ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ค. 2023
- I played Destiny and Destiny 2 for years but eventually realised it wasn't the game for me. Here's where I let you know why it wasn't for me.
All my references. More to come and/or trust me that what I say is true b/c I can't find references.
Destiny 10-year structure
www.accelerated-ideas.com/news...
gamerant.com/destiny-dlc-comet/
Rise of Iron from D2 (in all fairness, I remember other sources, I just couldn't find them after all this time)
/ 1
10th Better Devils/D1 decisions problems
www.vg247.com/destiny-2-scrap...
D2/Y1 multiple studios
www.ign.com/games/destiny-2-e...
Bungie split/money from NetEase
www.polygon.com/2019/1/10/181...
Bungie and Tricks to get people to come back
www.ign.com/articles/2015/04/...
Bungie Vidoc/Luke Smith quote
• Bungie ViDoc - Out of ...
Exotic Champion Mechanic additions
www.gamesradar.com/destiny-2-...
Trials Rewards/Farming Weapons
• DO NOT GO FLAWLESS THI... \
Black Armory Weapon Frame Expansion
www.vgr.com/destiny-2-ada-1-w...
Emblems
www.bungie.net/7/en/News/arti...
www.bungie.net/7/en/News/arti...
Transmog - bad system
www.forbes.com/sites/paultass...
Transmog currency drop rate
www.eurogamer.net/destiny-2-s...
Sunseting stop justification
www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Det...
gamerant.com/destiny-2-sunset...
www.polygon.com/2021/2/25/223...
DCV
www.blueberries.gg/leveling/d...
Stopping of secret missions
thegamepost.com/bungie-destin...
gamerant.com/destiny-2-whispe...
Speedrunner Bans
gamerant.com/destiny-2-speedr...
Whisper of the Worm Changes
www.pcgamesn.com/destiny-2/se...
www.gameinformer.com/2019/05/...
www.gamesradar.com/destiny-2-...
Worldline Zero Zipping nerf (not actually sure when the nerf happened, but looking for sources, it was much earlier than I mentioned in my video)
www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post...
Melee ranges
• All Melee Ranges in De...
www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Det...
Telesto Breaking the Game (again more than I mentioned in the video)
www.forbes.com/sites/paultass...
telesto.report/
Justin Truman at GCC
• From Box Products to L... - เกม
The fact that I thought that first clip was recorded recently until I saw the power level speaks volumes to the current state of Destiny.
I hear that. Considering how long D2 has been around, it's surprising how many complaints were around years ago that are still around today.
What’s wrong with that clip?
sad story...good points of pat there but unfoprtunate nobyody of the devs will ever watch that video :(
@@Vestisimmer I'd love to have an honest convo with a dev but that's unlikely to happen. I really do wonder what their thought process is like on a lot of their decisions and would love straight answers. Bungie knows the community isn't happy and even without watching any videos, I'll guarantee you they know why it isn't happy. This may be another trust-retention-revenue moment starting again.
@@Blue-qt8ms Nothing wrong with the clip. Thing is the clip is from Forsaken, from Sept 2018, and people are still using the same guns on the same pvp maps and have the same bounties to complete. For a live service game that's supposed to evolve, it seems strangely like it hasn't changed.
I’d argue that making Destiny 2 a free to play game was a very problematic change. This is because it acts as a scapegoat for Bungie whenever they add a new, scummy monetization scheme. They get to increase the price for less and less content while saying they “have” to do it in order to keep the lights on.
On top of this, they now don’t make any money off the base game so they simply stopped caring about crucible, vanguard, and gambit
I’ve been playing this game for around 5 years and I’m at a point where I just log into the game, look at my character and just log off because I don’t wanna play this shit anymore
Oh, absolutely! I contend that D2 went FTP because Bungie saw player numbers go down and it was an easy way to entice people to download and try the game to get the weekly player base up. This is the same reason they went cross-play. Going cross-platform is a good thing overall in any game, but Bungie would not have done that if all platforms independently had healthy player bases. I think Bungie underestimate the impact it would have; it basically invited cheaters into PvP/Trials and I don't think they've ever been able to recover. The conspiracy theorist in me wants to say that D2 went FTP because Bungie didn't want to put resources into things that didn't make them money... but that's the conspiracy theorist in me. :)
Also it opens to people that expect a game that's free to play, with free content, but whenever someone dares complain about how much content is paid, others always use it as the scapegoat with the argument of "base game is free lol". Also generates lots of clashes between "hey, I think that Forsaken/Shadowkeep/those two subclasses should be free" and "oh how dare they make a content they worked for, be a paid content".
I read through the State of the Game yesterday and now watching this video I have really crystallized my thoughts about how I view Bungie as a publisher vs Bungie as a developer. I feel bad for the devs who want to improve the experience and are handicapped by poor allocation of resources and lack of a consistent vision for the game but I am not going to support or defend D2 as a product because its miserable outside of the content I am being gouged for.
I'm glad I could help you figure things out. Unfortunately this weird 'faster but buggier' mentality is hurting their reputation. D2 has a healthy player base right now but if Bungie handicaps their very talented devs, like you point out, it's not helping the quality of D2 content or Bungie's reputation and I'm wondering if will that worsening reputation will hurt Marathon's sales and player base in any way. I'm very curious to see how Marathon will play out over the first couple of years.
Everything you said is true i also feel like when people were saying Activision was the problem it was really Bungie. Activision pushed Bungie to make us quality content and not short change us like they have been doing.
Thanks for the kind words! It's very strange how Bungie made Activision look like the less greedy party. I never expected to say that combination of words but here we are. :)
Personally I feel it was a mix of both. Even in D1 we had lootboxes, paid events, early forms of paid boosters, timed exclusives. I think what happened was Bungie got corrupted by Activision during the time of D1, and when they split not everyone from Activision was gone. The people left behind were in higher positions and began to change the company further, and without the money and studios Activision provided Bungie was forced to go down a slope they were already willing to go down but hadn't because of the Activision oversight.
@@dpray96 It was probably a combination of a few things, yes. Without Activision, they didn't have the backing they had to get help in making content with HM and VV, so they felt they had to monitise to be able to do more content internally. In the GCD presentation from last year, Bungie's steps to get D2 running well again after the debacle that was year 1 were Trust, Retention and Revenue. They followed their plan, it seems, but may have forgotten step one and two in the process. :)
This was a great video! being a dedicated player myself I completely agree with most of these, bungie has lost their touch and truly see's their players as just wallets now. Its hard to hear and watch but personally I have to stick around till the end, the game itself isn't treated as it was originally but I still love reading the lore and finding out all sorts of different things that even after years of playing there's still 1 or 2 things I didn't know about. Thank you for telling your story and maybe one day (hopefully soon) there might be a change in how the players and the game are treated by bungie but we can only hope for now!!!
Thanks for the nice words! I didn't touch on the lore in this video because it wasn't really relevant to what I wanted to convey, but the lore in the Destiny games has always been fantastic. Bungie can absolutely tell a great story and tell it well. It was a bit think in year 1 but they knocked it out of the park with Forsaken and later seasons. And Conor, nothing wrong with wanting to play a game you like. Even if you find flaws in a game, doesn't mean it's bad. Let me know what you think of Lightfall as it keeps unfolding!
I cane back to the game around last Dec and this Jan, i was shocked to see that everything I had purchased was gone. I looked into it and i was under the impression the DCV would rotate regularly, i played through Shadowkeep, Beyond Light, and Witch Queen the latter gave me hope for the game, I got Lightfall and the annual pass, Lightfall comes oit and falls on its face, then the seasonal content, microtransaction hell, and overall seemingly disdainful attitude towards the players have made me very angry. Mainly because the game is like nothing else out there ( Yes I am aware of Warframe, im also aware of the issues that game faces) and it creates an itch that nothing else will scratch. Sadly even in its current state Bungie and Destiny 2 are some of the best, the whole industry is Gatcha and microtransaction focused and its hurting gaming overall.
