It’s worth mentioning that the Bene Gesserit have an incredible degree of control over their bodies. Paul is in a much better position to handle his injuries than Feyd-Rautha was.
I intentionally did not find out anything about the second part having read the book. So it tripped me out that Christopher Walken played the emperor, because of Fatboy slim's weapons of Choice music video. th-cam.com/video/wCDIYvFmgW8/w-d-xo.htmlsi=dDJFhAnOdlkdrh80
I know right??? The fuckin autistic nature of people that can't keep their mouths shut. I literally read the books out of fear of being spoiled due to the popularity of part 1 when it came out, and holy shit am I glad I did because there are so many fucking spoilers everywhere, on social media, youtube. People get a dopamine hit spoiling stuff for others and then are like "You know the books have been out for ages though right??" It's like yeah and?? No one gives a fuck that you know what's going to happen next. Jesus Chroist.....
Not sure if you were talking to me but everything in my comment happened in these two movies not future books. I assume anybody watching reactions has already seen the 2nd movie. He mentions in the tent with his mother that he saw visions of people dying in his name under the atreides banner in this holy war. But that he saw a path through which is when he started talking about marrying the emperor's daughter to let kynes. He did not want to go south he fought that with everything he had until he drank the water. His mother and the Bennegesuit on the other hand wanted that war and as soon as his plan failed his mother excitedly told his sister they were getting their holy war in the last scene.
@@ChannelSee1 Nah the Star Wars folks are busy trying to launch tv shows and movies that nobody wants to see. Furthermore, those tv shows and movies are being put together by tone deaf hacks who go out of there way to insult the fandom.
The final Atredies slave in the arena isn't the doctor its Landville, an Atredies general. He's the one in the first movie that says "Shields!" just before the ship opens its doors when it arrives on Arrakis and also he's the one that tells Stilgar "Hey, Stop right there!." When Stilgar is walking up to Leto to met him for the first time.
30:32, no the Kwitzach Haderach (KW) is not the same as the Lisan al Gaib. The KW is the secret breeding program by the Bene Gesserit to create a super being - a male Bene Gesserit. Because Bene Gesserit are only women (i.e. XX chromosomes) they can only access the genetic memories of female ancestors and prior Reverend Mothers. Paul is definitely the KW as he is the culmination of several generations of cross breeding. When he takes the Water of Life later he will be able to access male and female ancestral memories and prior Reverend Mothers. Had Paul been born a girl (i.e. Pauline Atreides), she would have been married to Feyd-Rautha. Then their son would have been the KW. However, because Paul's mother chose to have a son the Kwitzach Haderach was born a generation early. The Fremen are not aware of the KW program at all. In fact, nobody outside of the Bene Gesserit knows about it. The Lisan al Gaib is a false messianic prophecy that the Missionara Protectiva division of the Bene Gesserit implanted in the Fremen people. This false prophecy was meant as a means to control the Fremen people en masse. It is also a tool that a Bene Gesserit could use to get individual Fremen to do whatever is necessary like Jessica is doing now.
That makes me think profecies are kinda paradoxal: what’s the difference between a false and a real profecy? Can anyone disprove a profecy before it happens? And when it does, well, isn’t it true?
@@Nicolau_Flamel Well now you're touching on the deeper philosophical aspects of Dune. Everything in Dune has double meanings, much like how the Baron explains to Dr. Yueh "I promised you may be free and that you can join your wife... so join her" before cutting off his head.. it's the same case with the Kwizats Haderach. Paul is that, he IS it and more and it's actually not at all what the Bene Gesserit imagined things would go at all. The books echo that phrase "Be-careful what you wish for because it might come true". Sometimes what we believe to be messiah or paradise can actually be the devil or hell in disguise. we just don't realize it until it's stomping us in the balls because we are short-sighted egoistic creatures. What we believe to be paradise is entirely subjective and contextual to what we're going through in the present moment. All the -ism's that existed throughout the 20th century promised humanity paradise, on paper they're all beautiful and sound great, but in reality became death sentence to millions of people for years to come. We see it at the end of part 2. Dune contains the most valuable resource in the universe, but the Fremen want to terraform Arrakis into a Green Paradise. You can't do that unless you get the entire galaxy (Landsraad) off of it's back. Absolutely no one would allow that happen. So in order for the Lisan Al Gaib to fulfill his purpose, what must he do?
@@Nicolau_Flamel Because there's hardly ever any mention of god or gods in the Dune books as far as a metaphysical being. There's never any "true" miracles or spirits seen or anything like that. There's religions, but Frank Herbert thought religions were for suckers and manipulative, and showed it in the books. He wasn't wrong.
@@ChannelSee1 Also the shields cause a small nuclear explosion when targeted by a laser based weapon, to my knowledge. So that whole Harkonnen squad would have been wiped easier and quicker.
@@LetsGetitBoahshame Anakin was the victim of a trilogy which has some of the iffiest writing ever put in a film. At least revenge of the sith wasn’t utterly terrible though
@@LetsGetitBoahshow Dany. There’s no denying the complexities of her book counterpart. I feel like if we’re going to make comparisons between all three, Danys book version should take precedence
@@Grimmreaper007 yh he’s not the first to be “the chosen one” but almost all similar characters (anakin/vader, harry potter, daenerys) that came after dune were based on paul’s.
I honestly dont understand how people arent noticing the "chosen one from a desert planet who's not quite a chosen one after all" theme between dune and starwars lol
When they ride the sandworms, they pull up their plating, exposing the tender flesh underneath. The worms instinctively roll the open "wounds" up to the top to avoid getting sand in them. The worms travel in a relatively straight line, and stay on the surface because of the wounds. They really don't even feel the Fremen on their "back." When they want off, they just remove the hooks and the sandworm dives into the sand. The Fremen just hop off.
Don't forget, that it is dangerous to release the worm too early. He can become mad and attack people, cause he clearly can feel vibrations so close to him. So fremen can get off the worm then he is already too tired to pursue them.
There are rings of openings called spiracles under the ridges that act like passive nostrils, allowing the worm to breathe. When the hooks pull up on the ridges, the worm rolls and rises to prevent sand from getting in.
Dune was the pioneer of sci-fi culture. Star War borrowed the idea of Dune and other sci-fi book to create a world of their own, but Star War was also a classic though
@@theoph1932 ...Foundation has entered the chat ...John Carter of Mars has entered the chat ...I, Robot has entered the chat ...Galactic Patrol has entered the chat ...War of the Worlds has entered the chat ...Frankenstein has entered the chat
To answer the question from the title: yes and no. The difference is that Paul knows exactly what's coming ... and still feels helpless to avoid his fate. Paul is simultanously the most powerful and most powerless man in the known universe, his prophetic powers can't help him.
The bene gesserit didn’t intend to have jessica marry feyd rautha. He was most likely a toddler back then. They just didn’t want her to have a son because of it’s potential and how it didn’t ally with their breeding program. The bene Gesserit have many prospects of people who could be the kwisatz haderach, and implanted the prophecy in many differently cultures including the freman. Lady margot saw potential in feyd to be a kwisatz haderach for them when feyd mentioned that he had a dream about her.
The chosen one trope is a very popular one that has existed for millennia but Paul Herbert is one of the most prominent modern examples of turning it on its head. People should be more skeptical of charismatic leaders who promise to fix everything. In fact, in the books Herbert writes that Paul reflects on leaders like Hitler which makes sense given that this book was published in 1965.
