I'm not interested in HOSAM (will be running dual stick), but I've watched dozens of flight control configuration and button assignment videos and yours is by far the best organized and most clearly presented I've seen. Using your approach will work for any control scheme, and you could honestly rebrand this content to be "how to organize your flight controls for Star Citizen" and reach a much larger audience than those interested in HOSAM alone (which is probably a tiny minority). I will recommend this to as many people as possible.
Hey thanks for the kind words! I'm glad you believe it's useful. I definitely was wondering when making it if I had gone to far into "theory" before swinging back into "practice", but I felt it would do an injustice to not explain the *why* behind my choices - and hopefully help some people make their own choices instead of copying mine. Thanks again!
I’ve been out of Star Citizen for a long time. I am one of the so called veteran who supported a star Citizen with buying a large armada of ships. However frustrated with the huge delays and at one point just unplayable I bowed out for the last 4 years more or less. They have made some progress to get me back into it. Amazing but from my perspective little progress but clearly enough to overcome some of the blockers of the past. Your video is an instructional nirvana lol Clear and concise…….made it understandable. I looked many times at other videos set ups and nothing with the clarity and easy to follow like yours. Based on this a veteran who spend obscene money in the beginning to support the dream I am back.based on this video I subscribe to your channel. Thank you
A thorough, well organized video for us dozens of HOSAM enthusiasts? Instant sub. Even though I’ve been using it for half a year I’m glad to have learned new things from your video. And since I’ve just convinced a friend to try HOSAM I’ll be showing this to him as well. Well done sir
@@TheHectate Of course man, I have some questions too! 1. Main thing is, with roll on X axis, is the precision of roll much more useful than having it on Z twist? I tried it and I think maybe I have to give my brain more time to retrain since I’ve been using it for strafe for so long, but in PvP where roll is a quick maneuver to keep the target on the vertical axis I find myself strafing and managing throttle while using the mini thumb stick for strafe up to keep my nose on target while maneuvering. With strafe all on the thumb stick, is it easy enough to strafe up and to the right at the same time? 2. So far I’ve been used to targeting on the red thumb button, with QT on pressing down the thumb stick. With vertical and horizontal strafe on the mini thumb stick, wouldn’t it be better to do target forward on thumb stick press? Then maybe move QT to red thumb stick or something. 3. I’m curious what you’ve bound to the base controls on the VKB. So far I’ve found I do enjoy mining laser power controlled by encoder 1, modules on the three buttons if needed, and ping angle on the other encoder. Alternatively, outside of mining I’ve got 1 for missile cam, 2 for decoupled toggle, and 3 for request landing.
@@krokenlochen Good questions. 1. The thumb-stick/mini-stick does well at hitting both axes to strafe up/right etc. With the Omni-throttle it's tilted 45 degrees off, but since my hand is also tilted, I've not had any issues with that since on my thumb it still feels like the correct direction. I'm not well-experienced at PvP so I can fully believe that different people will have different preference based on how they play or what they feel is most important. 2. I don't have a QT button bound on the stick. With the red button on countermeasures I'm sure I could do a click-in on a HAT/stick to toggle it, but right now it's on the keyboard. 3. For the three buttons I have those set to VTOL, Landing gear, and Request Landing. The switches/encoders are not being used right now. The current patch has been a mess for miners, and I'm not starved for funds, so it's not been something I've needed to set up yet. I do want to try the two encoders out on mining to see what I think. The ping-angle is a great idea that I hadn't thought of, so thanks for mentioning that. I know scouting for rocks has changed and made the pings more important, so that's a great suggestion.
This was a GREAT video and I'm not even interested in getting a hosam set-up! You went into, not only the benefits of the setup, but also the extensive thought and theory behind each decision you made. The quality of this video is truly refreshing. Like a class from one of the professors that really makes you want to learn, not because you need the credit but because they're just that good of a teacher. Sorry if the reference is a little out there, it's just what this video feel like lol
Wow such kind words! Thank you for that. I'm thrilled to know that my style doesn't come across as dry or boring; it was a concern that it's not as "exciting" as other videos. Thanks again!
This is by far one of the most thorough tutorials I have seen. The content is amazing and complete. Thank you for taking the time to share your setup and thoughts. Very well done.
So glad I came across your vid. I've been debating ordering the exact stick for that setup as I've really pushed the M&K as far as I want and now need that analog input for finer control and the extra buttons and such. Thanks man!
This is incredibly helpful. I was just looking at setting up for this... Which is probably what the internet brought it to me without me actually searching for it... The Googlebook overlords know all
I’ve got mine in finally! What I’ve found extremely useful is adding some shift functions to keys. So my “rapid fire” or “little black trigger” has 2 shift modes. Allowing me to have 3 quick potential functions for one button. Example red button=noise while shift1 button+red button=decoy, and shift2 button+red button=missile count
@@TheHectate almost makes me feel like I’ve paid for the software. Only binding I have in SC are the axis controls, and little throttle wheel. Everything else is bound through VKB software. Best part, I don’t risk losing my binding progress because the profile is saved independent of SCs User folder.
@@dito4lyfe I really need to try that. I have the software installed but I really only used it initially to ensure that all the axes/buttons were working correctly. While this last patch didn't wipe my control scheme, it definitely would have been annoying if it had.
My VKB omni throttle came today so Im just testing it out in a private arena commander race. Your movement bindings make a lot of sense going from M/KB to Stick and mouse for ship flying. It feels natural like it was intended to be controlled this way. Thanks for the video :) The only thing I find myself getting use to with the movement is the analogue input.
Nice! Yes, I definitely agree it takes some getting used to handling a ship with analog input. It's tricky because it's so easy to just "full send" which is no better/worse than just a digital keypress on the keyboard. That said, certain ships are much more comfortable to fly now - I didn't like the Arrow at all with M/K but it's much more comfortable to fly with the stick. Rolling in particular, since it was so twitchy on keyboard.
I've had a pair of T-1600's sitting in an Amazon cart for 160 CAD for the last month. Still holding back, but always looking for options, I also had a VKB setup in the cart on their site. Until I went to checkout, and they wanted to charge 178 CAD (150 US) for shipping, for a total bill, including mounting brackets, sitting at around 800 bucks. So I cleared that cart in a hurry. Went over to Virpl and I just didn't find anything all that appealing, namely the price. 1200 bucks before shipping. I was even more put off. This setup has me rethinking everything, and I appreciate the level of detail. One great stick for the cost of two cheap plastic ones, along with your setup, added value to my list of considerations. Much appreciated!
I'm glad it helped you! Yes, international shipping was much higher than what I'm used to in the CONUS, although as you mention - combining multiple purchases will help with that. I opted to go without any mounting since it's just a single stick at this time. That helped keep the investment a bit lower lol.
I was looking at going a HoSaS setup with dual T16000's but have decided to go with VKB Gladiators for the quality. Saying this I am very much in the same situation you found yourself in with lack of funds to drop for 2 sticks. So now I am looking at HoSaM setup. This is an extremely well thought out, well explained Video of not only your setup but the thinking behind why buttons and hats and switches were assigned the way they were. I thankyou for your time and effort you put into this production it is extremely invaluable and I will be referencing it in-depth as I setup my new VKB Gladiator when it arrives. Thankyou.
@@TheHectate Well today is the day. It arrived so I am rewatching your video and taking notes as to which buttons and axis go where. I'll report again after trying it for a while :)
g602 is a legend.. and 604 is a best successor! anticipating next evolution of that series 604 will give you extra 2 buttons on scroll wheel - side movement! its a game changer
Year late to this but ended up going the same route for almost the same reasons and its funny how similar our inputs ended up. Glad im not the only omi mouse user
good job ... I struggled so much with dual stick (not super good sticks) when the mouse responds much better and seems to be much more accurate. great job again. now with this setup, it's as if enemies fall much faster
Thanks for sharing your experience! I definitely want to eventually try dual sticks myself, but hearing how much people like this setup I have to wonder if it's worth the expense to even try it.! GLHF!
This is the exact setup I have been considering with that VKB nxt throttle and my g502. I'd like the right hand nxt evo as well but its also outside my budget. Thanks for this video!
I am also using HOSAM atm. Logitech extreme 3d pro ( a budget normal shape stick ) and G604 the 2nd gen of ur mouse. Great vid i just wish google recommended this to me a month ago. right now i have 90% of ur binds already self made. but i will add some like the power changer in the mouse buttons. also the X* in the stick i use it for side strafe, but will try do it as u suggested for roll. since my stick is the standard shape, i used the twist for up/down strafe. After testing the X stick as roll. i am going back to X stick as side strafe.