I feel that. I somewhat kept up with the game (watching YT vids and things) even though I wasn't playing and even getting back into the game to get clips for the video, I was surprised at a lot of the changes. Destiny 2 is absolutely a unique experience and it does a lot of things right. Unfortunately, too many things things outside of the actual gameplay affect the game in negative ways and make it not worth my time.
You said it all. My thoughts exactly. Thank you!
I just want to add that the turning point for me was when Bungie took away half of the content I had paid for over the years with the main campaign, several expansions, a lot of strikes, destinations, maps, gear, weapons, all gone. That amount of content was hundreds of dollars worth of purchases. I consider it a scam and a robbery. How about you give my money back, Bungie???
On top of that, the switch to 'live service' is just a way to switch from being a company that makes a product that I can then purchase and keep playing as long as I like, to being a parasitic business model that keeps milking and leeching its players, sucking them dry while giving nothing in return.
I cannot and will not support this business model in any shape or form. And like you, I will never, EVER, buy anything from Bungie, ever again. No matter what they can come up with.
I knew about the DCV when I stopped playing; I think it was announced around the time I let go of the game. It was basically another log on the fire that warmed me up to the idea of noting playing the game anymore (cheesy, I know. :)). Even today, when I hear a new game is being released that looks exciting is a live-service/co-op/multiplayer experience, my interest drops 95%. I still leave myself open, but they're gonna have to work mighty hard to get my money. Since D2, nobody has done that, though, and, to be honest, I doubt anybody will get me interested enough in a live-service experience to get me to buy it.
5000 d1 vet here. We ignored so much for so long. I realize it's been a great ride. But I cannot support future bungie projects.
Same here! I don't regret my time in Destiny but I feel bad for people that have put in more time and more money considering how Bungie has been treating the game the past couple of years. It's not all bad, obviously, but the def less effort has been going into the game than it should.
As much as playing Destiny feels good and the nostalgia for the fun of playing D1, I've never been able to make it my go-to game or my main game. My gaming time is rare and valuable and I've gone through long dry spells when it comes to the Destiny franchise. I can't explain why but I want this franchise to be amazing and I keep coming back to it for its potential, but it's frustrating to feel like I want the game to be better than the devs do
I completely understand what you mean. Every Destiny fan sees the potential of how good Destiny can be, and I think the community, by and large, would agree on what peak Destiny would be. Bungie has its own ideas, which unfortunately don't align perfectly with with fans want. Bungie makes players mostly happy, which is why a lot of them stay, but that also kills the enthusiasm that a lot of other fans have, because 'mostly' isn't what they're looking for. There are games that are more compelling than Destiny, and 'compelling' is better than 'mostly compelling', especially if you don't have as much gaming time as you want. Bungie had the perfect game, but they made it less and less perfect over time because of their own business decisions. I hope you find a game that makes you happy!
Really the only times it's been a viable main game were the first 4 months of the taken king Era, the rise of Iron Era, and the forsaken Era. Since the season pass model was implemented at the beginning of the shadowkeep Era the content just feels hollow.
@@TaysonPlaysGuitar I agree. Because Bungie doesn't want to overdeliver, you can easily guess the general activity structure and grind loop every season even before the season starts. The gunplay and overall feel of the game keeps a lot of players going but surprises ever now and then are nice to have.
Destiny 2 was like a brick house, it was pretty stable and solid, but a few bricks have fallen out making it a little unpleasant, but at least you got a warm fire place to keep it comfortable until the repair company arrives, they see the missing bricks in the wall, you ask them to add concrete or something to buff the structure of the wall, the repair company responds with, no need, you see the problem is that fireplace, so the company tears down your fireplace leaving a giant hole in the wall. "what the heck!?" the house owner shouts "how does this solve the first problem?"
"you see, that hole in your wall was letting the heat out, and therefore wasting energy, so we decided to get rid of the fire entirely no more energy wasted" said the repair men "and besides, you have a blanket to keep you warm, see you next week"
so there you are, with a giant hole in your once decent brick house, bugs now constantly buzz in your ears, the structure creaks, threatening to collapse on you and all the while you see other houses get proper repairs, get concrete buffs to their weak points, and made into an overall better home then what you have now.
Bungie has consistently dropped the ball, every week, another fun mechanic or weapon or armour is nerfed into the ground making the overall experience boring, dull, and repetitive.
I find a fun build, then a week later it gets nerfed for no reason other than it's popular, meanwhile servers crash on the daily, cheaters are running rampant, and enemies are way too bullet spongy, but deal massive amounts of damage. and instead of dealing with those issues bungie just decides to nerf something that broke the boredom.
what is the point of a looter shooter if the loot don't shoot
this was a steam review I posted
I agree completely, though I'd personally place your analogy in the transition from D1 to D2 rather than at the start of D2. D1 seemed stable with a very specific and concrete direction, whereas D2 has tried new things (with varying levels of success) every new season, leaving me with a mess of a game that doesn't seem to know what it wants to be. I'd rather play a complete game (or at the very least a game that knows what it wants to be and does what it can to get there) than a game that's trying to find itself over a number of years.
@@pat00139 a game I recommend is guild Wars 2 they mastered how progression works and the difficulty is pretty fun and challenging
I stupidly thought buying skins and the dlcs would eventually give them enough resources to improve my pvp playlist. Time has shown me how ignorant my thoughts were. Not one more dollar from me bungo
I feel bad for PvP peeps. Imagine the Vanguard playlist not getting new strikes for 2 years. The game would be dead. Bungie knows D2 pvp is a unique experience and nothing else compares so they bank on players staying because of this experience. There are a lot of other fun pvp games but nothing like D2. Also, don't feel back about buying ornaments and DLC. Like I say in my vid, I bought ornaments and things when I thought they were doing a good job and stopped when I didn't like D2's direction. Keep speaking with your wallet, that's unfortunately the thing companies respond to the most.
Ehh, I absolutely LOVED Black Armory, my favorite season in the History of Destiny even to this day, yes better than Opulance as well. I hate the current seasonal structure and weapon crafting has ruined loot grind, but Black Armory did it perfectly imo. Having to go back to Ada multiple times did suck but other than that I loved it. I like grinding for meaningful loot, and I feel the weekly content lockouts were MUCH better than what we get now with 30 mins of story each week and a red border or 2 and that's it. I loved the grind to unlock the forges and I really liked their difficulty on day 1, it made the content feel like it mattered unlike now where we run over everything day 1 outside of content we're forever locked under with scaling. Niobe Labs was also amazing imo.
I def really enjoyed BA and the target farming they introduced in it. To me, it didn't make sense you only had 3 frames per week but at least they fixed that eventually. The forges were def a really nice and satisfying grind and it's a shame Bungie doesn't do anything like Niobe Labs anymore. I remember watching Gladd trying to figure things out for hours on end. Nothing was happening but it was strangely compelling. I can't speak to the current state of crafting but I'm sorry to hear you're not into it. Maybe they'll eventually tweak it enough to make it worth it in the next few seasons.
why I should stop playing destiny 2: they take my money, they give me little to nothing.
It's incredible, isn't it? Compare the content in Forsaken with the content in any year after and then compare yearly pricing. The thing that bothers me the most, though, is then stopping secret missions after telling everybody that ornaments are what paid for Zero Hour, but yet offering more content in Eververse.
I've been a big fan with bungie for a very long time. When I was a kid, my brother owned the first two Marathon games on their Apple computer. Grew up with the Halo games. Even after Bungie left Halo, I stopped playing Halo and continued with Destiny. And what hurts me the most about this company is they care about money now more than their customers but before it was the other way around. I'm tired of all these companies today. All they care about is money and keep doing multiple microtransactions for the most stupidest s*** I've ever seen in my life. It breaks my heart seeing one of my favorite companies growing up turn out to be like this. I do recommend Warframe, though.
