Totally agree! Was shocked when my AD told me my watch was fake and asked me if they can demolish it. Had to correct them and write to their regional office. To make it worse they refused to even issue an apology letter but just an email saying your watch is genuine.
Ha! Going against the trend here. I just bought a pre-owned Panerai PAM0380 and love it!! I would have never thought I like Panerai but once it was on my wrist - I loved it. I think they see a bit of a resurgence nowawadays. And my ETA based movement looks lovely - well decorated and finished - though no display caseback. And the 380 has a screw in caseback and 100m WR \
Panerai is kind of like marmite either you love it or hate it, I'm in the former camp. I think they make some really iconic and gorgeous pieces. The whole thing about replica is overplayed for Panerai, there is a super replica for almost any watch these days. If people want a watch that can't be faked, the only option is to buy watches with uncommon complications that the fakers can't or can't be bothered to replicate.
@@lettuce1305 Fakes are going better from the outside but they cant meet high-quality movements like from Rolex or Omega and even fine details on the outside are not met fully. If you own a fake you could possibly want original Omega or Rolex just for the sake of fine craftsmanship, no doubt about that. However, Panerai here doesn't really meet expectations... Mechanical watches are about fine art. You could buy a cheap swatch and it will tell you a good time. You want to own something special. If the fake has the same movement, about the same quality build, why would you want to own the original?
@@hrvojelasic5794 yeah but you can't even see the movement in Rolex and also there are super clones of the rolex movement now. This whole replica issue is not only with Panerai, look up some videos on youtube, the super replicas of some Rolex are already almost indistinguishable from the genuine.
@@lettuce1305 Movements you mention are look-alike Rolex movements but are not equal to quality. They are coming dirty from the factory, lower quality standards, some crucial parts like balance wheels, they cant really copy. I agree with you there is good value for money but they are still not a real deal for Rolex or Omega (and some others). But in this particular case, I don't see value in buying Panerai. I am not seeing Panerai as a piece of high-end machinery. So I kind of agree with you, as for Panerai, I would probably prefer copy as even dealers can't see the difference. Just looks to be a money grab.
@@hrvojelasic5794 if you're so concerned with replicas, then don't even bother with Rolex and Omega, get a JLC with complications or a Grand Seiko. None of those have a super replica yet and you can immediately tell even if there's a replica for one.
Louis V, Gucci, Versace... The watch world is just behind the rest of the fashion world. Give it ten years and Patek will be selling plastic digitals to teenagers for 900 bucks a piece. The moron market is unfortunately lucrative.
Panerai was never about in house, they have always used sourced movement historically. A Panerai with in house movements are only a couple grand more so it's not a price issue, it's more of a choice.
@@joeylee6094 I did buy a used skx399, and gosh the crown is having really big problems screwing down. It wasn't abused. Its just a common problem with older screwdowns. Thread gets crossed and worn out
hi i have a Panerai ferrari which i sent back for repair through an ad .Panerai first said it was real watch then said it was fake and sent it back, just shows they cant even tell.
@@adama4791 They have released a 40 mm Luminor Marina with the same 300m water resistance as the regular 44 mm. It's super popular among the ladies. They have it in all 3 popular dial colors (blue, black and white). The Due was criticised because they didn't have the 40mm before and it was seen as the 'smaller case size at the compromise of WR'. With the 40 mm releases and the Due being focused on with precious metal (Gold and Mother of Pearl dial), they've established a clear difference in the product lines. The Due are 38 mm and generally men tend to prefer 40-42 which is why Rolex releases mostly in 40 for men. Hence my earlier comment on it being more for women. Truth be told, there isn't any Submersible in 40 mm or below so you won't get that Diver's bezel for women in the size they prefer. In short, Panerai does not make any suitable diving watches for women today.
@@seanlingham5254 I would say 1) suitable is in the eyes of the beholder, namely the woman who might or might not want say a 42mm submersible but 2) sure you could say that, it is likely partly because I'm a man and a tall and stocky one at that such that none of panerais decisions really bother me since I can get away with all of their watches. I think I just didn't like the self righteous tone of this video. I would agree with his "they've betrayed the brand" bullshit if they didn't actually make any more legitimate divers but just because they are making something that isnt fully true to form (while producing the vast majority of watches that are) doesn't mean they're betraying the brand.
I'm way late to this one but totally get your point. I'm a fan and like the fact the prices are down am looking for a used one as I type this. New subscriber!
Another reason Not to buy a Panerai is They lose value tremendously, I purchased my Luminor Marina for 10K kept in in excellent condition and exactly one year later I tried to sell it and got a low ball offer of 5K from crown and caliber and chrono 24. They low ball you and then sell those watches for around 8K .
Learned a lot, thanks Jory! It is sad that they went that route, I’m sure (if it hasn’t happened already) that this will make the engraved movement versions jump in price which is a shame for people who want to buy an authentic pre-owned watch.
