The real question is why did he lose MORE power in A FEW MONTHS between the end of Z and beginning of Super than he did in SEVEN years of no training after cell saga. Makes no sense when you think about it.
Guess you could just say his mental state by then was so pathetic it affects a lot like his ki too. Didn't think too much about the mental state aspect cause its kinda funny but it is true that usually we see it with chars getting angry then getting power out of nowhere. When Gohan fights Dabura Goku says that he should be able to beat Dabura because Goku cares more that his techniques are crap but doesn't care his son lived a peaceful life and went to school but his fighting technique is so horrible by then its what Goku uses to respond to Vegeta saying his power is lowered, it shows that Vegeta cares about power while Goku technique. Once Gohan is able to get his confidence back he strikes Buus shell with power that surprises people that have seen his and other SS2 powers before. DBS Gohan has worst mental state until TOP
Gohan's power came from a ritual. The Buu saga at the very most took a week in their universe. He didn't train in 4 years by the time BoG came, and after that, he still didn't train after a year. Frieza was revived for atleast a few more months after Vegeta went to Beerus' planet.
John Zhou Ssj2 full power gohan would have a little trouble taking out cell in the beginning of the buu saga. Since he had trouble with dabura who is like cell with magic techniques
Black Saiyan God have u ever watched gt? Lol. Gohan sucks and will always suck after the cell saga what they need to do is finish super and go ahead into gt again because gt is the future... so super sayian 4 is the strongest form, and gohan needs to have some heart
@Martin Ramirez when gohan got true potential mode in buu arc gohan was the strongest person in the series...that was stated. Gohan arrogance was his only weakness
Idk if it's a "form." I know in the games they treat it like a form, but in (at least DBS) the anime, Gohan just talks about achieving his own kind of strength different than Goku's. He also called it just "going all out" in the tournament of power. Gohan himself doesn't really refer to it as a "form."
@@zahktuthalxalyrion6364 yeah the games did, but hasn't he used it instead of SS in the anime? Like I would have thought it would be a boost to his base and increase SS power, not go out of SS to use it?
@@danielmoreira1802 Well it does provide a boost in his base form (it's all we really see him use it for). Logically, one would assume it'd boost his SSJ and SSJ2 forms as well. But Gohan doesn't WANT to use SSJ or SSJ2. Super Saiyan is his father's power. He doesn't want to just copy his father and just keep using super saiyan transformations to be stronger than his foes. He wants to be stronger in just his base form, and be able to fight on par with Goku. And we see that in DBS when Gohan goes all out against Goku, and Goku had to tap into SSGSS Kaioken to stop Gohan from pushing him. At just SSGSS, Gohan was still pushing Goku and telling him to stop holding back.
@@zahktuthalxalyrion6364 Mystic Gohan was the strongest form he had in the buu saga. He didn't need to go super Saiyan as it was stronger than super Saiyan 3. Gohan was dumping on super buu, which even goku said he couldn't beat super buu. Toriyama decided Gohan was not fit to be the main character of Dragon ball so that's why he has not surpassed Goku.
Literally the worst thing about dragonball.. seeing Beast Gohan overtake Goku and Vegeta when they trained so hard is ridiculous They should have capped out Gohan and used him as an example of what happens when you waste potential
@@kyleclatworthy8301 i dont like beast either, but gohan is still the most powerfull fighter of the series by far, even if he dont keep his training. At the age of 4 he managed to damage raditz, fought on namek a few years past against the strongest of the universe, and later unlocked ss2 at 11, the same age as goku in classic (were he struggled with yamcha and roshi) I think he is the only charavter that can get a lot of power from nothing based on his feats. The humans for example dont have any reason to become as strong as they were in TOP
I know right? I'm a adult with a kid and I'm still watching dbz clips and debating with people in the comment section lmao, I don't do this with no other show. I think us guys are attracted to power and this show was the best display of that.
Yeah, what a terrible mother, wanting her kid to succeed in the world and giving him education! Gohan had a loving wife, great family and good life, how terrible that he did not spend every waking moment of his life preparing for a crisis that might never come. He spend majority of his childhood in a constant warzone, how terrible of him to just want to be a normal dude...
Markel Paige full potential my ass everyone only looks from their side cuz everyone is selfish and want others to do things for them Chi chi is being a MOTHER and you can’t blame a mother for wanting to give HER SON a life outside of constant life death situations Look I love gohan Just like anybody else but I hate it when people say it’s chichis fault
Farmer with A shotgun you could also see from another perspective which is that gohan would die if he didn't do any of that training heck everyone one earth would be dead.
@@spiralanimations7736 what is wrong with you?? No one was disagreeing that point. They are just saying that yes, because of chichi, he never reached his full potential. Of course shes a good mom, but nevertheless, he didnt live up to what he could have been
I think Gohan's main issue is his loss of fighting sense because of the time he didn't train/fight... It doesn't seem to me that Dabura had the upper hand against Gohan... he just had some dirty tricks and Gohan... well... is just Gohan
I'm glad you all brought up Piccolo in this video. That was just plain bad writing on this character. Piccolo seems like a warrior who train daily even in times of peace, in case a new threat were to emerge. He should have been alot stronger in the Buu saga. He should have been able to keep up with a super saiyan 2 (or almost) after the 7 year time skip (assuming he trained nearly everyday for 7 years).
I feel like in my opinion if he hadn't had kami brain smarts in him he would cause think about it kami it's not really a fighter he's more of a teacher and nail and piccolo are more ruthless and independent so that explains why he was helping trunks and Goten with the fusion and knew the surpreme Kai
Perhaps Piccolo did train daily but he had no one to train against. It's been shown that if you train with a partner, like sparring, you get stronger a lot faster, since you're pushing each other. Remember the three-year time skip between Frieza and the Androids? Piccolo trained with Goku and as a result, Krillin said that he was about as powerful as a Super Saiyan when he fought Android 20. That's a pretty big jump, considering we know a Super Saiyan can completely own Frieza, and Piccolo was having trouble even against his third form back in that arc. Let's look at all his other battles in Z: Trained on his own and with a very unskilled warrior in Gohan, got owned by Vegeta and Nappa. We already discussed Frieza. He trained on his own for Cell, and he knew it wasn't enough. I'm not counting 17 and 18 because he didn't train, he just absorbed Kami. So going by all of that it's pretty much confirmed that at least Piccolo can't gain much power unless he has a powerful opponent to spar and train with, and that's why even if he did train during those 7 years he would have still been pretty useless against Buu.
To be fair, it was new Frieza with a base that is much stronger than his namek saga base. But I get your point, Gohan is really one heck of a disappointment
There is a mistake everybody makes when considering powers in dragonball. That's considering only RAW energy power and not abilities. Cell had all Z warriors abilities and Piccolo's regeneration buffed up to a level not even Piccolo can hope to reach. That's a huge difference. If Cell didn't have regeneration he would have died to Super Vegeta's Final Flash right after his transformation. Again against Goku's instant trasmission Kamehameha and Gohan's firt Super Kamehameha when he reflects Cell's own Kamehameha. Therefore Dabura having Cell's same Power Level doesn't make him as strong and problematic of a foe as Cell was. This reasoning goes for Bu too. Without his regeneration abilities Bu would have been defeated pretty easily when in his fat form and his kid form.
@@cheerioss-9121 I don't even consider Super as it is completely incoherent with all DBZ. If we had to consider it Gohan going from weaker than first form Frieza to keeping up with Goku SSGSS in a few weeks off screen just by getting back to his supreme form is pure bullshit. Supreme Gohan back in Buu saga was just a little stronger than SS3 Goku and from what is shown in the beggining of Battle Of Gods SS3 Goku is pure crap compared to his SSGSS form. So pure nosense there.
ItsDrako Lmao I honestly thought i was the only one having trouble trying to make sense of how everyone magically becomes as strong as Goku and Vegeta whenever they achieved their god form. They had Future trunks going blow for blow with Goku Black, who was supposedly suppose to be way stronger than Super saying Blue goku. Then they had android 17 evenly matched with Goku while he was SSB again, and the reasoning was “He’s been training by keeping the island safe” like that make sense lmao. Then they have beerus in some other worldly level for a few episodes then the next thing you know he’s getting bitched by Bulma and Goku and suddenly Vegeta and Goku magically surpass or reach his level? He’s suppose to be some type of God of destruction
@@cheerioss-9121 Its called holding back Goku was holding back against 17 and also Gohan if he wanted he could end the fight but he loves to fight its no fun just to end it
Idk if I would go so far to say that Gohan "lost" power. I would more so say that a portion of his power had gone dormant. In the Cell Saga he let out his potential through rage. In the beginning of the Buu saga he didnt have that rage to channel his potential thru, at least not like he did with Cell. I don't think he lost the power but more so lost the ability to channel it. While he probably remembers the feeling of being at that level and can still attain SS2 his emotions are still the barriers to unlocking it till Elder Kai.
Gohan trained literally everyday for a year just before the fight with Cell (with fkin Goku!). When he fought Dabura he was a scholar pretending to be a superhero as a hobbie... I think he actually lost some power but mostly technique and the mental state, also as you said, "the ability to channel" the power.