Check this: I quit playing Destiny, I believe, 5 or 6 yrs ago. I had been playing consistently since D1 up until the Deep Stone Crypt campaign. The only reason im talking about it here & now is because an ad popped up on my tiktok stream. The reason i quit was because i got really frustrated with paying for content i could not engage with. Years of doing that. I was a solo player from day 1. The majority of players were. But Bungie stood firm on the belief that it was a better decision to keep the best, most rewarding gear locked behind a ridiculous social paywall. I didnt have a fireteam, and couldn't get into one. Niether could most of the players at that time. I complained about this, and what did Bungie? They added Trials of Osiris. Another chunk of content with good rewards, locked behind another social paywall. Bungie went on to add Knightfalls and Dungeons after that. I dont believe I even finished the Crypt campaign. And after learning what ive missed since then, I see I haven't really anything except the lore. That seems to be this games only redemptive quality. I'll wait to see how this story ends, but Bungie can shove the game right back up😢😢 their greedy asses.
It’s cathartic to hear another person say all this. But god damn it is so sad that Bungie isn’t learning.
Subbed and liked, keep it up 👊
Thanks for the support! Yeah, I'm pretty sure D2 is mostly set in stone, so I doubt the business plan changes, but I hope Marathon is more focused on player experience and less focused on getting half-baked stuff out the door.
@@pat00139 Me too man, so much wasted potential here.
@@ocix Lightfall left the game naked, it showed there's no potential actually.
It showed how barebones and superficial the whole gameplay loop and universe really is.
Bungo just made us all a favour, to snap us out of the addiction...I mean, most people.
Some are hopeless for sure.
After 9 years of Destiny, bungie still don't know how to properly balance the game.
This is especially evident when they completely reverse past nerfs.
For example, renewal grasps.
They overnerf so many things it's stupid and ridiculous
@@Godlage Yeah, that's one of the big reasons I left the game. Because D2 has had a new creative director every year and a half to two years, the feel and the direction of the game has changed a lot, and nerfs are a part of that. They make seemingly arbitrary changes that nobody asked that have no big impact on gameplay. Bungie should keep the game broken or completely balance the game - I'm fine with either case - but their flip-flopping on a lot of stuff became tiring for me.
I’ve been feeling this way for honestly a long time. Probably beyond light. Because shadow keep wise an interesting steppingstone. It kind of set the tone for what to expect in the future. Like it wasn’t doing too much because it was sort of the start of a new Arc. But at this point, it’s been three years. The game has not really improved that much, it just looks different. I’m not going to praise them for the MOD set up when they have been calling Destiny 2 an MMO for years and this system just got implemented. The transmog system is one of the most bullshit things I have ever seen. How are you going to consider destinys endgame fashionable but then hold all the fashion behind five every three months, or spend money to get more. You don’t even get enough for a full set. and even if you do, why is some of the armor not there. I understand this idea of “if you didn’t get it then it’s hard to link it to your account quote”, but why? Wasn’t the whole thing a few years ago the FOMO affect? Like they kept trying to find a way to avoid it, and then made it worse! The fact that all of the armor is not available and then you hold my true cosmetic items behind a pay wall is fucking ridiculous. If I got the armor, then I should be able to use it in the cosmetic way. Not to mention all the shit that already is unlocked is ugly. I’m not going to grind your game to unlock armor that I have already had unlocked. Raid and dungeon armor should automatically be unlocked. It is endgame content, and yet I have to complete it get that item, break it down, go to Eva, pick up a bounty, do that downy, take the loom, and then get one piece of armor to unlock. This is fucking insane. They should just make it so you unlock the full set for three. I’m done with bungie, and I truly cannot give a fuck if this game succeeds or not. You’re not gonna disrespect me after demanding as much money as they do, and then basically saying well doing our jobs is hard so our bad. They can fuck off I’m done.
Much of what happened with Destiny happened with The Division, a similar game in its basic form. They just lost their magic and started to chase engagement over creating a impactful memorable experience. This is also in a lot of ways something that exists throughout the gaming industry. Very little innovation, just ways to create addiction and engagement for constant revenue. We are now seeing mass layoffs in the gaming industry. Because developers are just doing what the gaming heads and shareholders tell them to do. The playerbase is fatigued and dipping out. Its bad.
Never understood why Bungie would always release posts to say they're getting rid of different "currencies" in the game, and then proceed to release more the next season. Why not just lean more into Glimmer, or redesign glimmer so it can be used properly as the main currency in the game (Increasing the cap etc)? (but again it goes more into this video's talking points of needing players to grind for "rare materials" to get very basic items.
I've said for a while the best thing for Destiny would be Destiny 3 where the core concepts of the game is redesigned again, the current concept doesn't work for a game that lives as long as Destiny has. I haven't found the need to really put in grind for new weapons because I already have weapons that have the rolls suitable to alot of builds, and armour sucks from the game 90% of the time. (Mainly a PVE player if I do play, Bungie making more damage multiplyers in PVP killed the game for me, as the skill went further out of the game.)
"If you dont let a player play your game they way they want, they won't, and at the end of the day there are other games more complete, more competent, and more compelling."
Wow
D2 is good imo because the story is so compelling, it feels relatable to the experience of being human, but the complete and competent parts are so far gone these days that unless im watching one of the speedrunners abuse speed exploits, or a pvp main using a biased texture on a pvp map to sneak free kills I dont get much joy from the regular content anymore. I DONT feel FOMO about new D2 content...and Bungie should be shaking in their boots because of that. Im not alone, and they know it.
Thanks! And I agree completely. I didn't really touch on story/lore because I didn't feel it was relevant to what I wanted to convey in the video, but Bungie can absolutely weave a fascinating story and create incredible lore. However, because the story is only a small part of the game, most players will play more non-story content and that's the part of the game Bungie let slip through their fingers. Like you, I do enjoy watching speedruns and challenge runs and PvP gods do insane things, but at this point I'll stick to watching instead of playing.
I tried Destiny 2 for a while. I did the first raid and played for one expansion but they got rid of my favorite class, bladedancer. I don't care about what they did later on to fix things, what's done is done and the people I used to play with stopped playing as well. Destiny was a game I had a good time on and now it's time to move on as much as i'd like to try playing Destiny 2 again for the nostalgia.
It's funny how their missions statement went from 'We make games we want to play' to 'We create worlds that inspire friendship' or whatever it is now. If all your friends left, how is that supposed to inspire friendship. If they had stuck with their original mission statement, maybe the fun would have stayed in their game and our friends would have stayed!
I think I may finally have reached this point myself with the bitter disappointment Lightfall has been. With the unwarranted nerfs to red border drops on the destination weapons, to the drip-fed story that we get each season all topped-off by half-assed campaign, I've simply had it. I see no reason to continue with Lightfall. This is the first time I'll not finish-up an expansion since the beginning of D2. Bungie has succeeded in burning me out on their game. I don't want to log into the game for any reason now. Might that change down the road? Maybe. We'll see how The Final Shape lands. If the campaign is good, I may play through it. No more pre-ordering for me though. The hype-train won't run me over this time!
Sorry to hear that, but yeah, I know how you feel, but it's more likely no more Bungie for me. It's weird; I want to like the game and I want to play things but nothing in the director seems worth the time. Not sure how Marathon will play out, either. On the bright side, this year's been fantastic with great games so you'll def be find something to fill your time. I'm not a Baldur's Gate person, but I might give that a try at one point, and Starfield is coming out soon. You'll def find something fun!
