@@bib3024 I have had my one for 12yrs now. Has done just over 211000kms and I am only doing the timing chain now. It has been pretty reliable for all these years.
I’m getting mine changed at 138,000 miles. I do not have a cold start rattle, but I do get a bit of a rattle when I shut the engine off and there’s a rhythmic scraping noise from that end of the engine, the cam phaser also shows -4.8. The engine still runs well and delivers all the power it has ever had. I’ve had my GTI since new and it has only ever had oil that meets VW spec. In hindsight I think the point that going as long on a single change of oil as VW recommends is not a great idea. I did that for 70k to 80k miles when I decided to halve that number and essentially change it twice as frequently.
Agreed on oil intervals. -4.8°kw is ready to be changed for sure. Just bear in mind when switching off, your rattle cpuld be from the dual mass flywheel, unless of course you've heard it from the timing chain end. Thanks for your comment.
@@FourRingsAuto I searched for some examples of the noise a bad flywheel would make and I'm fairly sure it isn't that, thankfully. Question: about how many hours of labor do you usually charge to do the timing chain? ...and thank you for the response and thanks for the video, it was good to watch.
@@michaelw6277 5 or 6 hours, depends on the model. The chain itself is the easy part - cleaning the sealant from the lower timing cover and block is time consuming, but has to be done right otherwise it will leak.
Thank you for the video. I have been working on cars as a hobby for decades, but every time I get into a more complex repair like this, I'm nervous. These videos help me to feel more confident. I'm about to get into a Tiguan with the same engine and it was recommended that I change the balance shaft chain, guides, and tensioner as well. In your opinion, should I change it?
Changing the other chain setup is a good idea, especially if the main chain is excessively stretched. The timing of the balance shaft chain is relatively simple too. I've not had one yet that needed it or had majorly high mileage. I have heard more horror stories of balance shafts seizing up tbh.
I have -5.64* and old style tensioner. Lucky me that it didn't jump. Oil changes at max 4500km. Car is sitting in the garage waiting for OEM parts to arrive. Thanks for the video-advice.
Awesome video! I have a 2013 Tiguan and I have misfires on all cylinders and the weird hide cylinder code to add to it. No other codes. I have replaced injectors, intake manifold to the new revision and I’m still getting misfires on all cylinders and a really rough idle with loss of power. Did a compression test and all cylinder are at 180 except cylinder #2, which the first time was at 0 and second time was at 60psi. I guess my question is, how can I determine where I am loosing compression?
Hi. Great video. Just doing similar job my self. I have one question? At 6:00 in video. I can't clearly get what You are saying there. Should there be a oil screen of some kind or what is that what was blown out?
So I have a ticking noise coming from the timing belt area of my engine bay whenever I'm on the thorttle a little bit. I have no codes, compression in all cylinders. Nothing logged in my VCDS, but I'm going to check out my Phase Position tomorrow. I've been trying to figure this out for a week now and borderline about to take it into a shop if this Phase Position comes back a -5 or lower. Any ideas?
At 17:55, it looks like the blue link from the balance shaft chain is not lined up with the outer mark on the sprocket? I'm guessing this is fine since you could get them to line up if you had spun the crank over more before putting on the camshaft timing chain?
Very interesting, thank you. How many miles on the car? What is the mileage you normally see that requires a change? I tend to see mk5/6's with timing issues for sale at roughly 150k. In fact, at my storage unit , someone just came in with one that jumped timing... He is not sure if he wants to keep it and repair it...damn my vw addiction haha
I think this could be my issue given my mk6's mileage. I had the ignition coils, the fuel injectors, and the spark plugs replaced and I still get a jolt when the engine is under load. The issue for me is that I don't have a scanner to confirm this.
Very good video. Thanks for taking the time to show most of it all and with lots of helpful hints. Here in Germany VW sell special pack of the required replacement parts... so it's all there... apart from the turbo gasket.... o and all the special tools :)
I'm replacing the head gasket just blew at 265xxxkm's, i'm also replacing anything else i can think of while i got the engine apart like the timing. Although its pretty dang tight wasn't lose at all like in you're video, should i still replace it? But i'm changing the injectors, doing a carbon clean, all gaskets I've removed, fuel pump, oil pump ect aswell. Shockingly all hoses look great for canada lmao. Any other parts you would swap lmk! Thanks in advance.
So once you had your first sprocket and the crank shaft lined up with the marks and chains, did you lift the chain and turn the cam with your wrench to line it up? I’m a little confused
I may have missed it in the video. Does VW have a spec for the maximum amount of chain stretch in the shop manual? After cleaning the chain(s) in part cleaner, stretch can be measured on a bench top. Lay the chain flat, push together/pull apart, etc. Measure. Between the tensioner, guides & chain(s), VCDS can't really isolate this. If the tensioner is all the way out, I'd think a mechanic that has done a few of these could eyeball the groves in the guides and look at how much the chain stretches to know if the chain needs replacing. Some Honda motorcycles have this spec in the manual for a single row chain. Wondering if VW give guidelines on this.
Is this procedure the same for a 2016 volkswagen jetta 1.8 TSI? Everything looks familiar to my engine..and having a hard time finding a video for a 1.8
hello, thanks for your help, I just bought a golf gti mk6 with this engine, the old owner told me he did this job from 10000km, I don't feel it running well and reading the parameters from the vcds I read -3.89 ° I have to worry ? hope you can help me
I'm at -4.3° according to my obd11 on my 2012 beetle turbo (e888 Gen 1 cbfa) Cts ko4 fbo and tune.. 130k miles.. It's time🙄.. I swear this car is the most expensive car maintenance wise I've ever owned
That chain value is very interesting. I’m at -4.3 deg 50k kms ago. Now im at -5.6 deg. No chain rattle in cold start and car runs fine. I do change my oil very frequently. I wonder if this is caused by bad quality oil or people running too low on oil. My car is also modified to stage2+ with k04 turbo.
