I find broken chairs roadside with nicely turned spindles and legs, I cut those up for use as file handles and take the credit for the professional looks. ☺
I was repairing/cleaning a few files a while ago, they had lots of aluminium in the teeth. I had no chemicals/vinegar but stumbled on a guy that had the best way I have ever seen. Take a copper pipe, cut it on one side and flatten it out so it looks like a spatula - the tube is like a handle and the part you cut is akin to a blade. Then push the blade part along the same direction as the teeth and it cleans the file perfectly. It took an hour or so to clean four or five files, but they were all perfectly clean and no ali/rust/dirty or grease could be seen. A nice cheap and easy method to save your files.
Just try soaking them in a caustic soda drain cleaner - it will eat the aluminium in short order and will not damage the steel. I love finding them clogged with aluminium since they are so easy to clean, and often have had little use by the last owner since they got clogged up quickly and became 'useless' [caustic soda will also eat your skin very fast to wear some heavy nitrile gloves]
Many years ago an older machinist shared with me his secret for cleaning files. It is this: flatten the end of a 3/8 or 1/2 inch diameter copper tubing about 1/2 inch back; bend the other end up and over the flat portion to form part of a c-shape to act as a gripping surface. Rub the flattened end across and inline with the teeth of the file. This will quickly form groves in the copper which will fit nicely into the groves of the file cleaning out any debris lodged in there. Do this for the entire length of the file on both sides. This process can be repeated as needed. I, instead of the c-shape for a handle, found that the end could be inserted into a file handle which made it much more comfortable to use. Files rarely get dull. They just get clogged.
just an additional thought; oil will protect the file from rust but it will attract and hold both metal and wood fillings thereby clogging the teeth and limiting its effectiveness and necessitating a new cleaning.
@@jimtaylor1941 Agreed - but if I am storing for any great length of time, I grease them up and wrap them in waxed paper - easy enough to clean 'em up with some kitchen degreaser or petrol when you need a fresh one in the shop. I must have a couple of hundred files cleaned up and in storage .... for future generations OK - I admit it - I just love restoring all sorts of tools and I'm a bit of a hoarder
Most people would just throw out those old files. I love how you spent the time to bring them back to life! A file is the most basic and important way of removing material. Once you understand and embrace the file you can become a machinist.
I was a sawfiler for 33 years and accumulated a large number of files destined for the trash. Some are obviously worn beyond repair but many have the new gone but are worth some time as new files in hardware stores cost enough to warrant time with my free supply. I'll try this method. Thanks .
When fitting your handles, if you heat the tip of the file tang, 1/4" or so, to red heat, then push the handle onto the hot tang with the file held in soft jaws in the vice, the hot tip will burn the shape of the tang into the wood resulting in a better fitting handle without the possibility of splitting the wood. Makes lots of smoke so best done with doors open. Otherwise a very informative video. I've got a pile of files that could stand some of that treatment. Merry Christmas to one and all.
@@artisanmakes I was born in Zambia and have watched native blacksmiths making axes and badzas, a type of hoe, from bits of truck leaf spring. Once shaped they take the burl and trunk of a small tree and drive the red-hot end of the axe blade through the burl until it protrudes, partially, out the other side. These axes last them for years and, unless intentionally hit on the pointed end, the blades never fall out. Same principle with the files.
Ron is right. I have fitted many file handles and heating the tang is the way to do it. I do get them red hot further along though. The smell is glorious 😂. Also, test the tang in the hole first, idealy it should go about 1/3 into the hole without forcing. If it doesn't just stuff a drill down thd handle to open it up a bit. That way the tang will fit up to the hilt without splitting the handle and will be there forever 😁.
ive got this tip from Larry Potterfield from Midway usa, before filing to scrape with a blackboard chalk over the file, after using it on the iron you tap the file out on the workbench to release the iron shavings
Succinct, informative and occasionally entertaining. Love your vids bro! When I’m watching them l’ve almost convinced myself I’m actually doing the projects. So much so that I’ve watched about 20 of your vids and haven’t made anything or implemented any of your great insights. Today I’m breaking the cycle… Off to the workshop with no real plan, just gonna start. Cheers for the inspiration 👍
I tend to use either dilute sulphuric acid (or sodium-hydrogen sulphate from the pool shop) with reversed electrolysis for the sharpening step. It's way faster than vinegar or citric, although you can over do it and dissolve the teeth right off. About 30 minutes only and wet wire brush. No bubbles allowed. Then wash and neutralise with washing soda solution. I use lemon wood for the handles. And I like your copper pipe off cuts as ferrules, very quick and easy.
Very good work, I like your video, when I have to restore my files I first wash them in a bath of caustic soda, (Sodium Hydroxide solution) for about one hour and after brushing I resharpen them in a hot bath (about 60°C) of sulphuric acid with a 10% of nitric acid eluted with about 50% of water, it works much faster and it takes out also all the rust.
Use a flattened piece of copper pipe and run it with with the teeth of the file. The copper pipe will get little teeth that will push the gunk out from between the files teeth. It's a great way to get alloy out of the files teeth and u can work a much larger area than with a scalpel. Then I soak overnight in vinegar and then neutralise it in a bath of bi carb and water
To clean the teeth of the files get a piece of half inch copper pipe and flatten the end in the vice. Clamp the file in the vice with the working surface that you want to clean facing up. Put the longer flat end of the copper tube perpendicular to the file teeth and rub the copper tube back and forth until the end develops serration that match the files teeth, now you have a tool that can get right into the valleys of the teeth and you can remove all of the gunk that has clogged up you file, then finish with a file card.
