Bob Glidden had a 32-0 season with his 78 Fairmont with the Cleve. Never lost a single round and i believe is the only undefeated record for a season in NHRA.
Glidden's Pro Stock win record was only surpassed by big corp. interests, while Glidden developed his own race engines, making him the Gate Keeper of big Ford power. His BBF Thunderbird and 1985 Pro Stock Championship solidified Glidden's spot in the NHRA Hall of Fame.
@@BobbyOfEarth ☑️ Yeah, and I think Bob Glidden used Boss 429 engines in his 1980's big block Pro Stock T-bird for at least 1 or more seasons. That just adds a whole other level of coolness to his racing history!
My dad brought home a 1971 Boss Mustang on a hot summer's' evening when my 6 siblings and friends next door were playing football on the front lawn. We heard it ripping up the road and blasting past like a bullet. It was dusk so the running lights were on and it looked like a damn spaceship! It went out of sight over the next hill and as we all just stood there talking amongst ourselves as to what that was, we heard tires screaming and an engine roaring 1st, 2nd, 3rd CRAP! then up over the hill blistering towards us. Then the gearing down it went sideways into our side yard and stopped on the driveway. As the dust was clearing my dad steps out, I swear he looked like a NASA astronaut at that moment stepping out of that black beauty! OMG!! I was in love with that machine instantly! That car was crazy fast and that motor took some massive punishment from my dads lead foot. it was Truly a MUSTANG Stallion! I washed and waxed it every weekend. My dad gave it to me when I got my 1st job at Red & White Grocery Store when I was in the 10th grade. I was a car junky from then on and have had some nice rides since that day in my life. Unfortunately some (EVIL) dude, lol.. Came to our house and offered my dad some serious cash and my black beauty streaked away into my memories. I still have a lot of feelings about those days and that car, I wish I had her today... When I turned 18 I left Georgia for the San Fernando Valley, wow what an amazing time to be young and a car guy. I saw a 1969 Mach 1 at a street race that had been on the cover of Hot Rod magazine. It was Red, Lowered, big fat tires awesomely trimmed out interior that looked like a cockpit of a fighter jet packing a 351 C with a (PAXTON SUPERCHARGER)!!! 1st time I ever heard that beautiful sound! He raced a 1970 chevelle that had a 454 with a blower sticking out of the hood. The mustang blew out of the hole like a rocket and the chevelle front end went in the air... Mustang GONE!!! Great days!
I have this in my 72 Mustang convertible - an M code and even found a D1ZX aluminum intake. Got the motor out of a wrecked Cougar Eliminator several decades ago. Love this motor. I beat my friends 396 SS Chevelle, which made me pretty happy. I've since added a toploader and a 9" rear ... such a fun drive. Thanks for spotlighting this...made me smile.
I had a old school engine builder tell me the best thing about a Cleveland 4V is the Port is so big that they could fill the floor of the intake port with epoxy and then work on the Port roof ending up with a funnel shape intake port with a almost straight shot at the valve. That engine builder was Carl Holbrook.
Kevin, the biggest problem with the factory iron 4-V heads is the exhaust ports. To fit between the narrow confines between Mustang and Cougar shock towers, the exhaust ports were designed with a restrictive ridge on the floor and a sharp downward turn at the exit. The Pro Stock builders fixed it by removing a large section of the exhaust port and installing an aluminum exhaust port plate. The exhaust flow has a straight shot out instead of being slowed down by the sharp downward turn. They also did as you suggested by filling the intake port floors with epoxy or an aluminum insert and raising the port roof. I have a set of them. They are called high port iron Cleveland heads. You can google it or check out DragBoss Garage on TH-cam.
@@kevind3185 just remember- if headers don't come out of head 3" before turning downward,then might as well not run high port as it defeats it's purpose!
no such thing as a small block or big block ford. Those are terms chevy used. FE Series. 385 Series. 335 series. The 351c is a Ford 335 series engine. It feels icky using chevy terms on a great Ford engine.
@@todsimpkins8908 … You’re absolutely correct about the small and big block terminology but this far along in the game there’s really no point in trying to change things. The general public can more easily relate to the engines using the GM nomenclature. Now if they would just stop referring to INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINES, (ICE), as MOTORS, it would send a massive wave of understanding across the planet with WORLD PEACE ☮️ left in its wake. Well … maybe not that dramatic 😳but one is electric powered and the other uses gasoline for fuel and nothing in common. It just sounds odd when a professional, educated builder calls an ICE….MOTOR 🤷♂️
@@danielwilson6665when you’re talking about a particular engine yes use the correct terminology because that’s the name of the engine we’re talking about not going to call it what it’s not
Yeah. He talked about how he installed a new cam, and he showed a picture of that cam install at 6:10. But imagine how much more power it would make if he actually pushed the cam in more, and installed it all the way into the engine! 😁
My 79 F150 has a mildly built 9:1 351C-2V. Edelbrock Intake, Barry Grant Carb, Crane Cam, Headman Headers, 2 1/2 duals with X pipe and 40 series Flowmasters. The X-Pipe really mellows the 40 series Flowmasters. C-4 upgraded internals and shift kit, 3:55 gears with 30 inch rubber. 15 mpg around town, 18 mpg on highway running steady 70 mph. Smokes the tires when wanted and stone dead reliable. Estimated 325hp/380 torque Net readings with Water pump, power steering and Alternator according to my dyno software on my PC. Love my Cleveland.
The Cleveland is a very under appreciated engine love to see this test with a whipple twin screw and intercooler the hp potential on a stockish Cleveland is ridiculous… thx for work Richard best pure engine/horse power channel on youtube! Keep up the great work!
