2023 Subaru BRZ Quick Review
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ต.ค. 2024
- The 2023 Subaru BRZ Sport-Tech ($35,772 in Canada, $32,115 in the US) is a naturally aspirated, rear-wheel drive sports car with 228 horsepower out of a 2.4 L boxer engine. This second-generation BRZ has more power than the last gen, new suspension tuning, a stiffer chassis, more torque down low and more. Do these changes make for a completely improved experience over the last generation? And how does it compare to its Toyota twin the GR86 and the competition? Thomas and James are eager to share their thoughts. Watch to see what they think! SUBSCRIBE!
EXTRA THROTTLE HOUSE!
/ extrathrottlehouse
Throttle House Merch!
www.thethrottl...
Instagram!
/ thethrottlehouse
Facebook!
/ thomashollandproductions
Editor: Karston Chong
Sound: Harrison Dickson and Karston Chong
Music from Epidemicsound.com and Artlist.io
#Subaru #BRZ #Boxer
the way james noticed the bump and realized its already late and says "bump" after giving up was so relatable and funny
8:43 “lenient” is the word you’re looking for.
I was thinking "permissive," but "lenient" is good, too.
^was just about to say the same. I'm glad I'm not the only one who needed to have closure haha
@@williamgechtman9287 permissive was definitely what James was thinking 😂
Open minded.
@@spb78art Maybe "tolerant."
I ordered a GR86 in March of 2022. By April of 2023 it still hasn't arrived so I reached out to subaru because I heard they were supposedly actually delivering these vehicles to canadian customers.
So in April I canceled the gr86 and ordered a BRZ. It was supposed to be here in June. It's almost August and I still don't have it 🙃
Are you really picky about colour? I was open on colour and got one in 3 weeks…
@snowrang3r657 I gave Toyota my preference but said I'd take anything after the first 6 months lol
To be fair my BRZ is allegedly built, waiting in Japan to be shipped. The Vancouver port strike hasn't helped things I suppose.
almost the exact same story for me. 13 months wait before canceling the GR86 order. my subaru dealer took 2 months before I drove away in a BRZ. apparently, somebody canceled their order and I was given dibs to take it. hang in there, dude!
ughhh.... I ordered a gr a few months ago. but I really just want to buy a used 2019 Golf R. but they're sooo overpriced.
Took me six months to get mine. Worth the wait - an improvement in every way over my 2017.
I think it is time for Throttle House to make the ultimate comparison video that will be talked about for ages... BRZ vs Miata - which one is the better car, taking everything into consideration (not just autocross...). I dare you, do it!!
Thats a comparison that doesnt need to be done because its so simple, but I would still love to watch that video and hope they do it. The gr86 is if u need more space so ur willing to sacrifice a bit of fun, the miata is if u dont care about space and dont want to sacrifice any fun.
@@Sideways_Singhyeah that sums it up. I bought a GR86, ended up selling it for a Miata because I was willing to sacrifice the space for more fun
I would say they serve a different audience. Miata is a roadster, not a sportscoupe. Similar price and power/weight ratio, but that's it if you ask me.
@@Faxie83 They are two inexpensive, lightweight, fun, RWD, manual sport cars, and are cross-shopped a lot.
@@rideon41 True. But they still have a totally different air around them, like between a R8 and 911, which could be compared also technically
I like the contrasting colours of your outfits, very hetero!
💀
😂🎉😂😮😮😮😮
What
☠️☠️☠️
Very gay I think.
Extra throttle house reminds me of their videos of the past, it’s more natural. Kudos to them for their success on both channels, keep it up guys !
I traded my 2017 Limited in last December for a 2023 Limited, and I'm very happy with it. The video is pretty spot-on with how enjoyable the car is and how much of a value you're getting with one of these.
my advice to anyone who wants a GR86 is to get a BRZ because of the following:
1. You can actually place a BRZ order in your desired color/transmission without having to score a Toyota allocation and pray it comes in your spec
2. Subaru techs are more familiar with the engines and their maintenance needs
3. Subaru is far less likely to deny your warranty if you experience oil starvation
4. Subaru dealers don't do markups, meanwhile AUTOMATIC gr86s are sitting on lots with 3-5k ADM
Fully agree. And if you really insist on having the front fascia of the 86 they are easily swappable, though Toyota charges way too much for OE parts.