@@nemskalk I agree with you. Didn't lose a lot of power just some but more than anything he lost his fighting instinct and technique. His dormant power was still there and awakened by elder Kai.
Agreed...and he's a sayain so he definitely got a Zenkai boost from Cell even though it wouldn't be as much as a full sayain, but he definitely got one plus he got older. Naturally when you're a young adult you grow a bit in strength from a young teenager. I wouldn't say he got weaker in power, but I'll say he got extremely rusty in his fighting skills.
@D F ah yes under normal human physique I would agree. But Gohan is only part human. His Saiyan biology alone could easily keep conditioning since the Saiyan biology also keeps aging at bay so their bodies can continue to be used for battle. This is more apparent due to him having a muscular figure despite not training. Also he was 11 when he fought Cell. Just by naturally growing his body would make some progress at a later age. He admits that he isn't as strong which is true in the sense he doesnt have that access to that great power. Even in DB Super he states he needs to getting his fighting senses back to attain his "Mystic/Potential Unlock" again.
He lost enough to be treated like a “Yamcha” when compared to Goku and Vegeta in the buu arc. I mean great saiya man??? Biggest smh moment when I first saw that goof doing ginyu force poses.
I think some of that was that the Ginyu Force was popular, and Toriyama tried to cash in on that by having Gohan act like the Ginyu Force. There was more to the Ginyu Force than the poses, so that's why it fell flat
@@Alienldr I respect that but in all my years in the fandom I never came across that bit of info. I know the Ginyu Force was a shout out to Japan's other popular franchise I.E Super Sentai. It would have made more sense to have Goten and kid Trunks to act like little ginyu rangers than a grown ass man running around like he missed a dosage of meds..lol.
I loved it, dragon ball z isn't meant to be so edgy, that's why in the west everybody loves gohan, cause he's an edge lord and a self insert whereas in the east the comedy prevails, Super Saiyaman was so much fun, and a slice of life in DBZ.
@@KaNgUrUhBR if you say so. To me the saiya man crap was just really cringy and made me not like Gohan anymore after the cell saga had finally gotten me to like him. I hated Gohan when he was a whiny kid and I hated him as a cringy on older teen & adult.
@@KaNgUrUhBR lol it just brought me back to namek as I couldn't stand the antics of the Ginyu force and to have it been brought back through Gohan makes me feel like that hit he took from Racoom had a larger effect on him like some deep seeded trauma that never fully healed mentally and his mental state is fractured like how Vegeta's arm never quite healed right. 🤣😂
I was stronger when I was 18 because I stopped working out for 6 years. It took me 2 years to regain most of my strength. I'm 25 now and I still haven't reached my 18 year old maxes
He probably lost around 20 - 25% of his power. That's fair considering he wasn't going to wreck SPC as easily as just Perfect Cell, but it's noticeable enough that SPC would still lose mid-diff.
I would say he lost a mildly considerable amount. He didn’t get too weak to where he couldn’t go Ssj2 anymore but he lost a decent amount so that’s why he wasn’t as strong as his cell saga counterpart.
SSJ2 adult Gohan was a little weaker than Super Perfect Cell in terms of skill and power especially since Cell had the instant transmission, we never got to see SPC fight cause he would have been OP. It still only takes a SSJ2 to defeat SPC and Dabura even if its a weaker Gohan but would be hard to win.
Another point that a lot of people don’t mention is that he didn’t just get weaker, he got much worse at fighting. During his fight with Dabura, he makes a lot of mistakes and straight up falls for baits and tricks. And during his fight with Buutenks, he starts mindlessly throwing punches the second he lost the edge in raw power
I wonder if Gohan even knew how to train by himself because let’s keep it real, he would’ve killed Vegeta or Piccolo in a spar session. That or he would’ve had to suppress himself heavily causing him to get weaker.
Gohan's biggest issue is his lack of confidence in himself. He can become mentally defeated, and that's what makes it diffcult for him to maintain his power. Even Adult Gohan still suffers from that some times, untill he's really mentally committed to win.
Too much time to his mother's skirts, he haven't a hard life and is unable to understand the struggles that goku and vegeta do. It's not fair to compare gohan with them, because they are warriors and gohan is a scientist. Goku tries to get out all gohan potential and he does for cell, causing gohan a great trauma, not being at that height cost him the life of his father; he's not wanting to fight anymore, as he didn't really wanted, he did it for his father and because his father was there cheering him up.
No I think he’d probably just be as strong as potential unleashed form buu saga gohan and if he got his potential unleashed at that point he’d prolly then be in vegitos league, but he wouldn’t need to
@@MoonFallSlump I thought that too, but based on how fast his strength increased in the hyperbolic time chamber and if he actually kept pushing himself during the 7 year skip, the gap between him, Goku and Vegeta would be so wide that fusing would be their only option to keep up with a seasoned Gohan. The training Gohan did with Goten, the zenkai he got from getting drained and surving fat Buu, the z-sword training and the Elder Kai's unlocking ability made him stronger than Super Saiyan 3. If he had a gravity machine, trained another day in the hyperbolic time chamber or any other room at the lookout, Gohan would have been OP. Vegito or Gogeta would have been the only ones able to compete with him.
i hate this narrative vegeta trained that same amount of time even harder and didn't get much massive gains to his power without being pushed by an equal power he wouldn't of grown that much.
@@imjustadog1897 with vegeta training even harder then gohan in those 7 years and still not get much stronger it would be odd for gohan to have been the only one improving while trying in the damn wilderness
@@goldtgr7704 Not much Beerus just bodied him, but from BoG to RoF... Oof... He struggled going super saiyan.. SUPER SAIYAN!! in about 2-4 years time.. He was easily able to go super saiyan after 7 years not training, super saiyan 2 as well, but with some effort.. so how the hell does he struggle going super saiyan after 2 or maybe 4 years not training after that... He still had his "mystic form" in BoG.
I think the problem with Gohan is not actually his physical power, but that his mental state is all over the place. Gohan hates fighting, therefore his heart never actually was in it. Yes, he would ultimately do, what needs to be done, but in that sense he totally does not live up to his potential. His idea for life is in the end not, what his Father lives for.
The funny thing is I do think Teenage Gohan liked fighting more than Kid Gohan does but I do agree with you. I just think that added to his confusion. He didn't want to get angry against Debura because he wanted to fight like Goku. Videl of all people sort of brought out Gohan's love for fighting. Gohan enjoyed training Goten and Videl. I wished they would have continued more with that storyline. Gohan couldn't resist fighting crime so although he isn't obsessed with training like Goku he does like saving people and beating up bad guys.
Gohan gains power when those who are close to him are under threat, this has been made very clear since the headbutt to Raditz, so in a time of peace he would not get much upgrades to his power
There's an aspect people here tend to forget. Super Sayan 2 Gohan when he fought cell could have killed Super Majin Buu, that's not a joke. We know from the guide books that SS2 is twice as strong as normal SS, Gohan says after Cell returns from blowing up his chi is at half which would mean he was only as strong as he was BEFORE he went SS2. Gohan didn't JUST go SS2 against cell he ALSO tapped into the power inside him that we had seen so many times before. Goku says in the manga to Gohan when he's about to fight Vegeta that Gohan needs to fight as he did against cell, thismeans "unlock" his power again. With Dragonball Super now out we now know that the supreme kai's ritual just unlocked all of Gohan's hidden power he got when he was enraged but now he had when he was calm. People think all gohan did in that battle was go SS2 but that's not true he did so much more. That's why it took Goku and Vegeta 7 years to try catch up.
I think it feels more magnified by the fact that the show instills us to expect a Saiyan to always be improving. So when compared to his past self he may only be a bit weaker yet it feels like a huge difference because in 7 years we would expect him to be insanely strong.
You guys forgot to mention the point on how Gohan handled base Super Buu as easily as he did in SSJ2 form against Cell, with the backing of the Dabura-Cell power level statement, that would show how Gohan not only regained the power he lost but how *STRONGER* he got.
The way it was depicted during their fight, I doubt Dabura was really stronger than super perfect cell. Gohan wasn’t even at SSJ2 level power, he never unleashed it during their fight, we can tell from his aura. If SSJ1 Gohan is on par with Dabura, how can he be stronger than super prefect cell.
神推しあしゅりん he was fighting as a super saiyan 2. It’s poorly drawn or shown. But it’s obvious. The whole vegeta getting angry thing wouldn’t have happened if Gohan was holding back
I agree with what you guys said, it's more so the fact that gohans power level stayed stagnant while Goku and Vegeta surpassed him taking him from #1 to #3.
