When you choose to play these types of racing games you're making the choice to play the game the way that think you should play. Microsoft and Sony want complete control of your experience.
If games like GT, F1 and Forza didn't exist, would Sims like ACC, iRacing, AC, RF2 etc. have as large of a player base as they do right now?? That's a very important question sim elitist should ask themselves....Cause I highly doubt anyone would jump from Need for speed to iRacing and say "wow, this is amazing" lol
Yes. Would GT, F1, Forza exist if not for Atari Night Driver (Racing game I grew up playing), Pole Position, Daytona USA, etc.? Games evolve to fill different market needs. Even today, new racing titles are in development.
No one knows the answer to this question. Would X-Plane or Microsoft Flight Simulator not exist if not for Ace Combat? No one has a time machine to run this experiment back.
@@JonRacesCarsBoth of you asked if they would exist. They could exist, the question is if as many people would be playing them. GT3 and GT4 are two of the best selling games of their generation, they introduced millions of people to a pseudo-realistic racing game. You can't use a wheel on NFS, it's hard to argue you should buy one if you can't use it on anything but a sim. It's an extra step that people who have played a simcade would be willing to make more than if they were playing an arcade game
I jumped from nothing to ams2/ac/iracing, and what drew me in is that the physics and equipment these days can essentially mean that outside of the G-forces, you're essentially driving a racecar. A priceless experience I can do whenever I want. Iracing with a strong DD and a quest3 powered b a 7800x3dl is just so incredible to me. If more people knew this experience was even possible, it would blow up. But if a game isn't attempting to actually simulate a racecar, what's the point?
I love playing GT7 for some reason. I love the menus, the little sound effects, the whole vibe is so relaxing after a hard day at work with a few beers. Plus the driving is a delight in it, in VR it's incredible. It's just cosy -- I think they really tried to make it that way and it shows. No other game has that feeling.
Spot on, particularly regarding the need to just chill after a work day. I have VR as well. It's an escape for many of us. You described the appeal well.
Yeah, because you can literally just drop in and get good racing, not worrying about perfect setups or dealing with custom dedicated servers. Ams2 is the only "sim" that gets somewhat close to that feel.
it was not gt7. it was the fact that u played for a whole year. LOL. If u played acc for a year it would be even more probably. Its the same thing with ppl getting new hardware and being quick. they are not quicker because of the hardware 90% of the time. its that they play more...
@@Icy20 With GT7 you can switch on the console, pick a race and… _race_ . You just get your DR to where it should be (same as you have to in any other sim racer) and you're off. Unlike ACC, the hoppers are actually populated and there's no faffing with setups. GT7's strong suit is that it helps you play more.
i play ACC and iRacing on a daily basis, its my go-to games currently but i do love me some good 'simcade' titles every now and then. its ridiculous how some simracers scoff at the notion that someone has fun with GT7 or a Forza game...
Going from gt7 to ams2 and acc on pc recently, gt7 is definitely not arcade, and I would even say not even a simcade, it’s just a sim with different levels of physics. Just as acc might have better physics than ams2. What I can tell you is, gt7 provides an Apple like experience to multiplayer, most pc sims are akin to unbranded android phones when it comes to multiplayer polish. I’m a sim racer because of gt7, would I be a sim racer because of a pc sim, unlikely, too much jank before the reward.
It’s a shame gt7 creators don’t creat a sister studio to just port the game to pc where it could enjoy higher frame rates, higher fidelity in graphics and physics. It’s seriously hindered by the PlayStation platform. Imagine: 1. Triple screen support 2. High res textures 3. Higher hertz ffb I’ve recently gone from gt7 to pc sims, it felt like going from underwater to back on land, all senses overwhelmed, driving around with a huge smile on my face.
@@speedgoat7496 It's really not hindered by playstation at all though. It's helped by it. One of the biggest reasons GT7 is so impressive is because they were able to focus only on the PS5 as a platform. Same with any playstation exclusive. Not to mention, the budget they have is much bigger because of the playstation platform. It's no coincidence that no PC sim can come close to GT's level of graphical quality or optimization (seriously, native 4k60 or 1440p120 is insane for the PS5's hardware) I'd still love a PC port just so I can play it in VR (I refuse to pay $550 for PSVR 2, and I currently have a quest 2) The crazy thing is GT5 and GT6 supported triple screens on PS3 LOL You needed a PS3 for each monitor but it worked. Not sure why GT Sport and GT7 don't though
@@speedgoat7496 I really want to try GT7 But i find no point in buying it when all my equipment is for PC only Ive been waiting for a PC port for awhile but theres no sign it will be coming
Never understood gatekeepers. What do they expect ? For beginners to sink $3k in a DD rig and iRacing, then not ruin their races because they're, you know, beginners ?
It's so funny how people can get snobby about this. They automatically write off titles like GT7/F1/Forza as toys for kids. They're all games with various levels of detail, and I've equal amounts of fun in all of them.
I always like when the actual race drivers say iRacing sucks and they just say the pros don't know what their talking about racing in virtual models of their own cars, while anything that isn't multiplayer falls to pieces after a few laps and the multiplayer lags out and drops connection.
There's an honorable mention for this: GRID, as a series, peaked as the embodiment of sim cade. Not the most realistic handling, yet simulates the fun of driving a race car, with each of the car drives differently to each other. Especially with 2008, Race Driver GRID, the game was so optimized that the crash model can still work for low-end PCs without sacrificing visual details and graphic, not to mention being able to break each and individual part of the car, giving you a sense of mechanical symphathy.
Thanks for this video man! After that, I'll subscribe! When I remember what Gran Turismo has done for the Sim Racing genre since 1997 and I read people calling it "simcade" not in the way you said in the video, but in a pejorative way, makes me feel really sad. The Sim racing community needs to be more united so that one day the genre can be in the spotlight again.
in general the hardcore sim racer scene has so much scorn for anyone who hasn't invested as many thousands as they have on a direct drive wheel and they don't play the right game with the right settings inside the right motion sim rig. it's just so bland and gatekeeperish
Great points in this video, the so-called 'real' sims could learn a lot from the ui, graphic, playthrough and all-round experience designs of the more accessible AAA titles. Thoughtful design doesn't cost anything.
I guess actual race drivers should "look down" on "Real Sim Racers" who play "Real Sim titles". Let everyone enjoy what they want. Most of us came up on Need for Speed and other similar games. Very few people get into gaming and go straight to "Real Sim titles"
Up until recently, they did. Pro racers used to come from go-karting or dirt oval racing. They used to laugh at the idea of sim drivers coming to the real world. Now, you can't even be competitive without adding sim driving to your training. So, the newer generation of drivers are less apt to look down at sim racing, because they compete there as well.
Idk, i played nothing but GT5/GT6 with a wheel and then eventually got into autocross and won the local championship in my first full year, I owe what I know about driving to those games. If it translates that well then it’s real enough to me. At the end of the day, even if the physics aren’t completely real, the racing sure is.
I got my friend a folding simrig for his birthday and he tried out GT7 in PSVR2 and it blew his mind. Let's face it, 99% of us aren't going to ever drive a Formula 1 vehicle or a GT3 racecar, so why even get caught up about the "simulation" or the "realism" of something that we have no tangible experience with. Forza, GT and Assetto have road cars that you might already have driven or own. The simulation factor in that case is 100 times more useful and relatable then whatever fake LMP1-2-GT3-D-F2-DPI-XYZ you drive in the other video games.
Well you could turn your argument around and since most of us will never drive these racecars that we love, we want the virtual thing to be as close to reality as possible because thats the only contact with these cars that 99,9% of us will ever have.
@@Gralfindel Yes, but will you have the knowledge to say if Game A, B or C is a better simulator or a "simcade"? That's the main problem nowadays. Lots of people who never drive those cars saying that Game A is a better sim then Game B.
What i consider to be the border between simcade and a sim. Is simcade games are designed with gamepads in mind. While sims are designed with FFB wheels in mind. The physics of a simcade, while often good, has to be dulled down to make easily playable with a gamepad.
I agree in a way. You don't need a wheel at all for F1 and Forza. But from my experience with GT, before getting a wheel, I'd get majority bronze in license tests 90% of the time. But with the wheel, i now get gold almost 95% of the time.
I played GTSport and GT7 for years before trying ACC. I am consistently a top 200-300 driver in GT7. Within a week of playing ACC LFM I was a gold driver in very competitive lobbies often finishing in the top 5. It absolutely translates, I actually found ACC easier than GT7 because the force feedback was more informative of what the car is doing. It's rare but sometimes still in GT7 I will lose the car and not really understand why. What GT7 manages to achieve in a single title is honestly mind blowing. It has complicated physics, tire temps, pressure, full weather system, VR, quality online racing system, a flipping ingame fully flushed out social media system to name a few. GT7 is simply the most complete title out there and it's oozing with quality. The tracks and cars are 3D scanned, especially the cars in VR just have insane levels of detail. My two biggest complaints with GT7 is the sound still isn't that good and I hate that you can abuse downshifting without consequences. I've tried all of the simracing titles out there and I keep coming back to GT7. It's the most fun and the most efficient experience to just hop on and play whether I want to relax or tryhard.
Bro, This. Sim racers got too much into a "tribal" sensation of being part of something, related to how hard the game is. So harder means you tamed the beast. And with that, we nowadays forgive HORRENDOUS menus, navegability, and crazy ways of configure a simple match between you and your friends. A lot of those games are in development for over 10 years, and still appearing ones where the steering wheel is not enough to navigate in the menu. You need keyboard, mouse etc etc. I have friends who likes cars, not big car fans, but enjoy they as they enjoy playing cod or dota. And thats enough. But is incredibly hard to put them with me and enjoy a nice match in nice sims, in comparison with F1 2019, wreckfest or even EuroTruck Simulator. And is nothing related to the car behaviour and laptime performance yadayadayada. Its due to the clunky menus and why mine G29 is working with FFB and my friend isn't, or why my friend can see my server but the other one can't, of a friend fell of the server, and I need to pass a freakin codeline just to restart the match. The hardest task in every industry is not to go crazy specific in something, is to make something simply good for everybody. And GT, Forza, F1, and even other games out of the racing genre such as the classic steam titles, still have a lot to teach to other dev studios.