Glad to hear that the video was helpful! I find it interesting that you preferred the X axis as strafing, but there's no shame in doing it the way that you like. Do what works for you. Thanks for watching!
Thank you very much for this video. Not having the stick in my dominant hand just didn't occur to me. Perfect for my use with star citizen. Just quick swap to wasd and IAM FPS ready. It's also fantastic for racing. Only trouble I had was to find left hand friendly stick, I got Airbus thrust master that works for both hands and it's cheap for PC. It has hall effect sensor and material feels good so I can recommend it for someone out of price range of the gladiator.
Thanks for the comment! Yeah, there are plenty of options out there that would work for left or right hands, so whatever works for you is the best choice! Thanks for sharing.
Wow, really really good video dude. I have been trying to explain this a lot over the years, but maybe not so well because most say "eff it...Buzzkiller!" The process you went through is exactly right, prioritize the stuff you need instantly and the rest can go on the keyboard or whatever. I would argue about some of the choices, but really that's not important as this stuff is usually personal in terms of both what is effective and what feels good to the player and especially going through this process. Couple things I would say is that you can double the buttons available to you by using the pinky button as a "shift" key and mapping combos based on that with some external software like joystick Gremlin (or might even be in the VKB software itself, can't remember). That's also useful for dual stick people with T16000s that don't have enough buttons. Stick and mouse is also something people can try to see if they might prefer sticks before they actually go and buy the second stick. The hardest part of going from mouse to stick is probably aim, so keeping the mouse in the mix at the beginning is kind of a halfway point. Good job!
Thanks for the comment! Yes, I'd heard not long after this video about being able to set up modifiers, so that's definitely a great way to expand the number of options available to a stick user.
I want to go dual stick, but can only afford one at a time. And was thinking get throttle first. After seeing this, now I'm going to get throttle first
U deserve more views and I wish you best luck for that. The video is well structured. Your voice is clear and calm. The information precise and valuable. In some parts it is a tiny bit too slow for my taste, but that’s just a very minor thing. Thank you for the insight. Fly safe CMDR o7
There isn't a ton of great info about this setup and I'm in the same boat where its pretty expensive to grab 2 sticks but I want one quality stick to build off of and I play a lot of FPS so mouse is natural to me. Thank you for this guide !
This is one of the best videos about HOSAM I've seen. Thank you. One of the questions I have is how often do you use roll? Something I keep reading about is that in space sim games in general, strafe is more important than roll (unlike flight sims), so people recommend using the x axis of the stick to be strafe right/ left. Have you tried that? Maybe putting roll on the thumbsticks? Or does it just "feel better" to keep your strafes all together on that thumbstick
Roll is actually fairly important still IMO, so I do use it a lot. The main reason has to do with the fact that many of the ships in SC have very strong maneuvering thrusters on the bottom. This is to counteract gravity (e.g. VTOL/hovering situations), however the increased force they can put out is relevant in zero-G also. If your strongest non-main thrusters are on the bottom of the ship, then using roll to put them in the best position for your benefit is a big deal. I'm not that great at PvP yet, but I can hold my own in racing. Being able to *smoothly* roll (instead of all on/off of keyboard rolling) has made a huge difference in controlling the ship on the "best path" whlie racing. Of course, depending on how they eventually implement or change atmospheric effects on the shape of the ship, flying more like a flight simulator could eventually become important. Either way, it works very well for me and I still have my full strafe options.
Thx a lot for this analytic point of view. As you say in the video, some things everybody already knows, But thats the point, I think. Just to know something doesn't mean you really can use it and work with this knowledge ;o) I allways was after dual sticks and just thought "everybody uses them and it looks just quite smooth, in all the vids, so of course that will be the way to go." Now I'm rethinking it and will mostly consider the point, you mention, just following logic. :) May be I'll end up with HOSAS, maybe not, but I'll sure overthink it again, before getting new hardware! again, thx a lot. :)
Great video Hectate. I like your setup, it is like you have three hands working with the thumb joystick. I also had issues using the twist option on a stick with the omni throttle. When twisting my wrist it would add other motions to the stick like up or down on the X - axis.
Awesome explanation of why you chose what you did. The very meticulous planning is insightful but I miss one part - there's a number of "dealfault left-hand inputs" such as Gimball mode, Free Look, Scanning etc that you did not mention. I'm assuming those went to the buttons on the base of the stick or other buttons on the mouse.
Yes, it's a choice of priorities. Free Look, for example, I wasn't worried about because I did have the "F" Inner Thought bound on the outside red button, and that's effective for a quick glance around without using actual Free Look mode. Scanning settings are on the base (a rocker for up/down angle, and a button) for mining mostly, and Gimbal mode was not mentioned because many people take those off to upgrade the weapons a size anyway. For me, on the occasions I want to use gimbals, I just press G on the keyboard as I'm heading into the fight.
I use same setup. Not budget but real estate is an issue. I'm loving it but definitely took me time to set up the way my brain likes. I use trigger 1 for boost and trigger 2 for brake.
Really appreciate your well-thought-out approach and clear explanation. I just got the same type of stick for my throttle and am planning to configure things as you describe for a nice starting, off point. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom!
@@TheHectate If you're taking suggestions: one thing I'm struggling with, is the abundance of throttle and strafe options available with the latest Star Citizen patch. Would be great to see an explanation of relative VS absolute, trim long and short, sensitivity curves, and dead zones, as it relates to flight movement.
I currently have a HOSAS setup (dual t16k), and they're definitely on the cheaper side, but I still think I would prefer this setup. I just love the precision of having a mouse, and I've kinda missed it with a right joystick. I dread going through all my keybindings again though 😭🤣
Give it a shot! Save your old configuration and try out just the controls on something like the Arena Commander racing mode to see how it feels to fly.
@Hectate I've been using HOSAM with pedals (HOSAM-FOP?) and it's SO GOOD. Also using an azeron to get rid of the keyboard all together. Had the t16k, but just ordered the same VKB as you (dont have Virpil money now lmao), should be here in a week. Thank you for the video!!
19:17 bind vjoy/relative mouse mode to something, I have mine set to clicking down the mouse wheel. This way you can quickly swap between being fast with aim, and being very accurate and controlled
I use this setup with a CH Pro Throttle, CH Pro Pedals and Logitech G502. Rudder pedals control roll. I am still experimenting with the pedals break inputs to see what works best.
I have a g600 with 12keys and a shift modifier allowing me to use all my f keys. I've been tempted by the wireless g602 for years now but I'm just not willing to give up having a full numpad built into my mouse.
Nice, that definitely has a lot of buttons! If you look at some of the other comments, you'll notice people have recommended using a modifier on the flight stick to increase the number of available options. I'm going to be looking into that myself.
I’ve ordered the same setup apart from having a different mouse. I’ve been watching SC from the sidelines for a few year and have finally just purchased it after putting in an order for a left Gladiator NXT evo omni throttle. I’m going to wait for the stick to arrive before playing the game but this vid will be my first point of call when setting it up. I had a vague idea of how I wanted to set up the strafe and roll and it turned out to be exactly the same as yours I’m going to bolt some unistrut brackets to my desk and have the stick sitting just off the edge so that it doesn’t clutter things up
@@townofgatecity3235 Yea, after doing some more research, after I receive the left stick I think I’m going to go for pedals next for forward and back thrust, then track IR just for free look and then eventually the right hand stick
Ok, Hectate, thank you for making this great and comprehensive video but....i hate you. After 10 mins in i went to see the costs and a little mole started to dig in my mind that i probably need this. ¬_¬' I fly with a Logitech G13 and mouse and this is by far the closest setup to what i'm used to. Tried dual stick (cheap ones i had) and wasn't happy with it, my mind just didn't accept it. But this.....man! i need to save some money dang it!
I totally get it. Initially, I was trying to justify the cost of nicer dual sticks, but when a friend recommended I look into this, it made all the difference in my budget. Don't feel bad if this is a bit of a stretch, because people can do extremely well with mouse and keyboard also! Save up your money for what you want (and don't waste it on cheap sticks). You could also look online for people selling used sticks - I've seen some for sale on Reddit, for example.
@@TheHectate Just so you know, i just ordered the flight stick from VKB Europe. The price was quite more (240€) than the US version (175$). We will se ;)
@Hectate i assume after a longer session your can feel it in your left shoulder? if so try to find a better position for your flightstick it looks like your arm is not resting while u sing the stick wich is very very bad and if you do not feel it now you will in the future specialy avoid straightening your arm to reach the joystick and god never in an upwards way.
