Goldeneye Speedrunners Tried To BAN These
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 พ.ค. 2024
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Today we look at a few controversial techniques that Goldeneye speedrunners tried to have banned from use. Do you think these techniques are legitimate, or do you think they should be disallowed from competition?
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Mr Jobst, "niche" is pronounced like "neesh", for some reason i just had to correct that. Love the vid as always.
Also, "glitch" is pronounced "gleesh," just fyi
@@Rick_McDick cool story bro
I've heard both but mostly "neesh"
@@JBroMCMXCI he is actually an Aussie, which actually makes less sense as we pronounce it as neesh. It didn't make sense to me for him to pronounce it as nitch. But anyway don't be a dick
@@JBroMCMXCI damn you're dumb asshole. It's a foreign way of saying it. In french i is e and an e at the end of a world is silent if not specified otherwise. "niche" is therefore prononced "neesh" or "niʃ".
*Turns out its faster to beat the game without glitches*
"Thats cheating"
RJ Cox he did
LMAO
broder
*Turns out it's faster to not play the game at all*
"That's cheating"
A
"Hey cool, look guys, I just got a new world record!!"
*"What did you do?"*
"Used a different control scheme"
*"Cheating..."*
"Why?"
*"Because I didn't think of it first."*
@No Limits ow!, why is that so true it hurts?
if it gives better times than theirs then is cheating
That's a disingenuous interpretation.
@@DenkyManner I mean, they banned using the JP version because it made the fastest route viable, they banned using different control styles that anyone can choose to utilize, it's not even like they banned specific glitches, they decided "hey, you're not allowed to use this feature of the game" it's one thing to say "no rubber banding, that's just Cruise Control, which is a glitch we said no to" but they're saying that speedrunning under a different version of the game isnt okay in general, not even wanting to consider making different categories
@@DisKorruptd The fact that they wanted to ban it instead of creating a separate category is the worst to me. They could have decided to make another category each time and to each their own, but they refused despite it literally not costing them anything. I have rarely seen any community that is as unwilling to changes as this one. Just look at the Mario Kart 64 community as the polars opposite. It has categories of EVERYTHING.
Single course 3 lap, single course 1 lap, each with shortcut and non shortcut, grand prix (all courses), PAL and NTSC are on the same, converted, leaderboard to not create a disadvantage based on your version etc This is in my opinion how a speedrunning community should operate, not as a collective of people hellbent on keeping the status quo and having basically a single version of the game be accepted
"My NTSC version has an advantage over PAL, that's fine. What?!, the NTSC-J version has an advantage over my NTSC cart? That's cheating!!!" lol
I think you mean NTSC-U.
@commutativedivisionringFor Americans, of course. For Europeans and especially Asians, I'm not so sure about that...
@commutativedivisionring Perhaps easier these days, but it sure wasn't easy in 2008... Americans got the best of both worlds for the most part.
This was hilarious. Showing these people in the 2000s a new strategy/technique is akin to showing a caveman fire. There's going to be angry and confused reactions either way.
That analogy was on point. Not a complete exaggeration at all.
Your sarcasm is unwarranted
That made me laugh
@@t.p.ggaming3884 Sarcasm is never unwarranted you twat.
@@Plusimurfriend oh yeah, I've 100% never seen a case where a sarcastic comment was unwarranted.
not even when the one being sarcastic turned out to be completely wrong, like me right now.
"It is cheating because it was not programmed into the game"
*Mario 64 Speedrunners staring nervously*
I'm unclear on the argument that it's not programmed into the game anyway. Isn't it just using a particular control scheme and then using a calibration feature to calibrate the controller to suit you? Or is the calibration part of a diagnostics mode on the n64 itself or something?
oh boy I can't wait until they hear about any%
@@bundo13 The sensors in controllers have some pretty significant manufacturing deviations, so to compensate for this controllers consider their starting position to be the center no matter what the sensors read. So they were just exploiting that feature of the controller.
I love that argument. Very clearly it was programed into the game seeing as how anyone can do it relatively easily.
Meanwhile doom speedrunners glitching out into the corner and bypassing half the level lol
Most other speed running communities: hey you optimized the game a little. Thanks for the info! Were all gonna start running like that.
Goldeneye runners: no no no we all have to run games exactly the same way forever.