Simcades have this funny little quirk called "Being good." Racing sims should try it sometime. Still waiting on one with more budget than pocket lint and grandma's PC in the closet.
@@gianpierorozzi495 Correct but Asseto Corsa launching a settings menu in a separate window ( that 0 other modern games do) does. Racing sims are *technologically* cheaply made.
@@NegitoroIsBestShip as you said “modern games” and assetto corsa isnt one of em. And assetto corsa still one of the best simulator ever made. Look at the smoke when a tire spins on the ground, its perfect, look at it on f1 23, its shit
@@gianpierorozzi495 My guy AC is on the ps4. It’s a modern game, it’s peers of which, are organized and put together with better software than its own. Definitely not Forza 2023 though. Hey, we all get bad games lol.
Gran Turismo has been making a solid effort to close the gap in physics realism to iRacing, ACC etc. There's still a gap, but all the tweaks made over the past couple years since the launch of GT7 have added up to a big jump in realism vs GT Sport, but has not reduced accessibility at all. If only they could remember how to make an engaging single player campaign, and manage to upscale the new AI system to replace the shite old one in all single player races and we could have a properly groundbreaking game. Fingers crossed for GT8 in 2030!
I liked your voiced emphasis on "real" simulators. I can't stand snobs and elitists, gatekeepers, etc, who denigrate others. Actually, I feel sorry for some (but not alll) of them. Great video.
What I’ve found is the real elite drivers will play a SimCade if they have channel they may post a review. Never do you hear them criticise what a SimCade is. What’s more they will play F1 multiplayer and when someone rams into them. They don’t get upset and rage about cheaters they laugh it off as it’s no big deal. Even if they get beat by someone using max assists. They will even compliment pad and assist driver for being able to achieve such a thing, But then EA answers gets flooded with complaints from others that controllers and assists are overpowered and either separate controller and wheel users or nerf assists and pads. Then they go crazy cause they got break checked in an open lobby. Er well it’s an open lobby. But they name and shame and demand they be banned. But what I now know to be a common factor with these Elitists is. They spent thousands on a sim rig. Sweat all day everyday. Then they get beat by someone using a controller and assists. So they blame F1 the game for being to arcade and believe if it was s proper sim they would never get beat by a kid and s pad. They don’t for a second consider the fact just cause they got all the gear and put in the time doesn’t make them any good. some people just can’t except their hand eye has no feel for racing Sorry going to stop posting now. Couple off years worth off real sim frustrations pouring out🙄😇
@@Scarduck14 Yea man honestly PC gamers crying about someone with a worse controller beating them is absolutely HILARIOUS. I see it in multiple shooters. Keyboard and Mouse players crying about aim assist being impossible to beat, and wheel users crying about assists as well There's a reason the fastest guys on every sim and simcade use a wheel, and no assists, and there's a reason the best FPS players use mouse and keyboard. Using assists and a controller is simply NOT better, otherwise the best players would be using them to gain an advantage but they aren't
This is why i stopped watching youtube game reviews. Most of the channels are run by the "Real Sim" types. Anything that doesnt drive like Iracing, RF2 or whatever that persons favourite "Real" sim is will never be good enough.
@@jessez8503 that's one thing I respect about Jimmy Broadbent. I'm not a big fan of his but when I've seen his content, he seems to treat everything fairly and has fun playing everything instead of turning his nose up at anything that isn't as realistic as rf2
Agree 100%. To your point: combat flight sims went from very 'arcadey' in the mid-1980s and morphed into "simcade" simulators in the mid-1990s, finally changing to "study sims" in the late 1990s. When combat flight simulators made the jump to study sims it was a great thing for enthusiasts, because it finally got us as close as we'll probably ever get to flying real jet fighters. But it also had the effect of essentially ruining an entire genre of games for the other 99% of gamers. Only an enthusiast wants to fly a simulator where it takes reading books and studying just to learn to run the radar, let alone how to do everything else. As a result we now have study sims (DCS, Falcon BMS) and then we have full-on arcade games like Ace Combat, and basically nothing in between. There is definitely a market space for simcades like Forza and Gran Turismo, and I hope they never stop making these games.
I'm tired of seeing "simracers" wrongly judge all sorts of games despite their sheer lack of any real racing experience to back it up with, every single time.🤦🏻 On top of that they have literally no real racing experience to back their claims of "this is a sim, and this is not"
Exactly. Even sims are definitely not as realistic as they seem. as we all see in Jann Mardenborough's career. showing that transitioning sim-racing to real-life is hard.
No matter how "real" a simracing game is, at the end of the day is just a videogame and most of the realism comes from how much you will allow to trick your mind to believe this is a like the real deal.
Having grew up in the days off pole position you really did need s lot of imagination. But that said atleast it conditioned me to understand If the gameplay is good the game is good. On EA answers people will post enraged that the clouds don’t look real or the trees are to green. When playing F1 games I’m concentrating on my marks and looking at where I want my car to go. Although it’s nice having detailed environments but games are for playing not looking at
I got so many hate comments from the F1 community, especially the Max Verstappen fanbase when I disagree about Max Verstappen that sim racing is still not just a video game and they said "Lol you're just bad bro" LMAO. I bet half don't know what the f*** dampers and Sway bars do. None of them touches the differentials 🤣
It's not just a video game though. Real-life drivers use these sim programs for training tracks and retaining their skills. So the authenticity of the sim and what it's teaching you are critically important.
Thank you. I love simcade racing games. I will never progress into full sims (although I own almost all the sim titles for some reason) I just like to have fun driving offline races. And leave the harsh wordings and intimidation to the people with egos a lot bigger than me.
As much as elitists don't wanna say, these are video-games. Iracing, Assetto Corsa, ACC, Richard Burns, etc. These are all video-games who happens to be simulator. The average person, even the average person who has a wheel, will play sims and sim-cades as video-games. And here's the thing, sim-cades are better video-games than sim racing games. You can like the sim racing games better, I personally prefer playing Assetto Corsa than sim-cades on my wheel, but I do understand that as a complete video-game Forza or Grand Turismo are objectively better, because of all the reasons you listed on the video.
I’m really into SIM racing, but sometimes it feels like I’m racing by myself, especially in those long endurance races. Once everyone gets into their pace, there’s not much overtaking or action. But I do love firing up GT7 or EA WRC every now and then. All that SIM racing has definitely made me better at avoiding crashes and finding the fastest line. From what I’ve seen, getting started in simcade games is pretty easy, but if you want to be one of the best, you’ve still got to put in the time and really get what’s going on. Great video btw!
Being a racing sim basically means that you're a bit more in depth in some aspects than a simcade but have 2010 graphics/sound, charge ridiculous prices for tracks and cars a la carte, have game breaking bugs and network issues and have an absolutely awful UI that even autists have issue navigating.
Many real racing driver train on the sim, and you expect from a driver to look at the graphics? They just want to improve their skills, so they want a place to train even if they are out from their car
Nailed it especially when you talked about the flaws in simulation titles. The truth is that nothing for the consumer market is even close to what real race teams get to use. By the time we get a new racing title, most of the manufacturer secrets are watered down or approximated by the developers. Getting lost in the argument about realism is a moot point since the vast majority of us will never drive a race car at the limit. As long as it is close enough to provide a believable, competitive experience, I'm happy. At the end of the day, racing is about getting the most out of your vehicle in the circumstances you're in and simcade titles can provide that experience just as well as simulation titles.
The thing about simcades is that they still follow close to real-world physics, but with some degree of simplification and idealization of the way cars should behave on race tracks, usually in the name of accessibility (and simcade is typically a spectrum between more similar to arcade racing and more similar to sim racing). For instance, Gran Turismo strikes a very effective balance, in that it still accurately models things like the effects of horsepower, weight, tire compounds, car setups, and downforce on lap times, however the minutiae of things like track and ambient temperatures are dealt with offscreen, and the handling model is a bit more forgiving (and significantly more accessible) than in say, iRacing, rFactor, or Assetto Corsa, which means expert hotlappers can take more risks and thus set slightly faster laps with the same cars.
It all started with Gran Turismo 1, Road and track:Need For Speed Andretti Racing, Destruction Derby, Collin McRae on PS1 for me. The Playstation 1 will always hold a special place for me since it really got me into motorsports with the plethora of titles they brought out to get me into sim racing today.
Geoff Crammond, maker of the original Formula 1 GP Game, once said something in the lines of "it is not so important that it is real from a physics standpoint, it's more import that it feels real for the player" (I cannot really recall his words, that's like 30 years ago.) But if he said it or not, that's what I think. Never forget, you still lack some feedback from the car, so if you are 100% accurate in physics, the funny thing is that it can still feel off, while if you find ways to compensate for the lack of feedback, something less realistic may even feel more real. This may not be absolute true in 2023, due to motion rigs and VR that make up for most of the feedback, but if you remember older "Sims" you will proably agree that they were shitty to drive, probably most cars would be easier to drive in real life than they were in the Sim. (GTR comes to mind). This is mostly not due to the sim being not that good but much more due to the fact that you just lack all the feedback a real car gives you. So imho there is a point between 100% realistic physics and Arcade that hits the sweetspot, not being so realistic that the lacking feedback becomes a problem and still feel "real". As someone with some real life driving skills and many, many miles on road and track I think a good simcade like GT Sport or something may even recall the real driving experience better in some cases than a full fledged sim, as crazy as this sounds. That point on which the driving experience feels really good shifts more towards sims as time goes on, just because you have VR and motion rigs and more that make up for the lack of feedback, and you simply have more computing power to make your tire model and contact point calculation so much better. At the end I will say that the very best driving experience I ever had is Assetto Corsa Street Cars in VR, that's the closest I ever felt to the real deal. But right now I'm in GT7 and love it. So I don't really see a fight between Simcade and Sim.
