The Enraged Rabbit Carrot Feed - The open source customizable MMU
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 พ.ค. 2024
- The ERCF is an open source MMU designed to be expandable to suit the users needs, While this project is mainly dedicated to be used on VORON printers, it can also be used (or adapted) on any 3D printer that runs Klipper, and also RRF.
Shoutout to DFH for providing the kit used in this video. What one of your own? check out the link below
deepfriedhero.in/collections/... (affiliate)
Want more info on the ERCF or wish to build one?
github.com/EtteGit/EnragedRab...
ERCF on RRF
github.com/pfn/EnragedRabbitO...
0:00 INTRO
0:28 WHAT IS AN MMU?
1:23 Downsides of using an MMU
2:30 Overview of the ERCF
4:07 Building the ERCF
6:15 How the ERCF works
10:59 Pros/Cons/Issues/Successes
16:37 Looking at prints
20:06 Final Thoughts
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Great video, Nero! I've been curios about the ERCF, but have been waiting for it to feel a little more mature. But now I feel much more comfortable building one. Thanks!
Sorry about the random crackle in the audio, did not notice till i got to the editing stage and it was present it two of the clips i recorded (which happened to be the longest two) I removed it as much as i could but its still there.
Thanks for the vid. Looks like it would make a great accessory for a belt printer.
I'd like to see more "short" content from you. I know people like your streams, but I simply don't have the time.
This thing has obviously been named to cause 3D printing TH-camr heads to explode from having to say "Enraged Rabbit Carrot Feeder" 5 million times during reviews.
Thats why people call it ERCF
Makes for 1 hell of a drinking game. Take a shot every time you hear someone say enraged rabbit carrot feeder.
3 and a half mins in I would be so drunk!
i tried saying it 3 times in a row and ended up saying enraged cabbit rabbit feeder
Great Introduction to it / Formal Description; I’ve been waiting for one of these!
Nearly all existing videos were long streams or caption free video documentation of printing.
Really great review, and loving the additional VoD content you’ve been putting out lately.
Slightly OT but that purple/blue filament used on the Bender Coat is a fantastic colour.
I did like that smash button lol. Awesome video, thx for all the info and time spent on testing this thing out. Definitely worth a shot especially for printing larger figures. I'd try the deadpool figure that's popular with black and red, I think that'd turn out nice.
I've waited that video for a long time.
Great vid, good info. Big fan. I'm dying to build a 6 pack for my V0.1 and/or CR10S Pro V2.....it would be nice to have for using support material on some larger complex prints.
Glad I watched this before ordering parts....
0:38 - Me, designing a multi material unit for my toolchanging IDEX with an inbuilt Y adapter:
"I'm playing all sides so that I always come out on top"
Make sure to share with the world through a video when you have made progress:)
Did you say Enraged Rabbit Carrot Feeder?
Nice review Nero
With prusaSlicer or SuperSlicer, set pressure advance and smooth time in the start GCode for each filament, then it will be loaded after each change. I have a dual extruder Bowden on my switchwire and o use the built in macro language to check whether I'm I have EXTRUDER_DIRECT or EXTRUDER_DUALEX_BOWDEN in the printer notes in the same way the default prusa profiles check for model, so can have the same filament profiles for clockwork/afterburner printers rather than duplicating most of the tuning.
Great Video!
This would be nice to use when you have multiple spools that have little filament on them so that you can use all the plastic.
That is exactly what i have been using the mmu2 on my Prusa mk3s for the last 4 years
for me, I'm thinking about keychains and dissolvable supports, so a purge bucket would be a better solution, no purge block, less waste and only purges when it actually needs it unlike the purge block
What I'd really like to build (next year) is a Voron IDEX with that as its primary mode of filament change plus two ERCFs to expand my options for the occasional extensively multicolored print. And if the filament changes are optimized between the two printheads, this should also cut down on time.
Doomcube discord my man. That is if you aren't currently on it
Still planning this?