As long as there are uninformed buyers out there paying for the brand name and look... Panerai won't do a thing. Most people who I know, who own a Rolex have zero idea what movement is in their watch! That's the Panerai target market :)
If the copies are so indistinguishable from the real ones that even the ADs cannot know for certain which is which, I think that it makes perfect sense to buy an exact non-Panerai Panerai...and save over 90% of the price.
@@rickb.4168 Maybe folks like the Rolex look and design but not the prices and unavailability. Maybe they want the status without the cost of an original Rolex.
Panerai remains an amazing watch with a history behind that gives a good balance between smart /casual/sporty, the bulky look ideal for people with large wrist /hands, exclusive lock for the crown which makes the watch recognizable at distance…. Tudor, Rolex, omega and others sometimes look the same from far , ….AP and Hublot have very similar models, lets not talk about Richard Mille hublot Spirit of big bang they get confused often, Panerai is unique in its style… and btw how fair is to compare brands with totally dofferent price range… Lets talk about the power reserve? How cool is that? sometimes i don’t use mine for a couple of days and I can just look at the power reserve indicator as if it was a fuel indicator in the car and i know if I need to wind it or not… and now they offer 8 years warranty… i am not sure that many brands offer such a long term warranty… i am not saying it is perfect and I think many statements in this video are based on true but lets not forget each brand have pros and cons…
But watches should never be heavily relied on style, style and design can be and will be copied. People still buy Rolex because the quality at MSRP is decent. The same for omega and JLC. Can’t say the same about Panerai. The 9010 movements don’t even hack, you can’t excuse corporate greed.
Agree with all your points on panerai. That's my issues with the brand too. I have an on again off again love fest with panerai but can't bring myself to buy a new or used one.
Love my Pam 323. I own a lot of nice watches and it’s still my favourite. All I’ve seen lately are Rolex copies. If you know how, where and what to buy it’s not difficult.
You can still buy a great Luminor, but you have to know the right one. The Due line up is crap and the older Luminors (2000-2012) do have some great models. Just my 2 cents.
Love to know how often anyone every uses a paneRai for diving. We use dive computers, this is a ridiculous argument and 30m is enough for most casual diving anyway
Despite the very high prices from what I have heard Panerai has a history of unacceptable cost cutting. I have heard that their latest tactic in response to dropping sales is to cheapen the product even more. One has to wonder about what management is thinking. They managed to become very popular and profitable company in a very short time...and then they have just frittered it away due to greed and short term thinking.
2 years ago my dear wife treated me on a nice watch of my choosing for a wedding anniversary. I was kinda interested in the Panerai with 8 days handwinding movement - but in the end I choose the Nomos Tangente 41 Update, I find it more elegant and more special. Unlike the Panerai, I know I will not get tired of the Nomos. 2 other watches I considered were the Drive De Cartier (very nice, but too bling for my taste) and a Rolex Oyster Perpetual with grey dial - which was nice enough but lacked something.
I'm so pissed off. I had my Panerai 312 serviced in January 2020 at a not authorised watch shop in Scotland and now it needs a new balance wheel. The shop has closed due to Covid. Panerai won't sell me a balance wheel. I have to get it fixed with them. Not happy about this. If I had my BMW serviced and none approved garage BMW would still sell me parts. Really changed my thoughts about panerai. PS love the channel
I have a PAM 001 with a solid case back, I agree that Panerai in the beginning was great but it’s like the Omega Speedmasters with all the special and limited editions that mean nothing
No problem with the video, the fact that Panari is counterfeited a lot goes to how attractive they are. My favorite is the PAM00171. They should definitely do more to protect the brand when it comes to quality, design, and counterfeiting.
When you have companies like island watches selling watches that have sapphire, hacking, winding for a fraction of the cost, you realize how much these companies try to rip ppl off not only that they are marketing to ppl who live watches but also know about other brands and difference in the watch industry, they will go under in my opinion, or the damage they will do to their reputation will be really hard, basically you are paying for the case.
I somewhat agree with your points except water resistance. Not planning on swimming with a 20k watch. I buy divers because I like the watch not cuz I plan on diving.
I own Rolex Sub, IWC transitional big pilot, IWC miramar triple date ceramic and of course Panerai. Out of all my watches I love my Panerai 1104 (Panerai movement). I get a lot of good comments above all my other watches on my Panerai.
@thetimeteller I love this video! You're angry for a good reason. The problem starts at the moment users and collectors begin to buy plain, ordinary tool watches like Panerai, Rolex, Doxa, Tudor, Omega, etc. as high end horology time pieces. They're not and they're not meant to be. Dive watches were constructed for the military as a part of the outfit and had to be reliable and cheap. A government supplies it soldiers with affordable pistols, but no civilian would buy the exact one for $20.000 and it happens with watches all the time, so the prices became outrageous and the watches … are still only a piece of tool.
Why, the people who buy 20.000 watches, buy then in a shop. All the other poor garbage who want to buy them second hand, are not worth to even take in account... If you have not two lambo, some Ferraris and some houses, who cares about you... You are a person 2nd class, a person of no interest...
