Hey Athena , I wanted to let you know there are bits with your profile picture replying to people with copy and pasted comments! I don’t know what they’re trying to do but in case it’s something bad I wanted you to know!
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE can you PLEASE do a lore video for the boss baby franchise? Or just watch all of the movies spinoffs and stuff? I DONT WANT TO BE THE ONLY ONE STILL😢
I personally think that Rapunzel’s hair and eyes turn black and not blue is because Rapunzel already has the powers of the sundrop, making it an eclipse :3
Arianna was originally a bigger part of the story. She was supposed to join Rapunzel on her road trip, but they replaced her with Hook Foot. I guess because the voice actress was to busy.
They fixed the lamp with the flower- but because Rapunzel was born under the light of the lamp she got magic- but Varian stole the lamp...god no hate on Arianna herself she just got shafted narratively now that you mention it.
“The more time that passes the less I blame Varian” SO REAL! Me too. Guy is 15, they knew his father was in dangers and being like- encased, and they never bothered to be like: “hey! Maybe we should go check and make sure this FIFTEEN YERA OLD hasn’t like… essentially become an orphan.”
My biggest issue is that they left THE 15 YEAR OLD ORPHAN unsupervised in the royal dungeon with Actual, Literal Terrorists. WHAT DID YOU THINK WAS GOING TO HAPPEN?!
@@Chryslis Yeah but he tried to kill the royal family. He may have overreacted and felt bad about it later, but that was a big crime. Of course he would go to jail.
Imagine having the audacity to look the teen boy that you assaulted, kidnapped and drugged in the eye and say "You think I'm the *bad guy?*" like girl 😭😭😭
Said teen boy kidnapped, drugged and assaulted people first though. And she didn't actually torture him. The issue was that she sees Varian objectively as a villain (that`s the last she knew him as) and he tries to lecture her about being evil. He is right of course, but you gotta see why that would upset her.
Sad that this is the only sequell we will get, especially because of the Animation, like of course they have less Ressources but Eugene and Rapunzel have like the most attraktive not only appearance but body language
I love Cas but how the show handled her villain arc was a bit crazy. Part of her issues kinda were being mad that Repunzel was kidnapped. They should’ve had more focus on the other part of it which is that it was so easy for Repunzel to be liked and get a lot of the stuff she wanted. They could’ve and should’ve tied in a bit of her being mad at the kingdom for not being very good and made at her adopted dad for not telling her the truth and not having faith in her. Not having faith in her skills/trusting her is another part of why she’s mad at Repunzel. There were better elements to have more focus on. I do get to an extent Cas being mad for getting her possible good life taken away especially with the trick of the memories making it seem like Gothel actually cared and loved her. It is still a bit weird for that part to have such a big focus. I feel like the songs Waiting in The Wings and Crossing The Line focuses on those moments so well to where you don’t need much more to justify her actions. Since they wanted to add more they didn’t need as much focus on those other elements.
What did Cass want from Rapunzel seriously??? An apology?? “Sorry your mom abandoned you to kidnap me . . . wait, no, I’m not sorry, because that was in no way, shape, or form my fault.”
In regards to Cassandra’s hatred of Rapunzel, I’m pretty sure the issue was that Cass needed someone to blame for her trauma, but the person actually responsible for it was dead. So instead of dealing with it in a healthy way, she decided to victim blame. (She is her mother’s daughter to an extent, I suppose.) I don’t think she would have hated Rapunzel if Gothel was still alive to take her frustrations out on. I love Cass, but she’s an adult, and she should have acted like it. She handled the whole thing childishly. Then again, considering she was raised by the guards, I suppose that shouldn’t be surprising.
Atleast Varian had the excuse of his dad being encased in amber and possibly dead, dude's clearly desperate and yknow, 14. Cass is like what, 23? I get the whole grabbing your destiny thing but girl it shoudlve been clear as day that she was being mznipulated, especially by that creepy ass child
Thank you for summarizing everything I see in Cass’s angst. So many people look past the fact that she’s watching her world fall apart for the first time and is crazy desperate for someone to blame. She’s grasping at straws and her logic is terrible, but that’s the point. Not to mention the literal demon stringing her along.
My favorite part of this show is how Rapunzel cuts her hair *at the same lenght Eugene did* it makes me smile and go HAH at any idiot that complains about Eugene "cutting her hair too short" like wow sorry the guy was dying and couldn't think of cutting it a little longer
@@mimicmeywasn't the whole point that it didn't grow back when it was cut? cause I swear in the movie you can see that the original bit gothel cut was still very short???