I’ve got a 1/2 pipe with a “T” connector that I cut out of my house 15-20 years ago that I’m still using today to clean my files. Also never use oil on them unless you plan to store them for some time. The oil helps the filings to fill the valleys and will reduce their effectiveness. Before I start I rub chalk on them
I use a tall plastic kitchen waste bin and suspend the files separately from a steel rod that sits across the rim of the bin which is itself, connected to the negative of the battery charger. Old knackered files and rasps are great for the sacrificial electrodes, which are also suspended from a common bar. A greater surface area speeds up the job. It always pays to first clean the file with a wire brush and some good de-greaser - it really speeds up the electrolysis. I use brass suede brushes instead of file cards, as the wire is thinner and gets right down to the roots of the teeth
Great video! Files are such an important yet abused tool. It took years for me to get into the habit of always using a file card and it goes a long way in keeping them clean.
'Vintage' file cards seem to be made with finer diameter steel wire and I buy them whenever I see them. The modern ones are too coarse and the wire is too thick to get down to the roots of the teeth. I mainly use a brass suede wire brush for keeping files clean as I am working
My preference is to use citric acid powder as it is a little faster than vinegar and cheaper when bought in bulk. I also found that dousing parts in an alkaline degreaser (purple power, super clean, etc) both neutralizes the acid and prevents flash rust.
@@artisanmakes The best source of really hard wood (in OZ) is Redgum.......I always stop when I see a fencer putting up a new fence and ask for the Redgum fence post off cuts as they are as hard as iron.......cut into long square sections with a chain saw and you have wood that glows with a deep red warmth when varnished.
Legendary. Correct I have some beautiful old Australian made hand tools all well over 120 years old and still going strong. None of this t!sh out of China. This was a ripper. 🇦🇺👍🍺🍺
Old files used to be re-sharpened by sand blasting them - the sand being blown from the handle end to the front. I presume that this would do a good job of removing rust. It's a good idea to use a new file for brass, and when it looses it's edge, use it for steel. If you've used a file on steel a lot, it's likely to loose it's sharpness and skate over brass.
Farkin ell mate. You two boys are giving our closely guarded trade secrets. Be carefull now THEY know who the officers are and you might be targeted or 'cleared' by the workshop luminate for revealing our secrets. What ever you do dont tell them about rust removal with houshold vinegar '( THEY ) will find you and who know what will happen then. And don't tell your apprentices to wipe down their tools before they put them back into the correct toolbox. That would get you years of thanks.
I tried it and it sort of work, but was hardly what I would call a miracle. For this to really work, you need to thoroughly remove any bits in between the teeth, which is hard to do for fine teeth. You also have to degrease the file as well, since any residue will act as a mask, preventing etching.
I agree I've not had a huge success with this other than to learn what not to do with the new files I went and purchased. I can say a better way to clean the teeth of fine files is a block of copper. The copper is soft and works into the teeth when run sideways across the file.
@@campbellmorrison8540 A better way is to use a strip of steel banding material......rubbed flat endways across a file the flat edge will wear down and take the pitch of the teeth and remove any stuck in metal........I use this for normal filing when I get steel "knibs" stuck in the file teeth.
You can do this all in one by using boiling (simmering) water and soda crystals. Make sure any wooden handles dont go in the water. Doing this removes the rust, removes the gunk between the teeth, and sharpens the teeth. Leave them in for half an hour or more simmering away. When you take them out they will of course be extremely hot. The heat is your friend. Stand them up so the air gets to both sides and let them cool in their own time. That way not only the water on the surface evaporates, but also the water that has soaked in. Metal is porous. If you do this in your kitchen make sure the hob extractor is on. I dont know if the fumes are unhealthy, but they are not very pleasant and its always best to be safe.
Great video. Suggestion. Buy yourself a couple wood lathe tools. A medium gouge and a skew would be sufficient. Much much faster than what you used. Thank you!
From past experiences I feel that I've always gotten better results from electrolysis, especially when there are fine details and stuck chips that need to be removed. Could just be wrong, but that was my experience when I did something similar a few years ago. Cheera
@@artisanmakes Acid bath has to be kept hot, does not work cold, maybe that was the problem? It is much easier to create an electrolysis bath than a heated bath so electrolysis is superior in that regard unless you are comfortable with high voltage (mains) and some improvised heaters in water.
hey dude! well I totally agree with you! Nothing beats a well repaired or maintenanced vintage tool of the favorite country! In my opinion its switzerland because I am swiss. But I also have a few very nice tools and machines from England. Think the country does only matter for the heart of the owner :-) But better put some afford into old vintage tools instead of buy new crappy stuff. I really like the file vid man. Have a good time and some good work with your files. greets ron
@@machinist_mattWell I own a very old mikron mill made in switzerland... and its really a nice piece of machinery, but my myford lathe is also really nice! Well I think there are no major differences because metal working machines from the old days are all on a high level... no matter from which land or country.
@@artisanmakes Well in case of files I am not really a good partner for a discussion.. because the only files from good quality I ever owned/used are some vallorbe files from swiss. the rest I used was always those bullshit quality from warehouses and only cheap stuff... But I know that many lands had some guys back in the day which make files totally by hand... once upon a time I have seen a documentation about a german old man. In a tiny old shop he was making files since over 50 years...
Couldn't you just go straight to vinegar for both de-rusting and sharpening? Also, what is that white fluid you used with the Scotch Brite to clean up the handle area? Very nicely done, edited and clearly explained.
