Beta Stovepipe Island : Cut Island & Dungeon of Zelda The Wind Waker | Cut Content
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 มี.ค. 2024
- There has been a long lost island to Wind Waker called Stovepipe Island, which is believed to have been a beta island of the Gorons and held a cut dungeon even. Today we explore this old beta mystery
Sources:
tcrf.net/The_Legend_of_Zelda:...
www.ign.com/articles/2013/10/...
Footage Credit:
• 100% Walkthrough - The...
• 100% Walkthrough - The...
• Zelda Twilight Princes...
• Zelda Twilight Princes...
• Longplay of The Legend...
• Longplay of The Legend...
• Oracle of Ages - Mini-...
• The Legend of Zelda: O...
Stovepipe Island Coloured Image Credit:
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#zelda #Nintendo #Retrogaming - เกม
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I'd like to dedicate this episodes to my subscribers here who brought to my attention before about the importance of Stovepipe Island. Back when I made my Beta Dungeons video, I had not really considered it as much but upon closer inspection it just made so much sense to also be a major contender. You guys are amazing!
Hi
Wind Waker have a rush development which some part was replaced with the dang Triforce quest.
Also someone is making a map of Hyrule when it wasn't flooded.
@@Cliffordlonghead I wouldn't be surprised if the Triforce quest was a way to fill in for space. I mean the whole of the underworld of Hyrule was meant to be explorable at one point afterall.
Yeah i've seen Wind Waker Unflooded. Neat stuff
@@TheObsessiveGamer i mean everything even the islands that was ones mountain tops
Sometimes you have to wonder how much of a masterpiece Wind Waker and Mario Sunshine could've been if they weren't rushed out so the GameCube would have more titles.
Yeah, i can't help but feel like there is so much lost potential.
It's why i'm really glad Nintendo has learned ever since on not rushing its developers and lets them make the game for as long as they need to. I was perfectly fine waiting for the masterpieces that were BOTW and TOTK as a result
Wind Waker is already one of my favourites so it'd probably just be endlessly replayable.
Those are already the best 3D entries of their respective franchises, they'd be even better masterpieces.
@@Vulpas Nah, Galaxy is way better than Sunshine. Wind Waker has a very good feel, i don't think the game as a whole is the best but it has a great feel to it, like SM64.
You're forgetting about Phantom Hourglass on the DS, which is basically ALL the ideas they couldn't implement into Wind Waker (including better ship combat). That one also includes a volcano island, as well as the Ghost Ship. I think that one was the other cut dungeon from Wind Waker. It makes the most sense, as the Ghost Ship feels incredibly rushed in the final game, being only a small combat arena. It's also possible the sand ship from Skyward Sword took some elements from the WW Ghost Ship.
haha I specifically mentioned in the video that it likely would have to be a "3D" dungeon as 2D and 3D zelda game and dungeons are very different actually and Phantom Hourglass despite being in polygons is still using a 2D Zelda gameplay format for dungeons. Thus why I can't imagine it having been in that game. Elevation and 3D space was not something utilzied in Phantom Hourglass like Wind Wakers was.
PS. Thanks for being one of the people to bring Stovepipe Island to my attention. I still remember your post :)
If you look at the Gorons within the goron mines... they have have stove pipes/smoke stacks coming out of their heads like in the 'wind waker goron' doodle you were showing :D
Oooh I should look at this more. Another piece of evidence in the block
@@TheObsessiveGamer It's fascinating to see one of Twilight Princesses coolest dungeons have STRONG connections to Wind Waker.
@@TheObsessiveGamer I immediately thought of that, myself! 👍
I also believe that the Stovepipe Island was the island for gorons. In the concept art you can see a hot spring lake. In Twilight Princess there are hot springs in Death Mountain: also reused.
Dragon Roost is probably a perfect introduction to Wind Waker dungeons... but it's fun to imagine a "late game" version of Dragon Roost... your theory that the 'Goron' dungeon appearing earlier in the game feels spot on. Great stuff, Obsessive Gamer!
Thank you! Yeah honestly i'm glad Dragon Roost was chosen as an intro. It's absolutely perfect. Probably my favourite starting dungoen in the series. I can imagine if Dragon Roost was late game, it would be the first of the late set since my theory has the Goron Dungeon as first. May as well make Fire as the intro in both cases.
_Wind Waker_ should’ve had a Goron Island with a Water Dungeon tied to it…
in _Majora’s Mask,_ Goron Link drowns in water… but in _Twilight Princess_ we see a Goron just hanging out under water for half the game… so I’m gonna go with the fact that Gorons _can_ breath under water, or hold their breath indefinitely 🤷🏻♂️
Given the Goron Merchant, it seems likely that the Gorons have an underwater society.
