DO THIS to stop ruminating about the narcissist
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 พ.ค. 2024
- ORDER MY NYT BESTSELLING BOOK 📖 "IT'S NOT YOU"
smarturl.it/not-you
JOIN MY HEALING PROGRAM
doctor-ramani.teachable.com/p...
JOIN THE DR. RAMANI NETWORK
www.drramaninetwork.com
GET INFO ABOUT MY UPCOMING PROGRAM FOR THERAPISTS
forms.gle/1RRUz41eWswjw63o6
SIGN UP FOR MY MAILING LIST
forms.gle/Bv9GNuMSR55PKTjQ6
LISTEN TO MY NEW PODCAST "NAVIGATING NARCISSISM"
Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...
Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/2fUMDuT...
Stitcher: www.stitcher.com/podcast/how-...
iHeart Radio: www.iheart.com/podcast/1119-n...
DISCLAIMER: THIS INFORMATION IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR CLINICAL CARE. PLEASE CONSULT A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER FOR GUIDANCE SPECIFIC TO YOUR CASE. THIS VIDEO DISCUSSES NARCISSISM IN GENERAL.
THE VIDEO DOES NOT REFER TO ANY SPECIFIC PERSON, AND SHOULD NOT BE USED TO REFER TO ANY SPECIFIC PERSON, AS HAVING NARCISSISM. PERMISSION IS NOT GRANTED TO LINK TO OR REPOST THIS VIDEO, ESPECIALLY TO SUPPORT AN ALLEGATION THAT THE MAKERS OF THIS VIDEO BELIEVE, OR SUPPORT A CLAIM, THAT A SPECIFIC PERSON IS A NARCISSIST. THAT WOULD BE AN UNAUTHORIZED MISUSE OF THE VIDEO AND THE INFORMATION FEATURED IN IT.
![🔴 [TRỰC TIẾP] Tứ Xuyên (Trung Quốc) VS U20 Thái Lan | Cúp VTV9 - Bình Điền 2024 | JET STUDIO](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bguJ41PcW0c/mqdefault.jpg)
Love this 🙏 3 years free. My tip is music. When your energy shifts badly into the repeated arguments in your head , endless justifications of why this was horrific, , take control and change the energy, put on some music, the radio, play some music, sing!!! Even if you can’t. Music is fantastic for healing. Love and light from Scotland 🏴
So true across the planet! Love and light from Holland🇳🇱
Good tip!!
My tip would be jogging and walking.
Whenever my memories take over i go for a walk, sometimes as many as 25 km and i feel better after.
Music is a huge coping skill for me too
Miss Carolyn, I Do,,do this! Especially if I find myself doing chores an my mind wonders to my 35yr.marriage with my X that he destroyed. I quickly go to my radio an turn it on....and all of sudden I'm humming/ singing an *Not Thinkin* about what he did to me.
After a 42-year marriage I walked away from my narcissistic spouse. I ruminated for TWO years. So hats off to the readers here: don’t give up. My decision was to LEARN new things: how to sail, work in animal shelters, volunteer to get tax training to assist low income families, learning how to make mosaic tabletops. New learning brings purpose, new connections. You CAN do this. Good luck to all.
Great advice, thank you for instilling hope; healing happens when we let it and we all adapt differently…I’m 1.5years post D and also ruminating but not remotely as before…❤️🩹
❤after 22 years I'm heading on that direction as well. Loving myself for real thus time! Congrats 🎉
So happy for you that you left and found so many other positive things in your life to divert your energy into!
This is excellent advice, and exactly what I intended to do when I ended my 39 year marriage in March 2020 😅. Unfortunately, the global pandemic derailed my original plans, and I spent an awful lot of time on the sofa with my cats, ruminating for hours on end!
I agree that trying to keep busy with new activities and challenges, and learning something new is very helpful in redirecting your thoughts. Gradual reduction in rumination is an improvement, and over time, I find that I have felt less distressed and more able to move on with my life.
This is such great advice...thank you!
I’m pretty sure we ruminate because we need our experiences to make sense. Twelve years of ruminating later I can finally say I do not ruminate any more. I understand what happened. Amongst other reasons thanks to this channel. Thank you dr. Ramani!
You're absolutely right. I'm currently in a toxic work situation (it might be strong to call those involved narcissists, but certainly there are some shared traits), and it's so tempting to figure out WHY they do what they do. I have to start getting over any expectation that I'll ever figure it out. I probably won't. I can only know my own reality. But I think as an empathetic person especially, I want to try understanding why someone would say or do certain things. Because that's the type of person they are. Or maybe there is a deeper reason, but honestly, even if there is, that doesn't erase how I feel about it. We can only know our own realities.
ETA: Which isn't to say we can't be empathetic. For instance, I do think the people involved are under a lot of stress, and I do understand that and can keep that in mind. But then that's what I need to do, as opposed to ruminating on all of the layers. "They had a bad day and took it out on me." Nice? No. Worth losing sleep over? No.
Thank you, Ellie.❤ You've described what my rumination represents and feels like perfectly, a deep desire to make sense of it..
Congratulations on overcoming this hurdle in healing! 🎉 I hope my ability to do the same comes along one day too.. ❤🦋🕊
I'm doing this too because the discovery is recent. I don't want to keep doing this. It is robbing me of sleep and everything else.
The thing is, I don't think it's ever going to make sense. It's like a tornado. The tornado doesn't need a reason or justification: it just does what it does. destroys what it destroys.
Dealing with this dam ruminating 🤦♀️ making sense of it all blows my mind, and then the races begin...
I think you are right about this. I took a screenshot of your comment to stick in my journal. Thank you Ellie and thanks Dr. Ramani for all your work.
Constantly, unwillingly thinking about what happened to you is a classic symptom of PTSD.
Yes. Absolutely.
One thing that has worked really well for me is making a voice recording when I am wanting to really rant and rave about some rumination . I ruminate into the recording and then I listen back to it and it’s fascinating to me how much empathy I feel for myself, and listening to myself. It’s almost like it’s a missing Link… might not be right for everyone but it sure is a great tool for me. Thank you for your work.!!
Good Idea. I never thought of that
I've literally started doing this and it really freeing. I'm loving it!
I do believe I will try this! Thank you for sharing!
Writing it down has the same affect :) just incase you don't want to speak. Sometimes using physical words can be exhausting so writing can work better for some.
Interesting... I've never thought of that before, maybe I will try it out...
Yeah, The rumination is similar to PTSD. It's constantly scenario running to figure out how to stop the abuse from reoccurring. It's a survival technique if the person is still in your life. if they aren't you will be left with the fear that others will be similar or the Narcissist will return.
or that the narc will find you!
My fear is that they treat their next partner much better, because in their head that partner is wife/husband material. They are beautiful,rich, powerful,smart etc... That is the ideal partner for a narcissist. They treat them with respect and love
@@stardust5278 its always extractive. But yeah, the more effective the codependence the more ideal they will be able to make it look
It’s most definitely is firm of pstd
how do you deal with it?
Ruminating makes me nuts. I've gotten to the point that the minute any thought of him, what he said or did pops into my head I say out loud NO! I refuse to think about it! and I immediately delve into something else. So far it has helped.
I have a close friend who allowed me to ruminate about my ex-husband after he left me. I would catch myself repeatedly going down that path and not really listening to her and supporting her. I finally apologized for monopolizing our time together and explained that going over my anger/hurt/frustration with a safe person was very much like taking a Brillo pad and scrubbing the cruddy layers of pain out of my soul. I valued her friendship so much that I worked to heal almost as much for her as for me. And now I'm here for her.
💕
I do Thought Interruption. If I’m ruminating I stop 🛑 and insert a phrase like, “How does this help or serve me ?” I’ll say this phrase over and over again until it breaks the trigger or ruminating thoughts. Or I’ll insert a prayer 🙏. This is what helps me.
I don't think I can do this... it's too hard
Any reaction to PureOCD is like urticaria, skin rash - it gets worse when you scratch it.
If you leave it be, it still has itch but it calms and sooths down on its own in its own time.
Jung said what you resist, persist.
Also, by nitpicking our thoughts we signal our brain that we are faulty, inept, stupid, unworthy, in danger, weak, abnormal - basically we are spiraling down into deep pits of toxic shame and mental instability. Our thoughts are not sick, our thought patterns are not abnormal and no, we are not weak.
What we experience is re-traumatization and it is caused by abnormal people, psychopaths who act like normal human beings and introject their illness into our self pathology attempts.
Our rumination is totally normal reaction to immensely abnormal, twisted, inept, weak, psychopathic, fake, toxic people around us.
That’s good. I’ll remember this
Good advise
Great idea!
My wife has heard my rumination rants a thousand times and she still listens and doesn't complain.