Okay - Panerai has been quietly revamping their entire product line. The new PAM 915 - an AMAZING update to the 111 (rated to 300 meter). My personal fav - the PAM 960 (also rated to 300 meters). They have locked down their distribution, so their prices are holding very steady, few deals are gone, you will pay to get back into the new club. As for fakes; that has nothing to do with Panerai production facilities; that is just fake news. Ps - I wouldn’t be wearing a 20k Gold watch diving anyway.
8:17 ... So you actually expect this, $20k plus, GOLD watch to be used for scuba diving? I find it bordering on pedantic to bemoan the 30m water resistance on a watch that is, clearly, NEVER going to be worn underwater. Panerai makes actual Subermersible watches for that purpose. And I can confidently claim that pretty much ALL Panerai owners buy the watches for their distinctive style and do not intend to wear them wreck diving at 300 feet below. That's why the Kodiak leather straps are no longer standard on the Pams either.
I have had a Parnis titanium Luminor, with a Seagull auto movement for 15 years, with NO problems. Also just bought a Steeldive 'Cpt.Willard'. Terrific...£120
I own 3 panerai. If it doesn’t say marina or submersible check the water resistance. Unfortunately the crown guard is so iconic they have incorporated it into their dress watches like the ones you mentioned. They tried to keep their dress watches separate by only incorporating them into the radiomir collection but there was a clear demand for them. In my opinion everything went downhill as soon as they tried to cater to the mass market.
Great vid, and 100% correct. Panerai is really getting lazy and is raising prices at the same time just because they think that people will keep buying...
I have always thought the crown guards looked ludicrous. But then they release a watch with those ridiculous looking crown guards and only 30m water resistance? Why not just release them as Radiomir models then?
Man I finally caught one of your uploads I subbed when you had 98k subs and your videos are great! You also got me interested into tank watches! Greetings from California! Edit: the 30m water resistance with that crown guard is hilarious 😂
The only watch i own is a panerai , the same as you but from 2015, and i agree, when I saw online that in 2000 they had the engraving i panicked that mine was a fake, had it checked and it was cool but yeah wtf.
My problem with Panerai is their product catalog, holy crap how many Submersibles are there? Bronze green dial, blue dial, then with power reserve, and then the original Carbotech followed by green markers Carbo, then blue. Not to mention the massive collection of the Luminors with the GMT, the power reserve, sandiwch dial, sausage dial, just too much. How am I supposed to recommend this brand to my friends? I love my PAMs, just confused with the brand direction.
I just bought a Panerai 320 GMT in 44 mm recently on 30th August 2020,....I LOVE BIG Size watches in 44 mm and 47 mm, a Centralized hour and minute hand is a MUST.....I don't like small moon separate hour and minute hand, as many complicated watches nowadays have NOT a centralized hour and minute hands.........28,800 VPH (Vibration per hour) in 4 Hz is also a must for an accuracy which is Panerai pam 320 having 28,800 vph movement......previously, I have 3 Hz watches and always NOT Accurate..........Panerai 320 GMT has an IN House watch movement with a 3 Days Power Reserved in the back side watch movement in automatic..........IN HOUSE movement is also a MUST in watches nowadays.........Customers are becoming more choosy and always demand the best mechanical watches with NO Battery on the watch movement......Automatic and Hand Winding are my choice of watches.......Beside Panerai pam 320 GMT in 44 mm, I also have a Panerai 297 GMT in 44 mm as well as popular Panerai 372 in 47 mm in Plexiglass........Italiano certainly knew how to design a good BIG SIZE Watches........Luminor is my favorite.......Radiomir, Submersible.....are NOT my favorite in Panerai.......44 mm and 47 mm are my favorite BIG Size watches.........so I guess I am a Paneristi.......watch collector....Thanks for reading...O:))
You know, it was about the time when I was wanting to buy a Panerai I began to notice this trend of Panerai just giving up. Instead of sandwich, you get sausage dials. Instead of cool decorated movements, you get basic shit. Why they never bothered improving their water resistance is beyond me...especially given their size. Their catalog is confusing as shit also. You'll have what are seemingly two near-identical watches that are several thousand dollars in price difference. I love the Panerai aesthetic, but it's hard for them to justify their cost when there's a dozen microbrands that can make almost the exact same thing...for substantially cheaper and often better.
I cannot agree more! I love Panerai watches, the history, the looks, etc, especially a simple two hander. But the company is just completely lost. The Due is a joke, but it had so much potential. If they’re going to keep the Crown Protecting Device, make it properly water resistant. Otherwise, just give it a simple crown like the Radiomir. I do like the new materials they’re experimenting with, but the extra lume on the case is just a silly gimmick. I really hope they get it together soon.