I paid a 4K markup for my BRZ in the Bay Area back in 2021. I wish I could’ve gotten a premium, but I don’t regret the markup to get it so early as it took at least 6 months for others to show up on the road.
@@Rob165x you paid four thousand dollars to have a car early, nothing more american.
And honestly we all think we want the hardcore stiff sports car..... But in day-to-day living I appreciate that the Subaru is a little softer
Subaru does do ADM. I live in southern Oregon and can confirm this. Bunch of BS.
The 50% stiffness value refers to the torsional rigidity of the chassis, not the spring rate. Rear springs have identical values for the BRZ, while front spring rates are up to 3.1kg/mm from the previously softer 2.3kg/mm, which is about 35% stiffer. Here's a little summary of the exact numbers.
17-20:
86: 2.3k 3.4k
BRZ: 2.3 3.6k
2022:
GR86: 2.9k 4.0k
BRZ: 3.1k 3.6k
lovely review as always boys
Have you flipped the BRZ and 86 rears for the 2017 there? I was under the impression the 86 was firmer at the rear.
@@erwark Whoops you’re totally right, thanks for the catch! too many numbers in my head.
I own a GR86 and have flirted with the idea of owning a Lotus Exige BUT this car has the perfect power to weight ratio for driving on normal roads. I can't imagine driving anything faster than this on a daily basis with all the slow pokes, morons, and speed cameras on public roads.
A lotus Elise / exige is sooo sick for fun driving. It’s like the diference of drinking a coffee vs a double espresso
Yea, put a GR86 and a Lotus Exige in the same paragraph.
Fanboism is a mental illness.
@meowymeow282 amazing how people misinterpret what you were saying. Having owned both a Lotus and a GT86 in the past I do agree with you.
@@mikaelterdell1177 Exactly. Just like the fact that the idea of owning a supercar is usually better than the reality, at least for the average person. The running costs differ significantly at least where I live. Insurance alone is 6k per year more and maintenance when required will be quite expensive. All for what? 1 spirited drive a week that truly surpasses the experience I get from the GR. No thanks.
@@deejayimm Does the experience of driving these two cars really differ that much when you are on public roads driving between 40 and 80kmh? It's kind of nice being able to floor the accelerator and hear the engine for more than a couple of seconds before I potentially lose my license.
I love how they both are struggling to find the correct car model, car component, etc....and Thomas just looks at the camera defeated and says.."we do this for a living"
You guys are awesome!
I have a manual 2023 one of these and a C8 z51/mag ride Corvette. These two cars cover a lot of bases. Love the BRZ on the tight & narrow mountain roads!
As an owner of a 2022 BRZ I can confirm. Everything is better when you drive one. Best car for anywhere near the price, hands down.
Agree
So true. I was #1 hater in the YT comments. But even with a budget of Supra/M4 money, I paid cash for a 23 BRZ in black 6 speed. What a lovely car. The driving dynamics are superb. And I am a picky sob (previous cars; E36 M3, E46 M3, 350z, S2000, NSX).
@@j.3854 i own a 2020 Chevy Spark LS gasoline model. I love driving it. I love that it only weighs 2400 pounds. Do you think I'll enjoy the BRZ equally as much as my Spark?
@braetonwilson4296 the space you might mis. Trunk is small...rwd is different, some, very few dislike it.
I had a Fiesta ST, and both a new GR86 and had a BRZ....there is a reason I went out and bought it again instead of a hot hatch.
@@wayward03 thanks!
Wish these actually went for MSRP. Dealer markups are insane. Dealers charging $38-40k USD for these is absolutely crazy. And when you explain to them you won't even consider paying that price for one they look at you like YOU are the crazy one. The car was built and marketed to be a "value sports car". Hike up the price 25% and it's not a value anymore.
If can bear the wait, I'd recommend building & ordering one. No markups👌
@@Still_Nate can't order a Toyota in the states. Doesn't work like that. You can order a BRZ though. And even still, a lot of dealers are including ridiculously priced dealer installed options which is really ADM in disguise.
Just get the 2024 elantra N nice cool 33k mrsp with a better front end
where the hell are they marking up BRZ's? report them to subaru of america. im in the middle of the bay area, california, and i can buy a BRZ at MSRP. the GR86 is the one getting marked up to hell, and toyota is allowing it.
@@mikedavid1945 with questionable long term transmission reliability issues.