I never got great results with that on the test file. The file needs to be clear of rust and debris to sharpen. You could do two rounds in vinegar if you wanted to buy I've found electrolysis to work better at rust removal. Cheers
Another good way to clean out files (and one of my favorites) is to take a scrap piece of some soft brass, I usually use a piece that's about a 1/4" thick and about 1" wide and whatever length you want or have, and then run it parallel with the teeth and cut the teeth pattern into the brass and you'll have yourself a custom file comb that will get almost anything that's stuck in between the teeth out. Using the backside of a broken #11 hobby blade like you did is great for individual teeth and a great way to stab yourself if you're not holding the file correctly. Ask me how I know. Lol! I swear I'll never learn my lesson on that one. I bet I've got more than a hundred scars in my palms and fingers to prove it. 🙄
I use a short length of copper tube (plumbing offcut) hammered flat at one end (i have one split 3cm down from the end on one side and splayed out before hammering flat for a wider comb too)
Apart from the final coat of WD-40, that was a great and well made video. Consider something else instead of WD-40 as a coating. It just invites rust once that's applied by itself and left 😅
@@artisanmakes Great stuff if you don't mind your gear smelling like sheep, I use a fair bit if Lanotec, it was the only thing that stopped the springs in a POC Iveco from squeaking, but, well, sheep.
@@johnhodges8264 Thanks John. There are 60 or so bits in the kit, so that is doable with the lot. I've been thinking about gas fired kiln out of a gas bottle type thing.
This should work if they are carbon steel and might need to be heated to almost white hot or very bright red, cherry red might be a bit low. l@@MiniLuv-1984
I don't care what people say, Vinegar will definitely not sharpen a file in any way shape or form. Clean the file teeth Yes, but sharpen Hell NO. Clean the teeth and the file will work much better.
No, the reaction occurs b/c of the ferric oxide (Fe2O3) in rust. Once the rust is gone, you're not really doing much. You can make it take more time if you keep the sacrificial metal far away from the rusted piece, or if the water is too pure, or if you let the sacrificial metal get caked in rust.
Entirely confused why you didn't just continue to use the cutter and opted for hand rest and tooling... I make knives for a living, turn and taper everything on a similar lathe without a single hand tool.
I've tried that since but what I found is that the file teeth need to be spotless clean from grit and rust for the sharpening to work effectively Edit: haven't tried a salt and vinegar bath, only vinegar for the above comment
I don't believe in acid magically sharpening teeth. Acid 'eats' away metal, but doesn't spare sharp edges for some mysterious reason - why would it. Actually, I'm quite sure that sharp points are the fastest to be eaten away. However, acid may rough up a dull and glossy file. This way, a dull file may be given some extended life. But I would think not for very long as the porosity created by the acid will quickly get filled up. Note that this is not based on experience, but it seems most logical to me.
Yes, it is indeed metal etching, and I would probably shy away from doing this to a good condition file. Though this is a tried and trusted method that has been used for years. My understanding is that even commercial sharpening can do done using acid. Either way, super happy with the results. Cheers
@@artisanmakes I've been using a method almost identical to yours with good results. A couple of of things I do: after the best cleaning I can do to get out all the chips, gunk & surface rust, I soak them in degreaser (Citra solve works great) , rinse & dry, then brush hard with a stiff brush. I believe getting the files as clean as possible helps the acid work faster and better. I found even a slightly worn file benefits from the process. I remove that residue from the acid bath with a brass brush. Also: I've seen a couple of You Tube posts on commercial file re-sharpening, it does not work on badly worn or damaged files, but the company claims the re-sharpened file is sharper than new. One such firm is in California. Also again: check our the post of how farriers sharpen rasps using a buffing wheel and polishing compound. I've tried it and does work if the rasp is not too damaged.
@@1pcfred Rubbish......use a microscope and you will see the tops of the file teeth.....the cutting edges.......will be eaten away and rounded off by the acid......there are no reliable ways to "sharpen" a file once it gets the teeth worn away......the time it takes to "renew" a worn file cost 10 times more than buying a new file.......nothing cuts better or cleaner than a new file.
@@gangleweed why would acid just attack the tip of file teeth? That makes zero sense. Acid will erode the entire surface of metal. Effectively thinning out the whole tooth profile. The thinner an edge is the sharper it is. The time argument is bogus as well. If I want to invest my time in renewing files then it is quality time as far as I'm concerned. Not everyone makes Johnny Carson money anyways. And good files happen to be damned expensive these days. If you can even get them. I'm sure I own files you'd be hard pressed to find their like now and if you did you'd better be sitting down when you find out just what they cost.
I don’t understand why the acid bath sharpens the files. It seems like the acid would attack the points of the tooth, with the most surface area exposed, and round them off. I mean, I believe you and can see they got sharper. It just seems counterintuitive.
rust has eaten away the cutting edges of the teeth, scraping on them did even more damage...and the nicholson is the only decent file there. nicholson uses straight 1095 steel to make their files. ...sauce for the goose, the electrolysis just finished the job of destroying the cutting edges...suggested title of video "how to go from neglected tools to totally destroyed and useless..."
@Old Grizzly mid 1990s, I was forging knives out of recovered metal. old nicholson files were easy and cheap at swap meets. I called nicholson and spoke with one of their production guys. he told me as of then, they used straight 1095 for all their files except the farriers's rasp.
@@williambenson1477 I don't doubt that at all Nicholson had been bought out by Cooper Tools at that time, but were still being produced in the US. The quality problems started soon after that time, when production was moved to Mexico to 'cut production costs'
@Old Grizzly yeah, I've gotten some recent nicholsons and they don't seem to be as good as the older ones were. maybe just me, but I really think the ones I got are softer. like a bad heat treat process or the steel's carbon content is off
@@williambenson1477 Not hard to select the right steel, but it is much harder to accurately and consistently cut teeth, harden and heat treat steel. I have had the opposite problem of steel being too hard and thus getting sections, especially corners, of teeth breaking of after a couple of passes. I have an awful lot of good quality old files, [several lifetimes worth] but if I were buying new today, would probably opt for Bahco files made in Portugal. The best bench files I have ever used were Swedish and made by Oberg. The company was bought by Sandvik and subsequently taken over by Bahco. Production has since been moved to Portugal, and some Bahco files still bear the 'Oberg Portugal' trademark and are still very good quality
Wouldn’t it be much easier to take care of the tools accordingly after use? Much like the way a mechanic would with their tools for preparation for the next use after. That way it would avoid the caking and build up of long neglect would cause and save on the amount of time in the long run.