You realize the chain is stretching and the tensioner will max out until the chain jumps and fails. There is a revised timing tensioner and timing chain, you may have the old chain.
@@FourRingsAuto I've got some weird stuff going on, cam related codes + oil pressure dropping just barely below spec at warm idle, but going back in spec if I raise RPMs to even about 900 / 950. Looks like the valve cover is coming off for me to inspect both the timing chain and the intake camshaft bearings, etc...
Is yours the ea888.2 with the 2 oil pressure switches on the oil filter housing? If so, check PCV valve as I've seen 1 audi q3 2.0tfsi ea888.2 with a leaking pcv cause the idle to be too low from memory and it would trigger an oil pressure light on the dash. Replaced pcv and oil light gone. Because they have a variable oil pump on the ea888.2
@@FourRingsAuto I'll look into that, although the idle didn't seem low, maybe around 650-700. I'll probably have to just fix the timing issue then address the oil pressure thing, as I've seen really weird stuff on these german engines, like a bad electronic engine mount causing the ECU to disable the high pressure fuel pump... just have to address every issue one at a time...
Hi I have an Audi A3 with same engine. I'm using Cstrol Magnatec semi synthetic oil in this. What is your opinion on this. Engine has 134000km on it and still sounds good without rattles. At what mileage do suggest chain replacement. Regards
I recommend checking the phase position of the inlet camshaft and if more the 4°kw i would be replacing the chain drive components. But you may also want to remove the round rubber plug from the lower timing cover and check which style of tensioner you have, and the amount of teeth protruding. You're around the kms where it's likely to be a good idea to change it.
Hi our Audi engine went sick needed new camshaft and timing chain. Was going better then engine light came on and diagnostic picked up misfire on cylinder number 4. On investigation found hole in piston. What caused this we are unsure of. Dont know what remedy will be needed.
How accurate would you say the bank 1 phase position measuring value is? I changed my tensioner and it reads close to 8 deg no rattling on start up both cold and hot.
@@FourRingsAuto ahhh dam it well it runs good will change it at a later date so the tolerances are between plus or minus 5 deg correct? Also my thoughts are if it were really bad won't it make noise at start up etc?
@@shimon2476 won't always make a noise. You have a new tensioner so that is helping. Don't leave it too long, most i see at -7° that are left without repair last a short time before they jump timing and bend valves.
Hello mate I got a VW Scirocco 09, on the dashboard all the time if I’m driving for a long time it will say “engine fault management”, then on the faults when I’m getting diagnostics it says “Camshaft error”. I’ve changed the camshaft but again the error code keeps coming up. It might be my timing chain but I’m not sure.
It might well be, but that is way too vague of a fault code! What are you using to read the codes? Does it have a P code next to the fault code? Need more info, could be multiple different engines fitted to the car...
2012 golf r is mk6. Mk6r uses ea113 belt drive engine. This is the successor ea888 that replaced it and uses a chain. Just keep on top of your timing belt maintenance intervals, and report any rattling noises to your mechanic as there is a chain between the exhaust and inlet cams on the back of your engine.
Hey, what's the procedure for replacing the cam shaft bracket, the piece that hold the actuator magnet? Is there any sealant, are the bolts reusable, and what are the torque specs? I appreciate any information, I've been looking everywhere but haven't been able to find much.
A couple good videos for timing chain replacement: Edge Motors did a full timing chain replacement including the cam bridge on an Audi Q5. Getting to the timing chain is different, but once the covers are off the replacement process is exactly the same. Part 1: th-cam.com/video/DihEegHWaYM/w-d-xo.html part 2: th-cam.com/video/jIbFLFeTu2Y/w-d-xo.html. This one shows another angle on getting to the timing chain on a Mk6 GTI: th-cam.com/video/O0yde12lIJs/w-d-xo.html
@@FourRingsAuto is it necessary to apply some grease on the inner front main seal before installing the crank pulley, or do you just install the pulley with a dry front main seal and allow it to set for 4 hours before first crank?
@@FourRingsAuto thx. do you ever apply sealant to the balance shaft tensioner bolt on the washer? mine seems to be leaking around that bolt? can i just remove the tensioner bolt, clean it up add some sealant and then replace it and torque to spec?
I don’t know if you’re still in this position but I’m doing it within the next couple of weeks & could update you on wether or not it’s worth it to pay to have it done.
ARGH HELP @fourringsauto Great tips again dude. , My gause is missing in the cam bridge . I can't see it anywhere any ideas on where to look? could it have made its way to the sump? otherwise I ll just need to reassemble and hope for the best argh help.
Normally on a cold start, when the car has been left for a while. It's also down to where in the stroke the engine stops, as there can be a bit of rollback of the crank which can compress the tensioner more.
Hi, great video... I measured on my passat 193'000km, 1.8tsi CDAA 127mm between the cam marks.. time to replace? To the same time the engine was running very rough and with warm engine a loud noise came from the front around the crankshaft and chain...also misfire codes on all cylinders.. any ideas? Can I order the parts from you? Regards Ivo Antworten
Hi really good video, have a audi s3 tsi in work with a camshaft sensor fault, replaced sensor, checked wiring to ecu all good, would u be looking at chain next?
Oh sorry reread saying chain. So I would check the phase position MVB measured value block first, which gives you an indication of chain stretch. I'd then want to know if it runs well or if it is noisy. Next step you can only do with an oscilloscope, however it is the one thing that opens up the whole diag and you can actually see if there's a problem rather than guessing. Scope the cam sensor, you can check the 5v reference with a multi meter, and sensor ground (runs through ecu), but the signal back to the ecu you'd need to scope. This will show you the switching of the hall sensor. You could then scope the crank at the same time and from that you can check the timing without disassembly of the engine. This is something i should really do a video of, but i just assume most people watching are DIYers and would be of no interest.