A realization that struck me like lightning is that House Stark from Game of Thrones basically had a similar story arc with House Atreides and each of the Stark children receiving a fraction of Paul's story: - taught by foreign fighting masters - received top education - recieved secret assassin training - father sent into a far away place as a political trap - exiled - joined natives and learned their ways - died - resurrected - gained power to peek through time - ascended to monarchy There's another characteristic of Paul that is similar to a Stark child that i will not say here because it's potentially a spoiler for Part Three
Dune is a bit like Game of Thrones in Space. The Atreides are like the Starks, they rule through example (like Duke Leto risking his life and that of his son when he rescued the men on the spice harvester) and have a strong sense of honour, the Harkonnen are like the Boltons, enemies of the Atreides and ruling through fear, and the Corrino (the emperor´s family) being like the Targaryen, with a rule based on military might, with Sardaukar super soldiers instead of Dragons.
The water of life is basically hyper concentrated spice. Only Bene Gesserit can nullify the toxic effects. Since spice expands consciousness, this opens up ‘other memories’ for the Bene Gesserit, which essentially means they now have all the memories of all previous Reverend Mothers. It has a similar effect on Paul, by opening up and clarifying his presence, his ability to see the future. Because Jessica was pregnant, her baby (Alia) also now possesses other memories, and is essentially a fully conscious reverend mother in womb. This is what the Bene Gesserit call Abomination.
@1:19:16 Can't expect the Emperor to have a larger role! Thing is, nature of that character is he's an old man who's become irrelevant. Plain as that. He's a relic, whose biggest moment in this story will be bending his knee, to kiss the ring of a man he killed out of petty jealousy. For such a character, you need an actor so good with just his face, and few words, that still an audience could believe that for a long, long time, he's been the most important man in the room. Walken's exactly the talent.
Basically all the White Saviour narratives in which the saviour actually turns out to be the villian, were inspired by Dune. Stars Wars in particular borrowed so heavily from Frank Herbert that a lot of it is almost plagiarism. Great reaction guys, hope you enjoy Part 3 when it comes out in 2027 (or thereabouts). By the way, what you noticed about Part 2 is precisely why book aficionados get really angry at people who say it's just another White Saviour story. That trope was already tired in 1965, and Frank Herbert explicitly set out to subvert it and sound a warning about trusting charismatic leaders and messianic figureheads.
Plagiarism...nah. They're called archetypes--a recurrent symbol or motif in literature, art, or mythology. Frank Herbert's best move in Dune was definitely subverting the white savior trope, and the savior trope in general, but it's ironic how few people see it that way nowadays, with all the movie viewers wholeheartedly embracing Paul and his authoritarian conversion.
Fun fact, the Asian prisoner you guys thought was the doctor from the first movie was actually the guy who told Leto(Paul’s father) in the first movie to lower the windows because the sun is getting to high and the heat would be too powerful, it’s a quick short scene in the first movie but I recognize him
24:37, Chani might not be 7 months long by the end of the movie. But a lot of fans do think she is pregnant. In the books the scarf she wears in her hair symbolizes a Fremen woman who has given birth to a son. The director Denis Villaneuve says that within the movie, it symbolizes Chani's love for Paul. As long as she wears it in her hair she is in love with Paul. Notice where it is by the end - it's no longer on her head. In the first Dune book by the time of the final battle with the Imperial troops, Chani had already given birth to a son by Paul.
a couple of reasons why the harkonens didn't activate their shields are one shields attract worms and make them angry and two they had lasguns on them and if you hit an active shield with a lasgun there is a chance of a nuclear explosion of a variable size
The maker hooks lift the scales, exposing sensitive skin underneath. The worm doesn't go under because sand would get in the now exposed sensitive areas. Raised and lowered in opposite directions, the rider can turn the worm.
Not a spoiler. This is from book one. Alia is considered an abomination because she received the ancestral memories in the womb. This is taboo because they think you need to have your own personality before you gain ancestral memories otherwise you get lost in other personalities and lose your "self".
I'm glad y'all enjoyed the movie. Thanks for the reaction. Just wanted to share ---Kwisatz Haderach is a male Bene Gesserit who can see the past and the future. It's not the same thing as the Lisan-el-Gaib, who is a Fremen prophesied Messiah. The fact that Paul became a Kwisatz Haderach, gaining power over past and future visions, allows him to manipulate the Fremen religion and hope in prophesied Messiah to put himself in a future thats beneficial to him. It's all made-up and planned, and Paul, seeing the future, allows him to ride the wave of the moment. The Bene Gesserit wanted to actually have Jessica give birth to a girl first and not a boy like Paul. That way, they marry off that girl to Feyd Rautha, who would have given them the boy that would eventually become the Kwisatz, but Jessica fell in love with Duke Leto and gave birth to a boy (Paul) instead.
gonna say that when paul looks down at the end when he says take them to paradise is sad af. Basically he knew what he actually meant was go attack them and kill thousands of people. In the books this was the Jihad he feared most.
That Atreides soldier that Feyd Rautha was fighting was not Doctor Yueh. That was Lanville. You hear Duncan yell his name in the first movie after Duncan landed his fighter on Caladan. You also see him among the Atreides soldiers when the family arrives on Arrakis.
Awesome to see your reaction to the "Silence!" scene, it is one of my favorite moments in the book. And in the book it is even more impressive since Paul says: "Silence! Where is your Gom Jabbar now?" (GJ being the poison needle, since if you remember the Reverend Mother told Paul to be silent when she was testing him with the box)
20:34 "Why don't they use that on the helicopter?" Fair question. The reason they don't use lasers on shields is because both the shield AND the laser gun would explode like a mini-nuke.
In the book Paul and Jessica are on Arrakis for a longer time before the emperor shows up. Paul's sister is born and Paul and Chani have a son together. His son is killed by the Harkonnens and Paul's sister is 2 years old by the time the emperor shows up on Dune.
Lanville, the one who fought Feyd-Rautha, was one of the Duke Guards and in the first Film one of the Atreides Commanders. He sat in the Council of Duke Leto.
Yes, everyone borrowed from Frank Herbert. George Martin's whole feudal house system was taken straight out of Dune among many other things. George Lucas was a Dune book nerd who loved the idea of a "dark hero" and created Star Wars a decade or so later. glad you guys enjoyed it :)
Also, they reason they don’t use the laser guns on things with shields is because it will cause a nuclear reaction on both ends of the laser beam (it’s explained in the books). So it’s not good for anyone. That’s why they’ve went back to using swords in this world. They only use the guns when they can.
Anakin, Daeneris and Paul Atreides have little to do with each other. Paul is not a failure like Anakin. He chooses to stop being the kwisatz haderach because he understands how knowing the future traps you in your own destiny. Paul does save his loved ones, while Anakin doesn't and needed to be saved by Luke. Paul did what he had to do up to a certain point when life had no meaning without Chani and when he understood what it means to be God. He is also scared of the Golden Path, which he refuses. And for that he will be partially despised by his own son. Daenerys, at least in the show, is instead a Mary Sue and kinda crazy in the end. She is similar to Anakin and Paul in that she kills a lot of innocent people but she does not regret it like Paul does - and Anakin does not.
I have read that Denis Villaneuve started storyboarding this movie back in the 90s. Just like Peter Jackson and LOTR, the best movies are often passion projects. Now can’t wait to see what he does with Dune Messiah.