Can you use the Carrot Feeder for backup filament feeding if one spool runs out of filament??
That problem you got about the filament when it backs up, the MMU2 Prusa unit tries working out with a buffer. I havent had much success with it myself, but I've seen people doing an open source pulley buffer that might do better. Maybe you can check out their solution and see if it'll help you with that. My MMU2 has snapped PETG filament by backing it and looping it in a way it bents past it's plastic stage.
Can you direct the purge material to another model in the same build that isn't multi material/ccolour sensitive, say something that would be painted, so as not to waste material?
"Like that smash button" had me chuckling
What do you use for slicer and painting the models? I use p2pp for my mosaic palette. But curious about this. Also maybe others are also
I am quite intrigued which adapter you have used with that combination, I have stealthburner + LGX, and I have not found an adapter to place the toolhead sensor with that specific combination
Of course, as this video is one Year old, the ERCF nowerdays has to be compared to the AMS. I do not mean the nice construction with spoolholder, comfort and so on, but the way they actually work. There are two major differences in function I would rely like to see in the open source projects:
a) integrated filamentcutter. While it's actually in the printhead, not the AMS, this is critical for the reliability of the whole filament change process. Between feeder and heatbreak is a cutter wich can automaticly cut. So the filament in the nozzle and the heatbreak actually stays there, the unloaded filament always have a perfect tip. The negative side is of course much more waste, as the remaining filament in nozzle and heatbreak has to be purged out adittionaly. This is also the reason for "poo ejection" to avoid insane big wastetowers.
Actually the Smart Multimaterial Filament Feeder project (SMuFF) use a filamentcutter on the printhead, but due to the weight imho it is not optimal for fast CoreXY printers.
b) the filament buffer
The AMS filament buffer actually buffers less than an inch of filament. Between extruder and buffer is a bowden. Inside the buffer is a slider with a spring. If the extruder pulls filament, but the buffer gets no filament delivered, the spring gets compessed and the slider moves. Inside the slider is a magnet, under the slider is a hall-effect sensor. So the electronics always know where the slider is. This way the feeder in the AMS can be controlled to always deliver the needed filament.
Unlike every other MMU solution this allows the extruder and the AMS-Feeder being active while printing at the same time. This avoids underextrusion issues.
Also there is no need to attach/detach the AMS-Feeder. You simply have one feeder per filament; no selector or something like that.
In my opinion this is the most interesting part in the AMS.
So the best diy solution is imho:
- Using one feeder per filament (with runout sensor of course)
- Add some sort of swich into the tube, so you can unload the filament, move the swich, bush the filament in another bowden with a filament cutter atached, and retract it again.
- Build a bambu-like filament buffer to sysnc the mmu-feeder with the extruder
- use a lot of runout sensors, Y-couplers etc. to keep everything under control
- use a seperate controller for this.
The AMS is unreliable with different temp multi-material prints. Because it cuts filament at the printhead, it melts and jams, especially PVA filament that does weird things with too much heat.
@@TechnologistAtWork Actually this isn't the AMS but the printer. Any printer with high-flow nozzle has the problem the unloaded filament having a not so nice tip, wich makes reloading unreliable (or at least needs an insane time to tune the ramping profile for each material).
That's one reason the SMuFF project started cutting inside the printhead and bambulab used this approach.
If you want to use materials with massivly different printing temperatures a filament changer isn't the right approach. It might work with a standard flow hotend and integrated nozzle/heatbreak combi (Revo, TUN, Nextruder), as they leave a quite nice filament tip on unload. But even then you never get everything out on unload and need whiping. So wrong temperature for the remaining amount of the former filament still can cause problems.
If you want to combine massivly different materials, filament changing isn't the right approach. Different hotends (Idex or toolchanger) would be the right way there.
@@oleurgast730 the AMS is built for the Bambu printers but it's not a good system as a whole of the filament change is being done at the hotend. All what bambu needed to do is make the cutting above the extruder and that would've eliminated the entire problem with their system. Why would you cut the filament so close to where it melts?