Hubby does same for me. ♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️
Same here. So grateful for my wife and trust me, I tell her so.
My husband too ❤
This is very helpful. I realized that in ruminating, I was defending myself, but it’s exhausting. The relationship needs to be over or as superficial as possible. Accept that it doesn't matter anymore. Move on. Not easy, but it’s working for me.
Thank you 😊
My 2 tips: 1-talk it out alone. This is something I've been making a point to do, regularly. Carve out time alone at home, in the car, or both and I just talk to myself, and respond to myself the way I would respond to someone I care about, saying these things. It helps me to get my head clear, work through whatever is causing the thought loop, and free my mind.
2- Write it out. Writing really helps calm down the brain.
For me, I've discovered that ruminating is a way to suppress my feelings. So I've decided to use my rumination as a trigger to say "I'm feeling hurt right now" or "I'm grieving right now" and then really try to sit with the feeling. It's helped a lot!
Thank you. That is really helpful advise to me.
@MissIncognito good luck! You got this :)
Thank you, kindly. I feel like you have touched on something. It fits. It does feel like a suppressing of sorts. I like your suggestion. It feels like then I am giving the deeper emotions acknowledgement... which is possibly what I actually need instead of ruminating.. ❤ So insightful!
@@erinseward Ruminating is often our brain’s way of trying to solve a problem, but this is one that doesn’t need solving, it just needs accepting. And we can learn to accept easier if we work through our emotions. Pete Walker coined the term “left brain dissociation”, referring to how some people like to “think” their way out of their feelings. I’m 100% one of those people! My feelings are often overwhelming so I try to avoid them by intellectualizing and over thinking. That’s what led me to this solution for ruminating!
@@meowmirrr Thank you. I think I do the same thing. This has been helpful...💛 I want to look into more of Peter's work
Rumination has a purpose -to make sense of it all - how I didn’t see it, everything that he did that he minimized, turned around to be the victim and devalued me at the end. My brain is working to understand it, make sense of my feelings and thoughts that are rejected. Questioning myself then through thinking I am able to reaffirm what is right. It’s exhausting.
Ruminating on a narcissist will never clarify or help understand that which is not understandable.
The fact you have over 1 million subscribers shows how serious and rampant this abuse is.. :(.. thank you for helping those who have endured this scenario make sense of what we experienced.
😔
“Sometimes you just have to keep playing it out until you break the cycle” wow that was very powerful
My biggest thing is, reminding myself that I am responsible for my thoughts and feelings. That in this moment, she is not making me feel this way. It is me. And only me. And the petty aspect, I tell myself, don't give her the satisfaction of allowing myself to feel like shit.
I do understand it is so hard & I thought that actually making the decision & leaving was the hard part...NOT! but we will get there
Chris, it's not you and only you. I know this is what the world wants us to believe about ourselves, but abuse imprints itself onto us in a way that we don't have control of. We can & have to move ourselves through it, but it is absolutely not your fault or your responsibility that you feel like shit. Narcissistic abuse is no joke.
I might be mistaken but I detect a hint of shame in your comment. Like you feel you shouldn't feel the way you do because it's up to you. It's not really up to you. If someone jumps out in front of your car, you will swerve. People affect other people and we can't control every reaction we have. A narcissist is basically poisoning you. Because you're a healthy person, you feel like shit after being poisoned. It's not something you can control. There's nothing wrong with you for feeling bad in response to being poisoned. It takes time to heal.
To feel like them... lol
@@thequietinside3201 I experienced the worst of the ruminating years after the horrific abuse that was physical and emotional by my only sibling, my brother. I kept my mind in a place still trying to excuse his abuse and think of him as the big brother I only wanted him to be. Finally, years later it hit me with the reality of the abuse I had endured. It took years for me to get mad. I held it in because my mother taught me to be quiet about these awful things. I am talking about his abuse of children and his attempt to murder me because I knew about it. Now, I am furious and PTSD with horrible dreams. A human being cannot abuse themselves by taking responsibility for feeling what comes with abuse upon them. We try things to distract in a positive way. For me it is drawing and painting. But, the whole thing should have been stopped years ago. He would have gone to jail, and that is where he should be now.
I ruminate because it reminds me how terrible the relationship was and how justified the divorce was. Ruminating keeps me from returning to that relationship.
I can dig it. I enjoy ruminating every so often. I even talk to myself giving myself advice out loud. Telling myself I will feel better soon and I can handle what's happening still having to deal with narcissist daily.
This video was extremely helpful for me. I had a narcissistic mother, husband, mother-in-law and close friend. I divorced my husband 10 years ago and went no contact on my 96 year old mother. Then I ended my friendship. I cleaned house of all the narcissists in my life and their were many. I'm an empath and a truth seer. At the age of 63 I'm finally figuring out who I am without the constant voice of a narcissist telling me who I am. I spend a lot of time ruminating these days. I'm trying to heal from all of the abuse that I've suffered from narcissists and I feel the need to recognize what they told me is not my reality. I originally thought my constant need to ruminate was dwelling in negative feelings from the past. Now, I realize that ruminating is part of the process of healing. Recognizing that many of my beliefs about myself were influenced by narcissists who did not have my greater good in mind and in fact were doing everything they could to tear me dow, is part of my healing journey. I'm so grateful to Dr. Ramani for her videos that have greatly helped me on my journey to wholeness and healing.
Good for you to get finally rid of all the narcissists in your life. 2023 is going to be my ‘big cleaning’ year too … but it hurts to let go of so many people I loved deeply … and to realize that I’ve lost so many years, not being myself and living my life to its full potential 💔
As an Empath, it hurts so much because we love and feel it all for everyone and everything so much more than most x
I’m not an Expert, but, My Cognitive Brain & My Neurological Psyche, along with my Spiritual -Self… Is Wired to “Take Clues… Puzzle pieces, & DOTS, on the Page of Life… And Figure things out! For Myself: It’s like a “primitive instinct” to Protect from Future Predators that would like to Kill my Spirit! That Primitive Intelligence that wants To: “TAKE CONTROL & BE SAFE!” So with Narcissistic People, that means… Figuring Out All TRUTH, LIES, that I thought were Truths, Manipulations, Gaslighting Events, so that I can Figure things Out. Who Am I? Why did I allow that Stuff to Happen to Me? How can I Prevent this Snare in the Future?
Feel Free to use that one for a - BOOK TITLE:
“PRIMITIVE INSTINCT!”
Subtitle: Navigating RUMINATION w/Toxic People! Much Love,
🙏🏻💛🕊🍃
Oh Connie, so glad I saw your comment...so encouraging to me...I'm 74 yrs old, never thought I could leave, but watching this channel, especially Dr Ramani I realized what he really is, & knew I had to, to save my soul ...took a good year after I knew, to find a way out...out 6mo NC, but have trouble sleeping bc when I wake in the night I start ruminating & often can't get back to sleep...I wish it were different, really thought the hardest part would be me making the decision and actually leaving, little did I know how long the road to healing would be...I hate that I do this, still giving him control and I have so few good memories...I ty so very much for showing me that it is an important part of the healing process, that it has to happen for us to fully heal...ty! We will make it! ❤️❤️❤️
I'm 63 also. I just recognized this evil 5 years ago (a female pastor narc, evil person). As I peeled the layers away I recognized the behavior in most of my family members. And possibly my late husband. That has been difficult to reconcile. I'm working on it. I ruminate to the online narc group. We are family. I've stopped talking about it to close friends. They are weary of my ruminating to them. I journal some and will increase. I kept journals of my husband's behavior. I read some entries and made me apologize. He wanted to appear perfect. Nobody is. I will continue to name the behavior and refuse it.
“it isn’t even rumination, but reality”
thank you for this!
I recently found that writing all of those voices and experiences down in a big brain dump helped my rumination. No spelling correctly, no grammar, no continuity, just a brain dump. I took each person and gave them a page. Then if another memory popped up later, I’d go back and add it. And I think handwriting was important over typing. The memories have not gone away but the takeover in my mind has subsided to mage room for new positive experiences and memories.
Thank you! 👍❤️
Good advice. I did something similar and it helped get some of the emotions,anger especially, out of my system. However, my pen nearly tore holes in my notebook 😂. I think it's time for me to do this again, as a matter of fact. Thank you for this reminder.
Love this. I like to handwrite as well. It feels more safe for some reason and it makes me feel more calm. Drawing helps a lot as well ☺️
As someone who doesn't have friends I can visit in person, Dr R has been an indispensable voice for my inner talks 🤭
Me too she saved me from more years of ABUSE !! She made me understand that it was not me
@@JJ-mh4xd yes! I feel the same way.