@@mellowyello1478 - I thought the fact that he was the only Goron in the game (right?) was meant to imply that the Gorons had all but gone extinct…
…but I think it would’ve been much more fun if weren’t lead to believe, or outright told, that the Gorons had all gone extinct, only for Link to discover a thriving underwater Goron society late in the game. maybe they have some comical line about how since they couldn’t swim or float they just decided to stay under water? or that they’re just too heavy for boats 🤷🏻♂️
I believe the town could have been kakariko village, it does kinda remind me of twilight princess kakariko village because of how the buildings are positioned
It anything I would say that town became the Twilight Princess Kakariko village. I mean that version of Kakariko village was also odd next to every other iteration of the town
If Twilight Princess was developed off of the Wind Waker engine, wouldn’t it have been easy for the developers to reuse the cut assets from the cut dungeons and place them in Twilight Princess?
Exactly the case. Another point to why it is very very likely they were simply reused in Twilight Princess
The models for sure, the texture would have needed to be remade of course which they have done before for majoras mask
Sidenote, but the facial expressions of Link and the NPCs in the concept notes are hilarious. Good video as always!
Thank you! and yeah I do love how hilarious the expressions were. Makes me wish we had a Wind Waker manga
Something to consider is that if you shoot an ice arrow into any section of lava, it causes the lava to cool into one of those temporary rock platforms that appear the same way when you throw a water jug. As far as I'm aware, this gameplay mechanic is _never_ necessitated in-game. But it may have been an essential puzzle in a cut fire dungeon, with the ice arrows acting as one of its key items.
I feel there is more than meets the eye with ice ring island, yes it could have been just a reference to the ice cavern from ocarina of time. But I think it could have been one of these two scrapped dungeons.
Think about this, if greatfish island was fleshed out and had a character who was the third sage, what matches well with water? Ice of course!
And if we assume that the original intention was for dragon roost to be stovepipe island, then that would make sense on why the sage of earth is from that island, because they were a goron originally, not a rito
The only thing that goes against my theory is the fact that aonuma stated that “we’ve implemented these dungeons in other games” and since there’s no ice dungeon in SS, that would mean that snowpeak would have elements from this hypothetical scrapped ice dungeon.
Now it’s also possible that this scrapped ice dungeon wasn’t supposed to be a mansion either, and there’s just elements of it within snowpeak
I recently binged your whole Zelda cut content series and I loved it. You must have put a lot of work in it so thanks a lot for it. Im eagerly waiting for Twilight Princess!!
Thank you! Amazing to see it all binged like that. It has been a few years in the making. D yep indeed TP is coming after TWW. 2-3 more videos left in this series
If you look at the village on Stove Pipe Island concept art it looks like Kakariko Village from Twilight Princess. So I think it is far to say that the Goron Mines was meant for Wind Waker.
I love beta content. Great work!! Stove pipe island 🏝️
Thank you very much!
Wind Waker always felt incomplete to me, especially without a Water dungeon in an ocean 💀 It's still one of my favorites, but it probably would've been amazing with those 2 cut dungeons. I love Water so it really made me upset to not see one in WW. A third sage also felt missing with the Stovepipe Island temple probably
I always look forward to your wind waker videos. Something about playing this game screamed there was a lot of cut content and watching them confimed them
That chainsmoking goron has some serious shopkeeper vibes
2:32 that thing looks very like one of the Goron Elders from Twilight Princess
I like mechanical levels so it would’ve been cool to play a steampunk-ish dungeon but the Goron Mines are great!
If they ever remake TWW, I would hope they bring Steampipe back but make it a steampunk-ish dungeon as you state since Goron Mines is already in use
Another great video on what is still my all-time favorite Zelda game!
Thank you very much! :)
if the Goron Mines are a cut WW idea alongside the Lakebed Temple (which I'm starting to believe tbh) then we do have a better idea of what the Water Boots could do in theory, maybe not full on movement underwater, but something similar that functio only within the scrapped dungeon unlike the Zora Armor from TP which could be used anywhere.
I think the gorons smoking was going to be a plot thing about them having an addiction. Kind of like in tears of the kingdom. The industrial theme would be about pollution coming from the mines.
It probably got scrapped because it didn't fit the game overall.
I think the whole Rito/Zora thing can be explained. There was hints somewhere that there are multiple "domains" of Zoras. I just watched a video on here about this recently, can't remember who uploaded it. Maybe one such domain of Zoras ended up evolving into the Rito, whereas the other domains remained as Zoras.
The bigger issue is how would they could even become Rito in such short amount of time.