Best video I’ve watched in an age. I’m a “champion” on EA Answers for F1 and now WRC. Another champion sent me the link to this video and said I’m gunna fall in love. Not a week goes by where i try to explain to people that post wanting F1 to be hardcore sim. Every you layed out perfectly in this video. But still they do not get it. I have all the time in the world for those who are frustrated and angry with the games issues. But I do get triggered when elitists post things such as real sim racers spend 1000s their rigs so the game should be full sim first. I put in around 1000 hours every year on F1 and I use a controller 👍 Thanks I don’t need to type out same replies to hardcore sim post any longer. Just going to reply with link to this video
This actually I’ve only done 350. And because the game is so poorly balanced and bad implementation of F1 world has created serious problems in the core single player modes. I spent more time trying to recreate issues that had been raised on EA answers and then hours looking for work arounds. Ive finally had enough. Weirdly EA CMs have been a great help. But since David Greco left no one at Codies has filled the huge gap he left engaging on EA forums. But WRC launched and once my muscle memory in my fingers learned to do the opposite off what I’ve always known as a circuit SimCader. I first stopped flying off mountains and to my doom. And every time I nail a stage. The game makes me feel like a very excited god. Then the last patch dropped and now we are all being ripped apart in screen tearing hell 🙄😂
If u put the features, graphics, single player from simcades with iRacing physics, multiplayer and Assetto Corsa modding you would have the ultimate game
I would prefer rf2 physics instead of iRacing, but it's still a good point nonetheless. Maybe the upcoming AC2 or even Rennsport could be that ultimate dream game we've all been craving.
@@brett22bt idk about rennsport, but AC2 can definitely be that ultimate, one that triumphs all game and thats why im really hyped for it. we've already seen the potential with acc and their gt3s so how better would it be if it was expanded to other types
@@gervee_desu Yeah, I agree that AC2 definitely has more potential than Rennsport. Hopefully, AC2 will have a better user interface this time around and a career mode that makes more sense. I'm really hyped for it as well. I'm not expecting miracles at initial release, but hopefully, they can create something completely game-changing.
This so needed to be said, thank you for making this video. Low-floor high-ceiling products will ALWAYS be more important and more difficult to make than the most extreme enthusiast level stuff, and I say that as someone who primarily goes straight for enthusiast products. They deserve the most respect, and ironically, get the least of it from most enthusiast level snobs. Like, just because I have a V8 Mustang doesn't mean I don't owe almost that entire product SKU's existence to the more affordable V6 and now 4cyl models, so you bet your ass I'm waving to those folks on the road. If it weren't for simcades, the install base for iracing and other racing leagues in rfactor and others wouldn't be nearly the size they are. Or, possibly even worse: not large enough to be financially viable to continue operation. Speaking of.. it's been so many years, I'm so out of the loop - what ever happened to my dear, sweet Live For Speed? Is it dead? I don't wanna look. 😭
Personally i think F1 is executed beautifully and feels mostly authentic. No, ill never experience a real F1 car, so thank goodness for this "simcade."
Slightly related thing: Flight simmers would scorn the (then) new MSFS (2020) because, and I quote: "The menu looks like a game." So yeah, just because it was more accessible (by having a moden menu system) compared to the FSX-based (2006) sims that dominated the market before MSFS 2020 released, it was labelled as unrealistic. Its amazing to think back at this and see how stuck in the mud people who use old software and refuse to move on are.
I’m glad you made this video. It’s nice to see someone who appreciates all kinds of racing titles. There are so many out there that will just crap on the console titles because they aren’t “hardcore man” but they forget where they started out. About 99 percent of them were on a controller with an arcade game. At the beginning of their racing journey. Some of those titles have now moved into simcade. And I truly believe, because of those titles, in particular Gran Turismo, have inspired many other titles hardcore or not to be created. I’ve played plenty of iracing, AC with mods, ACC, RF1/2, Race Room. I’ve enjoyed them all. I love iracing and AC and ACC the most out of these more serious sims. But I always come back to GT7. It’s what I play the most. I even play F1 for my career, but I’ve been burnt out a bit with doing my driver career every year lol. So GT7 is my favorite racing game to play these days. I love it. It’s got a physics engine I enjoy. It’s not over the top hardcore, but it’s still satisfying and challenging enough and more forgiving and I really love the franchise.
Meanwhile, RBR fans expect 11 year-olds to download a sim released before they were born, with outdated graphics, and for them to enjoy it. Just like we don’t teach Shakespeare in kindergarten, these die-hard fans need to understand that before you get to a masterpiece, you need to fall in love with reading first. And that’s what WRC, Forza and GT do, they help newcomers fall in love, before they naturally gravitate to “proper sims.” We should celebrate these games, not shoot them down. Love this video!
I think that gran turismo and forza have a pretty good approach for fun and sim games. Both you can play after a working day with a controller on your couch, justo to have some fun or play in a more serius manner on your sim wheel. On sims i need to mount the wheel on the support, start the pc, config everithing, go through a crappy menu and just race. I think that Project Cars 2 had one of the best approachs for the common player and simracer, just needed more time of development and more updates.
Gt7 on a full dd rig and vr is as real as like it you can even get haptic feedback and telemetry by connecting the ps5 to a pc with simhub its getting really good
1. most so called ''console racing sims/games'' ui's do look nice but they are often pain to use imo. feels like they go looks over function. My favorite UI goes with probably new iracing ui most things are very easily found there. 2. career mode is always nice to have iracing has said that they are working on career mode atm
Gran Turismo is e most important racing game ever made and continues to be one of the most beloved and recognized names in anything. It may not be on the bleeding edge of realism but that doesn’t mean it’s not good at what it does. I’d argue there are few “complete packages” on every level as good as a GT game.
Just play what you like. If you have a blast playing Mario Kart, good for you. If you are a serious hobbyist and wear a fire suit while sitting in a 50k sim rig, good for you. Fun is all that matters.
I agree with your opinion RC. This is a video that could have done 10 years ago. So many gamers have been brainwashed by Sim-racing social media influences into thinking that sim-racing is superior and "simcades" and arcade racing games are a waste of time. These people are usually older gamers that have a lot of disposable income to spend on high-end wheels and rigs and they take sim-racing way too seriously I think in order to justify the expense to their family. They forget that racing games were really good before the home force-feedback wheel existed. There are so many great "simcade" and arcade racing games to play, people who turn their noses up at those games are fools. There is a lot more variety in the games of the past than there is today. I enjoy sim-racing but I'm not a snob about it. I sim-race with a pad, keyboard or my wheel. I don't see sim-racing as superior to an arcade racing just different. As a veteran gamer I would really struggle to put a sim-racing title in my top 10 favourite racing games.
Wdym, you are driving on a track, with a race car, you are not driving youre car on the public road. Its a totally different way to drive, you can’t say its not that hard. And the thing that makes a sim racing game, its not the difficulty but the realism instead. Having realism automatically cause a raised difficulty level.
@@gianpierorozzi495 When you have professional drivers criticizing games/sims about their unrealistic handling, levels of grip etc saying that the real world cars are far easier to drive than the digital counterparts.
Great video, I agree with all your points, and as someone who has spent many hours behind the wheel in proper sims and simcades over the years, Ive now settled on sim-cades as my end game. They provide 95% of the driving characteristics I want in a racing title, and serve up exactly the content that Im looking for, but even more than this, Forza especially gives me the ability to race online multiplayer in obscure content that i'll never find in public AC lobbies or leagues, sure im not facing a full grid of some cars, but at least I can configure my own car with particular upgrades and livery to match.
What I've been saying for years. Thanks for the validation RC 👍🏽😂 You don't need (a mostly broken in hindsight) hi-fidelity physics model to race/drive in a realistic manner and have fun
Haters of arcade car racing games seems to forget where they roots came from and how much fun they had at the arcades back in the day and the crazy rig those arcade car racing games had. I enjoy playing GT7 and ACC on my rig but I also love playing those old school good and fun arcade car racing games on it. Just my random rant, lol.
I really like and agree with this video. My favourite thing was your final sentence about fun, I think most people forget that gaming as is meant to be fun. To me simcades are where it's at because you can learn everything you need to that make you fast in proper sims and IRL without loosing that thrill of speed
Before I got into GT7 I thought it was supposed to be the most realistic driving game. I had no idea what a simcade was or any of that. I was just enjoying playing it on my G29, and almost 2 years later I still am.
Well said some nice points on this one. Sim cafes is where most sim racers came from so we shouldn’t hate them, they got us into racing. Reminds me of my video 4 levels of racing game fever.
I enjoy my sims a lot, and I'll have a great time with a simcade too, but why is some beanbag on reddit who's never driven a racecar in their life tyring to tell me what is an authentic sim and what isn't? I've never worried about absolute realism in my racing games because I don't know what driving a real racecar is like. Great video, thanks for sharing.
First game that got me hooked on track racing was Forza Motorsport 4. When I got my Xbox 1 I got a G920 wheel and bought ACC and most expansions. Would I have made that progress without FM4? I don’t think so
Great video, man! I've been thinking for a while that one of the reasons I don't play racing sims more is because of the career modes. I have nothing against a more realistic career structure, but frankly, the restriction just isn't for me. I like the more video gamey Gran Turismo style progression of winning races to get money and buy more cars to race in more events. Instead, most of the road racing sims that are recommended don't have anything like that. Most of them boil down purely to fill the role of competitive online racer or a sandbox. I'd like something else to keep motivating me to play. I don't care if its not totally realistic. This obsession with everything in a "sim" needing to be totally realistic is honestly a total pain. At the end of the day, your simulation is still a video game. And don't tell me that making a simple career mode is really hard. I've done game development. Making menus and a save file that remembers money is really not that difficult. Alex Mail did it for Assetto Corsa, on his own, in unity, and I'm pretty sure it works partially by reading the previous race log that Assetto Corsa has built in. He's also factoring in compatibility for mods and made a system that creates car prices based off performance and other variables. I really don't believe that a full development team of 40 people with access to the game's source code can't throw together a simple career mode. Assetto's current career mode is already half the work. All they need to do is add in race money rewards, car prices, and the ability to choose from the cars you bought for each event and restrictions. I've done this kind of stuff in Java after 4 months of learning it, in high school. And I almost failed that class. Of course a full fledged, deep RPG experience like GT4 isn't easy to make, but I'm just talking about a simple one.