Chi Chi should be destroyed after his birth. That way he would never have stopped training, and trained a lot more gowing up. He would probably be Gohan Beast by 11
I agree with most of what you guys said but I want to make some points 1. teen gohan fought dabura at full power whilst young gohan was weakened and injured yet young gohan overpowered cell or at least stayed even whereas teen was losing 2. Gohan held back against cell the entire fight. even with one arm and half his energy he was able to with encouragement push cell back and it turns out he was still holding back 3. Dende healed him and gohans body was wrecked so he would have gotten a saiyan boost. that would make his strength higher than cell games 4. gohan trained a month before the tournament so actually grew stronger as seen with his training with goten as before goten had to stand a large distance away but got closer the more gohan trained (during the throwing rocks) If young gohan was a 10 Sp cell would be a 7 Dabura would be 7-8 teen gohan would be a 6 young gohan after being healed would be a 12-13 goku would be a 14 non majin vegeta would be a 12
I do not completly agree... If we set super perfect cell at 7 I would say: If Sp cell would be a 7 Gohan cell ssj2 would be an 8 with potential of a 10 Dabura would be 8 Gohan boo ssj2 be a 9 with potential of 12 goku ssj2 would be a 12 majin vegeta ssj2 would be a 12 This means Gohan of boo saga is stronger than Gohan of cell saga. Because of reasons: 1-Cell's Gohan has just awakened ssj2 2-Cell's Gohan is a kid, immature, with no willing to fight beyong his father's cheering up 3-Boo's Gohan has no threat since cell is gone and has no opponent to test his strenth with, as Vegeta refuses to train with him. 4-Boo's Gohan has raised mentality and now he understands a little bit better what's going on. In fact, Gohan would be able to reach a 12 with potential of 15 in his outrage, but due to his lifestyle he doesn't grow as much as Goku and Vegeta.
@@chocolate3213 His maturity makes him mentally weak, and also his muscles arent grow to its top. It's only that it seems stronger, but he's not... also he is using his rage to increase his potential, and he's not doing that when he's older
i still find it super hard to believe that vegeta and piccolo would allow him to get rusty/out of shape, you would think both would want to keep him training
It wasnt power as much as getting rusty. He "lost his fighting spirit" he became lazy. Not a ton physically weaker. Debora was stronger than cell for example.
leloupgarou1000 that doesnt make any sense. Ssj2 is a 2x multiplier from ssj. Ssj gohan was weaker than cell. 40% of ssj2 gohan is even weaker than that
I agree, Gohan didn't really lose power. He just didn't continue to gain power at the same rate as Vegeta and Goku and they surpassed him. Gohan also holds himself back because of his lack of confidence and his mom forcing the normal life on him. He's conflicted and doesn't commit to being as powerful as he could be like other Saiyans do
Lol it definitely was more than that more like 50% loss in power as a teen ssj2 gohan was toying around with perfect cell whereas ssj2 gohan against Dabura(who is around perfect cell level) was having a hard time keeping uo with him
@@jay_kulina didn't he...? Oh... Ok. Still i would say the loss in power for gohan would br significant as vegeta stated during gohan's match against Dabura in the anime that gohan was far more stronger as a teen than his showing against Dabura
Shoaib Haq CG Gohan was slightly to somewhat stronger than CG Goku in FPSSJ, if we go by the logic of Buu Saga I’d put Buu Saga Gohan relative to CG Goku or just slightly above in terms of raw power.
I see it as well yes gohan did lose a lot of power technically BUT he did grow from preteen into young adult and we all know how much stronger you are as an adult versus when your an 11 year old boy
@@gekku1578 hay I was going into how the body grows. I was trying to say yes he lost power. The transformations are the same so they don't matter. While he has grown up and gone through purity so his body should get stronger. And in Dragon Ball his health of body goes to Ki. So I'm saying he had to lose a lot of Ki and get a lot weaker in comparison
The thing you gotta remember though is that Toriyama was intending for Gohan to take over the protagonist role from Goku after Cell but the fans didnt like the idea. So he had to retcon Gohan for the Buu arc and make sure Goku was the protagonist again. Its the main reason he loses basically all the progress he gained
Great video with great points, but my problem isn't the lack of power but the lack of purpose for him. What I mean is like a lot of things in the Buu Saga, Gohan was a waste of time. We watch him go through school, tournament, lose to Buu, Train and unlock Mystic just to lose and have no role in the outcome of the saga just like Gotenks and Fusion. Just my opinion
Gohan simply doesn't like fighting at all, hence the lacking of power. All the training in the universe doesn't matter if your not motivated. His cool down however is top notch, which is a part of his potential and is why he's able to aquire strength quickly.
Let's not forget gohan still beat perfect cell weakened and using one arm. When he unleashed everything with one arm he completely annihilated cells full power kamehameha. We don't know his full power. He mightve lost almost half
We can't say half because that would essentially be SSJ. It was most likely between 10-15% after his brief training with Goten which was exasperated by his loss of fighting senses.
@@jamainegardner4193 he just came back. Like he said he was even more perfect at that point. There was really nothing stating that cell wasnt giving his all
I would love! Love! To discuss Dragonball with you all one day 🤝. This video was fire. And you have to be a longtime fan to understand this without question. Great content y’all. Keep it up💙.
I think ssj2 rage boost gohan is mystic gohan level remember the elder Kai said that it unleashes all his potential. He did hardly any training from end of cell to buu so an argument can be made that mystic gohan was the same as ssj2 gohan with rage boost and fully sharpened fighting sense.
It's a double edged sword for Gohan in DBZ. If he's not mad/angry then he's not at his full potential, but when he got to 100% power (ssj2 teen Gohan, or Buu arc Ultimate Gohan), he was super cocky and arrogant.
Ronan YVR ??? He fought Freeza up to his 3rd form.... He was literally wished back by the dragon balls and fused with nail. Lmao shows how much you know
I think he lost a massive amount of power. Some of the points you guys raised I agree with but I'm on a different train of thought. Gohan was a MONSTER in cell saga and was still an absolute monster with 1 arm. I still think you're under estimating how strong he really was in cell saga, we never saw him go 100% with both arms, he was never even close. So, seven years of him not training, then and ONLY then, did Goku and Vegeta CATCH UP to Gohan. Even then, they said it themselves, if he got angry, it wouldn't have mattered. The Buu saga, in my mind, only goes to show, how RIDICULOUSLY strong Gohan was. The power was always there, like it had been since he was a kid...but years of not training left him poor in fitness and fighting prowess and, imo, ultimately short a huge amount of power.
I feel like Toriyama had Gohan lose all of that power for plot reasons, which should be obvious. If Gohan maintained or even grew in power during the 7 years, Dabura would've been a cake-walk. Thus, no Buu saga.
They didn't just catch up. Both ss2 goku and vegeta were stronger than ss2 cell sage gohan by a large margian. SS3 would probably one-shot cell saga gohan.
2:20 In my opinion, Goku lied. Goku wanted Gohan to defeat Cell. He wanted to give him self-confidence and show everyone how strong he was. apart from that you can say that he started thinking about the next generation and can't always do everything in the future. As Goku, understand that gohan dont like to fight and he is still a child, he told Krillin to give him a bean so that he could finish Cell. But that was prevented by Cell. I'm sure that Goku didn't show everything either. the much more important question is why cell got the most overpowered zenkai boost ever? from second form to SUPER Perfect cell. that makes absolutely no sense! xD
Cell just decided to screw the rules. He shouldn't have even been able to regenerate really. Although, one could argue that the zenkai boost scaled up drastically since he was regenerating very nearly 100% of his body. It does still break the rules of how his transformations are supposed to work...
Goku went from 400 something to thousands in a year, and then to hundred thousands in couple of days during his journey on Namek. And then some guy build two androids which were much stronger than emperor of the universe... consistent writing and clear rules in DBZ? Seriously
Don't even need to watch the video... Vegeta stated Gohan's power level was exactly the same since the battle with Cell because he stopped training. This also means the Saiyan race can never lose power. They either stay stable or increase. You're welcome
The fact that he was holding his own vs Debora and he is only really only emotionally motivated as a fighter makes me think he had a good bit more in the tank than he presented at that time. So I wouldn't be surprised if he edges vegetta pre Majin boost if he were genuinely motivated which let's be honest Debora didn't inspire much from him at that time.
I really like what was said about jiren and his mental state. I've always saw jiren as a character with sever trauma. (PTSD) His overwhelming strength and lack of trust is a coping response to that trauma. I don't believe he was beaten or over powered physically but like you said mentally. Maybe you could do a vid delving deeper into that theme?
He was technically stronger its just that the jump compared to if he was to continue to training rather than just flat out stopping. When Vegeta says he was weaker than he was back then I think he was implying that Vegeta has grown stronger than him gauging where he was and where he is suppose to be if he stayed on his training regime. Gohan didn't train a day of his life in the beginning of dragon ball z and still one shotted raditz. Gohan didn't loose any power, yeah sure probably rusty from not training. But the emense base power always stays with you. If we are implying gohan was stronger during the cell saga. Then I'm prrtty sure his power just became fauder with time. Transformations are flat multipliers, the stronger your base the stronger your transformation.
He's gone from a pre-teen or teenager to a young adult, he should be physically a lot stronger. I think the only issue he has is he's just out of shape and the rest of the cast had a few years to catch up. Gohan's got that OP half-saiyan blood that lets him get way stronger than everyone else and even compared to the other half saiyans he's a total power-house. I'm not inclined to buy into Vegeta's bitching about his changes from Cell Saga and the only real downgrade Gohan has had in the series was resurrection F after he'd been retired from fighting for years. Since even then he's bounced back to his Buu level era power and maybe gotten stronger than that - which makes him probably the most powerful non-god ki dude out there.
the reality is that toriyama had originally planned on the cell series being the end of dragonball. he was 'convinced' by his publishers to continue the series and he had to create powercreeps into the storyline to keep goku as the main character.