Including house Atreides and house Harkonnen there are 12 known great houses. Atreides, Harkonnen, Corrino, Fenring, Ginaz, Halleck, Metulli, Moritani, Ordos, Vernius, Richese, and Nebiro.
Paul and Feyd were first cousins. The Baron is Paul's grandfather, Feyd and Rabbon are the Barons nephews meaning that they are the sons of his brother making Jessica their aunt. Therefore they are first cousins.
37:40, this is Lady Margot Fenring and she is just visiting Giedi Prime. Also Margot is the Bene Gesserit wife of Count Hasimir Fenring. Count Fenring is the best friend and confidant of the Emperor. He appears in the book at some pivotal points but his scenes for the movie were left on the cutting room floor . Count Fenring appears to be a foppish type of guy that many don't take seriously beyond his close ties to the Emperor. Secretly, Fenring is a cold blooded assassin and works as the Emperor's hitman. In hand to hand combat, he is on par with Feyd and Paul. But he also has the skills to end targets though more covert means. Were it not for a genetic abnormality to makes him sterile, Fenring could have been a Kwitzach Haderach. On a positive side, Hasimir and Margot do have love for one another and he supports her Bene Gesserit shenanigans. In the book he present at this gladiatorial match with Margot and was fully aware of what she planned to do with Feyd.
Imagine being George Lucas, and having a blank cheque (because he owned the chequebook) to create a trilogy focusing on the epically tragic fall of Anakin Skywalker. Then he goes and creates something barely a few notches above Doctor Who. What a startling lack of imagination, skill, and ambition. And SW fans actually defend it all.
That's what success brings you, surrounded by yes-men. Actually, George Lucas did a pretty good imitation of Emperor Shaddam with the Prequels, didn't he?
Just to give you the 411 on why during the scene where you see the ornithopter exploding, why didn't they use the Lazgun (which is that blue light that you see destroying the harvester) is because if you shoot a lazgun add an object that is protected by a Shield there will be a thermonuclear explosion which would kill everybody. I know that's something they don't explain in the movie, it's from the book.
Jessica is the real hero of this story, the woman who knew Leto was the man that would give her the seed to create Paul who would go on to start the path to ensure life for humanity.
Very satisfying reaction. Good elements in the commentary: Chani coming comically close to saying her secret name is Zendaya, more cowbell, rich story in spite of narrative haste, etc. I love how Stilgar goes full LIFE OF BRIAN on Paul.
Something that's not explained in the movie that you see where Paul rides the worm, why doesn't the worm go under the sand again? The reason it doesn't go back under the sand is because as you see in the movie Paul lifts up one of his scales. By doing that the worm won't dive into the sand because the sand will get underneath and irritate its skin. This is how the Freman can ride the worms.
Stilgar's change from competent rational leader to obsessed fanatic was the real thread of the story. Looking past his comical behavior shows how tragic his change was. It gets even worse in later books. Having read them, I can't find any humor in his actions, just regret.
Agreed about the thinking on this film - its deep, the david lynch film uses actual quotes from the books and they are DEEP - I needed to watch it like 4 times before I even had a clue what was going on - These new ones are easier for people new to the universe to understand as translated into something people who have not read the book can get straight away and the bits you need to know etc What a film - Lisan Al Giab!
44:10, dude this is mild compared to what the Baron Vlad Harkonnen was doing to Feyd in the books. Vladmir didn't let things like blood relations get in the way of his kicks. He and Feyd have a seriously twisted relationship of abuse, assassination attempts and punishment. Some of the things the Baron makes Feyd do to stay in his good graces I can't even describe for fear of getting flagged. Also you keep mentioning all of the female servants surrounding Vladmir, don't be so sure they actually are female. The Baron shall we say likes his playthings young and a bit more masculine. The director has done a good job of tip toeing around how big of a freak this dude is.
Yeah it's...interesting to read. I love the movies and books both and their impact on sci-fi culture as a whole. Unfortunately, Frank Herbert was apparently very homophobic, and Vladimir was his designated "queer menace" character in the books. Morbidly obese, a shameless pedophile, and all around obscenely ruthless character that cared nothing for age or relation, and Herbert wanted to make it abundantly clear. Thankfully Denis Villeneuve changed his character to something more admissable in the movies. Still evil and gluttonous, and brief hints of an odd relationship with Feyd Rautha, but nothing blatant. Such a fantastic director.
I don't care what Frank's personal opinions were because the Baron's creepy side in the book emphasized he doesn't view people as people but objects to be used. Not making the Baron a gay PDFile is just good marketing strategy since the LGBTQ brigade would pitch a fit. Also not calling Paul's holy war a jihad was intentional because the Islamists would flip out too. Good marketing, but cowardly changes to avoid controversy. Oh well. They get the decadent side of him by putting him in water to be a juxtaposition the fremen holding water as rare and sacred.
I can see the similarities in the arc between Paul Daenerys and Anakin. They all had good intentions to begin with and then through people twisting them and pushing them made them turn into what they are. In the book, the small path that Paul saw through was what he tried in this movie. He hoped winning the battle for Arakeen and dethroning the emperor, marrying his daughter, would end it. As soon as he knew that the landsraad families that were hovering above were not going to accept his ascendancy. He knew that that path had closed. The holy war was going to happen and millions of people were going to die under the atreides banner.
Paul could have avoided Jihad/Holy War entirely if he had chosen not to join the Fremen from the start. When Paul joins them the Fremen begin to see him as their messiah so the Jihad/Holy War becomes inevitable because their faith can't be changed.
Nope. His arc is more that of a protagonist in an ancient Greek drama. He's a victim of circumstance (the Greeks would have called it a "curse of the gods", knowing there is more than one way to be their "chosen one") who is destroyed by the evil he has unleashed, being able to see it all in advance but unable to do anything about it.
“Why didn’t you use those things on the helicopter ?”. This one is actually a REALLY good question, as it is not told in the movies, but it is in the books : a laser encountering a shield triggers a nuclear explosion, which fallouts are unpredictable…
138 or so great houses. Paul now can bridge space and time. Like the huge space guild ships, he can be in two places at once and open the way for anything and everything to move from one place to another at once. He destroys the spice, then he is the only way anyone can be allowed to travel. Then he causes that deep space travel to happen.
I think one of the biggest reasons why there's such a divide among audience's response to Paul is because his archetype isn't nearly as familiar with in pop culture. Paul is not a hero, or villain or even anti-hero. Paul is a tragic hero, and that's a very different thing than most of the discourse surrounding the character and ultimately what Herbert is trying to communicate within his work. The whole "Paul is good guy vs. Paul is bad guy it just depends on your perspective" perspective misses the point. Paul is very deliberately written as the Mary Sue of Mary Sues; he's raised from birth as a mentat, an order that represents all of the sacred aspects of the masculine. He's surrounded by alpha males who love and guide him. He's trained in the Bene Gesserit way by his mother, representing all the cunning power of the feminine. Paul's mother loves him and his father so much that she disobeys a sacred order of her own sisterhood. Paul is raised as a ducal heir and learned in the ways or war and politics. He then goes on to live among the most robust, resourceful and pragmatic people in all the imperium and eventually becomes their legitimate ruler after succeeding in all of their rituals and besting all comers. At this point the missionaria protectiva is moot, Paul has fulfilled all of the prophecies that no other person in the imperium ever could, he literally is That Guy and proves it. And that's all before becoming the goddamn Kwisatz Hadderach, the supreme being who can see in all places at once. The most capable human to ever live. And yet, even this supreme being is unfit to wield such monopolized power because no one is. The jihad is inevitable, violence sings its own song. This understanding of power is demonstrated in all the surrounding characters and subplots. The Bene Gesserit have the hubris to think they can control humanity and even the Kwisatz if they just patiently plan in the shadows long enough, the Fremen think they are ready to fulfill their dream of the "green paradise" which they do, but at great destructive cost to themselves, and so on. Herbert once stated that his favorite president was Richard Nixon as Nixon taught the American people to distrust presidents.