While it's on my desk like this, yes my arm is "hovering" higher than usual. Thankfully at my height it's still reasonably comfortable but I could see other people having that issue. Getting it lowered (on a mount or something) would definitely improve the ergonomics!
Great video! I currently have one T16000 that I use and the keyboard. Would you recommend setting roll to twist with a normal stick like the T16000? Trying to mimic this setup
I personally did not like roll on the twist axis, but I know there are a lot of people that use it that way. The one thing I would caution you is that the T16000 has a reputation for a rapidly failing twist axis. If you train all that muscle memory and then you have to switch it up because it breaks... do you want to do that? lol. I can't answer for what you feel is best. I recommend trying everything out for just a little and see how it feels to you.
It's crossed my mind a few times. I both didn't want to get into it before I decided my own thoughts on the changes, nor just before they applied more tweaks and made the work pointless. Maybe in a patch or two when things have settled for Master Modes I'll make an update. For now, the short version is that I have one of the side mouse buttons mapped to switch master modes, and middle click does the SCM/NAV mode switching. Everything else is the same I believe.
Great video, very in depth and thorough. Quick question though, did you remove the spring for the Y-axis return-to-center to treat it as a real throttle, or do you prefer return to center on the Y-axis? Thanks in advance.
Great question! I did not remove the spring. I had considered it, but since I wanted to easily return to zero thrust from either direction, I felt the spring was necessary. I think the story might be different in other games, but for SC where all ships are essentially VTOL (some more efficient than others) it seemed like the right choice.
I have actually looked into 3d mice but it's not a priority for me and I've never actually had one. Bigger issue is that I'd like to get a vertical mouse (but with all the features of my G602). Some days I wonder if I just need to make my own peripherals instead.
This was really useful. I had an idea about the twist axis on your stick: Could you use that forward/backward twist to rebalance shields from front to back? What about setting it to add/reduce engine power on the triangle?
I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work. You might have to switch the twist to something that triggers at a certain value (since it's an axis and not a button), but that's something that can be easily done with the VKB software. I wouldn't use it for the power triangle personally though. For the maximum benefit, you really only have 4 choices. Max in one of the three points, or just balance it. The boost that each get (especially with weapons) to being at max means there's never a good reason to not have it on any other setting in between. That's why my mouse has the three buttons configured to max out a particular point. I can instantly switch to weapons, let them fast-recharge, and then back to shields max to protect myself while I empty the capacitors.
Your explanation of your process for choosing each control was so helpful for me in figuring out the basics for my first stick setup. Also doing HOSAM with the Omni. May switch to HOSAS in the future, but for now while I try it out, I'm very grateful for your video to get me started! One question: if you didn't worry about your ability to properly use the twist, what would you bind to it?
Thanks! Wow that is a tough question. Since I don’t *need* it for any of my axes, what would it be useful for? My initial thought is perhaps it would be nice for vertical strafe. Most ships in SC have very strong bottom thrusters - even more true for VTOL modes - so having the ability to accelerate directly up or down while having your thumb free for other tasks could be very useful.
@@TheHectate I got my stick and am learning to fly with it! Definitely taking some getting used to. I ended up doing roll on the thumb stick and strafe on the flight stick as that is just what my brain wanted to do. I tried the other way and kept trying to roll with the thumbstick. I have the stick set up pretty tight with 0 deadzone so I was rolling while trying to speed up or brake as well. I put targetting on the top left stick, power management on the middle D-pad and freelook on the small side pointer button. Quantum, landing gear, request landing on the lower thumb stick. Working out decently so far. Thanks again for the video and I am looking forward to getting deeper into SC with the update later today!
@@iamjeramy Glad to hear you got it working for you. Yeah, if your brain wants to do something different and it works for you, don't fight it! There's no rules about where one control has to be over another. Happy flying!
I posted this in another reply, but I think it's better for people to set their own bindings. It really cements the location of those buttons in your mental map of the controls when you've taken the time to manually think through the options and set it up yourself.
@@TheHectate I would generally agree. I have a VKB on loan to see if I like it and am trying al kinds of things. There are so few HOSAM profiles out there, I wanted to try a few variants. thanks for responding!
@@TheHectate I just went through the entire comment thread looking for it. lol likely would have finished manually binding by now if I just got on it. lol
I can't fly with a mouse, feels so horrible. HOSAS or HOTAS for me all the way. I've been doing flight sims since the 90's so the idea of using a mouse to fly with is about on par with using reins from a wagon to drive my car :p. I use VKB gunfighter for my stick and a vkb gladiator as the throttle in Star citizen. It's great!
Nice setup! Yeah it’s not for everyone, but for those that need an option that meets their needs halfway, it’s a good solution. Someday I want to acquire a second stick for the right hand, then I’ll be able to see which I like more too lol
Just ordered the same stick and I'm excited to follow your guide to get things setup quickly once it arrives! Do you find that the stick needed to be modified or mounted to your desk or is its heaftiness good enough to not shift around while in use?
For the way I use mine, it just sits on my desk. I know a great number of people prefer mounts like the Predator Mounts to give them quick-disconnect options while still keeping it firmly in place. For my case, desktop use is fine. You'll have to see for yourself. One downside to sitting it on a desk is the increased height compared to a mouse and keyboard on the same desk, though.
@@TheHectate Good point, I was definitely considering the forward and back distance, but didn't think about the up/down. I'll likely need to get it in front of me and then see where it could be placed if it feels to high. It may sound weird, but a very small elbow support on my chair arm might solve that problem. As long as it doesn't add any strange fatigue.. :)
No matter what you switch to/from there is always going to be some kind of learning curve. Maybe HOTAS isn't the right setup for you, but also maybe you just need to get more practice with it. That said, if it doesn't end up working out, there's always the option to sell the HOTAS and move that money towards a different setup like HOSAM or HOSAS.
In theory I could, but I would still recommend you do it yourself. Both because the binding process helps you think through what you're doing, and also because if patches break bindings in the future you'd have to do it anyway. Good practice.
Hello, i just got this controller and im having the problem of binding the forward and reverse thrust correctly. Going forward is reverse thrust and going back is forward thrust, and cant seem to switch it around
Open options, go to controls tab, click over to joystick in the bottom right (there may or may not be multiple, so click through until you find the correct one). Inversion settings>flight movement>invert forward/reverse thrust. Hope this helps, lmk if you need any more help!
Nice, I'm glad someone got the information to you. Yeah, I noticed that the default axis on the VKB is reversed from what SC expects. I believe there's a way in the VKB software to reverse it so you don't have to change anything in SC. If you go the SC configuration route, keep in mind that after the patch drops you''ll likely have to fix that (unless you save your settings elsewhere first).
Possibly? I would suggest you see if SC recognizes your pedals before committing one way or another. If they're recognized and functional, then you definitely have an extra set of inputs that I don't have!
What a useful video! Any reason why you went with the omni-throttle instead of a regular left handed stick? I can think of a few, but having no experience maybe my ideas are silly.
For me I chose the Omni-throttle mostly for comfort. I prefer the palm-down ergonomic grip over the traditional vertical. I wasn’t worried about muscle memory on a vertical stick, since my left hand does not have any.
i want something stiffer or more like 747 controls but for the big ships im a capital ship person so i want to feel like im flying the 165meters corvette not a fighter, check out noobifer videos he has a lot of stick control stuff and stuff from virpil
how did you get rid of the line that tracks from the center of your ui when flying with the mouse. I tlooks so much cleaner and cant find the setting anywhere! also, this is an insanely well done and informative vid
That was how it looked when the video was recorded. A later patch added the line. I'm not aware of a setting that disables it. Sorry. But thanks for watching and commenting!
@@TheHectate Just added, decoys, noise, scan mode, jump and skip jump. Skip jump will engage quantum wait 4 sec then hold down B to stop. Great for when you gotta run.
Keeping it on the desk like that is fine? No need to mount? I'm assuming mounting the stick would make it awkward since the mouse needs to be on the desk.
