5 Personality Disorders That People Mistake For Narcissism
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DISCLAIMER: THIS INFORMATION IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR CLINICAL CARE. PLEASE CONSULT A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER FOR GUIDANCE SPECIFIC TO YOUR CASE. THIS VIDEO DISCUSSES NARCISSISM IN GENERAL.
THE VIDEO DOES NOT REFER TO ANY SPECIFIC PERSON, AND SHOULD NOT BE USED TO REFER TO ANY SPECIFIC PERSON, AS HAVING NARCISSISM. PERMISSION IS NOT GRANTED TO LINK TO OR REPOST THIS VIDEO, ESPECIALLY TO SUPPORT AN ALLEGATION THAT THE MAKERS OF THIS VIDEO BELIEVE, OR SUPPORT A CLAIM, THAT A SPECIFIC PERSON IS A NARCISSIST. THAT WOULD BE AN UNAUTHORIZED MISUSE OF THE VIDEO AND THE INFORMATION FEATURED IN IT.
One of the differences I've observed watching videos about personality disorders is that people with borderline often leave comments saying that they themselves suffer from BPD. Most of the comments on the videos about narcissism are from victims of narcissist abuse, not from narcissists themselves. There seems to be a self-awareness in people with borderline personality disorder that narcissistic people do not have.
Yup! Self awareness means you can take a step back and acknowledge your struggles, a.k.a accountability. Narcissist lack accountability, it's one of their major red flags.
Self awareness is super rare among narcissists. The malady that destroys the ability to diagnose it. Like a virus with protection from your immune system.
I think that's because people with BPD tend to have more erratic public behavior and get feedback. Narcs tend to be saints in the streets and monsters at home.
This is gonna be really controversial so, disclaimer, I'm not trying to be inflammatory - I think a lot of justifiably emotionally traumatised people are getting diagnosed with BPD that perhaps shouldn't be, too. I don't think psychiatrists are so great at differentiating between someone being thoroughly traumatised and "dysregulated". Everyone is dysregulated in a crisis. It really only holds up as a diagnosis if the behaviour is enduring, started early and someone still meets the criteria at their calmest of baselines.
I'm not trying to override your compliment towards those with BPD who are facing their problems or anything, far from it, but I do think there's a gap in understanding about long term emotional trauma that clinicians have a blind spot about. And patients themselves struggle to advocate for themselves after narcissistic abuse because they don't know which way is up by the time they're seeking help for suicidal ideation.
It might be because BPD is a much more treatable mental illness than NPD. BPD is very treatable just from learning how to process & react to your emotions properly.
The 5 PD are not Narcissism ==>
1) Borderline PD - 0:26
- 1:20 Abondenment is a major issue
- 1:54 Disturbance & Identity
- Instability & identity
- Impulsivity, Risk taking & Chronic Manifestations, Hostility & difficulty with anger management.
- Self-harm behaviour
- Very Strong Emotional Reactions
- 3:30 Transient Passing Stress PARANOID ideation
- 4:05 RELATIONSHIP (BPD with Narc Abuse)
- 5:51 Abondenment b/w BPD & Narc
- 8:08 Overlap (Narc with BPD)
- 10:38 (Narc + BPD) in the same person
- 11:51 Treatment of BPD
-------------------------------------------
2) Histrionic PD - 14:19
- Shallowness, Attention Seeking, Self-Dramatizing
- Very vulnerable & easily influenced on conspiracy
- Actually consider relationships to be Closer than they are
- Ego syntonic
- Overly concerned about other people & having poor boundries
- 18:16 Narcissism & HPD
- 19:20 Psychologically immature, Childish immature
- 20:34 Overlap (Narc Abuse & HPD) & as a Parent
- 23:39 RELATIONSHIP (Narc with HPD)
- 25:05 Treatment of HPD
-------------------------------------------
3) Passive Aggressive PD - 27:09
- 29:28 Covert Narcissism
( Grandiose & Malignant Narc - Actively Aggressive)
( Covert Narcissists is more - Passively Aggressive)
- Holding of Grudges
- 31:00 Oppositional Defiant Style,
Constant Argumentativeness &
Unwillingness to follow rules
- 31:21 Narc Abuse & PAPD
- 33:04 RELATIONSHIP with (Narc + PAPD)
- 36:04 Treatment
-------------------------------------------
4) Obsessive Compulsive PD - 36:46
- Workaholicism, Rigid Perfectionism, inflexibility, Narrow Emotional Expression & Difficulties establishing+maintaining close relationships, inflexible, inefficient, Mean, Cheap, Rigid, Controlling, Self-Righteous.. Stubborn
- Good in Sending Thanku notes, but Bad at Gratitude
- 38:33 OC personality v/s OC disorder
- 40:45 Associated with Morality, Values, Ethics & Completely inflexible, they may think Divorce is very wrong...
- Not able to through things out like Old Shoes, Clothes not becoz of Sentimental values but cheap
- Reluctant to delegate work to other people unless exactly
- Very very miserly with Money
- More short of Anxious Avoidant cluster of PD
- An Offensive kind of very difficult style & not made for relationships.
- 43:20 Overlap (Narc with OCPD)
(Self Righteous Narc & Neglectful Narc)
- Very very Controlling Parent
- Coldly Loyal as Family stick together as Rule
- Judgement on spending
- Gaslighting, Manipulation, invalidation & frightening rage
- 56:38 RELATIONSHIP (OCPD with Narc)
- 58:19 Treatment
-------------------------------------------
5) Difference b/w Narcissism & NPD - 58:59
-------------------------------------------
Wow, Great job! Thank you so much
Thank you for taking detailed notes ✍
Very helpful, thanks! 👍
Thank you. I was diagnosed OCD once year's and year's ago. I had very strict religious parents and religious teachings.
❤❤
My mom taught me to love myself and is always supportive of my emotions. Thanks mom.
My mother is a psychopath.
@@No-xs1no
It takes a Psychiatrist to diagnose so unless you are one?
Sometimes people can feel resentful if their mother knows something they don't .....
@@nicolemurphy2629 Yes, she knows how to manipulate people.
What a brilliant & informative video
I especially enjoyed the conclusion described in simple grounded terms, so helpful to survivors of narcissistic abuse , while being labelled and conditioned for years for being "mental cases"
It can be so easy to have been influenced by some/many of those diagnoses.
Your conclusion is clearly very grounding & redirects ones thoughts /mindsets we are survivors while suffering the consequences from these toxic entanglements . You have relayed the message to remove the many labels hammered home by narcissistic people 🎉
❤
I have a borderline friend and I told her she is her own worst enemy and needs to get help, which she did. It hasn’t changed a whole lot but at least she is aware of her behavior. I hold her accountable and will not listen to her blame others for her problems. I do not coddle her or sympathize with her because I love her. I was willing to lose her as long as she got help to stop destroying her life and relationships.
She's lucky to have you!
Well done! I tried the same with my borderline friend and she dropped me as a friend! The abandonment obsessed person did that! Rather than be held accountable in any way. I thought maybe, even though it was for all the wrong reasons, maybe it would be empowering for her but unfortunately I was wrong. She decided to be friends with a narcissist we both new instead! Guess how that went for her
Reminds me of Proverbs 27: 6 Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful.
So glad she listened to you. It’s usually not the case.