"Herbert once stated that his favorite president was Richard Nixon as Nixon taught the American people to distrust presidents." Unfortunately such lessons only last a few generations. Seeing the rise of fascism once again proves this as well.
12:33 they don't make the distinction but any female group of people with access to spice can make reverend mothers. That's basically just the bg and the fremen tho. The fremen reverend mothers are called wild reverend mothers or sayyadina "friend to the prophet". That's a real Islamic term tho so I understand why they took out words like that and turned jihad to holy war. That reverend mother was not bg
Bless you both for the “more cowbell” cut. First time I’ve seen it in a reaction and I was starting to lose hope. Y’all truly are the Lisan Al Gaib’s 🙏🙌💯
Frank herbert who wrote dune basically took the "chosen one" trope, gave it a twist how our future could look like with the rise of AI and evolotiun of the human body and society and flipped it by saying not every charismatic leader is a good guy. people didnt like it and misunderstood it and he wrote dune messiah to get the message across that Paul is not a Hero. in the first chapter he compares his bodycount with hitler and dschingis kahn. dennis just put more of the warning signs in the first 2 movies. billions die because of his egoistical choices. There are no good guys but damn is it an amzining story that makes you think while reading. hard to get that across as a film thats why since the 1960's everybody said its "unfilmable" but kudos to you guys. beside the asian doctor/atreides warrior bit
Look I wasn't fully paying attention in that scene and I'm not the best with faces or names either lol. I also couldn't remember what the doctor looked like, when I looked back off screen I was like "oh yea that's obviously not him" But yes, the 2nd part definitely showed us Paul isn't actually all that "good". I personally love characters with shades of gray, I find them more realistic. No one is ever all good or all bad, we all balance the two. I'm excited to see what the third movie will yield. Thanks for watching! - Cam
By the way the kiss between Feyd and Vladimir is not a "Harkonnen" thing its because Vladimir has a sexual relationship with Feyd and favors him over Rabban
It's not explicitly explained in the movie as it is in the book so you guys can't know this If a shield is hit by a laser both the shield generator and the laser blow up spectacularly. 30:42 Chini is riding Paul's worm. 1:12:38 Chini is bout to Über out
Yeah. You should say “are Anakin’s or Daenerys’s arcs the same as Paul’s ?”. The book Dune was written in 1965, just as a reminder… So please give back to Caesar…
"PAUL ATREIDES’ ARC THE SAME AS ANAKIN AND DAENERYS?! " Given Dune was published way before either of those, the question should be is ANAKIN AND DAENERYS ARC THE SAME AS PAUL's?!
35:39, someone may have mentioned this but in the books the Harkonnen's are family of red heads. But I guess Villaneuve wanted them to look so different because of what Giedi Prime is like. The planet is an ecological nightmare as the Harkonnen family has over industrialized it for centuries. So with little to no natural sunlight they are pretty pale. Chef's kiss to the director for giving them a black sun that washes out almost all color in outdoor shots.
@ChannelSee1 Those outdoor scenes on Giedi Prime were filmed in infrared, not black and white. The difference on a big screen is stark. If you can still find it near you, I urge you to go and see it in person. It's magnificent in IMAX in particular.
There are lots of sad things to contemplate. Like expecting everyone to share your opinions. Or other's experiences being judged as "shallow". Some people get inspiration from experiences that others consider not worthy. They can change the World for the better because of that experience. But no!......... To you, is "sad".
This movie fucking slapped. One of the best movies I’ve ever seen. I’ve literally seen it multiple times because it’s so good. Compare that to Rise of “Skywalker”… haven’t seen that mess since I saw it the first time in the theater.
PLEASE DO NOT PUT SPOILERS IN YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT THE REMAINING DUNE BOOKS. Thank you :)
Cool. I will only mention what took place in the first Dune book which these two movies represent.
It’s worth mentioning that the Bene Gesserit have an incredible degree of control over their bodies.
Paul is in a much better position to handle his injuries than Feyd-Rautha was.
I intentionally did not find out anything about the second part having read the book. So it tripped me out that Christopher Walken played the emperor, because of Fatboy slim's weapons of Choice music video.
th-cam.com/video/wCDIYvFmgW8/w-d-xo.htmlsi=dDJFhAnOdlkdrh80
I know right??? The fuckin autistic nature of people that can't keep their mouths shut. I literally read the books out of fear of being spoiled due to the popularity of part 1 when it came out, and holy shit am I glad I did because there are so many fucking spoilers everywhere, on social media, youtube. People get a dopamine hit spoiling stuff for others and then are like "You know the books have been out for ages though right??" It's like yeah and?? No one gives a fuck that you know what's going to happen next. Jesus Chroist.....
Not sure if you were talking to me but everything in my comment happened in these two movies not future books. I assume anybody watching reactions has already seen the 2nd movie.
He mentions in the tent with his mother that he saw visions of people dying in his name under the atreides banner in this holy war. But that he saw a path through which is when he started talking about marrying the emperor's daughter to let kynes. He did not want to go south he fought that with everything he had until he drank the water. His mother and the Bennegesuit on the other hand wanted that war and as soon as his plan failed his mother excitedly told his sister they were getting their holy war in the last scene.
Star wars has been real quiet since Dune part 2 dropped 😂
LMFAO FACTS
@@ChannelSee1 Nah the Star Wars folks are busy trying to launch tv shows and movies that nobody wants to see. Furthermore, those tv shows and movies are being put together by tone deaf hacks who go out of there way to insult the fandom.
😂😂😂 lmao
@@technofilejr3401 MOAR FACTS
@@technofilejr3401facts
Dune did it first......just remember that 💯
And did it better! - Cam
Yes even GOT books were inspired by Dune
lord of the rings did it first 💯
@valerian6740 nobody said anything about lotr
@@Skrappy nobody said anything about doing it first 🤓🙌ℹ️
"He run funny."
Never tried running on a sand dune, eh?
Nope, but I'd bet I would run funny too lmao - Cam
@@ChannelSee1 for a few seconds
The final Atredies slave in the arena isn't the doctor its Landville, an Atredies general. He's the one in the first movie that says "Shields!" just before the ship opens its doors when it arrives on Arrakis and also he's the one that tells Stilgar "Hey, Stop right there!." When Stilgar is walking up to Leto to met him for the first time.
Also the fight coordinator for the movie
Thanks for that I legit was also like can’t be the doctor he got killed but it looked like him
From what I remember when a laser hits a shield it may trigger a nuclear explosion.
Yup
yep...
On both ends, the laser and the shield! Which is why my biggest criticism of the film from a book accuracy perspective is all the use of lasers.
@@BCPvideo yep, both ends have a chance of going boom... i only saw 1 point in the 2 movies, where a laser was used in a wrong place...
@@spyro257whens that?
30:32, no the Kwitzach Haderach (KW) is not the same as the Lisan al Gaib.
