Hearing Tarn and Zach talk about their need of money, while not urgent, has really pushed me hard into the camp of releasing when the fortress mode is finished. If that's the case, why are we even discussing this? I sincerely doubt releasing the Steam version without adventure mode will do anything at all to the PR reception of it. People who are new will not be offended or anything. People who play fortress mode will be happy and buy the game. The Adams family will see a level of security that they well deserve, and the people who are so solidly in the 'I won't touch it unless it has adventure mode' can wait to buy it at the same time they'd be buying it anyways if it got delayed for adventure mode. I literally don't understand why this is even a discussion.
If anything, I would make the argument that adventure mode muddies the identity of the game from the layman's perspective. Us more medium to long term players get its role in the DF ecosystem but I do defo remember being so confused about what it was and why it existed in the first place. Adventure mode is not a fully fledged RPG. Players going into it expecting it to follow the normal RPG trappings will be sorely disappointed. Honestly, from the perspective of a new new player (IE new to even the idea of DF) would be better served with adventure mode's initial absence.
On that point too, have they voiced any opinions about a patreon type deal? I think there's many in the community who would love to xhuck some $$$ to help with medical bills or whatever helps them be more comfortable in their situation.
Here is my suggestion for what could work in terms of tutorialisation. We already have solid factors that separate what makes a stronghold different from an outpost etc. What I suggest is simply a checklist of things that you need to do in order to get the next fortress size/renown level. It gives the player medium term goals, it doesn't force the player into any particular behaviour patterns but it also gives them an idea of what to be thinking about in terms of progression. You could even have each element of the checklist link to the most relevant menu. From there tooltips and experimentation should carry the learning process. Just my two cents.
@@BlindiRL ah that makes sense, I thought it did sound like tarn, but I was doing two things at once haha. Either way, I'm gonna be out here dwarf fortress for everyone I know when it releases :)
For a tutorial, I feel like a highly scripted, pre-generated world would be the best. Have every aspect of it controlled down to start location and events that occur. Pop-up windows can explain the basics, while giving new players the ability to get a feel for all the windows, tabs, functions, etc. After all that is completed, it can set the player loose to either start their own world or continue uninterrupted in the tutorial world.
I agree this is the best option, its not hard from a coding perspective, and gives the devs the ability to control and add to it as features are added. But they are against it as blind said.
@@marcbennett9232 well how hard it is would probably depend alot on how their game is written. Since basically all df is generated randomly I don't suspect they have particularly good ways to script gameplay events. But who knows.
A million people in here have already said this, but I want to weigh in as someone who has been too intimidated by the ascii version to jump in: the thing I’ve always been most interested in is the fortress mode, so I am totally in the “release once fortress mode is ready” camp. Especially if they’re having _any_ trouble financially! Take my damn money!
I exclusively play Fortress Mode. A basic tutorial could just be tooltips instead. That's how some games do it. They don't force you, but just have a small notice that could either bring you to a codex entry or just as a reminder. Edit: I've always looked at Loyalty cascades as a gang war.
Great to see both brothers on this one and hear both of their perspectives. Their dynamic of 2 brothers just trying to entertain each other is very cool, and is what makes this project so special. In general, a great discussion and it seems like they're setting hard, realistic cutoff points for the premium release.
I haven't watched much of the video yet. Two hours is intimidating. But i saw a comment with suggestions for the tutorial and figured I'd add my two cents: Might be nice for it to be similar to Minecraft's tutorial. Where it non-forcefully recommends an action like "press d to start mining" or "use < and > to change z level" and then when you finish one it moves on to the next until the fortress has at least a farm and a still and maybe a bed and they've edited a dwarf's labours. I may be wrong but i feel like that might be enough tutorial to make it possible to play dwarf fortress without an outside tutorial.
I have always loved "playing"(im trash but i try) adventure mode... never actually tried fort (ironic, right?) But when the game comes in steam i would definitely buy it! Even if that means waiting to be a crab man
Same, this is what I love about this game. There are so many details that even after years of playing, I'm still learning or discovering game mechanics. There's so much depth in both modes, and hope Adventure mode keeps on getting updated. Makes me wonder if we could build a lodge at some point as an adventurer.