I've been dieing to see this. I picked up a 351c with 4v heads and a c4 trans from a 71 stang. For $250cad. The old man was 92 years old and still building cars. I was impressed 👌
No matter what u do with these engines they make good power, thats what they were designed for, its so nice to see gus like you showing some of what these great engines really are capable of, thank for these awesome videos👍👍👍
Dano, big power is exactly what the design engineers had in mind. Unfortunately a combination of OPEC countries creating a false oil shortage to jack up gasoline prices, government regulations for reduced emissions, insurance companies penalizing high output vehicles and more all hit about the same time the Cleveland was released. It was a huge shit storm that put an end to all muscle car production by 1973. According to the few documents I could find, Ford had big plans for the Cleveland as the FE series was being phased out and they also knew that NASCAR Would soon be requiring mid-sized engines for competition. The Cleveland was going to be the engine of choice for virtually all forms of Motorsport competition. What factory engineer in his right mind would design an engine with such massive ports and valves if serious competition wasn’t on the agenda ? Although it was an available option for the family truckster grocery getter station wagon for a minute, that certainly wasn’t what the long term goal was.
not all cleveland fans are in OZ,welcome from the UK,have a 351 4V in a 66 fairlane,boss pistons,unknown comp cam,edelbrock inlet and 850 double pumper and headers,this is food for thought.
I can't imagine many brits having clevelands besides enthusiasts, clevelands were just an engine back in Australia and your mom would have one in her falcon since fuel was cheap back in the day in aus
I owned a 71 Boss 351 Mustang for many years, Torker intake, Holley carb, Crane F246 cam, and headers...was a beast. The 2.78 first gear in the Toploader with the 3.91 rear was perfect. Currently have a ‘62 Chevy II with a clone of a 71 LT-1 (flat top pistons), Muncie M-20 (2.54 first gear) and 3.73 rear, it is light and quick but there will ALWAYS be a place in my heart and garage for the 351C!!! The only boosted car in the garage is my son’s Civic hatch with a turbo B20 (total blast to drive!) but Richard, your videos REALLY have me thinking 🤔!!!!!
MW…The ‘71 Boss 351 was actually a beast in factory stock trim. I read all of the magazine test articles back then and it was one of the quickest quarter mile performers of all the Mustangs. In showroom stock trim it put the Boss 429 to shame with mid 13 second performance. With the upgrades you listed, it would be a TERROR ! I regret not buying one but I was into my ‘69 Mach 1, 428 CJ with ram air during that time.
My dad brought home a 1971 Boss Mustang on a hot summer's' evening when my 6 siblings and friends next door were playing football on the front lawn. We heard it ripping up the road and blasting past like a bullet. It was dusk so the running lights were on and it looked like a damn spaceship! It went out of sight over the next hill and as we all just stood there talking amongst ourselves as to what that was, we heard tires screaming and an engine roaring 1st, 2nd, 3rd CRAP! then up over the hill blistering towards us. Then the gearing down it went sideways into our side yard and stopped on the driveway. As the dust was clearing my dad steps out, I swear he looked like a NASA astronaut at that moment stepping out of that black beauty! OMG!! I was in love with that machine instantly! That car was crazy fast and that motor took some massive punishment from my dads lead foot. it was Truly a MUSTANG Stallion! I washed and waxed it every weekend. My dad gave it to me when I got my 1st job at Red & White Grocery Store when I was in the 10th grade. I was a car junky from then on and have had some nice rides since that day in my life. Unfortunately some (EVIL) dude, lol.. Came to our house and offered my dad some serious cash and my black beauty streaked away into my memories. I still have a lot of feelings about those days and that car, I wish I had her today... When I turned 18 I left Georgia for the San Fernando Valley, wow what an amazing time to be young and a car guy. I saw a 1969 Mach 1 at a street race that had been on the cover of Hot Rod magazine. It was Red, Lowered, big fat tires awesomely trimmed out interior that looked like a cockpit of a fighter jet packing a 351 C with a (PAXTON SUPERCHARGER)!!! 1st time I ever heard that beautiful sound! He raced a 1970 chevelle that had a 454 with a blower sticking out of the hood. The mustang blew out of the hole like a rocket and the chevelle front end went in the air... Mustang GONE!!! Great days!
The 351C-4v was far and away the best small block offered during the muscle car era. I really loved this engine and had one in a 1967 notchback Mustang.
I do, I've own a couple of them myself and I also have built a few for friends and or customers over the years. The 351C is my favorite small block Ford v8.
@@jesco6830 Stick with 2v heads for street/daily driver use, use clevite inserts for mains and rods, MSD for ignition, I like Badger or Mahle pistons, and you need to use a good high volumn oil pump, Chrome moly rings, brass head gaskets if you can get them. Felpro for all gaskets and seals. Find a good reputable machine shop to do your block and head work. You can't go wrong with a Cleveland !!!
🚫🤔 Hmmm....... After watching ^this video, you wanted to see a Charger!? This is strange.... Normally, when people start seeing Ford history and performance related stuff, they lose interest in ALL other car brands. That's the normal, healthy response. It's very concerning that after watching a Ford engine video, you STILL had a desire to see a Mopar product! Granted, it would be even more "troubling", if you'd expressed a desire to see Chevy stuff! I'm just going to recommend that you look at more Ford/Mercury related stuff. That should permanently wipe out any of these "errant desires" to see Mopar products! Watch some videos on 1964 and 1965 A/FX & B/FX Mercury Comets, some historical, mid 60s Ford GT40 LeMans videos, some Cobra stuff, and maybe some 1964 Thunderbolt Fairlane videos. That should cure you! 😁👍
@@HighlanderNorth1 I'm pretty sure he meant that he would like to see his 400 Ford build with the addition of the "super"charger he used on the 351C. Being that both engines are in the 335 series it should bolt right up. I would honestly like to see that too, even though I'm more partial to a turbocharger.
Cleveland country thankyou Richard, hahha. The 351c realy gave use the taste and feel of pinned to the seat. 10 hail marrys to ford. Thanks for anather awsome test Richard. Mad Mick .
