HOW TO: 400-HP SBF POWER COMBOS
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ต.ค. 2020
- 302, 347, 351W, SUPERCHARGED AND BOSS 302. IT'S ALL HERE! IF YOU WANT TO KNOW HOW TO MAKE 400 HP FROM YOUR 5.0L OR OTHER SBF COMBO, CHECK OUT THIS VIDEO. SINCE VARIETY IS THE SPICE OF LIFE, I PUT TOGETHER THIS VIDEO USING A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT SBF POWER COMBINATIONS TO ALL EXCEED 400 HP. 306, 347, 351, BOOSTED 302 & EVEN A MODIFIED, 4V BOSS 302!
- ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
From 255 hp to 459 hp with a top end kit on the junkyard 351W bottom end was impressive. The fact that it improved lower end torque significantly too is even more impressive.
Wow, that camshaft really improved the whole curve on that little engine that could.
And this is the one where most folks will live. Nice.
It looks like that upgraded cam in the Boss wanted to rev to 8,000
No doubt
And that's why I've had my Boss 302 since '75, though, sadly, the car it came in has been gone many, many years. All the nay-sayers scoffed at the non-Chivvie with ludicrously "mismatched" cylinder heads, but any time I had a fairly well-matched combo of parts in it, it exceeded expectations. This will probably be my last build on it since I'm an antique, and it is now out to .060 over, as well. With the good parts I got together for it, and the fact that the heads have FINALLY been cleaned up from factory as-cast form, I expect it will perform better over a broader range than it has before, which will be going some. Wish I had a bunch of buddies with a dyno, 'cause I'd love to compare what it ends up doing to my next build-up, which is a "mock" Boss or Clevor with AFD aluminum heads, a "better" (I think) intake, and parts less slanted to an old school vibe. Nice to have stuff like Richard puts out, that goes for the real effect of architechtures and parts choices, not "common" knowledge that ain't always rooted in unbiased fact.
This is the best ford small block series I have ever watched.Richard has out done his self again.The man is a Ford genius..He's like a FBI investigator just the facts man.
Been waiting on this Richard.
I'm old. I grew up in the late 60s and have had the pleasure of driving and owning almost every one of these pushrod engines on this site. My first car was a 70 1/2 Z28, when they couldn't give it away because of the gas wars. it wouldn't even start on the brand new at the time, regular unleaded. I have family that has worked for airlines for most of my life, so I could get enough avgas to mix up batches to make it fly. Few years ahead, I got ahold of a 71 Boss 351 Mustang. I don't care what anyone says, that car would spank my old Z28, any day of the week. The car was huge, and terrible to try to back out of parking spots, but by far it was one of the fastest stockers I have driven. It pulled from idle to red line, never missing a beat, and many big blocks were left in it's dust. Someone else wanted it worse than I did, and I messed up and sold it. I still miss that one more than most of the others I've had, with the Z coming a close 2nd.
take a look at the Boss 351 video-it made the most power of any muscle car small block.
This video confirms why I like Cleveland heads so much. I saw a dyno comparison with a boss 302 and a boss 351, they made identical peak power, the 351 just made a lot more low end torque
Been waiting all day for this video. Thanks!!!
In Australia, we didn't have Boss 302 engines in our factory Fords but 302/351 Clevelands. Although Clevors (Boss), Windsors block/Cleveland heads are popular now days because of all the aftermarket Windsor stuff available from the US.
Woohoo, Boss, fingers crossed it doesn’t let us down, luv your videos Richard.
What about 400hp efi combos surely you have done some rpm 2 or Holley systamax 2 combos that make over 400 not every one wants to run a carby
👍 BIGDOGS PORTING is a great source.
lots of those too
Best series ever! 👍
Love your stuf! Keep bringing the great information.
Awesome series I have learned so much for my build.
I enjoy all of your videos! I'd enjoy if you were to ever do an all efi 302 videos. I'd just want to see the cheapest top end efi kit to the most expensive top end efi kit
absolutely love these videos thank you for your time sir
Love the ford stuff!!!
