Horizontal Magazine fed shotguns on the range. (TS-12, SRM1216, TR-19S)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ก.ย. 2024
- I wanna appologize for the Video quality I didnt realize that it wasnt the greatest until i got a new editing PC, i will probably reshoot this at some point.
Dont worry, I’m gonna do a redemption video for the 1216.
Part 1 here: TS-12 vs SRM 1216 vs Garaysar TR-19S Overview Pt.1
• TS-12 vs SRM 1216 vs G...
This is part two of the Horizontal Magazine fed shotgun comparison where we shoot the IWI TS-12, the SRM Arms 1216, and the Garaysar TR-19S. You can see that we had multiple issues with some of the shotguns.
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Got a TS-12 few months ago, expecting it to misbehave for the first couple of hundred rounds, like many people reviewing it warned that it has a long break-in period.
Not a single malfunction so far, no cycling problems, it runs like a dream.
As a side note, despite it's a fairly complex shotgun, it disassembles literally in seconds, no tools required. Field maintenance would be extremely easy with this one.
Yes, cleaning the TS 12 is really easy & another reason I chose this Bull Pup over any others. A big thumbs up on the tear down.
I 💯 agree. From ' NEW ' . I think all firearms have a break-in period. I've learned from other TOP TH-cam people here, a good rule once you get a new firearm is to, field strip look over the firearm really well, clean it and lube where it needs lube. Then dry fire it a few days to works the parts in. THEN! Go do your live fire. I've done this to all 4 of mine. O! Issues. I'll do the same thing once I get my srm arms 1216 in.
I own a TS12 and mine runs flawlessly from what I can recall. Its truly a wicked shotgun that is a blast to take to the range. The ability to top off the left and right tubes is a genius design.
Hi... I'm getting one too. (waiting for delivery) What ammo brand seems to work best in yours?? Remington? Federal? Winchester?
@@ronwilson9080 honestly I think I’ve used all of those brands with target/bird shot rounds and haven’t had any issues. I haven’t tried any buckshot or slugs in it yet as it’s expensive to use and blow through that many rounds at a time. Congrats on your purchase, I’m sure you will love it too!
After an un-boxing, clean, lube and choke swap w/ included choke (improved cylinder)... I ran a mix of slugs and 00 buck through her. 200rnds later, she also flawlessly runs Federal blue box "Top Gun" #4 bird shot @1260fps without a hiccup.
This bullpup is a monster!
Hey, glad to hear it is working well for you, it definitely is a beast of a shotgun
Excellent video, I definitely appreciate that you're the only channel on TH-cam with an in-depth comparison of these multi-tube semi-auto shotguns. And you did an excellent job. Thank you!
Hi Shawn, i definitely appreciate you watching my video. As i believe i said in the video i am gonna take a close look at the SRM and see if i can figure out why it was giving me issues. So there is a redemption? Video planned for it.
Hi guys... What ammo brand seems to work best in your TS12?? Remington? Federal? Winchester? I'm awaiting delivery of mines now.
The TS-12 is such a superior design over these other two, as well as every single other high capacity shotgun. It's really in a class of its own. That class is at the top. Over 10 yrs of research IWI put into its design before releasing it. It shows. They went back to the drawing board dozens and dozens of times to get it perfected. They achieved it. After the break in period it runs flawlessly and eats any shell you throw into it.
Love my TS12. Wasn’t sure what to expect I traded for mine but once I shot it I don’t think I have smiled that big in awhile. Wound up going through the recommended break in rounds in one sitting. I didn’t shoot anything below 1200fps birdshot and #4 and 00 buckshot out of the 300 rounds I only had one malfunction and that was due to me over rotating the magazine which pinned a shell and kept it from auto loading. No regrets on that acquisition. My only nitpick is that the release for the tube in front of the trigger should be metal instead of polymer. It’s has a lot of friction when you push it forward to turn the tubes. Could be smoother.
TS12 just laughed it's way off the range. Damn 😅
Yeah its the best option out there for a bullpup shotgun.