The KW is the secret breeding program by the Bene Gesserit to create a super being - a male Bene Gesserit. Because Bene Gesserit are only women (i.e. XX chromosomes) they can only access the genetic memories of female ancestors and prior Reverend Mothers. Paul is definitely the KW as he is the culmination of several generations of cross breeding. When he takes the Water of Life later he will be able to access male and female ancestral memories and prior Reverend Mothers.
Had Paul been born a girl (i.e. Pauline Atreides), she would have been married to Feyd-Rautha. Then their son would have been the KW. However, because Paul's mother chose to have a son the Kwitzach Haderach was born a generation early.
The Fremen are not aware of the KW program at all. In fact, nobody outside of the Bene Gesserit knows about it.
The Lisan al Gaib is a false messianic prophecy that the Missionara Protectiva division of the Bene Gesserit implanted in the Fremen people. This false prophecy was meant as a means to control the Fremen people en masse. It is also a tool that a Bene Gesserit could use to get individual Fremen to do whatever is necessary like Jessica is doing now.
That makes me think profecies are kinda paradoxal: what’s the difference between a false and a real profecy? Can anyone disprove a profecy before it happens? And when it does, well, isn’t it true?
@@Nicolau_Flamel Well now you're touching on the deeper philosophical aspects of Dune. Everything in Dune has double meanings, much like how the Baron explains to Dr. Yueh "I promised you may be free and that you can join your wife... so join her" before cutting off his head.. it's the same case with the Kwizats Haderach. Paul is that, he IS it and more and it's actually not at all what the Bene Gesserit imagined things would go at all. The books echo that phrase "Be-careful what you wish for because it might come true". Sometimes what we believe to be messiah or paradise can actually be the devil or hell in disguise. we just don't realize it until it's stomping us in the balls because we are short-sighted egoistic creatures. What we believe to be paradise is entirely subjective and contextual to what we're going through in the present moment. All the -ism's that existed throughout the 20th century promised humanity paradise, on paper they're all beautiful and sound great, but in reality became death sentence to millions of people for years to come.
We see it at the end of part 2. Dune contains the most valuable resource in the universe, but the Fremen want to terraform Arrakis into a Green Paradise. You can't do that unless you get the entire galaxy (Landsraad) off of it's back. Absolutely no one would allow that happen. So in order for the Lisan Al Gaib to fulfill his purpose, what must he do?
@@Nicolau_Flamel Because there's hardly ever any mention of god or gods in the Dune books as far as a metaphysical being. There's never any "true" miracles or spirits seen or anything like that. There's religions, but Frank Herbert thought religions were for suckers and manipulative, and showed it in the books. He wasn't wrong.
They don't have shields because the shields attract the worms
And also really pisses them off
Thank you, they mentioned that before be I forgot about that detail - Cam
@@ChannelSee1 Also the shields cause a small nuclear explosion when targeted by a laser based weapon, to my knowledge. So that whole Harkonnen squad would have been wiped easier and quicker.
No, Paul isn't Anakeen or Danny, He's a more nuanced & complex character than them and with good reasoning, unlike them xD
Yup, Dany was just like, "Well, time to murder innocents, for no good reason." At least Anakin was tricked by the Dark side.
@@LetsGetitBoahshame Anakin was the victim of a trilogy which has some of the iffiest writing ever put in a film. At least revenge of the sith wasn’t utterly terrible though
you don't have to put those other two down. this "oh this guy is better than this guy" isn't helpful.
@@RaixsOreh but it's the truth. Comparison will always come
@@LetsGetitBoahshow Dany. There’s no denying the complexities of her book counterpart. I feel like if we’re going to make comparisons between all three, Danys book version should take precedence
anakin & daenerys actually based on paul’s character
basically all “the chosen one” characters start from paul
@@notjinx99not true. Paul is not the first chosen one trope. But Grrm and lucas gained aspirations from frank herbert
@@Grimmreaper007 yh he’s not the first to be “the chosen one” but almost all similar characters (anakin/vader, harry potter, daenerys) that came after dune were based on paul’s.
I honestly dont understand how people arent noticing the "chosen one from a desert planet who's not quite a chosen one after all" theme between dune and starwars lol
The logic in this niƃƃa is non-existent.
the doctor and the fighter were both asian. that’s why they “looked alike” 🙄
Yea off quick glance and not remembering his exact features they looked alike. Forgive me for not having the best facial recognition skills. - Cam
When they ride the sandworms, they pull up their plating, exposing the tender flesh underneath. The worms instinctively roll the open "wounds" up to the top to avoid getting sand in them. The worms travel in a relatively straight line, and stay on the surface because of the wounds. They really don't even feel the Fremen on their "back." When they want off, they just remove the hooks and the sandworm dives into the sand. The Fremen just hop off.
Don't forget, that it is dangerous to release the worm too early. He can become mad and attack people, cause he clearly can feel vibrations so close to him. So fremen can get off the worm then he is already too tired to pursue them.
There are rings of openings called spiracles under the ridges that act like passive nostrils, allowing the worm to breathe. When the hooks pull up on the ridges, the worm rolls and rises to prevent sand from getting in.
Dune books came out way before the game of thrones books and star wars movies
Heck book 1 came out before even Star Trek
Dune was the pioneer of sci-fi culture. Star War borrowed the idea of Dune and other sci-fi book to create a world of their own, but Star War was also a classic though
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Denis Villeneuve is really good at visual storytelling.
He really is. Absolutely kills it.
To answer the question from the title: yes and no. The difference is that Paul knows exactly what's coming ... and still feels helpless to avoid his fate. Paul is simultanously the most powerful and most powerless man in the known universe, his prophetic powers can't help him.
The bene gesserit didn’t intend to have jessica marry feyd rautha. He was most likely a toddler back then. They just didn’t want her to have a son because of it’s potential and how it didn’t ally with their breeding program. The bene Gesserit have many prospects of people who could be the kwisatz haderach, and implanted the prophecy in many differently cultures including the freman. Lady margot saw potential in feyd to be a kwisatz haderach for them when feyd mentioned that he had a dream about her.
The chosen one trope is a very popular one that has existed for millennia but Paul Herbert is one of the most prominent modern examples of turning it on its head. People should be more skeptical of charismatic leaders who promise to fix everything. In fact, in the books Herbert writes that Paul reflects on leaders like Hitler which makes sense given that this book was published in 1965.
A realization that struck me like lightning is that House Stark from Game of Thrones basically had a similar story arc with House Atreides and each of the Stark children receiving a fraction of Paul's story:
- taught by foreign fighting masters
- received top education
- recieved secret assassin training
- father sent into a far away place as a political trap
- exiled
- joined natives and learned their ways
- died
- resurrected
- gained power to peek through time
- ascended to monarchy
There's another characteristic of Paul that is similar to a Stark child that i will not say here because it's potentially a spoiler for Part Three
Most of those are tropes you'll find in fantasy and sci fi novels, though not always all at once.
Dune is a bit like Game of Thrones in Space. The Atreides are like the Starks, they rule through example (like Duke Leto risking his life and that of his son when he rescued the men on the spice harvester) and have a strong sense of honour, the Harkonnen are like the Boltons, enemies of the Atreides and ruling through fear, and the Corrino (the emperor´s family) being like the Targaryen, with a rule based on military might, with Sardaukar super soldiers instead of Dragons.