SAME! Her voice always finds it's way in my head when I'm doing daily reflection while I'm Journaling.
I hear ya. I'm right there with you. To feel a little less alone is incredibly helpful.
Hug
I considered my rumination to be more like an addiction. I once heard Dr Phil say the way to break an addiction is to do something that is incompatible with your addiction. I'm an avid reader, but reading wasn't enough of a distraction. But I found that listening to audiobooks worked much better. For me there's something about listening to audiobooks that pulls me more into the story, and pulls me more away from my tortuous and relentless inner thoughts. Switching to audiobooks brought me immediate relief for the first time in years.
Later I also picked up knitting, and I'm a naturally detail-oriented person. I've found that knitting the most complicated lace patterns require so much concentration that there's no more mental space left for rumination. And knitting complicated lace while also listening to audiobooks is a win-win.
But now I also sometimes knit while listening to Dr Ramani, Dr Les Carter, and a few others. 😁
Thinking of rumination as an addiction is something that never occurred to me, but it makes total sense. I’m ruminating about the many, many lies that are now apparent, and my own humiliation at being so gullible. Finding out about his cheating time and time again with the same woman, but giving him the benefit of the doubt every time and letting him back in. I got the classic empty apologies…..” I don’t know what’s wrong with me”….”I’m working on myself” etc, and stupidly believed him. I have to be honest, I think I chose to believe him because I was scared of being alone and hated the thought of him with someone else - not because I really wanted him. The other woman is also half my age, and I must say that for someone who has always embraced the aging process, this fact has devastated me. I look after myself really well, but I hate the thought that this was not enough - most men still want someone younger. This makes me (wrongly, I know) dislike myself and resent my aging body. This is what I’m mainly ruminating about, to be honest - and I’m addicted to beating myself up about it. Playing victim, I guess.
PS can you recommend any REALLY absorbing audiobooks?
N's train us to assess ourselves negatively. Many of our negative thoughts about our self-worth come straight from the N's, so those thoughts are invalid. Besides stopping the rumination I also worked on self-compassion. It was very hard work, and it took a while, but gradually I replaced every negative self-assessment with my own kind regard. And I sought out kind and caring people who could reinforce my own kind self-regard. Just remember that even when you made/make mistakes, you were/are doing your very best under very difficult circumstances.
Yes, there are men who prefer younger women, and there are also lots of men who prefer women their own age. They don't have perfect young bodies either, and they prefer a level playing field so they aren't reminded that they're not young anymore. Yes, they're out there too.
And audiobooks, yes, I have a lonnnng list 😁. Book name or series name followed by author. Hopefully you can find something that resonates... 💞
Stoneheart Trilogy - Charlie Fletcher
Inheritance Cycle Series - Christopher Paolini
Agatha Raisin Mystery Series - M C Beaton
Hamish MacBeth Mystery Series - M C Beaton
The Shape of Water - Guillermo del Toro
The War that Saved My Life - Kimberley Brubaker Bradley
The War I Finally Won - Kimberley Brubaker Bradley
Vega Jane Series - David Baldacci
Will Robie Series - David Baldacci
The House of Secrets Series - Chris Columbus
The Shoemaker's Wife - Andriana Trigiani
Big Stone Gap - Andriana Trigiani
The Mysterious Stranger - Mark Twain
Joan of Arc - Mark Twain
Pandava Series - Roshani Chokshi
The Star-Touched Queen Series - Roshani Chokshi
Gilded Wolves Series - Roshani Chokshi
Flavia de Luce Mystery Series - Alan Bradley
The Scandalous Sisterhood of Prickwillow Place - Julie Berry
The Passion of Dolssa - Julie Berry
Keys to the Kingdom Series - Garth Nix
Curiosity House Series - Lauren Oliver
H is for Hawk - Helen MacDonald
The Chronicles of Brother Cadfael Series - Ellis Peters
Game of Thrones Series
Harry Potter series
The Hobbit
The Hunger Games Series
The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe Series
@@waywardstitch8604 thank you so much. Your reply could not have come at a better time. I’m trying my absolute best to do what is suggested for recovery but I’m absolutely struggling….just forced myself to go to a Pilates class but could feel the tears welling up constantly. This has been going on for 5 years of a 30 year relationship. My husband has discarded me for the younger woman but still gaslights like you wouldn’t believe, purely so that he can maintain the appearance of a happy family. We are anything but, and this has left me and our three beautiful sons devastated and confused. He has insisted time and time again that the affair is over and I am the absolute idiot who has chosen to believe it. I hate my stupid brain now, as well as my body. I can’t believe I ignored all the signs that were glaringly obvious. All I can see in my mind now is the other woman….half my age and a triathlete. She hung around for long enough, praising him and pandering to his ego, so now she has him round her little finger. I’ve never felt so humiliated in all my life. Basically he’s done the discard but forgot to tell me - partly, I think, because he doesn’t want me to meet anyone else. He kept me around as a safety net while he developed a relationship with her. Thank you so much for the book list….I will study it tonight. I can’t tell you how much it means to me that you took the trouble to write back. Thank you again.
@@clairecole1736 My heart goes out to you so much, I had to write again, and thought carefully about what to say.
N's are good at slowly dismantling our core selves. But they're also good at convincing us to participate in our own dismantling. It's an insidious and unconscious process where we develop an addiction of gaslighting ourselves.
When we finally become aware of the N's games, and become aware of our own participation in self-harm, we're hit with a cascade of various confusing emotions we need to work through. But IMO one of the highest priorities is to start working asap to cease with self-harm, including self-blame, self-criticism, self-hatred, self-abandonment, self-eviction, self-isolation, self-neglect, etc. Just like rumination, self-gaslighting can be very hard to stop. But we must begin anyway, chipping away at all the ways we compulsively harm ourselves. One day I realized that all self-harm was a way of lying to myself, ("I do not deserve my own self-abuse!"). And I set out to find the core truth of myself beneath all the lies I had internalized. Journaling was key to that.
For me, in the beginning of turning it around it felt like trying to dig up 10 acres of land with a teaspoon. At first I couldn't fathom that I'd have any success but I just persevered out of sheer stubborness, and because I couldn't come up with an alternative solution. I went to therapy, sometimes 2-3 times a week, journaled until my hands ached, and read every relevant psychology book I could find at my library. Somewhere in that process I remembered, and then reminded myself often, that I'm a decent, kind and caring person at my core. Somehow I had lost sight of that simple truth that I used to take for granted. I also began to rid myself toxic friends, knowing that I needed to replace them with better ones. And I often drove to the park alone, and just sat in my car and sobbed. But I kept going stubbornly back to working on those 10 acres with my teaspoon... journaling, therapy, meditating, and learning to love and trust myself again.
Then much later I finally realized my problems were rooted in narcissistic abuse, and I finally feel like I'm on the downhill part healing.
There are many types of Ns but your husband sounds like a covert N, harmful in a particulary confusing way. He's still holding onto you, keeping you in confusion, because you are still valuable to him on some level. And while his young triathlete is appealing, she also is very deeply flawed, and lacking in many ways. IOW she is NOTHING compared to a woman who has stuck it out for 30 years. Please don't compare yourself unfavorably to her. You are a ROCK, no kidding.
Dr Ramani is indeed very wonderful, but if you don't know him yet, also look up Surviving Narcissism with Dr Les Carter on youtube. All his explanations about Ns are helpful but I found his vids about covert narcissism especially helpful in understanding my N sister's effect on me, how she convinced me to doubt myself, abandon myself, and lie to myself. Dr C has a way of explaining what the covert N is thinking, doing and trying to accomplish in his/her awful treatment of us. Their inner logic is so different from our own that we misread them, which is exactly what they want. Listening to Dr C's explanations of covert N's inner logic helped me even more to understand, and stop blaming myself. Every day I listen to Dr R, Dr C, and a couple of others for at least an hour, because it helps to stop me from slipping back into confusion. Every day I feel stronger, and eventually I expect to be able to hold onto my core truths without them.
My specific circumstances are very different from yours. I got out of a toxic 3-year marriage over 40 years ago, but I had to stop working because of debilitating clinical depression. It's certainly not the life I saw for myself when I joined the military as an determined and optimistic 18yo. I come from a big family of various kinds of N's, all spewing out their various types of abuses, pointing accusing fingers, playing the victim, gaslighting, invalidating, discarding, bullying, etc. I'm the only one in therapy.
I write all this to let you know that even though our lives are very different, I do know the great difficulty of getting free from the Ns, and free from our own self-abuse, and back to learning to love and trust ourselves again.