@@Yendisstar ikr, I'm tired of seeing those stupid posts getting thumbs up. Other speed running communities that are serious about it treat things the same way.
@@Yendisstar This "internet was way different back then" is kind of true. But, do you remember Doom? The speedrunning community of Doom was waaaaay better than Goldeneye, and Doom 1 and 2 came out before 007.
@@mark030a First of all you're replying to an 8 month old comment. Also this video is very generalizing and not at all representative of the community as a whole.
@@Yendisstar First of all I give no fucks about an 8 month old comment. I replied to 3 year old comments and those people were cool with it as we chatted about stuff on YT.
Second of all, I didn't comment on the video, I replied to YOUR comment.
@Cryptonomicon
Also don't forgot many new speedrunners are sponsored by certain video game devs , or console brands and computer brands .
I got my internet Adsl in 1997 what a huge joy it was the people playing games were mature and adults as i was 20 there were no moaning kiddos and so on .
Communities changed became "the thing" but back then it was just between a bunch of friends some conferences and video game magazines .
Sadly that since more than a decade nothing seem to change anymore as there're way too much seriousness into the gaming world .
I still remember gaming was just a fun thing after a hard day at work or coming back from college by venting killing stuff . Now gaming is only to gain viewers most of the time , to be the wannabe player of the month or whatever .
Guess that the community from Goldeneye 64 are a bunch of nostalgic people . And this is said with humor .
"Runners were unhappy..."
When are speedrunners EVER happy?
The guy, Beck Abney, completing the triple Weathertenko in Mario Kart 64 after 26461 tries sounded pretty happy.
When they get pb
They are only happy when they get a new world record
I mean the only speedrunners that are ever really happy are the ones who don't give a tit about setting world records. They just want to practice the sport of speedrunning as a hobby. Yes, they exist. Hugo_One is one for example
@@WrektSK money...
All these complaints can be summed up quite neatly: Salt.
All the people complaining were salty that they didn't think of it first, or salty that their records were now going to be soon beaten because of these new strats.
well i agree with new starts. But using a different version that gives you a advantage over the original game should be a whole new WR for that version of the game. But thats not how it is.. Which is really stupid.
@@keysersozee6513 but it's an official version. It's different when you switch systems. Like PC compared to console. But it neatly sums to people crying Wolf because All of their practice are "wasted". Basically the same as pro athletes complaining that the never generation are cheating for being younger, and having never and better training programs.
@@EISxD So by your logic if tommy comes into class doesnt like how the game is being played. he changes it to his version now tommy says its the same game and same records attached to it even though its his version and its different than the original. So anyone that has no skill in the game now can beat the original WR. Yeah that seems like some great logic my dude. -
@@keysersozee6513 No.
What I'm saying is the there are evolutions to games, the same way as books have different versions.
My exsample is that my Dad and I were taught by the same mathbook. The one difference is that the book I was taught by have been updated by multiple iterations..
Lets use the sports analogy again. Lets say American football. Same game as in the 70's. But strategy changes constantly in order to be better than the rest.
What you are refering to is D. Trump calling foul in advance if he looses the election.
@@EISxD If you were comparing the pro athletes to the gamers this would make sense.. But because you are not it doesnt work. Being a pro athlete and being better fit etc doesnt change the game. Just means people were not practicing hard enough etc the game still stays the same. If you look at gamers in regards to when comps first appeared you would have a similar thing happen. Where gamers then were not as conditioned etc as they are now. But either way you can still try and prove yourself right when you are clearly wrong. Its gotten really old at this point. Either be in super denial or troll. But this is my last msg if you dont see the issue with remaking a game with changes to it regardless if its official, then you need to jump on Billy Mitchell's side, because he took a official game and set records with it, then he got it all taken away because they said it was cheating because it wasnt the original game.
Lol, how can a legit feature of the controller be a cheat?
these tryhards played the same thing for so many years and no one really wants to change anything so any discovery is straight banned in their mind lol
Because stupid kids plagued the forums in the early 2000s who were never competitive and always stubborn to innovation. Thank God the community has matured a LOT since then.
the double controller is legit, the moving and shooting during cutscenes are a glitch. Shouldnt be allowed in a glitchless run, but for a glitch run its completelly fine.
that's what happens when man childs get wrapped up in something as insignificant as speedrunning LUL
@@1Ricov These same morons banned the amazing broken controller 2 strategy.