Yeah I just leave it on the desk. Even during heavy maneuvers I don't have any issue with it slipping around. I believe you're correct that mounting it wouldn't work as well because of the placement of the mouse. I could see someone with a mounted mouse pad doing it though, lol. Either way, it works for me fairly well. The only downside is that the flight stick itself is raised above the desk while the mouse is at desk level, which is a little uneven. Not terrible, but something to consider.
are you using the left premium omni throttle? i was just looking this up and was wondering should i just save up and get one omni throttle for my left hand and one regular flight stick for my right or do you recommend the mouse because i dont really wana throw 500-700 dollars on foot pedals also im still a beginner on using a hotas i bought a cheap thrustmaster and its horrible
Yes, that was the one I got. As far as the other side, it’s definitely something that will depend on your budget and preference. Firstly, shipping is expensive and if you plan to expand your collection eventually then it’s helpful to spend that amount only once - if it’s within your current budget. I’ve seen that the left stick is popular in the standard/premium version without the Omnithrottle. In my mind, foot pedals are an unnecessary extra, feel free to get them if you want to go all out, but it’s not going to change what you’re able to do - just how you do it.
How do you manage to not move the base of the stick around your desk? It feels like very minor movements move it all around and I really don't want to have to drill it into my desk for it to stay put.
I guess I don't have that issue? The rubber pads on the base are gripping my leather desk pad very well and I don't have any issues with it moving around. As a bonus, I can shift it closer or further easily, depending on what I want to do at the moment.
Yes, but many of them are keypresses and not special "buttons" that Star Citizen might not recognize. The Logitech software has them mapped to a key (F5, for example) and that key is just bound as usual like you would if you were flying with the keyboard.
@@TheHectate Thanks, yeah, I ended up mapping the commands I wanted to add to things like Right-Alt+K and then setting the mouse button to that. I'm surprised "Mouse button 5" isn't available but at least I can work around it. I also dusted off my old Saitek ST290PRO and I'm trying out HOSAM. It is fun even with this awkward joystick.
Do you just put the left stick on your desk? It seems like it would feel strange to have your hands at different levels, which would be the case if your stick is just sitting on your desk.
Yes, mine is just sitting on the desk. Not ideal but it's the best setup I have right now. Eventually I'd like to get a mount that I can snap-on/off my chair. That would be ideal for ergonomics.
I'm enjoying it! I still need to actually spend time practicing PvP but for flying around and racing it's a great setup. It makes so much of the flight smoother; and having controls right at my fingers is great.
@@TheHectate Pretty sure this is an attempt to let others know where you get into the meat and potatoes of selecting what goes where and skips your introduction. I enjoyed it all.
@@TheHectate So does the keyboard, but you said you went HOSAM due to budget, not because you think it's the best setup, so I assumed you wanted to upgrade.
@@j.d.4697 It's debatable. I definitely started this adventure thinking HOSAS was "best" simply because everyone else used it. Now I'm less certain, having enjoyed HOSAM for a bit. It's got a great degree of control. That said, I can't say I'm the most knowledgeable person on it; since I've never flown HOSAS!
@@TheHectate It's the best of both worlds, but it still lacks fine analog control of 1 axis. There is a reason some use extensions for their mounted stick setups, the longer the stick the more fine control you have due to leverage. Conversely, tiny thumb sticks may be analog but because of the extremely short stick and the super cheap sensor they are super unprecise. On the other hand, to aim as well with a HOSAS as you can with a HOSAM you will probably want gimballed sticks with good touchless sensors, so minimum VKB Gladiator EVO I think, and also practice. So bottom line is, I have no doubt you can aim as well with a stick as you can with a mouse, at least in SC. The question is whether you put in the money and time investment to get there.
@@j.d.4697 Thanks for the thoughts. Yes, a small stick will definitely be less precise than a larger one - not to even mention the sensor quality question that you bring up. I see what you mean about losing a degree of control over the axes that are on the thumb stick. And you are correct as well that practice will be a huge part of success also!
@@TheHectate In your rendering /editing software should be an indicator. Just put it below overshooting the threshold. Max Volume without overshooting into distortion ist what most people seem to use, so if people come from another video to your channel they dxont have to put the volume up, and the next video ist way loudeer when they forget. There a red clipping indicator on most softwares so you know if youre too loud. Once you figured out how that workds, its easy to get the same volume every time. Interesting Video, i was just trying to figure out a setup before i swith to dual sticks, so i just wanted to see what different people use. gj there.
@@GameTalkEddie Glad it was helpful! And thanks for the tips. I’ll pay attention to the volume meter more next time, I definitely worried about it peaking but probably a little too much. It’s probably advisable to do some further experiments with audio levels, mic placement, and my own voice to see what works best.
@@TheHectate Yeah i did that in the beginning with my edits too, but its better to have it peak slightly once or twice in the video, because even eith my studio headphones i would not notice any bad sounds as long as its not way over the threshold. Depending on the audio software you might even be able to compress the audio so that it has basically the same volume all the time, wich makes the leveling even more easy. Have a nice day, and good luck! Stay Healthy.
Well if someone is considering dropping a couple hundred on a flight stick to play with Star Citizen (and possibly other games too!), then I doubt they're the target audience for your sarcasm. Some of us enjoy this "crap". Either way, thanks for watching!
I don't see why not! Having a touchscreen nearby does mean that you have to take a hand off a control, but if you're seeking an input that's not on those controls already then it should already be a secondary need to everything on your controls.
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I just ordered a gladiator for a hosam setup and this is by far one of the better and more comprehensive videos on setting things up. Really helpful!
Thanks! I’m glad that you’ve found it useful.
I'm not interested in HOSAM (will be running dual stick), but I've watched dozens of flight control configuration and button assignment videos and yours is by far the best organized and most clearly presented I've seen. Using your approach will work for any control scheme, and you could honestly rebrand this content to be "how to organize your flight controls for Star Citizen" and reach a much larger audience than those interested in HOSAM alone (which is probably a tiny minority). I will recommend this to as many people as possible.
Hey thanks for the kind words! I'm glad you believe it's useful. I definitely was wondering when making it if I had gone to far into "theory" before swinging back into "practice", but I felt it would do an injustice to not explain the *why* behind my choices - and hopefully help some people make their own choices instead of copying mine. Thanks again!
Thx for adding the therory in there. It went a long way to helping understand the control input layouts and why great info video well done
I’ve been out of Star Citizen for a long time. I am one of the so called veteran who supported a star Citizen with buying a large armada of ships. However frustrated with the huge delays and at one point just unplayable I bowed out for the last 4 years more or less. They have made some progress to get me back into it. Amazing but from my perspective little progress but clearly enough to overcome some of the blockers of the past. Your video is an instructional nirvana lol Clear and concise…….made it understandable. I looked many times at other videos set ups and nothing with the clarity and easy to follow like yours. Based on this a veteran who spend obscene money in the beginning to support the dream I am back.based on this video I subscribe to your channel. Thank you
Glad to hear you're back. The game isn't perfect (or even done) but I have great fun with what is there now and that's good enough for me. Cheers!
Thank you! SO MUCH for this. I've been trying to find anybody out there that has the same setup. This is great.
I’m glad it was helpful!
I very much applaud your methodical approach to figuring out a solution to this.
Thanks for the kind words!
A thorough, well organized video for us dozens of HOSAM enthusiasts? Instant sub. Even though I’ve been using it for half a year I’m glad to have learned new things from your video. And since I’ve just convinced a friend to try HOSAM I’ll be showing this to him as well. Well done sir
There's dozens of us! Dozens!
Thanks for sharing, subbing, and I'm glad you liked it!
@@TheHectate Of course man, I have some questions too!
1. Main thing is, with roll on X axis, is the precision of roll much more useful than having it on Z twist? I tried it and I think maybe I have to give my brain more time to retrain since I’ve been using it for strafe for so long, but in PvP where roll is a quick maneuver to keep the target on the vertical axis I find myself strafing and managing throttle while using the mini thumb stick for strafe up to keep my nose on target while maneuvering. With strafe all on the thumb stick, is it easy enough to strafe up and to the right at the same time?
2. So far I’ve been used to targeting on the red thumb button, with QT on pressing down the thumb stick. With vertical and horizontal strafe on the mini thumb stick, wouldn’t it be better to do target forward on thumb stick press? Then maybe move QT to red thumb stick or something.
3. I’m curious what you’ve bound to the base controls on the VKB. So far I’ve found I do enjoy mining laser power controlled by encoder 1, modules on the three buttons if needed, and ping angle on the other encoder. Alternatively, outside of mining I’ve got 1 for missile cam, 2 for decoupled toggle, and 3 for request landing.
@@krokenlochen Good questions.
1. The thumb-stick/mini-stick does well at hitting both axes to strafe up/right etc. With the Omni-throttle it's tilted 45 degrees off, but since my hand is also tilted, I've not had any issues with that since on my thumb it still feels like the correct direction. I'm not well-experienced at PvP so I can fully believe that different people will have different preference based on how they play or what they feel is most important.
