Charging FAIL & GREAT Surprise When We Compare The Model Y & Mach-E On The World’s Toughest EV Test!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ม.ค. 2021
- Tesla's Model Y is the crossover to beat when it comes to living with an electric crossover, but there's a new challenger: the 2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E. Can Ford's latest crack at a full-electric model take on an established EV brand's best-selling crossover on the Loveland Trials? Only one way to find out!
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#ModelY #MachE #LovelandTrials - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
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Great video! Very interesting real world test!
That's a long stretch from being a real world test. The Mach e has plenty of range for real world day to day driving. Tesla gets far too many passes for build quality issues that should have been corrected by now.
@@larryhill1953 I disagree, it was a great real world test, a lot of people live in mountainous cold weather parts of the US and this tells us lot!
@@larryhill1953 The ones coming out of China’s factory are excellent quality; near the top of the list of JD power survey next to Nio. Germany and Austin factory will produce even better cars.
Quality is far better nowadays. As said, the Austin and Berlin factories will move the whole game on both in structure of the car, cost savings and technology improvement as well as build quality. Expect Fremont to then close soon after for gutting and rebuilding. It’s a tired argument. There is a great Pro/Anti Tesla argument and as Jim Jefferies would say, it boils down to a simple one. You either like them or don’t. If you don’t, it’s really because they are ugly to you or you think Elon is a freak. Can’t be much else as the tech is simply brilliant....
@@larryhill1953 My dad has a Chevy Bolt and I begged him to wait a bit longer to get the Model 3 if for nothing else than the charging infrastructure. He likes his Bolt but he admits having to plan out road trips and find working chargers is a real engineering task. He agrees non-Tesla EV road trip are not at ALL ready for prime time.
The loser in this race was..........
..... Electrify America
I was just thinking, VW is extending its reputation for poor electrical systems to EV chargers.
@@jghall00 The problem is VW is not even directly in charge. The Electrify America (EA) itself is buying equipment from third party manufacturers. Also recently EA drastically changed its suppliers and started replacement of old units. At this point there is the risk of encountering old units on the road, unfortunately. I am not taking away blame from VW but merely state the situation lingering in traditional auto world with supply chain. Tesla innovated all the system around but has got still wrong its quality control which is settled down better at a traditional automaker - Ford in this case. However in charging Tesla nailed it.
The real loser here is Ford. They are losing buyers only because of the supercharging network (electrify America).
Electrify America was forced on VW as a punishment. Why would they care if a punishment is done well or not?
@@JHuffPhoto Exactly. It's like assigning 1000 push-ups to an overweight slob, as a penalty and expecting that each one would be performed perfectly with great form... and that you'll actually get more than 10...
I think I know why the model y charging rate was low. They did not pre-heat the battery for the supercharging. When you put the supercharger location, the battery preheats for the charging.
one should watch more Tesla Bjorn content...
@@norbertmachaj6127 This just shows the limitations of these systems. You have to have a lot of knowledge to use it on an okay way.
@@Xanthopteryx no, just say goodbye to old fossil world and get to know a new exciting one...
@@norbertmachaj6127 This is most surely not the sole future. It will be a mix of fuel types in the future, just like we have it today.
@@Xanthopteryx I think the Tesla will automatically condition if you specify your charging destination. An owner would need to confirm. Most people will charge at home anyway.
"Navigate to charger" helps heat the battery and get charging speed up
Hey bud not to be an English teacher but it’s *Battery*
@@mrzayoftoday tks!! U r rigth
It doesn't make that much of a difference if your car has been driving, the battery stays somewhat condition for charging. Tesla slows down charging based on %.
The only time pre-conditioning helps is if you notice that your regen is operating at reduce capacity. Pre-conditioning helps, when you parked your car for a while, and you're driving to a charger that's 5-10mins away.
@@WallStreetBeggar this is incorrect, regen maxes out only around 70 or 80 kW, but to charge at 140 kW or even 250kW the battery needs to be much warmer.
@@WallStreetBeggar
A lot depends on how cold it is outside. In winter conditions like this pre-conditioning makes a lot of difference, and the lack of it probably was what was going on here.
Charging Station:
Tesla: Plug and Relax
Ford Mach-E: Plug and Pray
Charging Ford Mach-E is like dealing with USB-C - never know what to expect until you figure things out, vs iPhone Lighting cable - always works and give the same results while not perhaps being the fastest or best.
They didn't even use Plug and Play, the video shows him using the CC reader.
What is Plug and Play?
im totally agree....if u come supercharge from a place u dont know well specially in video
@@mlodyme3675 wait there are people that have Problems with USB c? Or ist this a Apple Fanboy blabla?
Every video that involves electrify america always ends the same
It isn't just them though, I live in Europe and the vast majority of charging stations here have similar issues besides the Supercharger network and Ionity. :)
@@VoxelLoop Ionity network is probably the real rival on SuC network. Also because it already surpass the SuC in charging speed
@@francescoboselli6033 But have you seen how much it costs to use? It's multiples times the cost per KW of SuC network. :)
It seems like they charge a premium for fast charging.
SuC = £0.24 per KW
Ionity = £0.69 per KW
@@VoxelLoop This is true if you don't have a car from the brand the participated in the Join venture (and if I'm not wrong Ford is between them). In that case the cost is reduce to 0,30/0,40 cent/kW.
