The End of Google Bard as We Know It!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 พ.ค. 2024
- This week, Marques, Andrew, and David discuss everything from the rebranding of Google Bard to the Cybertruck. And of course it gets philosophical as the question of "What is a photo?" was brought up again by a Samsung exec. Plus, we start a brand new season of trivia so hopefully you caught the finale earlier in the week. Enjoy!
Chapters
00:00 Intro
02:03 Vision Pro Talk
04:00 TH-cam Color Testing
13:16 Google Bard to Gemini
23:06 Samsung Exec Talks About Photos
34:10 Trivia Question
34:58 Visible (Sponsored)
35:58 Apple Vision Pro Wishlist
51:21 Apple Vision Pro Dev Updates
55:43 Trivia Question
56:25 Ad break
56:28 WaEVform
01:20:14 Trivia Answers
01:24:58 Outro
Links:
The Verge TH-cam Thumbnail Test: bit.ly/3SRhxvR
Techradar Samsung Story: bit.ly/3HPuOit
JerryRigEverything Apple Vision Pro: bit.ly/42FVCLG
Casey Neistat Video: bit.ly/3SqDFMk
Captain Disillusion tweet: bit.ly/3UB99Ce
Engadget Rivian story: engt.co/3SwkLUs
New Porsche Taycan: bit.ly/3UAnjU3
Shop the merch:
shop.mkbhd.com
Instagram/Threads/Twitter:
Waveform: / wvfrm
Waveform: www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast
Marques: www.threads.net/@mkbhd
Andrew: www.threads.net/@andrew_manga...
David Imel: www.threads.net/@davidimel
Adam: www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17
Ellis: / ellisrovin
TikTok:
/ waveformpodcast
Join the Discord:
/ discord
Music by 20syl:
bit.ly/2S53xlC
Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
Imagine showing photo evidence on court and the opposing lawyer rejects it with "Photo isn't real."
That argument was used in the Kyle Rittenhouse trial and the judge accepted it and excluded photo evidence from the trial
@@skolariireally, do you remember what it was specifically, bc I don't remember that happening
"As said by technology expert Marques Brownlee in so and so episode of Waveform podcast". They will be citing the show in court haha!
@@skolarii If I'm not mistaken this was because the image(s) in question were "manipulated", that is they were quite substantially enlarged in order to be able to "discern" the actions/behaviour of the defendant. And pictures were still not at all "clear", and since they were ""Zoomed in and enlarged"" naturally a certain ratio of the pixels were NOT captured by the camera (drone video), but rather were "created by the interpreting software". And "in a nutshell" it was this that made the judge "throw out" SOME of the "photographic evidence", though some was allowed.
At least that is how I understood it, but if You know differently I'd be interested to take part of Your information and knowledge about it.
Best regards.
@@acberkowitzIt was really nothing. The judge was just dumb & the lawyers involved were just dumb. The prosecutors presented the "zoomed in & enlarged" version of the photograph, the defense objected & the judge accepted the objection because apparently, "zooming in" on an image makes it "manipulated". They basically said if you can't see something without zooming in, you can't use it. Like, seriously!
Andrew at 27:07 "You're manually breathing." I was working and had to stop for a break
I'm mad that I got got by a man in a podcast lol
Lmaoo that got me too 🤣
Andrew has some epic one-liners. 😂
This was perfect 🤣
Just wanted to say that I appreciated Adam's dad joke after Ellis said "it's a meta decision" at 30:07
Me too!
I hate that NO ONE acknowledged it
it was acknowledged by me and it was hilarious 🤣
"ELLIS IS STRESSED" 😂 28:32
Its the funniest thing ever😂😂
- You can't take photos inside our Samsung facilities...
- What is a photo?!
so photo leaks of a product are not leaks because photos are not real and it did not violate a non disclosure agreement, right? RIGHT? XD
Cameras are not allowed because Samsung's facility is full of dismantled products from competitors. Every product category bearing an uncanny resemblance to the competition that preceded it doesn't come for free.
@@tonyhawk123you don’t understand irony?