Absolutely correct. I've always said that as long as a sim-cade has great FFB it can be extremely fun and involving. However, its a pity that most sim-cades never get beyond the gamepad controller itself. This is actually at the core of what sets the Gran Turismo series apart from the Forza series. A person going from sitting on a sofa with hardly any effort, to gripping a FFB steering wheel and holding on against the sim "G forces" is a vastly different experience and is really what truly draws a person into it. I always compare the difference to "arm-chair" vs "real world" persons in any area of expertise. The actual physical labour is what truly makes the experience different.
Arcade racers serves as an entry point that attracts people interested in racing and cars. They dont need anything more then a controller to play and this is enough to spark an interest in the genre. Eventually leading people to buy wheels, pedals etc and go into the hardcore sims.
It's funny how some of the comments prove the need for simpler and more accessible games like the ones you mentioned in the video. There are many people who think they have the right to say what other people should or shouldn't like or how they should enjoy the hobby. Anyway, congratulations on the video, RC. Lots of wisdom in your comments.
(realism = fun) as a fact is an idea that needs to be thrown in the bin. When games turn into work, they aren't games anymore. When I first got my simrig (after getting really into F1 2020 during covid, I kept playing online on ACC and various games and just stopped enjoying myself pretty quickly. After a couple weeks I just banned myself from playing online for a bit, I even started messing about trying to drift. I learnt that the number 1 rule is that it has to be fun. ACC I find fun, grinding and paying in iRacing I do not find fun. GT7 I find fun. The very idea of setting up Richard Burns and all the mods and getting it all working I do not find fun. Etc.
It sucks that you have to buy a console to play them, then there is the micro-transactions, the monitoring and control with persistent online connections, the data collecting, $100 Ultimate versions ($100 VIP pack) (just corny), the strange DLC packs, such as Doritos car pack DLCs, or Hot Wheels DLC, Barbie or any other DLC pack they can think of for whatever is hot or trending at the moment. Some people like those I know, I just find them really corny.
Really appreciate seeing this, especially after recently giving Forza a try even after all the negativity around the game. I actually found the game to be pretty fun to drive after messing with wheel settings and really enjoyable. It has its flaws sure but I've been liking the game for what it is and on PC there isn't any build your own car track racer so it fills the spot of GT 7 for me on PC.
I agree with this, these games are like gateway drugs to get into sim racing. You start playing then get addicted and start venturing to harder and more realistic sims.
A simcade is just a sim with a decent single player career mode bolted on. The truth is there is no "real" sim available on PC or console, this is proven by the fact that the same car on the same track feels completely different in the games typically considered as sims, such as iRacing, ACC, AC, and rF2.
I look sim and simcade like laser scanning vs handmade tracks. One is millimetre accurate, but sometimes the hand made tracks can still feel very right even if it's not 1:1 representation. Physics in sim and simcade is the same imo
I think comparing with this whole arcade simcade sim thing is silly, like it’s just segmenting this genre into multiple smaller segments and over complicating things
Spot on. FH4 is how I got into sim racing 2 years ago. Now I live with a full DD cockpit and VR rig, over 1500 hours on Forza titles, 500h in AC and a race car IRL. The complexity of ACC is off-putting even to this day.
If they sell project car 3 as a DLC or a setting (like light or arcade mode) to the PC2 game, I think it can lure more people in to the "simulation" title.
I agree with the sentiment that simcades are very important and that not only they have their place, they are important for the simracing hobby as a whole as well. Pretending they are even remotely close to actual sims on the driving aspect is just beyond silly though, simulators have much more detailment going under the hood than your average simcade with 600 cars could ever dream of.
So yeah my complain about simracing other than the elitist attitude of the community is The UI. Most UI in simracing is like made under the impression of for "commercial and corporate" use stuffs and its struggling to use for average users including me.
Simcade is just a meaningless term coined by people who aren’t professional race car drivers but want to feel better about themselves for playing a particular video game.
Great video. Not one of those elitest wannabes trying to destroy what made sim racing what it is today. Gt can be downed by the elitests..... It is the gran daddy, and it's was the inspiration for all sim titles that came after. ACC (my other title of choice) has a very straight forward UI, is presented well, a freaking intro video, a video before starting ur season....... So my question is, is ACC now a simcade just because there has been some actual effort put in outside the racing? Luckily I race on, pc and console, gt7, acc and ac. Any of these titles can be a sim or more simplified for a more approachable experience......making something more user friendly...... Why is this classified as a negative by the wannabes? Blows my mind.
Loved the video!. I started playing Forza 3 back in the day but I wasn't too interested in it. when GT7 was released, I gave it a chance and I wasn't a big fan because of the lack of championship like modes. But when I tried online races, something clicked and I couldn't stop playing it. Now I'm a big fan of AMS2 bc and I'm seriously considering buying rfactor 2. Simcades are way more important than some people think.
Excellent video! Shocking how good the lighting in GT7 is and how dull Forza Motorsport is looking... from the ground up my a**. They should really port GT7 to PC.
LOL you say about simcades being pick up and play yet forza motorsports on a wheels has some of the must worst ingame options I have seen, no matter what settings I adjust the racing feels numb even games like dirst 3 have better force feedback, forza motorsports is the one game I was waiting for and its garbage on a wheel passable on a controller
If sims had decent menus, the hobby would be so much popular, I like how you can tune and transform your favorite cars into straight up race cars in Gran Turismo, too bad it won't come to PC
Yes, simcades are very important for simracing itself. BUT, most of negative opinions refers to very poor quality of recent simcades, which is undeniable. Thank you.
its true. I hadnt played racing games since like PS2 era. Decided to try forza because I kind of miss having titles like racing games that you can play over and over and still be challenged by. You can load them up quick and race for hours or 20 mins. I was impressed enough by what racing has become since the old PS2 days, I bought a DD wheel and am starting to get familiar with ACC now.
One thing I didn’t like about most simulators is that a lot of effort put into it is simply to make it work. That’s why most of the time I find myself playing GT7 (because simply will work and launches quickly) and Live For Speed (for the same reason)
Just my individual opinion. If people want Closed Captioning (I don't like them) we can turn them on using the CC button on the video...and by you typing out most of the video you've practically transcribed the thing anyways....we should have the option to turn them off... and it saves you from editing them into the video.
GT7 is a sim physics wise. It has a weak damage model and missing features like camera options. But apparently, to hardcore sim racers, a sim is a barely usabel piece of software - the worse the UX, the more hARDcoRe sIM it is. Joke of a community. Yeah, I came form heavily modded PC AC.
Thank you, before 3yrs ago the only racing i was in to was motocross. Then I found f1 2020 on gamepass thing, i remember playing in Australia and not getting past t3-4. Getting me in to f1 because of those cars. 3 years later i today have a cockpit and wheel mostly playing AC and Dr2, ea wrc
Pretty specific, but in GT7 after tuning the car, the N/A torque per liter is unrealistic even for racecar levels Then you have the wheels spinning the wrong way when reversing and going forward back and forth at very low speeds, like 0.5 km/h And that's about it I guess, there's probably more though
Hmmm ahhh press like and subscribe
alright
Aahhhh
Hmm I guess I will
give a better negotiation (I'm already subscribed)
When you choose to play these types of racing games you're making the choice to play the game the way that think you should play. Microsoft and Sony want complete control of your experience.
If games like GT, F1 and Forza didn't exist, would Sims like ACC, iRacing, AC, RF2 etc. have as large of a player base as they do right now?? That's a very important question sim elitist should ask themselves....Cause I highly doubt anyone would jump from Need for speed to iRacing and say "wow, this is amazing" lol
Yes. Would GT, F1, Forza exist if not for Atari Night Driver (Racing game I grew up playing), Pole Position, Daytona USA, etc.? Games evolve to fill different market needs. Even today, new racing titles are in development.
No one knows the answer to this question. Would X-Plane or Microsoft Flight Simulator not exist if not for Ace Combat? No one has a time machine to run this experiment back.
@@opmike343 I think the first Microsoft Flight Sim has like 13 years on Ace Combat.
@@JonRacesCarsBoth of you asked if they would exist. They could exist, the question is if as many people would be playing them. GT3 and GT4 are two of the best selling games of their generation, they introduced millions of people to a pseudo-realistic racing game. You can't use a wheel on NFS, it's hard to argue you should buy one if you can't use it on anything but a sim. It's an extra step that people who have played a simcade would be willing to make more than if they were playing an arcade game
I jumped from nothing to ams2/ac/iracing, and what drew me in is that the physics and equipment these days can essentially mean that outside of the G-forces, you're essentially driving a racecar. A priceless experience I can do whenever I want. Iracing with a strong DD and a quest3 powered b a 7800x3dl is just so incredible to me. If more people knew this experience was even possible, it would blow up.
But if a game isn't attempting to actually simulate a racecar, what's the point?
You are officially the voice of reason in this hobby of ours. This video is tremendous, RC. Thank you for posting it!
Glad you enjoyed it!
It's also a quite sexy voice might I add lol. Pretty much on par with Billy Strange who has the voice of angels :)
Billy has a voice comparable with Bob Ross. He's on another league.
I love playing GT7 for some reason. I love the menus, the little sound effects, the whole vibe is so relaxing after a hard day at work with a few beers. Plus the driving is a delight in it, in VR it's incredible.