2. I don't have a QT button bound on the stick. With the red button on countermeasures I'm sure I could do a click-in on a HAT/stick to toggle it, but right now it's on the keyboard.
3. For the three buttons I have those set to VTOL, Landing gear, and Request Landing. The switches/encoders are not being used right now. The current patch has been a mess for miners, and I'm not starved for funds, so it's not been something I've needed to set up yet. I do want to try the two encoders out on mining to see what I think. The ping-angle is a great idea that I hadn't thought of, so thanks for mentioning that. I know scouting for rocks has changed and made the pings more important, so that's a great suggestion.
Ordering a omni throttle today and enjoyed your discussion on button layout it made me think about key binding for Elite thanks
Glad it helped! Thanks for watching!
I applaud your input planning. Thank you for the format.
Thanks for watching!
This was a GREAT video and I'm not even interested in getting a hosam set-up! You went into, not only the benefits of the setup, but also the extensive thought and theory behind each decision you made. The quality of this video is truly refreshing. Like a class from one of the professors that really makes you want to learn, not because you need the credit but because they're just that good of a teacher. Sorry if the reference is a little out there, it's just what this video feel like lol
Wow such kind words! Thank you for that. I'm thrilled to know that my style doesn't come across as dry or boring; it was a concern that it's not as "exciting" as other videos. Thanks again!
lowkey HOSAM is the superior setup. good vid
Thanks! Glad you liked it. I definitely agree!
This is by far one of the most thorough tutorials I have seen. The content is amazing and complete. Thank you for taking the time to share your setup and thoughts. Very well done.
Thanks for the kind words, and thanks for watching! I'm glad it helped.
So glad I came across your vid. I've been debating ordering the exact stick for that setup as I've really pushed the M&K as far as I want and now need that analog input for finer control and the extra buttons and such.
Thanks man!
Thanks for the kind words! I'm glad to hear that it was helpful for you.
This is incredibly helpful. I was just looking at setting up for this... Which is probably what the internet brought it to me without me actually searching for it... The Googlebook overlords know all
Glad you enjoyed watching!
I’ve got mine in finally! What I’ve found extremely useful is adding some shift functions to keys. So my “rapid fire” or “little black trigger” has 2 shift modes. Allowing me to have 3 quick potential functions for one button. Example red button=noise while shift1 button+red button=decoy, and shift2 button+red button=missile count
Very nice! I've been meaning to get into the shift modes myself. It's a great upgrade that doesn't require anything extra in hardware.
@@TheHectate almost makes me feel like I’ve paid for the software. Only binding I have in SC are the axis controls, and little throttle wheel. Everything else is bound through VKB software. Best part, I don’t risk losing my binding progress because the profile is saved independent of SCs User folder.
@@dito4lyfe I really need to try that. I have the software installed but I really only used it initially to ensure that all the axes/buttons were working correctly. While this last patch didn't wipe my control scheme, it definitely would have been annoying if it had.
good insight into the process of rebinding commands and the mindset necessary for achieving functionality when doing so.
Thanks! Yeah, I didn't want to just be "here's a mouse and stick", so I wanted to ensure people were thinking about how they wanted to use them.
My VKB omni throttle came today so Im just testing it out in a private arena commander race.
Your movement bindings make a lot of sense going from M/KB to Stick and mouse for ship flying. It feels natural like it was intended to be controlled this way. Thanks for the video :)
The only thing I find myself getting use to with the movement is the analogue input.
Nice! Yes, I definitely agree it takes some getting used to handling a ship with analog input. It's tricky because it's so easy to just "full send" which is no better/worse than just a digital keypress on the keyboard. That said, certain ships are much more comfortable to fly now - I didn't like the Arrow at all with M/K but it's much more comfortable to fly with the stick. Rolling in particular, since it was so twitchy on keyboard.
I've had a pair of T-1600's sitting in an Amazon cart for 160 CAD for the last month. Still holding back, but always looking for options, I also had a VKB setup in the cart on their site. Until I went to checkout, and they wanted to charge 178 CAD (150 US) for shipping, for a total bill, including mounting brackets, sitting at around 800 bucks. So I cleared that cart in a hurry. Went over to Virpl and I just didn't find anything all that appealing, namely the price. 1200 bucks before shipping. I was even more put off.
This setup has me rethinking everything, and I appreciate the level of detail. One great stick for the cost of two cheap plastic ones, along with your setup, added value to my list of considerations.
Much appreciated!
I'm glad it helped you! Yes, international shipping was much higher than what I'm used to in the CONUS, although as you mention - combining multiple purchases will help with that. I opted to go without any mounting since it's just a single stick at this time. That helped keep the investment a bit lower lol.
Wow... I've always used a half controller/mouse setup for all of my games including Star Citizen... This is a great idea... Brilliant video sir 😊
Thanks for the kind words!
I was looking at going a HoSaS setup with dual T16000's but have decided to go with VKB Gladiators for the quality. Saying this I am very much in the same situation you found yourself in with lack of funds to drop for 2 sticks. So now I am looking at HoSaM setup. This is an extremely well thought out, well explained Video of not only your setup but the thinking behind why buttons and hats and switches were assigned the way they were. I thankyou for your time and effort you put into this production it is extremely invaluable and I will be referencing it in-depth as I setup my new VKB Gladiator when it arrives. Thankyou.
Thanks for the kind words! I’m glad to hear the video helped. Happy flying!
@@TheHectate Well today is the day. It arrived so I am rewatching your video and taking notes as to which buttons and axis go where. I'll report again after trying it for a while :)
Was thinking about this exact setup and then saw this video. Ordered right after I finished watching thanks!
Glad that it was helpful! Enjoy your new setup.
Awesome video brother! Really like your setup with strafe mapped to the hat, killer idea!
Glad you liked it! Thanks for watching!
g602 is a legend.. and 604 is a best successor! anticipating next evolution of that series
604 will give you extra 2 buttons on scroll wheel - side movement! its a game changer
Nice. I'll have to check that out.
Year late to this but ended up going the same route for almost the same reasons and its funny how similar our inputs ended up. Glad im not the only omi mouse user
Nice! There are dozens of us!
good job ... I struggled so much with dual stick (not super good sticks) when the mouse responds much better and seems to be much more accurate. great job again.
now with this setup, it's as if enemies fall much faster
Thanks for sharing your experience! I definitely want to eventually try dual sticks myself, but hearing how much people like this setup I have to wonder if it's worth the expense to even try it.! GLHF!
This is the exact setup I have been considering with that VKB nxt throttle and my g502. I'd like the right hand nxt evo as well but its also outside my budget. Thanks for this video!
I'm glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching.
I think this is a BETTER setup than dual stick. It allows you to stay on target a lot easier than a joystick. imo.
I can definitely agree that there are cases where the mouse gives you much finer control. I enjoy doing the races with it myself!
I am also using HOSAM atm. Logitech extreme 3d pro ( a budget normal shape stick ) and G604 the 2nd gen of ur mouse. Great vid i just wish google recommended this to me a month ago. right now i have 90% of ur binds already self made. but i will add some like the power changer in the mouse buttons. also the X* in the stick i use it for side strafe, but will try do it as u suggested for roll. since my stick is the standard shape, i used the twist for up/down strafe.
After testing the X stick as roll. i am going back to X stick as side strafe.
Glad to hear that the video was helpful! I find it interesting that you preferred the X axis as strafing, but there's no shame in doing it the way that you like. Do what works for you. Thanks for watching!
Thank you very much for this video. Not having the stick in my dominant hand just didn't occur to me. Perfect for my use with star citizen. Just quick swap to wasd and IAM FPS ready. It's also fantastic for racing. Only trouble I had was to find left hand friendly stick, I got Airbus thrust master that works for both hands and it's cheap for PC. It has hall effect sensor and material feels good so I can recommend it for someone out of price range of the gladiator.
Thanks for the comment! Yeah, there are plenty of options out there that would work for left or right hands, so whatever works for you is the best choice! Thanks for sharing.
This video is amazing, and may have just saved me a serious amount of money. Thank you!