The BOSS 302 rules!!! Many moons ago, I passed on a set of Boss 302/351C heads. As a young hotrodder, I was told that these big port heads on a small motor would not make any power below 5K rpm-myth busted!! Have you run the 351C 2V heads, with smaller ports than the 4V and open combustion chamber-good enough for a boosted application?
Love the vids Richard, any chance we can do same video back to back with different EFI systems and manifolds. Keep up the great work
Great video series!!
91👍's up Richard thanks again for taking us all along with you for the rest of the story
351W had the giant leap of power,over 200hp increase,those motors are great,Windsors and Clevelands.
Keep putting more cam in that Boss 302! I want to see it at 500 hp.
Yeah or 600 maybe na?!?
I’d be curious as to how much power you’d get extra on the boss/cleveland 4v heads with the exhaust port plates that fill in the bottom of the exhaust ports between the headers to prevent the tumble that the exhaust ports are notorious for. Some people use to epoxy them in for a higher port shape and claimed to get significant power increases
Richard I know this is extra work but if possible listing the parts separately for each combo would help so we could study and make better decisions based on budget constraints. Thank you for consideration of my request.
Your videos are great.
Mark
Would love to see a junkyard dog special using gt40p heads (explorer for instance) and see what you could make as far as a low buck special . Loved this too btw. Thanks for the hard work you guys put into this!
Not long ago he showed the set up.
Gotta love that 218 likes and zero dislikes good job richard
My sbc was a 355 untill it ate 3 roller tappets,when I tore it down ,I went with a 3.750 crank 13.7 to 1 slugs and just went with a lil bigger cam @.615/.625 .I home ported the heads myself wp angle plug 64cc iron heads .010 off the heads .my port job was little more than deburing ..haven't dynoed it just dropped it in and run it ..the difference was something I'm quite satisfied with.
Always wondered how my combo would make power. 351W, 10.5:1, ported TFS170's, Comp 35-518-8, RPM Aig gap with a 600CFM TBI through shorties. Thanks for all the testing!
TBI?
@@richardholdener1727 Fi-Tech 600 Power Adder. TBI Injection, basically.
I feel like you should include a $ per HP gain for each of these. Excluding the stock engine cost of course.
So 408w with Cleveland heads! 550hp good to know
Us aussies do like Boss 302s, but we never got them here. We did have a 302 Cleveland, which shared the same parts with a 351 except for crank, rods and the closed chamber 2V heads. This is where "Aussie 2Vs" come from. Only 302Cs got them.
🔔👍 Love the SBF stuff!!
Im stuck in 1990 with a stock 5.0 GT HO fuelie T5. 25 yrs.
It has all been tried.
Where can I get reasonable hop up information for this fuelie?
Thanks for your great videos.👍
YeeeeeHaaaaaw!!! 😁😁😎
This is awesome
Hey Rich, can you try getting your hands on a set of the new AFR 185 “as cast” heads. I think they call them ENFORCER heads. Maybe try them on this 347 so we can compare them to the trick flow “as cast” heads?
Could you please show the power figures with the Four Hole Spacer. I was looking at a 1 inch fourhole spacer for my 308/ 5 Ltr Holden V8 motor that runs a .214@ .050 lift camshaft.
Richard, take the 306 that u got and put a solid flat tappet cam with duration in the 250 plus area and around 600 lift with a victor jr intake and lets see what it makes. I had this combo and it was a screamer.
Big fan of clevors after spinning the big ends on my basically stock cleveland through draining the oil pan into the heads. I couldn't find one of the bearings until I realized the two halves had fused into one. The horror.
I've been watching the Touring Car Masters from down under (and I love it) ! They've got some of their stuff running out past 8300 ! Sounds great , and if you don't believe me , it's on you tube .