@@francescoboselli6033 I've only ever charged at Ionity once and it was somewhere in the middle of France. I wanted to try out the 300kw, see if I could hit the 250 max for my vehicle.
It didn't really get anywhere near that speed though as the battery was around 30% at start of charge, instead it just emptied my wallet. 😅
It's good to have some actual fast chargers though outside of SuC network! 50kw chargers are not acceptable but seem to be the most common.
Need to teach Blaze to lick the steering every couple mins to keep the auto driving active
My dog would be more than happy to volunteer to demonstrate. He loves licking everything he can get his little doggy tongue on.
@@MichaelMiller-rg6or My dog licks the wall. I think he fell off the short bus.
@@JUST_ONE_ID10T My dog licks the floor and carpets, and I am not just talking about in my kitchen. I wake up in the middle of the night to use the rest room and I see him going to town on the carpet at the foot of my bed sometimes.
My beer gut would finally come in handy.
The charging structure is everything!! GREAT POINT!!!! Tesla is the only EV that makes sense because of this fact.
So technically Ford will now have access to the largest charging system in North America
@@bradleyisfishing lol ppl don't realize how big that infrastructure is some odd reason
Charging structure is already there for Ford. Difference is they don't try to push you towards their own proprietary network like Tesla does.
That's the one thing I love about Tesla is how he actually made his own charging charging points and pays people to maintain them often
Ford have money to build their own ...i dont think so
They keep saying Mach-E as one word. Sounds like maki. Now I want sushi
I'll stick with Sush-E
Great comparison.
You have to use the navigation to get the Model Y to precondition the battery for supercharging. Just select a Tesla Supercharger in the nav and it will know to precondition the battery within an estimation of your arrival to the Supercharger.
They know this, it was intentional for drama and Ford-kissing.
Yes make a huge different the longer you can precondition (not 5 min before you pull in). It's hardly go over 100kW without precon in winter.
The way they did it is more realistic. I don't plug a gas station into my GPS because they are everywhere and I can drive further than an electric car.
@@JStryker7 Gas stations are way different than superchargers - they're everywhere. With a Tesla, you would use the nav system to first find the one along your route, then enter it. The added benefit is also that if you have FSD, the car will take the exit for you. I have literally never just driven to a supercharger... I ALWAYS enter it into the navigation system... it's right there in front of me
@@Thomas-re9ky my point is that they are inconvenient both in location and time spent
Holy crap that Electrify America performance is concerning. You guys should do a video solely on Electrify America? Would be very curious to see.
The problem with speed is most likely same as with Tesla, a cold battery. Don't know about Ford can it be heated but Tesla can do it.
Reliability of most chargers are messed up with crappy sw, complex chargers and lack of testing. That's sad becauss all it needs to do is deliver power with current requested by vehicle bms. If they can't get digital handshake working, signal could be even analog.
Kyle Connor from out of spec motoring went across the US using Electrify America in record time using a Taycan. I'd say it's more a vehicle issue than a network problem.
Yeah, I think I’ll be sticking with plug-in hybrids for the foreseeable future. If the automakers keep cutting PHEVs for full EVs, I may have to go back to a gas car. I’m not too optimistic about the QC infrastructure. The EV diehards may be willing to cope with the charger issues, most people are not.
@@ScramJett By principle, there should be no reason why charging should be more unreliable than getting gas from the pump.
There are two logical explanations. Either idiots are making those systems or it is because energy companies or traditional car manufacturers own most of the charging networks and are responsible of the complex stadards.
Also nowadays typical programmer can’t make things simple and robust unless being forced to do it.
@@teropiispala2576 I don’t think it’s idiots and only Electrify America is owned by a traditional car manufacturer (VW). ChargePoint is not. My experience with public EV charging was far more positive when it was just unnetworked clipper creek chargers. You just drove up, plugged in and... BAM... done! Now with all of these networks and memberships and other crap, it’s way over complicated! I know why it is this way, these companies are rent seekers who are taking a page from the smartphone app rule book of the subscription model. So far, membership is free, but I expect that to change soon. I don’t think regular folks want that for cars though. I know I don’t. I have a ChargePoint account and THAT is IT. I will NOT be adding any other networks, EVER! If these companies can’t get their s*** together and make EV charging as easy as pumping gas, then governments and car companies are deluding themselves with their electrification goals. But I don’t expect these charger companies will do it on their own, they have to be forced. So far, governments seem unwilling to force them, so nothing will change.
Would be so great if Circle K America could install fast chargers at all their gas stations like they do in Norway and be just as reliable and easy to use as they are there.
Seems like it would be smart! Don’t understand why we are so protective of oil here. Norway’s biggest export is oil and they still move toward electric.
Mrspuzz. My state (NM) is a perfect example of the push and pull with the oil industry. Huge oil field in southern NM and west Texas that they do fracking. Terrible for the environment but it pumps loads of tax dollars into the state. Then we have green energy initiatives here in both solar and wind fields generating clean energy to get transmitted to California. Neither side can agree on anything.
Things don't work that way in America. Or better yet... things don't work in America unless you bribe a politician.
amazing how well Tesla really did make that supercharger network. quiet, fast and seamless
It is because of Elon's and team's smart planning. Build the network first then mass produce cars.