Thanks for watching and I'm glad it helped. Good luck and have fun!
goated
Greatest Of All Throttles
Wow, really really good video dude. I have been trying to explain this a lot over the years, but maybe not so well because most say "eff it...Buzzkiller!" The process you went through is exactly right, prioritize the stuff you need instantly and the rest can go on the keyboard or whatever. I would argue about some of the choices, but really that's not important as this stuff is usually personal in terms of both what is effective and what feels good to the player and especially going through this process. Couple things I would say is that you can double the buttons available to you by using the pinky button as a "shift" key and mapping combos based on that with some external software like joystick Gremlin (or might even be in the VKB software itself, can't remember). That's also useful for dual stick people with T16000s that don't have enough buttons. Stick and mouse is also something people can try to see if they might prefer sticks before they actually go and buy the second stick. The hardest part of going from mouse to stick is probably aim, so keeping the mouse in the mix at the beginning is kind of a halfway point. Good job!
Thanks for the comment! Yes, I'd heard not long after this video about being able to set up modifiers, so that's definitely a great way to expand the number of options available to a stick user.
I want to go dual stick, but can only afford one at a time. And was thinking get throttle first. After seeing this, now I'm going to get throttle first
One of us!
Hosam my prefered combo! \O/
It’s great! Get the word out; more people must know lol
U deserve more views and I wish you best luck for that. The video is well structured. Your voice is clear and calm. The information precise and valuable. In some parts it is a tiny bit too slow for my taste, but that’s just a very minor thing. Thank you for the insight. Fly safe CMDR o7
Thanks for the feedback, and for watching!
There isn't a ton of great info about this setup and I'm in the same boat where its pretty expensive to grab 2 sticks but I want one quality stick to build off of and I play a lot of FPS so mouse is natural to me. Thank you for this guide !
I'm glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching!
This is one of the best videos about HOSAM I've seen. Thank you.
One of the questions I have is how often do you use roll? Something I keep reading about is that in space sim games in general, strafe is more important than roll (unlike flight sims), so people recommend using the x axis of the stick to be strafe right/ left.
Have you tried that? Maybe putting roll on the thumbsticks? Or does it just "feel better" to keep your strafes all together on that thumbstick
Roll is actually fairly important still IMO, so I do use it a lot. The main reason has to do with the fact that many of the ships in SC have very strong maneuvering thrusters on the bottom. This is to counteract gravity (e.g. VTOL/hovering situations), however the increased force they can put out is relevant in zero-G also. If your strongest non-main thrusters are on the bottom of the ship, then using roll to put them in the best position for your benefit is a big deal. I'm not that great at PvP yet, but I can hold my own in racing. Being able to *smoothly* roll (instead of all on/off of keyboard rolling) has made a huge difference in controlling the ship on the "best path" whlie racing.
Of course, depending on how they eventually implement or change atmospheric effects on the shape of the ship, flying more like a flight simulator could eventually become important.
Either way, it works very well for me and I still have my full strafe options.
Avenger One (the guy whose control scheme inspired this set up) has roll bound to twisting the left stick.
Thx a lot for this analytic point of view. As you say in the video, some things everybody already knows, But thats the point, I think.
Just to know something doesn't mean you really can use it and work with this knowledge ;o) I allways was after dual sticks and just thought "everybody uses them and it looks just quite smooth, in all the vids, so of course that will be the way to go." Now I'm rethinking it and will mostly consider the point, you mention, just following logic. :) May be I'll end up with HOSAS, maybe not, but I'll sure overthink it again, before getting new hardware! again, thx a lot. :)
Glad to hear that it was helpful in some way. Whichever way you go, I'm sure you'll enjoy it. Thanks for watching!
Thanks this was informative; well done.
Thanks for watching!
Great video Hectate. I like your setup, it is like you have three hands working with the thumb joystick.
I also had issues using the twist option on a stick with the omni throttle. When twisting my wrist it would add other motions to the stick like up or down on the X - axis.
Thanks! Yes, having the thumb stick available makes a huge difference; without it, this control scheme would be significantly limited.
Awesome explanation of why you chose what you did. The very meticulous planning is insightful but I miss one part - there's a number of "dealfault left-hand inputs" such as Gimball mode, Free Look, Scanning etc that you did not mention. I'm assuming those went to the buttons on the base of the stick or other buttons on the mouse.
Yes, it's a choice of priorities. Free Look, for example, I wasn't worried about because I did have the "F" Inner Thought bound on the outside red button, and that's effective for a quick glance around without using actual Free Look mode. Scanning settings are on the base (a rocker for up/down angle, and a button) for mining mostly, and Gimbal mode was not mentioned because many people take those off to upgrade the weapons a size anyway. For me, on the occasions I want to use gimbals, I just press G on the keyboard as I'm heading into the fight.
I use same setup. Not budget but real estate is an issue. I'm loving it but definitely took me time to set up the way my brain likes. I use trigger 1 for boost and trigger 2 for brake.
Nice!
great vid mate
Thanks for the compliment!
Really appreciate your well-thought-out approach and clear explanation. I just got the same type of stick for my throttle and am planning to configure things as you describe for a nice starting, off point. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom!
Glad that it was helpful, thanks for watching and commenting too!
@@TheHectate If you're taking suggestions: one thing I'm struggling with, is the abundance of throttle and strafe options available with the latest Star Citizen patch. Would be great to see an explanation of relative VS absolute, trim long and short, sensitivity curves, and dead zones, as it relates to flight movement.
@@verbalpics Thanks for the suggestion. I'm not sure if I understand all of it yet either, but maybe that'll be something to do soon.
Useful advice for most any setup!
Thanks for watching!
I currently have a HOSAS setup (dual t16k), and they're definitely on the cheaper side, but I still think I would prefer this setup. I just love the precision of having a mouse, and I've kinda missed it with a right joystick. I dread going through all my keybindings again though 😭🤣
Give it a shot! Save your old configuration and try out just the controls on something like the Arena Commander racing mode to see how it feels to fly.
@Hectate I've been using HOSAM with pedals (HOSAM-FOP?) and it's SO GOOD. Also using an azeron to get rid of the keyboard all together. Had the t16k, but just ordered the same VKB as you (dont have Virpil money now lmao), should be here in a week. Thank you for the video!!
I also got a Logitech G600 MMO mouse, my favorite mouse so far
19:17 bind vjoy/relative mouse mode to something, I have mine set to clicking down the mouse wheel. This way you can quickly swap between being fast with aim, and being very accurate and controlled
Great Video. Thanks for the effort !
Thanks for watching!
Switch to this setup from hotas and I like it 👌
Nice! Welcome to the club!
Awesome! I am looking at doing the same. this was a great help.
Glad to know it helped! Cheers!
I use this setup with a CH Pro Throttle, CH Pro Pedals and Logitech G502. Rudder pedals control roll. I am still experimenting with the pedals break inputs to see what works best.
Very nice. Pedals would be awesome to have. Sadly, the way my desk is built I don't have much space underneath to put them. Someday...
I have a g600 with 12keys and a shift modifier allowing me to use all my f keys. I've been tempted by the wireless g602 for years now but I'm just not willing to give up having a full numpad built into my mouse.
Nice, that definitely has a lot of buttons! If you look at some of the other comments, you'll notice people have recommended using a modifier on the flight stick to increase the number of available options. I'm going to be looking into that myself.
what a nice product...
Thanks!
I’ve ordered the same setup apart from having a different mouse.
I’ve been watching SC from the sidelines for a few year and have finally just purchased it after putting in an order for a left Gladiator NXT evo omni throttle. I’m going to wait for the stick to arrive before playing the game but this vid will be my first point of call when setting it up.
I had a vague idea of how I wanted to set up the strafe and roll and it turned out to be exactly the same as yours
I’m going to bolt some unistrut brackets to my desk and have the stick sitting just off the edge so that it doesn’t clutter things up
Nice! Thanks for watching and I hope you enjoy your time on the game; perhaps we will meet out there. Good luck!
Ive been doing the same. Been watching for awhile now. Looking for the best setup.
@@townofgatecity3235 Yea, after doing some more research, after I receive the left stick I think I’m going to go for pedals next for forward and back thrust, then track IR just for free look and then eventually the right hand stick
Loved the tutorial man this thing is legit 100% !! althogh i wish if theres a way you can do it on computer
Thanks for watching! But, do what on a computer?
Ok, Hectate, thank you for making this great and comprehensive video but....i hate you. After 10 mins in i went to see the costs and a little mole started to dig in my mind that i probably need this. ¬_¬' I fly with a Logitech G13 and mouse and this is by far the closest setup to what i'm used to. Tried dual stick (cheap ones i had) and wasn't happy with it, my mind just didn't accept it. But this.....man! i need to save some money dang it!