The water of life is basically hyper concentrated spice. Only Bene Gesserit can nullify the toxic effects. Since spice expands consciousness, this opens up ‘other memories’ for the Bene Gesserit, which essentially means they now have all the memories of all previous Reverend Mothers. It has a similar effect on Paul, by opening up and clarifying his presence, his ability to see the future. Because Jessica was pregnant, her baby (Alia) also now possesses other memories, and is essentially a fully conscious reverend mother in womb. This is what the Bene Gesserit call Abomination.
@1:19:16 Can't expect the Emperor to have a larger role! Thing is, nature of that character is he's an old man who's become irrelevant. Plain as that. He's a relic, whose biggest moment in this story will be bending his knee, to kiss the ring of a man he killed out of petty jealousy. For such a character, you need an actor so good with just his face, and few words, that still an audience could believe that for a long, long time, he's been the most important man in the room. Walken's exactly the talent.
Baron is the ultimate creepy uncle and Feyd is just as messed up
Basically all the White Saviour narratives in which the saviour actually turns out to be the villian, were inspired by Dune. Stars Wars in particular borrowed so heavily from Frank Herbert that a lot of it is almost plagiarism. Great reaction guys, hope you enjoy Part 3 when it comes out in 2027 (or thereabouts).
By the way, what you noticed about Part 2 is precisely why book aficionados get really angry at people who say it's just another White Saviour story. That trope was already tired in 1965, and Frank Herbert explicitly set out to subvert it and sound a warning about trusting charismatic leaders and messianic figureheads.
Plagiarism...nah. They're called archetypes--a recurrent symbol or motif in literature, art, or mythology. Frank Herbert's best move in Dune was definitely subverting the white savior trope, and the savior trope in general, but it's ironic how few people see it that way nowadays, with all the movie viewers wholeheartedly embracing Paul and his authoritarian conversion.
Well-said @apostatereacts.
Fun fact, the Asian prisoner you guys thought was the doctor from the first movie was actually the guy who told Leto(Paul’s father) in the first movie to lower the windows because the sun is getting to high and the heat would be too powerful, it’s a quick short scene in the first movie but I recognize him
24:37, Chani might not be 7 months long by the end of the movie. But a lot of fans do think she is pregnant. In the books the scarf she wears in her hair symbolizes a Fremen woman who has given birth to a son. The director Denis Villaneuve says that within the movie, it symbolizes Chani's love for Paul. As long as she wears it in her hair she is in love with Paul. Notice where it is by the end - it's no longer on her head.
In the first Dune book by the time of the final battle with the Imperial troops, Chani had already given birth to a son by Paul.
a couple of reasons why the harkonens didn't activate their shields are one shields attract worms and make them angry and two they had lasguns on them and if you hit an active shield with a lasgun there is a chance of a nuclear explosion of a variable size
The maker hooks lift the scales, exposing sensitive skin underneath. The worm doesn't go under because sand would get in the now exposed sensitive areas. Raised and lowered in opposite directions, the rider can turn the worm.
Actually Anakin and Dany's arc are like his, as he was written first. But his journey is weirder and is better written.
Paul😔
Chani😢
Stilgar😀
Emperor😚
Feyd💀
Not a spoiler. This is from book one. Alia is considered an abomination because she received the ancestral memories in the womb. This is taboo because they think you need to have your own personality before you gain ancestral memories otherwise you get lost in other personalities and lose your "self".
Tragically true.
Decaliter is a unit for measuring volume, equal to 10 liters.
The best Star Wars analogy for Paul is essentially what if Luke chose the dark side instead.
I'm glad y'all enjoyed the movie. Thanks for the reaction. Just wanted to share ---Kwisatz Haderach is a male Bene Gesserit who can see the past and the future. It's not the same thing as the Lisan-el-Gaib, who is a Fremen prophesied Messiah. The fact that Paul became a Kwisatz Haderach, gaining power over past and future visions, allows him to manipulate the Fremen religion and hope in prophesied Messiah to put himself in a future thats beneficial to him. It's all made-up and planned, and Paul, seeing the future, allows him to ride the wave of the moment. The Bene Gesserit wanted to actually have Jessica give birth to a girl first and not a boy like Paul. That way, they marry off that girl to Feyd Rautha, who would have given them the boy that would eventually become the Kwisatz, but Jessica fell in love with Duke Leto and gave birth to a boy (Paul) instead.
Oh nice okay. Thanks for the clarification. I may end up reading some of the Dune books one day, I’m loving the lore so far. - Cam
gonna say that when paul looks down at the end when he says take them to paradise is sad af. Basically he knew what he actually meant was go attack them and kill thousands of people. In the books this was the Jihad he feared most.
That Atreides soldier that Feyd Rautha was fighting was not Doctor Yueh. That was Lanville. You hear Duncan yell his name in the first movie after Duncan landed his fighter on Caladan. You also see him among the Atreides soldiers when the family arrives on Arrakis.
Awesome to see your reaction to the "Silence!" scene, it is one of my favorite moments in the book. And in the book it is even more impressive since Paul says: "Silence! Where is your Gom Jabbar now?" (GJ being the poison needle, since if you remember the Reverend Mother told Paul to be silent when she was testing him with the box)
20:34 "Why don't they use that on the helicopter?" Fair question. The reason they don't use lasers on shields is because both the shield AND the laser gun would explode like a mini-nuke.
The Harkonans have a black sun so that’s why everything is in black and white
you just triggered the Dune fanbase with that title
lol it’s a legit question
@@ChannelSee1then the answer is Anakin and Danaerys go through their Paul Atreides arc
In the book Paul and Jessica are on Arrakis for a longer time before the emperor shows up. Paul's sister is born and Paul and Chani have a son together. His son is killed by the Harkonnens and Paul's sister is 2 years old by the time the emperor shows up on Dune.
Lanville, the one who fought Feyd-Rautha, was one of the Duke Guards and in the first Film one of the Atreides Commanders. He sat in the Council of Duke Leto.
His real name is Rick Yuan he is the fight coordinator for the movie
Contrary to what Chani's friend said, the Water Of Life is not worm piss. It's the bile from a drowned immature sand worm, so it's worm vomit. 😆
No shields in the desert. Shields attract sand worms and send them into a frenzy
Yes, everyone borrowed from Frank Herbert. George Martin's whole feudal house system was taken straight out of Dune among many other things. George Lucas was a Dune book nerd who loved the idea of a "dark hero" and created Star Wars a decade or so later. glad you guys enjoyed it :)
George’s feudal house system was taken straight from history. Just as frank did.
@@James-kd2qm Yes, specifically the War of the Roses from English history.
Also, they reason they don’t use the laser guns on things with shields is because it will cause a nuclear reaction on both ends of the laser beam (it’s explained in the books). So it’s not good for anyone. That’s why they’ve went back to using swords in this world. They only use the guns when they can.
I believe the Harkonnen spice harvesters are supposed to look like ticks, rather than a scrotum!
Anakin, Daeneris and Paul Atreides have little to do with each other. Paul is not a failure like Anakin. He chooses to stop being the kwisatz haderach because he understands how knowing the future traps you in your own destiny. Paul does save his loved ones, while Anakin doesn't and needed to be saved by Luke. Paul did what he had to do up to a certain point when life had no meaning without Chani and when he understood what it means to be God. He is also scared of the Golden Path, which he refuses. And for that he will be partially despised by his own son.
Daenerys, at least in the show, is instead a Mary Sue and kinda crazy in the end. She is similar to Anakin and Paul in that she kills a lot of innocent people but she does not regret it like Paul does - and Anakin does not.