Hi, Rich..... Thanks. God LOVES a Cleveland.... I am sure your fannage love the idea of a blown ( BOOM! ) 4 JUGGER.. And yes, M owners EVERYWHERE are clamoring for the BIG M with the blower... Is it possible, turbo wise, to put the ultime in free horse, to duplicate the cad-zilla syndrome on the BIG M? Also, 'round here, fresh air will soon be restricted... In tribute to fresh air everywhere ( unlike Sir HOLDENER, we live in a dead Sea zone...And not in the cali-4 knee hills, there's no rarefied air up there.... Yes, the loco politico's heads tend to be in disfunctional mode due to low oxygen about... You lucky dog... In altitude.there is absence. NO STEVE ABOUT..! GOD BLESS.
The problem with these engines beyond the bottom ends weren't very good is that they're the size and weight of a bbc while not having as good performance. Hell some bbc might be lighter with the factory aluminum heads and intake.
I had a Q-code 73 351 Mach 1 Mustang in the late 70's . I wish a lot of things , but I really would wish that I had known about blow through boost back then , since that year the Q-code only had 7.9 comp ratio (I think) , and would have been a good candidate . It would rev pretty freely and it had 4-bolt mains straight across the crank . I know , because I put a hole in the oil pan (going too fast on a hilly road) , and had to remove it 😑 . I sure miss those days ! Love your channel !!
I had a mild 2v cleavland back in the early 90's in my LTD. What a great engine! So watching this brought back some very fond memories.👍 I took out the FMX 3speed and put in a FIOD trans with a 4pinion and 4:11 gears - it did a flat 13.0 down the quarter with some problems holdingnit back.
When was a teenager in 80s in Australia 351 where insane the smoked all other v8.been in heaps 351 got plenty memories they snap head back real quick.my mate had one in a xd station wagon it was insane to say they least.had to turn it off in drive thru in KFC just to order man that thing went.peace
Thank you, Richard! I’m a 351 Cleveland fanatic, so loved this. How about trying a low-budget, junkyard, salvageable Turbo on the Boss 351? Btw, I’ve got a 4v, 351CLEVELAND, w ‘70 quench heads, ‘71 4bolt , .030 bored block that I’ll eventually put in my ‘64 Mercury Cyclone...one of these days.😃
Always been a Chevy guy, but have a lot respect for the Cleveland. The 2v head with an aftermarket 4v intake to match the heads made an amazing combo..
Now I know you're a good guy, You loved Lost in space as much as I did and still do !!! Got all of em on DVD DANGER WILL ROBINSON alien approaching. All the best Sir.
I have a built cleveland I'm about to put some boost to. About 7-8 lbs, what ever waste gate pressure is. I have a different build but the HP is about the same. This gives me a good idea of what to expect. My 600 hp goal looks easy.Still be a good daily and also a sleeper.
Do you remember the other one ? I think it was called "It's About Space or Time and Space . I watched "Lost" too . "I'm too young to die" , that guy was pretty queen , even for those days! 🪐
@@jpsullivan4845 5500!What? Twist mine to 7500 with roller rockers and fresh valve springs when racing,otherwise a 7000 chip in the rev limiter-2 step.
Ha ha ha a Clevo cool great to see here in New Zealand it was Clevo that were in the Fords ,had a 302 clevo just rebulit with hi tops and a good street cam 2v ported head 750 DP tri y into 2 then one !977 Ford Fairmont lux pac ,had converter and rebuild C4 rear disc 8.8 3.5 lsd was a quick car ,lotta CNC 3V heads these days as 2V were to small and 4V were to big lol
I am from the US and I love cleveland engines. I have a 2v from a 74 Fairlane I believe according to the code on it and I'm gonna do a sequential turbo setup and stuff it in my 2000 sonoma 🤪. Oh I'm planning on a modern fuel injection system as well with a racing setup dual fuel rails one set of smaller injectors for street and a bigger set for strip just cause I think it'd be cool.
I knew they were good but I didn't expect the heads to be that good! Cam change monster! I get it now The Old pro stock guys like Bob Glidden did amazing things back in the day!
Awesome. Would love to see you revisit this one.... especially correcting for the issues that you had with it.. Would love to hear this thing sing on the dyno... video maybe? 😁 just sayin..
Thanks Richard I'm from Tamworth Aust and I have been really enjoying your work with the cleveland 351. Awesome engine. Really would love to see a comparison 4v vs 2v Aussi heads to dispell the myth that 4v is no good for street. Also with this engine with single plane. I have 4v single plane 750dp that pulls solid from 2k and is an animal from 3.5k to 6.5k . I think having the right combo is more important with 4v over 2v. Don't dispell a single plane on one of these for street use either. I have tried 3 different carb combinations, 750vs = Ok. 650dp = better. 750dp = best. And to my surprise the 750dp gave best low end in comparison to older Holley 4150 carb. To add this is with a single pattern high lift flat tappet hydraulic cam. An old crane 280h energiser 228 @ .50 . I think where I am going is that some things that may be intuitive may not necessarily be correct with the clevo 4v when comparing with other engines.
Blood Moon, your comments about how critical having the right combination for the 4-V heads setup for street use are right on the money. The single plane intake,750 DP along with a carefully selected cam is a monster on the street with the correct supporting parts. The correct differential gear ratio is equally important too. 👍
Richard love all your videos and due diligence. I got one of these Cleveland's. Maybe thinking about give me a little extra help. Anyways brother keep up the great work love your shows always watch them always share them amen
Excellent walk through. What are the options if you did not want to use Carb. Could you used a 4150 efi full setup? Paxton states the unit needs a blow-thru carb. However, I called them and they didn't have much of an answer for me about efi, other than "we didn't try it." Is there any reason why a smart EFI wouldn't work with a Paxton? Thanks
i have had quite a few Clevelands as well as quite a few chevy combos and the Cleveland would run off from any of the others even my LS in my truck will not keep up with my Cleveland
Would love to see some tests of a 302 Cleveland build. And no, they are nothing like a Boss 302. Small port, 2V heads closed chamber and 9.2:1 compression. I don't think anyone has ever done a 302 Cleveland engine dyno video and modify the 302 to see where it could go.