@@tubetop123 I remember when I bought my model S back in 2016. Only like 3-4 superchargers within 50 miles radius in the Bay Area. Now they have about 40+...
Except when they are all broken
@@Pops180 Super rare.
@@rickkay9548 not really actually.
Well done video. I know there's plenty of bias in there on both sides, but you did a great job of keeping it real and offering a fair comparison. Thank you.
Agree with Roman. The only charging infrastructure that makes sense right now is Tesla.
Yeah as a Model 3 owner, I hate a lot of what Tesla is as a company (Right to repair, obtaining parts, crazy FSD beta price, as well as many other things), but I cannot get myself to get any other electric car, because of charging.
The 21 likes has to be Tesla people
@@JustinJS Agree. Money down on a cyber truck.
And boom ford says they are switching to Tesla plugs lol
Infrastructure in the UK is slowly becoming better with car makers getting together and building charging stations. Will Tesla be able to improve their build quality because the one i tried was shockingly put together. There is no doubt Tesla do a lot of good things mainly efficiency and software and yes i own Tesla stock so i do believe it’s doing the right thing and pushing the car industry to change, but still to bland inside for me, and the amount of rattles and gaps is not good. The gap is not as big as it was and the big boys are catching up on Tesla all be it still not making any money Lol. I have ordered the Mach E AWD Premium its just put together better and i can do 90% of my charging at home. It as wireless apple car play, awesome sound system, and looks a hell of a lot better than the boring looking Tesla. Two very good EV’s Tesla still king of the EV for efficiency but Ford have a very well put together car it all depends on what you want from your vehicle. I know the 2023 model as a lot more over the air software updates which have improved the Mach E and let’s remember that Tesla have been at it for a lot longer and the same can be said for Ford which is why the Tesla is more efficient and the Ford is put together better.
Amazing trip and analysis! Wow! Can't wait to watch the other matches!
This is great - thanks for showing realistic range. I love Loveland - one of my favorite resorts in the West.
That was a very good real-world test. Thanks guys.
Real comparison: how much gas did the trail boss use?
Moved to Montana 2 years ago after 11 years in Colorado. This video is making me miss the Centennial State. Well done guys!
Really great video and very interesting test. All thumbs up!
The standard range Mach E is capable of 115kW fast charging. You need to get the ER battery to get the quoted 150kW charging.
Along with proper battery temperature..
Comparing the performance model to a basic version of a car seems wrong on the face of it.
I think it would be interesting if you guys broke down the elevation gained/lost on a trip like the one in this video. It was mentioned in passing a couple of times, but it would have been nice to see it in a graphic or on a graph. You gained over a mile in vertical elevation getting from Boulder to Loveland Pass, then you lost 2,000 ft going back down to Silverthorne, then gained it back going through the Eisenhower tunnel, then lost the whole mile again going back to Golden. Those elevation changes are significant in any vehicle, especially an electric car. I once drove a rented Ford CMax hybrid from Denver up to Estes Park and then back down to Loveland, CO. I don't think the gas engine came on the entire way down, and when we got out, the CMax was flashing that we got 99.9 MPG on that trip, and the battery was full. If you had driven those cars on relatively flat terrain for the same mileage, your results could have been way different. Maybe going back down the mountains made up for all the energy used going up and it was a wash, but maybe it wasn't. It depends on how efficient the motors and regenerative braking systems are.
Nice job y’all. Entertaining as well as informative.
This was a great realistic review. Thanks for creating this
The Mach-E is really growing on me.
only from the back corner the thin wheels look a bit strange, but any other angle is nice
I think you should do some more research. While I like it too, I think at this point anyone would be a fool to choose the MAch-E over the Telsa. Ford clearly has a lot more work to do and is making alot of promises. While tesla takes forever they usually follow through with what they say. I cannot say the same about Ford.
Me tooooooooo! But I'm leaning towards the polestar 2
@@abarrick09 PERFECT! Best way to put it.
Tesla does take a longer to do promises, but when it's released it is almost flawless.
The mach E was clearly rushed because if they delayed it by another year Tesla would have more software updates, better efficiently, build quality being mostly fixed and possibly the rear wheel drive car.
@@stewartstarling2309 the polestar has really flown under the radar compared the Mach-e. I think the polestar draws a different clientele than the mustard and tesla which is why.
I’m a Tesla fanboy, but it’s so interesting how much the charging network weighs in. I took one little road-trip and noticed I had two superchargers in my route when I only needed one. I know more and more EV’s are coming out and I think that’s so awesome! Excited for the future and the competition!
Nice. Thanks guys, you're definitely making the videos people wanna see.
Great video. You guys just helped me make up my mind. Thanks
Reminds me of years ago riding a motorbike round Scotland and worrying where the next petrol station was. 😂🇬🇧
Spot on Dave. I have said this to a number of people. 250miles on a motorcycle is considerable. Just do the North Coast 500 and discover the limitations. Riding a bike prepared me for the range anxiety of my EV 😂
@18:30. The best comparison wouldn't be to compare guess-o-meter miles used or even what metric they used in the video which is percent of battery pack. The best an most clear comparison is to show how much energy they each used total in kWhs or at least miles/kWh.
Great video. I suspect this was mentioned somewhere in the comments, but only V1/V2 superchargers have the stall sharing limitation. The supercharger you used (at Colorado Mills Mall) is a V3, which doesn't have the same sharing limitation. Looking forward to more videos.