Fun fact! My animation teacher worked on this series. They didnt have tablets, so if they needed a new hand or whatever, they had to draw a rough outline of what they needed to send to the rig people edit: He left before they got tablets, but they got them eventually
My favorite theory is that the moonstone made Cass ill because she gets paler and paler as season 3 goes on. Unfortunately nothing comes of it, but I would've loved if we unpacked that in a season 4. The music in this show slaps, and they really casted so many amazing singers.
AND THE CONTRAST, THE SUN DROP HEALS WHILE THE MOON DROP MAKES YOU ILL, THE SUN DROP GIVES YOU WHAT YOU ONCE HAD, THE MOON DROP THEN TAKES IT AWAY FROM YOU
Something you don't really talk about is how beautifully animated this series is. I'm still haunted by the way the first time Rapunzel sings the moonstones incantation looks. Girlie looks good with that flowing black hair.
When this show was first announced, I thought it was just another cash grab from Disney (and it sort of was on the company’s side). But the creators really did an amazing job expanding the lore and world of Tangled. The music is fantastic, especially whenever Cassandra or Varian sing. And the story is well thought out in my opinion. I watched the show from beginning to end while it was airing, and I’m telling you the cliffhangers 😂 This show has a soft spot in my heart, and I’m glad you covered it! ❤ Edit: I'm so glad you addressed Varian and the Seven Kingdoms 😭
For me I gave Before Happily Ever After and one episode of the show a chance. I enjoyed the movie but the first episode I saw I was kinda bored by. Sadly that kept me from watching it while it aired. I would’ve loved to see everyone’s predictions during those moments. I binged it a few years later. I had heard some songs from it. One was an animatic that used Nothing Left to Loose. I had found from a comment or something saying that it’s from this show bc I needed to know where it was from so I could watch it. Then I was so busy with school to where I didn’t have much time and kinda forgot about it. Then I heard Ready as I’ll ever be I think first in an animatic again and then forgot abt it and then I heard the song on TikTok. After the best songs being in my feed I was like I gotta watch it now
@@spleens4200 He’s a very talented guy. He also played Jack Kelly in the broadway version of Newsies. I’m so glad he has gotten more big stuff somewhat recently with TTS and Hazbin Hotel
Ngl Cassandra having a villain arc was kinda deserved and a cool idea to keep the show interesting especially after getting her hand burnt and crunchy. Cassandra had plenty of other reasons to be mad and fed up with Rapunzel but man the Gothel reason didn't land at all. She had the right to be mad at Raps and even resent her for being abandoned bc who wouldn't. That could've fueled her villain arc but blaming Raps was where they lost me. She was a baby!
I believe the name for it is misplaced anger. An example of this would be an episode from Little House on the Prairie where a dad subconsciously blames his son for his wife dying in child birth and beats him anytime he drinks. While that is a fictional example, it happens a lot in real life.
@@xander7892 only in your opinion. A lot of people like Cassandra’s arc. I’ve seen the show 3 times and I grow to understand her arc more every time. It’s foreshadowed a bunch. And I always liked Cass’ arc.
@@shadamyandsonamyloverMy main beef with her arc is that its poorly written and, on the meta side of the cartoon, the actual writers didn't want her to be the villain, but Chris fucking Sonnenburg insisted his little mary sue oc get the spotlight Not only does Cassandra get the opportunity to prove herself, she gets it several times!
Once more, Athena flys from afar and comes back to our nest. She feeds us with the best slop of content the wilds have to offer. And once we are full once more, she flys out bravely into the sky seeking for more to return with.
i feel like the use of the word "slop" here is insulting to the amazing videos she makes, but I also wholeheartedly agree a lot of youtube content is just brainmelting at this point
its always annoyed me how little effort mother gothel put in. like she could've so easily changed rapunzels name and just- not told her what a birthday is
@@Jaxelh no but like that's the thing, gothel 100% had to deliberately tell her too, cuz how would someone living in complete isolation basically since birth even know what the concept of a birthday is unless someone told her
Did she have a bunch of books to learn from though? Then again mother Gothel could’ve just proofread them and cross out any facts or details she didn’t like.
Wild kratts lore, all I need is wild kratts lore. Heck you have already seen them. In odd squads there was a small cross over where Chris and Martian started doing their usual routine, then the odd squad came in to help them with something odd before leaving.
