How much performance do we lose by connecting an eGPU with a Thunderbolt port? RTX 4090
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 มิ.ย. 2024
- To figure that out, I took RTX 4090 and RTX 2060 and connected them directly to my PC with TH3P4G3 eGPU dock. Made benchmarks not just in games, but also in applications.
In case you wanna get the same eGPU:
TH3P4G3 eGPU - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DBq...
* This is an affiliate link, which means that if you buy items from this link, I get a percentage of that. Thanks :)
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Main question
00:18 Plans for benchmarks
00:40 Guess how much performance we lose because of Thunderbolt connection?
01:08 Benchmarks conditions
01:23 RTX 4090 benchmarks
02:04 RTX 2060 benchmarks
03:07 Problematic games, but not for Ryzen Z1 Extreme
03:42 CPU bottleneck? Comparing with i9 14900K
04:14 Benchmarking Lenovo Legion Go with eGPU
04:45 eGPU in work applications
05:45 What do we have in the end?
_ - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
FPS loss that massive such as RDR2 is often resizeable bar on EGPU vs Internal.
EGPU should have resizeable bar off in nvidia drivers.
Thunderbolt 4 is cutting things up into packets, which does not play nice with large memory addressing.
I see now. Thanks for the tip!
Out of curiosity for exact numbers what “is” the fps difference
And does only calling out Nvidia gpus mean it doesn’t happen on amd gpus? Is this a Nvidia driver issue only?
@@trysometech52I’m actually super interested in what the differences are and what settings influence them.
@@trysometech52could you make another video showing these differences?
Thanks man ! This video was great and answered all my questions about egpu ! +1 sub
Thanks for the benchmarks!
great to see you took more effort to prove the point. eGPU for image generation is a viable option. thanks.
Great video dude you’ve got my sub I’m here to stay🤞🏻
Another caveat for this is since this is a desktop setup, the thunderbolt controller is on a separate chipset present on the motherboard and is definitely not going to perform similarly to say a laptop with an Intel cpu or amd cpu (not sure on amd) that has a thunderbolt controller on-die. There would be higher latency on this desktop thunderbolt setup so you also have to consider that part.
Edit: not sure if amd has an on die thunderbolt setup similar to Tiger lake onwards for Intel, and they seem to have a worse? Implementation compared to Intel thunderbolt chips on desktop motherboards so there's that as well.
Thanks, Bro, great job! I've been waiting for this video review =)
Please test the benchmarks for CGI content creators: Octanebench 2020.1, and Cinebench 2024 (GPU mode is there).
Besides these two main ones, there is also VRAY Benchmark and Blender Benchmark.
I work on a laptop in Cinema 4D and Redshift Render, I want to buy like your eGPU)
Great video thanks a lot!
Fantastic test, something missing across the youtube tech channels is proper EGPU/Internal comparisons.
A suggestion is to test Oculink so internal/Thunderbolt4/Oculink comparisons.
Oculink is a direct passthrough. Unlike Thunderbolt 4(and 5)... it also has 50% more bandwidth then TB4, 63gb vs 40gb.
Thunderbolt breaks PCIE up into packets and needs to process the signal adding delay which impacts faster GPU's more then low ontop of bandwidth limitations.
PCIE Oculink Risers are that can plug into M.2 slot, and M.2 PCIE 16X4.0 PCIE cards is cheaper then the TB4 dock.
Oculink port are so rare, because it s too new, and using M.2 slot is messy it would require to open your laptop or miniPC and leave it open to dust also it s not convenient because most of the time M.2 slot are already busy running your operating system on M.2 SSD.
@@freedomisdead9638Oculink is not new, its actually very old tech. it was released in 2015.
The M.2 slot to oculink was a work around people found to get oculink EGPU running decently because makers wont include oculink ports on devices.
Great video, please continue with this work :)
Just an idea: Maybe add some charts of your benchmark result at the end. If I got it right a 4090 has sometimes double FPS in Desktop vs eGPU. Also the RTX 2060 was a bit faster in Desktop.
This results I would need somehow in a chart so I better see how big the differences are.