Great Video, will you be comparing the ID 4 with the Y on this same trip?
so the question is now, would you rather put up with a not so well developed charging network or put up with a slightly not so good build quality.
Charging network hands-down. I take road trips maybe 3 times a year. I would have to deal with poor build quality daily.
I guess you'll have plenty of time to admire the "perfect" panel alignments on the Mach-E when you're left stranded because the vehicle has lower range and the EA chargers won't work.
@@boostav see, the thing is that the charging network is getting better all the time and Tesla's build quality is not. Plus, if I were to buy a Tesla now I would be stuck with current Tesla build quality. If I were to buy a Mach E now, the only issues it has are being fixed by sheer market pressure.
Also, I am currently sitting in the car I would replace with the Mach E. I've had it for 8 years and in that time it has never been more than 200km from home. Even on the standard range Mach E it may have only needed to charge at a public charger once or twice total for maybe 15 minutes at 50KW much less 100+. So yeah, if you only have one car, buy a Tesla if you want a BEV. If not, then literally any other BEV is probably a better quality proposition.
@@tylerpubben4216 Quite the contrary, Tesla build quality is getting better. Not to mention Tesla's build quality issues are ridiculously overstated and can be easily taken care of by Tesla service centers.
You're making it sound like you're buying a Porsche, Ford isn't much better as far as build quality is concerned. Electrify America chargers not working are a common occurrence, fixing the charging network issue is a much longer endeavor not to mention far more crucial than a couple panel gaps since it could leave you stranded.
If you don't care about range you might as well buy a Model Y standard range then. Lastly I'd rather support a brand that manufactures their vehicles in the US and not Mexico.
@@boostav Supporting Mexico vs US as a Canadian is a wash and I test drove a Model Y yesterday that had major build quality issues including a non-functional rear door, a passenger side mirror that did not want to move up and down (left to right was fine) and the rear armrest/cupholder thing was so visibly misaligned that it was causing creases in the seat material. This was on a car that I assume the service center has tried to get fixed as it is their demo vehicle. It also had a non-functional heater that the Tesla rep told me they were waiting on parts to fix. While I was there 7 more Model Ys were in for the same issue plus a Model X that had gullwing doors that would not close, a Model S that was missing a suspension bolt I think the owner said and nearly 20 Model 3s with various body panel fitment issues. When I asked how long it would take to get the Model Y heater fixed they figured probably 14-20 days since the part to fix it is backordered.
I can't say Ford is the best build quality, but having owned Ford trucks for nearly a decade it is a damn sight better than that. I've never been in a dealership anywhere that had 7 vehicles less than 3 months old that had failed heaters or air conditioners AT THE SAME TIME.
Another nice video. The lack of charging infrastructure is the one big thing that worries me. I wanted to get the Mach e gt, but I might wait a while to see if that gets any better.
It's obviously Gina get better lmao
Ford and Tesla just teamed up to announce mach-e will be able to use the Tesla network starting next year so it's getting better!
Fun video and test. Thanks for sharing.
We are researching these two cars for our next dog hauler, and your review exactly what we needed. We have used the term Monster Puppy for all of our Burners over the last 20 years. We were leaning towards the Y because of the interior dimensions for the BMD's. Thanks, well done!
Fords seats can be turned flat to have more space like the model Y and is 15k cheaper.. plus you get 7.5k in tax returns. Comparing the model Y makes no sense since it cost way more.. and I expect it to have more range and what not. They should’ve compared the model 3 since they’re about the same price.
You guys need to do a trip to the Swiss Bernese Alps, with your Bernese Mountain Dog!
Don‘t know if you have a channel thst shows it, but today there is the ski slalom in Adelboden, in the bernese alps...
"It's gonna pick up boost. You'll see!!!" 22:06 😂😂😂
Seriously, that's Chevy bolt charging speeds.
The turbo in the charger is going to finally spool up.
Nice video. I love Roman’s laugh when he dusts the competition, son or anyone else
BTW this "remembering your settings" feature is now available also in the new Skoda Octavia, a small family sedan/liftback (mostly VAG engineering)
it also applies your settings as you hop from one Octavia to another (obviously most useful in fleets)
Those Mustangs are going to sell like hotcakes.
yes, worse in every way possible except maybe ride comfortness
mach e UI and touch screen are worse than a 2012 tesla.
@@adityasahasranshu7503 that could be true but isn't a deal breaker as is the fit and finish on that Tesla will be for me.
@@taurussho86 my build quality is decent. It's definitely lacking from other brands. However my issue goes much further where all the little things break. Just had to have my 2 front door hinges replaced due to creaking. Car is 2 years old 10k miss and it's babied. I've had to have my main screen replaced at 1500 miles. Too many little issues
@@taurussho86 so u r ready to giveaway facilities like sentry mode for safety, dog mode for your pets, free over the air software updates, one of the most advanced air filteration systems, best in the market autopilot (not like the useless geo fenced system by waymo), best charging network in the world, standard panoramic glass sunroof, streaming services, & most importantly fart mode.
Tommy, back the Mach-E into the garage to see how long it takes Ford to fix it!