I totally get it. Initially, I was trying to justify the cost of nicer dual sticks, but when a friend recommended I look into this, it made all the difference in my budget. Don't feel bad if this is a bit of a stretch, because people can do extremely well with mouse and keyboard also! Save up your money for what you want (and don't waste it on cheap sticks). You could also look online for people selling used sticks - I've seen some for sale on Reddit, for example.
@@TheHectate Just so you know, i just ordered the flight stick from VKB Europe. The price was quite more (240€) than the US version (175$). We will se ;)
Thanks. Good vid
Thanks for watching!
@Hectate
i assume after a longer session your can feel it in your left shoulder?
if so try to find a better position for your flightstick it looks like your arm is not resting while u sing the stick wich is very very bad and if you do not feel it now you will in the future specialy avoid straightening your arm to reach the joystick and god never in an upwards way.
While it's on my desk like this, yes my arm is "hovering" higher than usual. Thankfully at my height it's still reasonably comfortable but I could see other people having that issue. Getting it lowered (on a mount or something) would definitely improve the ergonomics!
Great video cheers
Thanks! Cheers!
You wouldn't happen to have the XML file for this setup? I am having a hard time figuring out how to program it all in, besides the mouse controls
Sorry, no I don't currently have it available online.
Great video! I currently have one T16000 that I use and the keyboard. Would you recommend setting roll to twist with a normal stick like the T16000? Trying to mimic this setup
I personally did not like roll on the twist axis, but I know there are a lot of people that use it that way. The one thing I would caution you is that the T16000 has a reputation for a rapidly failing twist axis. If you train all that muscle memory and then you have to switch it up because it breaks... do you want to do that? lol. I can't answer for what you feel is best. I recommend trying everything out for just a little and see how it feels to you.
@@TheHectate okay cool, thank you for all the information! I am going to get a VKB just to avoid the headache.
Great vid Hectate - something I come back to often.
Any chance of an update since master modes?
It's crossed my mind a few times. I both didn't want to get into it before I decided my own thoughts on the changes, nor just before they applied more tweaks and made the work pointless. Maybe in a patch or two when things have settled for Master Modes I'll make an update.
For now, the short version is that I have one of the side mouse buttons mapped to switch master modes, and middle click does the SCM/NAV mode switching. Everything else is the same I believe.
Great video, very in depth and thorough. Quick question though, did you remove the spring for the Y-axis return-to-center to treat it as a real throttle, or do you prefer return to center on the Y-axis? Thanks in advance.
Great question! I did not remove the spring. I had considered it, but since I wanted to easily return to zero thrust from either direction, I felt the spring was necessary.
I think the story might be different in other games, but for SC where all ships are essentially VTOL (some more efficient than others) it seemed like the right choice.
Have you tried the HOMAM with a 3Dconnexion SpaceMouse and a gaming mouse? Looking for some pros/cons on that setup.
I have actually looked into 3d mice but it's not a priority for me and I've never actually had one. Bigger issue is that I'd like to get a vertical mouse (but with all the features of my G602). Some days I wonder if I just need to make my own peripherals instead.
This was really useful. I had an idea about the twist axis on your stick: Could you use that forward/backward twist to rebalance shields from front to back? What about setting it to add/reduce engine power on the triangle?
I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work. You might have to switch the twist to something that triggers at a certain value (since it's an axis and not a button), but that's something that can be easily done with the VKB software. I wouldn't use it for the power triangle personally though. For the maximum benefit, you really only have 4 choices. Max in one of the three points, or just balance it. The boost that each get (especially with weapons) to being at max means there's never a good reason to not have it on any other setting in between. That's why my mouse has the three buttons configured to max out a particular point. I can instantly switch to weapons, let them fast-recharge, and then back to shields max to protect myself while I empty the capacitors.
I got ALL the control options, but not once did I stop to think if I should 😨
Your explanation of your process for choosing each control was so helpful for me in figuring out the basics for my first stick setup. Also doing HOSAM with the Omni. May switch to HOSAS in the future, but for now while I try it out, I'm very grateful for your video to get me started! One question: if you didn't worry about your ability to properly use the twist, what would you bind to it?
Thanks! Wow that is a tough question. Since I don’t *need* it for any of my axes, what would it be useful for? My initial thought is perhaps it would be nice for vertical strafe. Most ships in SC have very strong bottom thrusters - even more true for VTOL modes - so having the ability to accelerate directly up or down while having your thumb free for other tasks could be very useful.
@@TheHectate I got my stick and am learning to fly with it! Definitely taking some getting used to. I ended up doing roll on the thumb stick and strafe on the flight stick as that is just what my brain wanted to do. I tried the other way and kept trying to roll with the thumbstick. I have the stick set up pretty tight with 0 deadzone so I was rolling while trying to speed up or brake as well. I put targetting on the top left stick, power management on the middle D-pad and freelook on the small side pointer button. Quantum, landing gear, request landing on the lower thumb stick. Working out decently so far. Thanks again for the video and I am looking forward to getting deeper into SC with the update later today!
@@iamjeramy Glad to hear you got it working for you. Yeah, if your brain wants to do something different and it works for you, don't fight it! There's no rules about where one control has to be over another. Happy flying!
My good sir, excellent video. Would you be able to post your XML file of your saved bindings?
I posted this in another reply, but I think it's better for people to set their own bindings. It really cements the location of those buttons in your mental map of the controls when you've taken the time to manually think through the options and set it up yourself.
@@TheHectate I would generally agree. I have a VKB on loan to see if I like it and am trying al kinds of things. There are so few HOSAM profiles out there, I wanted to try a few variants. thanks for responding!
@@TheHectate I just went through the entire comment thread looking for it. lol likely would have finished manually binding by now if I just got on it. lol
I don't its so much a single stick budget but more accuracy ALOT more accuracy with a mouse aiming. THx for video.
Thanks for watching! Yes, there are definite benefits to having the mouse around :)
I can't fly with a mouse, feels so horrible. HOSAS or HOTAS for me all the way. I've been doing flight sims since the 90's so the idea of using a mouse to fly with is about on par with using reins from a wagon to drive my car :p. I use VKB gunfighter for my stick and a vkb gladiator as the throttle in Star citizen. It's great!
Nice setup! Yeah it’s not for everyone, but for those that need an option that meets their needs halfway, it’s a good solution. Someday I want to acquire a second stick for the right hand, then I’ll be able to see which I like more too lol
Just ordered the same stick and I'm excited to follow your guide to get things setup quickly once it arrives! Do you find that the stick needed to be modified or mounted to your desk or is its heaftiness good enough to not shift around while in use?
For the way I use mine, it just sits on my desk. I know a great number of people prefer mounts like the Predator Mounts to give them quick-disconnect options while still keeping it firmly in place. For my case, desktop use is fine. You'll have to see for yourself. One downside to sitting it on a desk is the increased height compared to a mouse and keyboard on the same desk, though.
@@TheHectate Good point, I was definitely considering the forward and back distance, but didn't think about the up/down. I'll likely need to get it in front of me and then see where it could be placed if it feels to high. It may sound weird, but a very small elbow support on my chair arm might solve that problem. As long as it doesn't add any strange fatigue.. :)
I wish I had seen this a while ago. I bought a HOTAS and just don’t get on with it in SC and the stick is right handed.
No matter what you switch to/from there is always going to be some kind of learning curve. Maybe HOTAS isn't the right setup for you, but also maybe you just need to get more practice with it.
That said, if it doesn't end up working out, there's always the option to sell the HOTAS and move that money towards a different setup like HOSAM or HOSAS.
Would you be able to upload your bindings files??
In theory I could, but I would still recommend you do it yourself. Both because the binding process helps you think through what you're doing, and also because if patches break bindings in the future you'd have to do it anyway. Good practice.
Hello, i just got this controller and im having the problem of binding the forward and reverse thrust correctly. Going forward is reverse thrust and going back is forward thrust, and cant seem to switch it around
Open options, go to controls tab, click over to joystick in the bottom right (there may or may not be multiple, so click through until you find the correct one).
Inversion settings>flight movement>invert forward/reverse thrust.
Hope this helps, lmk if you need any more help!
@@PropKnucklesFPV this worked. Thank you so much
Nice, I'm glad someone got the information to you. Yeah, I noticed that the default axis on the VKB is reversed from what SC expects. I believe there's a way in the VKB software to reverse it so you don't have to change anything in SC. If you go the SC configuration route, keep in mind that after the patch drops you''ll likely have to fix that (unless you save your settings elsewhere first).