Sunrise Slump frieza trained to achieve his golden form stated by him in the movie & anime than he he trained his mentally in heaven to perfect his golden form when he was brought back for the t.o.p stated by frieza himself prior to ever meeting goku he had never trained
The Frieza that wasted everyone on namek until Goku turned SSJ was the "weakened" form of Frieeza as in the power he had with no training ever, once he trained you saw the huge jump in power he achieved in mere 4 months, Freeza is naturally powerful.
Gohan really hasn’t had a rage boost since his fight with Cell. It’s as if when he was a kid, he couldn’t control his temper, and when it came out, it’s was it’s own multiplier on top of everything else. Ever since his late teens, he’s controlled his temper, so he doesn’t get that boost anymore. Essentially, Gohan has the “Hulk” multiplier that’s greater than everyone else’s. He takes the “you wouldn’t like me when I’m angry” to a Super Sayian level.
can he still have a rage boost after elder kai unlocked his full internal power? that's where his secret power came from in the first place and now is kinda the same thing unless he trains more. What do you think, is still possible that he achieve new levels by getting really mad? 🤔
@@siroreo Yeah, but everytime Vegeta has done that, it's been through months of brutal training and sheer will. Both Gohan and Goku have received cheap ass power boost from Kais or dragons.
Yea but who uses their bookworm knowledge to force SSJ4? Bulma. Gohan was just the wrong type of bookworm. Imagine if he just worked with Bulma studying science getting stronger that way. We've already seen it's possible.
For the thought at the end: Don't forget, the first time anyone used a new transformation, they tend to both lose energy quicker and also not be able to draw out the full potential. Take Goku at the end of the Frieza saga and compare his control over the SSj form in his 'fight' against Trunks. Or in DBS with Golden Frieza. The idea has always been that the first time someone uses a new transformation, they can only get stronger as they gain more experience in that form, and when they reach the peak they go into a new transformation. In that sense, Gohan never even scratched SSj2's full potential, as he skipped SSj3 and went straight to Ultimate.
Here's the thing tho, Gohan was "more powerful" but Goku was and will never cease to be a better FIGHTER than the others, and besides Toriyama's "OH MY GOD HE'S SO STRONG" fetish, the fight on and on itself kinda shown that
I don't know if Gohan really did get weaker, I think he just didn't have the same rage, desperation, and insecurities he had as a kid. He's had seven years of peace, and even once he gets into a fight with Dabura and Fat Buu, he doesn't look anywhere near angry as he did before. So it's really the "rage" bonus he's lacking. And I believe what the Elder Kai did was to bring back that rage bonus, and make it into a calmer kind of power which Gohan could tap into at will. I think if Cell Saga Gohan's max power was 10 + rage bonus of 10 = 20 Buu Saga Gohan's max power 12 (no rage bonus) Ultimate/Mystic Gohan max power 15 (as result of Zenkai boost) + rage/mystic bonus 10 = 25
Piccolo definitely knew of Gohan's latent potential, that's why he trained him after all. It's erupted time and time throughout the series for all characters to see. But yeah there was no way piccolo could forsee a whole new level.
I don’t think he lost power hear me out it’s bc he got a rage boost as well so when he lost that rage boost he when back just to ssj2 with no boost (if this is in the video I just guessed)
Think of it this way, when you practice at something and get really good, you can be amazing. if you then go and not practice for years, you are not as effective and your body will atrophy. When you go back again and practice, or even just go to pick it up for a demonstration, you wouldn't be as good as you once were, but your body will still remember a good deal of what you practiced. When you practice again it is more about conditioning and fully awakening the muscle memory. You'll quickly improve to a point where you return to close to where you were and eventually you can improve.
![PASULOL รามเกียรติ์ ตอนที่ 4 นนทกพบรัก [Ramakien Ep.4: Nonthok in love]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tMUQgmZzf_A/mqdefault.jpg)
I hate how Piccolo doesn’t get a Power Boost.
He deserves better
Yeah someone should do a fan fiction where piccolo fuse with all strong namekians on planet namek👌🏼
@@yamiimax Already happened.
@@Darkshadowdj is it on TH-cam?
@@Darkshadowdj you right it has been done. Seen it before.
I always wished he got Kaioken or some kind of analogue, he'd be beyond broken with something like that.
The real question is why did he lose MORE power in A FEW MONTHS between the end of Z and beginning of Super than he did in SEVEN years of no training after cell saga. Makes no sense when you think about it.
So true that piss me off.
It was actually 4 years he didn't train at all between z and super. Doesn't explain why he could barely go super Saiyan.
he didn't. Beerus just bodied him.
Guess you could just say his mental state by then was so pathetic it affects a lot like his ki too. Didn't think too much about the mental state aspect cause its kinda funny but it is true that usually we see it with chars getting angry then getting power out of nowhere.
When Gohan fights Dabura Goku says that he should be able to beat Dabura because Goku cares more that his techniques are crap but doesn't care his son lived a peaceful life and went to school but his fighting technique is so horrible by then its what Goku uses to respond to Vegeta saying his power is lowered, it shows that Vegeta cares about power while Goku technique. Once Gohan is able to get his confidence back he strikes Buus shell with power that surprises people that have seen his and other SS2 powers before.
DBS Gohan has worst mental state until TOP
Gohan's power came from a ritual. The Buu saga at the very most took a week in their universe. He didn't train in 4 years by the time BoG came, and after that, he still didn't train after a year. Frieza was revived for atleast a few more months after Vegeta went to Beerus' planet.
Gohans weakness is his mentality
Highly accurate assessment of Everytime he gets weak.
@@deathseraph3 I 100% agree. He low key became a bitch
He is supposedly the smart child of Goku but can't wrap his head around training considering the amount of threats that Earth has.
Everyone after dragon ball,dragon ball z and or gt became trash in super and you cannot deny that.
@@noahhetrick2794 can and will
He went from being easily stronger than cell to being relatively near cell's level
is that in his base or with ssj or ssj2 transformations?
John Zhou Ssj2 full power gohan would have a little trouble taking out cell in the beginning of the buu saga. Since he had trouble with dabura who is like cell with magic techniques
@@hermz8616 Why didn't he get a Zenkai boost from the cell fight?
Ness Rosenbrad Because he hasn’t trained in 7 years after that fight
@@hermz8616 So he got the Zenkai boost? But never trained so it went away is what you're saying?
Its really sad that we never saw that rage Gohan possessed in the Cell sage again in the Dragon ball franchise other than the Bojack movie.
I would say I hope it comes back but I don’t see it ever coming back to where he’s beyond Goku and vegeta
Black Saiyan God have u ever watched gt? Lol. Gohan sucks and will always suck after the cell saga what they need to do is finish super and go ahead into gt again because gt is the future... so super sayian 4 is the strongest form, and gohan needs to have some heart
majin Gohan would obliterate Dabura
Elijah Florence yep your dumb gut is most def not the future where did you get that information from
Elijah Florence gt is literally not cannon, what are you on about
A Lot...
_He was a lot stronger when he was a little kid!_
~Vegeta
@Martin Ramirez so you know more than the creator, who made his characters blatantly state "hes lost his touch" to prove that gohan became weaker?
Vegeta always has something so petty too say 🤣🤣🤣
Martin Ramirez that’s just a guide not the actual creator comments
@Martin Ramirez when gohan got true potential mode in buu arc gohan was the strongest person in the series...that was stated. Gohan arrogance was his only weakness
Martin Ramirez except your wrong but okay
I don't like how they "unlocked" Gohan's power and it became a form, it should have just been applied to him at base, without being it's own form.
Idk if it's a "form." I know in the games they treat it like a form, but in (at least DBS) the anime, Gohan just talks about achieving his own kind of strength different than Goku's. He also called it just "going all out" in the tournament of power. Gohan himself doesn't really refer to it as a "form."
@@zahktuthalxalyrion6364 yeah the games did, but hasn't he used it instead of SS in the anime? Like I would have thought it would be a boost to his base and increase SS power, not go out of SS to use it?
@@danielmoreira1802 Well it does provide a boost in his base form (it's all we really see him use it for). Logically, one would assume it'd boost his SSJ and SSJ2 forms as well. But Gohan doesn't WANT to use SSJ or SSJ2. Super Saiyan is his father's power. He doesn't want to just copy his father and just keep using super saiyan transformations to be stronger than his foes. He wants to be stronger in just his base form, and be able to fight on par with Goku. And we see that in DBS when Gohan goes all out against Goku, and Goku had to tap into SSGSS Kaioken to stop Gohan from pushing him. At just SSGSS, Gohan was still pushing Goku and telling him to stop holding back.
@@zahktuthalxalyrion6364 Mystic Gohan was the strongest form he had in the buu saga. He didn't need to go super Saiyan as it was stronger than super Saiyan 3. Gohan was dumping on super buu, which even goku said he couldn't beat super buu. Toriyama decided Gohan was not fit to be the main character of Dragon ball so that's why he has not surpassed Goku.