They just needed to move the cutting zone a couple of inches up.
@@TechnologistAtWork The main point of cutting the filament is to get a nice filament tip for the next load. So the best way would to totaly unload the filament and cut outside just the tip. However, with high-flow hotends the tip of the unloaded filament can become very deformed and you can get problems on unload.
Cutting above the extruder but after the hub makes no sense. You can not pull it out, as you just cut the connection between AMS-feeder and extruder, so the only way out for the filament still is the nozzle. You even get more filament to purge. You want to preserve as much unmolten filament, cut of the molten (and therefore deformed) part and also avoid the tip hardening in the heatbreak.
@@oleurgast730 you can't just pull the filament out without cutting. You also don't pull the entire filament out anyways. The reason the printer does a purge is to get rid of the remains filament by pushing it out with the new filament. Adding just two inches to it doesn't impact that process in any negative way. Moving the cutting away from the hotend just makes it more reliable.
The AMS is already a bowden style extruder that is more than capable of pushing the filament through until the extruder can catch it.
Can anyone tell me what exactly is different about the stealth burner that allows the ERCF to work with Vorons, but not other extruders? I have an Ender 5 plus and some Artillery printers I really want to convert to Multi material, but I’m yet to discover the trick that allows stealth burners extruder to disengage and re-engage to allow for loading and unloading of the filament without manual manipulation of the idler arm.
Looks great! How did you manage to tweak the filament tip?
It would be great to see a comparison between the Carrot feeder and the MMU2 from Prusa. I don't think anyone has a video on it.
I would need to get an MMU2 to do that, talking to others though, the ERCF wins in reliability and the amount of different filaments it can feed (cus you can build as big as you want)
Is it possible to set this up where if you run out of filament and have another roll of the same filament loaded it can automatically switch to the new roll and keep going?
do you have video on that dual extrusion build I saw at the beginning of the video?
I would sum up the underextruded layers as likely filament tips that the sensor thought was loaded but it wasn't truly loaded fully into the hotend. This happens on the mmu as well if the filament tip isn't clean and it loads enough for the IR to say it's good. This would lend itself to your theory about the better tips and whatnot with a different hotend. This happened more frequently to me on a v6 style and not the dragon design.
This can sometimes also be just the IR sensor is incorrectly calibrated so it passes the loading test but the filament never gets to where it should really be in the hotend when speaking of the prusa/mmu combo. I'm not sure how the ercf works entirely on the loading sequence.
The ercf doesnt use an ir sensor
The toolhead uses a halleffect sensor in conjunction with a magnet/washer thays directly in the filament path. Its really quite clever
Great info ! I just mandated my GF to make me one for my Chiron ! :D
Fun to have such a GF!
Thinking...Ultimate Multi Material set up! 2-head idex, with y splitters leading to x12 enraged rabbit carrot feeders, so 48 filaments on one printer! :V
actually i do get tempted by multi-head printers so i could have a general use filament and maybe a bunch of colours on the other head
Stupid question... does filament loading still work ok without releasing the extruder tension lever?
Do you think this can work with the prusa mini. Would love to print with 2 colors. I think you could make this work.
is it possible to truly print multiple materials, or 'just' multiple colors? Could you print TPU and, say PLA with this?
Starting to get set to print the parts needed to build the ERCF but I was curious is there a certain grouping of parts that people printed together?