Great video. I would love to see it with the inner cooler, bigger cam, ported cast iron heads, proper belt, aftermarket intake. Just wondering what the numbers would be.
My brother N law had a 70 Torino GT with a 351 Cleveland 4 speed that ran the quarter mile in the low 13s and I still have a 71 Ranchero with a 351 Cleveland
Really enjoyed this video despite not being a Ford fan (Holden / Chev fan through and through) but it was nice to see some dyno figures to go along with the engines we built decades ago. It confirmed what I long knew, that you need a healthy cam to get the most out of 4V heads. It was also very interesting to see how much of a dog the factory cast iron intake was. Was a heavy lump of poo.
Perfect for any Fox body! A lot less weight than a 460, although a 460 can be bored and stroked all the way to 557cid. But it's a lot heavier. That gives me an idea though: build another 557 and boost that! Roots, centrifugal, and turbo! Should be an 1100hp monster!
I am pure Ford guy and I love all Ford Hi Perfomance engines, but the design of the Cleveland was mad buy a guy that came from GM to Ford back in the day that’s why the flow so good with the big GM style canted valve heads!
I have a modified 351c 4v version With edlebrock torker intake single plane, 1.6 roller rockers forgot cam an piston brand but pistons are .010 over dome top, hooker long tube headers, holley 750 dp all mechanical. Makes more hp than the factory 390 my car came with and I couldn't be happier
Any interest in looking at the European v8 the Audi 4.2 - (the de facto European hot rod engine), jaguar xj8 4.0 or 4.2, bmw 4.4.would be interesting to see how they compare to the domesticv8’S
I watched the original Lost in Space when it aired on regular network TV waaaaay back in the day. I think we learned Richard is a bad ass that just makes shit happen.
Did you ever revisit the experiment doing things the way you should have? The Supercharger probably would have pared better with the low compression/open chambered heads. The Cleveland is my favorite engine. I hate that it has been forgotten as a performance engine
@@richardholdener1727 I'm by no means comparing my knowledge to yours. I'm not a mechanic at all. I thought I heard comment in the video suggesting the high compression ratio was a problem. A problem that made the engine require race gas to run. Didn't you say you needed an intercooler? That's why I commented about the low compression heads. I just wondered if you had considered using them for your situation.
You should try some first gen AMC v8s, they come stock with forged crankshaft and rods and not a lot of people know about them. The 327 can be brored and stroked to over 400ci too
351 Cleveland is my favorite engine of all time!! From racing in Nascar to Ford Powered Street cars, Cleveland’s ROCK!!!
Yep. Right there!
Bob Glidden had a 32-0 season with his 78 Fairmont with the Cleve. Never lost a single round and i believe is the only undefeated record for a season in NHRA.
Glidden's Pro Stock win record was only surpassed by big corp. interests, while Glidden developed his own race engines, making him the Gate Keeper of big Ford power. His BBF Thunderbird and 1985 Pro Stock Championship solidified Glidden's spot in the NHRA Hall of Fame.
@@BobbyOfEarth
☑️ Yeah, and I think Bob Glidden used Boss 429 engines in his 1980's big block Pro Stock T-bird for at least 1 or more seasons. That just adds a whole other level of coolness to his racing history!
@@chadkent1241 Bullshit.
My dad brought home a 1971 Boss Mustang on a hot summer's' evening when my 6 siblings and friends next door were playing football on the front lawn. We heard it ripping up the road and blasting past like a bullet. It was dusk so the running lights were on and it looked like a damn spaceship! It went out of sight over the next hill and as we all just stood there talking amongst ourselves as to what that was, we heard tires screaming and an engine roaring 1st, 2nd, 3rd CRAP! then up over the hill blistering towards us. Then the gearing down it went sideways into our side yard and stopped on the driveway. As the dust was clearing my dad steps out, I swear he looked like a NASA astronaut at that moment stepping out of that black beauty! OMG!! I was in love with that machine instantly! That car was crazy fast and that motor took some massive punishment from my dads lead foot. it was Truly a MUSTANG Stallion! I washed and waxed it every weekend. My dad gave it to me when I got my 1st job at Red & White Grocery Store when I was in the 10th grade. I was a car junky from then on and have had some nice rides since that day in my life. Unfortunately some (EVIL) dude, lol.. Came to our house and offered my dad some serious cash and my black beauty streaked away into my memories. I still have a lot of feelings about those days and that car, I wish I had her today... When I turned 18 I left Georgia for the San Fernando Valley, wow what an amazing time to be young and a car guy. I saw a 1969 Mach 1 at a street race that had been on the cover of Hot Rod magazine. It was Red, Lowered, big fat tires awesomely trimmed out interior that looked like a cockpit of a fighter jet packing a 351 C with a (PAXTON SUPERCHARGER)!!! 1st time I ever heard that beautiful sound! He raced a 1970 chevelle that had a 454 with a blower sticking out of the hood. The mustang blew out of the hole like a rocket and the chevelle front end went in the air... Mustang GONE!!! Great days!
I have this in my 72 Mustang convertible - an M code and even found a D1ZX aluminum intake. Got the motor out of a wrecked Cougar Eliminator several decades ago. Love this motor. I beat my friends 396 SS Chevelle, which made me pretty happy. I've since added a toploader and a 9" rear ... such a fun drive. Thanks for spotlighting this...made me smile.
I had a old school engine builder tell me the best thing about a Cleveland 4V is the Port is so big that they could fill the floor of the intake port with epoxy and then work on the Port roof ending up with a funnel shape intake port with a almost straight shot at the valve. That engine builder was Carl Holbrook.
Kevin, the biggest problem with the factory iron 4-V heads is the exhaust ports. To fit between the narrow confines between Mustang and Cougar shock towers, the exhaust ports were designed with a restrictive ridge on the floor and a sharp downward turn at the exit. The Pro Stock builders fixed it by removing a large section of the exhaust port and installing an aluminum exhaust port plate. The exhaust flow has a straight shot out instead of being slowed down by the sharp downward turn. They also did as you suggested by filling the intake port floors with epoxy or an aluminum insert and raising the port roof. I have a set of them. They are called high port iron Cleveland heads. You can google it or check out DragBoss Garage on TH-cam.