@@tonyhawk123 imagine being you
23:48 - 33:43
Most chaotic part ever and I'm all here for it!😆❤️
1:06:12 "are you rapping?" Got me crying 😂
I love it when you guys just go off the rails. David and Ellis were so stressed about what is a photo and then there's Andrew cracking jokes and teasing David hahaha never change guys
"We're not taking photos, we're living life" is iconic haha
“You’re now manually breathing”🤣🤣
You went from "No such thing as a photo" to "Commit crimes" real quickk
Marques is much more relaxed than the previous trivia episode. Refreshingly relaxed 😊
"Marquise" 💀
Oops! Marques 😊
you mean trivia finale
@@josh44026 Yes. He said that he was exhausted that week because of the Vision Pro videos. And loosing some trivia questions to David and Andrew didn’t help either 😊.
The difference in IQ between Marques and the others is soo huggeee! I don't know how he keeps himself sane around these jokers.
Brain: interprets mix of colours as white and magenta
Ellis: Let's go fill Moomin valley with crime!
27:05 That Do it! part was the funniest thing I have heard in a long time.. The wait, the tone, the slight hesitation, the delivery were incredibly good I laughed outloud multiple times. Thank you Ellis..
"Samsung said so!" got me rolling further 😂😂
😭
Didn't realize that youtube color thing was being tested on random people. I got that the other day and was like "who the hell thought of this"
I just keep seeing these colour wheels on my phone feed and scroll past, wondering WTF is all this about??!! Didn't know it was some new TH-cam masterplan to f*ck with our feeds even more!! 😜
I first got it months ago.
.... and I liked it. Showed me better videos than the main feed.
Digital photos are not real.
I didn't think it was thumbnail colour related, I've been ignoring it on my feed for a month now. Might check it out now 🔴🔵🟢
The photo not photo debate reminded me of the "ceci n'est pas une pipe" artwork form Magritte 🇧🇪 (1929) where the painting is just a drawing of a pipe with a writing that says "this is not a pipe". Because it's actually a 2D drawing representation of a pipe....
"We're not taking photos, we're living life" - Ellis (2024)
54:29 caught David slip one through 😂
I noticed that too, was looking for anyone else who did
Hey. Philosopher here. I've never researched the topic. But if you're interested. You can watch me postulate on photos...
A photo is real insomuch as it is an accurate representation of a moment in time. Everyone has a different perspective of the moment and each lense, sensor, person, or film has a different reproduction of that moment in time. But no matter what. That moment was captured. And the quality of the photo can then be assessed.
More post processing brings that photo further away from the original. And/or sometimes depending on the photographer they can edit the photo so that it looks even closer to the way the photographer saw the moment from their perspective. But no matter which way you process the photo. There once was a moment in time that was captured and that is the essence of a photo.
Well said
@@iroar5982 thanks!
Took the words right out of my mouth 😁
"Are you rapping?" 😂😂😂😂
Literally laughed out loud
I watch a lot of comedy videos, but haven't laughed as much as I did during your conversation about 'what a photo is' in ages. Thanks for the great laugh!😂
The RAW image before the processing is the photo. Simple as that.
I would seperate the word "photo" and "image". So what the sensor captures as raw data is the photo, and after that it is turned into an image.
If that's the case, then I'd like my phone to save both, so I have the reference as well as the result.
Why is the TH-cam thumbnail color sorting a thing before being able to sort your TH-cam Music playlists by artist, title, etc. Very backwards priorities on TH-cam/Google's part
Or even be able search songs in a playlist on mobile
Oh, now it's Friday
This is the notification I wanted. UK, it's the weekend, and the Waveform is my start! :).
Andrew, Ellis, and David going on a pedantic rant with the “what even is a picture?” tickles my brain so much!
“Color isn’t real.” I see you, David! Bluejays aren’t blue 😉
I gotta give it to you Marques, you’d make a really good scientist and/or epidemiologist. Your analysis of the TH-cam’s new multi thumbnail metric and the its pitfalls is really critical and well thought through 👍
Purist agree with David on photos are film old school. I think photos also include digital as long as it only processed to give you the best version of what you are seeing. Any altering or post process photoshopping, AI manipulation or filtering that fundamentally changes the image from reality are a different category of photo. Filters like black and white and sepia are okay but manipulations, art work, and other types of photos are not real because they are not what was observed. We still call them photos because they started as this but they should be called altered images. It is all just down to technicalities, definitions, and philosophy.