OMG!!!! I’m so glad I just watched your video!!! Here’s why: about a week ago I passed by a store that sells pre-owned timepieces and I saw a Panerai PAM 194 2500m in titanium that has been in their window for over 3 years and is not selling. He wants $10,500 for it and is missing some of the papers but has the box and part of the papers. I had no idea that there were fakes of Panerai watches until I watched your video and another video a few minutes ago. Then after you mentioned that even dealers will not buy a Panerai with box and papers I realized that should I buy the watch I would have a paperweight on my hands that would have cost me $10,500. You are also right about the ETA movements because having a timepiece with an ETA movement is not necessarily a bad thing and some of them perform better than in-house movements. Thanks for uploading I do have a question: is it possible for there to be a fake PAM 194 2500m titanium divers with a tritium dial? Should I avoid that watch after what you said in your video? Because I did own this watch previously and when I tried to sell it years ago I had a hard time selling it even with box and papers. Please let me know and thanks
I had a issue I m very disappointed about seiko 5 SNK375K1 automatic I bought it new but it's out of alignment little bit , and I'm scared buying more seiko any help to repair the watch please.
"All fur coat with no knickers" comes to mind when I see 30m WR. I like the original styling but those Panerai lack integrity in design. Like those Chinese knock-offs. ☘
I own a PAM00915 & i love it and its not fake i own papers and serial numbers & i bought it from the store directly, that's sad people are selling fakes out here. Ive love this watch since i seen Sylvester Stallone wear it in the movie day light & Arnold Schwarzenegger in Eraser!!! loved it ever since..
I totally agree. I've seen some high end expensive clones look and work better than the genuine ones. Like the Brooklyn bridge special, that kind of quality is just not acceptable.
I’m a little confused, why didn’t you tell which watch specifically to buy because you were over so many watches I don’t know which watch is the one to get?
![It's Official, I'm NEVER EVER Buying Another Panerai... [2022]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hhG6lUayfkM/mqdefault.jpg)
Let’s be honest... we are all waiting for Jory’s beard to reach his eyeballs. 😂 Love ya bro!
definitely
Lmao
He should connect with eyebrows that would be awesome
He's clearly an incel.
Panerai will always be an icon. Can clearly spot one from across the room.
Yes, whether it's made in China or not, you can still spot it from across the room.
yes, prob spotting a fake one lol
And? Is that something to be happy about?
Exactly. A Rolex, etc., look exactly like a Tag from any farther than 2 feet.
You can login to their website to check authenticity now.
Looks like Panerai have gone Pan-AWRY.
ThomasWilliamsMusic underrated comment 😂
Briliant! 😂
That was funny
ThomasWilliamsMusic Best Comment EVER !!’ 😆
My God!!
Enjoyed this rant, especially highlighting the mismatch of components vs price. 👍
When your ADs can’t tell your own genuine products from fake copies, you’re done, and you deserve it.
if no one can tell them appart, is there really a difference? considering the record of cutting corners, perhaps the fake is the higher quality watch
Totally agree! Was shocked when my AD told me my watch was fake and asked me if they can demolish it. Had to correct them and write to their regional office. To make it worse they refused to even issue an apology letter but just an email saying your watch is genuine.
@@peytonhuang2919 yeahhh that'd be enough to turn me off the brand, sorry you had to deal with that!
Ha! Going against the trend here. I just bought a pre-owned Panerai PAM0380 and love it!! I would have never thought I like Panerai but once it was on my wrist - I loved it. I think they see a bit of a resurgence nowawadays. And my ETA based movement looks lovely - well decorated and finished - though no display caseback. And the 380 has a screw in caseback and 100m WR
\
Panerai is kind of like marmite either you love it or hate it, I'm in the former camp. I think they make some really iconic and gorgeous pieces. The whole thing about replica is overplayed for Panerai, there is a super replica for almost any watch these days. If people want a watch that can't be faked, the only option is to buy watches with uncommon complications that the fakers can't or can't be bothered to replicate.
@@lettuce1305 Fakes are going better from the outside but they cant meet high-quality movements like from Rolex or Omega and even fine details on the outside are not met fully. If you own a fake you could possibly want original Omega or Rolex just for the sake of fine craftsmanship, no doubt about that. However, Panerai here doesn't really meet expectations... Mechanical watches are about fine art. You could buy a cheap swatch and it will tell you a good time. You want to own something special. If the fake has the same movement, about the same quality build, why would you want to own the original?
@@hrvojelasic5794 yeah but you can't even see the movement in Rolex and also there are super clones of the rolex movement now. This whole replica issue is not only with Panerai, look up some videos on youtube, the super replicas of some Rolex are already almost indistinguishable from the genuine.
@@lettuce1305 Movements you mention are look-alike Rolex movements but are not equal to quality. They are coming dirty from the factory, lower quality standards, some crucial parts like balance wheels, they cant really copy. I agree with you there is good value for money but they are still not a real deal for Rolex or Omega (and some others). But in this particular case, I don't see value in buying Panerai. I am not seeing Panerai as a piece of high-end machinery. So I kind of agree with you, as for Panerai, I would probably prefer copy as even dealers can't see the difference. Just looks to be a money grab.
@@hrvojelasic5794 if you're so concerned with replicas, then don't even bother with Rolex and Omega, get a JLC with complications or a Grand Seiko. None of those have a super replica yet and you can immediately tell even if there's a replica for one.
Paneri is starting to become one of those brands that are only expensive because of the brand mostly, which is mostly common with fashion brands
True said
cough cough hublot
@@idzzuddinishak7389 Rolex is still independent though, unlike pretty much all the swiss brands so at least they're doing something right.