In the old days they would anneal the files then machine the teeth of, hammer new teeth in and reharden the files. Here is a video of this from a series of the last people who practise this. th-cam.com/video/8owKXUqlVMk/w-d-xo.html the subtitles are pretty okay.
why just not start with vinegar at first place. leave files in the vinegar bath for 2 days and they will be like new, no need to remove rust. i think i used 8%, you just need the right kind of vinegar
From past experiences I feel that I've always gotten better results from electrolysis, especially when there are fine details and stuck chips that need to be removed. Could just be wrong, but that was my experience when I did something similar a few years ago. Cheera
Agree i restore files regularly. I always clear gunk with flattened copper pipe before and after vinegar bath. But this was an interesting and well done video
b*llox! I have used electrolysis for about 30years and have never seen a sign of embrittlement problems The hydrogen is produced, I think, at the at the -ve sacrificial cathode and is vented to atmosphere. The gas produced at the +ve anode [ie the file], is oxygen .
There’s no way you can DIY sharpen a file, all the processes used in the video do is to remove crud from between the teeth, which will prolong its useful life a little…immersing in acid dissolves the metal, and will actually remove some of the cutting edges as mentioned before.. It can be professionally done, but can cost as much as buying them new.
I can assure you acid file sharpening is a time tested method and it is even referenced in my 1904 machining handbook. It won’t fix bent teeth but it will etch dulled teeth and restored to Working condition more or less.
I find broken chairs roadside with nicely turned spindles and legs, I cut those up for use as file handles and take the credit for the professional looks. ☺
I salute you, sir! lol good work!😊
On old chairs, they used maple for the turnings. They used various wood species depending on the part of the chair.
I do the same for my gouges and chisels
awesome idea! def. stealing this 😆
Smart idea
I was repairing/cleaning a few files a while ago, they had lots of aluminium in the teeth. I had no chemicals/vinegar but stumbled on a guy that had the best way I have ever seen. Take a copper pipe, cut it on one side and flatten it out so it looks like a spatula - the tube is like a handle and the part you cut is akin to a blade. Then push the blade part along the same direction as the teeth and it cleans the file perfectly. It took an hour or so to clean four or five files, but they were all perfectly clean and no ali/rust/dirty or grease could be seen. A nice cheap and easy method to save your files.
Just try soaking them in a caustic soda drain cleaner - it will eat the aluminium in short order and will not damage the steel. I love finding them clogged with aluminium since they are so easy to clean, and often have had little use by the last owner since they got clogged up quickly and became 'useless'
[caustic soda will also eat your skin very fast to wear some heavy nitrile gloves]
Many years ago an older machinist shared with me his secret for cleaning files. It is this: flatten the end of a 3/8 or 1/2 inch diameter copper tubing about 1/2 inch back; bend the other end up and over the flat portion to form part of a c-shape to act as a gripping surface. Rub the flattened end across and inline with the teeth of the file. This will quickly form groves in the copper which will fit nicely into the groves of the file cleaning out any debris lodged in there. Do this for the entire length of the file on both sides. This process can be repeated as needed. I, instead of the c-shape for a handle, found that the end could be inserted into a file handle which made it much more comfortable to use. Files rarely get dull. They just get clogged.
just an additional thought; oil will protect the file from rust but it will attract and hold both metal and wood fillings thereby clogging the teeth and limiting its effectiveness and necessitating a new cleaning.
@@jimtaylor1941
Agreed - but if I am storing for any great length of time, I grease them up and wrap them in waxed paper - easy enough to clean 'em up with some kitchen degreaser or petrol when you need a fresh one in the shop. I must have a couple of hundred files cleaned up and in storage .... for future generations
OK - I admit it - I just love restoring all sorts of tools and I'm a bit of a hoarder
Most people would just throw out those old files. I love how you spent the time to bring them back to life! A file is the most basic and important way of removing material. Once you understand and embrace the file you can become a machinist.
I was a sawfiler for 33 years and accumulated a large number of files destined for the trash. Some are obviously worn beyond repair but many have the new gone but are worth some time as new files in hardware stores cost enough to warrant time with my free supply. I'll try this method.
Thanks .
.... and did you try it and get results that lasted more than a few strokes ??
A brass brush on a drill is ok for me .thanks for the vid, very simple and efficient electrolysis
When fitting your handles, if you heat the tip of the file tang, 1/4" or so, to red heat, then push the handle onto the hot tang with the file held in soft jaws in the vice, the hot tip will burn the shape of the tang into the wood resulting in a better fitting handle without the possibility of splitting the wood. Makes lots of smoke so best done with doors open.
Otherwise a very informative video. I've got a pile of files that could stand some of that treatment.
Merry Christmas to one and all.
I've seen that done, but it just didn't occur to me when I did it. I'll have to keep that in mind and try it out next time I make a handle. Cheers
@@artisanmakes I was born in Zambia and have watched native blacksmiths making axes and badzas, a type of hoe, from bits of truck leaf spring. Once shaped they take the burl and trunk of a small tree and drive the red-hot end of the axe blade through the burl until it protrudes, partially, out the other side. These axes last them for years and, unless intentionally hit on the pointed end, the blades never fall out. Same principle with the files.
Ron is right. I have fitted many file handles and heating the tang is the way to do it. I do get them red hot further along though. The smell is glorious 😂.
Also, test the tang in the hole first, idealy it should go about 1/3 into the hole without forcing. If it doesn't just stuff a drill down thd handle to open it up a bit. That way the tang will fit up to the hilt without splitting the handle and will be there forever 😁.
ive got this tip from Larry Potterfield from Midway usa, before filing to scrape with a blackboard chalk over the file, after using it on the iron you tap the file out on the workbench to release the iron shavings
Succinct, informative and occasionally entertaining. Love your vids bro!