Bro if I buy a left hand stick and I already have gas break pedals can I do this too
Possibly? I would suggest you see if SC recognizes your pedals before committing one way or another. If they're recognized and functional, then you definitely have an extra set of inputs that I don't have!
What a useful video! Any reason why you went with the omni-throttle instead of a regular left handed stick? I can think of a few, but having no experience maybe my ideas are silly.
For me I chose the Omni-throttle mostly for comfort. I prefer the palm-down ergonomic grip over the traditional vertical. I wasn’t worried about muscle memory on a vertical stick, since my left hand does not have any.
@@TheHectate thanks man! Checked your other videos, sick flying. pretty sold on this (h.o.t.a.m.?) layout
@@Cashatoo Thanks for the kind words! I don't really consider it a throttle (since it doesn't stay in place if I let go), so I like to say HOSAM.
i want something stiffer or more like 747 controls but for the big ships im a capital ship person so i want to feel like im flying the 165meters corvette not a fighter, check out noobifer videos he has a lot of stick control stuff and stuff from virpil
Heeey this is what my plan is after selling my hotas to a friend while I order an Omni thrust lol
Nice! Welcome to the club!
how did you get rid of the line that tracks from the center of your ui when flying with the mouse. I tlooks so much cleaner and cant find the setting anywhere!
also, this is an insanely well done and informative vid
That was how it looked when the video was recorded. A later patch added the line. I'm not aware of a setting that disables it. Sorry. But thanks for watching and commenting!
And I use voice attack for targeting and other inputs
Oh yeah, I've seen people using voice attack. I really need to try that out someday.
@@TheHectate Just added, decoys, noise, scan mode, jump and skip jump. Skip jump will engage quantum wait 4 sec then hold down B to stop. Great for when you gotta run.
i use TRP rudder peddals, a Wooting One keyboard and mouse. i can't use stick it feels ... wrong.
Hey, whatever works for you is what's important!
Keeping it on the desk like that is fine? No need to mount? I'm assuming mounting the stick would make it awkward since the mouse needs to be on the desk.
Yeah I just leave it on the desk. Even during heavy maneuvers I don't have any issue with it slipping around. I believe you're correct that mounting it wouldn't work as well because of the placement of the mouse. I could see someone with a mounted mouse pad doing it though, lol. Either way, it works for me fairly well. The only downside is that the flight stick itself is raised above the desk while the mouse is at desk level, which is a little uneven. Not terrible, but something to consider.
are you using the left premium omni throttle? i was just looking this up and was wondering should i just save up and get one omni throttle for my left hand and one regular flight stick for my right or do you recommend the mouse because i dont really wana throw 500-700 dollars on foot pedals also im still a beginner on using a hotas i bought a cheap thrustmaster and its horrible
Yes, that was the one I got. As far as the other side, it’s definitely something that will depend on your budget and preference. Firstly, shipping is expensive and if you plan to expand your collection eventually then it’s helpful to spend that amount only once - if it’s within your current budget. I’ve seen that the left stick is popular in the standard/premium version without the Omnithrottle.
In my mind, foot pedals are an unnecessary extra, feel free to get them if you want to go all out, but it’s not going to change what you’re able to do - just how you do it.
How do you manage to not move the base of the stick around your desk? It feels like very minor movements move it all around and I really don't want to have to drill it into my desk for it to stay put.
I guess I don't have that issue? The rubber pads on the base are gripping my leather desk pad very well and I don't have any issues with it moving around. As a bonus, I can shift it closer or further easily, depending on what I want to do at the moment.
Are you using the Logitech software for mapping the mouse buttons? I'm having trouble getting star citizen to recognize them.
Yes, but many of them are keypresses and not special "buttons" that Star Citizen might not recognize. The Logitech software has them mapped to a key (F5, for example) and that key is just bound as usual like you would if you were flying with the keyboard.
@@TheHectate Thanks, yeah, I ended up mapping the commands I wanted to add to things like Right-Alt+K and then setting the mouse button to that. I'm surprised "Mouse button 5" isn't available but at least I can work around it. I also dusted off my old Saitek ST290PRO and I'm trying out HOSAM. It is fun even with this awkward joystick.
Do you just put the left stick on your desk? It seems like it would feel strange to have your hands at different levels, which would be the case if your stick is just sitting on your desk.
Yes, mine is just sitting on the desk. Not ideal but it's the best setup I have right now. Eventually I'd like to get a mount that I can snap-on/off my chair. That would be ideal for ergonomics.
Is it possible to get your layout profile?
Sorry, I don't have it shared anywhere. It shouldn't be too difficult to re-create, since I kept so much as default as possible.
Hey mate, just wondering how this setup is going for you?
I'm enjoying it! I still need to actually spend time practicing PvP but for flying around and racing it's a great setup. It makes so much of the flight smoother; and having controls right at my fingers is great.
interesting
fascinating
What you came for @14:17
Sorry, I don't understand the question.
@@TheHectate Pretty sure this is an attempt to let others know where you get into the meat and potatoes of selecting what goes where and skips your introduction. I enjoyed it all.
What stick are you using
The flight stick is the VKB Gladiator NXT EVO with Omnithrottle attachment.
Hope you can upgrade to a HOSAS soon. HOSAM is missing 1 axis.
Did you watch the video? I have all the axes available 100%.
@@TheHectate
So does the keyboard, but you said you went HOSAM due to budget, not because you think it's the best setup, so I assumed you wanted to upgrade.
@@j.d.4697 It's debatable. I definitely started this adventure thinking HOSAS was "best" simply because everyone else used it. Now I'm less certain, having enjoyed HOSAM for a bit. It's got a great degree of control. That said, I can't say I'm the most knowledgeable person on it; since I've never flown HOSAS!
@@TheHectate
It's the best of both worlds, but it still lacks fine analog control of 1 axis. There is a reason some use extensions for their mounted stick setups, the longer the stick the more fine control you have due to leverage. Conversely, tiny thumb sticks may be analog but because of the extremely short stick and the super cheap sensor they are super unprecise.
On the other hand, to aim as well with a HOSAS as you can with a HOSAM you will probably want gimballed sticks with good touchless sensors, so minimum VKB Gladiator EVO I think, and also practice.
So bottom line is, I have no doubt you can aim as well with a stick as you can with a mouse, at least in SC. The question is whether you put in the money and time investment to get there.
@@j.d.4697 Thanks for the thoughts. Yes, a small stick will definitely be less precise than a larger one - not to even mention the sensor quality question that you bring up. I see what you mean about losing a degree of control over the axes that are on the thumb stick. And you are correct as well that practice will be a huge part of success also!
Little feedback while watching, the volume on your video is way to low.
Thanks for the info, it’s always hard to gauge what works for different people so I must have erred too low.
@@TheHectate In your rendering /editing software should be an indicator. Just put it below overshooting the threshold. Max Volume without overshooting into distortion ist what most people seem to use, so if people come from another video to your channel they dxont have to put the volume up, and the next video ist way loudeer when they forget. There a red clipping indicator on most softwares so you know if youre too loud. Once you figured out how that workds, its easy to get the same volume every time. Interesting Video, i was just trying to figure out a setup before i swith to dual sticks, so i just wanted to see what different people use. gj there.
@@GameTalkEddie Glad it was helpful! And thanks for the tips. I’ll pay attention to the volume meter more next time, I definitely worried about it peaking but probably a little too much. It’s probably advisable to do some further experiments with audio levels, mic placement, and my own voice to see what works best.
@@TheHectate Yeah i did that in the beginning with my edits too, but its better to have it peak slightly once or twice in the video, because even eith my studio headphones i would not notice any bad sounds as long as its not way over the threshold. Depending on the audio software you might even be able to compress the audio so that it has basically the same volume all the time, wich makes the leveling even more easy. Have a nice day, and good luck! Stay Healthy.
Thank you for supporting a broken game so more and more people will buy into this crap
Well if someone is considering dropping a couple hundred on a flight stick to play with Star Citizen (and possibly other games too!), then I doubt they're the target audience for your sarcasm. Some of us enjoy this "crap". Either way, thanks for watching!
Weird
Yeah, I know right?
So you bought Chinese lol ok
That's a weird comment; I have no idea what you mean. The VKB Gladiators are great quality.
@@TheHectate China doesn't make anything of great quality. Virpil 4 life
I am wondering if this might be even better using a pad and gameglass?
I don't see why not! Having a touchscreen nearby does mean that you have to take a hand off a control, but if you're seeking an input that's not on those controls already then it should already be a secondary need to everything on your controls.
wow great video ty verry much!
Thanks for watching!