Hope they can solve the powertrain issues in these cars so those that buy them can enjoy them worry-free.
I’m 31k miles in on mine and I can confidently say, there’s nothing wrong. Just because there are a few bad apples, doesn’t mean the whole batch is bad. I can give you numerous other owners that haven’t and don’t have issues, tracking or not. I definitely support buying one!!
@@Jrodrocks2448 also it's worth mentioning that Subaru warranty (and dealership) experience is completely opposite of Toyota's.
@@zydomasonAs in it’s good or terrible?
@@Jrodrocks2448 18k trouble free on mine
imagine if people from toyota and subaru ACTUALLY USE THEIR BRAINS and use one of toyota reliable 4 cylinder engine instead of pretending that the boxer engine is not a huge pile of shit?
Had a Neptune blue 2022 GR86 and by 3,000 miles I had my oil pan dropped and my oil pick up tube was full of RTV. The Toyota dealership experience was crap and I sold it already and bought an NB Miata instead and love it.
A separate issue was both of my key fobs went out and the Toyota dealership said it’s because of the crappy Subaru key fobs.
GR86 front end on a brz has been done (Cameron Hill)
With the timing of this video, I was really hoping this was for the 2024 BRZ tS. I guess I have to keep waiting. 😔
Thanks for always making this channel feel like I'm hanging out with friends talking about cars. 😎
Thanks for doing another review on one of the twins! I got my GR86 last spring. I'm staying off the track, but I like the car a lot for commuting to work. It has really good ergonomics, even for taller people.
Love the Jason cammisa quote
After wanting this car for 10 years, I finally purchased a manual 2023 sport tech in megnetite grey. Extremely happy with the car for the price. I paid msrp in Canada as Subaru doesn’t mark up their vehicles. I actually purchased it over a circuit edition Corolla gr. They both came in the same week and I couldn’t justify paying $60k for the Corolla so I went with the BRZ and I don’t have any regrets.
Bro talking like he can get a corolla even if he had the money lol
@@Chocobohunter U r a bum for coming against this guy trying to provide his story for everyone to know. Whether he could afford it or not the conversation was just discussing the value he found between the too. Keep up the hating
This review is spot on. 6 months into mine and i still love every single mile I drive. I even thought about the new lotus but I think im in love with the dynamics of smallish cars under 3000 pounds
Awesome, I love my 23 BRZ! You are spot on with the weight comment, I dropped another 20 lbs with a Titanium exhaust. Bonus, it sounds wicked!
Picked up my 2023 limited in February. The amount of fun I’ve had in this car in my short 5-6 months of ownership is unreal. 10/10 recommend to anyone who is considering purchasing
I really feel this is the successor to my 944.
Except I can make turns both left and right. 🤷♂️
Exactly why I have both! 944S2 and a '23 BRZ. Similar DNA but the BRZ is significantly more user friendly and lighter on its feet but misses on 944's has a bank vault feel. I love them both!
These two and Jason Cammisa are the only guys that should have 30 min segments.
I'd watch a show with these two, Jason, and Chris Harris just cutting up in cars.
The one takeaway: James is satisfied by a long knob.
Fun fact, in serbocroatian, brz (pronounced burs) means quick!
I pronounce it like that just for fun😂
In French mr2 is merdeux which sounds like 💩
While there is clearly an oil pickup issue, the warranty portion of the blame is not on Toyota. Dealership groups are different companies than the manufacturer (Toyota). The blame for these issues not being warrantied falls on the dealerships. Toyota on multiple instances has covered this repair when the dealership initially declined.
A lot of people don't realize this, anytime I see an article about Toyota denying a warranty claim and what it means for the car... They always fail to mention that the dealer is the one putting in the claim and for dealers there is an incentive to have the warranty denied; they will be paid more in labor and parts from the customer.
Toyota has the power to command the dealers to warranty the issues or more Intelligently issues a recall. It is absolutely Toyotas fault.
@@KC-lg8qf The fact that a recall hasn't been issued is due to the low number of reported instances. Toyota does not have the power to command dealers to warranty it. If a dealer never tells Toyota via a warranty claim, then Toyota has 0 clue that they turned down a customer. The only way Toyota would find out is if the customer reported the dealership to them or notified Toyota in some other way.