I have read that Denis Villaneuve started storyboarding this movie back in the 90s. Just like Peter Jackson and LOTR, the best movies are often passion projects. Now can’t wait to see what he does with Dune Messiah.
I wish someone would do the same with The Chronicles of Amber.
Including house Atreides and house Harkonnen there are 12 known great houses. Atreides, Harkonnen, Corrino, Fenring, Ginaz, Halleck, Metulli, Moritani, Ordos, Vernius, Richese, and Nebiro.
Paul and Feyd were first cousins. The Baron is Paul's grandfather, Feyd and Rabbon are the Barons nephews meaning that they are the sons of his brother making Jessica their aunt. Therefore they are first cousins.
37:40, this is Lady Margot Fenring and she is just visiting Giedi Prime. Also Margot is the Bene Gesserit wife of Count Hasimir Fenring. Count Fenring is the best friend and confidant of the Emperor. He appears in the book at some pivotal points but his scenes for the movie were left on the cutting room floor .
Count Fenring appears to be a foppish type of guy that many don't take seriously beyond his close ties to the Emperor. Secretly, Fenring is a cold blooded assassin and works as the Emperor's hitman. In hand to hand combat, he is on par with Feyd and Paul. But he also has the skills to end targets though more covert means.
Were it not for a genetic abnormality to makes him sterile, Fenring could have been a Kwitzach Haderach. On a positive side, Hasimir and Margot do have love for one another and he supports her Bene Gesserit shenanigans. In the book he present at this gladiatorial match with Margot and was fully aware of what she planned to do with Feyd.
Imagine being George Lucas, and having a blank cheque (because he owned the chequebook) to create a trilogy focusing on the epically tragic fall of Anakin Skywalker. Then he goes and creates something barely a few notches above Doctor Who. What a startling lack of imagination, skill, and ambition. And SW fans actually defend it all.
That's what success brings you, surrounded by yes-men. Actually, George Lucas did a pretty good imitation of Emperor Shaddam with the Prequels, didn't he?
Remember to set up your thumper on trash collection day.
Just to give you the 411 on why during the scene where you see the ornithopter exploding, why didn't they use the Lazgun (which is that blue light that you see destroying the harvester) is because if you shoot a lazgun add an object that is protected by a Shield there will be a thermonuclear explosion which would kill everybody. I know that's something they don't explain in the movie, it's from the book.
Jessica is the real hero of this story, the woman who knew Leto was the man that would give her the seed to create Paul who would go on to start the path to ensure life for humanity.
Jessica was not married.
You are watching a movie, but you forgot what was 5 minutes ago...🤦♂️
Yes I am diagnosed with ADHD, we don’t have the best working memories. Sorry bud. - Cam
@@ChannelSee1then pay attention, clown
Very satisfying reaction. Good elements in the commentary: Chani coming comically close to saying her secret name is Zendaya, more cowbell, rich story in spite of narrative haste, etc. I love how Stilgar goes full LIFE OF BRIAN on Paul.
Well...Dune came before Life of Brian, so maybe the Monty Python writers were fans of Frank Herbert.
Something that's not explained in the movie that you see where Paul rides the worm, why doesn't the worm go under the sand again? The reason it doesn't go back under the sand is because as you see in the movie Paul lifts up one of his scales. By doing that the worm won't dive into the sand because the sand will get underneath and irritate its skin. This is how the Freman can ride the worms.
"maybe like, 4 or 5" well close! it's actually 31 great houses!
And dozens of lesser houses.
“Why you gotta ruin a good moment?”- 🤣
We all need a hype man like Stilgar in our lives.
Stilgar's change from competent rational leader to obsessed fanatic was the real thread of the story. Looking past his comical behavior shows how tragic his change was. It gets even worse in later books. Having read them, I can't find any humor in his actions, just regret.
Agreed about the thinking on this film - its deep, the david lynch film uses actual quotes from the books and they are DEEP - I needed to watch it like 4 times before I even had a clue what was going on - These new ones are easier for people new to the universe to understand as translated into something people who have not read the book can get straight away and the bits you need to know etc
What a film - Lisan Al Giab!
Seeing Daenerys in the same sentence as anakin and Paul is actually insane😭 she is not even half the characters they are…
44:10, dude this is mild compared to what the Baron Vlad Harkonnen was doing to Feyd in the books. Vladmir didn't let things like blood relations get in the way of his kicks. He and Feyd have a seriously twisted relationship of abuse, assassination attempts and punishment. Some of the things the Baron makes Feyd do to stay in his good graces I can't even describe for fear of getting flagged.
Also you keep mentioning all of the female servants surrounding Vladmir, don't be so sure they actually are female. The Baron shall we say likes his playthings young and a bit more masculine. The director has done a good job of tip toeing around how big of a freak this dude is.
Yeah it's...interesting to read. I love the movies and books both and their impact on sci-fi culture as a whole. Unfortunately, Frank Herbert was apparently very homophobic, and Vladimir was his designated "queer menace" character in the books. Morbidly obese, a shameless pedophile, and all around obscenely ruthless character that cared nothing for age or relation, and Herbert wanted to make it abundantly clear. Thankfully Denis Villeneuve changed his character to something more admissable in the movies. Still evil and gluttonous, and brief hints of an odd relationship with Feyd Rautha, but nothing blatant. Such a fantastic director.
I don't care what Frank's personal opinions were because the Baron's creepy side in the book emphasized he doesn't view people as people but objects to be used. Not making the Baron a gay PDFile is just good marketing strategy since the LGBTQ brigade would pitch a fit. Also not calling Paul's holy war a jihad was intentional because the Islamists would flip out too. Good marketing, but cowardly changes to avoid controversy. Oh well. They get the decadent side of him by putting him in water to be a juxtaposition the fremen holding water as rare and sacred.
Rebecca Ferguson is so dam fine
On god. 💯
She is perfect.
Best Supporting Actress this year. She goes from concerned to creepy so well.
Short answer no, Paul does it for the greater good, and it's basically the best path he saw for a better future.
I can see the similarities in the arc between Paul Daenerys and Anakin.
They all had good intentions to begin with and then through people twisting them and pushing them made them turn into what they are.
In the book, the small path that Paul saw through was what he tried in this movie. He hoped winning the battle for Arakeen and dethroning the emperor, marrying his daughter, would end it. As soon as he knew that the landsraad families that were hovering above were not going to accept his ascendancy. He knew that that path had closed. The holy war was going to happen and millions of people were going to die under the atreides banner.
Paul could have avoided Jihad/Holy War entirely if he had chosen not to join the Fremen from the start. When Paul joins them the Fremen begin to see him as their messiah so the Jihad/Holy War becomes inevitable because their faith can't be changed.
Nope. His arc is more that of a protagonist in an ancient Greek drama. He's a victim of circumstance (the Greeks would have called it a "curse of the gods", knowing there is more than one way to be their "chosen one") who is destroyed by the evil he has unleashed, being able to see it all in advance but unable to do anything about it.
Oedipus Rex was one of the first.
“Why didn’t you use those things on the helicopter ?”. This one is actually a REALLY good question, as it is not told in the movies, but it is in the books : a laser encountering a shield triggers a nuclear explosion, which fallouts are unpredictable…
“Why don’t you use your shields ?”. Good question. Rewatch Dune part 1 (really paying attention this time !), Liet Kynes gives you the answer.
you got it backwards their story’s where derived from paul’s story, or really Frank Herbert’s stories.