I have a very strange and very unknown 3D Printer among the other 10 I have including a VORON. It’s a Dobot MOOZ 3. Has 3 extruders that use Bowden tubes into a hot end. The LCD lets you do only 3 color changes per model or you can do a gradient change which is cool. No filament waste but you do get a delay in color transition and bleed over since it does not retract, load, purge. It’s a delta set up so very fast prints very small, VERY small print bed, heated but small. I have not measured how much extra color I get before the color changes and I really don’t use it in color change mode all that much. I load 3 colors in so I can pick one color of the 3 and print, then next print I have an alternate color loaded for convenience of not having to swap and load another spool. It sold for $899 but I got it used on eBay “as is, for parts only”. Funny thing is that it wasn’t broken at all I think the user did not know how to configure a slicer for a delta. Got it for $70. It makes really good prints but very small. I do use it for gears as I build a lot of robotic, raspberry/arduino projects. The units that build these waste blocks, I’m really not interested. Waste is important to me as I even try to take parts of a design and print parts of it rather than printing a whole full prototype which would be a fully wasted model as I iterate the design. I’m really careful about waste. Nice videos and when I built my VORON I watched your excellent VORON build video. Excellent content.
For printers where the X assembly can clear the edge of the bed, would a purge bucket reduce the amount of purge required? That way you don't have to maintain the purge block height
It wouldnt save as much filament as it would save time, since it just rapid out the filament without needing to print anything.
Also purge towers can be adjusted, if theirs enough room on the bed for example, you can no printer "empty" layers on a pruge tower as long as the toolhead/gantry doesnt collide with the print when it drops down
How about putting little weights on a roll or so onto your filament, so that there is no tangling?
what was the model/make of the nema17 you use for the filament gear?
Can you use the MMU2S feature of filament depletion, SpoolJoin? Is an Ender 3 capable, or...should I go with something else? Primarily looking to do a SpoolJoin function for PET#1 with The Recreator3D. Maybe you can help?
What tool head board for stealth burner would have filament detection
I'm building an Enderwire (still need to fine tune it and build enclosure). I have an M4 bowden extruder on it now with a Revo Voron hot end. Gave up on the Tachi hot end, kept clogging. Since I now have a single extruder, I might build the ERCF later, will it work with a bowden extruder or do I need to switch to a Clockwork2?
Is this pre Bambu labs AMS? What are the time to print differences at this point?
could the purge block be configured to something useful?
The question that I have is, will this work with orcaslicer? Like, if I change the material/color in the slicer, this does the job? Or only works with a certain slicer
how did you setup the slicer/software? Id like to do this just to be able to have a few mats on standby and just click and choose what mats without having to mess with the printer. THAT and support CONTACT material.
I use SUPER SLICER
Is it worth trying to mod my ender 5 pro to add an ERCF, or is it such a hassle that I'd be better off paying the 1000-1500 to build a voron?
Will this work with a direct hot head?
Cheers.
Something you might look at, there is a setting in orca slicer, not sure if it's available in other prusa based slicers. That allows you to purge into infill instead of using the purge tower.
Oh yeah, it was written by the PrusaSlicer team some 5 years ago.
Hi, first I would like to congratulate you for your work. I have a doubt, could you tell me if the ERCF (Enraged Rabbit Carrot Feed) works well with the Raspberry Pi3? Do you have any studies done with the Pi3? Or would it be better with the Raspberry Pi4? Thanks
Rpi3 is plenty fine
I would be more interested in a fall over mechanic. like spool 1 is empty change to spool 2 to continue the print. most of the prints i would do would still be single color.
Would this be good for auto reloading filament when doing really long prints, or is there a better solution?
Yup, it can be used in a "continuous" spool mode
@@CanuckCreator In continuous mode, can you load more filament in an empty cart while it's printing from a different cart?
Should have read all the comments! You just answered my question above. Thanks!
Yeah I want a MMU because I hate changing filaments manually. too lazy. But consider this as well as an auto eject bed of some variant. queue up multiple models with one filament for each model and let it run itself for a few days
Is it possible to load two of the same filament and when one spool is empty it automatically uses the other? That would be perfect :) and does anyone have any more information about the filament sensor in the print head? I have a V2.4 with afterburner Thanks very much !!
It can be used in a continous spool mode yes
Hi, how does this compare to the MMU3? How is the interfacing with Klipper?