Appreciate the variety of the semi auto shot guns you have here. They are all tube fed with different designs & your fore thought into this comparison should remove doubters as to which one is the Winner. Sounded like you played with them before any video.
Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment, I will be doing a redemption video on the SRM-1216, because it did run good the first time i shot it pre video, just havent had the time yet to see if it works better.
@@WVGunsNGoats I bought the Tavor TS 12 & really love its ability to accurately hit a small Bulls Eye from 30 yards using rifled slugs with a Improved Cylinder choke. Went to Carlsons & got a rifled choke so expecting even better accuracy out of this Bull Pup. My setup is not stock as I have a muzzle brake / curved butt pad / soft leather cheek rest along with a Holosun 512 reflex sight. Its a great setup & cannot believe how accurate it is at long distance. I looked at the SRM 1216 before Buying the TS 12 but IWI is a military arms provider & its got a great reputation so it was my choice of Bull Pup 12 gauge.
Ran some birdshot through the tavor recently on high gas setting and had my first malfunction. I was expecting that and wanted to get a good glimpse at what happens.
What i wasn't expecting was for a 2-3/4" shell to get caugh UNDER the feed lever. Turns out the fix is honestly easy though. You can just break down the tavor like normal and pull the whole bolt out to easily reach and free that stuck round
I was naturally super hesitant until i finally just said screw and aimed it down range for dissasembly. I was wearing my concealed level 3 vest so i was a bit more willing to screw around and find out
I really appreciate you for these videos. I was looking at all 3 a couple of months ago trying to decide which one is better. There's a lot of other videos that showcase them individually but you really gave me a chance to see and make that decision that I definitely am happy and satisfied with. I did go with the Tavor Ts12 and it is freaking awesome. Probably one of my favorites guns period. Props for the awesome video and thank you.
Hey,I appreciate you taking the time to watch my video on these shotguns, it makes it worth spending the time it took to make the video if it helps someone out!
MOST that have problems with the IWI TS12 shotgun are because:
1. They don’t properly learn the “manual of arms” for the TS12.
2. They don’t practice.
3. They rotate the barrels improperly.
4. They don’t engage the barrel release control button properly.
5. They don’t pull the buttstock in tight to their shoulder securing the weapon (important to proper bolt carrier group cycling).
Almost all problems are operator error.
Rarely are they fault of the weapon’s design.
It’s an excellent firearm.
If you use it properly.
now this is a fair comparison. great vid. yes, i love my TS12.
Right on, Thank for watching!
Thanks for the comparison.I just got my TS 2 days ago.I have a X95 so I'm very well acquainted with IWI and the Tavor line.It's nice to see them up against other firearms.
Living up to your channel name on this one good on ya. I appreciate the side by side running now we just gotta get you some mag fed shotguns to play with
I think im gonna do a pistol review next.
Fk brno psd?
Thanks for posting this video on the Garaysar, I really like the capacity and the looks of it. May still get one though👍🏼
Just grabbed a TS12, great video!
Thanks for the demo. Loved the goat intro. How do your goats and other animals deal with the gun shots? Are your dogs OK with the noise? My poor German shepherd was scared of gun fire. What is that goat's name? My neighbor years ago had some goats that demanded me pet them (goat breaks). Although I have the TS-12, I so wanted the S-19 to work for a back up. I guess I will just put the super parts in my Mossberg 930 to make it better. Thanks for the video. I so appreciate your patience with these gun failures.
Hey thanks for the feedback, the goats have gotten used to the noise and the range is far enough from them they alsp have buildings where they can goto, i dont have any videos on rifles yet because of the noise level. When my range is done i will do rifle videos as its location is far away. The dogs stay inside during filming. That goat is Named butters, i had it in there but maybe the font is kinda hard to read.
I left the failures in and try to diagnose them to see if they can be fixed on the range, guns are mechanical items and like any mechanical item can have failures, i dont want to give an biased look at a gun.