Hopefully I've offered something here that is helpful. I wish you the best of luck on your healing journey, and FWIW just know that this stranger on the internet has high hopes for your greatest success. 🤗 💞
Ruminating (on trauma at least) is your mind's attempt to force you to process something. If you keep coming back to the same thing, then you haven't processed it well enough to make it ACTUALLY FIT in your picture of the world. You still find it disturbing and incongruent, so you keep coming back to it. Ignoring it won't make it fit any better, and you'll revisit it until it makes sense, which will make it finally uninteresting. Often what you need is to talk about it with someone, they'll help you reshape your picture of what it all means. Even just by listening without objection, they can help you validate your understanding of what's real.
Very good description of why we ruminate. When I understood it, half of the healing was done
it's terrible... the ghosts of the "relationship", the absurdities, the third person of the triangulations, the uncovered promiscuity, all the horrors... come back and come back, until they are placed in a coffin and buried forever
Sexlessness. Sharing a bed with someone who doesn’t acknowledge you are a sexual being hurts so much. I was in a sexless marriage for years. Being a woman with a high libido, I felt inadequate. Worst I feel invisible. The man who was “supposed” to want me, just didn’t. We talked about it many times, more than I can recall now. It was always me. I wanted too much - once a week was too much for him. I didn’t initiate - he was always complaining of headaches, stomaches, always stressed, always tired. I was too sexual - when being subtle doesn’t work, what is next? Explicitly saying I wanted sex. Oh but then it was not appropriate. Conversations would end up with him saying he didn’t feel desired or I made him feel emasculated because he didn’t want sex as much as I did. Yeah, it was always me. I could never win. While we were dating we would have a decent amount of sex, it was good. The first huge red flag was not having sex in our honeymoon - which I ignored. It rapidly decrease to once a week, then every other week. Years gone by it was months in between, by the time we divorced it was over a year with no sex. I cried myself to sleep more times that I can count. I didn’t understand what was wrong with me. Was I that undesirable? Was I repulsive? After those conversations, I just stopped trying, initiating, mentioning sex. We were still loving - holding hands, hugging, kissing - but sex was off the table. He then cheated on me. Swore he had sex only 4 times in a year (or more) long affair. It didn’t matter. For years my self worth was damaged by him, years of low self esteem, years of feeling less of a woman, the marriage that was more than over, waiting in hospice, really ended. Funny how things are, I asked him for a divorce, he manipulated me into staying, next day his infidelity came to light. I was out as soon as I could. Best thing of my life. Additionally, That feeling when your partner cheated and you don't have the courage to leave him / her so you just death with the pain and live everyday asking questions about your worth. This pain is different from the cheating one_living and seeing him everywhere anticipating when he or she do it again. The best thing is to hire a private investigator Digitalinvestigate@gmail. com to help you spy on their cellphone remotely just like he did for me...
I’m so sorry that happened to you.
Happened to me more than once with narcs. I'm a woman who WANTED sex. Basically if you enjoy it they destroy it. Whatever IT is.
This is a spam bot, report it
I've seen this same message before. Definitely a spam bot with the message at the end.
This channel seems to be from the perspective of women mostly , but the struggles and strategies seem to translate pretty well for a man living in constant narcissistic abuse. The relationship ended 10 years ago but our daughter is 13 and that offers her plenty of ways to abuse me by manipulating the custody, and ive faced discrimination as an unmarried father Florida legal system could possibly make things worse. So I just try to armor plate my emotions and withstand every Christmas and birthday as the abuse ramps up leaving me with so much PTSD that I'm dying inside. Her case of NPD is very deeply imbedded malignant type. All stemming from a step father who raped in the 1990's. My only shelter seems to be in reminding myself that she was given this disease by a criminal and part of her survival depends on my humanity and toughness to withstand and persevere. So I live in what feels like a world war 1 trench. Isolated and surviving . Hearing your struggle reminded me that someone is out there, somewhere a woman who also has been abused, misery loves company isn't the right term , your struggle is keeping me from drowning in despair, I'm gonna keep swimming knowing some survivors exist, just none that I can see in Melbourne beach Florida, I'm quite literally a castaway stranded in paradise just me and Wilson. SOS
22 years later and I still relive everything he put me through for 18 years. It happens in my sleep in the form of dreams and sometimes nightmares. His words follow me daily in my head. I haven’t let it go and I don’t know why. Sometimes I wish I had amnesia 💯
Your dreams remind you where you are stuck and where you need to keep working. It can be a chore to decipher some the info/ symbolism though. Keep working at it. Yr improving yrself all the time & it comes in the increments you can build upon & handle at the time. Look at ALL you have accomplished & improved upon already. You are getting better all the time. Thrive, butterfly.
@@jezebelproudfoot4976 Thank you so so much. Your words mean so much to me. ❣️
@@kimmaried.7313 Yes, she heard you and gave a very supportive healthy reply. wishing you the best ~
@@jezebelproudfoot4976 your very wise and have empathy that is what we all need...I love dreams & even if I can't figure out what they mean I trust the mind body spirit is working things out for me in that state of openess ~ such a universal beautiful soul ~ 🪴💗
Totally me too. Between 2-4 and it’s toughest when dark and you know you need sleep. I always say/think I wish a lobotomy was an option, seriously
Therapists who told me I was making a mountain out of a molehill, instead of vice versa, colluded in keeping me trapped for years. Thank you for using the mountain analogy. We need therapists who will help us see that it’s actually worse than we think. This is the age of predators now, unfortunately.
I have ‘amnesia’ because I am constantly thinking: was this real, did this really happen, did I live with a narcissist? I can not recollect everything. The details are fading. And I am thinking I imagine was has happend….
Yes I'm surprised she didn't mention this. I thought at one point Dr. Ramani would. But yes many therapist aren't even equipped to recognize abusive behavior and call it out. Sad.
Yes. I find my rumination is like an obsession my brain has with understanding what's going on and how to solve it. It gets worse after an episode of their rage/attacks
“Travel and tell no one, live a true love story and tell no one, live happily and tell no one, people ruin beautiful things.”
*- Khalil Gibran* 🇱🇧 †
so true!
When I wanted to “regurgitate “,but had no one to act as a sounding board, I have actually sat in front of a mirror, and had that conversation with myself. It helped almost as much. Definitely better than keeping it all swirling around in my head.
One technique that may be helpful is the Empty Chair Talk. In this, you imagine the difficult person to be sitting in an empty chair facing you. If you have a photo of the person that you can stick on the chair back facing you, so much the better. Have the regurgitation or rant at the imaginary person.
A variation is to place a photo of yourself on the chair back, and talk to Yourself as you would talk to or confide in a dear friend. This is a big help, if you don't have trusted confidants at hand, or if you want to keep your private life private.
i started just talking out loud to myself….i also talk to God about it. i know he hears me. sometimes it’s a combo of both lol.
I find writing it down in word then not saving it also helps the not saving it part is so I don't keep that energy around I get it out what happened, then find what emotions are behind the ruminations, then when I feel all good I just close & don't save it helps to let the issue go faster.
I imagined myself having an interview in some kind of fictional family law court. I think ruminating is also there because at some point you believe the things narcissist tells you and your brain's defense mechanism kicks in and says the opposite of what the narcissist accuses you of so that you can retain a little bit of yourself. For example, my narcissist husband would accuse me of being lazy and being a bad mom and I would run through the events of the day and the past week/month and go through all the numerous instances where clearly I was the one doing everything in the household. Then I would come up with an explanation as to why the narcissist would accuse me of that and it would be to control and manipulate me. And the people in the court in my head would be like 'hm yes these things the narcissist accuses you of/does to you has no basis.' I've found rumination to be useful as a form of closure and not letting your story be overshadowed by the lies of the narcissist but when rumination takes itself too far that starts to become a problem.
I agree (in my case) that rumination was painful but the more I:-
1. Talked about it with safe & reliable witness who didn’t roll their eyes or tell me to get over it
2. Journal all of the feelings
3. Breathe through all of the emotions
4. Be really kind to myself when ruminating….
5. Move my body as much as possible. Yoga, Pilates, dancing. Anything to shift the energy through…
It slowly dissipated. Maybe emptied? But going no contact was the game changer. The sick feeling in my stomach still circles around, but now I know it is a familiar part who I can now talk to & know she is an addict in recovery.
I’m sorry to those who cannot go no contact. Totally get it. After dad died, I remember the feeling of a wash of safety went through me. He was an old rickety man at the end, but when with him I was hyper-vigilant like a petrified 5 year old.
Thank you Dr Ramani, you have been such an integral part to my healing 🙏💗
When I was going through a difficult time after a traumatic mentally abusive encounter I ruminated about it constantly. Talking about it with trusted confidants was about the only thing that helped me to stop ruminating. Over time I ruminated less, and needed to talk about it less, but talking was a necessity to help me work through it.