The music in this is fantastic, anything with Cassandra or Varian is an immediate win. This show made me hate Gothel even more cause she had a whole ass kid that she abandoned to steal someone else's. The Decay incantation is easily one of the coolest things ever and moon stone Cass looks fantastic. Only still kinda ship Cass and Raps because I refuse to acknowledge Gothel as her mother though I do love the ship( poly Rapunzel real)
Yeah me liking this show and Varian helped me get more excited for Hazbin Hotel. Also I feel like despite some issues in the last season the Captain was a good dad for Cassandra.
@@NewsiesForeverSecondToNone lmao with that username? I couldn't tell. (I fucking LOVE newsies, I have watched it 3 times in one day before; learning jeremy jordan was in TTS was the whole reason I started watching it lol) (I also like the songs he's in in the Bonnie and Clyde musical, even tho that musical is overall not a fav of mine)
I saw him in The Great Gatsby on Broadway yesterday and he was absolutely amazing, 11 year old me was screaming inside. I discovered him in tangled the series 5-6 years ago so that just felt like a full circle moment
They almost made a series, Varrien and the 7 Kingdoms, but the idea was scrapped because Disney didn’t think it would have been popular and I’m still upset about it. Varrien would have had such a cute love story with Hugo too. :(
Disney severly misjudged their fanbase on that one. Unfortunely, I doubt theyd let hugo and varian be together, maybe if they made it now with the success of TOH but I doubt it. Really a shame too
Fun Fact: the kingdom is named after the Spanish word for “Crown”. It sharing the same name as the disease when the queen got sick was a mere coincidence. Also, I’m glad I’m not the only one who hates Monty, I hated him since I was a kid. (Mostly cuz I was biased and had a hyperfixated love for Rapunzel as a kid…)
It’s so cool that they got the OG voice actors back for this, an all around great cast Also this show was clearly taking casting seriously when they casted Jeremy Jordan (Jack in Newsies, Clyde in Bonnie and Clyde, now Gatsby in the Great Gatsby, etc) as varian Eden Espinosa (Maureen in Rent and original understudy of Elphaba in Wicked) as Cassandra And James Monroe Iglehart (Genie in Aladdin, King Arthur in Spamalot and he was Lafayette/Jefferson in Hamilton at one point) as Lance
@@morgancrabtree6248 yep Tiana show all we know about it is that it exists. My unrealistic expectation is that it’ll follow semi real world history and we’ll see Tiana try to get her restaurant through the Great Depression, and maybe have an arc where she nearly turns to voodoo to do so
@@Neevkl_7 Yes! I really hope the Tiana series wasn’t scrapped. Tangled and The Princess and the Frog are two of my favorite movies. If the Tiana series is as good as TTS/RTA, then that would be amazing!
The one thing we needed in season 3 that might have saved her villain arc was a full Cassandra backstory episode after be very afraid. In this episode Cassandra starts to pull away from Zahn Tiri because she knows hurting Rapunzel is too far. She would then stumble across the remains of the house of yesterday's tomorrow, which would then be magically reconstructed by Zahn Tiri and Cass would be shown more bad things about her past. Maybe she was interrogated as a four year old on the whereabouts of mother gothel to help them find the princess. (I definitely think king Fredrick would be desperate enough) Maybe her adoptive father was forced to do royal guard stuff and neglected Cassandra. Maybe Cass did things in her childhood that were well meaning, but her dad disapproved. We'd have owl maybe trying to reminder of all the good times in her life, and how much she loves rapunzel and her father. It would be interesting to see cass going back and forth between good and evil throughout the episode. Finally she'd succumb to darkness after Zahn Tiri tells her Rapunzel isn't a real friend. She'd point out how Rapunzel bever listen to Cass, or bother to try to understand how she was feeling. To seal the deal, she'd talk about what happened at the tree and say that Rapunzel easily could've grabbed the spear and used it herself, but insisted on using the decay spell, causing cass to hurt her hand. She then got mad at Cass for something that was 100% her fault. Zahn Tiri would convince Cass that no one ever truly loved and appreciated her, so why should she care for and appreciate others. Then black rocks would shoot out from the ground around cass as she succumbs to her rage. Owl, horrified by what he's seeing flies off to try to find Rapunzel. But we didn't get that. Instead we got "pascal has a dragon friend", which Athena didn't even mention because nobody freaking cares.