It works for the current mythos of course. I mean they HAD to spin it to make sense in the end in some ways, but it still always feels like a stretch by them as a means to quickly scrap together an explanation
There's also the explanation for the enemy Zora in the 2D era of games, which have been retroactively renamed to "Zola"
@@SorcererLance Actually, they were named "Zola" in the English manual for the first The Legend of Zelda on NES. However, it is a common thing in Japanese to English translations for "R" & "L" to be somewhat interchangeable, it is often up to the translator's personal preference as to which letter (R or L) is used sometimes. So, i assume that, despite the two different spellings, they probably are the same name.
easy retcon for the zora/rito thing is that Medli's ancestor fell in love with a rito and the zora part of her bloodline faded over time
When this game originally came out, even way back when... It felt rushed and lackluster when it came to content. Had amazing atmosphere and I still enjoyed it but it is a shame to think what it could have been with more islands/towns/dungeons and less just empty open Ocean.
Great video, as always. Now, I know that there were more Wind Waker videos, but they seem to have been delisted. I wonder why?
Oh one of them was delisted by mistake. Fixed that now. The other was of subpar quality for this channel so I took it out. Since then I have reutilized 2 out of 3 of the subjects discussed in that video with other Wind Waker videos. The third part to be utilized with a future one as planned.
One of the gorons in Twilight Princess has steam coming out of him like in the concept art. Also one of the cut dungeons may have appeared in Phantom Hourglass.
1:26 Did they really write in English for these concept sheets? I would have expected Japanese text.
It's more likely that Hyrule Historia officially translated these
@@TheObsessiveGamer Oh, i see.
I could see stovepipe island and whatever the zora temples dungeons being accessible via the hyrule field and you have to do them before entering Ganons tower; it always felt weird to me that you just re fought the other bosses before getting to puppet gannon instead of having something unique... also going through the desert and fighting through ganons tower could of been much expanded, that would be such a contrast compared to the rest of the game. There you would have to fight fire and ice types and just hordes of enemies to get up through the tower to puppet ganon and it would be more of a proper temple
Underrated channel
I noticed how the music in the Goron Mines sort of sounds like a slowed version of the Illusion Room in Ganon’s Tower Wind Waker. I wonder if this could be a small piece of evidence of the Goron dungeon originally in WW?
And I can see the resemblance of Stove Pipe map in Twilight Princess Death Mountain with Kakariko Village at the base and the hot springs up on the mountain.
I'm upset I didn't get the notification for when this video was uploaded
I'm upset that keeps happening to my subscribers lol But thanks for finding it regardless :)
Honestly, not mad at all. I love the mines and lakebed temple!
this wasnt in my feed for 3 days. happens a lot with some channels right now
Pleeease if they ever release this game again they really should add those two other dungeons, I always felt like the game was too short
I hope some day we're able to decompile the other games and port them to PC natively like what was done with OoT. It would be awesome if someone then mods WW for a beta recreation that imports these maps from the other games back into Wind Waker and reskins them with the Wind Waker art style. Nintendo would never do it because it wouldn't make sense for them to reuse entire dungeons, but the niche community online that loves this beta stuff would love re-exploring the same things in the original intended context.
Hopefully the modding scene picks up for the Wind Waker one day. Ocarina of Time may get a lot of it, but I feel we really should start shifting to GameCube mods to have stuff like this
It's been long established - for over a decade or two, no less - that the Rito from TWW (regardless of any possible relation to the ones from BOTW/TOTK, if they're even related at all) evolved from the Zora due to the divine intervention of the goddesses themselves. This either occurred directly, or as an indirect response due to the unnatural water of the Great Sea being uninhabitable for the Zora (recall that it's pointed out on more than one occasion - and even at one point by Ganon himself - throughout the game that regular, catchable fish are either sparse or outright non-existent). I'm really not sure why people still struggle and pull mental gymnastics with and over this to this very day because it's absolutely not that complicated or deep in the slightest. I also don't think it's a stretch to think that the Rito were always intended to evolve from the Zora either, especially when taking into consideration that the Kokiri became the Koroks and that even numerous enemies seen in OOT have descendants that've evolved differently over time from them (e.g the Boko Babas evolved from the Deku Babas, the Magtails likely evolved from the Tektites, etc.). I believe their intention was to make TWW feel very similar to OOT in many ways (much like they'd later do with TP), while also feeling very "exotic" when compared to it because of the introduction and effects of the Great Sea. This would've made it feel like a greater amount of time has passed since OOT while still heavily tying the game into it, and the fact that Link was seemingly supposed to age gradually also fits this idea rather nicely and pushes a more natural passage of time compared to the time travel seen in OOT. The Gorons being left unchanged and so few in number on top of it I think points towards the possibility that they were originally supposed to have a lager role alongside the Kokiri/Koroks and Zora/Rito. That, and they would've likely also "evolved" into a new race as those two races did (albeit perhaps with less dramatic or notable changes from the Gorons themselves), thus becoming the "smoke pipe" race that was meant to inhabit Stovepipe Island before it was ultimately cut. Nintendo still desired to have the Gorons present in the game, however, so we were just given three unchanged ones with no relevance to the main story as a compromise so as to still have all three major races introduced in OOT present (barring the Gerudo, and I guess the Sheikah as well). This would explain why they're the only ones left unchanged without a home or dungeon of their own. Goron Mines in TP is likely and largely based off of Stovepipe and its cut dungeon, with even some of the Gorons being inspired by the cut descendant race they were meant to have in TWW as a means of paying homage to them (hence why some of them have literal organic smoke pipes on their bodies). Afterwards I feel like it turned into somewhat of a gag/inside joke to keep the Gorons relatively the same in every game they appear in regardless of how much or how little the other races around them change. lmao I'm certainly willing to believe that the Rito may have original been under the care of Jabun, however, and therefore may have been moved from Greatfish Isle to Dragon Roost in the final game.