@DaBigVanilla Simple.....send a letter to customers and let dealers know to keep an eye out for the issue. Its not that hard to get everyone on the same page about the issue. Toyota has been in business a long time. Let's not act like their hands are tied and there is just nothing they could possibly do.
@@KC-lg8qf The dealers aren't ignorant to the issue, they are trying to get the warranty denied. The issue is lack of punishment for the dealers lying. Dealers putting in claims aren't saying "engine failure due to oil pick up/starvation" they are saying "engine failure due to abuse" to Toyota. And Toyota is denying based off of that.
The word you were looking for in regards to the traction control is "permissive". The traction control is permissive in terms of allowing slip angle and rear-end shenanigans. Keep up the good work, team!
Such a shame that dealerships are pure scum rn. I tried to buy aither this or a gr86 half a year ago. My budget was 30k and these were supposed to be $29,420. I thought it was perfect, but no one would sell one to me under $36,000 after mark ups... ended up buying a 2017 lexus rc 350, and though not stick shift, it is a dual clutch and natural 3.5L V6 toyota engine and still RWD.
I've never understood why people really care about the tire a car comes with. If you're spending 30k on one car vs 30k on another car ... are you really going to decide that for the next 5-15 years you want the other car because of the tire it started out with? How long to tires typically last on a sports car with "spirited" driving? A year? Two years?
It's not nothing. But, it's just SO minor. After a year or two the tire the car started with is pretty inconsequential because whatever it DID have you'll need to replace it.
It makes even less sense with more expensive cars.
plus, these cars are so much fun with average non track-day tires. Most owners on the forums replace the noisy PS4s with less aggressive UHP all seasons like Continental DWS06+ or Pilot Sport AS. They last longer, are much quieter, are cheaper to replace, and offer more progressive breakaway characteristics.
My last pair of tires took me the entire 6 years to expire with plenty of tread left, about 30k miles over 6 years. So yeah, I really really care about the original tires.
@@patchouli9 I see. You’re talking about a pretty inexpensive part of a thing that costs TENS of thousands of dollars. But, ok.
If I’m driving for fun my tires last about a year. Fewer than 10,000 miles. I don’t to burn outs and the like. I just run tires hard.
If you’re driving gently on your tires, do you really notice the difference between one tire and a more performance oriented tire? If you’re not pushing capabilities, will it matter where the ceiling is? If your Ferrari never accelerates hard or drives at more than 50mph ……
I just got a 23 brz 4 days ago, I am so in love with it
Got mine 2 wks ago! Absolutely obsessed!!
The Toyotas are pretty much unobtainable in the uk with the ridiculous price hikes and low allocations, it's to the point where I've never seen one of the new GR86s on the road. They may as well have not bothered selling it here at all. Oh well at least you can always pop down to your local Mazda dealer and get yourself the answer to everything 😊
Still own a 2014 BRZ (from new) and love it to bits. A forever car for me.
Welcome to the extra channel, where we also have extra voice characters in the background ;) love you guys and as usual great quick review!
2013 owner for a good 7 years. Loved it & only sold it because I had to.
Toyota reliability and hardly any wear and tear in the interior.
I've had my 2020 performance package BRZ for a little over two years now and it is the most fun car to daily drive and track all at the same time. I personally like the look of the 1st gen more and plan to own this car for a long time to come.
The BRZ is one of the very few cars I enjoy watching somebody else drive it on YT.
This is the exact spec car that I have!! 2023 BRZ in Red with a 6MT. So cool to see them review it 🙌🔥
Since you're so concerned about "zed" since that's how the whole rest of the world says it how about you put a little text or something in kilos so we don't have to figure out how much 2800 smash burgers is?
I adore my 10yr anniversary edition FRS, would love to trade it for the new gen toyota GR86.
I just got the Toyota GR86 last week and I have been loving it.
Just got mine, I’ve never loved a car more !
Literally keep wanting other cars and thinking “ I should just get one of the twins…”
Do it, I have both gens. No regrets!
My 2023 BRZ is currently getting fitted with a Sprintex S5 210 supercharger. It is being used by Sprintex as an R&D car to update their first gen fittings to the new second gen engine.
I'm expecting the final tuning shortly after the 5th September.