I also think that ruminating plays an important part in healing. Ruminating is basically self analysis. It helped me to pinpoint issues that were causing me to ruminate. And as I began to address those issues and talk them over, I was able to resolved or come to terms with them. Each time I was able to let something go I felt freer and stronger, like weights were being lifted off of me.
Talking to others does help but I was so embarrassed I allowed someone to get away with treating me so bad that I was to embarrassed to be honest to myself and others for so long.
@@joriebreyer2711 Same. Before breaking up, I actually held back on the devastating financial abuse I was going through, because I thought people would judge ME for not leaving.
@@enraegen561 so when you say financial abuse, I also was dealing with financial issues but it was me going him money and gifts etc. It was me being manipulated and wanting to keep this person in my life. Honestly just so embarrassed and so toxic and when I sat down and wrote it out I was like disgusted with who I was for the last 6 years. We haven't seen each other for over 6 months. So I'm getting better each day. It was me believing if I showed my worth he would be all I ever wanted, the guy I saw on occasions. That potential that was an illusion anyway.
@@enraegen561 I meant giving not going
I understand that because I am doing the exact same thing! I was seriously attacked by him. I had to hide my bruises from my friends and I looked at my arms and said that is ABUSE and you need to leave ! I left a year later!! Should have way sooner!! My friends hounded me to leave,
My personal remedy is to actually be grateful that I have pulled out or am in progress of pulling out of a narcissistic relationship whenever rumination occurs and reeling in any positive changes to reinforce that gratitude.
E.g. Reciting this in my inner thought: "I am thankful that I am longer seeing this narcissistic relative anymore. She can no longer hurt me and those around me. For that, I am in peace now and able to move on in life."
My best tip is noticing the rumination in the moment, stopping myself and saying “I notice I am a person who is having intrusive thoughts. This old thought doesn’t help me build the new life I want” and then I imagine balling up the idea and throwing it away. It doesn’t work immediately, but if you repeat it enough times, the rumination will go away.
Self-talk helps me to redirect my thoughts. But some days I just feel like wallowing in my pain & grief. Maybe that's part of healing, too. Allowing myself to feel the pain.
That lS working, the crunching it up in my fist and chucking it away. Thankyou!❤
Rumination is caused by the attemption to clear the fog and the confusion that comes wt narcissistic abuse.
In my case, as I put the pieces of the puzzle together, rumination decreased substancially. But It takes time....
Dr R’s ability to speak truthful with a touch of humor is priceless. I’ve found mindfulness to be so helpful; extreme mountain biking forces me to do this and I use that throughout the day. Narcissistic abuse is as mindfucking as it gets so enjoy the beauty where it comes 💞🦋
Absolutely so totally agree
Mindfulness and breath work can be so helpful
Yes, Loretta 😊
Thank you, Loretta 🦋💞
I don't have anyone to talk to about this. I have no income, so I can't do therapy. So I just watch these videos daily!! It helps, but I'm still trying to figure out how to get through this.
you are welcome to talk to me..keep fighting, keep breathing, keep talking...you are not alone...there are a million of us just on dr Ramani's channel who feel just like you and are willing to hear what you're going trough
How are you now?
Healing from narcissistic abuse is truly a grieving process. I expect it to take a long time. Perhaps my entire life, what's left of it. My mother always said, "Everyone has their cross to bear." She was right. I hope to carry mine with what's left of my dignity.
I perfectly understand you. They prey on your dignity mostly. What’s left is just the shadow of what you were. At the same time, this unbelievable horrifying experience changed me in a way i couldn’t even consider: i started to TRULY love myself…to embrace my vulnerability…to feel worthy of love. Good life my friend 😊
The last separation from my ex was abrupt and complete. I ruminated a lot and tried to distract me from it. I did not work. So after 2.-3 weeks I accepted that rumination was part of my healing. I started listening to my self closely and was very forgiving to myself. But sometimes I had thoughts like "how could she do this", "why did she do that" or "did she ever love me". I understood I was looking at my ex-partner as if she was a normal person. When looking at my ex as a narcissist these questions were meaningless, they don't give you any useful answers. And lastly I remembered the word from my Grandmother "Time heals all the wounds" . I still think about my ex, but it only 2-3 min per day. I don't have any feelings for her or my time with her. No anger, no regrets, no sadness, nothing. But I am still scared of trusting anyone as much as I trusted her.
I'm trying to not think of the narcissist as a normal person, it's hard! I keep falling back...
@@kalkhan816 same here, it's very confusing.
@@imperialsaboteur8391 there's just no way of getting clear is there?
@@kalkhan816 it's like she's two separate people in my mind.. no, there's no clarity for me... The only time I get close is when I recall certain things she's said that hurt and I remember how awful she could be.. but I'm still thinking.. well what if she's not a narcissist and just discarded me because I failed somehow.
@@imperialsaboteur8391 hope you overcome it one day, I keep thinking that the narcissist is one day going to change but it won't happen...
I take comfort in what Freud said. The mind will prepare itself, if it knows a SHOCK to it will come. When we experience abuse , we are shocked (and pained and confused), So now, the mind has to process it, after the fact. It repeats the shock over and over, again. I have never told myself that I was wrong, to think, remember , feel rage, disgust pain etc. I just let it happen. So much awareness has come to me about my whole life. My X played nice for many many decades, and then his secret life and his psychopathy ,was thrust upon me, in full force. The nightmare was indescribable. My kindness to myself, was to just let my mind do what it had to do. I am in a different and better place now, after many years. Who I am becoming is my true self. I guess , I am saying, that we need to grieve and process, it.
You put it in better words than I did. This is exactly how I came to see it and it helped me a lot
“Wisdom ceases to be wisdom when it becomes too proud to weep, too grave to laugh, and too self-full to seek other than itself.”
*― Khalil Gibran* 🇱🇧 †
What a beautiful sentiment.
I have had to go no contact with a family member for the second time. Believe them when they show you who they are the first time! I try not to ruminate after 12 midday and I have recently found some relief by telling myself that they (the toxic person) are not listening so why engage in a one way conversation. In reality my inner dialog will never reach the ears of this person so I tell myself; "Stop, they are not listening so there is nothing to be gained from repeating what you already know to be true". Instead use my Sensate to distract myself, I listen to a podcast or I redesign my home. May we heal and be whole again.
I like to think I'm prepared to avoid another toxic relationship by having boundaries. I know I hate confrontation, so my ruminating is like me practicing to be prepared if someone wants to overstep them.
This is very validating to know. I went through a very traumatic breakup out of a narcissistic relationship a year ago. I was ruminating horribly for so so so long. It is so good to know that it is common and a part of the process. I can definitely attest to having a good people around you who let you talk and process things truly helps. Also, therapy was tremendous and is where I came to be informed about narcissism. So happy to report that after a year, I am really doing so much better thanks to resources such as this!
What kind of therapist were or have you been seeing that helped you? Not many seem to know..
I'm so glad to know things will get better.
Good for you. I ended one today after twice he came back. He promised to treat me like a queen. He swore , anger still....
I'm glad you're doing better. I think Time is the best healer.
I highly recommend DBT Dialectical Behavioral Therapy - Make certain it is Marsha Linehan certified. It is a phenomenal therapy
I found it helpful to study narcissism, every night studying and it continues but the rumination stops.
stop this we know you are a fraud
Good idea 👍
"Avoiding your triggers" feels to me as if I'm to blame for the narcissist fog that was dumped on me. Education, recognition, going no contact, that is what stopped my rumination!
I think that grace and love often choose to listen to someone repeat herself without telling her she is doing so. A narcissist cannot do this, of course
Thank you, Dr Ramani. I find the best thing to let go of rumination is surrendering to it, just like you said. Sometimes we can't avoid the triggers, and no amount of distractions help. When I try to stop, I end up numbing and becoming completely avoidant - because what actually happens is I'm faking when saying or doing other things... so I just gave into it.
I allow myself think about it, talk with those who still listen, check the narc's social media, journal about it, feel my feelings... until there's relief. Not in a way that causes emotional disregulation, very carefully, and consciously. Over time, it happens less and less. Used to be once a day, then once a week, now it's maybe twice a month. Little by little it's subsiding, as I move through the stages of grief.
People that didn't go through narc abuse just don't get this convoluted healing process; they think it's like experiencing a normal breakup. Living with a narc for 6 months rewired my brain and nervous system in ways I'm still figuring out, and changing it back takes time. Self compassion & patience are key.
Well said truth...every word!
My now retired psychologist used to say that I needed to get out of my head. He suggested doing something physical, especially outdoors. I still find that helpful, though not always the one & only solution. Just doing something that needs my mind & body engaged helps. I also play video games & that helps, especially when I'm not playing them & thinking about how to go about different things or planning things. It just gives my mind something else to focus on besides the daily injustices & temper tantrums of my 63 year old husband. Thank you for the video & your unique mix of empathy & intelligence.
