Because the demos they show, even the ones that were live streamed were very accurate. The only things I’d expect to have impact on this are the wifi not being wifi 6 and using the 5GHz band and then the interference. Otherwise I’d contact rokoko for support or even a refund in the coil.
Same problems with the legs... I've smarsuite pro 2 and gloves. Not bad as raw data, but a cleanup is really needed, maybe cascadeur it can help on this? Looking for an automatic cleanup solution.
@@elvismorellidigitalvisuala6211 Yes I’m learning Cascadeur indie to try to do that. It’s tough because part of the issue is the unnatural and random “leaning” of the characters. And there’s no easy fix for that because Cascadeur just tries to balance the character (auto physics rather than “fix” it :)
This really was to test body mocap. I am looking for any hints and tips? So far am not pleased with smartsuit pro 2 with walking or turning etc. Jerky and fake looking to me, for cinematics. See description for info.
Dont buy rokoko - it is one of the worst motion system on the market. If you buy - sell. Buy xens or perfeption neuron
Thank you for posting this test. When they stand still, the results are pretty neat. But you are right that, when they walk or turn, the results seem unusable (to me at least).
If the suit is showing 100% green indicators in Rokoko Studio, as you say in your description, there is nothing else you can do to fix this?
@@phoenixstudios7520 In Rokoko Studio turn off locomotion and the other filters, and you’ll see the core issue. The suit isn’t getting any data at all about movement in 3d space, it’s purely getting rotation data of the sensors. So it’s then using maths to figure out where the suit is in 3d space, and yeah it’s not… good. It’s better than nothing but not good. There are two options to improve it: option 1: you can get gloves and coil pro. The coil pro helps the math because it at least has a reference to where your hands are, but it’s still not amazing. Option 2: get a Vive tracker and base stations. but there’s no easy way to feed its 3d location and rotation into Rokoko studio. You have to make your own custom api program (!) to feed the location of the tracker in. And it only can be assigned to hip bone. Thats it.
@@virtualfilmer Thanks for this detailed reply. I am thinking about getting a rokoko smartsuit, but now I am having some doubts. Maybe its best to save some money and buy a more expensive suit
Rokoko is fantastic for single motions for games and short animations. I only have issues because I’m trying to record actual acting scenes. So check out all of Sam’s great Rokoko videos - and he shows off the suit etc, and if his recordings are enough for you then buy. They are great people and trying hard. And there’s nothing at this cheap price point that comes close. But yeah it’s not good for actual performance capture for dialogue scenes
@@virtualfilmer I want to make animated films using UE, so our purposes are similar. I need solid mocap performance. I actually think that, as AI suitless mocap is developing, suits will gradually become cheaper. Maybe I will wait a while and go with the flow.
Hey I just got my suit and its extremely bad. Did you find a solution? My legs drag, body shifts... almost like my character is stuck in mud / drunk
@@PainnGames The best thing to do is to make a video of the mocap you’re getting and contact support. They take a few days and are on Greek time (which from USA can be very frustrating) but it’s worth it to just step through it with them. It’s never going to be “perfect”, but definitely can be improved with their help. Do you have gloves and coil pro? Both are necessary for better results because then there is some sort of positioning for the maths to work from. (The suit otherwise is just using math to work out how you’re moving)
@@PainnGames also it’s vital to learn how to use the cleanup features in the Rokoko studio program. You’ll notice that every time he captures, Sam always goes through and adjusts lots of foot movement etc in the software. It really makes a big difference.
@@virtualfilmer thanks for your reply, I have the suit and gloves. I heard the coil pro is ONLY for the gloves and has little to no influence on the suit. I'll record a side by side comparison of my mocap recording and send it to them for help
@PainnGames The coil pro, you’re correct, is only for the gloves. However; once Rokoko studio “knows” where the gloves are, it really massively improves the suit in my opinion. I’ve seen a big difference. It’s not perfect but it’s good. I think inertial mocap suits always need a lot of cleanup. I use “Cascadeur” mostly for that, and it makes a big difference to the result.
@@virtualfilmer you export your "cleaned up" mocap animation from Rokoko to Cascadeur to further clean it up again?
thank you for your test! you are right the hand gesture looks creepy, I prefer to use the hand gesture library or puppet-like in Iclone. Also, the balance of the character while wavering looks bad. I think Rokoco is more into marketing their product than support and development, they should use AI to clean and balance the mocap like in Casscadeure
Hi Tobby. I participated in their kickstarter at the time and was able to buy a suit for $700.
I find it extremely complex to implement (wifi connection is PITA).
I have never managed to get a usable result. I posted a video on the Reallusion forum and Rokoko asked me to remove it.
I have 2 Neuron mocap Gen1 suits and I am satisfied, however it still requires cleaning work.
@@Tontonmarto I really love their gloves and I like the upper body mocap. I just wish the walking wasn’t so unnatural!
Hello there, I am in the process of deciding if I should buy a rokoko or a perception neuron suit. Can you please elaborate on the part that it needs cleaning work? You mean it's jittery? Or it has other problems as well?
Thanks for the sharing
Was this adjusted at all? If this was raw it’s okay. Some of it looks fine but there’s some “swooping” for sure
@@ryanisanart it was cleaned up in Rokoko studio using their filters (foot contact segments etc) but that’s all. it’s so jerky though, no?
lol the girl dragging her leg at the end was priceless.
Read your description, yes it looks very robotic at times.
Have you looked at the electromagnetic interference at the place you're recording at? There's a video on the rokoko channel that recommends some apps on iphone and android and they recommend values < 4 on the unit the app uses. Apparently anything more than that and it starts messing with the IMUs of the suit.
@@npatch I tested the em but yeah it was aok. For me, the bottom line is that I didn’t understand how “approximate” intertial mocap is. It has no idea where you “are” in a space, it only knows the rotations of individual sensors. The rest is math. The Rokoko algorithm is fine but not great. It is trying hard to guess where the suit “is” but of course it’s only approximate; so it gets it wrong a lot.
@@virtualfilmer yeah. I think I heard somewhere are relative to router but I haven't verified it. That said, accuracy is the whole reason they added the coil pro. Also for interactions between multiple suits which seeingly have problems when touching (handshake) etc.
Exactly. I have the coil pro now (since I recorded the video) and I don’t know why my hands don’t “match” accurately for hand touch. They still don’t clap together accurately for example. And it doesn’t really help much with walking etc.
Did you contact rokoko? Because the demos they show, even the ones that were live streamed were very accurate. The only things I’d expect to have impact on this are the wifi not being wifi 6 and using the 5GHz band and then the interference. Otherwise I’d contact rokoko for support or even a refund in the coil.
Same problems with the legs... I've smarsuite pro 2 and gloves.
Not bad as raw data, but a cleanup is really needed, maybe cascadeur it can help on this?
Looking for an automatic cleanup solution.
@@elvismorellidigitalvisuala6211 Yes I’m learning Cascadeur indie to try to do that. It’s tough because part of the issue is the unnatural and random “leaning” of the characters. And there’s no easy fix for that because Cascadeur just tries to balance the character (auto physics rather than “fix” it :)
@@virtualfilmer I see... ok let's see we we find a solution, if I find all post a video and tag you :)
Thanks!
😂😂 i cancelled my Rokoko order.