@UCNZ52xJ4uOe2jqlBUuOUbwg I'm doing fine. Honestly, the way Cassandra's villain arc was written makes me sad. She's my favorite character. I don't think I've ever felt such a strong emotional connection with a fictional human than I did with Cassandra. She literally made me cry. I relate to feeling inadequate, and getting angry when I felt like people weren't respecting my talents enough. I''ve been through that, and it took me a long time to be able to trust people to be my friends again. Even my own stepdad made me feel like garbage. And there are definitely times in my life where I just wanna sing crossing the line and shoot black rocks out of the floor at the people who care about me. So I don't blame Cassandra, I blame the writers.
For real, and the fact that he was the first man she’s ever met because she was being held captive and away from society. The movie does not age well at all.
He really met her at 17 and then as soon as she turned 18 he kissed her. sir you're 26 and you're going after the girl who acts young cause shes been stuck a tower for years lmao
@@anonymouslucario285 i wouldnt say it ruined the entire show. Watching season 1 and 2 is in my opinion not tainted by it because there the Rapunzel and Cassandra conflict actually builds up very well which the third season kinda just throws out of the window for flimsy bs. So the build up remains, it's just the pay off that really sucks and is frustrating because you know how much could have been done with this but they just keep it aggravatingly vague and constantly go back and forth with Cassandra's characterization. Cassandra is obviously the character hurt the most by this writing, but even for her, her character isn't outright ruined because of how noticeable the line is between season 2 and 3. It is more infuriatingly wasted potential than actually ruining her character and the story
I do hate the obligatory everyone has to like everyone eposode, but honestly I do love how they don't end up friends in the end, and every time they meet it's as people with a dislike for eachother. Edit: Also I love how Varian isn't even technically a main character but still gets a hero dose of near-death experiences-
The character assassination of Cass by the writers will remain the biggest shame in this story. IMO when you look at the series in retrospect it's very clear they wrote the character of Cass with the intent to have her be a surprise antagonist especially with that eventual Mother Gothel connection reveal. The problem is, they gave Cass TOO MUCH positive characterization throughout all the early seasons. She was flawed and that was fine, you could see how she would be annoyed with Rapunzel or feel a bit jealous about not being number 1 or even the best at something. In the episodes where these are featured she works on them and it's cool to see her deal with realistic emotions that kids feel and work through those negative feelings. But the writers INSISTED on sticking to their original plan for Cass. Instead of thinking about organic storytelling and changing plans for her accordingly as her character and relationship to Rapunzel developed, THEY STUCK TO THE VILLAIN CASSANDRA PLAN. Cass had looooong outgrown that plan they had for her, but they went through with shoving her into this pre-determined role that DID NOT MAKE ANY SENSE for her character anymore. And what did it get Cassandra? One of the worst heel face turns in cartoon history. Motivations did not make sense. Her being attached to Mother Gothel did not make sense. Her convincing herself that Rapunzel was manipulative and abusive toward her did not make sense. Her completely falling for ghost girl Zantiri's lies did not make sense. Cassandra kept doing and saying things that did not make sense for her at that point in the story. She became a worse character because of what the writers forced upon her and that's so sad. She was a fun older and somewhat edgy cool sis type character otherwise. It will continue to piss me off until the end of time.
I wouldve believed it if it was only in the first half if s3 since she was isloted so i can see her being easily manipulated but the fact she continued to follow the plan after all that is just ridiculous. IMO they shoudve made her an anti hero and not the "main" villain, maybe a rival of sorts keeps crossing with the heroes despite not wanting anything to do with them
I heard that Cassandra was supposed to be aware she was Gothel's daughter the whole time and that she was supposed to manipulate Rapunzel by becoming her friend to get her in position to touch the rocks to activate her hair amd to get to the moonstone eventually, but have a crisis of conscience when she comes to genuinely value her fake friendship with Rapunzel and start to feel guilty about using Rapunzel. Right up until Challenge of the Brave, the writers were unsure if Cassandra was genuinely Rapunzel's friend or if she was tricking her before deciding to make her friendship with Rapunzel genuine to male Cassandra a less morally gray character and sympathetic. Personally, I think the writers should have stuck with the original intent for Cassandra's character since the first few episodes support this intent. Cassandra sneaks Rapunzel out of the palace to show her the black rocks, which activate her hair. She intentionally isolates Rapunzel from Eugene and positions Rapunzel in a situation to keep Eugene in the dark about her hair while making Rapunzel choose to appease her to keep her friendship over being honest with Eugene. All these early incidents with Cassandra seem calculated if she was trying to play the long con of getting back at Rapunzel because of Gothel, instead of all of these things being mere coincidences.