What may seem like maladaptive rumination may actually be "adaptive self-reflection" that is an important part of healing and helping spot and avoid future narcissistic abuse. Telling the difference between the two would be a great topic for a future video.
@mtdvideos5767
Excellent point, I agree..
That’s what I’ve been doing- a lot of self-reflection.
I think some of the thoughts are pointing me toward places that still need healing and beliefs that don't serve me anymore, but I also think my neural pathways have deep ruts and its just a really bad, compulsive habit. A video diving deeper into how to free ourselves mentally from past trauma would be awesome. There are many, many different strategies shared in the comments. Thank you to Dr R. and everyone who opened up about what is working for them. It may just be a matter of not giving up, and trying different things until something works.
really great point!
I really like that expression you use- "adaptive self reflection". That's what it is sometimes. And what we need to do. I definitely need time to reflect, process, express written, or verbally what I went through, what happened, in orter to move on. Otherwise it feels like a buildup in our system, all the emotions, upset, confusion stay stuck. Then could lead to other problems, or illness later on. I wish more people and professionals. Like therapists too understood this better.
This is totally the opposite of what people have told me in the past. I have been reprimanded and shamed for constantly droning on about the hurt that I had suffered. I turned to writing about it and, although the pain and rumination lasted literally for years, eventually I became bored with pondering and writing about it. The pain left as quickly as the boyfriend did at that point. So, thank you for pointing out that rumination is NOT a detriment to our healing.
I'm 34 and I started journaling during Lockdown.
I stopped journaling when I was a child because everyone used to read my diary when I was a child.
It helped organise my thoughts and put them in order.
It also helped me distinguish between what my thought and feelings were and what was actually happening.
Although I still have some of the narcissists in my life, it helps me clearly see them for what they are.
Their history and upbringing makes sense too.
You are so helpful 🥺 thanks for doing this for free.
Hope you are okay. I am in the same boat.
seriously!
It is rough, we ruminate about more than narcissitic abuse.
Sometimes it's loss of loved ones. It does stick you in a time
capsule, never progressing from that point. Still, we have to
use what we need to use to alliviate the rumination.
You know, a tactic that I found useful is to forbid myself to ruminate and have imaginary disputes with the narcissist because it was causing me physical arrhythmia and by allowing rumination I was causing myself physical harm. So I addressed this the same way I did with my PTSD caused by another strong stress (deaths in the family). I took all my attention away from the painful memories (without denying the issue or my emotions - merely recognizing that I can self-regulate by allowing the brain to erase the network of the overexcited zone by not using it for a while).
Thank you! I have cried it out, tried to understand how he could have done what he did, talked about it and then cried some more. I cried 3 days straight and I am 3 weeks from the event and now I’m painting my house, doing MY to do list and he is gone and Though I miss the fantasy of who I had thought him to be, I’m better off for talking it out, journaling, crying, feeling angry and going thru the cycles and stages of grief unabashedly. Thank you for this channel and your wisdom. It helped too. 😊
There's no confusion when you understand that you are seeking resolution. If the narcissist is not interested, it's on them.
What has helped me with stopping the rumination game is to record EVERY conversation with a narcissist. Then I replay it if I’m having a moment. They make no sense. They lie, deflect, accuse, etc. I see them for who they are because I’m not invested in the conversation, just a spectator now. Sometimes I even have a little chuckle and carry on.
Yes, that is good advice . When interacting with the narcissist, I remind myself that I am dealing with a person, who has a pathological need to control, examine my emotion and look closely at the issue using my own judgement. However for this to work well, a person can not be stressed out, has to be somewhat recovered from narcissistic abuse.
I have done this. It does work.
Ruminating has been my brain's way of healing from the years of gaslighting. Little by little as I recall memories, I'm able to see the behavior for what it was: abuse. I've thought about some moments dozens of times and each time it's more clear to me how abusive it was. Although sometimes uncomfortable, the rumination really helped me process and heal. I did and do have to be aware of my rumination and present to it, so I'm not just reliving the trauma but actually trying to process the feelings it's bringing up.
To me the issue with rumination is the emotion, the wound underlying it. It's like digging into a wound instead of letting it heal. It's so hard to let go of because you haven't excised the pain or learned not to believe the lie you were fed about yourself that's hurting you. It's very rough. If you're really lucky to have people who see this and can help you that's great - I found it helped to talk it out in groups of other people who've experienced a narcissistic mother. And in my case, it meant experiencing some serious pain as I accepted just how hurt I was by her. I am not drug-oriented, but during this period I did take some anti-anxiety and depression meds because it would have been even more brutal without them, and why not lessen pain if you can? And I agree -this rumination, which I think of a wheel that goes round and round, is the hardest part to get past.
Even a wound that fully heals leaves a scar. It's difficult to overlook a scar and the uglier the scar, the more we ruminate in an effort to remove it.
Yes! I relate to this so much! The wounds can’t be excised and stay there festering!!!
This is a hugely important video. After 4 years I still ruminate about the narcissist who bromanced me. The ruminating comes in cycles, of which I've been experiencing this week. I'm grateful to know I'm not alone. I have several friends who always patiently let me talk it out.
I am struggling with rumination I changed my whole life for this person. Found out years later about the theft of the money and I had no support from my family. His family attacked me his mother called me a liar. I had experienced a stroke and the raging started after so I felt my stroke was the cause of the raging. My feeling of being a burden. I left after several raging episodes where I was beginning to act unlike myself. I have no support system and I actually question whether I am a vulnerable narssasist because it's been soon and I am still struggling with this. I've spoken to trauma counselors and I don't feelany of it helps.
@@talkingsurvivalwithinspiri2090 Maybe you could try to find a specialist? It may help you put gain more clarity! I think a really good therapist can shed more light on the situation
@talkingsurvivalwithinspiri2090
Omg so sorry for you..
Try find a trauma informed and narcissism informed therapist. Ask them about it before you start sessions with them.. have you considered your stroke might have been a result of the relationship?
It’s typical of narcissists to target people with no support systems. I wish you lots of healing and the support you deserve.. 🌸🌸💖
I found you 6mons after going no contact w/ my mother. All I did was sit & think over the past. I'm not sure I would have gotten through this without your help. Thank you so much. The fact that you are helping ppl without charging for each video makes you an angel. Not sure why tears are rolling,I just wanted to say thank you. I still ruminate to much but you made me understand why & that there will come an end to it one day. I see so many young ppl getting abused by a narcissist mother or family & I've tried to help but I can't, But these 20something girls keep coming into my life.i try to get them to listen to you but I don't think they realize their situation isn't special yet. Thankfully these vids will hopefully they still will be when they finally realize what was happening to them. Bless you,thank you.(please excuse where I lost my train of thought)
Pausing and writing my thoughts down has been a saviour. Getting it out on a paper helps me see the contents of my thoughts from a distance and even process them. Also the added advantage of being able to do this on my own, anywhere, at almost anytime as many times I need to. And I feel heard... By me.
Ditto!!!!!! ✨
The rumination of narcissistic abuse is so insidious because it's real, and more often than not we ruminate as a way to try and make sense of what just happened. Narcissistic relationships constantly flip reality over your head like a circus act. Journaling has helped me a lot, its a healthy way to get it all out of my system, I find it easier to let the thoughts go once I feel like they've been properly addressed. Plus, putting things on paper helps me get a grip on reality, it gives some clarity and allows me to call out the behavior for what it is...
"Narcissistic abuse".
Re-reading my previous writing helps to validate what I’ve been through & helps keep me no-contact.
I love what you said here. This is so good! Thank you.
@@phonecoladycris5929 That's a very helpful way of grounding yourself in reality. It keeps you in the HERE and NOW, not the fantasy of the narcissist. Keep doing it ❤️
@@thequietinside3201 Thank you ❤️
I am 2 months into no contact. What has helped me is a very simple yet profound point: I was ruminating trying to make sense of something that will never make sense. When I truly accepted that I wasn't dealing with a normal and sensible person, the ruminating started to subside. I still think about the person and what I would say to them, but I am no longer trying to understand what happened or why they were the way they were. It gave me a level of peace I was looking for.
Once I realized fear was the main driver for my rumination, I could say, "this is fear" as a mantra.
It helped me when I heard someone say rumination is you trying to protect yourself by figuring out how to prevent the same pain happening again.
It feels like we're being logical when we're ruminating but the push is coming from that raw, gut level knowlege that we are unsafe.