Jeff Schwartz power
Oh yeah love that Aussie stuff, they rock down there
@@coyote5.02 Lol , (Space Balls). Yes , I get alot of jarin!🥫 (I don't think that's a jar) ? Best I could do .
thanks for including us Aussies!
@Richard Holdener Do you remember a magazine car way back in the day (MMFF?) Fox Mustang with Saleen kit, the motor was Vortech/Paxton supercharged with the carb mounted on the intake side of the supercharger. It used a fuel solenoid from a nitrous kit to prime the motor.
side of the supercharger?
@@richardholdener1727 yes
High school buddy had one was ah blast like to find a Boss 302 set-up
I have to say, I was not impressed with the valve springs TFS put on their TW heads. I had one break with less than 20k miles on an E-cam. Motor was 4yo and driven 5kmi a year give or take. However, it did give me a good excuse to ditch the terrible E-cam (terrible for anything but a stock engine IMO) and put an XE270HR in its place. The TFS heads don't work with the springs on the cam card, so I picked a set of 330lb/in springs. 165lb on the seat, 330lb open, .530 max lift. XE270HR with .512 lift worked great, the TW heads fall flat after .500 lift anyway. That is a great cam for a TFS TW head and street manifold combo, roughly 10.3:1 compression. Makes lots of torque and pulls to 6k.
Will you be doing more testing of the cadillac 500?
I have a comp cams xe274hr and I am not sure if would have enough PTV clearance on a stock 1992 ford 302 roller motor with an afr 165 heads?
I'm missing the blast of engine sounds. pulling down on the dyno.just me being the motor head I am
Richard have you tested any Anderson Cams in any of your Ford testing?
Boys in Australia 👍👍
Ford Man is pleased. boss 302 with the same cam I ran in the edelbrock top end kit.. Explains why it wanted to rev to 8000 rpm..
Do a dyno pull with a HCI 302 then put 180 degree headers on and see what kinda power gains you get from them.
But what about the truck intakes?!! I found an edelbrock efi truck intake at a local junk yard and have been curious what the do to the curves
I bet that thing could crank out some good power with bolt on parts.
Any Piston to valve clearance issues when slapping those 185cc heads on stock block (assuming stock pistons not notched for 2.02+ valves)? My edelbrock 2.02s hit factory style piston.
Could you show 351w bore 40 over with victor drag head 205cc cam lift 650
I love the 351c/w combos. Such an old idea yet it works so well. I have a set of clapped out closed chamber 4v heads. Makes me want to drag them out again.
Richard .. I've watched enough of your videos to be halfway dangerous ..I want to try my hand at a twin turbo set up on a 1987 5.0 using a blow thru carb ..I need some advice .. do you have a min to help a man out ??? I trust you 100%
How hard would it be to get your hands on a 7.3L engine in the new super duty? I would like to see you run some test on the new pushrod engine 🤔.
T.B. .............try RevAn Evan web sight got 7.3 from a couple of months back ,its impressive !!!!!!!!!!
They sell the complete long-block for just over 8k. It'll be a minute before wrecked trucks end up in junkyards. Hopefully the older ford 6.2 start becoming more available too.
You can buy one directly from Ford as a crate engine right now, today. Pretty easy.
Richard,
Would a spacer work on that Boss 302 combination?
Right on
I currently run a 331 in my Maverick with afr 185 and a 281hr cam with 1.7 rockers. Happy to assume i make at least 400 hp
window stickers 👍👍👍👍
Hey Richard! You've probably done more cam swaps than most people, so what is your opinion on installing and breaking in a used flat tappet cam in a new block? Precautions, procedures, caveats?
I put mold based assembly lube on the cam lobes and lifter bottoms, add break in lube to the break in oil and run with minimal spring pressure if possible (remove inner spring)-that usually works
To be honest I'd build a 331, and if that wasn't enough I'd go straight to a 351w. Especially for combos in the mid 400hp range. The boss and cleveland engines are high RPM BREATHERS!