Can I just take a moment to appreciate how hilarious the add placement was? Like genuinely one of the most entertaining sponsorships I think I’ve ever seen. Athena never dissapoints
I loved the hope you had for Cass's character arc and also how you legit sound like you wanna fist fight her while also simultaneously cheering her in to get with Rapunzel
Gothel really did not think this through. She had literal gold for herself and her daughter. All she had to do was get the job as the princess’ nanny and governess. Queen Victoria was fiercely loyal to Liesl, her nanny and governess. Then she and her daughter would live in the palace! The palace! Then she could have met the captain and fell in love with him and that’s how he becomes Cassandra’s dad.
Maybe she thought the king and queen agreeing to hire a random lady from an isolated wooded island with no references or experience to be their daughter's personal nanny would be... kindof a longshot?
@@Daeneiracorn I'm pretty sure in medieval times, royal nannies and ladies in waiting were typically selected from among the (lower) nobility. And anyway, even if Gothel did get a job as the princess's nursemaid or governess or whatever, that would still result in her having to share her "flower" with a bunch of other people, which she obviously didn't want.
@Daeneiracorn was the show in the middle ages? The time period in this show is so all over the place. 😑 I know it's fantasy, but other disney properties manage to be fantasy while still being at certain time and place. Sleeping Beauty: 13th century France. Hunchback of Notre Dame: 15th century France. Snow White: 16th century Germany. Beauty and the Beast: 18th century France...disney really seems to like France 🤔...OH YEAH, Frozen: 19th century Norway. 😅 Tangled the series...???🤷♀️
1:13:52 On it. I absolutely love the hair changes whenever Rapunzel's does. It's nice attention to detail. Also really liked whenever you called out Cass' obliviousness to her own wrongdoings like that that one bit about the "power ascending" or the analogy of getting angry at people who you have made threats to planning to defend themselves.
I _really_ loved your costume changes and that you didn't hold back on your opinion about Cassandra's villain arc without going overboard with it. You strike a really nice balance on getting the point across and what to then leave out (though I wished you commented on Cassandra leaving in the end) I also appreciate that you always go out of your way to include the time stamps so we can take breaks and come back to it easier. If I may just mention from my personal enjoyment, you obviously love music and theater/ musicals alot. I would love to hear more of your opinions on the songs and singers. Though, the videos are probably already long enough 😅 I just thought it's something you and alot of your viewers would enjoy as part of your videos
you have no idea how happy i am to see some sort of tts content still being made, and funny enough, vat7k was such a good idea that despite disney rejecting it, it made its own mini fandom and every once in a while it will get mentioned somewhere and the entire fandom rises up for a bit before sinking back down waiting to be mentioned again
Before The Owl House, this was the first Disney show I tried to follow as it was coming out. The only problem was, Disney never hic-yucking advertised anything within the third season well enough for me to know that it didn't just get cancelled after the season 2 cliffhanger.
I knew when the show was coming on and it was still difficult to catch episodes. I even had DVR at the time, but Disney's schedule was so weird and stuff never came on time so I'd never be able to to fully record a whole episode
Y’all have no idea the sheer chokehold this show had on me when I was 15. I forced my cousin to watch it with me (and he eventually even started enjoying it), I’d watch it every day, sometimes during class, but because I was a quiet, studious kid the teachers never suspected a thing. I posted like 12 tangled fan fictions to ao3, I spent every waking second listening to the ost, when it came time for my birthday, all I wanted were the TTS books. I was so vocal abt my love for the show and movie that some of my teachers even started calling me Rapunzel. Like deadass once in my drama class some girls made fun of my Tourette’s and made me cry, so I walked out. When I came back to get my stuff, my teacher asked if I’d be ok and I said “yeah, I’ll go home and watch Tangled and I’ll be fine,” he looked at me and just said “you’re crazy! What is it with you and Tangled? Why Tangled??” It was intense for everyone involved. Shoutout to my cousin though for being the Varian to my Rapunzel.
LEGIT!!!! THis show meant soooo much to me at 14-15, genuinely is how I met all my online friends on instrgam, I got added to a group chat just cause we all loved varian sm and I'm so glad I met them all because we're all still friends to this day and it was just a really cool part of my life, I remember the nothing left to lose snippet coming out and avoiding it with my LIFEEEE everyone talking about it omg those were the times. And the fandom being called the black rockers haha.
@@sprinkles06 the thing abt Disney channel is that new shows tend to get little to no marketing in my country (Australia), so I wasn’t actually aware of the show at all until 2020 and didn’t start watching until 2023 ahaha. I didn’t have cable either and my family didn’t get Disney+ until late 2020. Now I’d say I’m fairly involved with what remains of the fandom. I still write fan fiction and draw fanart (none of which I’ve posted but yk), and I cosplayed as moonstone Cass at a convention last year. Plus I was also fairly young when the show first released so I wouldn’t have been allowed social media.