Sunsetting set them back quite a bit. Spot on about the fomo part I left after shadow keep released and came back season of the splicer which was the 3rd season of beyond light. I didn’t know what I was playing anymore and all I remember was missing what I payed for and all the fun activities that should have stayed. I wish I played during shadow keep because some of it seemed fun. Now I wonder how many new players feel given there is no story or anything for them. Aswell as pretty much getting rid of forsaken. It’s fairly ridiculous as to what they are doing. Destiny 2 plays off this idea of fomo making sure people don’t miss the next season.
Thanks! Shadowkeep did have its moments overall I stopped playing during Shadowkeep for a reason. :) If I remember, Shadowkeep was the first content produced after the Activision split, so I think Bungie was trying to figure out what to do and how to make content by themselves. It felt like they were holding status quo for that year. Not bad overall, just nothing new or innovative.
@@pat00139I don’t think shadow keep was a bad dlc it was just that it came out when I was in highschool and a lot was going on. I think the bad thing was that bungie said they wanted to regain trust of player, keep players, then profit. It seems they threw the first two out the window over time and now it’s just about profit. Also they tell the devs to not over perform which holds them back. This is because forsaken was them over performing and look at what we got. Then going into shadow keep it was considered disappointing therefore hate.
I played Destiny2 from the very launch date up until little after beyond lights release, I met now real life friends during that time and I have so many wonderful memories about 2 tokens & a blue and raiding with our clan.. I quit little after beyond light because the game has already become just grinding for grindings sake and the nickel & diming through eververse was getting out of hand back then already..
My experience is very similar, I just ended up stopping a little bit before you. I hope our shared experience tell Bungie that we're not alone in our experiences and that they learn how to make games a better experience in the future. It's a shame it's D2 that had to suffer because it was an incredible experience that got ruined because Bungie took its players for granted.
So here's my take:
Destiny 1 was fun, especially if you had a bunch of active friends.
Destiny 2 is chasing the dragon of destiny 1. It has never been good, we have just been waiting for it to be as fun as destiny 1. It isn't the games fault completely, a huge factor is we are all older now. Many of our Destiny bros have stopped playing, many (me) have stopped gaming altogether.
Sometimes it is just time to put it away and leave it.
A lot of great points you made. Just to add some more..
How about the amount of times they released a new exotic, and it had to be disabled within the first few hours/days. Some remained disabled for week before a fix was available. (imagine paying for new content including Exotics that was advertised in promotional videos, getting lucky and acquiring it early, and then not being able to use it) Example: Radiant Dance machines: it wasn't even 'bugged or glitched' it did exactly what the perk described and it did it well. And yes it was OP and probably needed to be nerfed.. But then why even release it in that state? Its almost as if they didnt even test out the brand new exotics, missions or content before being released. This was the case for so many exotics had to be disabled and patched very shortly after release. Combine this with how most Exotics are obtained and RNG involved with getting the drop. This meant that some players who got an Exotic early lucky enough got to have fun with and 'abuse' it or 'have fun' with it for the hours or days it was available, while others schedules didnt even allow them a chance to use it before the nerf. The amount of times I experienced bugs and breaking content and thought to myself "did they even PLAY this?!
I enjoy getting Out of Bounds and breaking the map, but honestly it is not even that hard to find many holes in the walls of the map. This also shouts lazy development. There are holes to get out of the map in almost every zone of the game.
Crafting Guns, gets my 1st Place Prize for good idea with bad implementation. Takes too long to unlock patterns for each gun, and makes non deepsight drops feel meaningless and even negative because I dont want to waste space holding onto rolls or guns knowing I plan to and want to eventually craft it. Takes too long to Lvl up each Gun to a point that unlocks both Enhanced Perks (which is the unique aspect of this crafting)
It is too expensive to craft the Enhanced Perks for each gun. Think about a moment the cost of the 1 Crafted Gun maximum upgrade Glimmer, 50,000 when our max Cap which hasnt changed in a long time is 250,000. Then consider the 2 Ascendant Alloy you need when our Cap is only 10. Now consider how many Craftable Guns are in the game just say if you really wanted to have enhanced perks on them all.. 80
So some rough math says need 4,000,000 Glimmer if I wanted to afford truly upgrading all of these guns. And 160 Alloys when the cap is only 10 and its the rarest material in the game. One purchaseable 1 per week from Rahool for 400 Shards at the most expensive item to buy for shards in the whole game. only ONE per week and think of that 160This also supports this grindy, come back every week. That is just one place to spend glimmer too, if you want to focus any other engrams at vendors thats also costing you 25 - 50K each.
To top it all off, this gets back to Pats point about the Artifact reset costs and DE incentivizing build-crafting. Why would they want to make it so expensive to experiment? I WANT to experiment with variations on Crafted Weapons with Enhanced Perks, of which there are a lot of guns and combinations. But it is too godammn expensive to Craft and Re-Craft them.
I love Destiny
but Bungie has Missed (the Infinite) Forest for the Trees
Your first point mirrors what I said about being lazy and releasing things before they're ready. How many times were particular guns or armour pieces disabled for Trials, or Trials disabled completely for a weekend? I can't speak to weapon crafting because I left D2 a while before it was implemented, but I really don't understand the idea of material caps. If I play your game a lot, enough to earn 25 ascendant alloy, why not give 25 alloy? Who cares if I stash them for later? Ultimately, what does it matter? Play time will essentially be the same as if I grind 10, do stuff with the 10, get 10 more and so on... It's needless limitations for reasons that more than likely don't make sense. The same thing happened with Black Armory materials back in Y2.
Live service is a poison chalice. The western game industry has drunk too deeply of it, and expect us to do the same. I was done with the concept three years ago, yet I have not been wanting for games to play that were well worth my time.
It's just a shame to see all the old greats disappear into the maw of the pursuit of ARPU, or else, into obscurity. Farewell, Bungie. You were one of the greats. Once.
Yeah, live service could have been such a boon for gamers, but corporate laziness took over and now I have absolutely zero interest when a new, really-interesting game advertises it's a (insert genre of choice)/co-op game. If you make a good game, I'll play it, if you make a good game designed to make money every few months, I'll skip. I'm old now, I have no time for live service games. :)
I've been saying for years that Destiny 1 was more fun but, people keep saying I'm just being nostalgic.
It's tricky because both D1 and D2 have their advantages. D2 has better movement and gunplay and RPG elements (now), but D1 content is definitely better. Strikes and, overall, raids, are more fun. I also find the content more replayable. Just goofing off doing patrols or public events was more fun in D1. I don't know why but patrols seem completely pointless in D2. I really hope Bungie can eventually combine the best elements of D1 and D2 in a future game.
Great vid. Overall presentation felt very professional and well put together
I agree with a ton of your stuff, a lot of your points were addressed in Lightfall though, champs for instance can be stunned through certain ability interactions. You can stun all 3 with stasis no weapon needed…
Trials has been restructured, to match crucible vanguard and gambit. You get more exp based on rounds won not matches, maxing at 20 rounds.
Thanks! That's really good to know, as I haven't really played through Lightfall. I'm glad Bungie addresses older issues. My main gripe is that these things should never have been issues in the first place. Like, for instance, why not have ability interaction to stun Champions upon release in Shadowkeep? Either Bungie thought of this and didn't add it in until the community complained about it, or they simply didn't think about it. Either way, it doesn't look good for Bungie. Similarly, waiting until Beyond Light to reintroduce Adept weapons in Trials (instead of adding them in Shadowkeep) is baffling to me. However, I'm glad they changed Trials to make it more casual-friendly.
not a stun stun shows in kill feed as a stun, and lowers damage output and raises damage input to the champion, right?
i agree on what Pat Pilon is saying with eververse paying for cosmetics and content repeating itself
Everybody had that pang of panic when Eververse was introduced in D1, but Bungie took their time and waited for the panic to subside before expanding paywalled content so much that now now things outside paywalls aren't grabbing anybody's attention anymore.