The big problem about bins that I think Tarn is still unaware about is that stockpiles that have containers will not *give* to a linked stockpile unless the container is completely full. So there is basically *no way* to transfer items from a stockpile with containers allowed in it. This is important for distributing items with different qualities.
If they're gonna put in a classic mode then only a "finished" fortress mode for now should be fine, as they work on the game. The boost of income should help too.
The whole Meph stuff yeah, really threw a wrench in the works but I am super looking forward to hopefully being able to contribute with bug reports etc.
14:00 I did snoop around recently in the game files of some game running on electron (i.e. javascript and node, I think). I wanted to disable the steam api, but was unable to do so.
I originally thought that waiting with release would be the best course of action. But I've lately changed my mind. I'll gladly pay premium for this, and only this game in ""early access"". I can wait with Adventure mode, no problem.
Steam workshop is seperate from their networking library. You can have steam workshop on a singleplayer game. Their api's are also very clean and easy to understand; so I wouldn't expect that to be any issue.
While I’m more interested for adventure mode (I watched play troughs, read the wiki and read stories, but I have yet to really get into the game*), I’d definitively buy the game early just for the fortress mode to support the brothers, even if it means waiting for adventure mode!
hearing them talking about problems with ASCII version because of space restrictions and lack of glyphs makes me really wonder if it's possible at all to switch to Unicode or maybe somehow support multiple codepages (something like using 2 bytes per symbol where the first is the codepage and the 2nd is a symbol on that codepage... which would be close to UTF16 now that I think about it).
@@BlindiRL I have absolutely zero doubt Tarn did think about this problem and probably has some solutions in mind. I'm just curious what they would be (couldn't find anything related on the Internet - probably didn't try hard enough).
I could barely figure out adventure mode as is. So, all of my entertainment came from fortress mode. I'm sure with lots of improvements it would be fun but otherwise releasing it with just fortress mode would be plenty fun enough!
If they check Jonas Tylorel videos, or come in contact with him they will be able to get some help regarding porting to steam. In order to make their lives a bit easier.
Release the game before adventure mode! It'll be a nice treat to new players who end up getting hooked on fortress mode, plus so many people just play fortress so I'm sure it would be understood.
It's actually kind of funny. The developer of rim has talked about how he thinks achievements are counteractive to storytelling. I think that's the least counter storytelling thing he could put in that game.
Liking GIANT COCKATIEL TEETH? Terrifying eldritch items, I bet that dwarves child will grow up into a Necromancer with vampire minions and a legion of hand crafted servant races. Among them toothy birds.
Bar fights talk and the whole crime system made me wonder if a system of weregeld-like fines can be implemented, although it's gonna lead to the whole dwarven personal finances and property system... Which would also be dope! Just imagine dwarves shopping and trading, getting wages and owning personal stuff, paying fines and taxes... This is not in the game yet, right?
Why don't we have any actual in-game atomsmasher item? Like a powered trash compactor? Or a crematorium to get rid of corpses? It's a huge hassle needing to build an atom smasher (and also feels like abusing a glitch).
Ive been really enjoying the interrogations and counterintelligence elements of justice gameplay now. Its really fun to root out criminal networks and stuff :)
they better not make us wait a year for adventure mode, im not even playing adventure mode 😂
2 ปีที่แล้ว +2
They should do a paying Steam pre-release. I would gladly pay for that to support their awesome game. In return just give me unique perks like dwarves who don’t insist on jumping over fortifications in the middle of an invasion 😝
46:55 : Surprised you censored that and they cared so much about it. I'm pretty sure everyone assumed even if it wasn't announced... but yeah. I always find those announcements and stuff silly. Like why wait to announce something so fundamental? /shrug
@@BlindiRL : Ah, I'm not in the community much but I'm a game developer so I found it very odd. I looked up the original Twitch video just to hear what it was... /shrug Dunno who didn't know the game would eventually have music too.