Idea2: Also a compare to a iGPU would be nice so we would se iGPU vs RTX 2060 Desktop vs RTX 2060 eGPU. This wold give me a good overview about how much more fps I could get with a notebook (iGPU) + egpu and how much fps i loose vs RTX 2060 in a desktop and then decide if I should build a desktop system for max FPS or if i could live with Notebook + eGPU and some missing FPS^^
Hey, thanks!
Absolutely agree with you about some of the graphs. I could make it better.
Not sure about the iGPU though, it will be different for everyone. UHD 630/770 or 780M all have different levels of performance. I don't know how you will be able to compare them to your iGPU. But I plan on doing such a comparison when it comes to Legion Go.
Thank you for the video !!. It eould be interesting to see the difference between egpu and direct gpu for worloads like machine learning, Local Ai LLm like ollama and 3d rendering
The best video on eGPU!
Great video. Best eGPU channel!
Thanks!
Thank you for this video. I didn't realise that the difference would actually be, in some cases, quite significant.
It's too bad that a compact dGPU build, sometimes, comes with its own set of issues.
@trysometech52 i just wanted to ask you what gpu generation/model would maximize the thunderbolt bottleneck on razer x?
Regarding stable diffusion you said they both utilize it in the same way BUT I could see in the log you showed sometimes the GPU more than double (7.x it/s) the eGPU (3.x it/s), can you elaborate a bit more on this?
I had different settings there, and this metric depends on the settings. As soon as I made the settings the same, the metric became the same
Cant wait to see yor tests with thunderbolt5, there IS at least one laptpop on the market with this connection protocol already, the question is if there is a dock having thunderbolt5 yet?
Yeah, I've only heard about the laptop so far
Hello thanks for this video but have you tried stable diffusion on the legion go with the egpu? It has USB4 instead of thunderbolt and was wondering if performance would still be close to lossless like how it is in thunderbolt.
No, I haven't tried it, but USB4 uses the Thunderbolt 3 standard, so the result should be pretty much the same.
@@trysometech52 Thanks for the quick Reply!
if your fps ganna be capped by your GPU? No? What is the bandwidth cap in terms of fps for the CPU? A number close to that will be your FPS
A direct comparison between thunderbolt 4, oculink and direct connection would be interesting.... good review!!! You made me make my decision, thank you 😃👍🏻
Thanks man, I am working on it :)
so, I guess we would have to wait for thunderbolt 5
USB 4.2 !!
@@wantedyou2346 usb 5
80gb/s
But then thunderbolt 6 will just be around the corner, why not wait for that?
@@marv9906because 5 is enough so I don't think 6 gonna come out right after 5.
Can you make same test pls for Blender Bench and Octane Benchmark, i am interested can people who make a 3d work with egpu
i try egpu 1x3.0 exp gdc using amd rx 5700 play rdr2 fps lock 60 default setting / daysgone 45fps default setting . but when i use gtx 1070 rdr 30-40 balance setting / daysgone 60fps lock default setting but gtx sometime gpu spike when idle i think i need to changed my egpu dock
In the end will a 4090egpu be more powerful than the best version of a laptop's dedicated 4090? especially for video editing in Davinci Resolve/Premiere?
the rtx4090m is actually the underwatted rtx4080 desktop, even rtx4070ti egpu can easily beat it
Editing software are not GPU heavy, there is absolutely zero difference in Davinci using an RTX 4090 or an RTX 4070 or even a an RTX 3060
@@freedomisdead9638 it's evident you've never used Davinci Resolve before with a statement like "Editing software are not GPU heavy" Resolve relies on GPU more than any other component, it's crucial.
@@ChadVerified you are so wrong, i am a davinci resolve studio users, it is well known that Davinci is heavy on CPU and not on GPU, only some heavy Fusion FX will demand quite a bit of GPU resources., plus Davinci is bottleneck on GPU and CPU, i stand by my words, Davinci can t use all the power of an RTX 4090 card not even 50%.. there are plenty of reddit topic covering this subject, Davinci inability to properly fully use CPU, GPU power.