She probably comes from a broken home
Everyone thinks differently
I use the term sneaky aggressive instead of passive aggressive. Their gremliny delight at getting under your skin in a way they think they can't be called on is similar to the narc smirk. At their worst, they are utterly grotesque to be around.
Sneaky and evil go together.
the sadistic part.
flying gremlins..
Yes! That's a great way to describe it. It sneaks up out of nowhere when suddenly they are bored or annoyed for no reason with your presence. And they will make a surprising rude or hurtful comment and await your reaction. Definitely spooky! 😮
Grumpy Grumblekins🙂
I have Borderline and my ex husband is a covert narcissist. I was diagnosed with it a few weeks ago. He abandoned me after 30 years of marriage and i was so traumatized I almost took my life. I also have plugged into the Seattle Narcissistic group which you have spoken on Zoom. Between Therapy, my group and you Im finally healing. Thank you so much.
You're really brave ❤
If you understand your diagnosis your comment would read much differently. You cannot deny that you likely had a hand in the destruction of your marriage regardless if he is a narcissist in your opinion. A symptom of BPD is not taking accountability and blaming others for their problems such as claiming the person they are angry with are the ones with a defect. I am not trying to be mean and I’m not talking from inexperience, I’m trying to get you to look in the mirror the way I had to have my friend do. That’s the only way you will be able to fight through this affliction. Don’t let this disorder lie to you. You are a good person that was dealt a bad hand but you can beat it if you try. Dialectal Behavior Therapy (DBT) and Cognitive Behavior Therapy (CBT) are highly effective and I recommend asking your therapist about that. Im sorry if you think I am attacking you, this comes from a place of love. I want you to take an active approach to this and reclaim your life. I’ve seen it work, you can do this.
Stay strong, you will feel better with time
The work you’re doing is awesome! Did you see the professional for awhile before you got the diagnosis? Does it feel fitting to you? I have CPTSD and one person diagnosed me with BPD on the first session. They have similar behaviors, but I didn’t have it. I’m sorry you’ve endured this! Much healing and strength! ❤️
Because my mother is a covert narcissist, I think that caused me to subconsciously gravitate towards people with personality disorders for a lot of my life, both partners and friends. I eventually reached a point where I will not let people with personality disorders into my life. I have a lot of empathy for people with BPD because I had several friends who were officially diagnosed with it and I saw the turmoil they went through, but ultimately all of those friendships ended with them going off on me for some perceived slight and then never speaking to me again. I need relationships where I can trust that the emotional bond won't be nuked at the drop of a hat.
Same story. Borderline/narcissistic mom, and covert narcissistic dad. I attracted a lot of toxic people because it's all I know. Toxic family systems set their children up to accept bad behavior and call it love.
I’m hard core. Life is too short to be drawn in to the personality disorder whirlpool. Doesn’t matter what it is, the same shit (behaviours, non-learning, blaming, instability etc.) just goes on for as long as you continue to be “in relationship.” The cray cray whirlpool just sucks everything down that gets caught in its current.
My mom def has BPD with narc traits and yeah I have definitely dated my fair share of unstable girls. My sister also has a lot of friends who are bipolar and potentially borderline. My mom can go from being the most empathetic and caring person in the world to a gaslighting monster that manipulates eveeryone around her to screw over whoever didn't do what she wanted. I know 2 Borderlines who are very self aware and I have a lot of respect for them but I do feel nervous around them none the less.
If they are able to seek treatment, DBT + bipolar medications is basically a cure with a 75% success rate. The problem is, people with cluster b personality disorders have a really hard time seeking help.
@@younce-davis952 Yeah and she goes to therapy to lie to basically prove she’s normal. She’s always bragging about how her past therapist said there was nothing wrong with her yeah because she lies. It’s funny if someone is in therapy chances are they don’t have NPD or BPD
My mom was dead on what you describe as histrionic and I married a narcissist who I have to try to co-parent with. It’s exhausting to deal with these types of people. I no longer have a relationship with my mom but have to have a relationship with my ex. I’m just so tired of it all and am counting the days until my son is 18 and I don’t have to parent with my ex anymore. It feels like I’m in prison some days.
I was in that Narcissistic prison bubble for 15 years. My youngest son is only 14 now living with my X Cop/Narcissist. He's fed up with his antics, but I'm up against a "Disabled" Army, now Cop and a Narcissist, to get him back. 😢
For many years when I lived with and around my immediate family, I was pinned with having Chronic Depression and Borderline Characteristics. I didn't want to die, but I knew I didnt want to be around the environment. Outside of being around my family environment, I felt calm. So...Right before my father passed away at 80 years of age, he told me my mother had made his life a living hell. I didnt understand what he meant. After he was gone, I finally got to see and experience how horrible being around my mother and brother could be. I learned that she and my older brother were narcissists, so I went no contact. Voila! All those chronic depression and borderline characteristics went away. I hope people who live with narcissists don't get misdiagnosed and medicated if they don't need it. I hope they get away so they can heal from the abuse and finally get to know themselves.
Thank you for sharing this. It is helpful to me.
I wondered about the close proximity effect. I have recently discovered my ex is a covert narc, which lead to my mother being realized a narc, and how I’ve been judged and incorrectly labeled pretty much my whole life. I’m 50. But somehow, even though my reactions to them seemed borderline, I now realize I’m right, and normal. I believe myself to be balanced mentally and emotionally, but because of my reactions to them, made them think I had some disorder. My mother just claimed I have ADHD and that’s why bla, bla ,bla. Now I laugh at her obvious narcissistic trait of gaslighting and control issues.
I think because I did some heavy soul searching in high school, and made a claim to who I wanted to be regardless of everyone else, I’m able to address this a whole lot easier and come to more confident conclusions.
This is what we need to be mentoring our newest generations on. Asking them who do you want to be in life, and how will you do that?
I completely agree with you. In my experience, clinicians don't properly understand how to investigate abuse in a person's life, the background radiation of trauma as it were. So, it's easy to say "this is pervasive in your life over time, therefore it's a personality disorder" but it's also possible (and highly likely) what you have is a person with no social or emotional skills because it was withheld from them in childhood, getting triggered all the time because of still being around their toxic family or going from one controlling significance other to another. Or barring that, a boss. It's very rare for someone to have no boss, no siggo, and no family contact at the same time.
I recently went no contact with my family, left the medical system, and finally got a non toxic work environment, and all the BPD symptoms went away over about six months. They came back as soon as the work station turned toxic (uncovered financial Malpractice, fun fun). It definitely seems like a part of my brain is shut down now and that's where the splitting, paranoia, and inability to connect comes from. The abandonment comes from not having your needs heard and the despair comes from being stuck in the situation because it's hidden and your self esteem is tanking. Eventually anger because there's nothing left but pain and suffering. Suicidality because of the suffering seeming endless. It's not rocket science, but most people who haven't experienced it just don't get it and pathologize it instead.
I'd love to see a therapist explain what a normal person is and does, that would be much more helpful than just explaining why everyone is wrong. Can't really make a road map to success unless I know what I'm aiming for. And I think that's where life coaches are really capturing the market.
Psychology cares about making the population controllable. Social workers care about making the population able to access resources to care for itself. Life coaches care about getting people well adjusted and happy. I think all three disciplines could learn a lot from each other and wish they would talk more.