@@FourRingsAuto Not sure what engine chain code ill have to get back to u on that, vehicle only came in today, runs really well no noisey chain, fit genuine cam sensor fault code returned, checked voltage like u said had 5 v, no pico scope in our workshop so cant check signal wire wich would be a good test, checked continuity from each 3 wires back to ecu all good, in work tomoz ill check inlet cam phase position and report back to u something ive learned from you we have vcds 👍
I had this job done a few weeks ago but something troubles me and just doesn't feel right. I can 'feel' the new chain rotating on 1st and 2nd almost like grinding against the guide(s). It is a bit subtle but certainly not as smooth as before. Had replaced everything, (including balance shaft chain and guides) except from oil chain/tensioner. VCDS shows anywhere between -0.6 - -0.9 so timing looks fine. Any ideas? Feeling quite depressed to be honest...
Checked the crank pulley for wobble whilst running? The inner crank gear that all the chains run on can slip, especially if the bolt wasn't put back in whilst disassembled. Had a couple of guys make this mistake and have a noise.
Or maybe something is bent and vibrating. Can you hold it at the rpm it does it at in neutral stationary? Or get someone to do it whilst you look. Who did the work, you or a workshop?
@@FourRingsAuto I had it done at a workshop and i was present during the whole procedure. The gears were secured with the nylon washer. The only workaround they had to do was with the four pin counterhold tool for the vibration dumper. They had an other one for other vw models i guess (3 pins i think?) however they managed to hold it steady while screwing the crank bolt. I will try to rev it in neutral and see what happens although i think i tried this a few times. Another idea i had was to go to the shop, lift the car from the ground start driving through all the gears and listen carefully.
hy men i want to ask you about sharan 1.4 sdi d you know some think about the motor engine please because i want to buy some one thank you voor your vedios see you later
At minute 6:05. What bearing are you referring to? 2. Can you give more details on what you measured at 5.45 onwards? I know what you measured. I mean what are the points im looking to measure from - to.
If im only replacing the cam timing chain do I need to re time the balance shafts chain or can I just set it to tdc and replace the cam chain only without messing with the balance shafts chain?
Hello, i have a similar knocking noise when i start my 2014 golf r could it be the timing chaine also or is it the camshaft please its urgent and im waiting for your answer , have a good day
Hey, great video. But I have one question. This is my first tsi Volkswagen, 2009 mk5 gti it has 176,000 miles or to you 283,000 km the other chains behind the chain you replaced what was that one and should all chains and guides be done at the same time?
The other chain is the balance shaft chain. It would be a good idea at your kms to replace that and it's guides and tensioner too. Yours is a mk6 gti if it's a chain engine. The mk5 gti was belt drive. Thanks
Good question. Hard to put a mileage or time on them. The main thing is regular oil changes every 10k km and using quality oil rated to vw 504/507 spec or vw502.
@@FourRingsAuto Hi. Is Castrol the recommended oil from VW? I was thinking about using the Castrol Edge full synthetic 5w-30, even though the VW dealership who did my last oil change used 5w-40 according to the receipt. Which is supposed to be used? My 13 Eos is doing the rattle on cold start so Im going to have this done ASAP! You seem like a meticulous mechanic who wants it done right and I wish you were here to do mine! Thank you for the video and have a great weekend!
5w30 castrol edge longlife 3 i believe is what vw audi specifies. 5w40 is good too as long as it's vw504 rated oil. You'll generally burn less on on 5w40.
yes I ended up doing it with the engine still in. Just drop engine mount and lower accessing it from the wheel arch area. Pretty straightforward in the end.
8V s3 is UDS protocol. Go into the search box at the top and look for inlet or intake. It's usually the 3rd one down from memory on vcds and is called inlet phase position.
My TFSI had -7 degrees retarded "correction". The timing chain was over 1,5cm longer! 100, 200 maybe 500 km more and it would fall off. After replacement it has now only -0.27 degrees retardation. I think, that in your case here -2.71 degrees is still not perfect but acceptable. Also, you did not check the intake camshaft requested position / actual position. Personally, I'm still fighting now with that clanging noise that you also have in this engine. Thing is, even there are no error messages, all values and corrections are in order, you can still hear the valves ringing. You WILL NOT HERE IT from the inside of the car. Because the engine compartment has a very good soundproofing you will only hear it while speeding up (1200-2000 rpm) with windows opened and passing by some walls or other objects that will easily reflect the sound. The buzzing noise is awful and you really won't here it from the car. It sounds like a Diesel and it's not correct. Check it. This engine is still not running as it should.
@@FourRingsAuto From 19:53 on your video it's not so loud, probably because camera mic is too far, but it's very similar to this: th-cam.com/video/pOdaEj-3lPg/w-d-xo.html
This engine sounds fantastic IMO! It definitely runs smoother than mine, which will be getting this exact job done ASAP. Is the sound you're referring to the direct injection system? They ALWAYS make a clattering noise but can be a little different amongst the different carmakers.
5 or 6 hours roughly. People can "knock it out cheaper/faster" but they always come back leaking or with vvt faults if they're rushed. 5 to 6 hours allows you to do it as in the video, taking care not to bend the lower cover and clean all the silicone off properly.
Some last 100k km, some last 200k km. It's all down to the maintenance. Regular service intervals will make the chain last longer. Change the oil at 10k km max and it will last longer. Oil is far cheaper than repairs like this.