After thousands of hours of learning about personality disorders, I went from thinking that I didn't understand the person I was interacting with to *knowing* with absolute certainty that I will NEVER understand them in any way that feels natural to me.
But now I understand the patterns enough to avoid them, I hope. It's like a language you'll never speak but now we have translation apps that get us enough understanding fot the moment.
This hit me right in the gut. Dealing with someone I can’t escape from and will likely have to deal with forever that is a narcissist is not how I expected my life to go. THANK YOU for validating my feelings. I’ve been ruminating so much over a recent conversation with this person and hearing that my feelings are real made me incredibly emotional and I was able to experience some relief from my feelings and ruminations. Thank you, thank you, thank you Dr. Ramani. You are amazing.
For anyone who is here whose narcissist is no longer directly in their lives but feels it just as deeply and keenly: you're valid. Even if their presence is gone, you're still allowed to feel like this and get stuck in rumination too. For me, I didn't even realize I had been in a friendship with a narcissist until their splitting cut me from another friend. It conveniently took them both away, but I still felt the loss keenly and felt stuck on this for weeks and weeks and weeks. Still am! It's extremely hard to keep talking about the same things over and over to your friends, and I get it. But you've got to get it out of your head!
Yes, I ruminate a lot. I’m sure my friends are tired of it. I’m tired of it too. But it’s like a recorded loop that keeps on playing. In this loop I beat myself up over being so gullible to the narcissist and spending a life time working to keep them happy. So frustrating you can’t have a do over. This is something valid they should teach children in schools today in order to avoid narcissistic relationships. It would save them a lifetime of suffering. Teach the children how to treat one another well. I thought my narc was the greatest most empathetic person on earth until I married her. That was her mask. Underneath was an evil reptile.
One time I stayed in my closet talk through it alone, talking as I was explaining to someone else, years of repressed feelings from narcissistic interactions for 2 hours. Felt such relief.
10 months of constant, anxious rumination like at no other time in my life, from concurrent narcissistic marriage and friendship breakdown...it's the sense of injustice about it all that got to me and how friends/family don't get to see the crappy narcissistic behaviour that flies under the radar..its been both a personal and an interpersonal/social wound...I think it's more the social wound that kept me ruminating...once key others started to see the narcs' behaviour as problematic, I started to feel better. Wishing all the hurt folks out there the grace of recovery X
I walked up to him, told him he was a coward for screaming at me, and calling me names. Told him he was a coward again walked off, and while I was walking off, he told me that I could go somewhere else. And I realized at that moment, just how much of a coward he was, and I’ve never felt better. Now I feel like we both have an understanding that I’m not gonna take his nonsense because I will call him out on his cowardice. Done. And I’ve promised myself to never tolerate his nonsense again the end. Ruminated on that for two years up and to this point.
It's been several years since I went no contact with the worst narcissist in my life. There was a time I ruminated constantly and talked to anyone who would listen about my toxic relationship.
As I learned more about narcissism, it seemed to make the rumination worse, but I really needed to understand my feelings. And, in time, I did come to understand so much, especially about myself.
Time and knowledge has helped me heal and I ruminate less often, but it hasn't gone away. When something triggers a nasty memory, I acknowledge it, but then remind myself how grateful I am to be out of that relationship and to have good people in my life.
Thank you Dr. Ramini for your help, it's good to know I'm not alone in my feelings. ❤️
A lot of these articles tend to have generic suggestions because they need to play it safe, just in case someone takes their advice and it doesn't go well. For me, new positive experiences can soothe the ruminations over time, but coming up on almost a decade of no contact, I still think about the couple of narcissists I dealt with at times, because they just got away with it. It seems rare that we get justice for what happened to us. I wish I had a story like the one you told about the young lady whose business took off after years of being treated poorly by her family.
Yes, I think the memories will always be there for me as well. What makes it especially hard is my husband and younger child finally moved back to our hometown to specifically be closer geographically to all my siblings. While I have a nice relationship with my two older brothers, both my sisters have now shunned me and my husband and child after several mean spirited texts back and forth and no efforts being made to see us (after being gone for 42 years!) and yes, I made several attempts. It only got worse as time went by. Now I have no contact with either sister.
Bottling up does not help. Processing, ruminating, grieving, detoxifying has to be done; it’s important.
To me rumination was like being trapped in a house I couldn’t find my way out of. It feels miserable and pointless. My therapist once asked me to make a log for one week and keep track of how much I ruminated (this was prior to implementing tools to help redirect my thinking). At the end of the week I reported to her that I spent 18 hours ruminating. The one day it went on for 6 hours before I had enough presence of mind to stop myself. Seeing that time lumped together and represented by a number really hit home for me. It showed how much power this had in my life. It was a real eye opener.
That's an eye opener for me. Going thru this myself.
This is such a relief to my brain, to my rumination!! Something I've been very triggered by over and over again is therapists who have basically no understanding of Narcissistic abuse, and who unknowingly trigger my confusion about whether what I'm experiencing is even real. It's maddening and frankly, scary for me. I get retraumatized by this experience.
Something that helps with my rumination is the understanding that I'm having a trauma response to the hellish nightmare that was/is my life within my toxic family. I stop talking/thinking, put my hands on my heart & forehead, and breathe deeply. I witness this deep trauma & pain that I'm reliving. I say out loud to myself: "This is a trauma response. I'm having an emotional flashback to my repeated trauma of being abused, blamed, and silenced by my Mother. My body knows that I am right about all of it. I know the truth." And I'll comfort myself with my words in the way that I should have been by a protective adult all my life. Sometimes I also scream it out if I can, shout, chant, stomp around. I try to move the obsessive thinking through my body.
I love watching your videos! It sounds cheesy to say.. but… my mom passed away in 2012. I’ve had a lot of narcissistic friendships.. so when I’m watching these videos.. I just feel safe and calm. You are so smart and empathetic! I feel that sense of safety & protection when I watch you.
Thank you so much 💗💗
Why cheesy?
When I start getting sucked into that vortex, mindfulness and distraction aren’t that useful; like, “Don’t think about a pink elephant!”
But I do find it super helpful to turn to online content - like Dr. Ramani’s videos!- as well as articles about the specific aspect of narcissism I’m dealing with. It really depersonalizes the situation, validates my experience and helps me stop feeling like “if only I had done XYZ differently.” I almost always feel more grounded from this.
The point is, to do whatever you can to give yourself comfort. The ocean is bigger than all of this, and this too shall pass.
Just knowing about that rumination is a thing is validating for me... My narc wife (at the time) made me feel like an ass for trying to talk out my issues surrounding another group of people who I thought were friends that had hurt me deeply with horrible accusations and lies.
I thought my character would speak for itself, but I was wrong. I had to deal with these people for years after the betrayal, and I chose to take the high road and not publicly defend myself. I also figured that anything I said in my defense would just make it look like I was trying to make them look bad, which would only add fuel to their argument.
My then wife was the only one I thought I could trust, but even she made me feel like I just needed to "make like Frozen and let it go." I never knew rumination was a thing.
I have since worked through my trauma with those people, and it gave me the tools to better work through the betrayal of my wife cheating on me and leaving our children and I for another man. I'm still processing... Some days are tough still and involve lots of crying.
But most are ok now... A lot of it is thanks to the information you've shared here on your channel and in your books. It has given me the information I needed to understand and process what's happened so that I can use my emotional energies on more important things, like lovingly raising my boys!
Thank you, Dr. Ramani!
The part about how many hikes or TV shows can u watch, I laughed out loud like a maniac, when I lived in a domestic abuse situation for 4 years my therapist would say oh take a walk u like nature...and I'm like yeah but as soon as its over I'm back in the thick of hell.
Found you when I needed you most 🥺 this healing has been the hardest I’ve ever done in my 25 years of life. 💕 slowly but surely
So tough to find people to talk about it with. Even my family got tired of hearing about it. I even got tired of it. But it needs to be spoken about over and over in order to process it.
Takes a lot of patience and the obsession factor really is a huge component because of the confusion and anger and betrayal.
Another excellent video, that validates what I experienced. Years ago, I talked to folks about my mother but slowly, I noticed that their body language in response was “🙄 oh no here she goes again 🙄”. So I stopped talking to them. I was stuck in my sorrow and anger. I had to get thru this on my own. I sought professional help and began peeling back the onion. That, was almost 32 years ago. While I’m still at times stuck in a painful memory or facing emotions triggered by a present situation or circumstance, I’ve been blessed to be able to replace lots of the bad stuff. I’ve met lots of folks after relocating and the building of new relationships has been awesome. I do know this is not the life others have, but I pray all who are stuck like a hamster on a wheel will be free at some point. I know what that’s like and it’s frustrating…..stay in prayer. And plug into as many videos as you can to lift yourself up. 2022, was a year for me to learn and grow…now, beginning to thrive. Thank you Dr. Ramani…you are so very important and helpful for people who are or were in relationship with this destructive personality disorder. ❤❤ to all who have or are still suffering.