It's just cosy -- I think they really tried to make it that way and it shows.
No other game has that feeling.
Driveclub?
Spot on, particularly regarding the need to just chill after a work day. I have VR as well. It's an escape for many of us. You described the appeal well.
Aesthetically, it is utterly unmatched.
Gt7 isn’t bad and fairly realistic with the right settings
Yeah, because you can literally just drop in and get good racing, not worrying about perfect setups or dealing with custom dedicated servers. Ams2 is the only "sim" that gets somewhat close to that feel.
Playing GT7 for a year made me a second faster than I previously was at ACC 🤷🏾♂️
it was not gt7. it was the fact that u played for a whole year. LOL. If u played acc for a year it would be even more probably. Its the same thing with ppl getting new hardware and being quick. they are not quicker because of the hardware 90% of the time. its that they play more...
@@Icy20 With GT7 you can switch on the console, pick a race and… _race_ . You just get your DR to where it should be (same as you have to in any other sim racer) and you're off. Unlike ACC, the hoppers are actually populated and there's no faffing with setups. GT7's strong suit is that it helps you play more.
@@Catcrumbs EXACTLY
I’m the opposite. Switched from GT7 to ACC for a week and became a second faster in GT7😅.
@@amielterenceSwitched from Gran Turismo Sport to ACC and now iRacing. I was fast on GTS, faster on ACC and now fastest on iRacing,… what’s next 🤔
i play ACC and iRacing on a daily basis, its my go-to games currently but i do love me some good 'simcade' titles every now and then.
its ridiculous how some simracers scoff at the notion that someone has fun with GT7 or a Forza game...
Going from gt7 to ams2 and acc on pc recently, gt7 is definitely not arcade, and I would even say not even a simcade, it’s just a sim with different levels of physics. Just as acc might have better physics than ams2. What I can tell you is, gt7 provides an Apple like experience to multiplayer, most pc sims are akin to unbranded android phones when it comes to multiplayer polish.
I’m a sim racer because of gt7, would I be a sim racer because of a pc sim, unlikely, too much jank before the reward.
Exactly. It's a more casual sim with slightly lower level physics.
It’s a shame gt7 creators don’t creat a sister studio to just port the game to pc where it could enjoy higher frame rates, higher fidelity in graphics and physics. It’s seriously hindered by the PlayStation platform. Imagine:
1. Triple screen support
2. High res textures
3. Higher hertz ffb
I’ve recently gone from gt7 to pc sims, it felt like going from underwater to back on land, all senses overwhelmed, driving around with a huge smile on my face.
@@speedgoat7496 It's really not hindered by playstation at all though. It's helped by it. One of the biggest reasons GT7 is so impressive is because they were able to focus only on the PS5 as a platform. Same with any playstation exclusive. Not to mention, the budget they have is much bigger because of the playstation platform.
It's no coincidence that no PC sim can come close to GT's level of graphical quality or optimization (seriously, native 4k60 or 1440p120 is insane for the PS5's hardware)
I'd still love a PC port just so I can play it in VR (I refuse to pay $550 for PSVR 2, and I currently have a quest 2)
The crazy thing is GT5 and GT6 supported triple screens on PS3 LOL You needed a PS3 for each monitor but it worked. Not sure why GT Sport and GT7 don't though
@@speedgoat7496 I really want to try GT7 But i find no point in buying it when all my equipment is for PC only
Ive been waiting for a PC port for awhile but theres no sign it will be coming
@@Elijah1573 stick to pc, after playing pc sims, gt7 feels sluggish with numb physics.
Never understood gatekeepers. What do they expect ? For beginners to sink $3k in a DD rig and iRacing, then not ruin their races because they're, you know, beginners ?
It's so funny how people can get snobby about this. They automatically write off titles like GT7/F1/Forza as toys for kids. They're all games with various levels of detail, and I've equal amounts of fun in all of them.
I always like when the actual race drivers say iRacing sucks and they just say the pros don't know what their talking about racing in virtual models of their own cars, while anything that isn't multiplayer falls to pieces after a few laps and the multiplayer lags out and drops connection.
There's an honorable mention for this: GRID, as a series, peaked as the embodiment of sim cade. Not the most realistic handling, yet simulates the fun of driving a race car, with each of the car drives differently to each other. Especially with 2008, Race Driver GRID, the game was so optimized that the crash model can still work for low-end PCs without sacrificing visual details and graphic, not to mention being able to break each and individual part of the car, giving you a sense of mechanical symphathy.
Thanks for this video man! After that, I'll subscribe!
When I remember what Gran Turismo has done for the Sim Racing genre since 1997 and I read people calling it "simcade" not in the way you said in the video, but in a pejorative way, makes me feel really sad. The Sim racing community needs to be more united so that one day the genre can be in the spotlight again.
in general the hardcore sim racer scene has so much scorn for anyone who hasn't invested as many thousands as they have on a direct drive wheel and they don't play the right game with the right settings inside the right motion sim rig. it's just so bland and gatekeeperish
Great points in this video, the so-called 'real' sims could learn a lot from the ui, graphic, playthrough and all-round experience designs of the more accessible AAA titles. Thoughtful design doesn't cost anything.
also the simplicity and speed at which you can, you know, RACE
Absolutely agree. @@hugostiglitzracing866
I guess actual race drivers should "look down" on "Real Sim Racers" who play "Real Sim titles". Let everyone enjoy what they want. Most of us came up on Need for Speed and other similar games. Very few people get into gaming and go straight to "Real Sim titles"
Great point. Should be pinned.
actually i got in to GT around the same time as NFS, Also there was a game called Sportscar GT out on PS1 & PC that was hard to drive with game pad.
Up until recently, they did. Pro racers used to come from go-karting or dirt oval racing. They used to laugh at the idea of sim drivers coming to the real world. Now, you can't even be competitive without adding sim driving to your training. So, the newer generation of drivers are less apt to look down at sim racing, because they compete there as well.
No. No vapid fast and angy crap. Simcade is fine. Turning your brain off that much is not.
Idk, i played nothing but GT5/GT6 with a wheel and then eventually got into autocross and won the local championship in my first full year, I owe what I know about driving to those games. If it translates that well then it’s real enough to me. At the end of the day, even if the physics aren’t completely real, the racing sure is.
I got my friend a folding simrig for his birthday and he tried out GT7 in PSVR2 and it blew his mind.
Let's face it, 99% of us aren't going to ever drive a Formula 1 vehicle or a GT3 racecar, so why even get caught up about the "simulation" or the "realism" of something that we have no tangible experience with.
Forza, GT and Assetto have road cars that you might already have driven or own. The simulation factor in that case is 100 times more useful and relatable then whatever fake LMP1-2-GT3-D-F2-DPI-XYZ you drive in the other video games.
Exactly
Well you could turn your argument around and since most of us will never drive these racecars that we love, we want the virtual thing to be as close to reality as possible because thats the only contact with these cars that 99,9% of us will ever have.
99.9%
@@Gralfindel Yes, but will you have the knowledge to say if Game A, B or C is a better simulator or a "simcade"?
That's the main problem nowadays. Lots of people who never drive those cars saying that Game A is a better sim then Game B.
@@Gralfindel How do you know which is closer though? It's all just your make-believe in your simrig.
What i consider to be the border between simcade and a sim. Is simcade games are designed with gamepads in mind. While sims are designed with FFB wheels in mind.
The physics of a simcade, while often good, has to be dulled down to make easily playable with a gamepad.
I agree in a way. You don't need a wheel at all for F1 and Forza. But from my experience with GT, before getting a wheel, I'd get majority bronze in license tests 90% of the time. But with the wheel, i now get gold almost 95% of the time.
I played GTSport and GT7 for years before trying ACC. I am consistently a top 200-300 driver in GT7. Within a week of playing ACC LFM I was a gold driver in very competitive lobbies often finishing in the top 5. It absolutely translates, I actually found ACC easier than GT7 because the force feedback was more informative of what the car is doing. It's rare but sometimes still in GT7 I will lose the car and not really understand why.
What GT7 manages to achieve in a single title is honestly mind blowing. It has complicated physics, tire temps, pressure, full weather system, VR, quality online racing system, a flipping ingame fully flushed out social media system to name a few. GT7 is simply the most complete title out there and it's oozing with quality. The tracks and cars are 3D scanned, especially the cars in VR just have insane levels of detail. My two biggest complaints with GT7 is the sound still isn't that good and I hate that you can abuse downshifting without consequences.
I've tried all of the simracing titles out there and I keep coming back to GT7. It's the most fun and the most efficient experience to just hop on and play whether I want to relax or tryhard.
Bro, This. Sim racers got too much into a "tribal" sensation of being part of something, related to how hard the game is. So harder means you tamed the beast. And with that, we nowadays forgive HORRENDOUS menus, navegability, and crazy ways of configure a simple match between you and your friends.
A lot of those games are in development for over 10 years, and still appearing ones where the steering wheel is not enough to navigate in the menu. You need keyboard, mouse etc etc. I have friends who likes cars, not big car fans, but enjoy they as they enjoy playing cod or dota. And thats enough. But is incredibly hard to put them with me and enjoy a nice match in nice sims, in comparison with F1 2019, wreckfest or even EuroTruck Simulator. And is nothing related to the car behaviour and laptime performance yadayadayada. Its due to the clunky menus and why mine G29 is working with FFB and my friend isn't, or why my friend can see my server but the other one can't, of a friend fell of the server, and I need to pass a freakin codeline just to restart the match.
The hardest task in every industry is not to go crazy specific in something, is to make something simply good for everybody. And GT, Forza, F1, and even other games out of the racing genre such as the classic steam titles, still have a lot to teach to other dev studios.
Simcades have this funny little quirk called "Being good." Racing sims should try it sometime. Still waiting on one with more budget than pocket lint and grandma's PC in the closet.