"it's cheating" says only the person that didn't find/have the advantage.
Not really, as rubberbanding is definitely hardware modification. It's just that it's so easy and hard to regulate that it gets a pass.
How is it hardware modification? So if you used your toe (instead of your hands) to strafe with the second controller, is that hardware modification too? Or does it only count if you're not physically touching it?
I get your point but where is the hardware modification part? I feel like there needs to be another term for this.
Or if that person happens to hold any records or well ranking scores of their own...
@@Jade-ur8pl "Tool assisted", I'd say.
Doom speedrunners: Oh wow a dude improved my run with a new strategy
Goldeneye speedrunners: Playing the game is cheating
Seeing two controllers and a rubber band just makes me realize how crazy running gets.
It's basically goldeneye and the lost vikings, nothing else comes to mind as that crazy (apart from having the second controller input UP+A in the original Zelda to quicksave & quit)
Look at some of the early Super Mario World credits warp setups, those needed a crazy amount of controllers holding down specific buttons.
I use rubber bands all the time when just playing some games normally lmfao
To me it just makes me realize how archaic FPS control schemes were prior to Alien Resurrection, and how stupid the N64 controller was designed.
time to ban goldeneye speedrunners tbh
SPEEDRUNNING GOLDENEYE is UNFAIR to NORMAL players as they CANNOT hope to COMPETE AND goes DIRECTLY AGAINST the developers vision! BAN GOLDENEYE SPEEDRUNNING
Time to ban walking because that's cheating
To be fair, back stabbing in DS shouldn't really be a thing in PvP as the game runs on Peer2Peer so you often get stabbed due to the other person lagging and taking advantage of it. (/ hacking for a face stab since their anti-cheat is shit.)
hard comment
Reece Bender Yeah, I’m a Goldeneye speedrunner. Along with that I know many things that most don’t know about this community. The Goldeneye community isn’t actually part of the Goldeneye community and I’m not saying that because I don’t like them. I’m saying that based on years of research.
Speedrunners hate him! Check this simple trick...
Speed runners hate him! Check out how this guy can teach you to get a world record time with this one simple trick!
beautiful
There's no way people will click on a title like this...
@@kendog84bsc are you a Speedrunner? Do you hate him too?
"See how this 55yo managed to piss out the entire game's speedrunning community using this one simple trick."
Karl Jobst: "I'd love to hear the opinions of people who don't know much about speedrunning GoldenEye 007"
Me: "Man what in the *hell* were the developers thinking, making a play style where two controllers control one person? That sounds like they put it in as a joke!"
I think that it may have been a leftover thing while implementing Multiplayer
I think it was so that you could have dual control stick aiming?
I've only seen this one other time, the first viva pinata game allows 2 players to control the same "character" it was there as a way for the parent to help their kid play, in a game like this its just baffling
I was a tester on Golden Eye and Designer on Perfect Dark, from what I recall, the reason why the "Asian" version had more armor was because FPS games were not big in Asia (still true) and it needed to be easier for that particular demographic. This was not a new thing and there is no way it was a mistake by the Devs. No way.
I don't think a designer of PD64 should be any kind of authority on what is or isn't a mistake.
Joking aside, you're definitely right.
@@CNYKnifeNerd So glad we have people like this out here representing the goldeneye speedrunners and their immaculate point of view.
“I beat the game faster by using a shorter path”
“That’s cheating”
If a separate region's release results in a different play experience. Added items, different damage tables, whatever, that release should have it's own category.
If you can just switch the display language to Japanese on any cart, then that's just smart thinking to display text faster.
SM64 speedrunners: Basically all techniques are allowed, but cheat codes will result in the run not counting as an actual run.
OoT speedrunners: Anything goes, but only if it can be done by a human player. In other words, don't use TAS techniques unless you're going for a TAS run.
GE7 speedrunners: WALKING IS CHEATING! IN FACT, THE CONTROLLER IS OFF LIMITS!!11!11!one1!1
it's the same if GE007 ever gets rereleased on nintendo VC (or something of that sort)
goldeneye runners wont go there because it would change their game (no lag for example, even though the GE community was upset when lookdown was found and implemented so this would make everyone happy (along with maybe dual analog support)
Doom speedrunners: _anything_ bar cheats goes and the community works co-operatively to achieve the most insane runs.