@@kevind3185 just remember- if headers don't come out of head 3" before turning downward,then might as well not run high port as it defeats it's purpose!
Man I'm so pleased you still make videos on these old SBF's, so many people still have em!
no such thing as a small block or big block ford. Those are terms chevy used.
FE Series. 385 Series. 335 series. The 351c is a Ford 335 series engine. It feels icky using chevy terms on a great Ford engine.
@@todsimpkins8908 … You’re absolutely correct about the small and big block terminology but this far along in the game there’s really no point in trying to change things. The general public can more easily relate to the engines using the GM nomenclature. Now if they would just stop referring to INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINES, (ICE), as MOTORS, it would send a massive wave of understanding across the planet with WORLD PEACE ☮️ left in its wake.
Well … maybe not that dramatic 😳but one is electric powered and the other uses gasoline for fuel and nothing in common. It just sounds odd when a professional, educated builder calls an ICE….MOTOR 🤷♂️
@@danielwilson6665when you’re talking about a particular engine yes use the correct terminology because that’s the name of the engine we’re talking about not going to call it what it’s not
@@CoyoteFTW … 100% Agree. Just trying to get it right 🏁.
Wow! Now that's a huge! I like that torque curve. Look how flat it is on the top end. That would make a super duper fun motor.
Yeah. He talked about how he installed a new cam, and he showed a picture of that cam install at 6:10. But imagine how much more power it would make if he actually pushed the cam in more, and installed it all the way into the engine! 😁
My 79 F150 has a mildly built 9:1 351C-2V. Edelbrock Intake, Barry Grant Carb, Crane Cam, Headman Headers, 2 1/2 duals with X pipe and 40 series Flowmasters. The X-Pipe really mellows the 40 series Flowmasters. C-4 upgraded internals and shift kit, 3:55 gears with 30 inch rubber. 15 mpg around town, 18 mpg on highway running steady 70 mph. Smokes the tires when wanted and stone dead reliable. Estimated 325hp/380 torque Net readings with Water pump, power steering and Alternator according to my dyno software on my PC. Love my Cleveland.
351 Cleveland, Giant slayer.
Always like to see the Cleveland stuff! I just had another 2V one given to me last week.
Jealous!
The Cleveland is a very under appreciated engine love to see this test with a whipple twin screw and intercooler the hp potential on a stockish Cleveland is ridiculous… thx for work Richard best pure engine/horse power channel on youtube! Keep up the great work!
Thank You Richard. Love to see Cleveland builds.
Yes! Cleveland are awesome! Needs a tunnel ram!
Mild boost, belt slipping. Still flirts with 700 hp. Gotta luv a Cleveland 👍
With factory heads and block! Ford built that engine to run!
I've been dieing to see this. I picked up a 351c with 4v heads and a c4 trans from a 71 stang. For $250cad. The old man was 92 years old and still building cars. I was impressed 👌
Troy, even if those heads are the less desirable 4V open chamber design, you got an excellent deal for sure 👍
No matter what u do with these engines they make good power, thats what they were designed for, its so nice to see gus like you showing some of what these great engines really are capable of, thank for these awesome videos👍👍👍
Dano, big power is exactly what the design engineers had in mind. Unfortunately a combination of OPEC countries creating a false oil shortage to jack up gasoline prices, government regulations for reduced emissions, insurance companies penalizing high output vehicles and more all hit about the same time the Cleveland was released. It was a huge shit storm that put an end to all muscle car production by 1973. According to the few documents I could find, Ford had big plans for the Cleveland as the FE series was being phased out and they also knew that NASCAR Would soon be requiring mid-sized engines for competition. The Cleveland was going to be the engine of choice for virtually all forms of Motorsport competition.
What factory engineer in his right mind would design an engine with such massive ports and valves if serious competition wasn’t on the agenda ? Although it was an available option for the family truckster grocery getter station wagon for a minute, that certainly wasn’t what the long term goal was.
not all cleveland fans are in OZ,welcome from the UK,have a 351 4V in a 66 fairlane,boss pistons,unknown comp cam,edelbrock inlet and 850 double pumper and headers,this is food for thought.
I can't imagine many brits having clevelands besides enthusiasts, clevelands were just an engine back in Australia and your mom would have one in her falcon since fuel was cheap back in the day in aus
I love Clevelands. Thanks for the content.
I owned a 71 Boss 351 Mustang for many years, Torker intake, Holley carb, Crane F246 cam, and headers...was a beast. The 2.78 first gear in the Toploader with the 3.91 rear was perfect. Currently have a ‘62 Chevy II with a clone of a 71 LT-1 (flat top pistons), Muncie M-20 (2.54 first gear) and 3.73 rear, it is light and quick but there will ALWAYS be a place in my heart and garage for the 351C!!! The only boosted car in the garage is my son’s Civic hatch with a turbo B20 (total blast to drive!) but Richard, your videos REALLY have me thinking 🤔!!!!!
MW…The ‘71 Boss 351 was actually a beast in factory stock trim. I read all of the magazine test articles back then and it was one of the quickest quarter mile performers of all the Mustangs. In showroom stock trim it put the Boss 429 to shame with mid 13 second performance. With the upgrades you listed, it would be a TERROR ! I regret not buying one but I was into my ‘69 Mach 1, 428 CJ with ram air during that time.