I still play a couple hours a week for mindless entertainment, as the shooting mechanics are still some of the best in the business, and the sci-fi environments are beautiful. I also feel a bit "Invested" at this point since I've been playing my characters for almost 10 years now and I guess I'll see this through to the end. That said, I had 1000s of hours in the first game, no lifed it as a "main" game for years because it was simply fun, even the grind. The power fantasy was there and I may have Rose Colored glasses, but I feel like Age of Triumph at the end of D1 was peak Destiny. Everything was viable, all activities were viable and playable, and the game was just incredible back then. D2 it feels like we go through valleys and peaks, the power fantasy doesn't feel as good since they nerf anything anytime we start having fun with it, most of the expansions have been lazy garbage and to be honest, the narrative is all over the place and half ass. Characters like Saladin acting like we're some stranger after we spent an entire expansion helping him out, the way they constantly string the main narrative along with zero payoff, I mean hell at this point we have waited 9 years to find out what the damned Traveler is, etc. You can just see that even after they left Activision, they just turned the game into a lazy cash grab. The damage control video Joe came out and made the other day was kind of funny, because it got most people back on board and coping hard again, just in time to build hype for Final Shape preorders, and then Bungie will just go back to being the same lazy shit dev after that.
Witchqueen was generally fantastic though, so if you have a chance to revisit it, I'd strongly suggest playing it. Outside Forsaken, it's probably the best D2 has been and the weapon crafting introduced brought a fun aspect into the game, at least for me. I'm still trying to figure out how they hit a homerun with Witchqueen and then fumbled the bag so badly with Lightfall.
How many years did Tess look for her things? :) But yeah, you're not wrong, the business plan between D1 and D2 changed a lot and you felt that. In an effort to get content out on an arbitrary scheduled that Bungie created for themselves, they had to lower the bar on the quality of their product and Destiny is not as fun as it used to be. I haven't kept up on the story, but it was always pretty strong before I left. I did not enjoy the drip-feed story every week. Give me a full campaign that I can replay at any time in case I miss something or want to go ver details again. Giving me one missions a week is not a fulfilling way of telling a story. I appreciate the feedback on Witch Queen. I've heard very good things. It'll be tough for me to justify going back into D2 at all, but I'll def keep Witch Queen in mind. Thanks!
Good analysis, good statements, good arguments Thank you!
Thanks for being here!
Bungie did allow us to unlock all artifact perks, then with Lightfall they made them not mods and instead always active modifiers so they took it back to 12. But you can now change 1 single artifact mod at a time instead of resetting the entire thing. So while the rest of the game is a dumpster fire the artifact is in a good spot right now, it makes since we can't have them all cause they're always active. Also since Lightfall there's many more ways to stun champions than weapon mods, all subclasses and many weapon perks do it, it's to the point you can do a gm without any of the seasonal chmapion weapons. Strand for example is great for champions.
Thanks for the clarification! I remember hearing something to that effect about the artifact but got confused when I booted up D2 again to record some clips. I guess this just goes to show again Bungie keeps changing direction every year, which I don't agree with. I'm also very happy to hear Champions are less of an issue now. These additions should have been there from day 1 and even though these changes came way too late for me, I'm guess Bungie eventually makes things better.
Sunsetting was an absolute travesty, and still is.... I have 4 (count them FOUR) Throne Cleavers from 4 rereleases of the same weapon (Crown Splitter is the EXACT same weapon both have 2 releases)
Seeing light-filled art design an abilities was enough to make me quit prior to release an thank God I had a gut feeling it was going yo be bad but it was worse.
I can see that. I was very apprehensive about getting into D1 but my friends convinced me to buy it. Hopefully Marathon will be more to your liking!
It's sad how true your words are. Even now people are defending Destiny 2 Final shape now because of the promises to fix issues such as the reduced loot pool for ingame activites such as armor.
It's a shame Bungie decided to fix the game in they last year of Destiny's journey. The showcase video from a few weeks ago basically convinced I'm never going to touch D2 again. If people enjoy Final Shape and what comes after, have at it! I'm just going to be playing other things and not worrying about weekly server issues and bugs that force the devs to disable gear every week.
I never understood why Bungie has always made huge changes purely based on what the microscopic speed running community is doing or complaints from the EVEN smaller raid race community people like Salt n Greppo. The ACTUAL player base isn't in this .05 percent of players.
It's very bizarre to me, also. As far as I know, nobody ever used Worldline Zero skating to gain an advantage in any sort of competitive environment; it was always used in PvE to speed up traversal and no other reason (for speedrunning purposes or otherwise). I mention this in my video, but speedrunners are the most dedicated group of people that will EVER play your game. Why actively try to kick them out of your community? Every company should give props to speedrunners because they're often the only ones regularly playing particular games once the core base has moved on to other things. Probably not praise them and put them on a pedestal, but thank them for their dedication. That would def drum positive feedback from the community and get the devs some respect.
You have a great voice!
Also you are very Cool and nice!
Its an honor that destiny2 Have players Like you!
Hope everything in the game gets better
Thanks for the kind words! I hope so, too. I've essentially given up on D2 at this point considering how late it is in its dev cycle overall, but I do hope incremental changes make it better for people that are playing it. I also hope that Bungie learns what people want (instead of what numbers tell them) and make Marathon a better, longer-lasting experience.
I'm just burnt out on it & think I'm going to be taking a long break from it for now.
I felt that way a few months before Beyond Light and once I started playing something else, going back to Destiny never crossed my mind. I went back a couple of times because of my clan and this video, but otherwise I've had too much fun in other games to be worried about what happens in D2.
well said@@pat00139
When Destiny 1 released, and a bit into the life cycle of Destiny 2, Bungie had put players first. This was indicative with them providing meaningful and engaging content for players to dive into. Now? Money and their bottom line is at the forefront of their philosophy and, as a result, the game has suffered greatly from it. Gambit and PvP don't receive much support, seasonal models are samey and everything in the EV is over monetized. The tipping point for me was them selling a shader (alongside an ornament) was being sold in EV for TEN BUCKS! That's when I knew I had enough, so I decided that after TFS, I'm done with Destiny 2 for good. Some may ask why buy the expansion and to that, I say because I expansions were never an issue for me. But yeah, at the end of TFS, I will be uninstalling the game. However, if there's a Destiny 3 and Bungie puts players first, then I will definitely consider returning.
You're completely right. Bungie went into this in their GDC video from last year. Midway through Y1, they decided to get player trust back before doing anything else, so they put players first, which led to the best Destiny 2 had ever been in Forsaken. There's def too much monetisation for me, also. You're also nicer than me. Like I said in my video, I don't think I'll ever get another Bungie game because if they treat D2 this way, they will absolutely treat their next games this way also as soon as they have new shiny things to show off.
Sadly my #1 regret in life from now til the day i die will be buying Destiny 2 digitally instead of physically.
Could've avoided alot of this crap. After the first 2 weeks realizing the game suked, I would've gone to Gamestop and traded D2 for $30 and bought something else to play.
Oops.
Yeah, I that's def one big disadvantage of digital downloads. Luckily D2 got getter, even if for only a bit. :) Did you ever go back to it or did it leave your hard drive forever?
The only reason I had a ps5 was because I bought everything on ps4 for destiny (only game I've ever bought dlc for) but I could pretend the game was fun anymore about last month and I'm never coming back, sold my console and everything
Yeah, that's very fair. I had the same feeling back prior to Beyond Light. There was nothing that seemed interesting to me so I gave it up. There will be other interesting games, though if you sold your PS5, I hope you're finding other fun things to do with your time!