You should give us an update, or upload it to TH-cam. Superchargers for these aren’t super duper common
The part at the end where they talk about how good this car is for the price, I have to say I completely agree. This is not a perfect comparison, but I happened to rent a base 981 Boxster on vacation shortly after after I purchased my 2022 BRZ. Everyone always says the Boxster/Cayman is the next step up in terms of sports car experience, but I must say I preferred my BRZ over the Boxster. The sensation of speed is higher and more exciting in the BRZ, and the BRZ feels more torquey overall, especially in the low end. Steering and handling were pretty damn close too. It was shocking how close these two cars are, especially considering the price of that Boxster was nearly double when new, and even now are still 35k+ used. The new BRZ is an absolute steal at the price for the performance/experience you get. You really would have to pay 60k or 70k+ to get a better experience.
Go up the trims and it's a different story. 981 cayman s/gts is on another level. And this is coming from a brz owner.
@@sanzserif Money
“I’m not allowed within 500 yards” 💀
Picked mine up 2 weeks ago! As my 1st sports car, it's very forgiving and has a great learning curve. And with the balance and CoG, I've never felt more confident in a car! Truly an amazing car!🔥
would it be as fun to drive as my 2020 Chevy Spark LS gasoline CVT?
@@braetonwilson4296 not the CVT
Awesome review! As you mentioned the oil pick up issue, that is the one thing that is deterring me buying a GR86.Toyota's unwillingness to address this issue and cover it under warranty is a little worrisome later on down the road. Subaru is at least is addressing this issue and covered.
I’m 31k miles in on mine, a ‘22, and I have 0 fear behind the wheel. Just because there are a few bad apples, doesn’t mean the whole batch is bad. Definitely go get one!!
mine 18k and tested on track. No issues at all.
Less than 40 psi oil pressure mid corner… no thanks.
As someone who works for a dealership group, this is not a Toyota (company) issue. It is a dealership issue. Service departments/dealerships, who are separate entities from Toyota, are declining these warranty claims for some reason. Toyota does not know that an owner is experiencing this issue unless they contact Toyota (company) directly or if a social media post gains enough traction. Do not let the faults of a dealership group or 1 service advisor & manger cloud your view of a certain manufacturer.
Edit: Of course Toyota would know if the service department pushed a claim through but they have to do that first. Then the ball is in Toyota's court, well really whichever warranty people they have assigned to that region. People need to remember that large dealership groups and large companies are all made up of different people who can be flawed. Seeking out a different person will often result in a different outcome.
Same here, I was all set to get one this year and then all these horror stories started popping up. Considering that my plan was to keep this long term and make it my auto-x and track day car I decided not to pull the trigger. I'm not that concerned about the warranty piece, I'm much more worried what happens a year after the warranty is up. Instead I'm looking at a 20 year old S2000 which costs roughly the same, which also seems like a poor decision. Not sure what i'm going to do.
One of the few cars that looks like a 90s JDM sportscar
I got the last Gen 86 and I dropped the Garrett turbo in it (among many other upgrades) and when I drove the Ferrari 488 GTB - I was very shocked at how I felt like I was constantly comparing my sports car with it handling wise lol-$300k there you go! Lol
I have an 86. How I fixed the sound: Step 1, turn off fake engine noise pumped into cabin. Step 2, Borla Type-S exhaust. Step 3, rev and enjoy
you tune it yet?
@@vHeartAndS0ul I live in CA for the time being, so no. Moving in 2 years then yes :)
Has the Supra actually been more reliable? I haven't heard much bad about the B48/B58 reliability-wise and its been out a lot longer.
Can't speak to the Supra in particular but b58 engines are perfectly reliable by modern standards. The only questionable BMW engine in production is the n20 and that still gets to 150k miles before any issues
@@ChernzObylprobably because Toyota had to make sure the B58 was good enough to be in the Supra lol
Other than drinking oil it's good
@@KiraYamato209 if toyota wanted BMWs best 6i they wouldve choked up the money for licensing the s55
Regarding your question about the front bumper swap, yes it can be done and its pretty easy. I currently have a GR86 front on my world rally blue BRZ. If your BRZ shares a colour with the GR86, you can find someone's stock GR86 bumper of that colour and direct swap it. I couldn't stomach the extra $2000 for the GR86 and Toyota's super weird allocation system also I got my BRZ for under MSRP too...not a huge amount off but every bit helps. Also Toyota Canada has now allowed their dealers to charge I think about $1200 in extra fees, build any car and they'll put that extra $1200 as seemingly something to expect...I don't think any Toyota Canada dealer won't charge this, and you'll have to fight tooth and nail to remove it if you can.