When I’m watching them l’ve almost convinced myself I’m actually doing the projects. So much so that I’ve watched about 20 of your vids and haven’t made anything or implemented any of your great insights.
Today I’m breaking the cycle…
Off to the workshop with no real plan, just gonna start.
Cheers for the inspiration 👍
Nice one, it's not what you make but how you make.
I tend to use either dilute sulphuric acid (or sodium-hydrogen sulphate from the pool shop) with reversed electrolysis for the sharpening step. It's way faster than vinegar or citric, although you can over do it and dissolve the teeth right off. About 30 minutes only and wet wire brush. No bubbles allowed. Then wash and neutralise with washing soda solution.
I use lemon wood for the handles. And I like your copper pipe off cuts as ferrules, very quick and easy.
Very good work, I like your video, when I have to restore my files I first wash them in a bath of caustic soda, (Sodium Hydroxide solution) for about one hour and after brushing I resharpen them in a hot bath (about 60°C) of sulphuric acid with a 10% of nitric acid eluted with about 50% of water, it works much faster and it takes out also all the rust.
I restored some super rusty files and rasps I bought from a hardware store in a scrap bucket. Used Naval jelly. Worked great.
I've tried many times to get the jelly out of my Naval but all I get is Lint.
I'm so jealous of you guys that have good Naval Jelly.
@@wizrom3046 and where do you get your cheese from ??😲
@@bigoldgrizzly 😬
You guys gave me a good belly laugh. Thanks, I needed that.😂😂😂.
Many thanks. Excellent tutorial. Old tools just were made better than the modern cr@p.
Thoroughly nice little video. Plenty to learn, with a good dose of common sense.
Thank you for sharing your handy tips.
Greetings fro France.
Use a flattened piece of copper pipe and run it with with the teeth of the file. The copper pipe will get little teeth that will push the gunk out from between the files teeth. It's a great way to get alloy out of the files teeth and u can work a much larger area than with a scalpel. Then I soak overnight in vinegar and then neutralise it in a bath of bi carb and water
To clean the teeth of the files get a piece of half inch copper pipe and flatten the end in the vice. Clamp the file in the vice with the working surface that you want to clean facing up. Put the longer flat end of the copper tube perpendicular to the file teeth and rub the copper tube back and forth until the end develops serration that match the files teeth, now you have a tool that can get right into the valleys of the teeth and you can remove all of the gunk that has clogged up you file, then finish with a file card.
Copper work hardens... I might have to try that idea.
I’ve got a 1/2 pipe with a “T” connector that I cut out of my house 15-20 years ago that I’m still using today to clean my files.
Also never use oil on them unless you plan to store them for some time. The oil helps the filings to fill the valleys and will reduce their effectiveness. Before I start I rub chalk on them
I use a tall plastic kitchen waste bin and suspend the files separately from a steel rod that sits across the rim of the bin which is itself, connected to the negative of the battery charger. Old knackered files and rasps are great for the sacrificial electrodes, which are also suspended from a common bar. A greater surface area speeds up the job. It always pays to first clean the file with a wire brush and some good de-greaser - it really speeds up the electrolysis. I use brass suede brushes instead of file cards, as the wire is thinner and gets right down to the roots of the teeth
Great video! Files are such an important yet abused tool. It took years for me to get into the habit of always using a file card and it goes a long way in keeping them clean.
'Vintage' file cards seem to be made with finer diameter steel wire and I buy them whenever I see them. The modern ones are too coarse and the wire is too thick to get down to the roots of the teeth. I mainly use a brass suede wire brush for keeping files clean as I am working
My preference is to use citric acid powder as it is a little faster than vinegar and cheaper when bought in bulk. I also found that dousing parts in an alkaline degreaser (purple power, super clean, etc) both neutralizes the acid and prevents flash rust.
Baking soda mixed with water.
@@stevesyncox9893 That's the sodium bicarb he mentioned/used in the video. Baking soda is sodium bicarbonate.
Extra points for the lathe chips comment. 🙂👍
Needs more salt
I didn't actually know you could re-sharpen files, I may have to have a go at this as a lot of mine are going blunt!
Artisan Makes learned me something today!
Glad to hear it. Cheers
Depends what cut it is
@@TheLexiconDevilswhich types can be sharpened? Bastard, second, finish?
A cool project and I like the handles. I have zero knowledge about your Australian Oak. A beautiful wood.
Cheers. Its just good general hardwood that can be picked up at the hardware store for a decent price. Stains a great colour though.
@@artisanmakes The best source of really hard wood (in OZ) is Redgum.......I always stop when I see a fencer putting up a new fence and ask for the Redgum fence post off cuts as they are as hard as iron.......cut into long square sections with a chain saw and you have wood that glows with a deep red warmth when varnished.
Note that Tasmanian Oak is actually a name for the timber from a few species of eucalyptus, not actually a type of oak.
I just pulled a few old files out of a vinegar bath this morning! Also, hacksaw!
Legendary. Correct I have some beautiful old Australian made hand tools all well over 120 years old and still going strong. None of this t!sh out of China. This was a ripper. 🇦🇺👍🍺🍺
Anyone that doesn't card their files after use doesn't deserve to have files.
I would add 'during use' as well
That was very interesting, thanks for sharing it. you’ve for sure a lot of patience
Old files used to be re-sharpened by sand blasting them - the sand being blown from the handle end to the front. I presume that this would do a good job of removing rust. It's a good idea to use a new file for brass, and when it looses it's edge, use it for steel. If you've used a file on steel a lot, it's likely to loose it's sharpness and skate over brass.