I have some kind of knocking/rattling from the timing chain area, more so when cold but still evident at extremely low revs when warm. I've had this into a vw specialist but they seem to thinks it's fine and normal, it's definitely not I know that. It doesn't rattle on start up but the noise it's quite clear.
The chain was stretched or lengthened. The tensioner was replaced due to it being the older design that fails. The tensioners can be inspected through a round plastic inspection plug in the lower front timing cover.
It is not 2 links out of position. The balance shaft chain wasn't replaced. The links won't line up again once the engine has been turned so you can only use the links to line up the chain on installation only.
@@FourRingsAuto Thanks for the reply, great video! That actually makes perfect sense. I'm half way through doing this job myself - two chains, tensioner, all plastics and it's the first chain I've done so want to be totally sure I know what I'm doing! Been doing TDI belts for years! Nothing 'special' about the colured links, they're just there to help with initial fitting - you don't even need to use them if you are confident your pulleys are in the correct position. Hopefully will reoprt back soon that it all went well....
I have a 2013 MK6 GTI 2.0T DSG and on a cold start I hear a rattle for less than a second. It only does this on a completely cold start up and goes away. Car currently has 80,000 miles on it. Could this be the tensioner or timing chain starting to fail. I am about to switch to a Mobil 1 0W-40 Euro Spec Oil with the factory VW Filter and see if that helps it. I change the oil every 5-6,000 miles on it. It just started doing this as the temperature outside dropped to under 60 degrees F.
Could be a loose timing chain, a tensioner about to fail, or more rarely a variable valve timing variator pulley on the inlet cam. I would advise taking it to a reputable vw audi or euro specialist workshop and have them cold start it (u will have to drop it day before) and check the measured values of the inlet cam phase position also. This is the sort of thing that may be ok to leave in the short term, but it may also be a huge problem waiting to show itself. I'd highly recommend getting this checked and repaired before it does become an issue. Loose chains or rattling in the chain drive breaks plastic chain guides.
Absolutely fuck these timing chain covers on 2013 gti they literally put the bottom ones in the way of the motor mount theres like 0 way to get the shit out ive been trying for hours an im fuckin pissed
I have a rattle for a couple of seconds then car drives fine , im going to change the tensioner , i also have eml light that won't go ,, it says cam timing issue . Is that linked or separate problem
As a mk6 owner I feel like this damn car will be the death of me 😮💨
yes agree they are a load of crap
@@stephenhunt3068 lol they really aren't if you take care of them.
Take good care of them and you'll be fine. Had mine for 2 years and no issues.
@@bib3024 I have had my one for 12yrs now. Has done just over 211000kms and I am only doing the timing chain now. It has been pretty reliable for all these years.
Thanks ever so much for this dude, it's like a nugget of gold.
Thanks i gotta do one at my work next week 😭😂
I’m getting mine changed at 138,000 miles. I do not have a cold start rattle, but I do get a bit of a rattle when I shut the engine off and there’s a rhythmic scraping noise from that end of the engine, the cam phaser also shows -4.8. The engine still runs well and delivers all the power it has ever had.
I’ve had my GTI since new and it has only ever had oil that meets VW spec. In hindsight I think the point that going as long on a single change of oil as VW recommends is not a great idea. I did that for 70k to 80k miles when I decided to halve that number and essentially change it twice as frequently.
Agreed on oil intervals. -4.8°kw is ready to be changed for sure. Just bear in mind when switching off, your rattle cpuld be from the dual mass flywheel, unless of course you've heard it from the timing chain end. Thanks for your comment.
@@FourRingsAuto I searched for some examples of the noise a bad flywheel would make and I'm fairly sure it isn't that, thankfully.
Question: about how many hours of labor do you usually charge to do the timing chain?
...and thank you for the response and thanks for the video, it was good to watch.
@@michaelw6277 5 or 6 hours, depends on the model. The chain itself is the easy part - cleaning the sealant from the lower timing cover and block is time consuming, but has to be done right otherwise it will leak.
Literally same milage for me too ive ran it at 20 psi for 6 years too lol
Thank you for the video. I have been working on cars as a hobby for decades, but every time I get into a more complex repair like this, I'm nervous. These videos help me to feel more confident. I'm about to get into a Tiguan with the same engine and it was recommended that I change the balance shaft chain, guides, and tensioner as well. In your opinion, should I change it?
Changing the other chain setup is a good idea, especially if the main chain is excessively stretched. The timing of the balance shaft chain is relatively simple too. I've not had one yet that needed it or had majorly high mileage. I have heard more horror stories of balance shafts seizing up tbh.
I have -5.64* and old style tensioner.
Lucky me that it didn't jump. Oil changes at max 4500km.
Car is sitting in the garage waiting for OEM parts to arrive.
Thanks for the video-advice.
No problem at all. Chain, tensioner and 3x guides will get you sorted 👌
@@FourRingsAuto Yes sir, that's exactly I was thinking. Thanks!
So odd for an English person to be referencing distance in kilometers, had to check your location to figure that out. Nice one mate.
Awesome video! I have a 2013 Tiguan and I have misfires on all cylinders and the weird hide cylinder code to add to it. No other codes. I have replaced injectors, intake manifold to the new revision and I’m still getting misfires on all cylinders and a really rough idle with loss of power. Did a compression test and all cylinder are at 180 except cylinder #2, which the first time was at 0 and second time was at 60psi. I guess my question is, how can I determine where I am loosing compression?
Nice video.. Always change oil on time and use a high quality synthetic. Oil .. The chain Will last for ever..
Service is always key to a long healthy life span for an engine
Oil is cheap as the old saying goes!
@@FourRingsAuto add filters to that list ive seen filters loaded with metal due to them never being changed
Never changed oil without the filter! Ever! Oil and filter everytime. What is the point in changing one and not the other?