Super happy with this new 2023 BRZ, though I did have a 2014 FRS for 9 years so I am definitely biased heavily in favour of them.
I had a 14 BRZ for 9 years, I loved it. I traded it in for an FL5 CTR, as you can imagine thats a monster of a car; and I still miss the BRZ. I came really close to buying a 23 BRZ. If the rumored GR 3cyl 86 or BRZ STI I may switch back. That says a lot about this platform, it is brilliant way more brilliant than the price tag makes you think.
I can't believe they'll ever put the GR Yaris/Corolla inline-3 into the 86/BRZ, it's the wrong shape and size for the car. It'd be cool if they finally give us a factory turbo-4 though. Tho now that it's a 2.4 I wouldn't get the turbo, that was more a problem with first gen cars (though even the 2.0 liter was better than a lot of people said IMO). I could even go the other way slightly; a GR86/BRZ with start-stop and a little hybridization maybe Vonnen-style, keep the batteries small to keep the weight reasonable, but improve the fuel economy that much more. 86s are great fun/compact/efficient daily drivers, a model that gets 40 MPG without losing the fun seems attainable.
@MC-qk5rz from what I understand the "partnership" between Toyota and Subie is nearing an end on the engine side. Toyota has built 3 mules with the gr yaris/Corolla motor.
@@Trendyflutethe wrong shape and size? Toyota has factory backed GR86’s racing with this engine variant in Japan
@@peejayem4700 and there you have it, sometimes I still learn things. Ya gotta admit an inline 3 is a pretty different engine package shape than a flat-4. I guess as long as the I3 is physically short enough to fit in the chassis and under the hood and have appropriate ground clearance to the sump then it won't be too wide and it'd barely be longer. I just assumed it would be too tall.
Don’t get me wrong, I love the BRZ/GT86, but for American roads, and on paper even the ecoboost mustang is better. Cheaper, huge aftermarket, nearly a second faster 0-60 stock. If the mustang still didn’t have IRS and a LSD as standard, yeah the twins would win in handling all day, but that isn’t the case. Sure the mustang is heavier, but you literally get more car.
Honestly love to eat my words if they put a turbo in the twins, but the price would creep up.
My 2013 ate it’s engine at 70K and only 2K after the valve spring recall was performed. Love these cars but the Subaru flat four is the pain point. Will wait a few years for them to iron out the issues. Would be over the moon if Toyota could fit one of their inline 4s under the hood…
That's why I skipped the recall.
All you have to say about it is that it's a $30,000 Porsche Cayman. Enough said. Sold.
Wait.. is this not the extra channel where they do extra stuff anymore???
Every broke teenager who owns one is like look!!! It’s on throttle house!!!! Mooommmm!
I wish I liked the styling for the Toyobaru’s (also Britain said “Zee” first, than later changed it because competing with the ever growing US, just like every other phrase.”)
They look alright in person, but they’re kinda generic, and I think that holds up my enthusiasm for them as someone whose yet to drive one, but trusts the words of the reviewers.
You know what I’d like! I’d like an “inexperienced review”. Someone who loves cars but hasn’t had the experience of the extreme and high end. How much they like a Toyobaru might reveal more on the enthusiasm for me.
I saw it close up in white and WR Blue and the blue surely looked much better than "alright"! You should defs see it if you haven't. Also the new tS trim will be much more appealing with the gold Brembos and other stuff.
They're such fun cars. I wouldn't mind buying the new generation. But I'm waiting to see if they bring a Toyota motor after 2025
FINALLY GOT IT! its the sinn 105 that thomas is wearing, been trying to indentify since the AMG c63 video
Oh shot THATS what it is? Good eye, I’ve been trying to figure it out for a while!
You don't count cameraman Dan? Remember that the next you have access to food that he's about (or does the 'whole world' say aboot?) to eat.
Great car. One could say the traction control system is "permissive".
You about "submissive"? (especially in track mode). 😄
The word you were looking for was “permissive”
They really need to address the RTV issue, even though it's only a very small % of owners experiencing it. I would hop on the BRZ/GR86 train if they swapped the GR Corolla engine in it.
its pretty well proven that RTV in the oil pickup is not the root cause of engine failure.
Great review, on point. So sad we in Europe only get a small lot of cars (both BRZ and GR86) in 2022 and 2023, and then production for Europe ends thanks to shitty regulations over here. The very limited availability here makes the cars too expensive.