🤣 Savage
Ouch
That would be his real world test😛
I know! I have a new Ford Escape Hybrid and they can’t even fix a rattling subwoofer. They said, just turn you bass down to below the halfway mark. 🤦♂️
Only if not F-ound O-n R-oad D-ead first
Great review! Your dad looks like Doc Oc from Spiderman 2 with his sunglasses on 😂
This is what EV Testing should be about, pitting one similar model against another (even though the Mustang GT Mach E would have been a more Apples to Apples Comparison) Nice job of doing an Objective & Subjective variable test guys !
I love Colorado. What beautiful scenery!
21:51 The standard range battery only does up to 110kw. The extended range can do 150kw, though some people have seen it hit 160kw.
@@markplott4820 Although any Tesla can plug into a V3 Supercharger, only Long Range and Performance Model 3s running the latest firmware will be able to charge at 250 kW. Standard Model 3s will continue to charge at 150 kW, while the Model S and Model X have received a firmware update allowing 200-kW charging at V3 Superchargers. www.google.com/amp/s/www.motortrend.com/news/teslas-v3-supercharger-tested/amp/
@@awmustang that is from July 2019. I don't think there is a Tesla on the road running pre July 2019 software
The car geekiness of you both is fun to watch, not very often yiu see father and son just have same amount of passion for the same thing 👍🏼wish I'll have that bond when my son grows up 👍🏼
My favorite part was the dramatic charging scene lol ⚡️
Great video! A tie is a great result for Ford. To compete with the best on Ford's first, serious effort is outstanding.
no ..it was far from tie..look at it like that..a 100 year old so called great FORD could just cough up an that BS which cant even match 2012 Model S ...its a shame..they should have hold on to it and came out in next iteration...
@@sudeeptaghosh you know how companies make money? Selling cars. Money is how R&D can be justified.
Listen, no one can argue tesla makes the benchmark electric car right now from a technological standpoint BUT at the end of the day Tesla is a manufacturing company, they need to be able to produce good quality, reliable vehicles. Tesla was ranked last in initial quality by JD power in 2020. Who cares if their cars have the most range or are the fastest when customers are receiving cars without a nut on the ball joint or are having bumpers fall off on the freeway or the whole glass roof blows off on the freeway. Seriously? Those are incredible safety concerns that should not have EVER came out of the plant.
@@garrett_turbod I request you to never consider JD power creditable...but your points are valid....so for fact tesla is safest , most economical, most value for money , best technology, best charging network by far, only OTA for now for last 12 years but with some production line issues which they promptly fixes with most of time without you need to visit service center...would you agree on this?..if no what your counter argument.?
@@sudeeptaghosh I gave you three separate examples of issues which could literally cause the loss of life of someone. Let's use glass flying off the roof as an example. Please tell me how software could fix this?
And regarding JD power. They ranked each car brand on the market for issues per 100 vehicles. Tesla came in dead last with 250 issues per 100. That's astoundingly bad. It's actually embarrassing. And just think... One of those issues might be a missing nut on your ball joint.
You have fun driving your "safest car on the road".
@@garrett_turbod ohh you are the troll kind...anyways..nothing left to say..And yes Tesla will kill your favourite car maker ..not because of Tesla ..but because all of these are just big losers..already under 100s of billions of debt but cant stop paying divident..pathetic ..so called "great" American auto makers..ford 175 billion GM 126 billion ..national disgrace..dont worry none of them will lead innovation and progress in America it will be tesla and SpaceX...respect to all engineers..
This was a super good video - shows the real world application and differences between the cars, and also shows the relative strengths and weakness with charging infrastructure. Kind of backs up Tommy's video of a year or two ago on his sampling of various charging providers around the Boulder area. I support Roman's statement on Tesla's charging stations and that will be a huge consideration for me should I decide to go this route. Thanks guys. Keep up the great work. Now - let's take these two on a long distance vacation cross-country! Come visit us in San Diego!
With your awesome range test have you ever looked at getting one/talking to the Spark Charge guys that have that battery based EVSE for emergency charging? Would be cool if you guys could get your hands on one and test it out.
Great video! Honest, fair, balanced opinions on both sides. This is a must-see video for anyone deciding between these two cars
The Loveland Pass route is awesome. Worth taking the detour off I70 if time (and weather) permits.
I agree.
I really think you guys need to do top off to top off KWh/mile sorta thing at the end of these based on the charger KWh rather than going by what the cars are saying on these. Generally also sorta seemed maybe the ford was ahead on energy use until regen...but then ford didn't have snow tires for regen and there were complaints about ABS braking stopping the regen on the snow. So this seems to have left more questions than answers if one wants to know how they really stack up on efficiency if one is a bit suspect of the EPA test cycle and methods from each manufacturer.
The ford seemed better at "fuel economy" than the tesla... at least by the numbers they were mentioning when they went to charge
@@MiguelSanchez-os4xs No at the two stops they check "Battery %" the Ford was always further degraged, 50% down vs like 43% down for the Tesla. Then at last stop is was 70% down vs 56% down or something. But it's not clear if the % are even each realistic numbers? I suspect Tesla's is...but Ford and traditional guys are keeping it sorta ambiguous what that number means as they aren't using the whole capacity or allowing you to understand how much of it they let you use or what happens if you need a bit of extra range. I have a feeling they are very concerned about folks running out of charge show have very conservative miles left and charge left numbers they show the end users. Because of all this we need KWh/mi testing based on charger claims rather than anything to do with the charge.