I was severely disgusted with the state of Destiny 2 at launch. All the quality of life improvements made to Destiny 1 throughout its three year life cycle were nowhere to be found. I bought Destiny 2 with the understanding that Destiny 2 would be built on top of three years of lessens learned and good will that was cultivate in Destiny 1. But like you said, Bungie had shifted their focus going into Destiny 2. No longer were they about hooking their players by making the game overwhelmingly fun. They instead decided Grind + Grind Throttling + Time Gating + FOMO would make a good game. Not to mention Bungie's obsession at the time with balancing the game to the point of making it very "meh". Yup - I was so disgusted that I left for 14 months until my friends begged me to return after Forsaken launched. Now at that point the game was in a better state, but they had already re-introduced grindcreep where each new season was a reskin of the previous grind and just felt pointless. Destiny 1 was marketed on "Become Legend" and you felt exactly that as you played the game. Destiny 2 is now grind with a side of grind topped off with a rich layer of grind. And for what? At this point I'm going to stick around for The Final Shape just to see this story through to the "end", but like you, I am very much out of love with Bungie going forward. Destiny has always been a jealous mistress and there are so many other good games out there I've had to neglect just to not miss out on Destiny. I enjoyed my time on Titanfall 2, Monster Hunter World, Ace Combat, and (gasp) Warframe. But all my friends were still back in Destiny 2 so that's where I returned and still am. But recently my friends have come to the realization that they too no longer feel that love for this game that they once had. The shame of it is the Destiny 2 engine is now superior to the Destiny 1 engine but the ideology behind the game has gone very much astray. There are other aspects of the game that have more recently gone from minor annoyances to "do you really have to do this to your game - you're making me not want to play it anymore". And I won't go in depth on that last part but I suspect some readers will connect those dots....some might even make valid connections that I did not even intend when mentioning that. It's a pattern for Bungie now.
Absolutely! The focus definitely changed between D1 and D2. D2 was all about grind instead of about fun and for a while during Forsaken, it was justified because the game was genuinely good. Then Bungie left Activision and their focused within D2 changed and it lost my interest. I watched the Final Shape showcase and Bungie is really good and building up hype but my main question through all of this is, well, what about non-story content? What happens when you finish the story? Bungie talking about the Echoes pretty solidified the fact that I won't be returning to Bungie or anything they do. I'm very much interested in Marathon but I wont buy it or spend my time playing it. I hope it's good and I hope the player base likes it, but I'll be happy playing other things.
@@pat00139
An additional thought on D2 that occurred to me just now. What I'm about to say is not universally true but frequent enough that both proponents and detractors of D2 notice this. If something in the game is "broken" in the players' favor, Bungie has a history of almost immediately patching or disabling that feature in short order. But if something in the game is "broken" in that it hurts all players, then Bungie is not in much of a hurry to fix those problems no matter what they are. Now more recently they've gotten more lax on this point as they seem to have actually encouraged players to find subclass / aspect / perk / exotic combinations that break the game in their favor. For me, it was the Solar Titan with Loreley Splendor Helm (fast health regeneration in sunspots) and the incandescent perk on solar guns (igniting ads so they generate sunspots when they die). This has allowed me to survive in endgame activities while playing with friends of much higher skill levels. Still I kinda chalk this up to a broken clock being right twice per day. They've made more bad decisions than good on an incredible base game engine.
But the underlying fundamental problem is exactly what you have cited numerous times - Bungie has shifted it's entire focus from FUN to GRIND while still selling us on the FUN. Here's an example of how much this has shifted - remember back in 2015 at Euro Gamescon or whatever the convention was named when Luke Smith said we would be "throwing money at our screens" and alot of the player base was offended? And rightly so not so much because Bungie saw us as wallets (that shift was already underway at that point), but because Luke had done a poor job of explaining what he meant. Well...when Taken King dropped, alot of the player base came back and said, "Luke Smith was right. Now shut up and take my money"...and this was because Taken King was universally received by the player base as being an awesome expansion that they were very happy with.
Just a couple of quick thoughts that occurred to me that I wanted to add to the thread. Thank you.
@@SergioImbarlina That's pretty perceptive. Bungie fixes easier things first and server-side things end up being easier to fix, but the fact that they've needed to fix SO MANY THINGS only in the past few months is a big issue. I also remember that D1 line from Luke Smith, and I was also the 'yeah, he was right' camp. :) In all fairness, Taken King is one of my fav expansions ever in all gaming. Can you just imagine if Bungie re-mastered D1 inside D2's engine and sold it? How much of the D2 player base would actually stick with D2?
It’s brilliant from a greedy business perspective: exploit human psyche while charging a premium for less and less content over time.
This is where they WANT the game to be. Their priority is to get casuals into the game and get them to drop money at eververse. Plain and simple.
It’s a glorified mobile game at this point. All profits, no passion, at least not cost viable passion.
As someone with over 3000 hours combined between d2/d1, it breaks my heart to see such fertile grounds pillaged by greed. So much potential squandered in favor of the almighty dollar.
It's a sad state of affairs that this is where AAA gaming is at this point. Lots of devs are saying Baldur's Gate 3 is an anomaly and to not expect that from AAA companies, but the companies these devs work for have steadily lowered quality and lowered the bar over the past 10-15 years regarding what's considered an acceptable game. BD3 is basically what was expected 15 years ago: a functional game with good and plentiful content. Now we're told to expect less by AAA companies that made quality games less and less prevalent over time.
I have one though in mind, im a d2 player, just 2k hr in game, i go watch content of d1, and i feel inclined to go play d1, and also ppl want d1 content, there has to be a common denominator there.
It's a tricky comparison to make because D2 improved on a lot of things like movement and gunplay, but the D1 content overall is better because Bungie seemed less focused on getting stuff out quickly. They didn't seem to mind that players left D1 and came back eventually when new content was released. D2 seems focused on getting people to stay so the content seems forced and less passionate.
I peeped out Bungie Since Destiny 1 Vault of Glass. Even back then, they didnt respect your time.
Fair point, and I understand what you mean. You must be very happy you're not playing Destiny anymore, then. Do you have a go-to game right now?
@@pat00139 truly sad because Destiny was an experience unlike any other. After Destiny, I jumped into Eldersrolls Online pretty heavy but just got burnt out after about 4 years.
Now I sort of shyed away from always online, live service games. and Ive been recently having the time of my life revisiting Borderlands 3.
@@reffa2858 I was a day 1 Borderlands 1 player. I've bought ever BL game day 1 and I've never been disappointed. It's strange that the idea of leaving a game when you want to, coming back later and it being the same game seems like a foreign concept in 2023. If I buy a game day 1 and play for 100 hours, I enjoy the game. Don't change it because I play something else for a little while. Changing the game will just make me not want to play the game again.
Excellent video
Thanks for the support! :)
Since I took the time to watch this video - I figure I might as well respond to it.
While I sympathize with almost every criticism you make in this video (barring a few) I think you're overstating your case in a lot of these, or picking the most offensive examples (bows paired with seasonal mods to use in end-game activities / nightfall, for example).
Lets start with the first main point - "Bungie is lazy."
Considering I've played other games like Hearthstone, RuneScape and League of Legends for years, I don't agree with this whatsoever.
Lets look at Riot Games and League of Legends for comparison - the game has existed for more than a decade, and still expects players to use the same generic 5v5 Summoner's Rift map/game mode. They are releasing no more than about one champion a month (even that, I believe is being generous). Just like Bungie during Beyond Light's expansion, they actively *took out* older maps and game modes/content that some players enjoyed - and they explicitly said that part of the reasoning for it was that they don't make as much money from these alternative game modes and maps.
League has existed for over ten years, and Riot Games does little more than balance patches, create a new champion roughly once a month, create new skins which almost all of them cost money, barring some rare in-game event or halloween or christmas "gift", change the pre-game character stat tree perks and so forth. That's it. That is all you can expect from them. Virtually zero new content, unless you count graphics changes or balance patches as "content drops." I know they have made TFT and Legends of Runeterra, but the core game of League of Legends (which is their flagship), has in many ways remained identical or highly similiar to what it was back in late 2009. There is very little growth or "evolution" to it. If the game ever gets stale - which it did for me some time around 2014-2015, you are basically screwed, because you cannot expect anything from them to fundamentally change it, and there is no expectations of a League of Legends 2.