@@freedomisdead9638 ok could you send me one of those reddit topic because I don't wanna waste my money investing in a more powerful GPU if it's not beneficial but with my own personal experience Resolve utilizes GPu more than CPU when editing and when doing Fusion FX it utilizes Cpu more lol. I'm using Laptop Rtx 3070 btw
It’s will be interesting to compare laptop with pc using egpu
So, have you concluded that eGPU perfomance is OK for Stable Diffusion? Is there any difference in generation time? Great video!
Yep, I had pretty similar results. Pause at 5:25 and check graphs, eGPU was ~5-10% slower
Performance difference might be due to fact that some cpu have embedded tb4 controller in cpu die and some doesnt. Desktop cpu most likely does not have embedded tb4 therefor no difference between i7/i9 (using same contoller on motherboard). Can you do benchmark on similar cpu (ex intel i7) but with embedded vs external tb4 ?
I don't have other CPUs to test that. But most likely, it happened because of Resizable Bar. RTX 2060 doesn't support it, so we can see much more predictable behavior there
new sub!
eGPU for image generation works great. How about text generation ? I assume it works great also ?
Can't say for sure, but most probably yes
Can u try using oculink and show the difference between oculink, thunderbolt and destop. Please I really appreciate Wana see the difference in performance
I don't have Oculink eGPU at this moment, so maybe in the future
Very good video
Worth testing on those minisforum motherboards that have mobile chips to eliminate cpu variable
Exactly, i haven t the video yet, but the test is biased if CPU aren t equivalent in performance. CPU is definitely a bottleneck
Nice a new good tech ytb channel
I got the TH3P4G3 and a RX 6800xt without considering this, is kinda dissapointing only getting max 70fps on The Finals
What would perform better a laptop with a 4080 or a 4070 super egpu connected to ayaneo kun & external display?
Can't say for sure, but most probably laptop with 4080 will be better
Hey what power supply did you use with the EGPU dock??
Hey, it's Be Quiet pure power 12 for 750w
Totally unrelated, but can anyone tell me what gpu will be good for modded skyrim se?
I have heard that if you connect via M.2 instead of through thunderbolt, the performance loss is more like 10%. (not as convenient to go the M.2 cable method, but way better performance. )
Yeah, I know but that's not an option for me. Like you said, m.2. is not convenient connection. I'll check Oculink soon :)
I would think it would be important for your viewers to know the difference between a potential 40% loss and a a10% loss. My question was not to address your convenience or mine. @@trysometech52
Please use oculink port..TB 4 not worth it
Nice!
Creo que la pérdida de FPS en muchas ocasiones se debió a que la entrada de rayo tiene un GPIe 3.0 que no permite mucha transferencia de información. Hubo algunos juegos que estaban a 40 fps pero la CPU y la GPU ni siquiera llegaban al 90%, eso fue por el cuello de botella, 2 monstruos conectados por un cable GPIe 3.0 es como pasar por la aduana, solo hay 4 carriles que es más lento, sin embargo los resultados son sorprendentes, creo que si bajaras la resolución los FPS hubieran subido más en la EGPU.
Hi, Do you think "ASUS Dual GeForce RTX 4060 Ti OC Edition 16GB GDDR6 16GB GDDR6 " with eGPU connect to iMac via thunderbolt can play game like Battlefield V at 4K 60fps?
Hi, is your iMac intel based? I ask because it doesn't work with M-based CPUs.
Also I can't be sure regarding the performance, check my other video with Thunderbolt eGPU bandwidth limit. I tested on Battlefield 2042 there and had problems with it.
@@trysometech52 yes, it is Intel based
I hope you redo these tests with an Oculink dock.
Oh yes I will
If you happen to get an eGPU with Oculink and mod your laptop with a riser please share your results with us. I'm hearing that Oculink perform even better than what TB5 will provide when it launches
Yes, I plan to purchase one of these
but, while TB5 release, is this compatible on tb port laptop that staill in tb 4 or even tb3? i think both of tb 5 on laptop and tb 5 on the egpu should be same latest version, otherwise not give the best performance too. and if we need both tb5 , other laptop has been released with proper vga on it
Thunderbolt for now is just equivalent to x4 of PCIe Gen 3. If it was at least x8 then there would be no difference for 1440p. I think you should check 1080p only for now due to bandwidth limitation.
Resolution doesn't matter if you use external monitor connected to the eGPU directly.