My husbands son got diagnosed with BPD, schizophrenia and a lot more. Last year he committed suicide at 21 years. Something that his covert narc makes full use of. Perfect situation to be the victim. His outbursts and passive aggressiveness have worsened and I'm broken down and traumatized. I'm about to leave because I'm not going to go the same way as my son.
@@christopherbrubaker2070 thank you so much for sharing this. Currently 27 realizing that I have been exposed to this same environment. So happy you were able to get out. Take care out there ❤
THANK YOU! I’m so sick of seeing everyone claiming everyone is a narcissist 🙄🙄
I really like your channel and I’ve been watching for a couple years.
I was married to a woman later diagnosed as a psychopath. She faked having BPD to enable and excuse her toxic and manipulative behavior. It worked, because any time she was called on her behavior, she would play the victim card. "How dare you criticize me for my bad actions. I am the poor, sick individual. Do you think I WANT to behave badly? You are cruel and uncaring for even suggesting that. I am the one who is suffering here."
You say "was" so I'm glad you're out. What's the most upsetting thing is that people often believe the manipulation.
I have BPD. I can't stand being seen as parallel with NPD. I just got out of a narcissistic abusive relationship. I have graduated DBT and I go over my DBT skills regularly. It really does help along with meds. I just practice practice practice my skills and it really does help. I now have more clear boundaries and display less symptoms.
I’m so happy to hear you did CBT and DBT!!! It’s the BEST form of treatment for BPD, I’ve seen it work. It sounds like you are very self aware, even when it hurts to face it. If you don’t know Jesus I recommend you give Him a call, He is The Great Physician. And he will bear your burdens if you give them to Him. Lots of love from MN. -Rachel
@@Saltine_American I'm in MN too!
Apparently BPD-NPD relationships are common.
There are four kinds of BPD, the most common and extreme one has a lot in common with NPD. That's a fact, no matter what you feel about it. Good that you're taking responsibility for your BPD though, Borderlines do so much damage to other people when they don't take responsibility for themselves. I mean, they do damage anyway, but at least a little less.
As someone abused by a borderline PD person I fully commend you for trying hard using an effective method. Good for you! It also proves to me that my abuser had a choice and chose evil.
Wow! The description of the OCPD person was a person I worked with. She made me so exhausted that I went to counseling over it. I was an independent contractor and she still wanted to control every little thing. The place where we worked had to be organized but she wanted the place looking like a showroom ALL THE TIME. The thing that stood out was one day I was going into a room with a client to do an esthetic treatment and I moved a jar with product closer to me so I wouldnt have to walk back and forth. To me it was common sense, and for efficiency. She told me to please put the jar back in its place and said that when she works she keeps the jar in its place and goes back and forth. On that day, I just agreed with her and put the jar back, but when she left the area, I closed the door and moved the jar close to me. I didnt work there long. I was exhausted working there. I ended up quitting and I no longer needed the counseling. My unnecessary stress went away.
I also think I have worked with some OCPD people, and they are ridiculously tiring, possibly even toxic to someone younger or with less confidence. Glad you recognized it and knew when to walk away!
Yes, they literally make you tired! At some point in adulthood, I learned to shrug my shoulders and show them I don't value their opinion by displaying what I call "active neutrality". It might be a term already, but I think you might understand - just relaxing, doing the work effectively without any regard to their "corrections" (unless they're actually correct, of course) and refusing to let other people dictate your day (within reason). @@katie4408
@katie4408 I was 20 years older, but she was the owner of the establishment. She stressed me out even more because she had no humility. She had narcissistic vibes. The day after my last day, and I had said goodbye to her and had even given her a hug, she called me to ask me if I had broken into her business that night. You see they had treatment rooms and one was to sit and get oxygen from a machine. She said the room looked like it had been used.
That is how they infuriate you. I called her husband to ask what happened. He was a police officer and I belive he knew that she was obsessive. I told him I left yesterday and was sitting in peace in my living room thinking I never had to deal with that again, and she called me to ask me that. He reassured me that I didn't have to worry about anything and to continue to have my peace. She was a nutcase, and I'm using that term because of the frustration she would cause. She really lived in her own strange obsessive world.
One thing that people also mistake for narcissism upon first meeting someone is certain symptoms of autism. Because we don't show emotions appropriately, we may struggle with empathy and we can come across as narcissistic when we talk about special interests because we seem like know it alls.
I was never diagnosed but I've come to realize I probably have mild autism, I have to effort into feeling empathy, and I am a know it all lol, never been accused of being narcissistic though.
Have we met? Lol I've had this happen more than once. Apparently, you have to stay on the speaker's topic instead of sharing a personal anecdote to show understanding.
@paulmryglod4802 ohmygosh. 100% It's so hard. For the longest I thought that was what I was supposed to do after a conversation pause- respond with a personal anecdote to show understanding. Ugh. Apparently not.
@@berlingolingofulI agree. It’s very hard, and sometimes when I’m with other autistic people it actually is fine to empathise by swapping anecdotes.
@@berlingolingofulwait thats what happened to my long talks w friends?! 🤭 I was relating but I do see how that may be seen as making it about me. Today years old when I learned the pause doesn’t mean insert understanding… just an ok/oh 🥰 thanks guys
1:01:24 - omg this laundry list of narcissism is spot on
"It is: Lack of empathy, grandiosity, entitlement, arrogance, superficiality, chronic egocentricity, admiration and validation seeking, envy, incapacity for intimacy and instead exploiting and using people in relationships. It's disregulated anger, it's the two faces - the validation-seeking face in public and the abusive one in private. That's narcissism."
You're right. It's contempt! He holds everyone in contempt. He/she wants us to be aware of the contempt they have for all of us. Narcissists want us to feel it on a very deep level. I'm still having trouble wrapping my head around the narcissist selfishness and self - absortion.
For years and years I thought we were going to make progress. Not anymore. I really really woke up. How could I not see that she never once hugged me, no kisses, never ever an I'm sorry, constant lies, bashing me to anyone who will listen, etc etc etc. I thought I knew she was ill, but you really don't understand until you Wake Up. It is a very odd place to be mentally when you finally wake up. It's actually astonishing that I was so dumb for 60 years. I don't have money for therapy and I know for a fact I wouldn't have woke up fully without Dr Ramani. Bless you Doctor...
You weren’t dumb. Don’t judge yourself harshly. Seek support. Wishing you all the best.
@@marcirobins5144 it made me easily handle toxic people now. It’s the nice comments that make me fall apart. For example, yours made me cry… still…
Same position...
One day you realise you never knew the person.
For 10 years, I've struggled with a very toxic relationship. I can't even remember me before her. Now, with all the abuse I've endured, 've got some inner work.
Dr Ramani, brillantly identifies with clarity.
She deserves a nobel peace prize.
@@sherriflemming3218she's a troll
I'm going to preemptively state that my strategy is to stay away from them all. I don't trust them. Yes, I spend the majority of time alone and that's fine with me. I realized that if they don't want help, they're going to resent me no matter what I do.
Now, I'll watch the very informative video.
Some people won't get that, and that's their prerogative. I absolutely get what you are saying. Being alone doesn't always mean lonely. You're not introverted are you?