This is actually a really interesting topic. I am currently in a toxic relationship with my family (siblings and parent are narcissistic) and have been pretty much my whole life. I recently discovered and have been diagnosed with bipolar 2 and OCD. And with my OCD, rumination is one of my many compulsions and the main compulsion i struggle with the most. After a situation happens with a narcissist, I end up ruminating about it. It was a few months ago one of the narcissists were rampaging and they had said something very hurtful to me as it was something that I am insecure about. I could not get myself to stop ruminating that I panicked and ended up doing self harm. It's something that I definitely struggle with on a daily basis.
Some of these tips can be helpful but then again are kind of funny. As someone with OCD, avoiding triggers is kind of...pointless? Especially if you're unable to and are doing ERP, in which you have to kinda face your triggers to become desensitized to them. And more often than not, it is extremely hard to just, stop doing compulsions/rumination. Timing yourself to worry can be helpful, I think journaling can be helpful but be careful as it may lead to more rumination (speaking from experience). Talking to others that are supportive is definitely helpful as well but be careful because that can also be another compulsion (especially if you have OCD). I find that setting timers to exercise and even going for small walks and get a fresh breath of air to be very helpful too, especially with the cold weather. With exercising it can even be just 5 minutes a day, start small and maybe increase dosage later on. You really have to treat yourself as if you were a baby, haha (and not in a derogatory way)!
I was also wondering, Dr Ramani, if you were to ever do a topic discussion about the relationship(s) between narcissistic abuse and how it can possibly cause and worsen mental illnesses, such as bipolar disorder and OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder). i definitely do feel like there is some kind of connection/link between these things, especially if you are constantly being put under pressure and anxiety every day. I mean, narcissists do make you doubt yourself, and it becomes 10times worse when you have the Doubting disorder, lol.
Beautiful comment. Wishing you well.
Thank you for this. Really needed to hear this. Still struggling with rumination. Peeked at her social media today and what i saw triggered my intense anger towards the cruelty of the discard (long story but core was this 52 year old woman wanted me to get a separate room in the hotel so she could sleep with a 20-year old staff member). I'm trying to allow myself to feel the anger and let it run through me and pass and go away, but it is so damned hard.
Exactly!!!! It is so liberating to hear someone who truly understands, discussing what a survivor of Narcissistic abuse goes through.
I thought I was ok after about a month after cutting my narcissist out of my life. But i find myself thinking of him more often these days and missing him. I've blocked him and haven't reached out to him but I feel like if he ever came back I would be taken in and pick up the relationship. Its very hard to not think about the few good things we had. But I know he was bad for me. Thanks for these videos and support❤
The most helpful thing for me when I was in the relationship was self-inquiry mediation and meditation videos... after I was out of the relationship, I started cultivating a habit of talking to myself in a loving way every morning before I got out of bed. I was recently triggered by and ruminating about this person - and was eventually able to stop it by engaging in conversation with myself- talk to the parts that were hurt, angry etc... and show compassion and support for all the feelings & thoughts coming up. As I am doing this I also feel into my heart and breath...What's wrong? what happened? ...[ ....] "I'm so sorry .[.....] Tell me more,... what else? [...] "I'm so sorry (and really feel into my heart so that you can feel the compassion )... I also went on walks with a voice recorder and talked it out... and journaled about all that I have learned and faced since I started my healing journey. Meeting the rumination with Love and compassion, and facing the feelings- and before I could do that for myself - I had found other people - coaches, spiritual groups, energy workers, therapists -even my Osteo - who could, or could model it for me.
You have the most relevant information on narcissism that I’ve found on social media. Your insight is so helpful in my personal situation with a co-worker. You are correct about getting that “throw-up” feeling when talking about ( or writing down in my case) what I’ve been experiencing. I had trouble writing things down at the beginning because I felt like a possessed crazy person rambling about petty things. After I started realizing how my co-worker charmed her way into my personal life and then started making jabs about things shared in confidence and by making me question my reality is when I started researching “why are people mean”. I eventually and thankfully ended up on your channel which hits the mail on the head EVERY time!
I’ve been following you for two months now - she knows something is different. I don’t share my feelings any longer, I don’t initiate conversation, I’ve learned to gray rock and she’s being so kind to me now. My guard is up and I look at it all as an act she’s putting on. I feel really bad that that is her existence.
Thank you Dr Ramani for making me aware that I need to take my life back and live it without her influence. It’s not been easy all the time, but I feel so much better about myself and having to work with her.
I would love to hear more about how important grieving and feeling the sadness is to personal healing. My experience is that deeply processing the hurt and sadness under the experience can be healing. Rumination can be a way to avoid feeling the pain - often the way over rumination is through the pain. It can be healing to share the pain with a safe person!
To me, narcissistic abuse is like looking at an optical illusion: Your brain can't make sense of it, but because your brain is a logical computing machine it will churn 24 hrs a day to try to solve the unsolvable puzzle. It's why you feel like you are going in circles in Narc relationships. You are literally, in your mind, walking the stairs in the optical illusion image. But, like Dr. R says, talk to the good, loving, kind people in your life (maybe watch more Dr R videos! :) and your mind will come to accept that there IS a different reality you CAN step into where you can actually get somewhere happy and good, and out of the one that is an illusion and leads only to frustration, anxiety and sadness.
You know what sucks?
As much as I hate the narcissist I still love her enough to want the best for her. I want her to succeed in life, have the life of her dreams, etc.
These conflicting emotions confuse me. Both love and hate for the same person, and then IF you see them again/are in their presence you are reminded why you aren't anymore.
The snobbery, the "I'm the best person in the room", the "it's all about ME" convos, etc.
They are just so, so, so annoying! And irritating! And boring and predictable!
And yet, later that day you remember the good times and miss them too.
So then you need a drink...
Gosh, I hate them.
I have been ruminating lately. My boyfriends sister is a narc and she actively drove me to a mental health breakdown last year. I was doing fine and ignoring her and moving on, but she stated that “she really cares about people’s mental health” to her brother (in such an unconvincing tone I must add) and it has caused me to ruminate again. Obviously I can only say so much to her brother, and seeing as I live with them it makes it difficult for me to just get over stuff sometimes.
Getting this bit of validation around a very painful thing you've been dealing with for decades feels like a balm for the soul. Thank you.
Quite some time ago I ended my relationship with a narcissist. To me, it helped a lot to stop ruminating about that relationship when I finally found on the internet information that I was in a relationship with a narcissist. I knew I was in an abusive relationship but most of the explanations and accounts of experiences did not fit what I went through until I found what it was. Rumination, for me, is an attempt to put things into perspective, make some sense of them: whenever I find myself ruminating about something, it's a signal that something is wrong that I'm able to recognize as such.
The other thing that helped me is what dr. Ramani defines as radical acceptance. My spin on it has been that there are two reasons why some people abuse others: because they want to and because they have an opportunity do so. Radical acceptance shifts focus from how and why and what if to more practical approach of how to minimize and avoid abuse (while not throwing anyone under the proverbial bus).
This is incredibly valuable and validating to hear--rumination is so difficult to stop. I also recommend EMDR and finding an internal place in your imagination. I had to dissociate from an early age, and now as adult survivor of an enmeshed toxic family of origin I had to deal with an intense amount of emotions coming up that I had dissociated from after allowing myself to feel them...developing a baseline of what you can handle when dealing with people, recognizing how to identify your own emotions and not repressing or supressing them is very very hard after you've been conditioned by narcissists to dissociate from your own emotions.
This is the worst ~ I was always "day dreaming" in school ~ now I know the violence at home was causing my brain injury by disassociating. The result adult complex trauma and PTSD ~ why did our parents have to be so abusive? What bs did they learn in their families as kids? Infinite regress back generations of abusive behavior. Pitiful.
I use these videos to educate myself , like continued education for my work license. I’m retired now so this is enjoyable.
After that I’m done, got my credits and I’m moving on. Thank you. My narc is gone, in mediation with him but these videos
get me through.
Before mediation I drive through my neighborhood where my family grew up, pick up all those souls and take them with me to
mediation. They are all with me.
Our lives are full of diversions. It only works until it doesn't. Life is now about seeing how long I can divert myself before my thoughts get caught in the same endless loop. It gets hurtful when people who have a loving family play off my trauma as if I'm overreacting and I need to fix myself. I was legit abused and if they could see the mental and emotional scaring that was inflicted on me, they would probably be more mindful of what they said.
The worst is “well what did they say that was so bad…” and I have zero memory of the conversation