@@laibatangled literally 😭it feels a little forced- like you're really having her relive moments with her that she shared and had with her soon to be fiance/husband that were key moments of their bonding together, like- what??
Well the show never tried to pretend it would work out? From the start we knew Rapunzel was going to marry Eugene. The fact that Rapunzel might also be bi and had some unresolved feelings with her female best friend enriches her character, but it's not "making the canon gay".
1:13:26 this part is so funny cause when I hyperfixated on Tangled the series and Varian and the Seven Kingdoms, I told my sister all about it and eventually got her to watch the show. One of the first things she said when we finished it was “Where was Hugo? I thought Hugo was gonna be in it.”
Honestly, you putting into words the feelings I had to for Cassandra’s villain arc was SOOOOO VALIDATING. Like, as someone who’s just got to finish the series but had an acknowledgment of the general story for literal years, I just couldn’t justified how long they dragged Cassandra’s angst. At first it was cool, then it got the perfect amount of eeeevooool, then it continue to drag as Rapunzel gave her chance, after chance, after chance. I knew from the first episodes that Cassandra was hardheaded, but it got to a point when she actually just sounded, not only stupid but also incredibly dense. Every single thing started to be a contradiction and when her big plan was being questioned by Rapunzel (she became logic queen for a second, amazing moment), she still sounded bonkers. I also thought that it probably was a moonstone thing, which I need to stand by, because otherwise it makes me annoyed. At some point, screaming like a small child the opposite of whatever the person that cares about you says, just because you’re petty, despite making zero sense with yourself, gets old.
My personal headcanon is that Cassandra actually died when she slammed the moonstone into her chest (the rocks came out of her body when they formed her catsuit-armor), so she has to be under the influence of the stone. It is also obvious that the stone becomes her life energy from that point on, since she never eats again after that moment. Before we did see her eat and she is the only (important) character who we do not see eat in season 3. Also her hair and eyes turn blue...most importantly her eyes, since changing eye color means being influenced/possessed by something. The show also shows us that detail multiple times. So, when the stone broke Cassandra lost some of the life energy and that why she got paler. Before someone ask how she could still move when Zhan Tiri took the stone away from her: I like to thing the moonstone is similar to a soul gem from Madoka Magica in that regard. Meaning she can stay away from it withing a certain distance to be able to move, but has to have it on her body to use it's powers.
Athena. Please i swear that i am most certain that a lore video on All Hail King Julien and The adventures of Puss in Boots on Netflix would go unfathomably hard
@vastro921 i know right? Thats why i think Athena might like it. The lore doesnt go off the deep end. It backflips off a cliff and swan dives into the deep end lmao
Tangled is a franchise that I'm really glad Disney invested in and expanded. The amount of lore in this franchise? This was an amazing tv series and I'm so glad they created it
@@russellharrell2747 They could "dig a little deeper" into the voodoo aspects of the story. I think there was a scrapped storyline about Facilier being Mama Odie's son. If they were to add on to the universe and lore, I'd like to see that
As someone who cohosts a podcast about this show (Corona After Dark: A Tangled Podcast,) I love seeing other people get as sucked in as I have and share their thoughts on it! I agree that we should abolish Disney sequel movies and replace them with series with increasingly unhinged lore. More time for filler episodes that feel like fever dreams! Have an obligatory "everyone is a bird now" episode for every single show.
Varian deserved his own TV show, I’m so sad it got cancelled. The lore of him and his dad was amazing, and I wish we got a more in depth look on them. Like bro WHY DOES HE HAVE THAT BLUE STRIPE? Was it because his dad was part of the moon stone gang? Was it his mom?? 😭🙏
@@The-Glitch-Erroralso- when when Cassandra tried to hold Moon!Rapunzel her hand got Burnt through layers of what I assume to be layers of military grade armor (which probably had leather or cotton underneath the metal), but when Varian does it with his alchemist’s gloves (which should be flame or combustion resistant, but that didn’t actually apply to him) the gloves instead melt Around his hands in a shower of sparkles.
I actually really enjoyed how they handled varian and Cassandra’s relationship even when he isn’t trying to flirt in Cassandra’s revenge that he loves her and cares for her. I still enjoy the ship with how similar they are and how opposite to them.