Daniel Moreira I still think it’s a transformation, not a form
Doesn't matter how much power he lost, When the writers wanna make him relevant again they just unlock his 'hidden potential'
The classical toriyama power wank when the plot demands it any character of choosing will get an illogical power wank to fit the narrative
You called it lol
Literally the worst thing about dragonball.. seeing Beast Gohan overtake Goku and Vegeta when they trained so hard is ridiculous
They should have capped out Gohan and used him as an example of what happens when you waste potential
@@kyleclatworthy8301 i dont like beast either, but gohan is still the most powerfull fighter of the series by far, even if he dont keep his training. At the age of 4 he managed to damage raditz, fought on namek a few years past against the strongest of the universe, and later unlocked ss2 at 11, the same age as goku in classic (were he struggled with yamcha and roshi)
I think he is the only charavter that can get a lot of power from nothing based on his feats. The humans for example dont have any reason to become as strong as they were in TOP
20+ years later and people are still talking DBZ . a jewel of its kind.
m sam No No they are comparing DBZ to DBS
Saurav Chowdhury that means they're talking about it still bruh
I know right? I'm a adult with a kid and I'm still watching dbz clips and debating with people in the comment section lmao, I don't do this with no other show. I think us guys are attracted to power and this show was the best display of that.
My favorite Gohan moment is when he goes SSJ2 against Bojack and his gang with his serial killer look.
Love that
Master Kenobi hello there
Me too
How does that compare to "No, I'm here to kill you." GOHAN VERSUS FRIEZA STARTS BLASTING.
Hello there
Chi Chi’s influence is Gohan’s greatest downfall
Yeah, what a terrible mother, wanting her kid to succeed in the world and giving him education!
Gohan had a loving wife, great family and good life, how terrible that he did not spend every waking moment of his life preparing for a crisis that might never come.
He spend majority of his childhood in a constant warzone, how terrible of him to just want to be a normal dude...
Jakub Mike of course i understand that, that’s common sense, I’m just saying it hindered him from unleashing his full potential
Markel Paige full potential my ass everyone only looks from their side cuz everyone is selfish and want others to do things for them
Chi chi is being a MOTHER and you can’t blame a mother for wanting to give HER SON a life outside of constant life death situations
Look I love gohan Just like anybody else but I hate it when people say it’s chichis fault
Farmer with A shotgun you could also see from another perspective which is that gohan would die if he didn't do any of that training heck everyone one earth would be dead.
@@spiralanimations7736 what is wrong with you?? No one was disagreeing that point. They are just saying that yes, because of chichi, he never reached his full potential. Of course shes a good mom, but nevertheless, he didnt live up to what he could have been
Vegeta literally says: He was a lot stronger vs Cell.
probably maxed out
Gohan doesn't desire to fight. Piccolo clearly pointed this out to Goku.
yah hybrids don't run as hot
Gohan: Just saw my dad die whole planet was almost destroyed I don't think I'm gonna train
I think Gohan's main issue is his loss of fighting sense because of the time he didn't train/fight... It doesn't seem to me that Dabura had the upper hand against Gohan... he just had some dirty tricks and Gohan... well... is just Gohan
I kind of find it funny how within those 7 years gohan was vegeta’s goku. Until goku came back to visit
I'm glad you all brought up Piccolo in this video. That was just plain bad writing on this character. Piccolo seems like a warrior who train daily even in times of peace, in case a new threat were to emerge. He should have been alot stronger in the Buu saga. He should have been able to keep up with a super saiyan 2 (or almost) after the 7 year time skip (assuming he trained nearly everyday for 7 years).
I feel like in my opinion if he hadn't had kami brain smarts in him he would cause think about it kami it's not really a fighter he's more of a teacher and nail and piccolo are more ruthless and independent so that explains why he was helping trunks and Goten with the fusion and knew the surpreme Kai
It's piccolo. Of course he trained daily.
That's just his training. The weighted clothes, the meditation, fighting himself just kept him polished.
Perhaps Piccolo did train daily but he had no one to train against. It's been shown that if you train with a partner, like sparring, you get stronger a lot faster, since you're pushing each other. Remember the three-year time skip between Frieza and the Androids? Piccolo trained with Goku and as a result, Krillin said that he was about as powerful as a Super Saiyan when he fought Android 20. That's a pretty big jump, considering we know a Super Saiyan can completely own Frieza, and Piccolo was having trouble even against his third form back in that arc. Let's look at all his other battles in Z: Trained on his own and with a very unskilled warrior in Gohan, got owned by Vegeta and Nappa. We already discussed Frieza. He trained on his own for Cell, and he knew it wasn't enough. I'm not counting 17 and 18 because he didn't train, he just absorbed Kami.
So going by all of that it's pretty much confirmed that at least Piccolo can't gain much power unless he has a powerful opponent to spar and train with, and that's why even if he did train during those 7 years he would have still been pretty useless against Buu.
I agree with you! He should of been near SSJ2 or past it to be honest.
Kid Gohan: *beats up second form frieza*
Adult super saiyan gohan: *gets destroyed by first form frieza*
Adult Gohan is a beta and a loser, our boy peaked as a teen
@@BasileusRex he doing good in manga tho.
well frieza was way stronger in super
To be fair, it was new Frieza with a base that is much stronger than his namek saga base. But I get your point, Gohan is really one heck of a disappointment
There is a mistake everybody makes when considering powers in dragonball. That's considering only RAW energy power and not abilities. Cell had all Z warriors abilities and Piccolo's regeneration buffed up to a level not even Piccolo can hope to reach. That's a huge difference. If Cell didn't have regeneration he would have died to Super Vegeta's Final Flash right after his transformation. Again against Goku's instant trasmission Kamehameha and Gohan's firt Super Kamehameha when he reflects Cell's own Kamehameha. Therefore Dabura having Cell's same Power Level doesn't make him as strong and problematic of a foe as Cell was. This reasoning goes for Bu too. Without his regeneration abilities Bu would have been defeated pretty easily when in his fat form and his kid form.
Well said!
It was different with Jiren though. He was the only villain to have pure strength, there was no tricks or tactics.
@@cheerioss-9121 I don't even consider Super as it is completely incoherent with all DBZ. If we had to consider it Gohan going from weaker than first form Frieza to keeping up with Goku SSGSS in a few weeks off screen just by getting back to his supreme form is pure bullshit. Supreme Gohan back in Buu saga was just a little stronger than SS3 Goku and from what is shown in the beggining of Battle Of Gods SS3 Goku is pure crap compared to his SSGSS form. So pure nosense there.
ItsDrako Lmao I honestly thought i was the only one having trouble trying to make sense of how everyone magically becomes as strong as Goku and Vegeta whenever they achieved their god form. They had Future trunks going blow for blow with Goku Black, who was supposedly suppose to be way stronger than Super saying Blue goku. Then they had android 17 evenly matched with Goku while he was SSB again, and the reasoning was “He’s been training by keeping the island safe” like that make sense lmao. Then they have beerus in some other worldly level for a few episodes then the next thing you know he’s getting bitched by Bulma and Goku and suddenly Vegeta and Goku magically surpass or reach his level? He’s suppose to be some type of God of destruction
@@cheerioss-9121 Its called holding back Goku was holding back against 17 and also Gohan if he wanted he could end the fight but he loves to fight its no fun just to end it
Vegeta on that bane
Peace has cost you your strength, victory has defeated you.
Harold should give him some pointers. One training sesh and his power will surpass Omi king.
Like what 21 savage said a lot
Did you also get that ad?lol
Idk if I would go so far to say that Gohan "lost" power. I would more so say that a portion of his power had gone dormant. In the Cell Saga he let out his potential through rage. In the beginning of the Buu saga he didnt have that rage to channel his potential thru, at least not like he did with Cell. I don't think he lost the power but more so lost the ability to channel it. While he probably remembers the feeling of being at that level and can still attain SS2 his emotions are still the barriers to unlocking it till Elder Kai.
Gohan trained literally everyday for a year just before the fight with Cell (with fkin Goku!). When he fought Dabura he was a scholar pretending to be a superhero as a hobbie...
I think he actually lost some power but mostly technique and the mental state, also as you said, "the ability to channel" the power.
@@nemskalk I agree with you. Didn't lose a lot of power just some but more than anything he lost his fighting instinct and technique. His dormant power was still there and awakened by elder Kai.
xKratosx89 I’d say he didn’t get stronger
Agreed...and he's a sayain so he definitely got a Zenkai boost from Cell even though it wouldn't be as much as a full sayain, but he definitely got one plus he got older. Naturally when you're a young adult you grow a bit in strength from a young teenager. I wouldn't say he got weaker in power, but I'll say he got extremely rusty in his fighting skills.
@D F ah yes under normal human physique I would agree. But Gohan is only part human. His Saiyan biology alone could easily keep conditioning since the Saiyan biology also keeps aging at bay so their bodies can continue to be used for battle. This is more apparent due to him having a muscular figure despite not training. Also he was 11 when he fought Cell. Just by naturally growing his body would make some progress at a later age. He admits that he isn't as strong which is true in the sense he doesnt have that access to that great power. Even in DB Super he states he needs to getting his fighting senses back to attain his "Mystic/Potential Unlock" again.
He lost enough to be treated like a “Yamcha” when compared to Goku and Vegeta in the buu arc. I mean great saiya man??? Biggest smh moment when I first saw that goof doing ginyu force poses.