This is the shortest range mach E though so it did percentage wise get pretty close on that aspect. The extended range could end up pretty close on range it seems. But have a feeling the efficiency disparity of the EPA numbers isn't necessarily as suggested if proper apples to apples testing on same day/route/conditions is done.
@@MiguelSanchez-os4xs It's basically how Ford and Tesla rate their vehicles. Tesla just dumps out the EPA numbers and that's it. Real world you will never get that range even in good temps and with ideal driving. You'd have to hypermile to get the full amount the onboard computer is telling you. Ford's range rating is probably much more accurate to the real world. It's the same idea to how Chevy didn't have to get the Trail Boss trim version of their Silverado EPA rated (which would inevitably lose some efficiency for the tires and lift), but did so anyway so customers have an accurate expectation as opposed to only getting the standard Silverado rating and never actually getting close to that. So, it seems like Tesla has a crazy range advantage but in real world use they are a lot closer, with Tesla still having an edge but not by a crazy amount.
@@sipher3516 I get you, I agree with you my grip is more with the hosts of the channel, maybe its in my head but I follow their content and from what it seems is that they talk down the ford so much and make the tesla seem soooo much better. If we are sticking to the point this is just in regards to fuel economy @The Fast Lane
great stuff guys, keep it coming
I really enjoyed your video comparisons. Great job Dad & Son duo 😀👍
But in the Tesla, if you put on the navigation you will get a very accurate range estimate...
Same with the Ford.
Came here to say the same
Isn't it a little unfair to compare one car to another that costs 50% more? ($42,500 vs 63,000.)
great reviews guys; 1st time watching your reviews and you guys did an outstanding job with the EV vehicles. Definitely thinking of purchasing one of these vehicles in the future; but as Dad says; you gotta have the charging infrastructure in place and solid 1st and foremost. Was looking at the Ford F-150 EV for 2022
The f-150 looks soo good and soo many good features.
I’m so glad that you guys made this video and that you and other journalists made the charging points. I’m sure it influenced Fords decision to find access to teslas charging network- which was a big factor in our purchase of a 23 Mach e. When it rolls out (in May I believe?) we will definitely have an account and use it when needed for our trips across Southern California, when we can’t home charge.
Great video, surprised I would probably go with the Ford simply due to cost and build quality. I mean I am a Ford fan but Tesla has always been a dream.
The Tesla rear hatch not opening was pretty hilarious to me.
Good ol’ Tesla quality control
Love this channel. Such fantastic content!
Nice touch having your phone covers match the colors of the cars!
Cold batteries have reduced charging protection built in to help reduce battery degradation over time. Had you used autopilot to navigate to the Tesla supercharger, the car would automatically precondition the battery and the charge rate would have trippled. Or you can turn it on manually.takes about a half hour when really cold to fully warm up/precondition and get max rate.
This is good way to show how limited these systems are. I want to go from A to B. I type in my destination. Then if i have to charge, i will charge where i find a good place (could be also just that someone needs to pee and then you start charging because there might be acharger there).
Today, BEV are far from simple and intuitive. To become main stream, this have to change. It should be easy to handle, especially in cold climate (below around -10 to -20 C). Also the infra structure have to be proper. Just look at how stiff a lot of those (yes, especially Tesla!) charge cables get in the cold.
@@Xanthopteryx Well, you're wrong. The normal workflow in the Tesla is to 1) put in your destination and then 2) go to the superchargers that the car wants you to go to. The car preconditions automatically, so for real-world road trips, the driver hardly thinks about it at all. I don't top off much, because I just go home and plug in. Overall, my experience driving a Tesla Model 3 is better than any gas car I've ever driven, and it is not even close.
@@Xanthopteryx The reality is EVs aren't going to be as convenient for long range cold weather driving but for warm weather states and for daily commutes as long as you charge at home range and charging and range shouldn't be an issue. So for a lot households having one EV and one ICE vehicle probably makes the most sense until technology improves and chagers are as universal as gas stations and pumps. I have to imagine the first gasoline cars had a slow adoption rate as gas stations didn't just pop up overnight (and they were expensive just like EVs).
@@benjamind7290 And then.. there might not be a super charger where you are going, or i do not want to stop at that place since i might want to eat first, or stop for another reason. There are many scenarios.
Have you ever had longer trips with a kid and family and animals? And fit that into good locations to stop, and adapt to upcoming situations like when the kid sleeps just when you had planned to take lunch and so on?
My diesel car is outstanding. On longer trips i can go 1000-1200 km on one tank (60 liter). No need to consider where to fuel and to have that in the plan too. And that is good because especially when it comes to BEV, you need to stop for a while to charge, and at NO PLACE where we stop to eat or rest are there any chargers (not even a single 230 outlet).
And i have to find a place suitable for kid and animal and, well, the family, so we all can cope with the 8 hour trip.
It is SO versatile to have an ICE car. Takes five minutes to fuel up (if you take it slow), have outsanding range, easy to fuel up if they get empty, easy to prep for in case of an electricity blackout (just have a few cans of diesel at home in case, or then just transport some diesel in a suitable way) and more.
What do you do when the power goes out? How do you charge? Or when you arrive at a charging station with two chargers and ten cars waiting to charge?