Quake speedrunners: same as Doom but they made "movies" out of the efforts.
GoldenEye speedrunners from the early noughties: *this* dumpster fire.
@@DinnerForkTongue Doom and Quake are PC games, meaning that they have no standard hardware or control method. Goldeneye, as a console game, is hardware- and control-method bound. BOTH types of platforms suffer from lack of official authority, at least when playing non-casually.
I wish GE7 was more like SM64 in that they allow emulators as a seperate category instead of outright banning it.
in my opinion, as long as you dont tamper with the timer it counts
Your ability to solve problems is incredible...the whole speed run community in general...blown away
hacker mindset
007 Player: hey i found this trick that saves time
007 speedrunners: REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Funny how I don't really care about speedrunning but your videos are seriously enjoyable to watch. Sub well earned.
This may be because of lack of information, but I feel the Goldeneye speed running community are usually upset when new techniques are discovered, especially if they give massive time saves and was kept secret by the discoverer. In my opinion, they should have used the time they wasted on whining practicing the new technique, if it was generously revealed by the discoverer.
Having something like this happening:
Speed runner: *does and/or reveals a new technique*
Community: Wah, that’s cheating!
Just makes me think the community feels like they envy the discoverer of new technique for finding it, are jealous of their records, or both.
A good portion of all the bickering mainly comes from their pride being shot down. These people waste endless hours upon hours of their life. Just to perfect the art of completing a series of levels in the most competitively tightened time as possible. Shave a few miliseconds off? That is a cake walk. But to shave off over 2-3 even 4 - 5 seconds? Watch as they shit their collective pants bitching. When in fact they're just jealous it wasn't them that found it first.
@@nanakimurasaki this was speedrunning more than 15 years ago. Keep that in mind. Speedrunning in the early 2000's was more about playing the game as intended in the fastest way possible.
So your comment is really off the spot. accusing people, based on 2019's standards, is really, but really, stupid.
@@AlcyonEldara, not really lol the old fourms are still running or are archived.
They should be more like the doom speed running community.
@@Zellonous No they should not. Doom speedrunning is by its very nature casual as everyone has a different setup. Of course if they have real life competitions with a standard setup then someone can be named the true champion but until then it's just for fun.
I do think Japanese and U.S. cartridge times for GE should have been separated, as the two games are in fact different, just as emulation is generally banned in all console communities. I also strongly advocated that PAL and NTSC should have had separate charts in MK64, though neither of what I stated ended up happening in the long run in either community. All other strategies in this video are otherwise accessible to anyone with a U.S. NTSC cartridge (and a second controller, which is nearly everyone.) Dealing with change is hard, but ultimately inevitable.
The slower inputs essentially turn the PAL version of MK64 into "easy mode" for mini-turbos. While there is a conversion factor to translate PAL times to NTSC and vice-versa, you also run into the rounding errors where certain exact times are unachievable on one platform. It just opens up its own can of worms by integrating the two regions.
The original site admin did so because he was concerned there wouldn’t be as much interest if they were separated. This may have made sense for the early days, but now that the game has been around for decades, separating would make more sense (not that I’m active anymore anyway.)
The idea of separating games is only for leaving current world record holders in place. Not for any real profit. As time shows, everyone just switch to japanese versions. And if saparated it would be the same. Those who in the top of US version would be there, yes, but everybody will do the japan version, 'cause it is faster.
For example battletoads. The japan version is much easier, but no one speedrun that, as there also a lot of bugfixes. So what the difference? For someone to be the "top"? Well, their records are still there. No one remove them.
@@enosunim Thats not true at all. If you separate them its not going to make someone choose a different version because they can do it faster. If the records are not counted the same. They will choose the one that is most familiar to them because they can still do WR on them without sacrificing a language barrier, and without worrying about someone using a different version that moves through the game quicker than the original beating your time. The fact they are allowing different versions onto original games WR is BS because they cant accomplish that record on the original version which doesnt make any sense to even count it as a WR unless its standing on its own.
not even a massive fan of speed running but your break downs of games i grew up with is pretty entertaining . gj!
"This style was not programmed into the game" Wouter Jansen is a magic man that can run nonexistent code on an N64, then?
Being able to set the default control stick angle is part of the controller, not the game.