I think some of that was that the Ginyu Force was popular, and Toriyama tried to cash in on that by having Gohan act like the Ginyu Force. There was more to the Ginyu Force than the poses, so that's why it fell flat
@@Alienldr I respect that but in all my years in the fandom I never came across that bit of info. I know the Ginyu Force was a shout out to Japan's other popular franchise I.E Super Sentai. It would have made more sense to have Goten and kid Trunks to act like little ginyu rangers than a grown ass man running around like he missed a dosage of meds..lol.
I loved it, dragon ball z isn't meant to be so edgy, that's why in the west everybody loves gohan, cause he's an edge lord and a self insert whereas in the east the comedy prevails, Super Saiyaman was so much fun, and a slice of life in DBZ.
@@KaNgUrUhBR if you say so. To me the saiya man crap was just really cringy and made me not like Gohan anymore after the cell saga had finally gotten me to like him. I hated Gohan when he was a whiny kid and I hated him as a cringy on older teen & adult.
@@KaNgUrUhBR lol it just brought me back to namek as I couldn't stand the antics of the Ginyu force and to have it been brought back through Gohan makes me feel like that hit he took from Racoom had a larger effect on him like some deep seeded trauma that never fully healed mentally and his mental state is fractured like how Vegeta's arm never quite healed right. 🤣😂
Too relatable. I also got much weaker after I stopped training.
Don't take atrophy lightly.
Yes. Relatable. SS2 is just like your 20 mins at planet fitness. Clown.
@@fja5085 Damn you ain't gotta do him like that.
no. you only lose the physical look, I have been training for 6 months and stopped for 2 years I'm not that ripped but still strong.
I was stronger when I was 18 because I stopped working out for 6 years. It took me 2 years to regain most of my strength. I'm 25 now and I still haven't reached my 18 year old maxes
@@fja5085 Ass
He probably lost around 20 - 25% of his power. That's fair considering he wasn't going to wreck SPC as easily as just Perfect Cell, but it's noticeable enough that SPC would still lose mid-diff.
Early buu Saga Gohan looks like a Default Fighting Style game Skin.
Hypothetical powerlevels
Dabura-360 billion
Gohan-450 Billion
Vegeta-480 Billion
Teen Gohan-600 Billion
Goku-750 Billion
Oh my goodness. Piccolo was relegated to human status.
Krillin to Piccolo: And now, you're one of us!
Piccolo and Gohan are the most disrespected characters in the show
@@Rucarlos Tien?
@@Rucarlos wrong it's tien that got disrespected to the oblivion
I would say he lost a mildly considerable amount. He didn’t get too weak to where he couldn’t go Ssj2 anymore but he lost a decent amount so that’s why he wasn’t as strong as his cell saga counterpart.
SSJ2 adult Gohan was a little weaker than Super Perfect Cell in terms of skill and power especially since Cell had the instant transmission, we never got to see SPC fight cause he would have been OP. It still only takes a SSJ2 to defeat SPC and Dabura even if its a weaker Gohan but would be hard to win.
XSuperHumanSayian MachineX he didn’t get weaker it’s just he didn’t get stronger
He got rusty during the time skip, to busy with school to keep in shape, like jotaro in part 4 th-cam.com/video/MTW4sIL9Dpw/w-d-xo.html
Deathmare no, he actually did get weaker. It’s a fact
Another point that a lot of people don’t mention is that he didn’t just get weaker, he got much worse at fighting. During his fight with Dabura, he makes a lot of mistakes and straight up falls for baits and tricks. And during his fight with Buutenks, he starts mindlessly throwing punches the second he lost the edge in raw power
I wonder if Gohan even knew how to train by himself because let’s keep it real, he would’ve killed Vegeta or Piccolo in a spar session. That or he would’ve had to suppress himself heavily causing him to get weaker.
Gohan had hard time during college days surpressing his power even 1% would overpower normal people
?
Gohan's biggest issue is his lack of confidence in himself. He can become mentally defeated, and that's what makes it diffcult for him to maintain his power. Even Adult Gohan still suffers from that some times, untill he's really mentally committed to win.
Too much time to his mother's skirts, he haven't a hard life and is unable to understand the struggles that goku and vegeta do. It's not fair to compare gohan with them, because they are warriors and gohan is a scientist. Goku tries to get out all gohan potential and he does for cell, causing gohan a great trauma, not being at that height cost him the life of his father; he's not wanting to fight anymore, as he didn't really wanted, he did it for his father and because his father was there cheering him up.
If Gohan kept up his training up to the Buu arc, he'd be in Vegito's league.
No
Just *no*
No I think he’d probably just be as strong as potential unleashed form buu saga gohan and if he got his potential unleashed at that point he’d prolly then be in vegitos league, but he wouldn’t need to
@@MoonFallSlump I thought that too, but based on how fast his strength increased in the hyperbolic time chamber and if he actually kept pushing himself during the 7 year skip, the gap between him, Goku and Vegeta would be so wide that fusing would be their only option to keep up with a seasoned Gohan. The training Gohan did with Goten, the zenkai he got from getting drained and surving fat Buu, the z-sword training and the Elder Kai's unlocking ability made him stronger than Super Saiyan 3. If he had a gravity machine, trained another day in the hyperbolic time chamber or any other room at the lookout, Gohan would have been OP. Vegito or Gogeta would have been the only ones able to compete with him.
i hate this narrative vegeta trained that same amount of time even harder and didn't get much massive gains to his power without being pushed by an equal power he wouldn't of grown that much.
@@imjustadog1897 with vegeta training even harder then gohan in those 7 years and still not get much stronger it would be odd for gohan to have been the only one improving while trying in the damn wilderness
The things gohan could’ve achieved if he followed in his dads footsteps and became a deadbeat
Or maybe if Toriyama wasn't an asshole
Obama44 💯😂👍
This video should say how much power did Gohan lose from the buu saga to the god saga
@@goldtgr7704 Not much Beerus just bodied him, but from BoG to RoF... Oof... He struggled going super saiyan.. SUPER SAIYAN!! in about 2-4 years time.. He was easily able to go super saiyan after 7 years not training, super saiyan 2 as well, but with some effort.. so how the hell does he struggle going super saiyan after 2 or maybe 4 years not training after that... He still had his "mystic form" in BoG.
PowerJolt72 I think it also had a lot to do with his mental state too
Gohan lost some power but its more that everyone else got stronger.
I think the problem with Gohan is not actually his physical power, but that his mental state is all over the place. Gohan hates fighting, therefore his heart never actually was in it.
Yes, he would ultimately do, what needs to be done, but in that sense he totally does not live up to his potential.
His idea for life is in the end not, what his Father lives for.
The funny thing is I do think Teenage Gohan liked fighting more than Kid Gohan does but I do agree with you. I just think that added to his confusion. He didn't want to get angry against Debura because he wanted to fight like Goku. Videl of all people sort of brought out Gohan's love for fighting. Gohan enjoyed training Goten and Videl. I wished they would have continued more with that storyline. Gohan couldn't resist fighting crime so although he isn't obsessed with training like Goku he does like saving people and beating up bad guys.
Well he got rejuvenated after Old Kai gave him a special lap dance.
And then he lost it :] and took a good bit to recover that form and end up at Blue Goku level
I would like to see future Gohan and main Gohan meet
Jason Knowling And if they fight future Gohan gets his ass beat
@@animetiddylover6819 no
MatroMajor 12 yes
Btw I didn’t wanna start a fight
I don’t like arguing I only said that because it makes sense so no hate :)
@@animetiddylover6819 no
@@animetiddylover6819 how does it make sense the main gohan would slap him no problemo
Gohan gains power when those who are close to him are under threat, this has been made very clear since the headbutt to Raditz, so in a time of peace he would not get much upgrades to his power
Saiyan Gohan Belongs to a Warrior Race but his Mother Fit Him Into a Human Race this is why He lost his ki day by day studying books
Biased me: Almost all of it...
Unbaised me: Enough to be a reoccurring joke in the fandom.
Gohan is talented, while everyone else just works super hard.
There's an aspect people here tend to forget. Super Sayan 2 Gohan when he fought cell could have killed Super Majin Buu, that's not a joke. We know from the guide books that SS2 is twice as strong as normal SS, Gohan says after Cell returns from blowing up his chi is at half which would mean he was only as strong as he was BEFORE he went SS2. Gohan didn't JUST go SS2 against cell he ALSO tapped into the power inside him that we had seen so many times before. Goku says in the manga to Gohan when he's about to fight Vegeta that Gohan needs to fight as he did against cell, thismeans "unlock" his power again. With Dragonball Super now out we now know that the supreme kai's ritual just unlocked all of Gohan's hidden power he got when he was enraged but now he had when he was calm. People think all gohan did in that battle was go SS2 but that's not true he did so much more. That's why it took Goku and Vegeta 7 years to try catch up.
They messed up by not giving us a super perfect vs ssj2 Gohan fight.
I think it feels more magnified by the fact that the show instills us to expect a Saiyan to always be improving. So when compared to his past self he may only be a bit weaker yet it feels like a huge difference because in 7 years we would expect him to be insanely strong.
You guys forgot to mention the point on how Gohan handled base Super Buu as easily as he did in SSJ2 form against Cell, with the backing of the Dabura-Cell power level statement, that would show how Gohan not only regained the power he lost but how *STRONGER* he got.