@@FourRingsAuto people being cheap lmao
The yank on that dipstick mate😭
That shit was hilarious
I like to watch this channels i can learn a lot the only fear i have is to timing cars? I don't know ??
Hi. Great video. Just doing similar job my self. I have one question?
At 6:00 in video. I can't clearly get what You are saying there. Should there be a oil screen of some kind or what is that what was blown out?
So I have a ticking noise coming from the timing belt area of my engine bay whenever I'm on the thorttle a little bit. I have no codes, compression in all cylinders. Nothing logged in my VCDS, but I'm going to check out my Phase Position tomorrow. I've been trying to figure this out for a week now and borderline about to take it into a shop if this Phase Position comes back a -5 or lower. Any ideas?
At 17:55, it looks like the blue link from the balance shaft chain is not lined up with the outer mark on the sprocket? I'm guessing this is fine since you could get them to line up if you had spun the crank over more before putting on the camshaft timing chain?
Very well done video man good on ya 👌
Very interesting, thank you. How many miles on the car? What is the mileage you normally see that requires a change? I tend to see mk5/6's with timing issues for sale at roughly 150k. In fact, at my storage unit , someone just came in with one that jumped timing... He is not sure if he wants to keep it and repair it...damn my vw addiction haha
I think this could be my issue given my mk6's mileage. I had the ignition coils, the fuel injectors, and the spark plugs replaced and I still get a jolt when the engine is under load. The issue for me is that I don't have a scanner to confirm this.
Very good video. Thanks for taking the time to show most of it all and with lots of helpful hints. Here in Germany VW sell special pack of the required replacement parts... so it's all there... apart from the turbo gasket.... o and all the special tools :)
Where can i buy the special pack?
Buy at VW. FEBI Bilstein also have a Set you can buy. All in one box.
I'm replacing the head gasket just blew at 265xxxkm's, i'm also replacing anything else i can think of while i got the engine apart like the timing. Although its pretty dang tight wasn't lose at all like in you're video, should i still replace it? But i'm changing the injectors, doing a carbon clean, all gaskets I've removed, fuel pump, oil pump ect aswell. Shockingly all hoses look great for canada lmao. Any other parts you would swap lmk! Thanks in advance.
Thanks for the video. What tool did you use to remove the mount from the block? It is a really tight area there. Thank you again for the video.
Triple square xzn12
So once you had your first sprocket and the crank shaft lined up with the marks and chains, did you lift the chain and turn the cam with your wrench to line it up? I’m a little confused
I may have missed it in the video. Does VW have a spec for the maximum amount of chain stretch in the shop manual? After cleaning the chain(s) in part cleaner, stretch can be measured on a bench top. Lay the chain flat, push together/pull apart, etc. Measure. Between the tensioner, guides & chain(s), VCDS can't really isolate this. If the tensioner is all the way out, I'd think a mechanic that has done a few of these could eyeball the groves in the guides and look at how much the chain stretches to know if the chain needs replacing. Some Honda motorcycles have this spec in the manual for a single row chain. Wondering if VW give guidelines on this.
Is this procedure the same for a 2016 volkswagen jetta 1.8 TSI? Everything looks familiar to my engine..and having a hard time finding a video for a 1.8
Great video thanks
hello, thanks for your help, I just bought a golf gti mk6 with this engine, the old owner told me he did this job from 10000km, I don't feel it running well and reading the parameters from the vcds I read -3.89 ° I have to worry ? hope you can help me
Good video thank you sir
I'm at -4.3° according to my obd11 on my 2012 beetle turbo (e888 Gen 1 cbfa)
Cts ko4 fbo and tune.. 130k miles..
It's time🙄.. I swear this car is the most expensive car maintenance wise I've ever owned
That chain value is very interesting. I’m at -4.3 deg 50k kms ago. Now im at -5.6 deg. No chain rattle in cold start and car runs fine. I do change my oil very frequently. I wonder if this is caused by bad quality oil or people running too low on oil. My car is also modified to stage2+ with k04 turbo.
You realize the chain is stretching and the tensioner will max out until the chain jumps and fails.
There is a revised timing tensioner and timing chain, you may have the old chain.
Thanks for the vid! What is the part number for the turbo oring you replace? I’m struggling finding it
How you call and remove that piece the go in front of the balancer pully thanks
Have you ever seen 93-3 Phase at +13? That seems super advanced, almost like the timing has jumped or something...
That's approx the amount of one tooth jumped. But can also be when either the spool valve is broken, or the vvt magnet is sticking.
@@FourRingsAuto I've got some weird stuff going on, cam related codes + oil pressure dropping just barely below spec at warm idle, but going back in spec if I raise RPMs to even about 900 / 950. Looks like the valve cover is coming off for me to inspect both the timing chain and the intake camshaft bearings, etc...
Is yours the ea888.2 with the 2 oil pressure switches on the oil filter housing? If so, check PCV valve as I've seen 1 audi q3 2.0tfsi ea888.2 with a leaking pcv cause the idle to be too low from memory and it would trigger an oil pressure light on the dash. Replaced pcv and oil light gone. Because they have a variable oil pump on the ea888.2
@@FourRingsAuto I'll look into that, although the idle didn't seem low, maybe around 650-700. I'll probably have to just fix the timing issue then address the oil pressure thing, as I've seen really weird stuff on these german engines, like a bad electronic engine mount causing the ECU to disable the high pressure fuel pump... just have to address every issue one at a time...
Did you ever fix the problem, if so what was it, sounds like the same thing my cars doing
Hi I have an Audi A3 with same engine. I'm using Cstrol Magnatec semi synthetic oil in this. What is your opinion on this. Engine has 134000km on it and still sounds good without rattles. At what mileage do suggest chain replacement. Regards
I recommend checking the phase position of the inlet camshaft and if more the 4°kw i would be replacing the chain drive components. But you may also want to remove the round rubber plug from the lower timing cover and check which style of tensioner you have, and the amount of teeth protruding. You're around the kms where it's likely to be a good idea to change it.