I'd like a link to an AliExpress product (prints not included) of the ERCF. Can't find a good set...
is there a way to reduce the number of feeders? I am thinking about building one, but I am only concerned about filament runout. I'd like to have a two-spool feeder.
you can build it with as many feeders as you want, so yes, you could do a dual feed system.
Can I install this on an Ender 3 V2 our CR10Smart with sonic pad?
Did anyone else notice he said at the end of the video to "like that Smash button"!!! Anywho, I really enjoy your videos and the time that you put into getting info out to everyone. I wouldnt have made it without you Nero. I built one of the first Ender EXtender Voron builds and asked to get a seriel number for uit but was denied because i wasnt using a electronics case cover and all of my electronicxs could be seen. Oh well i decided to build a 2.4 and man am I glad that I did. it is night and day from using a bed slinger. Keep up the good work. their is only a few of you gents that actually put the time and effort that you do into a extremly well thought out machine
What hot end were you using prior to the Revo?
everyone take a shot every time he says "enraged rabbit carrot feeder"
Did you have those under-extrusion issues with the duel M4 setup?
I'm trying to figure out which to build the ERCF or a duel Y setup for my Switchwire.
not really
Can you give me info on that printer right by you? I like it but don't recall that voron.
Nice video. Have you purchased a green screen?
Does it work with an ender 3 s1
Is there any color mixed? even if I change the filament manually, I have to cold pull a couple times, but still, I can see some different color from the last print
you get a big purge tower, when it changes it prints material on the purge tower to get rid of any old filament
It’s something that’s tuned
Can this connect to a k1 max?
Would you say this is better than the Prusa MMU2+?
..oh geeze and a lot of voron parts lol
Hi I got some questions V2.4 or switch wire? If you add up the price of a swtichwire or V2.4 + ERCF or Prusa + MMU..... What would you realy recomend? Also you need to add the revo... so?
AliExpress i3&mmu, followed by a switch wire ercf would probably be cheapest, depending on how you source a 2.4, that with a ERCF would probably be the most expensive, but definitely the fastest most overpowered machine and I’d recommend it if you want something to mess with. If you want to print than a Prusa with MMU. As far as price I’d estimate an official prusa i3 mmu setup would be between an AliExpress and self sourced voron in price.
That being said you’re probably better off with a Prusa XL or E3D tool changer is probably a better choice if you don’t already have the i3 or voron. And even better than that depending on how long you’re willing to wait would be the idex trident.
I imagine could be helpful milking almost empty spools.. set single color on multiple feeders and when one finally dies the feeder would switch to the other?
do you have to use on voron? I have ender 3v2 and sv06
Is it possible to use this instead of the bambulab AMS with a bambulab printer?
With a bambu machine? No
Anything that requires firmware modification is a no go on their machines, the only other multimaterial system that works on bambu machines other than their own AMS system is the 3d chameleon
@@CanuckCreatorokey thanks 😊
is there a reason you didn't mention the palette ?
I honestly forgot about it while filming, The palette is sort of its own thing, and after the most recent iteration of it locked down functionality (completely incompatible with klipper) ive stopped following it really.
wonder how it would work with a vz bot
Is there a possibility that you would make a video to eddietheengineers voron trident idex (for dummies) so that more people are able to build one like that because i cant find any instructions except for eddies vids and since his printer is a prototype there are no real instructions.
I would love to see an easy guide for this printer since its practical for dual material printing and doesn’t require that much time for a filament swap
A future plan is to conver the trident to an IDEX system that eddie is using, but since hes currently working on his designed, i will be waiting till its a more mature system first.
Would it be possible to use this with a Sonic Pad running Klipper?
Maybe, but the sonic pad`s version of klipper is closed source (violating the license) so there may have conflicts that would prevent it from working properly
@@CanuckCreator oh OK thank you. I'm kind of new at this. Is there anything else I can use for multi color prints. Thank you for writing back.