If you fill the teeth with soapstone it won’t gall aluminum....
Farkin ell mate. You two boys are giving our closely guarded trade secrets. Be carefull now THEY know who the officers are and you might be targeted or 'cleared' by the workshop luminate for revealing our secrets. What ever you do dont tell them about rust removal with houshold vinegar '( THEY ) will find you and who know what will happen then. And don't tell your apprentices to wipe down their tools before they put them back into the correct toolbox. That would get you years of thanks.
I tried it and it sort of work, but was hardly what I would call a miracle. For this to really work, you need to thoroughly remove any bits in between the teeth, which is hard to do for fine teeth. You also have to degrease the file as well, since any residue will act as a mask, preventing etching.
I agree I've not had a huge success with this other than to learn what not to do with the new files I went and purchased. I can say a better way to clean the teeth of fine files is a block of copper. The copper is soft and works into the teeth when run sideways across the file.
@@campbellmorrison8540 A better way is to use a strip of steel banding material......rubbed flat endways across a file the flat edge will wear down and take the pitch of the teeth and remove any stuck in metal........I use this for normal filing when I get steel "knibs" stuck in the file teeth.
That’s why you throw in some dishwashing liquid. Degrease as you go
Great Job! The handles came out great!
Thank you! Cheers!
You can do this all in one by using boiling (simmering) water and soda crystals. Make sure any wooden handles dont go in the water. Doing this removes the rust, removes the gunk between the teeth, and sharpens the teeth. Leave them in for half an hour or more simmering away.
When you take them out they will of course be extremely hot. The heat is your friend. Stand them up so the air gets to both sides and let them cool in their own time. That way not only the water on the surface evaporates, but also the water that has soaked in. Metal is porous.
If you do this in your kitchen make sure the hob extractor is on. I dont know if the fumes are unhealthy, but they are not very pleasant and its always best to be safe.
Great video. Suggestion. Buy yourself a couple wood lathe tools. A medium gouge and a skew would be sufficient. Much much faster than what you used. Thank you!
I love me some old tools they come with good juju
I have to have a go as most of my files see plenty of use and could a freshen up
Ah, wouldn't a card file clean out those grooves faster?
File card works great on a good file but doesn't work all that well when the gunk is all rusted up in the teeth
Citric acid (food additive) in hot water removes rust and will do the same "sharpening" of the files.
From past experiences I feel that I've always gotten better results from electrolysis, especially when there are fine details and stuck chips that need to be removed. Could just be wrong, but that was my experience when I did something similar a few years ago. Cheera
@@artisanmakes Acid bath has to be kept hot, does not work cold, maybe that was the problem? It is much easier to create an electrolysis bath than a heated bath so electrolysis is superior in that regard unless you are comfortable with high voltage (mains) and some improvised heaters in water.
Oil on a file makes chips stick, and that can damage the teeth. But it will make for a nicer finish too.
Thanks mate. Good tutorial and excellent W.O.R.K (Wisely Organize Reliable Knowledge)
80's and 90's are "vintage", making me me feel even older 🤣
Another vintage man right here. They don't make us like they used to.
That’s alot of really good information. Thanks.
Well done 👍
Thank you! Cheers!
hey dude! well I totally agree with you! Nothing beats a well repaired or maintenanced vintage tool of the favorite country! In my opinion its switzerland because I am swiss.
But I also have a few very nice tools and machines from England. Think the country does only matter for the heart of the owner :-) But better put some afford into old vintage tools instead of buy new crappy stuff.
I really like the file vid man.
Have a good time and some good work with your files. greets ron
That's interesting. I am English so of course I like British tools best but most people here would consider Swiss and German tools amongst the best. 😎
I too am a bit biased as I am Aussie, though I have a few vintage Sheffield files and they are great tools.
@@machinist_mattWell I own a very old mikron mill made in switzerland... and its really a nice piece of machinery, but my myford lathe is also really nice! Well I think there are no major differences because metal working machines from the old days are all on a high level... no matter from which land or country.
@@artisanmakes Well in case of files I am not really a good partner for a discussion.. because the only files from good quality I ever owned/used are some vallorbe files from swiss. the rest I used was always those bullshit quality from warehouses and only cheap stuff...
But I know that many lands had some guys back in the day which make files totally by hand... once upon a time I have seen a documentation about a german old man. In a tiny old shop he was making files since over 50 years...
Fun to note I have the same four files as you, the three Aussies and the Nicholson brought at the same time as your's were I expect.
I hope they have held up better than mine have. Cheers
As luck would have it, I was just thinking of starting on a near identical project today!
Merry Xmas, Well done
Awesome. Hot chips n vinegar.
Nicely done.
Why not use a file card or some brass/copper instead of the X-acto knife?
I've been meaning to try wood turning in my mini lathe. I have the same one you do, minus the upgrades you did to it.
Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up
Much appreciated, glad you enjoyed the video
Well done Sir
Couldn't you just go straight to vinegar for both de-rusting and sharpening? Also, what is that white fluid you used with the Scotch Brite to clean up the handle area? Very nicely done, edited and clearly explained.
I never got great results with that on the test file. The file needs to be clear of rust and debris to sharpen. You could do two rounds in vinegar if you wanted to buy I've found electrolysis to work better at rust removal. Cheers
And the white stuff is jiff or ciff, depending on your country
@@artisanmakes Great, thanks for the info.
Excellent
For cleaning a file a the corner of a piece of brass works a lot better than a file card.
Very nice! 👍👍
How did you get that like.. paint like gunk out of the teeth, I got some old files that had either.. paint.. or something else...
My friend you need a super sonic cleaner, would've made cleaning these files much much easier
Why use labour intensive picking withe knife blade? I find a rotary wire brush in a hand held electric drill to work just as well.
I like the taste test.
nice job. thinking of some new projects
Would putting a dirty file in a blast cabnit work for cleaning or would it damage it?