@@oneofthegoodonesok I'm introverted now, after being abused by every sort of narcissist and those with the conditions Dr. Ramini describes in this video. I used to be outgoing, but now I can only spend about 5 minutes in conversation before I'm ready to be alone again. I don't go to events or crowded places if I can help it.
Fair play to you, being alone rather being driven nuts ✌
I have found being given a diagnosis of mixed Personality Disorder, mainly BPD has been a mix of benefits and disadvantages. I am frustated that when I initially was given a diagnosis, the mental health professionals involved didn't explain my diagnosis nor giving me further information and education about it. I feel they basicly passed the buck back to my primary care GP and voluntary sector services. It is a mistake not to educate people who want to improve and manage their health, relationships and life.
For people reading this who may be in a relationship with a person suffering a Persnality Disorder, please support us wisely. Don't try to rescue us and don't try to fix us. We are only going to grow by learning to manage our emotions, our problems and our lives ourselves.
Thank you for taking the time to read this.
Agree. So what do we do?
@@mikimiki6202 I think educating yourself about personality disorders generally and what may have cause them, having firm, reasonable boundaries and respecting our autonomy. While it is fine to offer some support in the way of guidance if it has been requested, I have had people giving me unsolicited advice which wasn't in any way constructive.
However I also advise not putting up with abusive behaviours from anyone and protecting yourself from anyone who is being abusive.
I hope this has been useful and thank you for asking.
@amac2573 I understand where it comes from, but I can't change his past. This gentleman believes it's everyone's fault. I can't get him to therapy 😪 and I truly worry for his safety. He's pushed everyone in his life away. I'm all that's left, and he's trying hard to get me to leave without saying it, already making himself the victim. I married him, I don't want to abandon him
@@mikimiki6202 Very difficult!!! I am trying to think.
I am going to assume he was abused, responsible for that lies with the person and people who abused him. It is their fault he is suffering. It is not fair to blame or expect other people who weren't involved in the abuse and didn't know that the abuse was happening to be responsible.
By not taking responsibility now for managing the effects the abuse has had on his life and how it is damaging him and his life, he is abandoning himself particularly the child he once was and is still carrying deep inside himself (his inner child).
People can be so afraid to ask for proper support and professional help because they are deeply afraid to confront and deal with the pain, also that it may confirm their deepest fears about themselves.
Someone has to want to go to therapy for themselves, because they see and know the damage that staying stuck, blaming and fault finding in other people is doing to their lives and to the relationships they have with those people they love. He is trying to protect himself which is understandable and natural, but it is actually hurting him because his behaviours are going to cause people to abandon him unless he looks and deals with what is happening for him.
You can only support him so much, he is an adult and responsible for himself and the choices he now makes. He didn't have a choice as a child.
@amac2573 he seems to blame his mother for everything. She didn't know. Dad's friend. We all pay, he rages at everyone, and one by one, they check out of his life.
Bipolar, borderline and even autism. But some disorders can be comorbid as well.
Why bipolar? It's not a personality disorder. No hate, just confused:D
exactly 💯 very common for comorbidity
@@evagabrysova8871mood shifts
@@evagabrysova8871Symptoms and presentation of Bipolar, BPD and CPTSD can be very similar. That is why some mental health professionals may take a while before they make a decision about someone's diagnosis.
Absolutely 💯
Yep the golden child is taking care of both parents now! Lots of manipulation and I see through it all! Been aware of IT since 4 years old! I’m the scapegoat wanted to help them come out of it! It puts me in danger.
I never thought of my sociopathic sister as being passive-aggressive before, but OMG did you ever describe her.
Dr. Ramani is brilliant.
Whew, one of their most subtle characteristics…
Sociopaths aren't passive-aggressive. They are only aggressive never passive. They don't back down, they act up.
My covert narc wife gave passive aggression a new name. She was so PASSIVE aggressive that I didn't notice it for literally years. It was so well hidden and the few times I caught on and brought it up she gaslighted me into submission. These people are actually terrifying.
You are doing a very important job educating innocent people and raising their awareness of the danger posed by these toxic people. I have been told to take a compassionate attitude toward all evildoers, but I have the right to put up a barrier and protect my own peace.
Read the article Compassion hurts.
Yes you do! We don’t have magic wands to “fix” anyone. And it’s *EXHAUSTING* dealing with. Sometimes you have to step away!
Histrionic Personality Disorder really does need to remain in the DSM…
With today’s social media, one can easily identify those who suffer from HPD.
It really isn’t a normal behavior to be honest.
If they don’t get the attention they seek from being exhibitionistic, it messes with their psyche.
There’s other examples but it needs to stay on the DSM…
If it’s taken away then people will view it as normal character.
I always thought my X was BPD, a covert narcissist, or some combination of both. But he was dx with Histrionic PD. If they take it away from the DSM, what would the new dx be?
Also, “narcissistic light” doesn’t fit. He was very abusive in many ways. There was nothing “light” about it.
I think histrionic is a flavour of narcissism.
Finally a video that makes sense. That word, Narcissist, is used often by lay people that are not mental professionals. That you for this video, the end is very telling.
My sister has either bipolar or borderline. She can apologize, genuinely mean it, feel bad about it, and try to fix it by putting in effort. She has never disrespected me, or my kids by calling us names, putting us down, belittling us etc. she is suicidal, she does have mood swings that are drastic, and cuts people off when they did nothing to her. I love her so damm much, I wish she got the help she needs, but she truly believes she can heal herself and fix herself without support. I don’t think the same way, I do believe she needs psychological help, but she refuses help, so I had to cut her off. I couldn’t sit back and continue to see her risk her health, her life, and lose respect for herself the way she was anymore. It hurt more to be present in her life and witness the choices she was making, and hear how low she spoke of herself. No matter what I said to her, no matter what compliments I gave her and help and support I offered, it was never enough or she wouldn’t accept any of it. I tried protecting her the best I could, I tried helping her to the best of my ability, but she wouldn’t cut off my mom like I was able to. I tried telling her we could live together, on our own, and just leave everyone behind, and she agreed but then backed out last minute. Hopefully when she gets older and gets help, we can come together again.
In the beginning of my husband and i relationship, I had to tell him that I wasn’t being silent to hurt him, that’s just the way I processs things. Being silent was a trigger for him because of growing up with his malignant adoptive grandma. And in my household growing up we didn’t talk about our feelings so I internalize things inside where it’s safe. My mom/ sister always had the notion of acting like hey everything’s fine everything’s fine let’s just sweep everything under the rug lol
Thanks for sharing. I suffer BPD, and all of my realtionships were with NPD. The last one coast me retraumatisation so hard that I lost myself. My rage is inward, toxic shame, no self easteem, emptiness, and empathy and super explanation for others. My mother is NPD, and I have a lot of NPD traits, but the only difference is that I have empathy, and early seraching for psychological help scence teenage, because I was suicidal each time I had broken relationship, and the only thing that brought me there was that Im crazy and that something is wrong with me. No grandiosity in a good scence. When I was broken from the last relationship there was no medications for me, I was only worse and worse. Only therapy that helped me is deep trauma work, because in my personal expirience BPD is acting out of CPTSD. And I hope that DSM will change a narative about disorder in general and to treat trauma and not behaviour. Our nervous system only knows what it knows, and in BPD it was somehow childhood abondonment. Many people have sexual abuse in the early childhood. Also many people have one of the parents who have full blown NPD. I have hope. And I want to say thank you for sharing so much support. Wish you thw best dr Ramani.