I totally agree with that Samsung guy.
The moment a modern digital camera captures a photo it's heavily processed:
- Picture profiles
- Auto white balance
- Active D-Lighting (Nikon)
- Portrait impression balance (Nikon)
- The way skin colors are handled in green colored environments (leaves, grass, trees)
(was he running or was he sick?)
- Surely Canon, Fuji, Sony have similar image improving steps that alter reality.
More so concerning smartphone cameras:
- Each night shot is a composite of multiple shots
- Heavy noise reduction maybe deletes small objects like letters or hole writings on a sign or a wall.
- Nobody knows how a smartphone or AI handles different parts of the photo individually after hitting the shutter button.
With 10 different cameras you will end up with 10 different pictures and you won't be able to say how the scenery's lighting really was if you weren't there yourself.
"can you explain this?"
Ellis: "No!"
lol I was laughing audibly
Two computers walk into a Bard...and bartender asks: "are you gemini?"
No, I'm Leo, give me a drink..!! 😜
No better feeling than coming home and seeing that the new Waveform episode is out
the way David pronounces 'weekeepedia' is adorable
I think the new metric for VR will be “ppd” or pixels per degree. So a combination of field of view and resolution. By that metric an iPhone’s Retina display is much higher (as it, in fact, appears to be).
That's been a metric for VR for quite some time now, it just hasn't caught on outside of the VR market.
@@VaalkinTheOnly Yes, I was trying to be diplomatic in striking down the ppi comparison.
It would be cool if Gemini becomes capable enough to just let you decide what you want the trigger name to be. So you could say Hey "Google","Bard", "Gemini", etc. or whatever you'd like and it can still trigger the action.
i love the fact that samsung just triggered a communications theory class conversation between them for 15 minutes
The names in the beginning with the Waveforms is a nice touch!
The photo conversation has forever changed my life. 😂 Although, some would argue that perhaps Samsung has changed my life...through you guys. 🤔
I have Gemini advance and you can set the new app to replace your Google Assistant but it doesn't necessarily replace your Google Assistant. It just when I trigger my assistant between many different ways that you can accomplish that. It goes through Gemini first and then It determines does it need to handle what I'm asking or does it need to delegate that to the assistant. It's awesome!
And it's horrible at delegating. I tried it and it was super glitchy. Uninstalled the app and went back to Assistant. I'm on the Pixel 8 Pro too. Kinda disappointed because I was wanting to have a conversation with a LLM with the convenient integration of Assistant.
@@CapCannoli what do you mean It's horrible at delegating? If I ask it something like set a timer for 25 minutes It sets a timer for 25 minutes, but it shows a little flag icon or toast notification if you will showing that the assistant did that. If I ask it something like a complex math problem or pretty much anything else that just requires an answer rather than a task it needs to complete on my phone the answer is given to me from Gemini and if it's a task that needs to be completed on my phone like set a timer or a calendar thing or other things like that the Google Assistant handles that. It does it beautifully.
@@CapCannoli also, I believe it's the pixel 8 Pro that is glitchy or buggy not necessarily integrating Gemini with the assistant. I'm using the Google pixel 7 with AP21.240119.009.
@@bl5843 I asked it to play a song and to launch an app. Neither command worked. Both times it told me that it couldn't control my devices. It also wouldn't listen after I said "Hey Google." It would launch at the bottom like Google Assistant but stop listening immediately. It would only work if I hit the microphone button to talk into it, then launch into the Gemini app.
Also, never had any glitches with the phone before Gemini, and now that it's gone assistant is working fine.
I'm using the Galaxy s20 ultra and I have Gemini and it has replaced the assistant app. I got to say it's delegating well on my phone and has worked just as well if not better than assistant. I am really loving it so far and so excited to see how far it goes. I live my life with Google Assistant helping out and it's so far NOT a downgrade
You all are quickly becoming my favorite podcast. Just recently stumbled across this.
That meta discussion about photos was hilarious.
I KNEW I was seeing multiple thumbnails for videos!! This is the first confirmation I've heard of it 😂
49:48 Shared experiences already exist in Apple Vision Pro. It's left with app developers to integrate those experiences. Anyone who have watched some of the developer videos on Apple Vision Pro released in June 2023 knows what they are.