I just donated $100 on their Bay 12 website. Its amazing what a fun game comes from the imagination of these two guys. Its a shame they haven't been able to profit more from their contributions.
Had a fort with a open air tavern, no walls, just a big roof so everyone could watch the soldiers fight the incoming goblin army. Was going great till a lil 6 year old dwarf girl, euphotic from her recent drink decides to join the battle. It did not end well for her, no other causality's tho
How can I help to speed up release? I am a normal viewer. Never prayed before. If you want me to kneel at the pc at 9pm every day for a minute only so this game release someday I might consider it :D All the love from Germany to the brothers! Hope they are doing good atm.
Kitfox must be really, really patient. Other publishing houses would be taking them to court over these delays. Of course, artist drama. But these guys need to go ahead and release Fortress/Legends mode then patch in the Adventure mode support. I know there's adventure mode fans, but let's face it. Adventure mode needs MUCH more work than just menus and could chase people off. The money would be significant even after Kitfox's and Steam's cut. And, if Tarn/Zach can get over the possessiveness of the code, could hire people that are just as passionate and talented as they are to help them bring stuff like myth/magic/economy stuff to life in a span that isn't measured by the time we are in nursing homes.
i agree but at the same time we've all seen what happens when money comes in and then its sourced out. it loses all gameplay and becomes a money thing. tarn has chase4d his passion for so long that hes the one guy out there i believe (after watchign him speak) that will do this the right way and has my support however he decides to do this. also, this is his code... somethign he has brought up from the ground, one of the innovators of procedural generation in gaming worlds... this guy is a genius and we are just experiencing the home grown talent through the game
Who and about what actually Kitfox should take to curt? xD As for your second point - hire them with what cash? xD As far as I've seen on their patreon their full monthly income is about the size of single senior dev income in US.
@@rpgtactics8057 this very very substantial cash flow is not only one time cashflow but also theoretical. Frankly they would have to sell at least the amount No Man Sky or Rimworld numbers to be able to sustain team for any reasonable time on that alone. You are also glossing over the whole problem of running a company of multiple people, maintaining personnel long term, hiring processes...Its not only possessiveness of code but willingness to deal with this shithole of epic proportions that need to be overcome.
100% release without adventure mode. It makes no sense to sit on a complete game mode for the sole purpose of haing a "complete game". Games nowadays keep getting new features all the time. Adventure mode will just become the next milestone.
![ทุกครั้งที่หลับตา (Lucid Dream) - AYLA's [ Official MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4i1OBAQyv58/mqdefault.jpg)
Hearing Tarn and Zach talk about their need of money, while not urgent, has really pushed me hard into the camp of releasing when the fortress mode is finished. If that's the case, why are we even discussing this? I sincerely doubt releasing the Steam version without adventure mode will do anything at all to the PR reception of it. People who are new will not be offended or anything. People who play fortress mode will be happy and buy the game. The Adams family will see a level of security that they well deserve, and the people who are so solidly in the 'I won't touch it unless it has adventure mode' can wait to buy it at the same time they'd be buying it anyways if it got delayed for adventure mode. I literally don't understand why this is even a discussion.
I totally agree.
"The adams family" dunno why, but that just makes me laugh.
@@ManCheat2 dun dun duh dah *snap* *snap*
If anything, I would make the argument that adventure mode muddies the identity of the game from the layman's perspective.
Us more medium to long term players get its role in the DF ecosystem but I do defo remember being so confused about what it was and why it existed in the first place.
Adventure mode is not a fully fledged RPG. Players going into it expecting it to follow the normal RPG trappings will be sorely disappointed.
Honestly, from the perspective of a new new player (IE new to even the idea of DF) would be better served with adventure mode's initial absence.
On that point too, have they voiced any opinions about a patreon type deal? I think there's many in the community who would love to xhuck some $$$ to help with medical bills or whatever helps them be more comfortable in their situation.