Love your channel for the honest common sense reviews. Never heard of the 1216 or the TR19. Now I know why! IWI makes amazing products. Israelis need their stuff to work as they are always in a controversy! So if IWI makes it, it will work. I also like the adjustable gas on the TS12. You have helped me make my mind! Who wants a M4 when you can have a TS12!
Thank you for the kind words, I am glad you are enjoying my content, i will be covering SHOT show and all the new stuff coming out this year this coming week, the TS-12 is also pretty low recoil for a shotgun as well!
Can’t wait to see your shot show coverage. I just REALLY hope that you can reveal if and when H&K will release their micro 9! That’s my most anticipated gun! Have fun out there. Wish I could go as I would be there in a minute! Have fun stay safe and keep up the good work!
MUCH better than, “Vertical Magazine Fed” shotguns!
And they look cool too!
I THINK the SRM1216 calls for HIGH BRASS ONLY. The one that was damaged looked like it was LOW Brass. I've also saw that the Aluminum rimmed looking shotgun shells don't work as well as the brass looking ones in MOST of the Bullpup Type shotguns. My brother owns the DP-12, SRM1216 and the Tavor TS-12
Yeah i plan on doing another video on the SRM, the biggest issue was the magazine binding and not wanting to rotate.
As was previously noted you need high fps rounds for the SRM 1216 to work properly. It says it in the instructions. I have run over 1000 rounds of 1450 fps slugs no problems. But as soon as you put in 1250fps or less you have problems. The point is the SRM is a tactical shotgun and should be fed high fps rounds....if you are gonna use low fps stuff, then stick with the appropriate type shotgun. This is definitely for stopping bad guys not ducks😊
@@iamJeffyB Yep
I just found out about this type of shotgun this is an excellent review thank you 😊
And Thank you for Watching!
Thank you for comparing them. Very interesting.
Glad you liked it!
When i was looking for my next auto feed shotgun. It was a toss up between mag fed and vertical cylinder style. After researching I landed on the ts12. Reliability, compact vs bulky mags and drums and accurate with 18½ barrel. Ts12 ftw
It would look so cool If it were less bulky like slim shotguns with reloading like revolvers but instead of cylinders, these tubes would come out and without the cylindrical function of revolver shooting.
Is it possible to make something like this?
Glad I bought the TS-12!
I still need to retry the SRM-1216 though.
Me too Jack. Its a great design & blows the others out of the water ! I have an D Green TS 12 & really enjoy its engineering put onto this shot gun. Semi auto shot guns are NOT supposed to be reliable as seen in the other semi autos here !
@@WVGunsNGoats When are you going to re-test?
@@Joeak74 its something i have planned, i just havent set a date for it yet.
The SRM1216 is an Incredible Design !
It has solved the major issues of combat shotguns. Capacity !
Unfortunately the SRM1216 requires a bit of a Break-in period & minor "Smithing".
I have mine working @ ( 100% ) Reliability now.
The Israeli TS-12 is basically a rip-off of the SRM. If only they hadnt thrown so much freak'in plastic on it.
And a removable Mag would be Awesome !
But these designs are the future.
Solving the capacity & length issues of combat shotguns.
Hey Mark, I will be making a redemption video on the SRM-1216 someday, Designs by smaller companies can definetly have some issues at times that need to be straightened out. But i think its a really neat design anyway.
@@WVGunsNGoats By Far the ( # 1 ) Negative with Shotguns is capacity. As well as their issues feeding the sharp / Sharper edged rounds through typical box-magazine designs. The fact that the ( SRM 1216 ) has a ( 16 rd ) Capacity without some ridiculous over-sized appendage ( Magazine hitting your knee or a Tube extending ( 2 ft ) beyond the barrel is Incredible. The mags are a really quick change with some practice. I honestly cannot think of a better way to solve a shotguns capacity problems better than this. If SRM had focused on refining the ( 1216 ) i think it would be a Massively popular SG. Massage the reliability issues out of it along with a few High-Performance option parts. Like a Larger Magazine release & Rotation paddle. Easier access to the recoil springs along with lighter weight recoil springs in order to run the cheaper less powerful ammo.