My dad brought home a 1971 Boss Mustang on a hot summer's' evening when my 6 siblings and friends next door were playing football on the front lawn. We heard it ripping up the road and blasting past like a bullet. It was dusk so the running lights were on and it looked like a damn spaceship! It went out of sight over the next hill and as we all just stood there talking amongst ourselves as to what that was, we heard tires screaming and an engine roaring 1st, 2nd, 3rd CRAP! then up over the hill blistering towards us. Then the gearing down it went sideways into our side yard and stopped on the driveway. As the dust was clearing my dad steps out, I swear he looked like a NASA astronaut at that moment stepping out of that black beauty! OMG!! I was in love with that machine instantly! That car was crazy fast and that motor took some massive punishment from my dads lead foot. it was Truly a MUSTANG Stallion! I washed and waxed it every weekend. My dad gave it to me when I got my 1st job at Red & White Grocery Store when I was in the 10th grade. I was a car junky from then on and have had some nice rides since that day in my life. Unfortunately some (EVIL) dude, lol.. Came to our house and offered my dad some serious cash and my black beauty streaked away into my memories. I still have a lot of feelings about those days and that car, I wish I had her today... When I turned 18 I left Georgia for the San Fernando Valley, wow what an amazing time to be young and a car guy. I saw a 1969 Mach 1 at a street race that had been on the cover of Hot Rod magazine. It was Red, Lowered, big fat tires awesomely trimmed out interior that looked like a cockpit of a fighter jet packing a 351 C with a (PAXTON SUPERCHARGER)!!! 1st time I ever heard that beautiful sound! He raced a 1970 chevelle that had a 454 with a blower sticking out of the hood. The mustang blew out of the hole like a rocket and the chevelle front end went in the air... Mustang GONE!!! Great days!
The 351C-4v was far and away the best small block offered during the muscle car era. I really loved this engine and had one in a 1967 notchback Mustang.
Your the best, much love for all you do for us! And a big thank you Richard!
The 351 Cleveland. America's best kept secret. No one knows anything about it except the Australians....
I do, I've own a couple of them myself and I also have built a few for friends and or customers over the years. The 351C is my favorite small block Ford v8.
Haha so true.
@@lawnmowermanlawnmowerman9930 can you give me some advice for building a 351 Cleveland?
@@jesco6830 Stick with 2v heads for street/daily driver use, use clevite inserts for mains and rods, MSD for ignition, I like Badger or Mahle pistons, and you need to use a good high volumn oil pump, Chrome moly rings, brass head gaskets if you can get them. Felpro for all gaskets and seals. Find a good reputable machine shop to do your block and head work. You can't go wrong with a Cleveland !!!
@@lawnmowermanlawnmowerman9930 I plan on stroking it to a 393 or 408 and using 195 or 225 trickflow heads.
Yes we are us Aussies love the clevo😍
Very good Richard. Thank you for this.🎉😊
That’s an impressive toque curve!
My first car was a '71 Mach 1 with a 351C-4V. That motor came alive with a hot cam, headers and an 850 Holley carb, even with the original intake.
Present, Sir! I'm a Cleveland guy. Because boost makes everything better.
Would love to see the charger on the the 400 you built.
🚫🤔 Hmmm....... After watching ^this video, you wanted to see a Charger!? This is strange.... Normally, when people start seeing Ford history and performance related stuff, they lose interest in ALL other car brands. That's the normal, healthy response. It's very concerning that after watching a Ford engine video, you STILL had a desire to see a Mopar product! Granted, it would be even more "troubling", if you'd expressed a desire to see Chevy stuff!
I'm just going to recommend that you look at more Ford/Mercury related stuff. That should permanently wipe out any of these "errant desires" to see Mopar products! Watch some videos on 1964 and 1965 A/FX & B/FX Mercury Comets, some historical, mid 60s Ford GT40 LeMans videos, some Cobra stuff, and maybe some 1964 Thunderbolt Fairlane videos. That should cure you! 😁👍
@Hunter Limbach
It was! Although I'm mainly a Ford guy, I'm driving my Dodge Ram pickup right now! 😁
That 400 build was bad! One of my favorite he has done
@@HighlanderNorth1 I'm pretty sure he meant that he would like to see his 400 Ford build with the addition of the "super"charger he used on the 351C. Being that both engines are in the 335 series it should bolt right up. I would honestly like to see that too, even though I'm more partial to a turbocharger.
@@g44sarge
Is the 400M block strong from the standpoint of a performance build?
Cleveland country thankyou Richard, hahha. The 351c realy gave use the taste and feel of pinned to the seat. 10 hail marrys to ford. Thanks for anather awsome test Richard. Mad Mick .
"Danger Rich Holdener - DANGER!" (arms flailing & lights a flashin)
yes
Hi, Rich.....
Thanks.
God LOVES a Cleveland....
I am sure your fannage love the idea of a blown ( BOOM! ) 4 JUGGER..
And yes, M owners EVERYWHERE are clamoring for the BIG M with the blower...
Is it possible, turbo wise, to put the ultime in free horse, to duplicate the cad-zilla syndrome on the BIG M?
Also, 'round here, fresh air will soon be restricted...
In tribute to fresh air everywhere ( unlike Sir HOLDENER, we live in a dead Sea zone...And not in the cali-4 knee hills, there's no rarefied air up there....
Yes, the loco politico's heads tend to be in disfunctional mode due to low oxygen about...
You lucky dog...
In altitude.there is absence.
NO STEVE ABOUT..!
GOD BLESS.
351C fan since 1980 here in Michigan.
I’m a Chevy fan but this motor impressed me.
@Brock Main3 I totally agree. It’s nice to see a variety and the innovations of each manufacturer.
The problem with these engines beyond the bottom ends weren't very good is that they're the size and weight of a bbc while not having as good performance. Hell some bbc might be lighter with the factory aluminum heads and intake.
@@HioSSilver1999 no they are a small block you're confusing it with a 351M
@@vernonknight9455 no...I'm looking at the size, weight and deck height. With that i come to the conclusion it's big block size.
@@HioSSilver1999 9.2 deck height 351W 9.5 BBC 9.8ish 351M 400 10.3
I had a Q-code 73 351 Mach 1 Mustang in the late 70's . I wish a lot of things , but I really would wish that I had known about blow through boost back then , since that year the Q-code only had 7.9 comp ratio (I think) , and would have been a good candidate . It would rev pretty freely and it had 4-bolt mains straight across the crank . I know , because I put a hole in the oil pan (going too fast on a hilly road) , and had to remove it 😑 . I sure miss those days ! Love your channel !!