They need to have him just make up for all the time he’s wasted not training and have him be as strong as he should be. So irritating
The way it was depicted during their fight, I doubt Dabura was really stronger than super perfect cell. Gohan wasn’t even at SSJ2 level power, he never unleashed it during their fight, we can tell from his aura. If SSJ1 Gohan is on par with Dabura, how can he be stronger than super prefect cell.
神推しあしゅりん he was fighting as a super saiyan 2. It’s poorly drawn or shown. But it’s obvious. The whole vegeta getting angry thing wouldn’t have happened if Gohan was holding back
SSJ2 Gohan was still around SSJ2 Goku/Vegeta levels of power, he’s only slightly weaker.
Nissy92 Gohan never went SSJ2 after his energy was stolen
I agree with what you guys said, it's more so the fact that gohans power level stayed stagnant while Goku and Vegeta surpassed him taking him from #1 to #3.
Chi Chi should be destroyed after his birth. That way he would never have stopped training, and trained a lot more gowing up. He would probably be Gohan Beast by 11
I agree with most of what you guys said but I want to make some points
1. teen gohan fought dabura at full power whilst young gohan was weakened and injured yet young gohan overpowered cell or at least stayed even whereas teen was losing
2. Gohan held back against cell the entire fight. even with one arm and half his energy he was able to with encouragement push cell back and it turns out he was still holding back
3. Dende healed him and gohans body was wrecked so he would have gotten a saiyan boost. that would make his strength higher than cell games
4. gohan trained a month before the tournament so actually grew stronger as seen with his training with goten as before goten had to stand a large distance away but got closer the more gohan trained (during the throwing rocks)
If young gohan was a 10
Sp cell would be a 7
Dabura would be 7-8
teen gohan would be a 6
young gohan after being healed would be a 12-13
goku would be a 14
non majin vegeta would be a 12
That's a very accurate assessment bro
He wouldn’t get a zenkai boost since it wasn’t really a near death situation, he just had a hurt arm
I do not completly agree...
If we set super perfect cell at 7 I would say:
If Sp cell would be a 7
Gohan cell ssj2 would be an 8 with potential of a 10
Dabura would be 8
Gohan boo ssj2 be a 9 with potential of 12
goku ssj2 would be a 12
majin vegeta ssj2 would be a 12
This means Gohan of boo saga is stronger than Gohan of cell saga. Because of reasons:
1-Cell's Gohan has just awakened ssj2
2-Cell's Gohan is a kid, immature, with no willing to fight beyong his father's cheering up
3-Boo's Gohan has no threat since cell is gone and has no opponent to test his strenth with, as Vegeta refuses to train with him.
4-Boo's Gohan has raised mentality and now he understands a little bit better what's going on.
In fact, Gohan would be able to reach a 12 with potential of 15 in his outrage, but due to his lifestyle he doesn't grow as much as Goku and Vegeta.
Victor Salvadores Hernandez Actually it was stated many times that Gohan SSJ2 was stronger as a kid. His maturity has nothing to do with his strength.
@@chocolate3213 His maturity makes him mentally weak, and also his muscles arent grow to its top. It's only that it seems stronger, but he's not... also he is using his rage to increase his potential, and he's not doing that when he's older
i still find it super hard to believe that vegeta and piccolo would allow him to get rusty/out of shape, you would think both would want to keep him training
It wasnt power as much as getting rusty. He "lost his fighting spirit" he became lazy. Not a ton physically weaker. Debora was stronger than cell for example.
About 30 to 40%, I still think he could beat regular perfect cell
both Cells
leloupgarou1000 I don’t think he could, I’d say he still would still be way stronger than semi-perfect cell
I have full power perfect cell and ssj2 gohan buu saga around the same level.
leloupgarou1000 that doesnt make any sense. Ssj2 is a 2x multiplier from ssj. Ssj gohan was weaker than cell. 40% of ssj2 gohan is even weaker than that
Because I feel gohan had a rage boost on top of awakening ssj2, except this rage boost caused a permanent boost to his power
I agree, Gohan didn't really lose power. He just didn't continue to gain power at the same rate as Vegeta and Goku and they surpassed him. Gohan also holds himself back because of his lack of confidence and his mom forcing the normal life on him. He's conflicted and doesn't commit to being as powerful as he could be like other Saiyans do
I'd say gohan lost about 20-25% of his power
Lol it definitely was more than that more like 50% loss in power as a teen ssj2 gohan was toying around with perfect cell whereas ssj2 gohan against Dabura(who is around perfect cell level) was having a hard time keeping uo with him
@@shoaibhaq8680 gohan never used ssj2 against dabura, its funny, after babidi man's stolen gohan's energy, he never goes ssj2 after that
@@shoaibhaq8680 exactly what the other dude replied to ya. Never used SSJ2 after his energy was stolen.
@@jay_kulina didn't he...? Oh... Ok. Still i would say the loss in power for gohan would br significant as vegeta stated during gohan's match against Dabura in the anime that gohan was far more stronger as a teen than his showing against Dabura
Shoaib Haq CG Gohan was slightly to somewhat stronger than CG Goku in FPSSJ, if we go by the logic of Buu Saga I’d put Buu Saga Gohan relative to CG Goku or just slightly above in terms of raw power.
I see it as well yes gohan did lose a lot of power technically BUT he did grow from preteen into young adult and we all know how much stronger you are as an adult versus when your an 11 year old boy
Airagon Akatosh but his technique does not apply which results in a weaker fighter
@@gekku1578 hay I was going into how the body grows. I was trying to say yes he lost power. The transformations are the same so they don't matter. While he has grown up and gone through purity so his body should get stronger. And in Dragon Ball his health of body goes to Ki. So I'm saying he had to lose a lot of Ki and get a lot weaker in comparison
The thing you gotta remember though is that Toriyama was intending for Gohan to take over the protagonist role from Goku after Cell but the fans didnt like the idea. So he had to retcon Gohan for the Buu arc and make sure Goku was the protagonist again. Its the main reason he loses basically all the progress he gained
Gohan turned to a nerd after cell saga he wasn’t training like he supposed to.
Great video with great points, but my problem isn't the lack of power but the lack of purpose for him. What I mean is like a lot of things in the Buu Saga, Gohan was a waste of time. We watch him go through school, tournament, lose to Buu, Train and unlock Mystic just to lose and have no role in the outcome of the saga just like Gotenks and Fusion. Just my opinion
SSJ2 Gohan was the OG one punch man tbh
Gohan simply doesn't like fighting at all, hence the lacking of power. All the training in the universe doesn't matter if your not motivated. His cool down however is top notch, which is a part of his potential and is why he's able to aquire strength quickly.
unlike true saiyans who have strong fighting spirits, gohan is generally a pacifist (unless provoked) so he does not train to fight every day.
Cell saga Gohan: You peaked
Let's not forget gohan still beat perfect cell weakened and using one arm. When he unleashed everything with one arm he completely annihilated cells full power kamehameha. We don't know his full power. He mightve lost almost half
We can't say half because that would essentially be SSJ. It was most likely between 10-15% after his brief training with Goten which was exasperated by his loss of fighting senses.
Except Cell wasn't even _close_ to full power during the Kamehameha clash.
@@jamainegardner4193 he just came back. Like he said he was even more perfect at that point. There was really nothing stating that cell wasnt giving his all
I would love! Love! To discuss Dragonball with you all one day 🤝. This video was fire. And you have to be a longtime fan to understand this without question. Great content y’all. Keep it up💙.
Gohan 7 years later was about 70 percent of teen gohan, after training a little he bumped up to about 80 percent of his former teen self
Even in Super Vegeta mentions that Gohan has the highest potential of all of them. He is referencing Cell Saga and maybe Buu Saga Gohan's power.
vegeta also said saiyans have limits then said the opposite later.
I think ssj2 rage boost gohan is mystic gohan level remember the elder Kai said that it unleashes all his potential. He did hardly any training from end of cell to buu so an argument can be made that mystic gohan was the same as ssj2 gohan with rage boost and fully sharpened fighting sense.
Mystic is a bit below ss3 and Vegito because he was struggling against buu after absorbing gotenks I don’t think ssj2 is on that lvl
SSJDamaury mystic is above ssj3 google it
Sergio Gonzalez oh
It's a double edged sword for Gohan in DBZ. If he's not mad/angry then he's not at his full potential, but when he got to 100% power (ssj2 teen Gohan, or Buu arc Ultimate Gohan), he was super cocky and arrogant.
I can get behind this most of all. Gohan never really learned how to check himself.
Piccolo even calls him out on that particularly when he fought Buu.
I want a piccolo power boost, he used to be a beast in the frieze and Android saga
Ronan YVR ??? He fought Freeza up to his 3rd form....
He was literally wished back by the dragon balls and fused with nail.
Lmao shows how much you know
I think he lost a massive amount of power.
Some of the points you guys raised I agree with but I'm on a different train of thought. Gohan was a MONSTER in cell saga and was still an absolute monster with 1 arm. I still think you're under estimating how strong he really was in cell saga, we never saw him go 100% with both arms, he was never even close. So, seven years of him not training, then and ONLY then, did Goku and Vegeta CATCH UP to Gohan. Even then, they said it themselves, if he got angry, it wouldn't have mattered. The Buu saga, in my mind, only goes to show, how RIDICULOUSLY strong Gohan was. The power was always there, like it had been since he was a kid...but years of not training left him poor in fitness and fighting prowess and, imo, ultimately short a huge amount of power.