Just start with a 351w, preferably a 93 up so you got a roller cam. A half inch more stroke, right at 6" connecting rods! I'm 63, been hopping up these things for 45 years! Find a 351w, unless it won't fit! If not, sell that and get a fox body!
Hey Richard, do you think the tfs3 cam will fit.?In the explore engine. Without Ptv clearance? Thanks for all the info you are sharing.
NOT SURE-I DOUBT IT
I can't wait for the 500hp stuff... But what happened to the 289?!? *sad panda*
Ya id love to see some 289 videos
Yeah would love to see some 289 or even 260 tests!
The power curves will look the exact same, just less total power and torque from the smaller motors
i wanna see what someone could do with ported e7 heads on a budget really see what that head is capable of ive ported a few sets and they have so much meat to take out and shave 20 tho off the deck and that 274 cam
Richard, I am super impressed with the 351w. Did you have valve to piston clearance issues with the 351 stock bottom end and the healthy .573/.582 lift cam?
it fit
Usually under 230duration your safe.. its when u start going higher and duration.. the longer the valve is held open, is usually the problem. So lift doesn't really matter.. but you should be clear to use that cam no worries
Fords boss to dodge’s judge. Who has the authority??? Thanks Richard
How about building an EFI 302?
On the 400 hp 302 with the spacer did adding the spacer to the dual plane drastically change cab jetting?
yes
What distributer were you using on the 302?
What happened to low-down 5.0 mm/ff procomp heads intake Back in 09 I think 🤔 made a wink under 400hp for 1000$ with a relatively small cam .
lots to choose from
Hey Richard how much more do you think a set of TFS 192 high ports would get you on that 351w setup
not much
Hey @richardholdener1727 love your videos! I'm in the process of swapping a EFI 351w over to a carburetor and was wondering if there was any issues when you swapped this one you used in the video? Did the Intake fit right up? does it just take any normal 351w distributer? Someone was telling me the deck height changes on the 351w EFI compared to the Carbureted version.. any input helps! thank u!
deck height is 9.48 vs 9.053 but I don't think that changes the distributor pad height
HOW TO: Big Block ford FE hp series...PLEASE! I NEED ANSWERS! FOR MY 428 IM BUILDING SOON
Richard is it plausible to build an adapter to go from the 5.0 lower to a gt500 eaton supercharger...? You know a plate that matches the 8 hole lower and a plate for blower and connect them? Or the possibility of adapting a 177ci Weiand street blower lower to a modern supercharger? I'm a professional fabricator/welder so custom fabrication isn't an issue.
plates are not difficult for a fab guy
What's the trick to Installing the TFS stage 2 cam in a stock shortblock? I've read and read you can only run about .520 max lift for enough piston to valve clearance. I want to duplicate this combo on my 88 stock piston shortblock
THE LIFT MATTERS VERY LITTLE-IT'S THE DURATION THAT DETERMINES THE PROBLEM WITH P-V
Awwww, I was really hoping the 289 would make it into the 400 HP combo video.
certainly possible
seems rare to hear about Canfield heads anymore. they use to be the hot ticket.
Is that their 1 inch spacer?
The 11r heads on the first engine, the 302. Must have been the 190 intake runner to make that power?
I think they make 190 and 205 versions-either will make that power
How do the boss heads compare to a modern aftermarket Windsor head?
Well it depends on your intended goals. The boss heads of the 4V version where the go to heads back in the 70’s because that all that was available. The only other inline valve head at the time were from the 69/70 351W. There were the basically the GT-40 head that we know today. But they were not the Cleveland head. But by today’s standards trick flow afr have better heads compared to the Cleveland heads of the 70’s . But!!! There are some aftermarket Cleveland heads CHI trick flow that are amazing.
I am building a .060 over 351w for a boat. I have a set of fresh stock heads from the Cyclinder Head Shop. Using a xe274 with 10 degrees lobe separation flat tappet cam and 9 to 1 comp will it make 300 hp?
what intake? but probably yes
So how much horsepower can a 302 block actually handle? I seem to be hearing different answers.