What did you use to lift the files off the bottom of the container for the sharpening the teeth around 5:29
Cool way of doing it. I think if I had to do it I would use some evaporust
Great video as always gonna try this at home i have ton of old files made from USA
try electrolysis first, combined with a good clean out - no need for acid
Approx how much was your interference fit for the copper sleeve?
It was roughly 0.25mm, though there is a lot of leeway in it.
Another good way to clean out files (and one of my favorites) is to take a scrap piece of some soft brass, I usually use a piece that's about a 1/4" thick and about 1" wide and whatever length you want or have, and then run it parallel with the teeth and cut the teeth pattern into the brass and you'll have yourself a custom file comb that will get almost anything that's stuck in between the teeth out. Using the backside of a broken #11 hobby blade like you did is great for individual teeth and a great way to stab yourself if you're not holding the file correctly. Ask me how I know. Lol! I swear I'll never learn my lesson on that one. I bet I've got more than a hundred scars in my palms and fingers to prove it. 🙄
Yeah that works really well, I used to have a piece of copper that used to use too. Cheers
@@artisanmakes I was just going to suggest that...
@@trollforge Yes, me too!
I use a short length of copper tube (plumbing offcut) hammered flat at one end (i have one split 3cm down from the end on one side and splayed out before hammering flat for a wider comb too)
I really like it
How does vinegar sharpen a file?
Apart from the final coat of WD-40, that was a great and well made video. Consider something else instead of WD-40 as a coating. It just invites rust once that's applied by itself and left 😅
its not really wd, its lannox, i just use wd as a catch all water displacements
I use Valvoline .. know what I mean
6:37, @Artisan Makes looked awfully like a blue can with yellow writing on to me.
@@bushratbeachbum He displaced the water with Water Displacer 40 and (off camera) finished with lannox.
@@artisanmakes Great stuff if you don't mind your gear smelling like sheep, I use a fair bit if Lanotec, it was the only thing that stopped the springs in a POC Iveco from squeaking, but, well, sheep.
I bought a kit of Chinese drill bits. You can bend the 2 and 4mm in your hand - they don't break, they bend. Can I harden these and if so how?
Try heating to cherry and quench in oil, then temper to light straw and quench.
@@johnhodges8264 Thanks John. There are 60 or so bits in the kit, so that is doable with the lot. I've been thinking about gas fired kiln out of a gas bottle type thing.
This should work if they are carbon steel and might need to be heated to almost white hot or very bright red, cherry red might be a bit low. l@@MiniLuv-1984
Nice
I don't care what people say, Vinegar will definitely not sharpen a file in any way shape or form. Clean the file teeth Yes, but sharpen Hell NO. Clean the teeth and the file will work much better.
I just put a pair of Nicholson's in for a vinegar soak! The stuff I have here is only 4% though.
Higher concentration is usually sold as a cleaning solution vinegar, but 4% still works great. I have a few Nicholson and they are great files. Cheers
Add salt to it. And water.
You should invest in some file cards!
I use one in the video
Is it possible to screw up the electrolysis and "overdo" it?
No. Electrolysis only removes rust, not metal. I have left a piece in for about a month [I simply forgot it] and it does no harm whatsoever.
No, the reaction occurs b/c of the ferric oxide (Fe2O3) in rust. Once the rust is gone, you're not really doing much.
You can make it take more time if you keep the sacrificial metal far away from the rusted piece, or if the water is too pure, or if you let the sacrificial metal get caked in rust.
wire brush on a 6.. or 8 inch grinder is good to
I beg to differ my boy. I good British Made Vintage Tool will far outstrip any ozzy tat !
"teeth aren't as sharp as the used to be" and this is why i will give this a thumbs down. real answer. buy a new file and take care of it.
Use citric acid dip for 36hrs, cleanup wihj wire brush
I prefer electrolysis but it should all work the same
wood you can cut by hand.
Sorry, you’re going to have to help me here…I cannot find the term “gunk” in any machinist text or reference….😉
Tried that. I still could not open folder on my disc to access my files :P
You tried turning the file off and on?
Entirely confused why you didn't just continue to use the cutter and opted for hand rest and tooling... I make knives for a living, turn and taper everything on a similar lathe without a single hand tool.
I dont mind doing a bit of free hand turning every now and then if Im doing wood
To bad you never tried a special COPPER CARD FILE and Muratic acid.
Just different ways of doing the same thing. I prefer electrolysis
A piece of copper takes of care of the hard junk... Just rub it sideways to the cut....
Then strong acid makes wonders...
Vinegar & salt bath overnight. Rust removal & ‘sharpen’ in 1 lazy step
I've tried that since but what I found is that the file teeth need to be spotless clean from grit and rust for the sharpening to work effectively
Edit: haven't tried a salt and vinegar bath, only vinegar for the above comment
I don't believe in acid magically sharpening teeth. Acid 'eats' away metal, but doesn't spare sharp edges for some mysterious reason - why would it. Actually, I'm quite sure that sharp points are the fastest to be eaten away.
However, acid may rough up a dull and glossy file. This way, a dull file may be given some extended life. But I would think not for very long as the porosity created by the acid will quickly get filled up.
Note that this is not based on experience, but it seems most logical to me.
Yes, it is indeed metal etching, and I would probably shy away from doing this to a good condition file. Though this is a tried and trusted method that has been used for years. My understanding is that even commercial sharpening can do done using acid. Either way, super happy with the results. Cheers
The theory is as the acid eats the metal it makes the teeth thinner. A thinner edge is a sharper one.