Anyway, so back to Bungie. Let's go over what Bungie has been up to over the years.
2017: Destiny 2 - Base Game - "Beta Version" as you semi-jokingly but mostly seriously stated it as - I don't think this is necessarily even wrong.
2018: Destiny 2 - Forsaken - by many considered to be their best expansion of all time (with the possible contender of The Witch Queen)
2019: Destiny 2 - Shadowkeep - My personal favourite expansion of them all (I loved the soundtrack, loved the haunting theme, and never played D1 so the moon was a new location)
2020: Destiny 2 - Beyond Light - Terrible villain (felt boring and worse than the Red War Bane-like villain), but otherwise I have to give them high marks on this expansion. The aesthetics of the icy cold Europa, the re-introduction of The Exo Stranger, interesting new exotics (notably, the Stasis Grenade Launcher) and exotic missions, new strikes, introduction of Stasis supers, etc.
2022: Destiny 2 - The Witch Queen - Absolutely top notch. Somewhat similiar theme to Shadowkeep in terms of playing up the 'scary horror' element. Osteo Striga is even better than Recluse, Parasite is a great addition and the introduction of weapon crafting is very much welcomed. They also alternated from one raid to one dungeon being released each season around this time, which I feel like is the opposite of lazy.
2023: Destiny 2 - Lightfall - A complete flop in terms of it's narrative, but the campaign missions / gameplay was completely fine in my opinion. A fine expansion if it was released around 2017-2019, but towards the later years, and particularly on the back of The Witch Queen it feels dissapointing, but otherwise the criticism against it is overblown in my opinion. It is not bad per se, it is more so, that it doesn't meet the higher expectations players have set given that we are this late in the game and fast approaching The Final Shape.
Given what I saw of 'The Final Shape showcase' I have to say, it did indeed, seem somewhat Mid-Tier (just like Lightfall) but personally, I don't regret the money I spent on acquiring Lightfall. My personal thoughts are that I have no beef with spending money, so long as a) the content is legitimately good and b) I do not feel like I am being over-charged.
I have been getting back into HS since late 2022, and while I feel like the HS developers (Team 5 of Blizzard) are not necessarily lazy, I do feel like Blizzard is absolutely over-charging me at certain times. Its quite laughable that I was unsure whether spending roughly $100 a year on Destiny 2 was worth it when Blizzard seems to expect I spend twice as much (and still be missing certain key cards) on a bloody digital card-game where I don't even own anything and they can ban my account at any time they like for whatever reason they want.
This is getting long - so I will summarize by saying that all in all, compared to other monetization practices and developers from other game studios/developers/private companies, Bungie is by no means anywhere near the worst. Far, far from it.
My one main gripe of Destiny 2 isn't actually the amount of glitches it has or even the amount of money spent, it's the fact that after having spent thousands of hours playing the game I am simply at the point when I do not feel I have the energy to grind endlessly for a new weapon which I know in a year or 2 will eventually become 'out-dated' and I'll be expected to grind for a slightly better version of the newest auto rifle, scout rifle, pulse rifle, sniper, shotgun, or what have you with ever-so slightly better stats and ever-so slightly better perks. D2 should not feel like a job, Bungie, it should be a game, enough with the grind already. There are ways they have gotten better about this - like with weapon crafting and Deepsight Resonance, but there are still ways in which I feel like I am still being asked to play the game in a way which I would rather not. All in all, D2 is a mixed bag, and it is entirely possible I do not feel incentivized to continue to play it after The Final Shape, but again, in comparison, there are worse games and private companies I could have put my trust and time and effort into than D2 & Bungie. Through thick and thin, in sickness and in health, Destiny 2 has been here for me.
Thank you for the comments, I appreciate the time you took to watch and reply. Good point about LoL and its content. I'm not particularly familiar with LoL but if every champion has different perks/ultimate/super/what-have-you, a new champion every month or two isn't so bad. I feel e-sports game shouldn't change too much over time, as it would fundamentally change how the game is played and would alienate the viewers. Hockey/football/baseball have small rule changes here and there but the sports haven't really changed since the leagues were started. However, I do understand your point of lack of content not necessarily equating to laziness and I do agree there. My issue is that, for a long time, everything they introduced had to be fixed later on. In the same way you didn't feel your time is respected by getting new guns, I felt my time wasn't being respected by releasing things that weren't complete. I did like the look and gothic feel of Shadowkeep. Eris was always an interesting character in D1, so seeing her again was nice. I appreciate your thoughts on the expansions I haven't played. I've heard Witch Queen was really peak D2, so I'm glad to hear Bungie aced that expansion. The Final Shape looks interesting to me and I'm really curious to see how everything will turn out from a story perspective. I'll skip playing it but I'll watch Goth or Gladd or someone play through it. I don't think Bungie is the worst company out there, either (as you point out, I feel Blizzard is worse), but I definitely think they could and should do better. I really hope Marathon is great and they they focus on players more than their bank accounts with that game. I think we generally feel the same about D2, but we just differ in details here and there. Like I said, I've put 2500 or so hours and hundreds of dollars in the Destiny universe and I don't regret my time in there, but by the same token, I don't regret leaving that universe at all.
7:21 nail, meet hammer
Lord of Wolves is def fun to play with. :)
Bungie are the cancer of gaming. All games being rammed with microtransactions and season passes are all because of Bungie and their philosophy of "less is more" and "never over-deliver". Now all the big studios follow this matra.
Bungie is no Blizzard, but this is definitely a competition you don't want to be a part of, and Bungie is doing its best to stay in contention. :) They definitely need another trust-retention-revenue moment to bring them down a few pegs and to make them re-think monetisation as a whole.
You hit all the weakness points 👍
Pat speakin FACTS lol 😂
I appreciate it. Thanks!
This mate deserves at least a couple thousand more subscribers so inma engage the algorithm real quick.
Excellent opinion piece too, concise and brimming with evidence and knowledge (and experience) from the previous games. D2 has lost its mark and now its objective, they're clearly at this point making it up as they go along.... This video opened my eyes to that fact.
I appreciate the comment! Because the creative director has changed so many times, the game doesn't seem to have a consistent feel and that gets tiresome after a while. Combine that with the fact that they don't really care about releasing functional and bug-free systems now and it makes happy I stopped playing when I did.
I come back to this game now an again, don't really take it seriously any more, i assume there must be some reasonable income for bungie to do what they do, so there must be some player base that still plays the game. but the games definitely slowing down with its community. especially noticeable now that bungie confirmed they are returning to older IP Marathon. way i see it destiny 2 on life support. slowly waiting to die as they milk it for every ounce of profit until its dead or Marathon is finished. just hope Marathon get more love as it is an original bungie title from way back.
I only came back to get clips for this video, but otherwise have stayed away, though I do watch challenge runs and PvP stuff occasionally. The maintenance/server issues tell me you're right in saying the game is winding down. Unfortunately, D2 seems to be on the backburner now with Bungie focusing on Marathon, as you've said. I've very curious to see how Bungie will handle this game post-Final Shape.
Honestly i blame fortnite for alot of this BS. If they didnt come out with that stupid season pass BS this game would be different. I feel like bungie is focusing too much on this seasonal BS instead of the core game itself. Going free to play was the worst decision ever. They have such amazing people working over there at bungie and such an amazing community idk how tf they manage to flop with ever expansion (besides Witch Queen). It just blows my mind. The only fix right now is to listen to the community. Bring attention back to crucicble for the PVP players. Bring back strike specific loot for fucks sake!! If we continue with the season pass, make it worth buying by having more than just a weekly mission to complete! Make it 3-4 a week! I feel like bungie just lost the love for the Destiny franchise and just now views it as easy money. Destiny has such a strong player base that they know we’ll spend the funds mindlessly to fill their pockets even after a shitty expansion the year prior. D2 is probably my most toxic relationship yet. I hate it so much but i just cant seem to get away because mainly the nostalgia. I hope they really fix it before the light/dark saga ends. I’ve never been one to like change, if it wasnt broke dont fix it. Bungie just doesnt understand how to follow instructions when fixing things because the community has been screaming it to them since Curse of Osiris and Warmind. Wonderful video.