Good tip. Thanks for that. Must write it down....
Hi our Audi engine went sick needed new camshaft and timing chain. Was going better then engine light came on and diagnostic picked up misfire on cylinder number 4. On investigation found hole in piston. What caused this we are unsure of. Dont know what remedy will be needed.
How accurate would you say the bank 1 phase position measuring value is? I changed my tensioner and it reads close to 8 deg no rattling on start up both cold and hot.
It's accurate. You should have changed the the chain too.
@@FourRingsAuto ahhh dam it well it runs good will change it at a later date so the tolerances are between plus or minus 5 deg correct? Also my thoughts are if it were really bad won't it make noise at start up etc?
@@shimon2476 won't always make a noise. You have a new tensioner so that is helping. Don't leave it too long, most i see at -7° that are left without repair last a short time before they jump timing and bend valves.
@@FourRingsAuto ok NP think its on the positive side will check back again and see thanks again.
@@FourRingsAuto mine is at -5.6, the mechanic said my engine is a ticking time bomb...... U agree? I have 2014 tiguan with 120,000 miles
Hello mate I got a VW Scirocco 09, on the dashboard all the time if I’m driving for a long time it will say “engine fault management”, then on the faults when I’m getting diagnostics it says “Camshaft error”. I’ve changed the camshaft but again the error code keeps coming up. It might be my timing chain but I’m not sure.
It might well be, but that is way too vague of a fault code! What are you using to read the codes? Does it have a P code next to the fault code? Need more info, could be multiple different engines fitted to the car...
Will this be same process for a 2012 golf R? and quick question if I was on the high way and that's breaks is my motor done for?
2012 golf r is mk6. Mk6r uses ea113 belt drive engine. This is the successor ea888 that replaced it and uses a chain. Just keep on top of your timing belt maintenance intervals, and report any rattling noises to your mechanic as there is a chain between the exhaust and inlet cams on the back of your engine.
Hey, what's the procedure for replacing the cam shaft bracket, the piece that hold the actuator magnet? Is there any sealant, are the bolts reusable, and what are the torque specs? I appreciate any information, I've been looking everywhere but haven't been able to find much.
I will get the torque settings. No sealant required.
A couple good videos for timing chain replacement: Edge Motors did a full timing chain replacement including the cam bridge on an Audi Q5. Getting to the timing chain is different, but once the covers are off the replacement process is exactly the same. Part 1: th-cam.com/video/DihEegHWaYM/w-d-xo.html part 2: th-cam.com/video/jIbFLFeTu2Y/w-d-xo.html. This one shows another angle on getting to the timing chain on a Mk6 GTI: th-cam.com/video/O0yde12lIJs/w-d-xo.html
@@FourRingsAuto is it necessary to apply some grease on the inner front main seal before installing the crank pulley, or do you just install the pulley with a dry front main seal and allow it to set for 4 hours before first crank?
Dry
@@FourRingsAuto thx. do you ever apply sealant to the balance shaft tensioner bolt on the washer? mine seems to be leaking around that bolt? can i just remove the tensioner bolt, clean it up add some sealant and then replace it and torque to spec?
Wow, seems like a huge pain. How much does this kind of job cost? I want to get a 2012 GTI but im scared about this Timing chain part. . . :(
I’m in the exact same spot as you
I don’t know if you’re still in this position but I’m doing it within the next couple of weeks & could update you on wether or not it’s worth it to pay to have it done.
@@zorohz8381 what did you end up doing
@@TechnicaX did it my self, not that bad of a job
ARGH HELP @fourringsauto Great tips again dude. , My gause is missing in the cam bridge . I can't see it anywhere any ideas on where to look? could it have made its way to the sump? otherwise I ll just need to reassemble and hope for the best argh help.
How much would this kind of thing usually cost ? I have a 2.0 Scirocco tsi, on 109k miles.
i’m getting it done next week $1400 CAD so like $1000 usd
@@tjwilddyt2233 ahh canada. i was asking for UK, but i think its between £500-800 depending on where you go.
When this sound starts is it a present everytime when engine starts or sometimes not?
Normally on a cold start, when the car has been left for a while. It's also down to where in the stroke the engine stops, as there can be a bit of rollback of the crank which can compress the tensioner more.
@@FourRingsAuto please look my two videos and tell me what do you think
Hi, great video... I measured on my passat 193'000km, 1.8tsi CDAA 127mm between the cam marks.. time to replace? To the same time the engine was running very rough and with warm engine a loud noise came from the front around the crankshaft and chain...also misfire codes on all cylinders.. any ideas? Can I order the parts from you? Regards Ivo
Antworten
replacing my chains guides and tensioners and hardware bolts
Did you replace the timing cover or re-use the old one?
Replace. It will bend while removing it
Check out this playlist I've made for issues with the 2.0tsi ea888 engine.
th-cam.com/play/PL7h7Lv2An3_dzSmN6-NM2DZ_yZTSUvCN7.html
why you install old rev timing chain? and correction in 93 grup after job is very bad, should be close to 0.00 max to 1.00 deg.
Hi really good video, have a audi s3 tsi in work with a camshaft sensor fault, replaced sensor, checked wiring to ecu all good, would u be looking at chain next?
Which s3, 8p with belt drive ea113 engine, or 8v with the chain drive ea888 gen3? Sorry if I'm getting too Audi nerdy with the numbers.