Or if you get stuck because of an accident and the power runs out?
@@db4z09 I would like to have a car with a battery that takes you like, let's say 100 to maximum 150 km (in REALITY! and winter). And then a small range extender that kicks in to generate electricity.
This will make a car go 1000 km, without wasting expensive environmentally bad batteries and driving around with all that extra weight (that also is bad for the environment). And the range extender can be VERY efficient, since it only have one job to do: Go at a constant RPM connected to a generator.
And then you fuel it up with HVO100.
Then i am all in NOW!
95% of all peoples normal driving is solved by battery and the rest by the extender. No need to have all those expensive and areal intensive chargers everywhere.
“thErE ArE nO qUaliTy ContrOl IsSueS” -Tesla owners
1 min. Into video... Tesla’s hatchback gets stuck upon opening 😂
How cold was it there again?
My family has some ebikes, and my dad and I decided to bike up a mountain pass near Sisters, Oregon. We went uphill until we have 2/5ths the battery left and then turned around, and got back down with... 2/5ths of the battery left.
It was about 30 miles.
Forbes just linked this video in their article about the Model Y (new range) vs. Model 3 vs. Mach-E! Legit.
What was the total kWh used for the two vehicles on the trip? What percentage of their EPA range did they achieve when adjusting for how many miles were actually driven? Obviously cold weather and grade are some of the worst case conditions for EV range but I would like to know how close their actual range would have been if the mach e had the bigger battery pack.
One thing for sure, if I spend $12 to fully charge TESLA model Y, to fully charge Mach-e will cost $26. That's more than double. Mach-e is very inefficient car.
@@peterp4753 That makes no sense. They have the same size battery so the cost difference must be due to the cost per kWh based on the charging network, not the efficiency of the vehicle. Otherwise, using the same charger network the cost to charge would be identical.
@@zmanmd1641
Mach-E Long Range will get 88 Kw battery with range of 270 miles on the single charge.
Model Y have 75 Kw battery with 326 miles of range in a single charge. So Tesla have 15% less battery to be charged with 20% more range.
Tesla model Y gets 250 Kw charging.
Mach-E gets 150 Kw charging.
Tesla gets 150 miles of range in 10 minutes charging.
Mach-E will get 58 miles of RANGE in 10 minutes charging.
Do the math !!
@@peterp4753 Tesla is really good at the EPA tests whereas everyone else is more conservative. It is a matter of setting expectations. In real world driving the differences are not that great. As you saw in this video, neither car came close to their max charging rates. Also neither car were close to the stated range. However, the Ford was closer to its projections, so its owners would not have expectations they could not meet. The same issue with the Model S P100D vs the Porsche Taycan Turbo S. On paper the ranges are not close. However in tests they are very close. You don't drive on paper, you drive in the real world. As the fine print states, your mileage may vary.
@@peterp4753 where did you get $26 from lmao 🤣 and where did you charge it cause you just got ripped off
Great video. I’m loving my 2018 Model 3; easily the best car I’ve ever owned. Nice to see more EV options now.
I would love to know the consumption on your way back to the start. With the Tesla which now have a heated battery (after charging) it can use that heat to heat the cabin and spend much less energy. The different in charge was 14% on the way there, I bet the difference on the way home was 20-25% in charge.
I'm glad you guys showed the recharge amount heading down from the tunnel. I do this drive all the time and recently picked up a Highlander hybrid that barely has to touch the gas engine on the way down to Golden, I was always curious how much energy a full electric car would recapture on the same drive. Cheers
That was fair. Good work.
One of one of my favorite road trips used to be Dallas to Taos and back in our F-150 Supercrew . Dogs had the back seat and the bed was packed with gear. Neither one of these vehicles is up to that task. Road trip = petrol.
GARBAGE ! If you drive a TESLA and use the SUPERCHARGER network and hotel destination charging it is a better roadtrip. The world's best road trips have been done in TESLAs including around the world.
@@honesty_-no9he Nice to here from you, Elon.
This was an awesome video. I was hugely interested in Tesla but all the QC issues - and your video about the rear door not working, highlighting complexity where it is not necessary - scared me away. I would have considered the Mach E but the infrastructure isn’t good enough here in NJ (near shore areas)... I ended up going with an Outback XT. Hopefully in 10 years things have changed and there are more options. The standard CCS is hugely important for everyone instead of the old Chademo style one. No objections that the Supercharger Network is the best, but I wish they had a CCS to Tesla adapter for the US market for more charging options. If I had to choose today I would pick the Ford, despite the charging problems since you’re using another company’s network. Electrify America is pretty cheap here at the local shopping center - $0.31 per kWh at 350 kWh. Perfect for my personal needs.
Also I would want the AWD version and now we are talking close to $55-60k before the tax credit.
Wow... this really helped drive home the message that we still don't have a good way to compare charging rate, calculate range, or compare capabilities between electric cars!
"there's never been a Mustang with 5 doors" I guess that's true... But there was the 80s "Ford tempo" Mustang. The MachE is better than that.... That's for sure.
Only real issue I have with the Mach-E is that it is made in Mexico. Products made there tend to not be of the highest quality and durability. Otherwise it’s not bad for a first try. Too bad they are still at least 5-7 years behind Tesla though.