@@PlayerZeroStart That's irrelevant.
@@machina188 All I'm saying is that, semantically speaking, they are correct. I don't agree with their decision, but their reasoning, if flawed, was not incorrect.
For the ‘Cruise Control’ one, I feel as though as long as you’re not directly modifying hardware, namely ANYONE can do it, it’s totally fine.
It would only be if the controller was manually changed that I feel it wouldn’t be fair which in this case it wasn’t.
The Japanese levels one, what the poster said at the time for it to be separated was the correct course of action I feel.
Bruh, I don't speedrun, have no realistic desire to, and probably wouldn't even be good at it.
But! This shit is riveting! Love it. Only problem is, I've watched all your videos. (That's a good problem to have.)
I know you said you don't have a desire to speedrun, but the whole "I wouldn't be good at it" thing shouldn't hold you back. As SmallAnt1 has said, being good at speedrunning is all about putting the time in and practicing. Nobody starts off good at speedrunning. Not even the top players.
Every other speedrunning community: "Awesome! a new strat to exploit!"
Goldeneye community: "Cheating!"
The Goldeneye speedrunning community was forever damaged when they allowed that cheater to remain on the boards even after it was proven he spliced and doctored videos, as well as using GameShark.
@@dennisanderson8663 Context please. Which strat or person makes use of GameShark?
@@usualunusualkid7149
Karl literally made a video about him, search "the biggest cheater in Goldeneye 007 speedrunning history".
@@ahriman935 Oh okay, thanks!
Oh thank god..
If I don't hear Karl call me an absolute legend every few weeks or so I start to taper off a bit..
a necessary shot of dopamine
I'm not a big fan of speedrunning, but watching these videos and being called an "absolute legend" makes me feel incredibly warm inside
Thanks Karl
CC was also something that had to be accepted to speedrun SW: Shadows of the Empire. In that game, CC increases forward speed beyond the normal limit. The only backlash I've seen for it being used for that game was from me, at the very beginning of my time speedrunning the game. I quickly accepted CC though because it made the game more fun to play. The default running speed in Shadows is pretty slow.
Hello you absolute legend Karl! Appreciate your content , thank you for it!
Thanks man really glad you like it
Always weird to see creators who speak different languages on random videos in English
Another cool video. I really enjoy hearing about the history of speed running. Been playing golden eye for 20 years and just getting into the speed scene now. Learning the history is so much fun and look forward to the next vid!
Imagine playing the English version because you can't get ahold of a Japanese version and getting a time that would be world record on the Japanese version and having that not acknowledged.
Separating speedruns by version is actually a good idea, as the text may not necessarily be the only difference.
This is the only time I've ever seen a community consistently get angry when finding time saves
I've honestly always believed that different versions of a game should have different leaderboards. If a game is faster in Japanese, then there should be separate JAP and ENG boards.
If the PAL and NTSC carts change items and levels, then why are they considered the same? They're clearly different, and it's a boldfaced lie to claim otherwise. If a game is run on a specific patch to circumvent the developers patching out your useful glitches, then it should be it's own unique category.
This would allow for more run diversity, and that's a good thing. It leaves more space open for different runners, which will draw in more people and increase the odds of something silly or incredible being found.
As it sits, if you want to run something like OoT, you need a Japanese cart to even be playing the same sport as the top rankers. It's silly that you can save minutes by playing a game in a different language and everyone just shrugs and says "that's how things are"
The more you split games and the more rules there are the fewer people there are going to be in each category and the harder it will be for new players/viewers to engage with the community. You need to strike a balance in order for the community to remain healthy.
@@CaptianSwan A year later, my opinion hasn't really changed.
I get that you don't want 30 categories for a game with like, 12 runners, but for games like OoT, you could afford to double the categories and not worry over it. Plus, with more categories, you get more world records people will push, trying to get their name at the top of the list.
@@firedrake110 oops, didn't notice your comment was a year old. Sorry!