It's my turn today...I love this one.
Mine was in a 71 Pantera...it was fun
My dream car.
My neighbor had a yellow 74. They had to redo the heads on it and ran it with open headers for a test. Pure music👍
Richard you are the best engine guy and I love my 351c/408c stroker love you here in Oz
I had a mild 2v cleavland back in the early 90's in my LTD. What a great engine!
So watching this brought back some very fond memories.👍
I took out the FMX 3speed and put in a FIOD trans with a 4pinion and 4:11 gears - it did a flat 13.0 down the quarter with some problems holdingnit back.
Probably was a 351m. Most people don't know the difference.
Richard great work we really enjoyed this
When was a teenager in 80s in Australia 351 where insane the smoked all other v8.been in heaps 351 got plenty memories they snap head back real quick.my mate had one in a xd station wagon it was insane to say they least.had to turn it off in drive thru in KFC just to order man that thing went.peace
Thank you, Richard! I’m a 351 Cleveland fanatic, so loved this.
How about trying a low-budget, junkyard, salvageable Turbo on the Boss 351?
Btw, I’ve got a 4v, 351CLEVELAND, w ‘70 quench heads, ‘71 4bolt , .030 bored block that I’ll eventually put in my ‘64 Mercury Cyclone...one of these days.😃
VERY HARD TO FIND ANY MORE
My '70 Mach 1 was damn fast with the 351C4V - I never lost a race against a 350 Camaro.
Always been a Chevy guy, but have a lot respect for the Cleveland. The 2v head with an aftermarket 4v intake to match the heads made an amazing combo..
Defiantly had some great low end torque and was still very potent on the top...
Clevo!! Yes!!!! Hi from Tamworth Australia :D
do you have King Browns in your area?
Also from Tamworth Aust. Yes they are all over most of Aust but not a problem for most people.
Now I know you're a good guy, You loved Lost in space as much as I did and still do !!! Got all of em on DVD
DANGER WILL ROBINSON alien approaching.
All the best Sir.
I'm still a big fan-even watched the Netflicks version-loved that they used the original Robot voice
I had a Boss351c, great motor. Sounds great wound out.
Shout out to you brother,i ❤ my Cleveland s please keep testing them on tube, cheers from down under👌😆👍
There’s a good reason we’re clevo fans, great engines!! Check out TM Meyer, they’re making their own Cleveland bock
I have a built cleveland I'm about to put some boost to. About 7-8 lbs, what ever waste gate pressure is. I have a different build but the HP is about the same. This gives me a good idea of what to expect. My 600 hp goal looks easy.Still be a good daily and also a sleeper.
Hell Yeah!!! 351C all day !!!! Not modern not big hp but I love it! From Aus.
We want to see More of this.🤗🤗🤗🤗🤗
I used to watch Lost in Space series every Sunday morning before church!
Do you remember the other one ? I think it was called "It's About Space or Time and Space . I watched "Lost" too . "I'm too young to die" , that guy was pretty queen , even for those days! 🪐
I had a 72 mach1 with 2V Cleveland and later had a 70 mach1 with 4V Cleveland .Loved the Cleveland motor.
Ok, Lost In Space? Richard, you are, yet again, my hero.
Clevelands Rock, not just the power but the sound they make around 5500 rpms. Wish we could hear that Paxton!
@@jpsullivan4845 5500!What? Twist mine to 7500 with roller rockers and fresh valve springs when racing,otherwise a 7000 chip in the rev limiter-2 step.
Awesome!! Would love to have lend you my rare 4V Bud Moore “NASCAR” intake for a N/A test with some big rpm’s 💪🏼🏁
69JANKS… With a suitable long block with components worthy of that Bud Moore intake, that would be totally badass 🏁.
@@danielwilson6665 👍🏼🏁
Ha ha ha a Clevo cool great to see here in New Zealand it was Clevo that were in the Fords ,had a 302 clevo just rebulit with hi tops and a good street cam 2v ported head 750 DP tri y into 2 then one !977 Ford Fairmont lux pac ,had converter and rebuild C4 rear disc 8.8 3.5 lsd was a quick car ,lotta CNC 3V heads these days as 2V were to small and 4V were to big lol
When there's a will there's a way. Cool to see.
I am from the US and I love cleveland engines. I have a 2v from a 74 Fairlane I believe according to the code on it and I'm gonna do a sequential turbo setup and stuff it in my 2000 sonoma 🤪. Oh I'm planning on a modern fuel injection system as well with a racing setup dual fuel rails one set of smaller injectors for street and a bigger set for strip just cause I think it'd be cool.
I knew they were good but I didn't expect the heads to be that good! Cam change monster! I get it now The Old pro stock guys like Bob Glidden did amazing things back in the day!
Awesome. Would love to see you revisit this one.... especially correcting for the issues that you had with it.. Would love to hear this thing sing on the dyno... video maybe? 😁 just sayin..
Now you gotta boost a clevor. And then Cleveland with boss heads
Great to see the Clevo getting some love. We love them in Fords down here in Oz
XB turbo 351 m.th-cam.com/video/117dHt1a74k/w-d-xo.html
Thanks Richard I'm from Tamworth Aust and I have been really enjoying your work with the cleveland 351.
Awesome engine. Really would love to see a comparison 4v vs 2v Aussi heads to dispell the myth that 4v is no good for street. Also with this engine with single plane. I have 4v single plane 750dp that pulls solid from 2k and is an animal from 3.5k to 6.5k . I think having the right combo is more important with 4v over 2v. Don't dispell a single plane on one of these for street use either.
I have tried 3 different carb combinations, 750vs = Ok. 650dp = better. 750dp = best. And to my surprise the 750dp gave best low end in comparison to older Holley 4150 carb. To add this is with a single pattern high lift flat tappet hydraulic cam. An old crane 280h energiser 228 @ .50 .
I think where I am going is that some things that may be intuitive may not necessarily be correct with the clevo 4v when comparing with other engines.