RICHARD MILLE
Louis V, Gucci, Versace... The watch world is just behind the rest of the fashion world. Give it ten years and Patek will be selling plastic digitals to teenagers for 900 bucks a piece. The moron market is unfortunately lucrative.
Panerai was never about in house, they have always used sourced movement historically. A Panerai with in house movements are only a couple grand more so it's not a price issue, it's more of a choice.
And You are hu?
But bro! That movement he showed was disgusting
Dive style watches are great for exploring the depths of your kitchen sink XD
No. Don't even get them wet.
I just got my first Pam 1209 (300m) and absolutely love it. It has been on my wrist over my Rolex’s and Cartier’s lately.
The whole beard thing is fine. Please just do something about the growth on the cheekbones, it's kinda creepy.
Apparently he don't own a razor
Let the man wear his beard however he chooses. I’m just worried about the limited edition T-shirts!😁
It's disgusting
Wax
You were very fair, thank you for doing a Panerai story. I have a Luminor 1950 with a display back very nice movement. Cicra 2011.
Totally agree. Bought my one and only Panerai. A PAM 177 in 2006.
I own 2 Panerai and I love them more than Rolex. Omega or Tag.
🤔😂🤣
I'm gald you're finally covering this topic Jory. This has been goung on for way too long with Panerai.
About the skx, I am not a fan for threaded crowns. I don't like how they age
Why?
@@joeylee6094 I did buy a used skx399, and gosh the crown is having really big problems screwing down. It wasn't abused. Its just a common problem with older screwdowns. Thread gets crossed and worn out
All very valid points. They are very cool looking watches though.
hi i have a Panerai ferrari which i sent back for repair through an ad .Panerai first said it was real watch then said it was fake and sent it back, just shows they cant even tell.
A 30m water resistance for a sportwatch (especially on a diver looking thing) is unforgivable period.
It's all 30 bar. The Due isn't meant for men.
Because it’s not a sports watch? It’s not like they took their luminor and changed it to 30m. It’s a different line
@@adama4791 They have released a 40 mm Luminor Marina with the same 300m water resistance as the regular 44 mm. It's super popular among the ladies. They have it in all 3 popular dial colors (blue, black and white).
The Due was criticised because they didn't have the 40mm before and it was seen as the 'smaller case size at the compromise of WR'. With the 40 mm releases and the Due being focused on with precious metal (Gold and Mother of Pearl dial), they've established a clear difference in the product lines.
The Due are 38 mm and generally men tend to prefer 40-42 which is why Rolex releases mostly in 40 for men. Hence my earlier comment on it being more for women. Truth be told, there isn't any Submersible in 40 mm or below so you won't get that Diver's bezel for women in the size they prefer.
In short, Panerai does not make any suitable diving watches for women today.
@@seanlingham5254 I would say 1) suitable is in the eyes of the beholder, namely the woman who might or might not want say a 42mm submersible but 2) sure you could say that, it is likely partly because I'm a man and a tall and stocky one at that such that none of panerais decisions really bother me since I can get away with all of their watches. I think I just didn't like the self righteous tone of this video. I would agree with his "they've betrayed the brand" bullshit if they didn't actually make any more legitimate divers but just because they are making something that isnt fully true to form (while producing the vast majority of watches that are) doesn't mean they're betraying the brand.
@@adama4791 I agree with you completely. I was just responding to one part of what you said. I agree with your sentiments.
I'm way late to this one but totally get your point. I'm a fan and like the fact the prices are down am looking for a used one as I type this. New subscriber!
Your movement is actually better looking than the “in house” version...
and more reliable.
How often are you hanging out under 30 meters of water?
Another reason Not to buy a Panerai is They lose value tremendously, I purchased my Luminor Marina for 10K kept in in excellent condition and exactly one year later I tried to sell it and got a low ball offer of 5K from crown and caliber and chrono 24. They low ball you and then sell those watches for around 8K .
Looking at an Panerai PAM 000051 on the link. Beautiful watch with 300m water resistance.
For me, this brand jumped the shark when E gave Turtle one for his birthday in the HBO series Entourage.
Learned a lot, thanks Jory! It is sad that they went that route, I’m sure (if it hasn’t happened already) that this will make the engraved movement versions jump in price which is a shame for people who want to buy an authentic pre-owned watch.
Very informative. I don’t know much about Paneri; as I don’t really like there style. But it’s good to learn about them.
At least the Seiko 5 has 100m wr.
nakinate it’s a good watch
Agreed. I have two 5KX's and they are great fun. I will never dive. But I will use the bezel for parking meters.
Its a 100 mm diver 😋
Really good points here, particularly around the substandard workings inside some of these expensive timepieces.
Panerai’s are ‘Limited’ to the number of watches they can sell.
That I presume is what they mean by Limited Edition.