Here is my suggestion for what could work in terms of tutorialisation.
We already have solid factors that separate what makes a stronghold different from an outpost etc.
What I suggest is simply a checklist of things that you need to do in order to get the next fortress size/renown level.
It gives the player medium term goals, it doesn't force the player into any particular behaviour patterns but it also gives them an idea of what to be thinking about in terms of progression.
You could even have each element of the checklist link to the most relevant menu. From there tooltips and experimentation should carry the learning process.
Just my two cents.
Though tarn may be older, he's living the millennial life. Broken down cars, high rent. Feel for you my man's. Much love
Zachs broken car, Tarns high rent. Tarn was forced to move last year D: Bloody sucks.
@@BlindiRL ah that makes sense, I thought it did sound like tarn, but I was doing two things at once haha.
Either way, I'm gonna be out here dwarf fortress for everyone I know when it releases :)
Hope DF coming to steam helps them out a lot.
For a tutorial, I feel like a highly scripted, pre-generated world would be the best. Have every aspect of it controlled down to start location and events that occur. Pop-up windows can explain the basics, while giving new players the ability to get a feel for all the windows, tabs, functions, etc. After all that is completed, it can set the player loose to either start their own world or continue uninterrupted in the tutorial world.
They are rather against that just from a design perspective.
@@BlindiRL Yeah, I imagine it'd take a lot of work to program all of that.
I agree this is the best option, its not hard from a coding perspective, and gives the devs the ability to control and add to it as features are added. But they are against it as blind said.
@@marcbennett9232 well how hard it is would probably depend alot on how their game is written. Since basically all df is generated randomly I don't suspect they have particularly good ways to script gameplay events. But who knows.
Or even allow modders to make tutorials. I dunno how much mod-ablilty will be allowed in these games, though.
im in favor of helping the developers of a great game. it sounds like releasing dwarf mode first will help the team financially and im all for that.
Yea Agreed.
Yeah my buck is totally prepared for this
A million people in here have already said this, but I want to weigh in as someone who has been too intimidated by the ascii version to jump in: the thing I’ve always been most interested in is the fortress mode, so I am totally in the “release once fortress mode is ready” camp. Especially if they’re having _any_ trouble financially! Take my damn money!
I exclusively play Fortress Mode. A basic tutorial could just be tooltips instead. That's how some games do it. They don't force you, but just have a small notice that could either bring you to a codex entry or just as a reminder.
Edit: I've always looked at Loyalty cascades as a gang war.
Totally relate to the username discussion. Mine comes from a 30 years ago college RPG character based on a nickname based on a Rutger Hauer movie.
Great to see both brothers on this one and hear both of their perspectives. Their dynamic of 2 brothers just trying to entertain each other is very cool, and is what makes this project so special. In general, a great discussion and it seems like they're setting hard, realistic cutoff points for the premium release.
Happy to help! I love providing conversations to people interested in listening.
I haven't watched much of the video yet. Two hours is intimidating. But i saw a comment with suggestions for the tutorial and figured I'd add my two cents:
Might be nice for it to be similar to Minecraft's tutorial. Where it non-forcefully recommends an action like "press d to start mining" or "use < and > to change z level" and then when you finish one it moves on to the next until the fortress has at least a farm and a still and maybe a bed and they've edited a dwarf's labours.
I may be wrong but i feel like that might be enough tutorial to make it possible to play dwarf fortress without an outside tutorial.
I don't really think it'll need much with all the quality of life stuff tbh.
I have always loved "playing"(im trash but i try) adventure mode... never actually tried fort (ironic, right?) But when the game comes in steam i would definitely buy it! Even if that means waiting to be a crab man
Same, this is what I love about this game. There are so many details that even after years of playing, I'm still learning or discovering game mechanics. There's so much depth in both modes, and hope Adventure mode keeps on getting updated. Makes me wonder if we could build a lodge at some point as an adventurer.
@@Lexyvil it would be cool! Like settling down making "camps"
You can build a fort as an adventurer.
@@BlindiRL :0 i had NO IDEA!!!