I had high hope for the srm until I saw all these issues .. yeah not going to get these
Good points at the end .. yeah iwi is something I’ll look into
Thanks for watching, I think the TS12 is a great shotgun, I plan to make a redemption video for the SRM-1216 some day.
A useful video. I like the TS12.
Nice comparison, I have the fde ts12 for more than a year now. I never had a malfunction , but I had some on my od green x95 (maybe operator error).
What kind of issues were you having?
TS-12 all day.
Don't forget night time too just add a light !
Have you used high velocity shells and done a break in on the Tr19 since you have had it? Just curious as I’m interested in them myself since their price tag is much lower than the 2 others. I’ve see a couple reviews and 1 video showing the Tr19s doing pretty well with different shells. Unfortunately, there doesn’t seem to be much info on this shotgun in particular anywhere, but it appears that Using high velocity shells at a minimum 1 1/8oz seemed to be the ideal load for it, as it never seemed to cause a FTF or FTE. It did fail on both when using Winchester white box and another lower grade shells. The Winchester shells failed almost every one, or other one. The other cheap one only failed on the first shot and then finished the rest easily. The HV shells never caused an issue whatsoever.
Colin, when the weather cooperates i will take the shotgun back out to the range and see if a higher brass or velocity load gives me the same issues with feeding. I will do a short video for you, just the weather has been pretty crappy lately. As i have not shot it or the SRM since this video.
I also think it may be the lower power shells not kicking the carrier lifter back hard enough when i got a better look at the failure that day.
@@WVGunsNGoats I guess so, looking forward for another video from you.
Won’t have too many Issues with my Remington 870 magnum 🤠
Liked for goat...
Goat fetch soap...
Great review, looking forward to running the TS-12 later this week!
You can easily load doubles in it when reloading, try it!
@@WVGunsNGoats Double feed is easy on either side. IWI did a great job engineering this shot gun.
Yeap! I've learned that semi-auto shotguns. DON'T like lite loads. As most tactical or semi-auto shotguns don't. Will see how my SRM ARMS 1216 does with federal law enforcement Le loads. I went ahead and order up 500 rounds of that load. Since finding out that round works Very well with that shotgun. Yes! I 💯 agree when someone gets a new firearm in 1st thong to do. Go thru it, and clean it and lube it where it needs it. BEFORE firing it, it's first time. To many people don't do this, and do blame it on the firearm
Hey James, One of the reasons i decided to run a lot of light loads to start with was that its really what a majority of people will be shooting through them for fun a large amount of the time, the cheapest 12ga ammo they can get, The biggest issue i was having with the SRM 1216 was that the magazine would bind up when trying to turn it, i have looked at the gun since and i believe i have the issue resolved, I will be making another video where i do a redemption on the SRM 1216 because i believe its nearly 100% now. just have to get it out for some more testing. Thanks for commenting, please give me a sub if you havent yet.
Sooo everyone talks about no birdshot in a shotgun for home defense… why are you using #7 or 8 anyway…
I would love to see a show where you proof out say 4 shot seems to me that would be horrid at 5 yards ( my home isn’t 20 yards away)
Then say number 4 buck and so on?
I do realize it could be expensive
But
No way would I consider slug or 00 for home defense
I have seen vids them going through 16 pieces of sheet rock …
Cool video thanks!!
Got the SRM 1216 coming in soon! 💪🏼
Hell yeah man, it is a good gun and i still believe in it, but mines being tempermental.
@@WVGunsNGoats Honestly that the first I’ve seen someone have issues with one! I love the design though!
They need to design a pump for the ts12.
You can add a spiral trace groove that will convert a straight pull pump into a rotary action very easily, with a straight trace for said pump. Not sure it would be reliable and I am sure there’s many other ways to reliably convert the motion do you don’t need to do all the twisting. It’s cocking the gun when you rotate the cylinder, that’s why it feels like it does
Hell no ! WTF ! As owner of a TS 12 the beauty of this shot gun is its a semi auto & very reliable when you know WTF you are doing ! Well designed by IWI.