Blood Moon, your comments about how critical having the right combination for the 4-V heads setup for street use are right on the money. The single plane intake,750 DP along with a carefully selected cam is a monster on the street with the correct supporting parts. The correct differential gear ratio is equally important too. 👍
My favorite v8!! Tough as a Bullitt
I love this clip and have got some of theme heads!
Richard love all your videos and due diligence. I got one of these Cleveland's. Maybe thinking about give me a little extra help. Anyways brother keep up the great work love your shows always watch them always share them amen
Excellent walk through. What are the options if you did not want to use Carb. Could you used a 4150 efi full setup? Paxton states the unit needs a blow-thru carb. However, I called them and they didn't have much of an answer for me about efi, other than "we didn't try it." Is there any reason why a smart EFI wouldn't work with a Paxton?
Thanks
The 351 Cleveland was the most powerful small block.
Great test man my favorite engine😀
i have had quite a few Clevelands as well as quite a few chevy combos and the Cleveland would run off from any of the others even my LS in my truck will not keep up with my Cleveland
122k awesome seeing this channel grow
Would love to see some tests of a 302 Cleveland build.
And no, they are nothing like a Boss 302. Small port, 2V heads closed chamber and 9.2:1 compression.
I don't think anyone has ever done a 302 Cleveland engine dyno video and modify the 302 to see where it could go.
Great video. I would love to see it with the inner cooler, bigger cam, ported cast iron heads, proper belt, aftermarket intake. Just wondering what the numbers would be.
750+ at least… wrap a Pantera around it 😂😂😂🤙🏻🇺🇸
are the 4V heads a straight swap if i have a 2V motor? Would be interesting to see a 2V vs 4V video.
My brother N law had a 70 Torino GT with a 351 Cleveland 4 speed that ran the quarter mile in the low 13s and I still have a 71 Ranchero with a 351 Cleveland
Love me some Cleveland power! Thanks for sharing and please tell me you have turbocharged one of these before!? Would love to see the results!!!!
Love my 1970 ranchero 351 cleve o 4v. With the correct parts a 7500 screamer
👍 Good build.
That was great! I have a 351 C in my 67 Mustang much better then the old 289! I would love to see you do more with the 351 C:)
Really enjoyed this video despite not being a Ford fan (Holden / Chev fan through and through) but it was nice to see some dyno figures to go along with the engines we built decades ago. It confirmed what I long knew, that you need a healthy cam to get the most out of 4V heads. It was also very interesting to see how much of a dog the factory cast iron intake was. Was a heavy lump of poo.
Sounds like you're describing the garbage you run, "fee fiftty fourbarrel, whiffa four speed, is a junkyard of poo!!!
I had a 351 Cleveland in a 67 mustang. Definitely a tire Roaster. ❤️❤️❤️🏁🏁🏁
Yeah absolutely love my stroker clevland plenty of power and reliable aswell
The Cleveland is one of my favorite motors
Perfect for any Fox body! A lot less weight than a 460, although a 460 can be bored and stroked all the way to 557cid. But it's a lot heavier. That gives me an idea though: build another 557 and boost that! Roots, centrifugal, and turbo! Should be an 1100hp monster!
I am pure Ford guy and I love all Ford Hi Perfomance engines, but the design of the Cleveland was mad buy a guy that came from GM to Ford back in the day that’s why the flow so good with the big GM style canted valve heads!
I would like to the same test but with a 351c 2v !
351 2V with 302 2Vs. Then you have some compression. Though for blower maybe the open chamber 2Vs would be ok.
Yep 2V closed cahmbers might make a big comebake yet
Hi from Oz. Liked your vid.
Awesome! Thank you!
I have a modified 351c 4v version With edlebrock torker intake single plane, 1.6 roller rockers forgot cam an piston brand but pistons are .010 over dome top, hooker long tube headers, holley 750 dp all mechanical. Makes more hp than the factory 390 my car came with and I couldn't be happier
Any interest in looking at the European v8 the Audi 4.2 - (the de facto European hot rod engine), jaguar xj8 4.0 or 4.2, bmw 4.4.would be interesting to see how they compare to the domesticv8’S
Definitely a Cleveland fan
A Scott Cook dual plane looks factory stock, but flows somewhat better. Might have been interesting.
I watched the original Lost in Space when it aired on regular network TV waaaaay back in the day.
I think we learned Richard is a bad ass that just makes shit happen.
Wow Amazing! With a little ingenuity you can pretty much accomplish anything hehe! Thanks for the video Richard, this is always fun to watch :)
I'd love to see how much hp those 4V heads can support on a boss 351 maxed out
794 hp
The intake to head port mismatch may have even helped!
Kinda like anti-reversion header flanges. (Cyclone?)
Did you ever revisit the experiment doing things the way you should have? The Supercharger probably would have pared better with the low compression/open chambered heads. The Cleveland is my favorite engine. I hate that it has been forgotten as a performance engine
why would lower compression and a less-efficient open-chamber head be better with boost
@@richardholdener1727 I'm by no means comparing my knowledge to yours. I'm not a mechanic at all. I thought I heard comment in the video suggesting the high compression ratio was a problem. A problem that made the engine require race gas to run. Didn't you say you needed an intercooler? That's why I commented about the low compression heads. I just wondered if you had considered using them for your situation.
Thank you richard
The Netflix remake is a lot better than I thought it would be.
Thanks Richard. I was playing around with ya earlier, your the best booster bro I know. Lol
no worries-mistakes were made...but....we won! Someone tell me what movie quote this is from-they win a prize!
@@richardholdener1727 Here comes the boom!! 2012
I think I can do this!
What?
Lose!!
Hilarious movie
This engine would be a total blast in my 64 comet cyclone!
You should try some first gen AMC v8s, they come stock with forged crankshaft and rods and not a lot of people know about them. The 327 can be brored and stroked to over 400ci too
Didn't amc make a 401
360 390 401 304 and I don't know what else I had a 69 390 javelin.