TL;DR: Rito evolving from the Zora is not at all complicated, has been explained, and is in line with other things we see have changed since the events of OOT in the final game. Gorons were likely meant to evolve like their sister OOT races, but the game being rushed left us with three unchanged ones with zero plot relevence. Gorons Mines and certain Goron designs in TP are based off of Stovepipe Island, its dungeon, and the descendant Goron race that were all cut from TWW.
_Wind Waker’s_ unfinishedness hurts me so much.
You missed a strong piece of evidence pointing towards the Goron mines of Twilight Prince, being from Stovepipe island.
One of the Goron Elders you meet in the mines has little volcanic craters that are constantly giving off smoke kinda like that concept art.
Yeah I had completely forgotten about them even existing haha. But only bolsters it as you say it.
I'm largely on board but I don't think that Stovepipe Island was supposed to be where Dragon Roost is. Rather I think Birds Peak Rock replaced where Stovepipe Island should be.
I suspect one of the cut dungeons was supposed to be hyrule castle. This is because very little items are required to progress just the claw shot and the bow while the claw shot isn’t in wind waker it could easily be substituted with the hook shot. And the abundance of darknuts which were common in the castle in wind waker
Sorry if this came of a little rambly I’m not good with explaining ideas
I thought for a while that Stovepipe Island might be where the Gorons ended up after the flood, possibly growing chimneys on their bodies to adapt to their environment.
It would explain why Gorons appear randomly and why they later reappear properly in Phantom Hourglass.
A good way to spin it to make sense of things in what became the final game :)
3:45 I never knew this! Thanks!
I have the answer to 2:52
Remember the old Gordon’s that had the key peaces in twilight princess
Does anyone know the song at the start? It sounds like the Great sea theme but then changes to the main zelda theme. I can't seem to find it
It was the trailer theme of the game. Not used in game as far as I'm aware
I always thought Gorons as nomad traders was a moronic idea. Gorons can't live or travel underwater. They should have been sedentary in wind waker. Still, I liked that idea better than all of TOK or BOW.
It would be awesome if future HD remakes did include cut content, not just Wind Waker but other games too, like what if Ocarina of Time did add the Wind Temple? Maybe as to not interfere with the story it is unlocked after beating the game? I don't know just a thought Hyrule Historia is full of great ideas that weren't used in their respective games, some of the Divine Beast BOTW designs were mind blowing and incredible would've Loved them to be DLC
I wonder if the modding community could add in Stovepipe alongside the other removed dungeons in Wind Waker.
"Goron-infested" 💀
This game was so good!
I really hope we get a chance to step away from BoTW soon, because the Wind Waker timeline has always been more interesting to me with how it expands on the future of Hyrule and the world.
definitely sounds like they reused some concepts for TP
9:41 " the introduction of doritos"
I still wish if they released a fixed completed wind waker instead of a remastered
Everyone likes tobacco lmao
Such a weird thing to write lol
Everyone on Stovepipe Island does
@@yqafree Goron's feeling the stress of being surrounded too much water :P
Isn’t it obvious that the Great Valoo might have driven away the gorons and granted the Zora their wings. Gorons may have been scared away because of the dragon Volvagia
In the past
That's the current mythos of course as to make sense of it. However it still feels like quite a stretch that the team had to make to make sense of it at all. The Gorons aren't really a people afraid of things like that, which is why they stood their ground against Volvagia
They didn't stand their ground against Volvagia, they were horrified with the sole exception of Darunia who is just built differently. It's not a stretch at all to think that the Zora could have evolved and grown wings so as to survive in a sea incapable of sustaining life. Also using Breath of the Wild as a basis to criticize things in other Zeldas is very silly, it's its own game with its own distinct lore.
Oh. OH. OOOOOOOHH!!
yeah lol
Cubegame
CGN :P
😀 - Nice!
Thanks!
Wind waker is better than totk
Different kinds of games attempting two completely different ideas.
@Zephrese Bro WW is one of my favorite zelda games, drop the aggression
Spitting
Catsup is better than ketchup