Athena: "Instead of leaving suggestions for the next video, can you tell me your favorite part of this one is?" Me: You know what? How about both? My favorite part of the video was when you talked about Corona's guards being terrible at their job! Thank you, someone finally addressed that!! And you singing Ready as I'll ever be was beautiful 😍 For the request, I would love for you to cover Hanazuki: Full of Treasures... trust me this show is wild!! It has a LOT of drama for a kids show, the colors and the designs are just amazing and it's lore is very interesting!! WATCH IT PLEASE!!🥺
I've wanted this to be covered so much. Also Eugene needs to be checked... as well as anyone else Rapunzel's hit with that pan. That shit is cast iron and she hits hard. Also why do people always assume Rapunzel needs to be protected? Challenge of the Brave shows she's actually very skilled in martial arts and combat. Also fun fact: Queen Ariana is voiced by the same actress who played Claire Dunphy in Modern Family and Varian's voiced by Jeremy Jordan, who voiced Winn Schott in Supergirl.
THE WAY I SCREAMED WHEN I SAW THIS, THIS IS LITERALLY MY HYPERFOCUS, THANK THE GODS ABOVE (also your lack of explanation for "be very afraid" makes me mad because it's so important for Varian's character)
I can’t communicate how desperately I need you to make a video on Varian and the Seven Kingdoms lore, I promise we’re a dedicated fandom, we have enough content-
32:34 i always found it so wild that Repunzel just LET THE GUARDS THROW A 14YR OLD OUT INTO A SNOW STORM and didnt even think about if she should go make sure Varian/His dad were alive
3:43 one of my friends really liked tangled as a little kid so from ages 3-7 she would answer the door holding a frying pan threateningly and hit anyone she didn’t immediately recognise. This included her parents several times.
I wish companies would just go the TV series route instead of doing movie sequels. I've never even seen Tangled yet, but watched and liked the tv series.
I personally choose to believe that the Moonstone and/or Zhan Tiri did mess with Cass’s head and her perception of how bad things were with Rapunzel to get her to do a lot of those things. It just feels like less of Cass’s character is assassinated this way, because there were a few times where Rapunzel was a little inconsiderate or Cass’s feelings of being overshadowed were valid but never to a degree that would justify that reaction. I think she grabbed the Moonstone intentionally because she felt like less than, and after that it was a push and pull of it driving her kind of crazy and her having more lucid moments like when she almost let Rapunzel talk her down until something was said that triggered her anger again or when she fully regretted her actions and wanted to apologize until she was attacked and the Moonstone was able to capitalize on any negative feelings that caused. It also explains why Cass is nothing but remorseful and upset with herself the second the Moonstone is away from her. Might be a copout but I just think this is how they can have their cake and eat it too. Changing literally nothing else, if they just made it clear at a few points that Cass wasn’t in her right mind, they can have the villain arc but still say she’s a good person with some unresolved issues. Leaving it ambiguous really only hurt the arc.
There's actually a book called "what once was mine" (official Disney book, it's part of a series which is basically alternate universe versions of princess stories) and the premise is what if the queen drank a moon flower, and it like gave Rapunzel silver hair and I think just touching her kills people? I never finished it unfortunately, but it definitely was a bit darker, maybe like pg 13 instead of pg like the usual Disney stuff
1:12:50 Immediately after seeing the characters' designs from Varian and the Seven Kingdoms, I saw Hugo and went "yup, that's his boyfriend. They got matching clothes"
I watched this entire series for ready as I’ll ever be, that song changed my brain chemistry, I can’t hear the phrase without almost breaking out in song. I had seen the first episode when I was little though, I wanted to hang out with Varian so bad. (I also didn’t know there was a pre show movie-episode until now 💀💀)
You can start your claim now with Morgan & Morgan at www.forthepeople.com/Athena without leaving your couch. Remember, it's free unless you win.
Between you and Big Tugg, Morgan & Morgan is just sponsoring left and right. But hey get that bag babes 😙💅
Hey Athena , I wanted to let you know there are bits with your profile picture replying to people with copy and pasted comments! I don’t know what they’re trying to do but in case it’s something bad I wanted you to know!
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE can you PLEASE do a lore video for the boss baby franchise? Or just watch all of the movies spinoffs and stuff? I DONT WANT TO BE THE ONLY ONE STILL😢
Could you please do a lore video on the ben 10 franchise please
My favourite part way 59:13 it was very funny! But I loved the whole thing
The queen falling ill in her kingdom callled Corona is so ironic
Hahaha I see what you did there
And they probably drink corona beer
That’s hilarious.