@@artisanmakes I've been using a method almost identical to yours with good results. A couple of of things I do: after the best cleaning I can do to get out all the chips, gunk & surface rust, I soak them in degreaser (Citra solve works great) , rinse & dry, then brush hard with a stiff brush. I believe getting the files as clean as possible helps the acid work faster and better. I found even a slightly worn file benefits from the process. I remove that residue from the acid bath with a brass brush. Also: I've seen a couple of You Tube posts on commercial file re-sharpening, it does not work on badly worn or damaged files, but the company claims the re-sharpened file is sharper than new. One such firm is in California. Also again: check our the post of how farriers sharpen rasps using a buffing wheel and polishing compound. I've tried it and does work if the rasp is not too damaged.
@@1pcfred Rubbish......use a microscope and you will see the tops of the file teeth.....the cutting edges.......will be eaten away and rounded off by the acid......there are no reliable ways to "sharpen" a file once it gets the teeth worn away......the time it takes to "renew" a worn file cost 10 times more than buying a new file.......nothing cuts better or cleaner than a new file.
@@gangleweed why would acid just attack the tip of file teeth? That makes zero sense. Acid will erode the entire surface of metal. Effectively thinning out the whole tooth profile. The thinner an edge is the sharper it is. The time argument is bogus as well. If I want to invest my time in renewing files then it is quality time as far as I'm concerned. Not everyone makes Johnny Carson money anyways. And good files happen to be damned expensive these days. If you can even get them. I'm sure I own files you'd be hard pressed to find their like now and if you did you'd better be sitting down when you find out just what they cost.
I don’t understand why the acid bath sharpens the files. It seems like the acid would attack the points of the tooth, with the most surface area exposed, and round them off.
I mean, I believe you and can see they got sharper. It just seems counterintuitive.
I turn the old files into knives
Probably the right steel for it. I’ve seen videos of people doing it
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
👍😀👍
Don't use steel to clean a file use brass or bronze
rust has eaten away the cutting edges of the teeth, scraping on them did even more damage...and the nicholson is the only decent file there. nicholson uses straight 1095 steel to make their files. ...sauce for the goose, the electrolysis just finished the job of destroying the cutting edges...suggested title of video "how to go from neglected tools to totally destroyed and useless..."
they used good steel back in the day... modern 'nicholsons' are crap
@Old Grizzly mid 1990s, I was forging knives out of recovered metal. old nicholson files were easy and cheap at swap meets. I called nicholson and spoke with one of their production guys. he told me as of then, they used straight 1095 for all their files except the farriers's rasp.
@@williambenson1477 I don't doubt that at all Nicholson had been bought out by Cooper Tools at that time, but were still being produced in the US. The quality problems started soon after that time, when production was moved to Mexico to 'cut production costs'
@Old Grizzly yeah, I've gotten some recent nicholsons and they don't seem to be as good as the older ones were. maybe just me, but I really think the ones I got are softer. like a bad heat treat process or the steel's carbon content is off
@@williambenson1477 Not hard to select the right steel, but it is much harder to accurately and consistently cut teeth, harden and heat treat steel. I have had the opposite problem of steel being too hard and thus getting sections, especially corners, of teeth breaking of after a couple of passes.
I have an awful lot of good quality old files, [several lifetimes worth] but if I were buying new today, would probably opt for Bahco files made in Portugal.
The best bench files I have ever used were Swedish and made by Oberg. The company was bought by Sandvik and subsequently taken over by Bahco. Production has since been moved to Portugal, and some Bahco files still bear the 'Oberg Portugal' trademark and are still very good quality
You ever heard of a file card?
I use one in the video
@@artisanmakes indeed good on you, my mistake. Rock on.
No worries. Cheers
Wouldn’t it be much easier to take care of the tools accordingly after use? Much like the way a mechanic would with their tools for preparation for the next use after. That way it would avoid the caking and build up of long neglect would cause and save on the amount of time in the long run.
Would be nice, but reality is there just weren’t times when we could practically do that
In the old days they would anneal the files then machine the teeth of, hammer new teeth in and reharden the files. Here is a video of this from a series of the last people who practise this. th-cam.com/video/8owKXUqlVMk/w-d-xo.html the subtitles are pretty okay.
You defently have to wear Black gloves next time......
Don't see why, gloves kinda get in the way and make handling stuff harder. Cheers
why just not start with vinegar at first place. leave files in the vinegar bath for 2 days and they will be like new, no need to remove rust. i think i used 8%, you just need the right kind of vinegar
From past experiences I feel that I've always gotten better results from electrolysis, especially when there are fine details and stuck chips that need to be removed. Could just be wrong, but that was my experience when I did something similar a few years ago. Cheera
Agree i restore files regularly. I always clear gunk with flattened copper pipe before and after vinegar bath. But this was an interesting and well done video
Always interested in how other people do it, cheers
This could also be an IT video lol
Not a good idea to put hardened steel in electrolysis. It might become brittle.
It's a file, it's already brittle
@@zubirhusein something else happens during electrolysis called hydrogen embrittlement. It goes away over time. Or it can be baked out of steel.
Settle down it’s just a file
b*llox! I have used electrolysis for about 30years and have never seen a sign of embrittlement problems The hydrogen is produced, I think, at the at the -ve sacrificial cathode and is vented to atmosphere. The gas produced at the +ve anode [ie the file], is oxygen .
With all that time, effort, and tooling you used, you could've just drove to the store and bought new ones.
Wouldn’t be much of a hobby would it
There’s no way you can DIY sharpen a file, all the processes used in the video do is to remove crud from between the teeth, which will prolong its useful life a little…immersing in acid dissolves the metal, and will actually remove some of the cutting edges as mentioned before..
It can be professionally done, but can cost as much as buying them new.
I can assure you acid file sharpening is a time tested method and it is even referenced in my 1904 machining handbook. It won’t fix bent teeth but it will etch dulled teeth and restored to Working condition more or less.
Another person who cannot absorb basic information.
Read up on etch sharpening. Same method used on fish hooks