The Mustang GL, with a straight six. Had the misfortune of that being my car in the late 80s.
@@JHuffPhoto According to their scores it tied with the Tesla and they are just getting started. And this was not the long distance version like the Tesla. I think that they are off to a good start.
@@billstoys8324 yeah. Keep believing that. They want Ford to keep sending them cars so they can’t be too hard on the Stang. Actually I think it is pretty good for a first try. It’s just that they are about 5-7 years behind Tesla in development. Not to mention the charging network. Competition is good for us all.
@@JHuffPhoto And Tesla is almost 100 years behind in building cars. With all the technology that exist now, 5-7 years can be cut in more than half. Competition is awesome.
Charging is everything, I would never go more than 50miles from my house in anything that relies on a 3rd party charger...holy crap, so much anxiety it would give me. Day to day it might be fine...but they are still just too expensive and when I want to travel long distances, I don't want to stop for 60+ minutes every 200 or so miles. One day hopefully, but just not there for me yet
I drive a Bolt and my success rate (defined by able to charge on the first try) at EA stations is 50%. Yeah, I've always found one that worked so I've never been stranded, but still...
Also, a cold battery charges much slower than a warm battery. Even though you drove for awhile, it doesn't mean the battery warmed up. Tesla will warm the batter as you near a supercharger if you're navigating to that supercharger.
50% is a scary figure. The us needs to invest more in this infrastructure...EA will soon be done with its volkswagon penance.
Somebody may have already pointed this out but at 10:33, the statement "the Tesla does not know I'm going down the back side of the mountain" is wrong. If you are using the trip function on the center screen, it does take into account the elevation changes. Here's a quote from Tesla "“The calculation is an estimate based on driving style (predicted speed, etc.) and environmental factors (elevation changes, weather, etc.).” See the article electrek.co/2019/01/24/tesla-range-prediction-algorithm-temperature-data/ for more detail.
I own a model Y. For the most part I love it. I wish it had a normal dashboard. Ford did a really nice job for their first attempt at an electric car. I hope they do well with it.
13:28 that lift off / regen braking engaging the ABS.... isn't what caused Richard Hammond to wreck in the Rimac?
Adjustable regen gain on the streering wheel or from the instrument panel would be a nice addition, although with the general public's skill level, I doubt we'll see something like race cars with driver adjustable ABS/TCS on the fly. I can already see the legal implications.
How much energy did each car use? Did I miss that or did you forget to tell us? The EPA numbers are only a crude approximation, both these cars covered the same ground at the same speed at the same time, your actual power consumption for the whole trip is the interesting number.
Wish you had both reported about how well the navigation and trip computers did on calculating range remaining at destination. The couple times it was mentioned in the video, it seemed they both were pretty close in the number they were estimating.
I would want to know how many miles I could travel per Kwh. That would be the best way to compare efficiency across different models.
I’m ready to see what the GT version can do.
Would be really nice to have percentages and times/mileages on the screen when talking about them. The numbers can be a lot to manage when discussing two vehicles !
Nice video and findings. If the efficiency of these cars drops significantly in Colorado, I wonder what will happen up here in Alberta Rockies. Interesting. I guess I will stick to my IC engine for now.
When I need to charge I always use superchargers. I only plug into other chargers if they just 'happen to be there' at a parking lot. Non supercharger chargers are never part of trip plan.
Or your house
What really stands out in this video is that...we really need more snow out here!
Good comparison, can't wait to see you test Rivian on that mountain pass. Tesla should watch out in 2021 i would expect mach e to fall way behind the Y. Love that energy calculations on the mach e. Once I almost got stuck in my older S because it gave me way way too much range estimate. Its definitely better to be conservative when it comes to range. Great video guys, I was looking forward to seeing mommy of your pup 😎
Really great and informative video.
What an absolutely beautiful countryside you guys have! As a Los Angelino, I never really get to see vista like that.
So glad to see that the Mach-E is shaping up to the a real competitor to Tesla. Ford just needs to kick Electrify America in the butt to get their chargers to work better, and be more plentiful, and the Mach-E will be an unqualified hit!
hmmm, we have seen tests of the tesla in winterland norway and the trick is the pre heating of the tesla battery with adding the supercharger station in the navigation it will be happen automatically and u should get nearly full power from the beginning. I think this trick is not possible with the Mustang at all! Sof if you plan to go on a long trip their is clearly no competitor to the tesla. btw this known problem of cold batteries is not a problem of the charging station, except for faulty ones, we have seen some charging station in norwy that have problem with the temperature sensor in the connector leading to wrong information and reduced power, in this case it helps to put the connector for some time on your heated seat and sit yourself on it :)
I LOVED this!! You guys are incredible!!
I think you should have mentioned repair/dealer network as well.
The tax credit is great, but you need to do a nation wide dealer mark up average.
You can certainly order one for around invoice if you check around the high volume dealers
@@mattbrew11 not in Canada
@@robintaylor1490 sucks for you I guess?
@@mattbrew11 no not really, I'll be getting my Cybertruck in a year.
@@robintaylor1490 So your point is basically invalid then.
Fairly heavy traffic!? You must be unfamiliar with the New York metro area traffic. Very good video. Thanks!
Great videos as always :)
Recording the 'received' voice of the walky talkies is a lot harder to hear.
Keep up the great work!