As long as there are uninformed buyers out there paying for the brand name and look... Panerai won't do a thing. Most people who I know, who own a Rolex have zero idea what movement is in their watch! That's the Panerai target market :)
If the copies are so indistinguishable from the real ones that even the ADs cannot know for certain which is which, I think that it makes perfect sense to buy an exact non-Panerai Panerai...and save over 90% of the price.
But you know it’s a fake, so why wear. It? I don’t get fakes.
@@rickb.4168 Maybe folks like the Rolex look and design but not the prices and unavailability. Maybe they want the status without the cost of an original Rolex.
@@kaunas888 status with a fake? Haha! Nope.
@@jonirwin7316 That is only if folks do not find out that it is a fake...
Panerai remains an amazing watch with a history behind that gives a good balance between smart /casual/sporty, the bulky look ideal for people with large wrist /hands, exclusive lock for the crown which makes the watch recognizable at distance…. Tudor, Rolex, omega and others sometimes look the same from far , ….AP and Hublot have very similar models, lets not talk about Richard Mille hublot Spirit of big bang they get confused often, Panerai is unique in its style… and btw how fair is to compare brands with totally dofferent price range…
Lets talk about the power reserve? How cool is that? sometimes i don’t use mine for a couple of days and I can just look at the power reserve indicator as if it was a fuel indicator in the car and i know if I need to wind it or not… and now they offer 8 years warranty… i am not sure that many brands offer such a long term warranty… i am not saying it is perfect and I think many statements in this video are based on true but lets not forget each brand have pros and cons…
Couldn't agree more.
BTW, Cartier and JLC also offers 8 years warranty.
But watches should never be heavily relied on style, style and design can be and will be copied. People still buy Rolex because the quality at MSRP is decent. The same for omega and JLC. Can’t say the same about Panerai. The 9010 movements don’t even hack, you can’t excuse corporate greed.
you forgot to mention snap-on case backs 😂 dive watches with snap on backs and 30m water resistance... umm... Richement board room decisions I bet.
Agree with all your points on panerai. That's my issues with the brand too. I have an on again off again love fest with panerai but can't bring myself to buy a new or used one.
Love my Pam 323. I own a lot of nice watches and it’s still my favourite. All I’ve seen lately are Rolex copies. If you know how, where and what to buy it’s not difficult.
Great video. I won’t buy any more pams. I got the 317 and 292. That’s more than enough
Great info! Was seriously considering getting a Luminor - no longer.
You can still buy a great Luminor, but you have to know the right one. The Due line up is crap and the older Luminors (2000-2012) do have some great models. Just my 2 cents.
I have one it's used very nice ugh$900 no box no papers lmfao
Love my pam279 titanium. Great watch. Sucks the resell value has gone down so much.
Love to know how often anyone every uses a paneRai for diving. We use dive computers, this is a ridiculous argument and 30m is enough for most casual diving anyway
Despite the very high prices from what I have heard Panerai has a history of unacceptable cost cutting. I have heard that their latest tactic in response to dropping sales is to cheapen the product even more. One has to wonder about what management is thinking. They managed to become very popular and profitable company in a very short time...and then they have just frittered it away due to greed and short term thinking.
2 years ago my dear wife treated me on a nice watch of my choosing for a wedding anniversary. I was kinda interested in the Panerai with 8 days handwinding movement - but in the end I choose the Nomos Tangente 41 Update, I find it more elegant and more special. Unlike the Panerai, I know I will not get tired of the Nomos. 2 other watches I considered were the Drive De Cartier (very nice, but too bling for my taste) and a Rolex Oyster Perpetual with grey dial - which was nice enough but lacked something.
I'm so pissed off.
I had my Panerai 312 serviced in January 2020 at a not authorised watch shop in Scotland and now it needs a new balance wheel.
The shop has closed due to Covid.
Panerai won't sell me a balance wheel.
I have to get it fixed with them.
Not happy about this.
If I had my BMW serviced and none approved garage BMW would still sell me parts.
Really changed my thoughts about panerai.
PS love the channel
I bought my 388 last Nov, preowned, triple box papers etc. Keeps crappy time, but its still my fav watch in my collection.
What do you think of the pam1086. I’m so close on getting one or the IWC spitfire. Thanks
I have a PAM 001 with a solid case back, I agree that Panerai in the beginning was great but it’s like the Omega Speedmasters with all the special and limited editions that mean nothing
I kinda built my own panerai lol. eta 6497, a case and a dial and hands.. wasnt hard or anything.
Hey Jory love your videos man. I just got a PAM 960 I haven’t found much information about the movement would appreciate your insight on this.
This needs an update. Some cool Panerai models have come out since this video was posted, including the new 40mm Luminors, waterproof to 100M.
No problem with the video, the fact that Panari is counterfeited a lot goes to how attractive they are. My favorite is the PAM00171. They should definitely do more to protect the brand when it comes to quality, design, and counterfeiting.
When you have companies like island watches selling watches that have sapphire, hacking, winding for a fraction of the cost, you realize how much these companies try to rip ppl off not only that they are marketing to ppl who live watches but also know about other brands and difference in the watch industry, they will go under in my opinion, or the damage they will do to their reputation will be really hard, basically you are paying for the case.