Just cause you can’t drive on it i doesn’t mean it isnt good
@@gianpierorozzi495 Correct but Asseto Corsa launching a settings menu in a separate window ( that 0 other modern games do) does. Racing sims are *technologically* cheaply made.
@@NegitoroIsBestShip as you said “modern games” and assetto corsa isnt one of em. And assetto corsa still one of the best simulator ever made. Look at the smoke when a tire spins on the ground, its perfect, look at it on f1 23, its shit
@@gianpierorozzi495 My guy AC is on the ps4. It’s a modern game, it’s peers of which, are organized and put together with better software than its own. Definitely not Forza 2023 though. Hey, we all get bad games lol.
Gran Turismo has been making a solid effort to close the gap in physics realism to iRacing, ACC etc. There's still a gap, but all the tweaks made over the past couple years since the launch of GT7 have added up to a big jump in realism vs GT Sport, but has not reduced accessibility at all.
If only they could remember how to make an engaging single player campaign, and manage to upscale the new AI system to replace the shite old one in all single player races and we could have a properly groundbreaking game. Fingers crossed for GT8 in 2030!
I liked your voiced emphasis on "real" simulators. I can't stand snobs and elitists, gatekeepers, etc, who denigrate others. Actually, I feel sorry for some (but not alll) of them.
Great video.
What I’ve found is the real elite drivers will play a SimCade if they have channel they may post a review. Never do you hear them criticise what a SimCade is. What’s more they will play F1 multiplayer and when someone rams into them. They don’t get upset and rage about cheaters they laugh it off as it’s no big deal. Even if they get beat by someone using max assists. They will even compliment pad and assist driver for being able to achieve such a thing, But then EA answers gets flooded with complaints from others that controllers and assists are overpowered and either separate controller and wheel users or nerf assists and pads. Then they go crazy cause they got break checked in an open lobby. Er well it’s an open lobby. But they name and shame and demand they be banned. But what I now know to be a common factor with these Elitists is. They spent thousands on a sim rig. Sweat all day everyday. Then they get beat by someone using a controller and assists. So they blame F1 the game for being to arcade and believe if it was s proper sim they would never get beat by a kid and s pad. They don’t for a second consider the fact just cause they got all the gear and put in the time doesn’t make them any good. some people just can’t except their hand eye has no feel for racing
Sorry going to stop posting now. Couple off years worth off real sim frustrations pouring out🙄😇
You know the funniest thing about them?? If GT7 was ported to PC they'd be all over it
@@Scarduck14 Yea man honestly PC gamers crying about someone with a worse controller beating them is absolutely HILARIOUS.
I see it in multiple shooters. Keyboard and Mouse players crying about aim assist being impossible to beat, and wheel users crying about assists as well
There's a reason the fastest guys on every sim and simcade use a wheel, and no assists, and there's a reason the best FPS players use mouse and keyboard. Using assists and a controller is simply NOT better, otherwise the best players would be using them to gain an advantage but they aren't
This is why i stopped watching youtube game reviews. Most of the channels are run by the "Real Sim" types. Anything that doesnt drive like Iracing, RF2 or whatever that persons favourite "Real" sim is will never be good enough.
@@jessez8503 that's one thing I respect about Jimmy Broadbent. I'm not a big fan of his but when I've seen his content, he seems to treat everything fairly and has fun playing everything instead of turning his nose up at anything that isn't as realistic as rf2
Agree 100%. To your point: combat flight sims went from very 'arcadey' in the mid-1980s and morphed into "simcade" simulators in the mid-1990s, finally changing to "study sims" in the late 1990s. When combat flight simulators made the jump to study sims it was a great thing for enthusiasts, because it finally got us as close as we'll probably ever get to flying real jet fighters. But it also had the effect of essentially ruining an entire genre of games for the other 99% of gamers. Only an enthusiast wants to fly a simulator where it takes reading books and studying just to learn to run the radar, let alone how to do everything else.
As a result we now have study sims (DCS, Falcon BMS) and then we have full-on arcade games like Ace Combat, and basically nothing in between. There is definitely a market space for simcades like Forza and Gran Turismo, and I hope they never stop making these games.
I'm tired of seeing "simracers" wrongly judge all sorts of games despite their sheer lack of any real racing experience to back it up with, every single time.🤦🏻
On top of that they have literally no real racing experience to back their claims of "this is a sim, and this is not"
Exactly. Even sims are definitely not as realistic as they seem. as we all see in Jann Mardenborough's career. showing that transitioning sim-racing to real-life is hard.
No matter how "real" a simracing game is, at the end of the day is just a videogame and most of the realism comes from how much you will allow to trick your mind to believe this is a like the real deal.
not when I connect my nueralink to Assetto Corsa
Having grew up in the days off pole position you really did need s lot of imagination. But that said atleast it conditioned me to understand If the gameplay is good the game is good. On EA answers people will post enraged that the clouds don’t look real or the trees are to green. When playing F1 games I’m concentrating on my marks and looking at where I want my car to go. Although it’s nice having detailed environments but games are for playing not looking at
I got so many hate comments from the F1 community, especially the Max Verstappen fanbase when I disagree about Max Verstappen that sim racing is still not just a video game and they said "Lol you're just bad bro" LMAO. I bet half don't know what the f*** dampers and Sway bars do. None of them touches the differentials 🤣
It's not just a video game though. Real-life drivers use these sim programs for training tracks and retaining their skills. So the authenticity of the sim and what it's teaching you are critically important.
@@pixelcultmedia4252 I agree with that. Most of them don't even realize the importance and it's purpose.
Thank you. I love simcade racing games. I will never progress into full sims (although I own almost all the sim titles for some reason) I just like to have fun driving offline races. And leave the harsh wordings and intimidation to the people with egos a lot bigger than me.
As much as elitists don't wanna say, these are video-games. Iracing, Assetto Corsa, ACC, Richard Burns, etc. These are all video-games who happens to be simulator. The average person, even the average person who has a wheel, will play sims and sim-cades as video-games. And here's the thing, sim-cades are better video-games than sim racing games. You can like the sim racing games better, I personally prefer playing Assetto Corsa than sim-cades on my wheel, but I do understand that as a complete video-game Forza or Grand Turismo are objectively better, because of all the reasons you listed on the video.
I’m really into SIM racing, but sometimes it feels like I’m racing by myself, especially in those long endurance races. Once everyone gets into their pace, there’s not much overtaking or action. But I do love firing up GT7 or EA WRC every now and then. All that SIM racing has definitely made me better at avoiding crashes and finding the fastest line.
From what I’ve seen, getting started in simcade games is pretty easy, but if you want to be one of the best, you’ve still got to put in the time and really get what’s going on.
Great video btw!
Being a racing sim basically means that you're a bit more in depth in some aspects than a simcade but have 2010 graphics/sound, charge ridiculous prices for tracks and cars a la carte, have game breaking bugs and network issues and have an absolutely awful UI that even autists have issue navigating.
Many real racing driver train on the sim, and you expect from a driver to look at the graphics? They just want to improve their skills, so they want a place to train even if they are out from their car
Nailed it especially when you talked about the flaws in simulation titles. The truth is that nothing for the consumer market is even close to what real race teams get to use. By the time we get a new racing title, most of the manufacturer secrets are watered down or approximated by the developers. Getting lost in the argument about realism is a moot point since the vast majority of us will never drive a race car at the limit. As long as it is close enough to provide a believable, competitive experience, I'm happy. At the end of the day, racing is about getting the most out of your vehicle in the circumstances you're in and simcade titles can provide that experience just as well as simulation titles.
The thing about simcades is that they still follow close to real-world physics, but with some degree of simplification and idealization of the way cars should behave on race tracks, usually in the name of accessibility (and simcade is typically a spectrum between more similar to arcade racing and more similar to sim racing). For instance, Gran Turismo strikes a very effective balance, in that it still accurately models things like the effects of horsepower, weight, tire compounds, car setups, and downforce on lap times, however the minutiae of things like track and ambient temperatures are dealt with offscreen, and the handling model is a bit more forgiving (and significantly more accessible) than in say, iRacing, rFactor, or Assetto Corsa, which means expert hotlappers can take more risks and thus set slightly faster laps with the same cars.
It all started with Gran Turismo 1, Road and track:Need For Speed Andretti Racing, Destruction Derby, Collin McRae on PS1 for me. The Playstation 1 will always hold a special place for me since it really got me into motorsports with the plethora of titles they brought out to get me into sim racing today.
I just want to have fun without a "sim racer" screaming "well, actually..."
Geoff Crammond, maker of the original Formula 1 GP Game, once said something in the lines of "it is not so important that it is real from a physics standpoint, it's more import that it feels real for the player" (I cannot really recall his words, that's like 30 years ago.)
But if he said it or not, that's what I think. Never forget, you still lack some feedback from the car, so if you are 100% accurate in physics, the funny thing is that it can still feel off, while if you find ways to compensate for the lack of feedback, something less realistic may even feel more real. This may not be absolute true in 2023, due to motion rigs and VR that make up for most of the feedback, but if you remember older "Sims" you will proably agree that they were shitty to drive, probably most cars would be easier to drive in real life than they were in the Sim. (GTR comes to mind). This is mostly not due to the sim being not that good but much more due to the fact that you just lack all the feedback a real car gives you. So imho there is a point between 100% realistic physics and Arcade that hits the sweetspot, not being so realistic that the lacking feedback becomes a problem and still feel "real". As someone with some real life driving skills and many, many miles on road and track I think a good simcade like GT Sport or something may even recall the real driving experience better in some cases than a full fledged sim, as crazy as this sounds.
That point on which the driving experience feels really good shifts more towards sims as time goes on, just because you have VR and motion rigs and more that make up for the lack of feedback, and you simply have more computing power to make your tire model and contact point calculation so much better.
At the end I will say that the very best driving experience I ever had is Assetto Corsa Street Cars in VR, that's the closest I ever felt to the real deal. But right now I'm in GT7 and love it. So I don't really see a fight between Simcade and Sim.