@@CaptianSwan Well, if a player is going to join a diverse speedrunning community--such as Super Mario N64--then they really only need to worry about the category/categories they plan to compete in. Any players who leave one category will be replaced by rising competitors who wish to focus on that category, especially for popular games. Allowing for various categories actually improves accessibility by letting people zero in on a category they may be more specialized or interested in and allowing for the use of different regional versions. This encourages new players to compete who may otherwise have not and also would allow players who have an inferior version of a game to continue competing without feeling threatened by a superior version. Although, if versions are separated into categories, it would still probably be good to have a broad category encompassing all of them, since there would undoubtedly be people who prefer that.
sup dude, just discovered your channel and i just wanted to say that iv really enjoyed watching your content, im not a speedrunner myself i just admire it from a distance but its been really fun to watch your stuff for the past 2 hours, keep it up!
i never played goldeneye and i dont speedrun any game but i love the goldeneye speedrunning content :D
Mee too! Keep it up Karl :D
Never played goldeneye?
Sacrilege
N64 wasn't that popular in some countries. PC players also had shooters with better control by that point. You'd be surprised at the amount of people simply oblivious to existence of the Golden Eye game.
Back when it came out I was against it as shown but it came down to me being stubborn. I almost usually prefer to play the jp version now it has a better feel. Great video as usual Karl
I'd also like to add at the time it was very difficult to find a Japanese copy of the game so accessibility was also an issue for me and made me salty. Copies on eBay were scarce and sometimes close to 100 dollars. Now they can be found frequently for about 20 bucks or less which is great. Japanese runner taka actually played on English while having the jp version at the time which I feel bad about he was capable of a new untied surely
Great video that covered a lot of ground quickly. One of your best yet.
Man, your content is absolutely wonderful to watch. You explain everything so well and pleasantly, please keep it up!!
"I got a new world rec..."
"CHEATING"
My absolutely friendly legends..
It just keeps happening.
Gotta love those Jobst-Goose crossover vids
I love how you have the gta v pause music playing during the vid, not only is the music relaxing, it compliments your narration very well.
Imagine the npcs just watching your character looking down running and shooting at seemingly random
It was also insane hard to get a Japanese game 20 years ago...
I totally understand why people would resist a lot of these revelations. I would, too. In the end, people pick a game to speedrun because they like that game. And at some point, when you've got a rubber band attached to two taped controllers and you're staring at the ground without end, you're really not playing the game you like anymore.
Thanks for these videos, very informative and you explain strategies in a simple manner.
When regular youtubers all for patreon- "Oh yea... soooo im just want money so yea thaaanks.."
Karl Jobst- "Hey, I'm genuinely scared because I don't have a massive bank account so your support is appreciated!"
P.S. Great work on the videos as always!
I love when every time a guy improves by using an unorthodox method he is called a cheater on the spot. Says you a lot about humanity.
Goldeneye speedrunners in the early 2000's: *I DON'T WANT CHANGE, I DON'T WANT CHANGE, EVERYTHING NEEDS TO STAY THE SAME!*
Your music choices are on point Karl
Just found this channel a few days ago. Love the content!
Love your self-aware clickbait titles. They're like a parody, keep going at it, and all types of channels got monetization problems, it's AdPocalypse 2.
Lots of the resistance to newer techniques seem more like the old guard trying to preserve their WRs
You want to be beaten at the game you played not at a game you weren't playing in the first place.
Honestly, I don’t know anything about Goldeneye 007... But I still really enjoy watching these Goldeneye videos and learning new things every time I see them :) Good job and keep it up!
I do not nor have I ever had any interest in speedrunning and a practically non-existent interest in gaming but good god, I love your videos. Very thorough and interesting and pretty damn accessible to people outside of the community. Thanks for doing what you do!
After watching a lot of these speedrunning videos, I'm starting to think "Cheating" comes down to disclosure. If the runner explains their methods and posts it to the right category, it's valid.
i dont know why one day i started getting Goldeneye speedrun videos lately but i aint complaining
Perhaps you watched some AGDQ videos? That's how i got the goldeneye stuff into my feed.
nope and nope
It makes mw actually less sad when he opens it with 'hello you absolute legends' and i feel better about myself for a moment before remembering im watching youtube in a onesy at 2 in the morning on a sweltering lockdown weekend.
just found your channel! really enjoy your videos!
Speed runners: let’s find the fastest way to play through games
Someone: -Finds a fast way to play 007-
GE007 Players: BLASPHEMY
my dude snapdragon up in here. Didnt expect that one! :D
I never did speedrunning and have no experience on it, but somehow your videos are always very interesting for me. Keep it up buddy !