You just described my sibling. He made himself the executor and the trustee. I had to get an lawyer to protect myself. I couldn't believe someone could be so cruel and hateful.
Exactly what happened tp me. Only I didn't fight my brother on anything. I just didn't have the strength.... good for you for getting a lawyer and standing your ground.
Btdt with 2 Nazi bros. They lost the remnant of my inheritance.
Now, I have to get a lawyer so I don't lose my 1/4 of some property before the oldest, now, loses that, too.
I have BPD and tend to get sucked into narcissisticly abusive relationships because both my parents are narcissists. It's my worst fear to be a narcissist. This explains the difference and describes my experience exactly. I know I am not a narcissist because I do have extreme empathy that can make me vulnerable to narcissistic people and I question myself. Narcissists don't have strong empathy, nor do they question themselves or their own motives. BPD and Narcissist abuse is truly dangerous like you said. This should be discussed more often so that people can detect the signs and possibly avoid or intervene if necessary. It's not just dangerous for the individuals in the toxic relationship, but everyone around.
One of my exes was a grandiose narcissist with a passive-aggressive style. This is probably an unusual combination and was it ever confusing!
I’d be curious to hear you talk more about co dependency
I also have had passive aggressive friends. This leads to covert narcissism. And abusive negative behavior. I def felt more isolated as a result of this too. Multiple people I knew were like this. I’m glad it’s a I knew although those relationships weren’t all bad.
Thank you so much for doing this! There’s nothing worse than being told “what your problem is,” by someone who has no idea! ❤
Best Video Yet, and I listen every day. Smart Woman, I hope she continues to educate, give insight, give real attention and help others with her experiences, education, support and advice for the ones that are trying to learn about themselves and others. Thank you, Dr. Ramani
I also think the BPD is wayyy over diagnosed. It seems to be the modern version of "hysteria." When I would say half the time it comes from trauma & is symptom of the way society functions.
or, bpd is a trauma response, and the fact that people are pathologized and medicated, instead of the reasons for those trauma responses being addressed (rampant narcissism everywhere), is why there are so many people with bpd, why it functions as a hysteria diagnosis. hysteria was a real medical condition, its not that those women werent hysterical, but the diagnosis ignores the reason: they were hysterical because their husbands were drunk all the time, beating them, gaslighting them, r@ping them, etc.
Thank you, thank you, thank you Dr. Ramani! I was diagnosed with BPD at 23, and have been so afraid I might also be a narcissist; I've had family members tell me I was, unfortunately.
Within 2 minutes of this video I understood the difference, thank you SO MUCH for what you do.
For anyone with BPD, there is tons of hope! I have been in therapy for over a year now, and DBT group for months. The information from DBT has been more valuable to my life than any other experience I've had.
Never give up!
Thank you for this video, and for giving so many examples with the different personality types as well as the personality disorders. This is exceptionally helpful to clear those muddied waters from the misuses of those terms. I have a lot more realization of what these really are now rather than just what some people say or post about.
I really appreciate how you spoke on narcissist symptoms and BPD coexisting. I get really, well... triggered, by being called a narcissist because I know that I am not motivated to intentionally hurt others like a narcissist would and to think that the way I'm acting is similar to that is painful to comprehend because it would be the last thing I'd ever want to do. From what I've learned over the years, we often take on the traits of those who abused us and I think it feeds our negative self-talk and shame to think that we could ever exhibit those behaviors when we swore we would never be like those people. It's hard to come to terms with, but possible for the person with BPD to see their actions and feel intense self-hatred for acting that way - which can sometimes make us act out even more in that self-hatred and trying to downplay what symptoms from our narcissist abuser we have adopted or learned. I for one have been incredibly thankful to learn the names of these things so I can identify them within myself to work on them as they arise... and arise... and arise...
OMGoodness! Years ago in a psych class I remember a teacher saying that when she began her course work to become a psychologist, she identified with all the behaviors she was studying. LOL this is how I feel today as I listen to Dr. Ramani who is incredibly articulate! 😊 I've been seriously attempting to find a psychoanalyst to assess me, now that I've completed as much self analysis as possible on myself. Yet, I truly do not think that we can ever stop growing - as old as we become. I suppose the bottom line question is, how defensive am I?
I do believe that we must learn to accept all the positive sides and the negative sides of ourselves...and be willing to continue to improve the negatives that interfere with our personal lives.
Dr RAMANI,
You have such a likeable and genuine personality. I wish the world had more of your compassion and true kindness. Thank you for your beautiful heart and wisdom. God bless you!
Thank u....it wasn't until the clarity at the very end speaking into narcissistic personality traits vs disorder & the fact that it's not diagnosable....that I was relieved to have listened to the whole lecture....cause it was a lot. It is a powerful word & ur clarity & depth surrounding it & the traits associated with it are super helpful. I very much appr3ciate when pros call out bogus-Ness online...we can all get caught in these traps & I'm thankful you spoke into this:)
I learned to keep my distance from the disturbing sight of my friend's ex overbearing,psychological abuse of her in public. The thought of her not being able to find her way is so sad!
This is the best video I've watched I now completely understand why I was diagnosed with BPD cluster b,3. Thank you 🙏. In the end it's just a way I ended up with dealing with life after 5 suicide attempts 20 years ago . But, not all of the personal traits fit . I feel much better about myself now. All started with being surrounded by narcissistic people from a young child
I experienced a narcissistic abuse and had bpd. But the worst part is she manipulated the situation and claimed that i self harm with the intention to control her. Im so thankful to my therapist that im recovering well now
I'm learning a tremendous amount from you!! Thank you for the thorough and easy to understand explanations.
I was never involved with any of these disorders. Nor do I have any of these disorders.
Some say autistic ppl are similiar to narcissist personality disorder, however not all autistic ppl are like narcissist. You might gey some ppl with autism that share similar traits to npd. However, I have autism but I have good cognitive empathy levels. I'm definitely not self-centred, and I'm not arrogant. We, as autistic ppl, aren't perfect. But some ppl with autism like myself are very caring and thoughtful.
Dr ramani has a video explaining how autistic people are not narcissists. I see a lot of autistic people online talking about how they are genetically superior to neurotypical people and that makes me wonder if they’ve heard of the nazi regime. It’s really uncool. But because autistic people have been so mistreated perhaps they’re just trying to compensate or fight back.
I think the main reason ppl call autistic ppl narcissists is because our empathy is not obvious or expressed the same as everyone else... so they ASSume we dont have any at all 🤦♀️
Also, in some countries they call narcissistic thought "autistic thought". Its horribly deceiving and confusing to use that term in such a manner, but its not supposed to mean the same as ASD. They should come up with a new term for narc thoughts.
I'd like to see a video by Dr Ramani about the differences. I'm a late diagnosed autistic in my 40s who has suffered narcissistic abuse from my childhood and through all three of my relationships, the most significant of which has just discarded me, partly because of my recent diagnosis. I have always been very empathetic, painfully so sometimes, and I think my empathy is a big draw for narcissists, as I seem to be surrounded by them and have only discovered this (and all the damage they are inflicting on me) since my diagnosis.