Best video I’ve watched in an age. I’m a “champion” on EA Answers for F1 and now WRC. Another champion sent me the link to this video and said I’m gunna fall in love. Not a week goes by where i try to explain to people that post wanting F1 to be hardcore sim. Every you layed out perfectly in this video. But still they do not get it. I have all the time in the world for those who are frustrated and angry with the games issues. But I do get triggered when elitists post things such as real sim racers spend 1000s their rigs so the game should be full sim first. I put in around 1000 hours every year on F1 and I use a controller 👍 Thanks I don’t need to type out same replies to hardcore sim post any longer. Just going to reply with link to this video
Be careful though the Sim Elitist are gunna come for you 😂
Frigging excellent post. Wow, 3 hours a day!
This actually I’ve only done 350. And because the game is so poorly balanced and bad implementation of F1 world has created serious problems in the core single player modes. I spent more time trying to recreate issues that had been raised on EA answers and then hours looking for work arounds. Ive finally had enough. Weirdly EA CMs have been a great help. But since David Greco left no one at Codies has filled the huge gap he left engaging on EA forums. But WRC launched and once my muscle memory in my fingers learned to do the opposite off what I’ve always known as a circuit SimCader. I first stopped flying off mountains and to my doom. And every time I nail a stage. The game makes me feel like a very excited god. Then the last patch dropped and now we are all being ripped apart in screen tearing hell 🙄😂
This other Champion you mention surely seems like a nice chap 🫶
Never loved another Brazilian more 😂 Always has my back when the toxics come for me
Sim racing this, simcades that... I just want a good Burnout Revenge sequel, without open world like Paradise had😂
Top GT7 talent will spank a lot of these elitist
If u put the features, graphics, single player from simcades with iRacing physics, multiplayer and Assetto Corsa modding you would have the ultimate game
I would prefer rf2 physics instead of iRacing, but it's still a good point nonetheless. Maybe the upcoming AC2 or even Rennsport could be that ultimate dream game we've all been craving.
@@brett22bt idk about rennsport, but AC2 can definitely be that ultimate, one that triumphs all game and thats why im really hyped for it. we've already seen the potential with acc and their gt3s so how better would it be if it was expanded to other types
@@gervee_desu Yeah, I agree that AC2 definitely has more potential than Rennsport. Hopefully, AC2 will have a better user interface this time around and a career mode that makes more sense. I'm really hyped for it as well. I'm not expecting miracles at initial release, but hopefully, they can create something completely game-changing.
I loved that gran turismo 1 separate arcade mode from simulation mode. You had the option to choose how you wanted to play.
Why can't a full blown "SIM" also have a compelling career mode?
This so needed to be said, thank you for making this video. Low-floor high-ceiling products will ALWAYS be more important and more difficult to make than the most extreme enthusiast level stuff, and I say that as someone who primarily goes straight for enthusiast products. They deserve the most respect, and ironically, get the least of it from most enthusiast level snobs. Like, just because I have a V8 Mustang doesn't mean I don't owe almost that entire product SKU's existence to the more affordable V6 and now 4cyl models, so you bet your ass I'm waving to those folks on the road. If it weren't for simcades, the install base for iracing and other racing leagues in rfactor and others wouldn't be nearly the size they are. Or, possibly even worse: not large enough to be financially viable to continue operation.
Speaking of.. it's been so many years, I'm so out of the loop - what ever happened to my dear, sweet Live For Speed? Is it dead? I don't wanna look. 😭
Personally i think F1 is executed beautifully and feels mostly authentic. No, ill never experience a real F1 car, so thank goodness for this "simcade."
Slightly related thing: Flight simmers would scorn the (then) new MSFS (2020) because, and I quote:
"The menu looks like a game."
So yeah, just because it was more accessible (by having a moden menu system) compared to the FSX-based (2006) sims that dominated the market before MSFS 2020 released, it was labelled as unrealistic.
Its amazing to think back at this and see how stuck in the mud people who use old software and refuse to move on are.
I’m glad you made this video. It’s nice to see someone who appreciates all kinds of racing titles. There are so many out there that will just crap on the console titles because they aren’t “hardcore man” but they forget where they started out. About 99 percent of them were on a controller with an arcade game.
At the beginning of their racing journey.
Some of those titles have now moved into simcade. And I truly believe, because of those titles, in particular Gran Turismo, have inspired many other titles hardcore or not to be created. I’ve played plenty of iracing, AC with mods, ACC, RF1/2, Race Room. I’ve enjoyed them all.
I love iracing and AC and ACC the most out of these more serious sims. But I always come back to GT7. It’s what I play the most. I even play F1 for my career, but I’ve been burnt out a bit with doing my driver career every year lol.
So GT7 is my favorite racing game to play these days. I love it. It’s got a physics engine I enjoy. It’s not over the top hardcore, but it’s still satisfying and challenging enough and more forgiving and I really love the franchise.
Meanwhile, RBR fans expect 11 year-olds to download a sim released before they were born, with outdated graphics, and for them to enjoy it. Just like we don’t teach Shakespeare in kindergarten, these die-hard fans need to understand that before you get to a masterpiece, you need to fall in love with reading first. And that’s what WRC, Forza and GT do, they help newcomers fall in love, before they naturally gravitate to “proper sims.” We should celebrate these games, not shoot them down. Love this video!
I love simcades. For some they're the gateway drug to proper sims for others they're the perfect balance of realism and accessibility
I think that gran turismo and forza have a pretty good approach for fun and sim games. Both you can play after a working day with a controller on your couch, justo to have some fun or play in a more serius manner on your sim wheel. On sims i need to mount the wheel on the support, start the pc, config everithing, go through a crappy menu and just race.
I think that Project Cars 2 had one of the best approachs for the common player and simracer, just needed more time of development and more updates.
I started with Ridge Racer and Gran Turismo 1 on PlayStation 1, back in the day. Now I'm driving Automobilista, iRacing and Assetto Corsa!
Gt7 on a full dd rig and vr is as real as like it you can even get haptic feedback and telemetry by connecting the ps5 to a pc with simhub its getting really good
1. most so called ''console racing sims/games'' ui's do look nice but they are often pain to use imo. feels like they go looks over function. My favorite UI goes with probably new iracing ui most things are very easily found there.
2. career mode is always nice to have iracing has said that they are working on career mode atm
Gran Turismo is e most important racing game ever made and continues to be one of the most beloved and recognized names in anything.
It may not be on the bleeding edge of realism but that doesn’t mean it’s not good at what it does. I’d argue there are few “complete packages” on every level as good as a GT game.
Just play what you like. If you have a blast playing Mario Kart, good for you. If you are a serious hobbyist and wear a fire suit while sitting in a 50k sim rig, good for you. Fun is all that matters.
I agree with your opinion RC. This is a video that could have done 10 years ago. So many gamers have been brainwashed by Sim-racing social media influences into thinking that sim-racing is superior and "simcades" and arcade racing games are a waste of time. These people are usually older gamers that have a lot of disposable income to spend on high-end wheels and rigs and they take sim-racing way too seriously I think in order to justify the expense to their family. They forget that racing games were really good before the home force-feedback wheel existed. There are so many great "simcade" and arcade racing games to play, people who turn their noses up at those games are fools. There is a lot more variety in the games of the past than there is today. I enjoy sim-racing but I'm not a snob about it. I sim-race with a pad, keyboard or my wheel. I don't see sim-racing as superior to an arcade racing just different. As a veteran gamer I would really struggle to put a sim-racing title in my top 10 favourite racing games.
Many “sim racers” seem to think that if a game isn’t hard as hell it’s beneath them. Driving isn’t that hard. A lot of us do it everyday.
Wdym, you are driving on a track, with a race car, you are not driving youre car on the public road. Its a totally different way to drive, you can’t say its not that hard. And the thing that makes a sim racing game, its not the difficulty but the realism instead. Having realism automatically cause a raised difficulty level.
@@gianpierorozzi495 When you have professional drivers criticizing games/sims about their unrealistic handling, levels of grip etc saying that the real world cars are far easier to drive than the digital counterparts.
@@effinjamieTT yeah, but you also hear them say that they use the sim for train breaking and much more.
Great video, I agree with all your points, and as someone who has spent many hours behind the wheel in proper sims and simcades over the years, Ive now settled on sim-cades as my end game.
They provide 95% of the driving characteristics I want in a racing title, and serve up exactly the content that Im looking for, but even more than this, Forza especially gives me the ability to race online multiplayer in obscure content that i'll never find in public AC lobbies or leagues, sure im not facing a full grid of some cars, but at least I can configure my own car with particular upgrades and livery to match.
What I've been saying for years. Thanks for the validation RC 👍🏽😂
You don't need (a mostly broken in hindsight) hi-fidelity physics model to race/drive in a realistic manner and have fun
Haters of arcade car racing games seems to forget where they roots came from and how much fun they had at the arcades back in the day and the crazy rig those arcade car racing games had. I enjoy playing GT7 and ACC on my rig but I also love playing those old school good and fun arcade car racing games on it. Just my random rant, lol.
I really like and agree with this video. My favourite thing was your final sentence about fun, I think most people forget that gaming as is meant to be fun. To me simcades are where it's at because you can learn everything you need to that make you fast in proper sims and IRL without loosing that thrill of speed
Before I got into GT7 I thought it was supposed to be the most realistic driving game. I had no idea what a simcade was or any of that. I was just enjoying playing it on my G29, and almost 2 years later I still am.
Well said some nice points on this one. Sim cafes is where most sim racers came from so we shouldn’t hate them, they got us into racing. Reminds me of my video 4 levels of racing game fever.
I enjoy my sims a lot, and I'll have a great time with a simcade too, but why is some beanbag on reddit who's never driven a racecar in their life tyring to tell me what is an authentic sim and what isn't?