Bard was a cuter name
Light hitting the sensor when it's off still CREATES an image, but that image is not picked up/recorded by anything. Just like a pinhole camera, where the "sensor" is just the back wall of the box, there is an image there, but it's not captured permanently. The key here is the lens (optical element) in the process, that creates the picture (eyes, camera lenses, or the hole in the pinhole camera), that is what renders the image, after that is just a capturing process, be it film or a photo-diode, and that's where different methods come into play, so even a film stock is not the original image, because each type uses a slightly different chemical composition, altering the colours and exposure already.
I stumbled upon this red green blue feature the other day, not going to lie. Blue is my favorite. Red is a little aggressive
I liked green a lot!
The what is a phone conversation is so good 😂
Focus modes make so much sense for what Marques is talking about at 47:30
Loved the "what is a photo" segment 😂 was a lot of fun... *existential crisis*
I was not expecting a full blown philosophical discussion on the existence of photos, 😂
The Samsung exec maybe trys to say that all the photos you take with electronic sensors never show reality how it actually was. Our eyes can perceive more brightness levels than any display can show (thats why tonemapping is a thing). Since no photo you see on a display is even close to reality and only an approximation of reality I can understand where the thought "there are no *real* pictures" might come from.
Andrew: I loved your comment about the Vision Pro dropping when trying the immersing Car Play in the Tycan. Great and funny comment
Not only can you not control home devices with Gemini, you also can't use Gemini if you use Google Assistant instead. I just want to be able to ask assistant to turn on my lights AND ask Gemini questions when I want.
@32:00 @Marques The point being made for a photo definition was before digital photos. The light landing on paper or film brings it back to the 35mm days. When the light hits the film it has the original photo, and from there you can edit it how you wish.
In the beginning when they started talking about PPi, i took a magnifying glass to my 15 Pro Max since thats what they were talking about. And then it switched to meta quest footage. And ironically the screen door effect i got with the magnifying glass looked the exact same as my quest 2
I feel like veritasium tends to undersell his thumbnail. For exactly his last video was just "blue LEDs are hard to make" but ended up being a very interesting video (as always)
A photograph is what we consider a captured moment in time, whether the image is processed, altered or left untouched. It is a graphic, created by the absorption of photons and then made into something we can practically use.
Regarding that “new” TH-cam thumbnail colour sorting feature, I had access to it for probably the second half of last year but it recently disappeared. I’m in Canada so I wonder if we were among the first to test the feature.
I am going to choose to believe that photos do exist in every capacity so I keep my sanity 😂😭
I think the "real photo" discussion confounded two concepts:
1. "Real" photos as photos do "exist"
2. "Real" photos as "the contents of the photos match the reality"
Not sure if maybe mine is different, but I installed the Gemini app, and saying 'Hey Google' activates Gemini and also allows for all my google assistant tasks (smart devices, routines, etc.) to work. It seems to me Gemini can be a full replacement of Google assistant
really?
Fun Fact about Samsung. Samsung group also has a construction company (Samsung C&T) which built the Burj Khalifa.
I really enjoyed the "what is a photo" discussion. Its completely unproductive, but amusing and interesting discussion.
49:31 pinning windows is great but also, imagine making pinned windows public for other vision pro users. Like, at the studio, shared pinned windows floating with chats, announcements for others in specific spots. Can be a great way to reward perks.
les goooo I’m watching this and after the trivia finaleee! 🎉
The TH-cam color feature is really helpful when you are bored af and not sure what to watch. I have been using it for a couple of days, and it looks fun
Oh, I saw that colour thing to do. I assumed it showed me it because I'd been looking for specific searches with the colour red listed in the search string.
The subtle “you are now breathing manually” GOT me. Now I actually am 😩
Perhaps since this is a death of Bard episode, you should have asked Gemini "what is a photograph".
"A photograph is a type of picture created by capturing light with a camera. Light reflects off objects and is focused by the camera's lens onto a light-sensitive surface, either film or a digital sensor. This process creates a chemical or electronic record of the scene, which can then be reproduced as a visible image. Photographs can be realistic or abstract, depending on the photographer's intent and technique."