I much prefer Toyota GR86
Front bumper?
I have a premium steel 2023 GR, it’s my daily but I’m super scared about the RTV issue so I’m not tracking it. I would go with the brz for better warranty
its wayy prettier in front.
Same
Yes it is very nice but you could always swap the front end. At the end of the day I love my GR but it’s always in the back of my head “will my warranty be denied?” Toyota is very stupid when it comes to warranty with the GR.
With you guys dressed as a co-ordinated Arts performance act, I expect the nearby schoolkids were expecting a visit! 😄
Great car. I prefer the GR looks myself. Not trading my ND2 RF though... Looks better, sounds better, feels more upscale, and most importantly - the top goes down :)
How much Porsche can you get into for the price of the BRZ? 996 Carrera maybe? Porsche prices have gone insane.
You can get a 996 Carrera or a 987 Cayman S. Both will be faster than the BRZ, but in my experience the amount of fun you can have is comparable. Depends on your goals and where you drive.
@@patricklinkous also Porsche repair bills on a 20 yr old car vs Subaru repair bills and hopefully a warranty on a new car. I think I just really want a Porsche tho.
@@sleekskyline120 Yes, there are definitely expensive parts to replace on an older Porsche, but it's not that crazy. I had a 986 Boxster, my dad has a 986 Boxster S and a 996 Carrera, and my mom has a 987 Cayman. No catastrophic failures, just old parts that wore out. My mom's Cayman has been the most reliable and she's had it 12 years.
Alternative title: James and Thomas try to speak english words for 11 minutes straight 😂
10 years ago this would be a 23k car that anyone could be approved for. Now it’s a lower middle class car. Thanks to the hyper hype tax
Honestly the Subaru boxer engine has a history of not taking abuse well. This is all the way back to the bug eye
@@ZREXER1250 LOL K24 SWAP EVERYTHING and I know someone with such a car.
This and the gr86 are so cool as value cars it's a shame dealers mark it up to the price of a used m4.
I gotta be honest. I own a 2017 BRZ, and I think visually it is the best looking of twins. The new ones are all rounded and squishy looking, and the first gen were plain The facelift from 2016/2017 to 2020 are spot on. I also don't have issues with oil pick up and with the mods I've installled I'm putting down the same power to the wheels as a stock new one. Oh, and mine is paid off. So is a new one really worth another $15k+ in car payments? :) Regardless though, these are amazing cars (I agree with all of the points that James and Thomas have said about them) and I'm thankful that Toyota made this happen!! (Toyota owns a lot of Subaru, so yes... it's Toyota. lol)
It sounds like you basically have the perfect BRZ - if you have the same amount of power as the new ones and likely better reliability (plus better styling) then there's really no reason to buy a new one. Sounds like a sweet ride.
@@bananaoligarchy8754 Thank you!! :) I absolutely love it and I get a silly grin everytime I climb in. Even errands running is fun. I couldn't be happier!! She's my 'affordable pre-mid life crisis car' haha
The old brz/FRS/86 was the better looking car
@@cloudyview yep 2012-2016
talk about VINFAST and INEOS grenadier cars
I just got mine in a few months later. Such a fun ride
I live in America and I instantly liked the video after that “accommodate everyone” 😂
8:40 I think the word James is looking for is 'forgiving'
I was thinking "lenient".
That car looks good in RED. (:
its a $30K Porsche with Japanese reliability.
...you DO realize it's a Subaru engine, right?
@@thegirthquake8574 Yes! That's why I included Japanese reliabilty in the description - no bore scoring, no intermediate shaft bearings, no critical plastic components that spontaneously fall apart, plus the interior is probably more durable.
@@dannoyes4493 Dude just google WRX/86 engine failures. Subies need to be rebuilt constantly.
@@thegirthquake8574 At what cost v. Porsche engine? I think you just made my point.
GR8 review of a fairly decent car. It's not to my liking, but I can see its value.
I bought one of these a couple months ago. I live in the states and went BRZ Limited 6spd manual, I’ve already done a road trip, and I absolutely love this car. Out of the MANY cars I’ve owned (this is my 40th car) this is in my top 3 favorites! The other 2 in my top 3? 90 325i coupe (E30) and an N54 135i.
tempted to get a 128i as theyve depreciated a lot but idk if that's smart on my small budget, what other sports cars have you had?