Thanks very much for the comparison. I have the TS12 but its a little heavy. I was hoping that the lighter SMR 1216 would serve as a suitable substitute, but the problems that arose in the video are giving me cause for pause. Thanks again for the well made video.
Thank you for watching my video, its weird that i started having issues because i had shot the SRM without issues before i started making the video, but havent had time to mess with it.
TS12 THE WINNER
Yea , there is a reason IWI needs reliable weapons because they are involved in a constant War !
After the break in period, mine eats everything, and I'd have no problem putting my life on the line with it!!
Oh hey did you see the new 410 option?? A vid on that would be awesome for my wife ( recoil and weight shy)
Can’t wait to see one
I have not seen that yet, sorry.
as much as I like the look of the TR-19S, I'm really not liking the reliability and functionality of it. its a shame that something that looks cool can't be functional and reliable as well. I got to get into making some firearms myself to just make the ones I want
Good luck Andy !
Have you ever tested the Kel -Tec KSG 12 Gauge Shotgun?
I have one and its planned.
Why did you put your charging handle in on your shooting hand side after you changed the pressure? Wouldn’t it work better on your support hand side?
I believe i did it just to show you could swap it around to either side if you wanted too.
Are the magazines from the SRM1216 and the TR-19S interchangeable?
They are not.
As this shotgun have a revolving type cylinder that holds more than one round per cylinder can it be called a revolver? With so many problems it might not be the best home defense weapon after all. It is a very cool idea though.
What I am doing is not having fun by not getting to the range to have fun shooting.
I did enjoy watching your video so I subscribed to your channel and hit the bell so I don't miss any new videos.
Thank you for watching the video, there are more planned to come! I'm not sure you could call it a revolver as its not automatically rotated like the old street sweeper style were.
Comments for the algorithm
The TS12 I had was the biggest POS shotgun I've ever owned... I literally had to send it back THREE times. First time I got it to run all 3 tubes, I sold it!
Wow none of those sg's seem to be worth it at all. Good ole 590, 870, A300, A1301, 930, 940, and V3 are way better imho.
Its a unique way to address the 12ga shotgun shells issues when feeding from a box magazine, as well as the capacity issues that shotguns have, and a way to utilize the space you have when a shotgun has to have a 18" barrel, so i can understand why its being tried.
@@WVGunsNGoats I also see why they are trying. I have two mag fed shotguns that have taken a lot of work to get running reliably.
@@clarkrichards1907 It's pretty interesting take on higher capacity, if one mag tube works and is proven, lets just add more! As they say, variety is the spice of life and its always good to see innovative takes on designs.
I have the TS12. If you use Federal Tactical 00Buck with the flite control wad, you can easily take a head shot on a human threat at 20 yards. Under 15 yards and it just looks like your using slugs, lol!!!
I was hitting a small Bulls eye from 30 yards rifled slugs Improved choke on my TS 12. Very accurate with rifled slugs at distance. If your breaking into my home at 10 feet away you better have said your prayers.
I had an SRM1216… most expensive POS gun I’ve ever had. Got a good trade for a Henry lever action and a Mossberg 590A1.
God that shotgun sucked.
Yeah im pretty disappointed in how it performed on video, when the first time i took it out i had no issues with binding up.
I've never had an issue with mine, I made sure to use 3 dram shells
@@WVGunsNGoats Where is the video ? Every time you show this shot gun its jamming.
Damn, those are some fugly weapons.
Beauty is in the eye of the OWNER ..... TS 12 is a Big Girl ! Deceptively light & short for room clearing. Versatility of this shot gun is awesome ! One of the best reviews more in depth I've seen on the TS 12 is by X Ring.
th-cam.com/video/gIVPmoPivQo/w-d-xo.html
Won’t have too many Issues with my Remington 870 magnum 🤠
One of the best. EVER