@@SaltyCrabOfficial Now you know :D
Love the mention of the Myth series. That series was way ahead of its time and holds a special place in my heart.
The big problem about bins that I think Tarn is still unaware about is that stockpiles that have containers will not *give* to a linked stockpile unless the container is completely full. So there is basically *no way* to transfer items from a stockpile with containers allowed in it. This is important for distributing items with different qualities.
If they're gonna put in a classic mode then only a "finished" fortress mode for now should be fine, as they work on the game. The boost of income should help too.
I'm mad this alert reached me half an hour late but I'm loving this.
TH-cam be like that. Discord is faster.
The whole Meph stuff yeah, really threw a wrench in the works but I am super looking forward to hopefully being able to contribute with bug reports etc.
More then I expected honestly.
I may have mentioned this before, but Tarn's voice is quite reminiscent of H. Jon Benjamin.
I think that one is new, at least to myself.
I would happily pay full price for an early access fortress mode and nothing else
It'll be a normal release no Early access. It'll be nice once people realize this.
@@BlindiRL fair point, so I will rephrase it as "please take my money so I can play whatever they have now" ahaha
@@graemecondon6038 Yeah im the same way, shit I might even buy multiple copies to give to friends cause i need my boys to be rewarded for their work.
@@lazerrhino Exactly, I've been playing DF for over a decade now, everyone I know will get a copy for Christmas if it's out in time :P
I can’t wait, the only thing holding me back from finally starting to play this wonderful game is for it to be on the steam store.
not for a LONG time
We'll see.
Sad ):
Well if they are finally talking about potential time frames for release, they got to be closing in on it.
@@ethanhoward389 they are.
14:00 I did snoop around recently in the game files of some game running on electron (i.e. javascript and node, I think). I wanted to disable the steam api, but was unable to do so.
missed most best question, how dorf dig?
Thanks so much for doing this, Tarn, Zach, and Blind!
Thanks for helping moderate chat.
I originally thought that waiting with release would be the best course of action. But I've lately changed my mind. I'll gladly pay premium for this, and only this game in ""early access"". I can wait with Adventure mode, no problem.
It won't be categorized as early access but yea I agree.
Tarn saying "You just fucked up" needs to be a meme.
Clip it and go nuts.
My wallet is ready, drop that release date please!
Same.
Great stuff thank you guys, cant wait to play the Steam version!
Same!
Steam workshop is seperate from their networking library. You can have steam workshop on a singleplayer game. Their api's are also very clean and easy to understand; so I wouldn't expect that to be any issue.
Hope so.
@@BlindiRL it's publicly available on github with some very good documentation too. I've been researching what they offer for another project.
Hope the release gives them the much deserved financial stability, these guys are awesome, wishing for the best
Same here!
While I’m more interested for adventure mode (I watched play troughs, read the wiki and read stories, but I have yet to really get into the game*), I’d definitively buy the game early just for the fortress mode to support the brothers, even if it means waiting for adventure mode!
hearing them talking about problems with ASCII version because of space restrictions and lack of glyphs makes me really wonder if it's possible at all to switch to Unicode or maybe somehow support multiple codepages (something like using 2 bytes per symbol where the first is the codepage and the 2nd is a symbol on that codepage... which would be close to UTF16 now that I think about it).
Pretty much most of this has been brought up before. I'm sure that they have solutions in mind.
@@BlindiRL I have absolutely zero doubt Tarn did think about this problem and probably has some solutions in mind. I'm just curious what they would be (couldn't find anything related on the Internet - probably didn't try hard enough).
Cheers for the timestamps
The least I can do
Really want to know what got beeped around the 47:00 mark. My two thoughts seem unlikely.
Just gonna go ahead and picture them saying sh*t for the time being.
lol
Based on the twitch chat I think it might be related to music but idk. Im sure they'll make a big exciting announcement about it soon
1:32:25 please please pleeeease tell me the whole 30 minutes of him playing still exist somewhere
I just want him to do a music stream. I would pay so much money to see that.