Dumb question do u use petg or? For the plastic pic3s
im using the smuff v6
Great video! I don't print, but my suggestion would be to paint colors instead lol :D
about the wasted filament when running multi colors. There is a need to do something about that for the regular customer. Dream scenario would ofcourse to melt it down to spool up and use again. Not needing a industrial priced machine.. Also all crappy prints and failed prints.. Yeah shure, if you use certain prands you can send in all your old crap and prints, but like me, using whatever i can get on short notice for best price... well
What's the little board next to the extruder?
Hartk toolhead board. Its not required but just makes wiring a bit cleaner.
Try it with Sovol SV06 Plus
I have all parts for a 6 pack just need spare time to build it lol
I'm jel....I have time but no parts.
I couldn't find the smash button so I liked the like button instead
Hola soy de Colombia, como hago para armar sistema múltiple de color filamento tienes un video paso a paso y materiales ya que soy bajo recursos todo lo hago como hobbit gracias
Empieza por armar una switchwire o una Voron luego le agregas el MMU
Do you run into issues running different polymers through the nozzle with ERCF? I'm picturing using ABS and a TPU or some kind of flex, but since it's going through the same nozzle I'd be worried about mixing causing layer adhesion issues.
You won't have issues unless you are using different materials on the same print. For example, mixing pla and petg.
@@PunaJussisorry for the necropost, but one solution is mechanical interlocking of the materials
I'm assuming you lose direct drive?
What's this thing called again?
Is there the mod for the stealthburner with filamentsensor available?
The stealthburner hotend/cooling ducts are drop in fine. The sensor is part of the extruder. Atm the cw2 is not supported
Ok, so it‘s CW1 with SB
Do you have more Infos on the SB IDEX setup?
They need to find something for that waste block....
multiextrusion waste isnt such an issue if you have the means to recycle filament
a big IF but a notable one
Ya, thing is very few people have that capability
@@CanuckCreator yall can send em to me 8^)
@@MrFranklitalien 300 benches coming up
@@felixisme awesome, where are you located?
@@MrFranklitalien haha I was joking but when I have them collected I will send them over to recycle into a mega benchy 😄
Hey. What 3D printer is this?
ERCF seems like an ok acronym 😅
id love to get one but the hassle of unlearning marlin and learning clipper is just too much for me T_T
Do it mate, they have great docs and you can rapidly test things since you won't have to recompile on changes.
@@felixisme my issue is also not being able to use my BTT tft35 since its not compatible with klipper
@@deathsmilez5297 that's a shame. yes i looked it up as well and see that it's currently only possible to use that screen without touch support. so it would function, but you'd use the knob instead.
everything is a lot nicer to control through your phone or pc website anyway though when using klipper. look at mainsail or fluidd which are the interface used.
there's also klipperscreen that you can set up with a new supported touch screen if that is something you value a lot. those screens don't cost much on amazon.
@@felixisme not gonna lie i hate you a bit for making me actually consider it xD
@@deathsmilez5297 you know it's inevitable, listen to your heart and you will see; there is no way you won't spend days switching firmware. its just the right thing to do
honestly though I've never used marlin, my first printer is a voron and the goto there is klipper. so I don't know much about marlin but working klipper has been super easy and smooth for me. my favorite features is the web interface and easy adjustments, just works and has really good docs and features not seen in marlin if you want to try and push speeds
How come every video I look ups for MMU's nobody ever shows how the printer connects with it?
its always: here is printer, here is MMU, look at it go, specs, thats it.
Is the board easy to fit on the stealth burner? I'm running an ab in my v2 and I don't know if I should get the stealthburner before building an ERCF or just leave it like that
Stealthburner has two community modded extruders with sensors. Clockwork 1 and Galileo. They're just the regular cw1 and Galileo with some geometry to meet up with the SB cooler more aesthetically.
@@Apophis-en9pi thanks! I'll check that out
It would be nice to see all the waste for these things you printed.
I just bin it