What a nice timing, while I am about to start my workout.
the photos conversation was so funny I had to stop working and finish listening cuz I was laughing too hard, Ellis is so unhinged 😂
I’ve decided that will join you on your Trivia journey this year.
gratuitous weekly "Go Devils!!!" Thank you Andrew for continuing to represent!
I'm with Andrew "Bard is better" 22:09
taking pic with phone: computational photo
ai edited pic: computationaly generated photo
❤❤Thanks for covering across the board❤❤
You guys should do a deep dive on professional sports broadcasting tech! Cameras, live setups and software. That'd be fascinating!
Agreed
43:18 the best video is the one with the guy driving the Cyber truck wearing vision Pro and tapping with his fingers😂
Honestly, the right question isn’t “what’s a photo” but “what is an edited photo / an acceptable level of editing in photos”. I think we know what photos are.
What we can’t agree, is what is an acceptable level of manipulation in photos, and at what threshold we should be informed that the photo is edited.
For the TH-cam color thing. A creator could color code there videos so a channel with different types of content could easily sort there video type
Playlists?
Hey, I got that color sort of thing as well. I thought it was a new feature. I opted out/stopped using it after a few minutes coz that's not how I choose what to watch... but maybe I subconsciously do and never knew??
A photo is a process of capturing reflected information. Either through photosensitive emulsion or through a charge coupling device used in digital photography
Imagine working on the vision pro and when it comes to present your presentation, you go like “Oh! I forgot the presentation at the gas station!”
Bard, never even made it to Canada 😂 lmao
29:14 I like Wikipedia’s definition: “A photograph (also known as a photo, image, or picture) is an image created by light falling on a photosensitive surface, usually photographic film or an electronic image sensor”. To Marques’s “if the sensor is off, nothing is created” argument I would say that if the sensor is off, then it is no longer a photosensitive surface. Hence, the definition stands.
And now you guys included those three colours on your thumbnail 😂
The TH-cam color thumbnail feed could actually be pretty helpful if you want a TH-cam feed as a video background, that way it fits the set aesthetic
I hope Apple enables focus mode, like when you are at home, you can toggle the Home mode, so that all the virtual displays suddenly just be shown around your home (where you set them up), it also applies to work, like when you are in the office, enable Office Mode, then all apps that you set up will just open. Apple can just use location to notify the user what focus mode to enable, then they will call this machine learning, but it works, both marketing and user experience.
27:05 Just had to repeat this part over and over again.
Best one yet from this podcast. 👏😂
So, as a creator who has, y'know, 1/10,000th the subs as the main channel, Test & Compare/A/B testing is something I've wanted for years.
At my size, and maybe the crew can reflect on this too, my subscription base is so small that CTR is misleading. CTR and watch time can be amazing, but, counter-intuitively, that can lead to YT not offering impressions to the video because only my subscriber base is clicking through and watching it and non-subs aren't clicking on it at all, leading to distorted stats. It's frustrating to not have enough data to be able to optimize without skating directly into clickbait territory with titles and thumbnails and instead having to gamble with totally different concepts and hope that catches the eyes of non-viewers.
The guy with a beard says “it’ll look great at the beginning and way later but not great in the middle” 😂
“Push to Pass” is something they use in Indycar. Every driver gets about 150-200 seconds per race. F1 uses DRS, or also an overtake button that allows the driver to use battery energy to overtake or defend a position. Cool to see Porsche using something similar!
Drs isn’t battery the wing changes angle for less (or more I can’t remember) downforce so you can go faster in the drs zones
Cybertruck discussion could be electrifying!
I got the same color thing. And strangeness aside, there were more on those pages that I wanted to watch than there normally is on my home feed
"Bard" felt really good as a brand name, as it evoked something you could have a conversation with, that told you new things
"Gemini" felt good for their knowledge model, as it evoked the idea that it was different versions of the same model. And it could change and adapt to Gemini 2, or another new model name, without muddying up the branding for their conversational endpoint
There were alot of editor funny moments in this pod 🤣🤣🤣
Bro!!! You guys reminded me to breathe in the middle of this intense fight whether we see or not. However, our brain is the one interpreting the light perceived from our eyes. It's not that we see colours...
Surely the Rimac Nevera is the fastest reversing car Marques has ever driven?
Happy Friday everyone