Oh sorry reread saying chain. So I would check the phase position MVB measured value block first, which gives you an indication of chain stretch. I'd then want to know if it runs well or if it is noisy. Next step you can only do with an oscilloscope, however it is the one thing that opens up the whole diag and you can actually see if there's a problem rather than guessing. Scope the cam sensor, you can check the 5v reference with a multi meter, and sensor ground (runs through ecu), but the signal back to the ecu you'd need to scope. This will show you the switching of the hall sensor. You could then scope the crank at the same time and from that you can check the timing without disassembly of the engine. This is something i should really do a video of, but i just assume most people watching are DIYers and would be of no interest.
@@FourRingsAuto
Not sure what engine chain code ill have to get back to u on that, vehicle only came in today, runs really well no noisey chain, fit genuine cam sensor fault code returned, checked voltage like u said had 5 v, no pico scope in our workshop so cant check signal wire wich would be a good test, checked continuity from each 3 wires back to ecu all good, in work tomoz ill check inlet cam phase position and report back to u something ive learned from you we have vcds 👍
I had this job done a few weeks ago but something troubles me and just doesn't feel right. I can 'feel' the new chain rotating on 1st and 2nd almost like grinding against the guide(s). It is a bit subtle but certainly not as smooth as before. Had replaced everything, (including balance shaft chain and guides) except from oil chain/tensioner. VCDS shows anywhere between -0.6 - -0.9 so timing looks fine. Any ideas? Feeling quite depressed to be honest...
In 1st and 2nd gear?
@@FourRingsAuto Yes. After 2000rpm or so. If i put it on D i cant feel it it shifts early.
Checked the crank pulley for wobble whilst running? The inner crank gear that all the chains run on can slip, especially if the bolt wasn't put back in whilst disassembled. Had a couple of guys make this mistake and have a noise.
Or maybe something is bent and vibrating. Can you hold it at the rpm it does it at in neutral stationary? Or get someone to do it whilst you look. Who did the work, you or a workshop?
@@FourRingsAuto I had it done at a workshop and i was present during the whole procedure. The gears were secured with the nylon washer. The only workaround they had to do was with the four pin counterhold tool for the vibration dumper. They had an other one for other vw models i guess (3 pins i think?) however they managed to hold it steady while screwing the crank bolt. I will try to rev it in neutral and see what happens although i think i tried this a few times. Another idea i had was to go to the shop, lift the car from the ground start driving through all the gears and listen carefully.
How long did it take you to do this job?
5 hours
good men you are 👊👌👏❤
does the chain cover have anything to do with engine mount? ive done an engine swap and im having diffilcuties fitting the mount. Golf MK6 GT
No it shouldn't affect it.
hy men
i want to ask you about sharan 1.4 sdi d you know some think about the motor engine please because i want to buy some one thank you voor your vedios see you later
At minute 6:05. What bearing are you referring to?
2. Can you give more details on what you measured at 5.45 onwards? I know what you measured. I mean what are the points im looking to measure from - to.
The aluminum bracket is known as a bearing ledge or bearing saddle, as it is a removable end bearing for the cams.
Measuring between the timing marks.
If im only replacing the cam timing chain do I need to re time the balance shafts chain or can I just set it to tdc and replace the cam chain only without messing with the balance shafts chain?
Don't need to time the balance shaft chain if you're not replacing or dismantling it.
@@FourRingsAuto thank you very much
Hello, i have a similar knocking noise when i start my 2014 golf r could it be the timing chaine also or is it the camshaft please its urgent and im waiting for your answer , have a good day
Fucked mate.
Hey, great video. But I have one question. This is my first tsi Volkswagen, 2009 mk5 gti it has 176,000 miles or to you 283,000 km the other chains behind the chain you replaced what was that one and should all chains and guides be done at the same time?
The other chain is the balance shaft chain. It would be a good idea at your kms to replace that and it's guides and tensioner too. Yours is a mk6 gti if it's a chain engine. The mk5 gti was belt drive. Thanks
@@FourRingsAuto i also have a 09 gti thats chain driven (mk5). They dtart putiing chain driven TSI motors in 2008.5 and up. Just fyi
@@tunerguy495 where are you located? I'm guessing USA?
How many km did this engine have?
Is the timing chain cover connected to the mount? I’ve changed my engine and the mount is different
Mount is attached to the block on a 2.0tsi, not the covers.
So how long should the new chain and tensioner last? Good video
Good question. Hard to put a mileage or time on them. The main thing is regular oil changes every 10k km and using quality oil rated to vw 504/507 spec or vw502.
@@FourRingsAuto Hi. Is Castrol the recommended oil from VW? I was thinking about using the Castrol Edge full synthetic 5w-30, even though the VW dealership who did my last oil change used 5w-40 according to the receipt. Which is supposed to be used? My 13 Eos is doing the rattle on cold start so Im going to have this done ASAP! You seem like a meticulous mechanic who wants it done right and I wish you were here to do mine! Thank you for the video and have a great weekend!
5w30 castrol edge longlife 3 i believe is what vw audi specifies. 5w40 is good too as long as it's vw504 rated oil. You'll generally burn less on on 5w40.
Forgot to add that you jacked up the piss out of the engine to get the engine mount (bracket) BOLTS
What price should I be looking at to replace to the whole timing kit...runs fine just worried as mine is 2011 with the old tensioner...
In the region of 5 or 6 hours from memory. Labour rates will vary country to country, as will parts rrp.
How much does that job cost?
Great video 👍 Do you think its possible to do the balance shafts inside the engine bay or is it an engine out job?
my stepdad did mine inside the engine bay so yes it can be done but idk how he did it
yes I ended up doing it with the engine still in. Just drop engine mount and lower accessing it from the wheel arch area. Pretty straightforward in the end.
Great Video. Please help out with the P/N for the turbo outlet pipe O-Ring?
WHT006482
What tops did you use to remove the engine mount ?