I could barely figure out adventure mode as is. So, all of my entertainment came from fortress mode. I'm sure with lots of improvements it would be fun but otherwise releasing it with just fortress mode would be plenty fun enough!
If they check Jonas Tylorel videos, or come in contact with him they will be able to get some help regarding porting to steam. In order to make their lives a bit easier.
I'm sure they are well aware of what they need already.
"There's too much thinking going on"
Just like real life.
Release the game before adventure mode! It'll be a nice treat to new players who end up getting hooked on fortress mode, plus so many people just play fortress so I'm sure it would be understood.
one of the things that always bugs me about rimworld is there are no steam achievements. So so hyped to get these df cheevos
It's actually kind of funny. The developer of rim has talked about how he thinks achievements are counteractive to storytelling. I think that's the least counter storytelling thing he could put in that game.
Liking GIANT COCKATIEL TEETH? Terrifying eldritch items, I bet that dwarves child will grow up into a Necromancer with vampire minions and a legion of hand crafted servant races.
Among them toothy birds.
I mean it depends on whether or not they dreamed of ruling the world or not or bathing the world in chaos.
Bar fights talk and the whole crime system made me wonder if a system of weregeld-like fines can be implemented, although it's gonna lead to the whole dwarven personal finances and property system... Which would also be dope! Just imagine dwarves shopping and trading, getting wages and owning personal stuff, paying fines and taxes... This is not in the game yet, right?
Why don't we have any actual in-game atomsmasher item? Like a powered trash compactor?
Or a crematorium to get rid of corpses?
It's a huge hassle needing to build an atom smasher (and also feels like abusing a glitch).
I heard that was "planned" at one point but never happened. I know theres a nice little mod for a crematorium if you dig a bit.
Ive been really enjoying the interrogations and counterintelligence elements of justice gameplay now. Its really fun to root out criminal networks and stuff :)
For a second I thought you were saying I did a good job interrogating the brothers :D
@@BlindiRL Well, now that you mention it I think you did!
they better not make us wait a year for adventure mode, im not even playing adventure mode 😂
They should do a paying Steam pre-release. I would gladly pay for that to support their awesome game. In return just give me unique perks like dwarves who don’t insist on jumping over fortifications in the middle of an invasion 😝
That would probably cause delays rather then actually help. If you want to pay for df rn you can do that on patreon.
46:55 : Surprised you censored that and they cared so much about it. I'm pretty sure everyone assumed even if it wasn't announced... but yeah. I always find those announcements and stuff silly. Like why wait to announce something so fundamental? /shrug
I censored it more as a comedy bit.
@@BlindiRL : Ah, I'm not in the community much but I'm a game developer so I found it very odd. I looked up the original Twitch video just to hear what it was... /shrug
Dunno who didn't know the game would eventually have music too.
Why did they not have a murder charge for regular dwarves years ago?
I've been wondering that for years.
In dwarf society, killing someone is like eating one grape at the store. Not allowed, but come on, who's gonna do something?
I just donated $100 on their Bay 12 website. Its amazing what a fun game comes from the imagination of these two guys. Its a shame they haven't been able to profit more from their contributions.
I'm sure they will profit heavily once this version releases. Thanks for helping them stay funded!
Had a fort with a open air tavern, no walls, just a big roof so everyone could watch the soldiers fight the incoming goblin army. Was going great till a lil 6 year old dwarf girl, euphotic from her recent drink decides to join the battle. It did not end well for her, no other causality's tho
The kids in my forts love playing in the emergency werebeast lockdown room
That can't be good for their health.
Support comment
awesome as always :)
Thank you! Cheers!
They really should just release fort mode when it's ready
Just release it now I’ll buy it even if I can only open the menu
If you ware so ready to part with money they do have a patreon. I would like to note I also like plants.
@@BlindiRL
Tutorial should be in a default world that has forts to reclaim that show different parts of fortress life.
I don't think they are going that route.
What tileset is that?