You’re spot on, I love seeing great critiques.
What is a dive watch and its difference from a dive style watch? certification? 200 m plus water resistent
I like your feedback. thoughts on the PAM244? I've been looking for a unique GMT that has crazy durability and this seems to still have the 300m WR
If you were to buy paneri which production years movements and models would you stick with or would you just not touch it ? @thetimeteller
This is one of your best videos. Good job.
I'm glad I saw this before I looked for a Panerai.
Cortebert made the original Panerai movements which they supplied to Rolex who used them in the Radiomir 3646. It was movement Rolex Cal. 618 Type 1c
I somewhat agree with your points except water resistance. Not planning on swimming with a 20k watch. I buy divers because I like the watch not cuz I plan on diving.
I own Rolex Sub, IWC transitional big pilot, IWC miramar triple date ceramic and of course Panerai. Out of all my watches I love my Panerai 1104 (Panerai movement). I get a lot of good comments above all my other watches on my Panerai.
@thetimeteller I love this video! You're angry for a good reason. The problem starts at the moment users and collectors begin to buy plain, ordinary tool watches like Panerai, Rolex, Doxa, Tudor, Omega, etc. as high end horology time pieces. They're not and they're not meant to be. Dive watches were constructed for the military as a part of the outfit and had to be reliable and cheap. A government supplies it soldiers with affordable pistols, but no civilian would buy the exact one for $20.000 and it happens with watches all the time, so the prices became outrageous and the watches … are still only a piece of tool.
Bought my 000 eight years ago, still love the watch but so disappointed in the brand. 😥
Same! I'm glad I got it before the WR became 100 meters lol. I get women asking what watch is that ? I like it 👀
Love my pam1312. Its a shame, such a versatile watch. New versions looking pretty sweet too. But unfortunately they have gotten lazy
You are absolutely right! Panerai should watch this, and address this!
Why, the people who buy 20.000 watches, buy then in a shop. All the other poor garbage who want to buy them second hand, are not worth to even take in account... If you have not two lambo, some Ferraris and some houses, who cares about you... You are a person 2nd class, a person of no interest...
@@alx252 You are extremely negative, full of negative energy. And that is repelling.
Okay - Panerai has been quietly revamping their entire product line. The new PAM 915 - an AMAZING update to the 111 (rated to 300 meter). My personal fav - the PAM 960 (also rated to 300 meters). They have locked down their distribution, so their prices are holding very steady, few deals are gone, you will pay to get back into the new club. As for fakes; that has nothing to do with Panerai production facilities; that is just fake news.
Ps - I wouldn’t be wearing a 20k Gold watch diving anyway.
I have my Panerai pm568 and it is discontinued and it is still brand new. I don't know how much is the resale ratio
Didnt know that about the Brooklin bridge piece....what a shame!
8:17 ... So you actually expect this, $20k plus, GOLD watch to be used for scuba diving? I find it bordering on pedantic to bemoan the 30m water resistance on a watch that is, clearly, NEVER going to be worn underwater. Panerai makes actual Subermersible watches for that purpose. And I can confidently claim that pretty much ALL Panerai owners buy the watches for their distinctive style and do not intend to wear them wreck diving at 300 feet below. That's why the Kodiak leather straps are no longer standard on the Pams either.
I have had a Parnis titanium Luminor, with a Seagull auto movement for 15 years, with NO problems. Also just bought a Steeldive 'Cpt.Willard'. Terrific...£120
It's really too bad that they got lazy and people have stopped trusting their products. Especially when they have such a cool past history with Rolex.
I own 3 panerai. If it doesn’t say marina or submersible check the water resistance. Unfortunately the crown guard is so iconic they have incorporated it into their dress watches like the ones you mentioned. They tried to keep their dress watches separate by only incorporating them into the radiomir collection but there was a clear demand for them. In my opinion everything went downhill as soon as they tried to cater to the mass market.
Totally agree, with that price tags common, that why I got a seiko 5, 10 bar WR and under 200usd
Great vid, and 100% correct.
Panerai is really getting lazy and is raising prices at the same time just because they think that people will keep buying...
Simple, keep your box, papers, receipt from the authorized retailer.
I have always thought the crown guards looked ludicrous. But then they release a watch with those ridiculous looking crown guards and only 30m water resistance? Why not just release them as Radiomir models then?
Thank you for your infornative insights to the current state of Panarai after year 2005
At last , Someone came out and said it , out loud ! You have my respect !
Man I finally caught one of your uploads I subbed when you had 98k subs and your videos are great! You also got me interested into tank watches!
Greetings from California!
Edit: the 30m water resistance with that crown guard is hilarious 😂
The only watch i own is a panerai , the same as you but from 2015, and i agree, when I saw online that in 2000 they had the engraving i panicked that mine was a fake, had it checked and it was cool but yeah wtf.
Interesting.
For me the look of the watch is the main reason would never buy this watch. Even the 25€ fake :|
Really good points. You win your case.