Thank you so much for making these videos. I have always been a huge fan of Goldeneye, it was my favorite game growing up. I don't think any new game will create the same experience. I remember all of my friends gatethering at each others houses just to try to beat some of the missions. I remember in particular 10 year old me struggling with Control 00A.
Speedrunner: “CC is cheating. The game didn’t intent for it to happen.”
*Proceeds to clip through wall to beat level faster*
Most if not all of these being “controversial” sounds more like straight up not wanting to have to pour time into learning a new skill and don’t like there even being a small chance that there is any information that they themselves don’t already know, so as apposed to just understanding that healthy competition will always have new and potentially hugely advantageous strategies and tactics being developed. Its the nature of things, and by writing every thing a player did to beat you that you yourself didn’t or couldn’t do as cheating just comes across as childish while they argue it is to protect the way the game “should be played” which is pretentious and lacks any self awareness.
The ONLY exceptions I have seen and there are not many are exploits that no longer make the experience even worth playing or watching (example: pause spamming)
Welcome to Formula One.
I dont even speedrun, but I love your videos Karl! Keep up the good work!
The intro song unlocked my deepest memories as I realized that I was recommended the video containing this song a little while ago and listened to it so many times but forgot about it like 2 days afterwards
if someones game is different then the others then why should they be in the same category, why not its own rank system/title? and its common practice in the speed runner community? thats stupid
it's not... sensible communities categorize runs by game version/glitch usage and other stuff...
But can you explain why it is stupid?
Differentiaton between versions seemed the way to go though. Rubber banding i would consider cheating.
I find the second controller thing to be questionable anyway. I know you'd have to purchase an N64 and a cartridge to even speedrun the game, but not being able to optimally without also buying a second controller is odd. It's like that Amiibo fiasco with some Nintendo games recently.
I've watched about 15 of your vids b2b and I'm actually starting to feel like an absolute legend. Cheers you absolute legend.
always excited for another video. legendary!
having certain versions being different like adding armor should be used in a different category
rubber band = hardware modification/tool assistance
Man... What a load of crap.
How is it not though? You're using a third-party device to make the inputs easier than they'd be without it, even if it's something as simple as a rubber band. Turbo controllers typically aren't allowed even when they're just making the inputs easier and not doing anything a human theoretically couldn't (e.g. having Megaman rapidfire).
Me and my friends discovered the look down technique on multiplayer not long after the game came out, we'd always default to looking down and strafing when running or knee sliding as it always just seemed quicker. It also allowed you to glitch back up into the vent on facility when used with strafe. We had no idea solo speed running was even a thing back then
Dropped the like to help u make more vids, im not into speedrubbung but ut videos so wellmade i love watching them
3:28 "This style was not programming into the game, so that why I think it's cheating"
But You guys using glich... Glich is things was not programming into the game but why you guys say Cruise control is cheating
‘Cause you make me feel
You make me feel
You make me feel
Like an absolute legend
I love these speedrun related videos. Well done my friend.
I can relate to having to use CC due to a loose control stick. I had to use it to beat Majora's Mask in order to use the goroon roll. It was pretty annoying as I had to keep resetting the stick dozens if not hundreds of times throughout the game but it in the end I managed to finish it.
the best players in the world at goldeneye were using 1.1 in the year 2000? surely any rational mind can see that 1.2 is better even just for aiming and shooting. surprising that it took so long for 1.2 to catch on.
People are stubborn and stupid
For the topics you mentioned:
Cruise Control: Eh its legit. It's Pseudo 1.2 and as you mention people went to 1.2 anyways and with how bad the N64 controller was was for joystick durability and getting progressively worse and worse dead zones, it saves money if just needing to go side to side
NTSC JP: Really we have so many games where region differences result in different versions being superior than others. If it's Japanese text being faster or other games having more differences between them. If they wanted a separate leader board for NTSC JP then they'd have to split off NTSC US and PAL into their own boards too which would cause chaos within the community.
2.2 Controls: Kind of a weird area with the taping together and stuff but really it could became a hardware barrier for new runners who don't have two controllers.
Look Down: It's legit, as lag management is a huge thing in a lot of games. This time it just looks a lot weirder than most.
yo dude i love your channel a lot!! keep it up.!