Its a custom version of Kruggsmashes. cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/569337015703699456/804504541818257458/tileset4.bmp
I am fine with only fortress mode
I'm leaning that way yea.
@@BlindiRL yea everything else is basically early access anyway or a little tattered. It is better PR to only have fortress
Is the world generation slowed down for the Podcast or is that the real time it takes?
That is real time. But I have everything cranked up to maximum. You can generate a world in under a minute.
@@BlindiRL I thought it was only just my computer who coudn´t handle it.
Looks like it´s a feature🤣
@@larzkruber822 it does lots of calculations! Like at least 20 or 30!
Is their a way to contribute
www.bay12games.com/support.html
Please let us do dwarf things now!
Dorf dig deep and sudden facemelt from vomit monster.
How can I help to speed up release? I am a normal viewer. Never prayed before. If you want me to kneel at the pc at 9pm every day for a minute only so this game release someday I might consider it :D
All the love from Germany to the brothers! Hope they are doing good atm.
Just hang in there for another year tops.
Is kick starter possible?
why? you can fund them on patreon. Kickstarter would be totally pointless.
Ah I see.
Since you "Beeped" out a part of interview, I'd like to point out, that it may be reasonable to also blur the chat for a minute or so :)
Nah. I did the beeping for fun. Its still totally hearable in the 3 clips and vod on twitch.
OK what was the bleep topic?
I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT D:
The bleep is for the coders they have on the brain-chip release.
I think it was e-girls
I really just want to listen to Tarn Adams talk about Dark Souls.
Tbh I'd watch him stream dark souls.
Damn beeps
2 more years. Remind me.
Eh, maybe half that.
Kitfox must be really, really patient. Other publishing houses would be taking them to court over these delays. Of course, artist drama. But these guys need to go ahead and release Fortress/Legends mode then patch in the Adventure mode support. I know there's adventure mode fans, but let's face it. Adventure mode needs MUCH more work than just menus and could chase people off. The money would be significant even after Kitfox's and Steam's cut. And, if Tarn/Zach can get over the possessiveness of the code, could hire people that are just as passionate and talented as they are to help them bring stuff like myth/magic/economy stuff to life in a span that isn't measured by the time we are in nursing homes.
i agree but at the same time we've all seen what happens when money comes in and then its sourced out. it loses all gameplay and becomes a money thing.
tarn has chase4d his passion for so long that hes the one guy out there i believe (after watchign him speak) that will do this the right way and has my support however he decides to do this. also, this is his code... somethign he has brought up from the ground, one of the innovators of procedural generation in gaming worlds...
this guy is a genius and we are just experiencing the home grown talent through the game
Who and about what actually Kitfox should take to curt? xD
As for your second point - hire them with what cash? xD As far as I've seen on their patreon their full monthly income is about the size of single senior dev income in US.
@@MrElrood Hire with Steam release cash, which could be very, very substantial.
@@rpgtactics8057 this very very substantial cash flow is not only one time cashflow but also theoretical.
Frankly they would have to sell at least the amount No Man Sky or Rimworld numbers to be able to sustain team for any reasonable time on that alone.
You are also glossing over the whole problem of running a company of multiple people, maintaining personnel long term, hiring processes...Its not only possessiveness of code but willingness to deal with this shithole of epic proportions that need to be overcome.
It's not a delay if you haven't announced the release date, right?
would gladly pay whatever retail price for what they have done right now lol. could care less about adventure mode.
$20 when it releases
Wait, they lost their graphics?
One of their artists was removed from the position and due to issues with their previous work. A lot of the art had to be redone.
Oooh thats a shame. Thanks for the info
@@jonathanshihadeh no problem
Release Fortress Mode. Let us give you money
You already can give them money tho.
I'd pay for early release
Alright.
100% release without adventure mode. It makes no sense to sit on a complete game mode for the sole purpose of haing a "complete game". Games nowadays keep getting new features all the time. Adventure mode will just become the next milestone.
Yea :P
Just do fortress mode it's already been fucking ages.
No need to be rude.