You think problems don't evolve and change, dismissing nuance is game development. Also, I find it generally distasteful to point at an entity doing work to evolve and change and improve and say "you should have known this years ago". As if change is a sign of weakness. That kind of attitude won't get you far in life.
Thanks for the dissenting comment, I honestly appreciate it. My issue with D2 is not change at all. It's now lazy Bungie is with implementing new things. Balance changes that favour one or two weapon types is basically Bungie telling people what guns they should be using and that's not the way to make RPGs fun to play. I don't like Bungie messing around with Whisper of Worm ammo reserves and functionality multiple times, especially when they introduced a viable answer to this issue the previous year. The issue is not change, it's laziness. I have no inherent issues with the introduction of transmog, weapon crafting or even weapon sunsetting if done right; these are all changes that add depth to an RPG. I don't believe change is a sign of weakness, but the constant flip-flopping in many aspects of the game tells me Bungie has no cohesive plan for Destiny. I also have no issue with a entity doing work to evolve and change and improve, but that shouldn't come at the cost of quality and player experience. Changes will absolutely result in slight dips and peaks here and there but I don't believe Bungie's changes while I was playing resulted in a consistently high-quality experience; there were always things to fix that shouldn't have been an issue in the first place. If the game is in a better place now, then I'm happy for the D2 player base because they don't have to deal with the issues of the past. Honest question: are you happy with all of the changes Bungie has implemented throughout D2?
In before they finally do away with gear and weapon sun setting.
Leviathan, come back..
For sure. I really liked the idea that you could wind your way through the basement of the ship and get to the boss room really early. Not sure how it helped with getting loot but was def a fun raid design.
@@pat00139 I remember heading down there to farm the turrets for the Izanagi's burden quest, good times. The Leviathan Underbelly reminded me of Dark souls 1 if you have played it. Great interconnected paths below ground that only the real secret hunters could find to get to places early.
In the division there is no respec option... You change gear. There is no RPG element outside of the Lvling from 1-30 or 1-40 if you meant division 2. no idea where you got that from. Also the gameplay in the background. If that is you playing. I understand why you stopped. The aim and movement is terrible for a person on mouse and keyboard. It legit looks like a controller player. No idea of where their mouse is at. Moving back and forth in situations where you need to stand still. It hurts to watch :(
Thanks for pointing out, I misspoke when it came to Division. My main point is that in the Division you can change your build at any time with zero consequences at zero cost. You'll need to get the perks you want on your gear, but you have no real downsides on buildcrafting. Also, throughout the years, I've tried different DPI and sensitivity settings and it took me a while to find a setup I liked in Destiny. Every game has a different feel on M&K also. I've now settled on fairly low DPI and sensitivity settings and I prefer how that looks for me and for any viewers.
We cannot be listening to a guy that knows nothing about this game now lol. D2 is a whole different game now
Correct, I'm not very familiar with the current state of D2. This video isn't a commentary on current D2, it's an explanation of why I stopped playing Destiny, and I was very clear that I stopped playing before Beyond Light came out. If the game is in a better place now, that's terrific, and I hope Bungie is now releasing things when they're ready to be released instead of releasing seemingly-half-tested things to fit an arbitrary schedule they created for themselves and have to fix any, say, server issues and weapons bugs once patches have been released.
And its still shit… if not the worst its ever been
all true uninstalled the game 90 days go,not going back
Same. I reinstalled to record clips for the video but I never had the desire to reinstall D2 to play it again after I stopped playing. Like I said, there are other game that are more worth your time out there.
same tbh
This is kinda a carbon copy which gets old after a while
Fair point. If videos like this are repetitious, then it should tell Bungie what they're doing wrong and hopefully they won't keep doing it in subsequent games. My intention was to be honest, not original, but feedback is noted. Thanks!
Fortnite is the cause of the greed they saw people paying real money for emotes and skins and bungir got greedy!! Plus let me use my old weapons why do I keep grinding for weapons and armour which gets nerfed?!! Bungie want you to play destiny and nothing else which is why it is so time consuming the game is rigged unfortunately
The game is definitely rigged! Or, at least designed to increase playtime without regards to actual replayability. Diablo 4 is a worse example of this kind of design, but it's a shame companies have to resort to these tactics instead of, you know, making a good game that I feel like playing again. I've put in SO much time in the Mass Effect games, Final Fantasy 6, Deus Ex Human Revolution, Skyrim and all the Borderlands games and all of those are designed to be fun and replayable. Hell, I've bought all of these games multiple times, also. At this point, I'd rather buy the next Deus Ex game five times over than give Marathon any money, or, well, time, for that matter.
Bro mute background audio!!!! This video is just awful.
You are 50. It's for the best.
Single Player gamer to Multiplayer gamer:
“Wow, sucks to be you.”
This guy is coping hard
But I understand
From your gameplay.. You're just bad and can't keep up. Get better now. This isn't raid shadow legends lmao
@@JonathanGarcia-nr9yjlol, thanks for the comments!
Nobody cares
lol, thanks for the comment!
I care. Why are you here commenting on a Destiny video if you don't care.
you seem to care tho
My problem with this game is yhe need to force people to play certain game modes to complete catalysts. I hate pvp. I am no good at it so forcing me to get 50 kills with a weapon when I am not likely to get those kills is just shitty game design. At least they aren't forcing trials.
Making the artifact cost glimmer helped create consequence. Consequence in games is "fun".
People will complain it doesn't mean anything for all the time I. Invested when noobs look just trike them and have all the same abilities.
Wah wah wah
Thanks for your comment, I appreciate your feedback. I do believe that games should have consequences, but the consequences should be in combat or platforming or other sections of active participation, and not in buildcrafting or picking the mods you want to use for the day. I think building your character should engage you and not punish you in any way at all, especially if there is a way to reset the character. Getting resources to reset your build is just tedious an unnecessary in a game like Destiny. People complaining about various aspects of D2 did lead to a lot of positive changes so some complaints can be valid. Did you prefer D2 in its earlier years?
@pat00139 elden does something similar. So you can't just test everything in a day and have perfect God build with no consequences.
I see your point a little as well as it's prob more tied to the content promised and not given. Speculative.
Honestly I just played a few times early. Played more halo than anything and cod . Recently picked up destiny2 kinda expecting a lot of content for a 10 year game but figured out real quick it's a lot of good content but not as much as you first think.
@@nicklafave351 That's a fair point but I believe Elden Ring and D2 are very different RPGs. ER has no real endgame and experimentation comes through different playthroughs, while D2 is live service and changes over time so creating new characters (of which you can only have 3) is not encouraged as the main hook of the game is the endgame. You experiment through swapping fragments, grenade/melee types and what-have-you. I def agree that D2 looks very enticing but that the actual free content is pretty slim. The gameplay and gunplay are fantastic and I'm very curious to see what Marathon will be like those regards. Regardless of the amount of content, I hope you're enjoying your time in D2!
@pat00139 yea I've really enjoyed it. Just kinda bummed like alot of others at what could be or have been
Telesto the best-o
Which game would be worse if you included Telesto? None! COD Warzone? Better! Destroy All Humans? Better! Papers, Please? Final Fantasy 16? LotR Gollum? All better with Telesto!
Yup. Long-in and just don’t care about anything 🫠
I got all the expansions for cheap , really cheap. And having things to do on my gf’s account is so refreshing compared to my account that has everything but raids unlocked