@@veganjoy depends on your definition of sports car.
2021 Mustang GT
2001 Corvette
1988 Corvette
1991 Miata
A handful of E30s
G8 GT
04 Z4
85 mustang gt
And some fwd “toys”
Such as 2019 GLI
2015 GTI
2023 Mini Cooper S
09 GTI
05 GTI
03 GTI
06 Mini Cooper S
And lots more.
@@PortersGarage lotta GTIs lol. ever have/drive a civic si? looking to get one of those soon. and what'd you think of the american cars?
@@veganjoy for me the GTIs were the best bang for the buck and punched well above their price point.
Never owned an SI, drove a 10th gen SI a couple times but by that point I was too used to the GTIs and couldn’t see myself switching over. My thoughts on most American cars, build quality usually isn’t as good as its Japanese or German counterparts, but for the performance cars (like the corvettes and mustang) they represented a good performance value that was fun to drive.
@@PortersGarage interesting, i've kinda looked at golfs and a few other similar cars but they're a bit expensive compared to something like an FA5 civic. if i was looking for more of a street car i'd probably consider a mk6 more but for autocross/track use on the side it seems the FA5 will be hands down better.
and yeah build quality on american cars suffers a bit lol. though i don't really mind my c6 vette interior. at least for the low price i paid for it (
“And this, at 2800 pounds-“
“-Jason Cammisa 🗿”
I believe the recent testing done by @900BRZ which found the oil pressure drops on high G right turns was not performed on stock tires, they were 225 Champiro SX2. He does feel they have similar grip to the OEM PS4 - but just wanted to throw that out there, technically the testing wasn't on OEM grip tires.
It does not matter. The issue happens with any tire.
@@nelsonricciardi7087 that's an opinion, I simply corrected an inaccurate statement in the video. The point is reliability of a mass produced machine can't be judged when non OEM parts are being used in the testing.
Champiro SX2 offer terrible grip levels. Worse than PS4.
The thumbnail makes it look like Thomas and James are trying to stay strong in their final moments together before the coming storm separates them from their BRZ 😢
Considered the GR86 after my ND Miata, seemed to be a good compromise between light sports car and daily comfort. Ended up with a 718 Cayman, because when the answer isn't Miata, it's probably Porsche.
That [bill] escalated quickly...
@@YoShImUrA53 Haha! Yeah, 100% used Cayman, not on that level to buy a new one. Also sold the ND Miata at just the right time to make a good return.
Love Extra Throttle House so muxh! 😊
If you were going to buy one for a daily/fun car, never going to track it, probably would modify gently... would you go Yota or Subie?
Step 1: Do you like frowning or smiling?
Step 2: Pick a color.
BRZ, it’s a bit softer. They even said it at the end of the video. It’s also easier to get a BRZ
If you're going to modify the suspension, I'd probably get a GR86. Since there are numerous differences in this generation between the 2 and they make more Toyotas, you're likely to find more options.
That said, I picked the BRZ as I don't plan on modifying it and the suspension is perfect for daily driving and mountain road adventures.
Just the video I needed. Was on the fence on selling my 22 BRZ for a GR Rolla or Type R Fk8 but I think I'll keep it
Brz 0-60 is 5.4 sec, a 2003 bmw 330ci was 6.4 sec with the same hp but 2 more cylinders 😔
Worse tires back then and more weight.
Nice James reminded me that I’ve been watching throttle house since 2015
That subtle jab at Cammisa 😂
Shocked James did not deliver some tofu during this episode.
Picking up mine next week 😎
The first car I owned was a 2016 GT86 and sold it as I needed a work car. It's been a few years now but I'm ready to buy a weekend car and I'm between the GR86 or a WRX STI VA and I have no idea what to do 😢
Get the WRX, its becoming rare and if u wait u'll never be able to obtain one
So, uh... James finds the long knob satisfying? 😮
James enjoys long knobs and rear end play
I was planning to buy another M3 after finishing grad school, but since those are now as much or more than a new one of these, I think the choice is clear.
People are gonna hate me for saying this but SN95 V6 Mustangs are the cheap version of this. It weighs 200 lbs more, it has precisely the same wheelbase and while its factory horsepower is low, that is a lot less difficult to fix than you might think. It's a bit of an IQ test and a lot of people fail it but that's their problem.