Some people with ASD try to hide their challenges with communicating empathy, their need for anxiety management using special interests, and other ASD traits by attacking others using manipulative narcissistic traits. If you are honest about the challenges that ASD presents, get help in managing them, and are astute in identifying NPD traits and don’t allow them into your relationships, you won’t be mistaken as a narcissist.
@silverriver7866 I was interested more in the effects of narcissistic abuse on people such as myself and if there's any difference in the advice we should take for healing. I have met autistic people whose behaviours are wrongly seen as narcissistic, and even a couple of people where ASD and narcissism are both present, but I have strived all my life to be a good, kind, empathetic person, often to my own detriment.
My favorite, probably the smartest woman I’ve ever heard in the world! Thank you again thank you thank you thank you thank you!❤
Loved, loved, loved learning these differences! Thanks for your knowledge and expertise on this topic. I cant wait to learn more.😉👍♥️
Thank you so much for sharing the information in such easy way to understand and follow. It helps to deal with understanding self and other people around you. Love watching your clips.
Oh, Dr. Ramani! I have watched every video you’ve made since your channel came across my path at least 3 years ago. You have taught me so much about NPD (of course!). THIS one comparing and contrasting all the personality disorders is taking my breath away!! Thank you so much!!
Yes, this video is very educating to the details that only a researcher and a clinical experience of her caliber can point out. These comparisons and interactions are so deep and enlightening. I happened to know a person of pure Borderline traits and I easily related to Dr. RAMANI's statements. I was waiting for a video that would point out that the popular understanding and the blanket attribution of all behavioral traits to NP is overly stated and inaccurate. Dr. R went far and beyond of what I expected. Our hats off to all these psychologists and authors with clinical experience, researchers and PhD or PsyD level of education and knowledge that help us appreciate and understand this wonderful science of psychology, the study of human soul!
I waited long for this video not only for the BP part but also for the OCPD part, and it's entirety for the HPD, the Passive Aggressive behavior and Dr R very teaching comment between NP and NPD. She tells us to be serious, respectful, and accurate, not to use psychological terms as insults and put downs of other people. Last but not least, Dr.Ramani's facial expressions show her seriousness, knowledge, and relation to human suffering and pain. She has even more of my respect and admiration after this video. Thank you, Dr.
And thanks to you, Nancy, for your wonderful comment that gave me the incentive to reply and say what I thought. Dr R touched us both and you touched me by bringing your thoughts to this public forum. What a great place to be😊
This is why your videos have become so important for me. Your teaching so I can understand
Thirty years ago I walked away from a narcissist with a healthy touch of OCPD with almost nothing. But I had a great career, and am now very happily remarried. Your videos have taught me soooo much, explaining my family of origin and the one sibling who is determined to either control me or destroy me. Blessed with two very loving and supportive siblings, plus my daughter and grandchildren. The information you have given me helps me to navigate all relationships with opened eyes. I used to be the eternal optimist and very gullible. Not anymore! Blessings and love, Dr. Ramani!
Emotional dysregulation is definitely an issue of mine I have to work on.
I have never been diagnosed with NPD or Borderline. But have been diagnosed with major depression. My depression is in remission now, and I able to function reasonably well with meditation, prayerfulness (with or without a spiritual object), and habit changing. It's a process, and not a process where the focus is not measuring up to an unmet ideal. Yet, it is simultaneously a matter of raising my standards, and embracing that they are my standards FIRST, rather than to be SO subject to introjects.
I was diagnosed with BPD when I was 23 and CBT and DBT have helped me so, so much. My ex husband of 10 years is a narcissist and it was incredibly toxic. I left 7 months ago and I’m so much healthier. Thank you, Dr. Ramani, for helping me learn how to process this. I still cry a ton and am struggling to ever imagine being in love again, but I’m finally understanding what I have gone through so that I do not get into another toxic relationship in the future. I plan to be single for a couple of years.
Congrats for your progress and deciding to stay alone for a while until you feel aware and strong. Ty for sharing your fear that may not be able to love again soon. It is bold to acknowledge fear on your part, but you will overcome. You are a strong person.
@@dpetinatos omg thank you so much 🥹🙏
Thankyou Dr Ramini for this immensely informative video. I now understand that my husband has OCPD and NPD.
That closing speech was Olympic Gold. God bless you a million times, Dr Ramani!
OMG It’s the first time I hear about OCPD 😮my ex was that! He said he had OCD but it was nothing like it, this makes so much sense! Wow you’re great Dr Ramani I admire you so much 😊
The thing about interpersonal relationships wow that’s totally it
I finally learned the difference between OCD and OCPD. My friend's ex was definitely OCPD. She claimed to be OCD but I thought she was a narcissist with her gaslighting, triangulation, perfectionism, coldness, mocking and putting others down, etc. Those OCPD characteristics fit her very well.
Thank you so much for describing these symptoms of BPD because I don't understand the difference between narcissism and BPD sometimes if I get triggered. I have friends who have BPD and would love to be able to recognize what is going on before I respond.
Thank you for this exceptional explanation. It has helped me tremendously to understand the dynamics and overlap of some family members behaviors and personalities and that all the therapy in the would wouldn’t change them so nothing I say will either (which I already knew but it is reassuring to hear from a professional). It is such a relief and makes my journey of forgiveness to achieve personal wellness and happiness easier. Thank you again for all of your wonderful videos.
I had an acquaintance of my mother approach us out of the blue at a store and she gushed that my mother was the sweetest woman in the world. The punch line was along the "but you know that" variety. Shocked me somewhat speechless knowing my mother's tendency to be something of a victim narcissist and my living on the inside where all that woe-is-me and judgmental scorn at current events gets expressed. Outwardly my mother was trained by her parents to be cordial with strangers and cultivated that style it to appear, I guess, Southern "sweet" but also kept that front up to work for people and at the same time get to tell stories and get validation to her viewpoint in the stories from her clients. One quirk has always been my mother breaking out into a "thank you" to people she talks to for agreeing to the angle of the story she's telling when the listener affirms the idea she is striving to present as insightful in the superior way. My mother would never disagree with a client so would be entirely sweet to anyone met in public or their private home. it was hard to understand the "appearances matter" aspect without becoming aware where my mother draws the line in each relationship.
Taking a break from this wonderful presentation at 28 minutes. I will come back. Very very interesting with the varieties of strong minded people that we have in my family. I’m thinking at this point of my youngest grandchild even with the help of Quakers ( in a school attended). Now getting much better with out medication from five different therapists, with a personality disorder, attitude instead of a chemical disorder but of course, now they all have to be considered together.
I’ll be back.
One of the most informative videos. Thank you Dr. Ramani.