I have to say, you're an excellent content creator, I like ALL of your videos and I've gained a fascination for the meta- of old games that I only passively followed in the past due to my associations with folks like Goose in The-Elite and MK64 forums. I used to be a world record holder in a couple of big titles like Resident Evil 4, Pokemon Red, Pokemon Emerald, Mario Kart DS, and Super Mario 64, but they were so early in the development of the Meta- that almost all of them have been destroyed by now. Keep up the good work my friend.
Do I consider the following cheating:
CC: No. This is manual setting for the game in an unmodified controller. The only time I think this would be cheating is if it was specifically and explicitly not allowed for a particular competition or leaderboard.
Japanese body armor: I think that the response here is pretty obvious, it should be on a separate leaderboard since there is a stark advantage. Japanese players could still submit for the leaderboard without body armor, but only if they didn't pick up the armor that wasn't available to other players in the course of their run.
2nd controller: I think this should be allowed since it's universally available and I'm pretty sure most consoles shipped with 2 controllers back in the day. The key I would think, is to make sure everyone knows about the technique as a matter of common knowledge.
Rubberbands: I think the ruling made is probably the best option, yes it's hardware modification/tool assistance and that's definitely not cool, but it's also something that regulating for would be near impossible to do and advantage it gives isn't something you couldn't technically do with a toe if you were flexible enough, and that's still a manual input of sorts. Plus maybe someone has a really long sixth finger, are we going to ban them from using it to hold that? I know that's absurd but it kind of draws out how absurd freaking out over the simple adjustment is.
Lookdown: I think this is fine as long as it's accepted as per the category.
Started with absolute legends 5/5
It really is a testament to your ability to present and explain your videos in such high quality that even someone like me who hasn't even played the games you cover watches them. Came for the Doom stuff and stayed for the entertainment.
I used to play golden eye when I was a kid I’m loving watching this old game makes me feel nostalgic and that’s why I just subbed Good luck keeping the monetization. BTW I used CC sometimes when I was a kid not for speed running but just because my controllers joystick was worn out and loose
Declaring war on rubberbands is like de Declaring war on drugs
California-Hold my plastic straw.
Some constructive criticism: I wouldn't mind if you did away with the obvious clickbait in the titles/thumbnails. Your content is pretty good and I feel it can stand on its own without it. I keep considering not clicking for that simple fact alone.
Same, I refuse to support people who clickbait most of the time, but in rare cases like this the content is actually really enjoyable
Glad you like the content. The strategies I'm using at the moment appear to be working. I have gained over 20k subs and millions of views in the previous month. Sorry if you choose not to click it but I'll continue doing it unless it stops working. I'm not entirely sure why people get upset at the title when at the end of the day the video is all that matters.
I mean, the thumbnail shows a Japanese cart, which was considered for banning... So is it really clickbait
None of my titles or thumbnails are ever misleading.
That's fair. I respect that. And Anakin makes a good point, too. It's not false info. But it's more the ambiguous title/arrows in the thumbnail that bug me. At the end of the day it's hard to argue with effectiveness. In regards to mjc's comment, I felt like I was pretty respectful about it. So I don't get what he means with me crying about it.
I love this! Although I do not understand why records on different versions of a game aren't considered seperate? If there are differences in the levels they should be considered different games more or less.
Hearing rubber bands described as "controller modifications" and "TAS tools" is so funny to me. Like yeah, I s'pose they fit the literal definition, it's just odd to see a very technical term normally used when describing dedicated cheating devices instead being applied to a trivial household object.
my thought is, how is it different (or worse) than someone having more keen reflexes and faster hand movements. one of them is completely based on your biology and some external factors, the other is something you can do in 3 seconds
"i am completely reliant on youtube ad revenue"
sounds like you need to diversify your revenue streams, my guy. dont leave all your eggs in one basket
Why do speedrunners in forums seem to get upset when someone is using a strat in secret that they themselves have discovered or is not commonly known? It's pretty cheap and petty to call it cheating just because they didn't come up with it themselves. This is a competition - not an everybody get's a participation medal day. If a boxer is on a special diet/training programme they don't have an obligation to share it with everyone. Good lord.
Just getting into your videos. Great stuff. Love that Waterworld track at the open of this one. Ocean's music department was better than the game designers lol. Anyway cheers.
That gta backround music got me in the feels. Miss those days on the ps3😔