We need a universal PCIE port for egpus.
I confused, why egpu rtx 2060 has better performance?
Check the pinned comment. Most likely because of the resizable bar
Either way it's still viable to use something like an egpu+ intel arc 770 on my laptop that has a 3050ti and see better results than my what my 3050ti could produce?
Hey, not sure if this eGPU dock supports Intel arc GPU. You better double check that first
@trysometech52 10-4 , that sucks if it doesn't as it's very affordable.
@trysometech52 I see I can get a 4060ti for about 350 bucks, will the performance of this and its much larger vram over the 4gb of the notebook 3050ti be noticeable enough. Seems I can get the egpu and gpu for about 500, but for another 500 I could also get a laptop with the 4060 8gb.
I don't know man, if you're happy with a gaming laptop I'd say go for it.
I just love the eGPU concept and the lightweight laptop, so I would probably go for the eGPU variant.
@trysometech52 yeah I love the concept of it especially if you go the cheaper route of a mini pc or lower end laptop but with a decent cpu
TB4 is slow. Use TB5 or Oculink connector
Will USB 5 (with Thunderbolt 5 I guess) be better for eGPU's performacne?
Yes for sure
so oculink port really the goto.
How to calculate connection via OkuLink?
I got a similar video about Oculink, you can check that as well.
❤❤
Nvme oculink or adt link. Thunderbolt and usb are obsolete
Yes, but Thunderbolt still has some advantages. For example, it can be connected and disconnected at any time to a device that is already powered on. It can also charge a device in parallel, and the eGPU can be a USB hub.
Hello can in gpu asus phoenix rtx 3050 (PH RTX-3050)?
Did you mean if you can use 3050 as eGPU? Of course you can.
Yes
Damn, thunderbolt 5 cannot come soon enough !
Is pcie dock good for egpu
1 whole
can you use 2 Thunderbolt ports in the same time?
Yes you can. I used second port for SSD in another video
Thanks you, that was the test i was looking for, i heard before about eGPU performance lost but i never thought it would be that bad,
You have just proven that eGPU is a scam, if only these device were cheap it wouldn t be that bad, but my God eGPU price range from 400+ $ up to 700$, this is pure Madness.
Why buying an expensive high end GPU to get a 50% performance drop on eGPU????
Actually my eGPU dock cost less than 200$, and I personally use RTX 2060 with a handheld. It's not THAT bad, but yeah, not perfect ether :D
i wish this was an oculink test :(
me on GTX 1660 Ti connected to TB3 on old lenovo L580.
How is it doing?
@@moessyd its fine but it works better when it output hdmi or dp at the card to monitor, worst when using built in monitor. But if you want better performance but more hassle its connecting with oculink for best performance but not plug and play.
Oof. those frametimes though. Same GPU. but you're not even fully utilizing it lol.
eGPU's are fine if they NEED them, but if you can slot it into a PCIe slot, do so.
Its also probably not a driver issue, you're legit putting a card through thunderbolt. It adds latency, and will make your GPU just run worse. Its just a limitation with how it works.
Its the reason why you always should go with PCIe, as its closest to the CPU and all the components it needs to talk too
Bro, eGPU are obviously for laptops/handhelds. Everyone know that :)
If that's not a driver issue, why we can see such a huge difference between Ryzen Z1E and Intel CPU's in RDR2? I used same Thunderbolt eGPU there.
@@trysometech52 Resizeable Bar is likely on, on your desktop computer, while likely disabled in Bios on the Ryzen Z1E and so disabled by default when Nvidia drivers are running for the 4090 when acting as an EGPU.
i can use 2060 or 3050 ??
I used 2060 in this video, so I don't see any reason why you cant
Strange, if only it could be predictable. 😔
Test oculink vs pcie
It's already done, you can find it on my channel
Test oculink you will get much more performance
Можете пожалуйста проверить blender 🙏🙏🙏
Schrödinger's fps
Just use occulink
Oculink is the solution
oculink much better then tb
Nobody has Oculink port on their laptop or miniPC, that s stuff is brain new
Very informative but man, none of the tracks you chose fit the content of the video. It sounds like I'm watching a cheesy teen romance.