I've been listening to yr podcast/videos for a short time but just now, I stumbled across this one and with perfect timing. My daughter has BPD and I've struggled to get my head around it logically. Thinking that maybe she suffered from bipolar, schizophrenia or narcissism. I'm often trying to explain to others why she has these behaviours but unable to really get my message clear due to lack of knowledge. You have helped me enormously where I feel I can now navigate this (family problem) with a lot more light. Thanks you, thank you, thank you Dr Ramani. It all makes more sense now and I think I can probably tell myself that I haven't been a pathetic or bad mother. 🙏
I listen to so many of these symptoms and they also remind me of the symptoms of those being abused by these personality types - for me, that’s led to a lot of confusion… I used to want to be so understanding. I think I was overly sympathetic because of my own struggles. It makes it difficult to discern who exactly I’m dealing with. I’ve experienced a lot of trauma, so I think that’s also left me susceptible to being overly understanding while empathizing that we’re having struggles for similar reasons. Also, I like how you mentioned paranoia. I used to think this was what I was experiencing when I distrusted people and it turns out what I was fearing was actually real…. it turns out that there are bad people and that they do bad things. 🤦🏼♀️🤷🏼♀️
Dr Ramani, Thank - you for your videos on toxic people. As an adult daughter of an undiagnosed toxic mother I am forever grateful. Through my own research (10 years)
I am discovering my mother displays narcissistic and BPD traits. She has bouts of deep depression, violence (when she was younger) verbal abuse and anger, however no suicidal tendencies ..
Question: Is BPD always associated with self harm? Thank you Dr R and to your online community
Cheers from Down Under 🇦🇺
I love watching this videos, my favorite past-time between what I will do next, like a little entertained by acknowledging stuff that I feel so interesting to learn about, Im finding out so many stuff about my self and how I once was…and I even feel like I fluctuated in many types of those personalities styles through my life and now I realize some stuff I never was able to, also sometimes labeling stuff can be usefully so you can relate to other people who feel the same way and you see is just something it happens all around the world not just with you and you can just learn from it. Although is never a rule in my opinion, after all in the deep down each one is different in their own way. I don’t identify with any of them anymore tbh. I feel healthy.
This is very enlightening, and it explains about my parents. Most important how it got passed down the line to my siblings. My brother does care a lot about a job. But he will walk away from a marriage for peace of mind, and leave any monitory value behind. Once again he believes that makes him righteous. When I say walk away, I literally mean with his gym bag; and the clothes he’s wearing.
OCPD + narcissism explains everything! I even went through the only-two-pairs of shoes per year fight; I had to secretly save money to buy what they needed as their feet grew or they needed band or track shoes, and still hear the crap for doing it. The endless court battles for stuff I was only too happy to give him but he never came to get it, on and on. The endless contempt for everyone. The picky perfectionism that drove me and everyone whoever worked for or with him. Name That Tune. Thank God I'm finally free from this lunacy.
My Nana told me in the last couple of years that my Mum was diagnosed with “indirect behaviour” as a child, the closest I could find was “indirect aggression”, she has extremely manipulative behaviour, It seemed that my Nana didn’t grasp what that meant, she thought that just means she could misbehave undetected, but not realise that means she can also use indirect aggression to mentally torture people. I can see how indirect aggression / passive aggression can be is so extreme it can intersect with histrionic and NP styles.
So clear, so good! You have helped me to envision the pursuit of a better understanding of several people in my life. I feel as if I have a place to start in managing these relationships without feeling insulted, guilty, angry, confused, sad, hopeless--if I can see these people and their issues as something outside of myself and how I live my life, I may eventually be able to deal with them without so much damage to my own health and happiness. Maybe? With some work and good information? I have more hope today. Thanks so much!
Thank you…So wonderful to have a real framework, and language, around these behaviours. Truly, the difference that makes, in understanding, what happened… Beyond being, ‘simply, being totalled’… Bless you, over and over….xxx🌺
My cousin is both BPD and schizophrenic/schizo affective. I was trying to help her, but she became too abusive and I had to step away. While I can't do anything for her, it helps to understand. Thank you for helping me to understand.
My cousin has that diagnoses. She can be emotionally and physically abusive. Btw she looked down on people who were different before schizophrenia emerged. My former psychiatrist said that this is a dangerous diagnosis or to that effect, forgot his exact words.
"Dangerous" is a very good description.
Yes, thank you! I'm diagnosed with BPD and recently I've started therapy and as hard it is to admit to some of my own faults rather than avoiding them and repeating the same mistakes I've come to a place where I'm sort of in an existential crisis because I really see how selfish I can be and this led me to wonder whether I'm really a covert narcissist.
Haven't watched the whole video but had to comment first, I'm kind of excited to hear your thoughts!
Narcissists don’t ask themselves if they’re the narc.
That's really impressive because I know people with BPD who never think they could be selfish and constantly blame others. I don't know you, but I'm proud of you for making strides in your recovery 🙌
Having BPD means that you will move back and forth between hating yourself and over-valuing yourself. Learn to see yourself clearly, and this will end. Stop labeling yourself and manage your emotions. You can do it.
I think I needed to see this. I am still holding out hope that my mom is not a narcissist.
Omg: I have been wondering for a while if my husband was passive aggressive. It’s unfortunate that it’s not part of the DSM. Because you described him to a T. I might have recognized him sooner, if this had been covered sooner.
I have bpd, autism, cptsd, anxiety, and depression. It's a unique kind of hell to experience because I don't fully recognize others facial expressions and tones of voice but I have good pattern recognition and so I can tell what's "good" emotions and what's "bad" so I need very clear communication and a lot of reassurance. Thankfully I'm on a good med regimen so I don't have the extreme rollercoaster emotions anymore. Though i still have a lot of depression. I've never had a problem with empathy because my autism makes me hyperempathic all the time. I've found that it is really easy to take advantage of me so I have a very small group of family and friends that vet any new friends or partners. I've found that tapping, and emdr has really helped me more than dbt and cbt. I think it's because it's helped process the trauma and reframed a lot of my typical bpd thought processes. So if you have a similar make up of disorders and cbt and dbt haven't worked for you talk to your therapist or doctor about trying those.
Thank you for this video Dr. Ramani. You nailed BPD at the beginning. Every one of those characteristics describes my personal experiences. I was diagnosed with BPD after decades of therapy. My therapy had been focused on BPD for nearly 7 years (keeping regular appointments), and it did include DBT therapy (both in group and in session). DBT worked amazingly well, but it wasn’t the only set of “tools” I could lean on. I practiced my DBT tools for interpersonal effectiveness, and my spiritual practices for my sense of self. This combo worked for me.
Ironically, I married a covert narcissist. The section on BPD & Narcissist getting married was exactly what happened to me. It was this separation and divorce that gave me motivation to work hard on my own issues. Believe it or not, we have a child from the marriage who lives with my ex. I gray rock with the ex, but to a degree. Since there is a genuine concern about my daughter’s well being, I have to show some genuine self in front of both my child and the narcissistic parent. Knowing how the narcissist functions, I know what I need to do to help my child.
I agree with most things in this video, but squirreling away money is good practice if you’re living paycheck to paycheck. A medical emergency or a death can financially ruin someone, money and possessions aren’t everything by a long shot but depending on the situation having a nest egg of sorts is good. Not helping in an emergency when you’re okay is bad, but being frugal can be a smart plan, especially if you’re trying to get yourself into a better situation.
I would be very interested in learning how these personality types react with high masking neurodivergent personalites
Wow!! Ok!! You made this so incredibly clear. Ty Dr.R! Def dealing with overlapping in my fam… 😯🤔😳
Wow! You described my husband of 35 years with that Passive-Aggressive Negativistic style! It's exhausting, but on the plus side I've learned to do everything myself. I wanted to leave ages ago, but something always went wrong and it was bad timing, or so I felt. Two years ago I just couldn't take it anymore and asked him to leave. My health, mental and physical, has improved sooo much since then.