Tops? Sorry i don't understand
Cant find thr measuring block value on this audi under 93?
8V s3 is UDS protocol. Go into the search box at the top and look for inlet or intake. It's usually the 3rd one down from memory on vcds and is called inlet phase position.
My TFSI had -7 degrees retarded "correction". The timing chain was over 1,5cm longer! 100, 200 maybe 500 km more and it would fall off.
After replacement it has now only -0.27 degrees retardation.
I think, that in your case here -2.71 degrees is still not perfect but acceptable.
Also, you did not check the intake camshaft requested position / actual position.
Personally, I'm still fighting now with that clanging noise that you also have in this engine.
Thing is, even there are no error messages, all values and corrections are in order, you can still hear the valves ringing.
You WILL NOT HERE IT from the inside of the car. Because the engine compartment has a very good soundproofing you will only hear it while speeding up (1200-2000 rpm) with windows opened and passing by some walls or other objects that will easily reflect the sound.
The buzzing noise is awful and you really won't here it from the car. It sounds like a Diesel and it's not correct.
Check it. This engine is still not running as it should.
What clanging noise are you referring to?
@@FourRingsAuto From 19:53 on your video it's not so loud, probably because camera mic is too far, but it's very similar to this:
th-cam.com/video/pOdaEj-3lPg/w-d-xo.html
This engine sounds fantastic IMO! It definitely runs smoother than mine, which will be getting this exact job done ASAP. Is the sound you're referring to the direct injection system? They ALWAYS make a clattering noise but can be a little different amongst the different carmakers.
How long does it take to do this job ?
5 or 6 hours roughly. People can "knock it out cheaper/faster" but they always come back leaking or with vvt faults if they're rushed. 5 to 6 hours allows you to do it as in the video, taking care not to bend the lower cover and clean all the silicone off properly.
@@FourRingsAuto thank you for answering.
How long did all the replacing process take?
Something like 4 or 5 hours roughly. Sealant on the lower cover is time consuming to clean, bit is necessary to get good reseal and no leaks.
15:48 bookmarked.
Wheres your garage based at?
Western Australia
How much Km will it last ???
Some last 100k km, some last 200k km. It's all down to the maintenance. Regular service intervals will make the chain last longer. Change the oil at 10k km max and it will last longer. Oil is far cheaper than repairs like this.
I have some kind of knocking/rattling from the timing chain area, more so when cold but still evident at extremely low revs when warm. I've had this into a vw specialist but they seem to thinks it's fine and normal, it's definitely not I know that. It doesn't rattle on start up but the noise it's quite clear.
Its so hard to work on this A3s. The engine position is very bad
what are the miles on this at time of the video?
and was it the chain stretching or a bad tensioner
The chain was stretched or lengthened. The tensioner was replaced due to it being the older design that fails. The tensioners can be inspected through a round plastic inspection plug in the lower front timing cover.
Where are you in Australia?
Perth
@@FourRingsAuto nice, keep up the good content man 👍🏼
Brill
At 17:44 it looks like the balance shaft chain is two links out of position - what's going on there?
It is not 2 links out of position. The balance shaft chain wasn't replaced. The links won't line up again once the engine has been turned so you can only use the links to line up the chain on installation only.
@@FourRingsAuto Thanks for the reply, great video! That actually makes perfect sense. I'm half way through doing this job myself - two chains, tensioner, all plastics and it's the first chain I've done so want to be totally sure I know what I'm doing! Been doing TDI belts for years! Nothing 'special' about the colured links, they're just there to help with initial fitting - you don't even need to use them if you are confident your pulleys are in the correct position. Hopefully will reoprt back soon that it all went well....
I have a 2013 MK6 GTI 2.0T DSG and on a cold start I hear a rattle for less than a second. It only does this on a completely cold start up and goes away. Car currently has 80,000 miles on it. Could this be the tensioner or timing chain starting to fail.
I am about to switch to a Mobil 1 0W-40 Euro Spec Oil with the factory VW Filter and see if that helps it.
I change the oil every 5-6,000 miles on it. It just started doing this as the temperature outside dropped to under 60 degrees F.
Could be a loose timing chain, a tensioner about to fail, or more rarely a variable valve timing variator pulley on the inlet cam. I would advise taking it to a reputable vw audi or euro specialist workshop and have them cold start it (u will have to drop it day before) and check the measured values of the inlet cam phase position also. This is the sort of thing that may be ok to leave in the short term, but it may also be a huge problem waiting to show itself. I'd highly recommend getting this checked and repaired before it does become an issue. Loose chains or rattling in the chain drive breaks plastic chain guides.
Oil change one golf gti
Absolutely fuck these timing chain covers on 2013 gti they literally put the bottom ones in the way of the motor mount theres like 0 way to get the shit out ive been trying for hours an im fuckin pissed
Golf 6 gti service engine
Tengo carro problema lo q pasa código p0016 ayudar por favor no marcha mi carro vw gti 2011
Trying to hit driver straight
What do you mean Bob?
Dude speak the hell up i stg talk people suck at doing these walkthroughs
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂👌👉
I have a rattle for a couple of seconds then car drives fine , im going to change the tensioner , i also have eml light that won't go ,, it says cam timing issue . Is that linked or separate problem
Good infos but Man you talk to fricking much. get on and turn some wrenches!!!
You know that's the idea of sharing information is to actually share it right?
Fuck off Dan.
@@FourRingsAuto Great job mate!
How much would this cost usually?
All depends where you live in the world, so difficult to put a price on it.
@@FourRingsAuto i dig your videos, very insightful. What does your workshop charge for the full blown out timing kit service in Australia?
5 or 6 hours labour from memory. Plus parts, oils, consumables etc.
thanks for sharing
@@FourRingsAuto
In the UK it's about £1200.00