Underrated comment. He went from treating Cell like a kid, to struggling against Dabura (a Cell equivalent).
This deserves more likes
I feel like Toriyama had Gohan lose all of that power for plot reasons, which should be obvious. If Gohan maintained or even grew in power during the 7 years, Dabura would've been a cake-walk. Thus, no Buu saga.
They didn't just catch up. Both ss2 goku and vegeta were stronger than ss2 cell sage gohan by a large margian. SS3 would probably one-shot cell saga gohan.
2:20 In my opinion, Goku lied. Goku wanted Gohan to defeat Cell. He wanted to give him self-confidence and show everyone how strong he was. apart from that you can say that he started thinking about the next generation and can't always do everything in the future.
As Goku, understand that gohan dont like to fight and he is still a child, he told Krillin to give him a bean so that he could finish Cell. But that was prevented by Cell.
I'm sure that Goku didn't show everything either.
the much more important question is why cell got the most overpowered zenkai boost ever?
from second form to SUPER Perfect cell. that makes absolutely no sense! xD
Cell just decided to screw the rules. He shouldn't have even been able to regenerate really.
Although, one could argue that the zenkai boost scaled up drastically since he was regenerating very nearly 100% of his body. It does still break the rules of how his transformations are supposed to work...
Goku went from 400 something to thousands in a year, and then to hundred thousands in couple of days during his journey on Namek. And then some guy build two androids which were much stronger than emperor of the universe... consistent writing and clear rules in DBZ? Seriously
Don't even need to watch the video... Vegeta stated Gohan's power level was exactly the same since the battle with Cell because he stopped training. This also means the Saiyan race can never lose power. They either stay stable or increase. You're welcome
Peace has cost you your strength, victory has defeated you!
-Bane
The fact that he was holding his own vs Debora and he is only really only emotionally motivated as a fighter makes me think he had a good bit more in the tank than he presented at that time.
So I wouldn't be surprised if he edges vegetta pre Majin boost if he were genuinely motivated which let's be honest Debora didn't inspire much from him at that time.
Chi chi’s fault this happend to Gohan. But atleast he’s stronger than his teen self now since he has Mystic (Potential Unleashed)
I really like what was said about jiren and his mental state. I've always saw jiren as a character with sever trauma. (PTSD) His overwhelming strength and lack of trust is a coping response to that trauma. I don't believe he was beaten or over powered physically but like you said mentally. Maybe you could do a vid delving deeper into that theme?
He was technically stronger its just that the jump compared to if he was to continue to training rather than just flat out stopping. When Vegeta says he was weaker than he was back then I think he was implying that Vegeta has grown stronger than him gauging where he was and where he is suppose to be if he stayed on his training regime. Gohan didn't train a day of his life in the beginning of dragon ball z and still one shotted raditz. Gohan didn't loose any power, yeah sure probably rusty from not training. But the emense base power always stays with you. If we are implying gohan was stronger during the cell saga. Then I'm prrtty sure his power just became fauder with time. Transformations are flat multipliers, the stronger your base the stronger your transformation.
Gohan lost strength but not that much as I thought. Goku and Vegita were the ones who got a good power boost.
He's gone from a pre-teen or teenager to a young adult, he should be physically a lot stronger.
I think the only issue he has is he's just out of shape and the rest of the cast had a few years to catch up.
Gohan's got that OP half-saiyan blood that lets him get way stronger than everyone else and even compared to the other half saiyans he's a total power-house.
I'm not inclined to buy into Vegeta's bitching about his changes from Cell Saga and the only real downgrade Gohan has had in the series was resurrection F after he'd been retired from fighting for years. Since even then he's bounced back to his Buu level era power and maybe gotten stronger than that - which makes him probably the most powerful non-god ki dude out there.
N M yea just like how future Gohan looked .....
@@spirituallyoutmymind8006 I have no idea what that sentence means
the reality is that toriyama had originally planned on the cell series being the end of dragonball. he was 'convinced' by his publishers to continue the series and he had to create powercreeps into the storyline to keep goku as the main character.
How do you lose ki? Frieza wasn't fighting or ever using full power for years until he fought goku..are we supposed to think he got weak also?
Frieza is a freak, this is explained
Freiza has never trained, he was just born powerful
Sunrise Slump frieza trained to achieve his golden form stated by him in the movie & anime than he he trained his mentally in heaven to perfect his golden form when he was brought back for the t.o.p stated by frieza himself prior to ever meeting goku he had never trained
Bob Jr we’re are referring to z only
The Frieza that wasted everyone on namek until Goku turned SSJ was the "weakened" form of Frieeza as in the power he had with no training ever, once he trained you saw the huge jump in power he achieved in mere 4 months, Freeza is naturally powerful.
Gohan really hasn’t had a rage boost since his fight with Cell. It’s as if when he was a kid, he couldn’t control his temper, and when it came out, it’s was it’s own multiplier on top of everything else. Ever since his late teens, he’s controlled his temper, so he doesn’t get that boost anymore.
Essentially, Gohan has the “Hulk” multiplier that’s greater than everyone else’s. He takes the “you wouldn’t like me when I’m angry” to a Super Sayian level.
can he still have a rage boost after elder kai unlocked his full internal power? that's where his secret power came from in the first place and now is kinda the same thing unless he trains more. What do you think, is still possible that he achieve new levels by getting really mad? 🤔
Gohan's plot armor is to always be able to catch up Goku and Vegeta through training montages 😂
SKYRIDER619 lol to be fair that is Goku and Vegeta’s too. They all get beat by anyone, train or get bodied and come back stronger than their opponent.
now only if that plot armor can be applied to the human z fighters...
@@siroreo Yeah, but everytime Vegeta has done that, it's been through months of brutal training and sheer will. Both Gohan and Goku have received cheap ass power boost from Kais or dragons.
John Zhou I mean Krillin somehow held his own in the tournament of power. Which is a pretty big jump in power for him.
@@tonyj9743 goku did train a lot like vegeta
This video is amazing, you all just won a new subscriber :^)
I partially blame Chi-Chi for his loss of power. She wanted him to be a nerdy bookworm rather than a badass warrior.
Yea but who uses their bookworm knowledge to force SSJ4? Bulma. Gohan was just the wrong type of bookworm. Imagine if he just worked with Bulma studying science getting stronger that way. We've already seen it's possible.
For the thought at the end: Don't forget, the first time anyone used a new transformation, they tend to both lose energy quicker and also not be able to draw out the full potential. Take Goku at the end of the Frieza saga and compare his control over the SSj form in his 'fight' against Trunks. Or in DBS with Golden Frieza. The idea has always been that the first time someone uses a new transformation, they can only get stronger as they gain more experience in that form, and when they reach the peak they go into a new transformation. In that sense, Gohan never even scratched SSj2's full potential, as he skipped SSj3 and went straight to Ultimate.
He didn't lose anything or almost, he just didn't improve at all.
Here's the thing tho, Gohan was "more powerful" but Goku was and will never cease to be a better FIGHTER than the others, and besides Toriyama's "OH MY GOD HE'S SO STRONG" fetish, the fight on and on itself kinda shown that
BECAUSE GOHAN WAS GOING TO HIGHSCHOOL AND HE WAS WEAK
I don't know if Gohan really did get weaker, I think he just didn't have the same rage, desperation, and insecurities he had as a kid. He's had seven years of peace, and even once he gets into a fight with Dabura and Fat Buu, he doesn't look anywhere near angry as he did before.
So it's really the "rage" bonus he's lacking. And I believe what the Elder Kai did was to bring back that rage bonus, and make it into a calmer kind of power which Gohan could tap into at will.
I think if Cell Saga Gohan's max power was 10 + rage bonus of 10 = 20
Buu Saga Gohan's max power 12 (no rage bonus)
Ultimate/Mystic Gohan max power 15 (as result of Zenkai boost) + rage/mystic bonus 10 = 25
Only goku would tell their kid to use their anger to grow stronger lol
Like the Dokkan ssj2 gohan thumbnail
To bad mystic brought him to full power without traning
Piccolo definitely knew of Gohan's latent potential, that's why he trained him after all. It's erupted time and time throughout the series for all characters to see. But yeah there was no way piccolo could forsee a whole new level.
I think people say he’s not nearly as strong as he used to be when they really mean he’s not as cool as he used to be
It is just nice to hear another LSM video. It has been a minute. Dope video.
Thanks for watching. I usually upload a new video every week.
I don’t think he lost power hear me out it’s bc he got a rage boost as well so when he lost that rage boost he when back just to ssj2 with no boost (if this is in the video I just guessed)
That makes sense
Think of it this way, when you practice at something and get really good, you can be amazing. if you then go and not practice for years, you are not as effective and your body will atrophy. When you go back again and practice, or even just go to pick it up for a demonstration, you wouldn't be as good as you once were, but your body will still remember a good deal of what you practiced. When you practice again it is more about conditioning and fully awakening the muscle memory. You'll quickly improve to a point where you return to close to where you were and eventually you can improve.