I've never worried about absolute realism in my racing games because I don't know what driving a real racecar is like. Great video, thanks for sharing.
First game that got me hooked on track racing was Forza Motorsport 4.
When I got my Xbox 1 I got a G920 wheel and bought ACC and most expansions.
Would I have made that progress without FM4? I don’t think so
Great video, man!
I've been thinking for a while that one of the reasons I don't play racing sims more is because of the career modes. I have nothing against a more realistic career structure, but frankly, the restriction just isn't for me.
I like the more video gamey Gran Turismo style progression of winning races to get money and buy more cars to race in more events. Instead, most of the road racing sims that are recommended don't have anything like that. Most of them boil down purely to fill the role of competitive online racer or a sandbox.
I'd like something else to keep motivating me to play. I don't care if its not totally realistic. This obsession with everything in a "sim" needing to be totally realistic is honestly a total pain.
At the end of the day, your simulation is still a video game.
And don't tell me that making a simple career mode is really hard. I've done game development. Making menus and a save file that remembers money is really not that difficult. Alex Mail did it for Assetto Corsa, on his own, in unity, and I'm pretty sure it works partially by reading the previous race log that Assetto Corsa has built in. He's also factoring in compatibility for mods and made a system that creates car prices based off performance and other variables.
I really don't believe that a full development team of 40 people with access to the game's source code can't throw together a simple career mode. Assetto's current career mode is already half the work. All they need to do is add in race money rewards, car prices, and the ability to choose from the cars you bought for each event and restrictions. I've done this kind of stuff in Java after 4 months of learning it, in high school. And I almost failed that class.
Of course a full fledged, deep RPG experience like GT4 isn't easy to make, but I'm just talking about a simple one.
Absolutely correct. I've always said that as long as a sim-cade has great FFB it can be extremely fun and involving. However, its a pity that most sim-cades never get beyond the gamepad controller itself. This is actually at the core of what sets the Gran Turismo series apart from the Forza series.
A person going from sitting on a sofa with hardly any effort, to gripping a FFB steering wheel and holding on against the sim "G forces" is a vastly different experience and is really what truly draws a person into it. I always compare the difference to "arm-chair" vs "real world" persons in any area of expertise. The actual physical labour is what truly makes the experience different.
thank you for post it, people need to stop with Sim Elitism specially now since racing games are in a crisis of its own
Arcade racers serves as an entry point that attracts people interested in racing and cars.
They dont need anything more then a controller to play and this is enough to spark an interest in the genre.
Eventually leading people to buy wheels, pedals etc and go into the hardcore sims.
GT 7 is a SIM racer to me. No gatekeeping over here.
It's funny how some of the comments prove the need for simpler and more accessible games like the ones you mentioned in the video. There are many people who think they have the right to say what other people should or shouldn't like or how they should enjoy the hobby.
Anyway, congratulations on the video, RC. Lots of wisdom in your comments.
i think they talk more about toxicity in racing community. nothing about what you should or shouldn't, just have fun and that's all.
(realism = fun) as a fact is an idea that needs to be thrown in the bin. When games turn into work, they aren't games anymore.
When I first got my simrig (after getting really into F1 2020 during covid, I kept playing online on ACC and various games and just stopped enjoying myself pretty quickly. After a couple weeks I just banned myself from playing online for a bit, I even started messing about trying to drift. I learnt that the number 1 rule is that it has to be fun. ACC I find fun, grinding and paying in iRacing I do not find fun. GT7 I find fun. The very idea of setting up Richard Burns and all the mods and getting it all working I do not find fun. Etc.
It sucks that you have to buy a console to play them, then there is the micro-transactions, the monitoring and control with persistent online connections, the data collecting, $100 Ultimate versions ($100 VIP pack) (just corny), the strange DLC packs, such as Doritos car pack DLCs, or Hot Wheels DLC, Barbie or any other DLC pack they can think of for whatever is hot or trending at the moment. Some people like those I know, I just find them really corny.
Really appreciate seeing this, especially after recently giving Forza a try even after all the negativity around the game. I actually found the game to be pretty fun to drive after messing with wheel settings and really enjoyable. It has its flaws sure but I've been liking the game for what it is and on PC there isn't any build your own car track racer so it fills the spot of GT 7 for me on PC.
I agree with this, these games are like gateway drugs to get into sim racing. You start playing then get addicted and start venturing to harder and more realistic sims.
A simcade is just a sim with a decent single player career mode bolted on. The truth is there is no "real" sim available on PC or console, this is proven by the fact that the same car on the same track feels completely different in the games typically considered as sims, such as iRacing, ACC, AC, and rF2.
okay, the subtitles are driving me crazy, I had to cut the lower part of the video out or I couldnt have finished the video
How did you do that? I'm sick of this single-word subtitle trend.
I look sim and simcade like laser scanning vs handmade tracks. One is millimetre accurate, but sometimes the hand made tracks can still feel very right even if it's not 1:1 representation. Physics in sim and simcade is the same imo
I think comparing with this whole arcade simcade sim thing is silly, like it’s just segmenting this genre into multiple smaller segments and over complicating things
Spot on. FH4 is how I got into sim racing 2 years ago. Now I live with a full DD cockpit and VR rig, over 1500 hours on Forza titles, 500h in AC and a race car IRL. The complexity of ACC is off-putting even to this day.
Love slobbing out on the sofa with GT7 and also getting my pants tied up with AC.
If they sell project car 3 as a DLC or a setting (like light or arcade mode) to the PC2 game, I think it can lure more people in to the "simulation" title.
That would be a smart move actually. It would also keep Project Cars 2 relevant for the hardcore racers
I agree with the sentiment that simcades are very important and that not only they have their place, they are important for the simracing hobby as a whole as well. Pretending they are even remotely close to actual sims on the driving aspect is just beyond silly though, simulators have much more detailment going under the hood than your average simcade with 600 cars could ever dream of.
its funny because the olympics and fia use a 'simcade' in gt7 ;)
Totally agree. I LOVE Assetto Corsa and some other sims but GT Sport and GT7 are fantastic. I do wish they had better physics though ngl
Simcades get a lot of unnecessary hate. I enjoy playing both styles.
So yeah my complain about simracing other than the elitist attitude of the community is The UI.
Most UI in simracing is like made under the impression of for "commercial and corporate" use stuffs and its struggling to use for average users including me.
I love the effort put in to the subs! Must have taken ages to sync. Agreed with the videos' main points too!
Brilliant video. Great script, well delivered and it resonated so much with me that I joined the RC Garage Crew 🎉
Awesome, thank you! That means a lot!
This is a tremendous video bro. Great job.
Simcade is just a meaningless term coined by people who aren’t professional race car drivers but want to feel better about themselves for playing a particular video game.
Great video. Not one of those elitest wannabes trying to destroy what made sim racing what it is today. Gt can be downed by the elitests..... It is the gran daddy, and it's was the inspiration for all sim titles that came after. ACC (my other title of choice) has a very straight forward UI, is presented well, a freaking intro video, a video before starting ur season....... So my question is, is ACC now a simcade just because there has been some actual effort put in outside the racing? Luckily I race on, pc and console, gt7, acc and ac. Any of these titles can be a sim or more simplified for a more approachable experience......making something more user friendly...... Why is this classified as a negative by the wannabes? Blows my mind.
Loved the video!. I started playing Forza 3 back in the day but I wasn't too interested in it. when GT7 was released, I gave it a chance and I wasn't a big fan because of the lack of championship like modes. But when I tried online races, something clicked and I couldn't stop playing it. Now I'm a big fan of AMS2 bc and I'm seriously considering buying rfactor 2.
Simcades are way more important than some people think.
Excellent video!
Shocking how good the lighting in GT7 is and how dull Forza Motorsport is looking... from the ground up my a**.
They should really port GT7 to PC.
LOL you say about simcades being pick up and play yet forza motorsports on a wheels has some of the must worst ingame options I have seen, no matter what settings I adjust the racing feels numb even games like dirst 3 have better force feedback, forza motorsports is the one game I was waiting for and its garbage on a wheel passable on a controller
If sims had decent menus, the hobby would be so much popular, I like how you can tune and transform your favorite cars into straight up race cars in Gran Turismo, too bad it won't come to PC
the best part of simcades is that i can decide either to make the vehicle more challenging or the AI, or both
Yes, simcades are very important for simracing itself. BUT, most of negative opinions refers to very poor quality of recent simcades, which is undeniable. Thank you.
its true. I hadnt played racing games since like PS2 era. Decided to try forza because I kind of miss having titles like racing games that you can play over and over and still be challenged by. You can load them up quick and race for hours or 20 mins. I was impressed enough by what racing has become since the old PS2 days, I bought a DD wheel and am starting to get familiar with ACC now.
One thing I didn’t like about most simulators is that a lot of effort put into it is simply to make it work. That’s why most of the time I find myself playing GT7 (because simply will work and launches quickly) and Live For Speed (for the same reason)
Just my individual opinion. If people want Closed Captioning (I don't like them) we can turn them on using the CC button on the video...and by you typing out most of the video you've practically transcribed the thing anyways....we should have the option to turn them off... and it saves you from editing them into the video.
GT7 is a sim physics wise. It has a weak damage model and missing features like camera options.
But apparently, to hardcore sim racers, a sim is a barely usabel piece of software - the worse the UX, the more hARDcoRe sIM it is. Joke of a community. Yeah, I came form heavily modded PC AC.
Thank you, before 3yrs ago the only racing i was in to was motocross. Then I found f1 2020 on gamepass thing, i remember playing in Australia and not getting past t3-4. Getting me in to f1 because of those cars.
3 years later i today have a cockpit and wheel mostly playing AC and Dr2, ea wrc
Pretty specific, but in GT7 after tuning the car, the N/A torque per liter is unrealistic even for racecar levels
Then you have the wheels spinning the wrong way when reversing and going forward back and forth at very low speeds, like 0.5 km/h
And that's about it I guess, there's probably more though