Got the Harkonnen bustin at me. But they can’t do nothin to Muad’dib 🎶
R.I.P 2pac
138 or so great houses.
Paul now can bridge space and time. Like the huge space guild ships, he can be in two places at once and open the way for anything and everything to move from one place to another at once. He destroys the spice, then he is the only way anyone can be allowed to travel. Then he causes that deep space travel to happen.
you guys are hilarious! best reaction for this movie for sure
I think one of the biggest reasons why there's such a divide among audience's response to Paul is because his archetype isn't nearly as familiar with in pop culture. Paul is not a hero, or villain or even anti-hero. Paul is a tragic hero, and that's a very different thing than most of the discourse surrounding the character and ultimately what Herbert is trying to communicate within his work. The whole "Paul is good guy vs. Paul is bad guy it just depends on your perspective" perspective misses the point.
Paul is very deliberately written as the Mary Sue of Mary Sues; he's raised from birth as a mentat, an order that represents all of the sacred aspects of the masculine. He's surrounded by alpha males who love and guide him. He's trained in the Bene Gesserit way by his mother, representing all the cunning power of the feminine. Paul's mother loves him and his father so much that she disobeys a sacred order of her own sisterhood. Paul is raised as a ducal heir and learned in the ways or war and politics. He then goes on to live among the most robust, resourceful and pragmatic people in all the imperium and eventually becomes their legitimate ruler after succeeding in all of their rituals and besting all comers. At this point the missionaria protectiva is moot, Paul has fulfilled all of the prophecies that no other person in the imperium ever could, he literally is That Guy and proves it. And that's all before becoming the goddamn Kwisatz Hadderach, the supreme being who can see in all places at once. The most capable human to ever live. And yet, even this supreme being is unfit to wield such monopolized power because no one is. The jihad is inevitable, violence sings its own song.
This understanding of power is demonstrated in all the surrounding characters and subplots. The Bene Gesserit have the hubris to think they can control humanity and even the Kwisatz if they just patiently plan in the shadows long enough, the Fremen think they are ready to fulfill their dream of the "green paradise" which they do, but at great destructive cost to themselves, and so on.
Herbert once stated that his favorite president was Richard Nixon as Nixon taught the American people to distrust presidents.
"Herbert once stated that his favorite president was Richard Nixon as Nixon taught the American people to distrust presidents."
Unfortunately such lessons only last a few generations. Seeing the rise of fascism once again proves this as well.
@@rikk319 It never left. The US has had over 100 years of progressivism, every president since Wilson has been a fascist. Without exception.
12:33 they don't make the distinction but any female group of people with access to spice can make reverend mothers. That's basically just the bg and the fremen tho. The fremen reverend mothers are called wild reverend mothers or sayyadina "friend to the prophet". That's a real Islamic term tho so I understand why they took out words like that and turned jihad to holy war. That reverend mother was not bg
this was a great reaction but one thing i haven’t seen people tell you is that her name is pronounced zen-DAY-uh not zendieya 😭😭
In the books Lady Jessica became Silgar third wife.
Bless you both for the “more cowbell” cut. First time I’ve seen it in a reaction and I was starting to lose hope. Y’all truly are the Lisan Al Gaib’s 🙏🙌💯
Frank herbert who wrote dune basically took the "chosen one" trope, gave it a twist how our future could look like with the rise of AI and evolotiun of the human body and society and flipped it by saying not every charismatic leader is a good guy. people didnt like it and misunderstood it and he wrote dune messiah to get the message across that Paul is not a Hero. in the first chapter he compares his bodycount with hitler and dschingis kahn.
dennis just put more of the warning signs in the first 2 movies. billions die because of his egoistical choices. There are no good guys but damn is it an amzining story that makes you think while reading. hard to get that across as a film thats why since the 1960's everybody said its "unfilmable" but kudos to you guys. beside the asian doctor/atreides warrior bit
Look I wasn't fully paying attention in that scene and I'm not the best with faces or names either lol. I also couldn't remember what the doctor looked like, when I looked back off screen I was like "oh yea that's obviously not him" But yes, the 2nd part definitely showed us Paul isn't actually all that "good". I personally love characters with shades of gray, I find them more realistic. No one is ever all good or all bad, we all balance the two. I'm excited to see what the third movie will yield. Thanks for watching! - Cam
PLEASE DONT EVER DISRESPECT DUNE. It came before Star Wars. The creator for Star Wars got inspriattion from the dune novels.
when you lift the plates on the worm sand gets in which the worm does notice dosen't like and that's why they stay on the surface
I’m so glad you put the cowbell edit in! Most reactors miss r that opportunity
I was the annoying person in the theater who yelled it out
"Sandbush" is criminal. Keep going tho
Stop drinking me. Almost passed away.
By the way the kiss between Feyd and Vladimir is not a "Harkonnen" thing its because Vladimir has a sexual relationship with Feyd and favors him over Rabban
Bad editing job of your video with the view switching every 5 seconds.
We had 8 copyright claims when we first uploaded, sometimes we have no choice and we have to remove certain things.
It's not explicitly explained in the movie as it is in the book so you guys can't know this
If a shield is hit by a laser both the shield generator and the laser blow up spectacularly.
30:42 Chini is riding Paul's worm.
1:12:38 Chini is bout to Über out
You can see where George Lucas ‘borrowed’ from when writing Star Wars.
Yeah. You should say “are Anakin’s or Daenerys’s arcs the same as Paul’s ?”. The book Dune was written in 1965, just as a reminder… So please give back to Caesar…
You’re asking that question the wrong way around.
"PAUL ATREIDES’ ARC THE SAME AS ANAKIN AND DAENERYS?! " Given Dune was published way before either of those, the question should be is ANAKIN AND DAENERYS ARC THE SAME AS PAUL's?!
*Luke, I'm your (grand)father!*
35:39, someone may have mentioned this but in the books the Harkonnen's are family of red heads. But I guess Villaneuve wanted them to look so different because of what Giedi Prime is like. The planet is an ecological nightmare as the Harkonnen family has over industrialized it for centuries. So with little to no natural sunlight they are pretty pale. Chef's kiss to the director for giving them a black sun that washes out almost all color in outdoor shots.
Those shots are absolutely sick, kudos to how they stylized their planet.
They're not read heads in Frank's books - it was Lynch's movie. In Dune only Feyd's dark hair is mentioned
@ChannelSee1 Those outdoor scenes on Giedi Prime were filmed in infrared, not black and white. The difference on a big screen is stark. If you can still find it near you, I urge you to go and see it in person. It's magnificent in IMAX in particular.
kwisatz haderach can only be a male trained in the bene gesserit
You mean is Anakin and Daenery's like Paul... Dune was a massive influence on Star Wars. The Bennegesserit are where he got some inspo for the Jedi.
So sad that your knowledge of the 'chosen' one trope are all shallow hollywood movies.
Then be glad the Dune trilogy is here to broaden their perspective and stop being pretensious
There are lots of sad things to contemplate. Like expecting everyone to share your opinions. Or other's experiences being judged as "shallow". Some people get inspiration from experiences that others consider not worthy. They can change the World for the better because of that experience. But no!......... To you, is "sad".
@@craigmorrison4016 but they should understand that for it to broaden their perspective.
Long story short: It is not the same arc at all.
This movie fucking slapped. One of the best movies I’ve ever seen. I’ve literally seen it multiple times because it’s so good. Compare that to Rise of “Skywalker”… haven’t seen that mess since I saw it the first time in the theater.