Kind of curious about my combination. 5.0 with AFR 195 58cc chamber Renegade heads, pistons have a 6.8cc dome, E303 cam, TFS R EFI long runner, 75mm throttle body, 1 5/8 headers, 1.82 rockers and about 11.25 compression. It seems to pull really hard from around 2k to 6k.
Jeremy Mardlin should had put a better cam in it.
@@coyote5.02 for sure it could use a different cam. When the motor was done I already had that cam so it got used. I was looking at using a Comp XE274HR-12 in it.
Been running sbfs since mid 70s, they always responded best with bigger cams. Especially with solid lift cam. Don't understand why everyone today run such small cams with way too much duration. Hell with driving a hotrod 20mph , it's a hotrod!
It’s so easy to take a 351W and build a 427 that makes 600+hp and great torque I don’t understand why anyone would even mess around with a 302 anymore except for the BOSS 302.
427 IS DIFFICULT WITH A STOCK 351w BLOCK-MUCH EASILER WITH 4.125 DART BLOCK
The 302 that used in the test was a stock motor?, having enough PTV clearance with those high lift camshafts?
lift is not an issue-its duration
I'm sorry if I missed it but what valve springs do you recommend for a 5.0 gt40p.
Usually the ones supplied with the cam, but sometimes we go rogue
@@richardholdener1727 and in that case what do you us FT, Crane? Part#
400hp on a 302 is sick but mannnn id feel scared revving out to 6500.
With a steel crank proper oiling windage tray roller cam good valve springs and most importantly a properly balanced reciprocating assembly I wouldn't be scared. Richard did an article on a 8000 rpm 347.
Christopher Seay fair enough. But for me, who only wants a street purpose, I’m probably not gonna rev out that high while I run to get eggs 😂
As I have always heard.... How long will it rev that high? = Until it finally blows .... Of course.
One time or 1,000 ?
Let’s make 1000hp on 302 stock rods and stock crank and gap the rings sling the rods out the oil pan................ go for it Richard
Gregory Jowers any idiot can destroy an engine, proves nothing. Build something to be strong and stay together, that's impressive and not everybody can do. You want to see "the rods hangout" find a mouth breather style channel. Too many idiots out there blowing shit up.
This might be a amateur question.. but would these numbers be the same for a 302 out of a 68 mustang? If I followed the same setups? It is a 302 but just wanted to know before I start my project!
YES-THESE WERE HYD ROLLER CAM MOTORS BUT YOU CAN DO SMILIAR NUMBERS WITH FLAT TAPPET CAMS
@@richardholdener1727 okay great I actually have AFR heads and a roller cam setup! Thanks a lot looking forward to my build :). Love your content!
@@richardholdener1727 I messaged you months ago! But I finally got to the engine build. I bought a 302 out of a 68 mustang. The bottom end was rebuilt but has stock cast pistons.. would I still be safely able to run these setups without damaging the engine or would I need a forged setup?
Whats the compression ratio for the 347
mid 10s
Didnt the factory Boss 302 have the 289 HIPO cam ?? specs are identical.
Boss got 1.7 rockers
Was waiting for the Pro Comp / Speedmaster cylinder heads. $600 a PAIR !!!
Love a Windsor 5.0i Oo===oO
**What's wrong with my 400hp combo? 95 mustang 302. Stock bottom end, TFS Twisted Wedge 11R 190 heads (66cc) with Ford B303 cam, Ford stock Cobra intake, Procharger P1SC (8psi) with 3 core intercooler. Made 400 rear wheel hp at 6000 rpm. I know I lowered the compression going to the 66cc heads, but I figured it would do better than that. Any ideas?
is it on pump gas?
@@richardholdener1727 Yes. 93 octane. 60lb injectors, 340lph in tank pump
yes i found a vid that still has the music !