What are your thoughts on the company are gone and their watches
My problem with Panerai is their product catalog, holy crap how many Submersibles are there? Bronze green dial, blue dial, then with power reserve, and then the original Carbotech followed by green markers Carbo, then blue. Not to mention the massive collection of the Luminors with the GMT, the power reserve, sandiwch dial, sausage dial, just too much. How am I supposed to recommend this brand to my friends? I love my PAMs, just confused with the brand direction.
I just bought a Panerai 320 GMT in 44 mm recently on 30th August 2020,....I LOVE BIG Size watches in 44 mm and 47 mm, a Centralized hour and minute hand is a MUST.....I don't like small moon separate hour and minute hand, as many complicated watches nowadays have NOT a centralized hour and minute hands.........28,800 VPH (Vibration per hour) in 4 Hz is also a must for an accuracy which is Panerai pam 320 having 28,800 vph movement......previously, I have 3 Hz watches and always NOT Accurate..........Panerai 320 GMT has an IN House watch movement with a 3 Days Power Reserved in the back side watch movement in automatic..........IN HOUSE movement is also a MUST in watches nowadays.........Customers are becoming more choosy and always demand the best mechanical watches with NO Battery on the watch movement......Automatic and Hand Winding are my choice of watches.......Beside Panerai pam 320 GMT in 44 mm, I also have a Panerai 297 GMT in 44 mm as well as popular Panerai 372 in 47 mm in Plexiglass........Italiano certainly knew how to design a good BIG SIZE Watches........Luminor is my favorite.......Radiomir, Submersible.....are NOT my favorite in Panerai.......44 mm and 47 mm are my favorite BIG Size watches.........so I guess I am a Paneristi.......watch collector....Thanks for reading...O:))
You know, it was about the time when I was wanting to buy a Panerai I began to notice this trend of Panerai just giving up. Instead of sandwich, you get sausage dials. Instead of cool decorated movements, you get basic shit. Why they never bothered improving their water resistance is beyond me...especially given their size.
Their catalog is confusing as shit also. You'll have what are seemingly two near-identical watches that are several thousand dollars in price difference.
I love the Panerai aesthetic, but it's hard for them to justify their cost when there's a dozen microbrands that can make almost the exact same thing...for substantially cheaper and often better.
I cannot agree more! I love Panerai watches, the history, the looks, etc, especially a simple two hander. But the company is just completely lost. The Due is a joke, but it had so much potential. If they’re going to keep the Crown Protecting Device, make it properly water resistant. Otherwise, just give it a simple crown like the Radiomir. I do like the new materials they’re experimenting with, but the extra lume on the case is just a silly gimmick. I really hope they get it together soon.
have you ever been nearby 20 meters under water?
When your most interesting qualities are the things you own, it must seem reasonable to get upset when those things are undermined.
they have crown guards in case your bidet water splashes up.
OMG!!!! I’m so glad I just watched your video!!! Here’s why: about a week ago I passed by a store that sells pre-owned timepieces and I saw a Panerai PAM 194 2500m in titanium that has been in their window for over 3 years and is not selling. He wants $10,500 for it and is missing some of the papers but has the box and part of the papers. I had no idea that there were fakes of Panerai watches until I watched your video and another video a few minutes ago. Then after you mentioned that even dealers will not buy a Panerai with box and papers I realized that should I buy the watch I would have a paperweight on my hands that would have cost me $10,500.
You are also right about the ETA movements because having a timepiece with an ETA movement is not necessarily a bad thing and some of them perform better than in-house movements. Thanks for uploading
I do have a question: is it possible for there to be a fake PAM 194 2500m titanium divers with a tritium dial? Should I avoid that watch after what you said in your video? Because I did own this watch previously and when I tried to sell it years ago I had a hard time selling it even with box and papers. Please let me know and thanks
I had a issue I m very disappointed about seiko 5 SNK375K1 automatic I bought it new but it's out of alignment little bit , and I'm scared buying more seiko any help to repair the watch please.
"All fur coat with no knickers" comes to mind when I see 30m WR. I like the original styling but those Panerai lack integrity in design. Like those Chinese knock-offs. ☘
I own a PAM00915 & i love it and its not fake i own papers and serial numbers & i bought it from the store directly, that's sad people are selling fakes out here. Ive love this watch since i seen Sylvester Stallone wear it in the movie day light & Arnold Schwarzenegger in Eraser!!! loved it ever since..
I love my 111 and would like to get a submersible.
i have a question why do you have scratches on your time piece Ouch! Bro
I’ve never been tempted to buy a replica, but I’ll make an exception for a Panerai
I am tempted also! But there are copies of replicas also...
the marketing department must be amazing to pull this trick off. Calling seiko stupid and garbage but hooray a 20k panerai.
I totally agree. I've seen some high end expensive clones look and work better than the genuine ones. Like the Brooklyn bridge special, that kind of quality is just not acceptable.
wow,! i was planning to get a pam 1313, wow now i am having second thoughts already
As if Panerai is gonna lose sleep 😂
I’m a little confused, why didn’t you tell which watch specifically to buy because you were over so many watches I don’t know which watch is the one to get?