Interesting info. I def think I had a friend who was histrionic leaning. Or at least had some of that going on. It did feel very much like toxic NA. She told me she sometimes would assume or used to assume she was best friends with someone If she met someone once. And she def did that to me and my friend circles. On top of codependency and narcissistic tendencies. Gaslighting and aggressive verbal abuse became highly present at the end no matter how kind I tried to end this friendship. I felt bad. Because I cared for them. I just couldn’t do it anymore.
I’ve also experienced personality disorders where someone is suicidal and it sadly took this persons life. She would change drastically and suddenly also want to do something random that felt immature for her age. Then would be very sweet and then suddenly very angry then beg for forgiveness then flip and admit she was lying. Very confusing something wasn’t right about that friendship I had. I blamed myself for a long time. And am learning this was likely sadly something beyond my human ability. And I am now at a point of letting those feelings go: although it’s difficult because there is a lot of pain there. Thanks for posting about these other disorders. It’s interesting hearing about them and how they can look like narcissism
Thanks for sharing. 🙏
As a clinician, I think this video is helpful. One criticism is the sort of implied strict definitions to all these PDs and their manifestations. Behaviors can have varied motivations and explanations. Observing a person with judgment or looking for certain dx can cause mistaken diagnosis. It is important that untrained persons do not dx others or themselves. It's more important to trust yourself and your experiences so that you can decide if a relationship is safe and reciprocal for you. Also, everyone has character flaws, maybe even some of the aforementioned traits. That doesn't mean that any person should be dehumanized and made unworthy of love or relationship because of flaws, symptoms, or a dx. It doesn't automatically justify divorce either. Patience, grace, reflection are needed in these situations.
Check out more of her content - she's not myopic or rigid about symptoms, but the venue has time limitations. She has a very extensive library and a couple of books.
Dr Ramani is pro at this. She is exceptional and knows inside out on these topics. Watch all of her content. I'm in the medical field. I had doctors see me for 30 min and give me a stupid dx and meds that nearly kill me. Years later, it was my husband who wanted me dead and take my children and have a big life insurance policy on me. He is High up in Government and national security. So, you know, he had a way to gaslight you to hell and back. Thank God I got divorced and got away from the doctors at that time. I thank God for one doctor that I saw, and he told me right off the bat about what was done to me. He knew I had suffered narcissist abuse ( sociopath) he told me that I wasn't crazy and validated everything. That was the beginning of my healing from a traumatic event in my life.
Very interesting information on personality disorder. I loved my parents very much but their Love/Hate relationship was difficult to understand or support. Thank you Dr. Ramani!
I've still been in trauma years later after I've saved my ex from hanging himself. I do think he was BPD, yet narc like you said. I'm finally realizing that him breaking up with me kept me from what I kept putting off. His wanting to hook up for supply a few months ago was a huge mistake. I'm hurt again and they ghosted me after three days of doing that. Don't fall for it, anyone, if they act like they want to be back with you. It was just his "supply" filling.
I'm borderline and I'm terrified of being abusive or manipulative. I sometimes aks I my boyfriend and my long terms friends about that. So far so good, apparently😅
But I struggle with despair and hurt myself, causing myself bruises :/
Dr. Ramani, really appreciate your sharing all of this information with us. Thank you😊 for all of your hard work providing excellent content. ❤ A+ ⭐️ ⭐️ ⭐️ 🌟 💫
Needed this so much this morning ❤
This is great!! I def. had a mix of of personality disorder and then was with a narc. Now I have two adult sons whom I whiteness with both traits.. one of each. I just listened to The Body Keeps the Score.. WOW!! I wonder if you know of this book Dr. Ramani !? It’s so very good.
I was diagnosed with BPD many years ago, so I went into therapy, both individual and group settings. Since then I’ve been able to manage and regulate my emotions, set realistic boundaries and remain drug free and self harm free for 12 years now. Now 61 years old, I’ve worked very hard to change myself and my life. I guess my question is, can someone with BPD be cured? Could I have been misdiagnosed?
I just broke free from a 12 year on again off again narcissistic relationship a couple of months ago, and initially I struggled with abandonment issues. Since watching your videos and working on my own self discovery and self growth through an intense journaling process, I was able to go NO CONTACT and start to find inner strength and peace again.
Dr. R this is sooooo good! Thank you! ❤
Interesting way of looking at Histrionic PD as “Narcissism Lite.” Also, thank you for clarifying how the concept of being ego-syntonic fits into the Histrionic PD.
Also interesting is how an individual with NPD and an individual with Histrionic PD seem to attract each other.
It is hard to believe, but an individual with Histrionic PD has less insight than an individual with NPD, which results in the trait of being ego-syntonic and utilizes a lot of passive aggression.
I can hardly begin to describe how much Im suffering. Im losing the will to fight for a happiness that feels far out of reach and I can no longer imagine a life where I feel happy in any circumstances. The anhedonia and numbness feels like a perfect storm of hope-destroying symptoms. I can’t stop running away from myself even though theres nowhere to go. Nothing satisfies. Nothing helps. It feels selfish to talk about. I can’t stop ideation and intrusive thoughts. I hate myself for failing to be happy alone. I hate myself for hurting myself and others. Im scared of finding new ways I can’t enjoy things that I should be happy about. I avoid going home. I avoid people. I avoid hobbies. I can’t relieve stress in any meaningful way. I find myself wishing my life will end every day. My car was broken into and a bunch of stuff was stolen and I couldn’t even feel angry. How can it be that a human being can even feel like this?
This makes me sad for you. Probably because I can relate. Please seek a counselor or someone to talk to * help you through it
You're worth it♡
People who have borderline personality disorders seek treatment, while those who are narcissistic do not
Well, sometimes _"seeking treatment"_ is more about needing to possess someone's undivided attention for ~ an hour every week and using the narcissistic supply gained by holding them verbally hostage (literally paying them to listen) in a setting that's all about the person seeking to use someone for this task...that way they can coast through the rest of their week.
(narcissists will sometimes seek counseling or support groups for the same reason...and a lot of therapists are more than willing to take their money)
*BPD is about LOVING someone so much that your love for them mutates into an all consuming psychotic NEED driving you to choke the life out of every single thing you're trying to hold onto.*
*NPD is more about wielding POWER over others so that nobody can CONTROL you and make you feel weak, helpless, inferior, unworthy, or broken again.*
Dr Ramani this was amazing even for you. Fascinating. So pleasing that histrionic personality disorder may get the boot as a recognised condition. Misogyny has must to answer for in psychology.
The part of this video I liked a lot is at the end where Dr Ramani blows a few boats out of the water regarding what the term 'narcissism' actually means and how so many people are misusing this word. I've subscribed like the good bpd person that I am! 😁
Thank you for clarifying what a narcissist is. Whilst listening about earlier disorders I have noticed that I had some of the traits you mentioned, I am an achiever and care about my appearance and so on, and was wondering how messed up 😂I must be. However, when you clarified it at the end, I can sigh with relief I am normal after all😅
OMG, I was just thinking Histrionic personality sounds like narcissistic light. I was thinking of a relative that I get sad about because I believe she has narcissistic tendencies. But sometimes she acts as if she cares. I don’t know maybe she’s really good at manipulation. I do not take her behavior personally anymore. It used to break my heart. She’s very confusing.