Queen Elizabeth the third
I read that as iconic at first 😭
I personally think that Rapunzel’s hair and eyes turn black and not blue is because Rapunzel already has the powers of the sundrop, making it an eclipse :3
OOOOO I LOVE THIS THEORY
YOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOO
I LOVE THISSSSSSSS AAAA
HOLYYYY OMG YOU ARE SO SMART
"It's no wonder her weapon of choice is PAN" is such an iconic line XD
As someone who is PAN i love making memes like this-
Actually made me laugh out loud. XD
I hate those types of jokes so much but she pulled it off the right way it got a giggle outta me I'll admit 😭
as someone whos pan, it was a perfect line
The part where Athena was beating the camera with a pan and in one of the sequences she beats the camera with an PAN flag caught me wheezing too
Athena - she has long brown hair, but I don't have a wig for that
Also Athena - born with long brown hair
I imagine it was bc her natural hair was probably a mess from being tied back for the wig swapping.
My favorite part was " Gasp! Is that a wrinkle? I have to steal a baby!"
10/10 characterization of Gothel. 😂
le gasp
Can we just talk about how little Rapunzel’s mom is mentioned? She’s the whole reason rapunzel got her hair in the 1st place😭😭
Arianna was originally a bigger part of the story. She was supposed to join Rapunzel on her road trip, but they replaced her with Hook Foot. I guess because the voice actress was to busy.
Noooo! You’re kidding me!? I always wished for Arianna to have been more present in the series, I feel so robbed!😭💀
@@beingafk3494wait who said that ?
They fixed the lamp with the flower- but because Rapunzel was born under the light of the lamp she got magic- but Varian stole the lamp...god no hate on Arianna herself she just got shafted narratively now that you mention it.
Right cause even as a kid I was like why Rapunzel mom just on the back burner she produced a MAGICAL CHILD
“The more time that passes the less I blame Varian” SO REAL! Me too. Guy is 15, they knew his father was in dangers and being like- encased, and they never bothered to be like: “hey! Maybe we should go check and make sure this FIFTEEN YERA OLD hasn’t like… essentially become an orphan.”
Exactly he's forgiven by me, he's a child and honestly has very good reasons
Unlike other betrayers, Ahem Cassandra
My biggest issue is that they left THE 15 YEAR OLD ORPHAN unsupervised in the royal dungeon with Actual, Literal Terrorists. WHAT DID YOU THINK WAS GOING TO HAPPEN?!
even worse, he wasnt 15, HE WAS 14, then 15 in season 2......meaning he spent his birthday IN JAIL
@@Chryslis Yeah but he tried to kill the royal family. He may have overreacted and felt bad about it later, but that was a big crime. Of course he would go to jail.
@@Chryslis that is just heartbreaking 💔 😭
cassandra's real reason to become a villain was the rage of going through a sapphic situationship like 😭😭😭😭
Imagine having the audacity to look the teen boy that you assaulted, kidnapped and drugged in the eye and say "You think I'm the *bad guy?*" like girl 😭😭😭
Said teen boy kidnapped, drugged and assaulted people first though. And she didn't actually torture him.
The issue was that she sees Varian objectively as a villain (that`s the last she knew him as) and he tries to lecture her about being evil. He is right of course, but you gotta see why that would upset her.
@@yoursonisold8743 yeah that's fair
@@yoursonisold8743 I mean, she strung him up like hundreds of feet in the air, so it kind of depends on your definition of torture.
@@J0j0_Flip That was a scare tactic for sure, but there was no way she would have dropped him.
I havent watched the series or this video yet i think i underprepared myself lmfao
The “Ready as I’ll Ever Be” song has lived rent free in my skull since I first heard it back in 2017
Same here
The music had no reason to be that great.
I first heard it in a warrior cats map
@@serventium4049 That Warrior Cats MAP did more to advertise the series than Disney did.
@@serventium4049same lol
It’s like they took like 5 concepts for Tangled 2 and said “DO IT. ALL OF IT.”
Kind of not the worst strategy in theory - "do you have a lot of ideas for a sequel? Make them a series!" 🤔
It's better than Disney's usual formula of taking the first three episodes of a canceled series, mashing them together and calling it a movie
@@Repulsa2080 lol the tarazan/atlantis strategy
@@hamstersandwich9917 I mean, Tarzan did eventually get series for itself.
Sad that this is the only sequell we will get, especially because of the Animation, like of course they have less Ressources but Eugene and Rapunzel have like the most attraktive not only appearance but body language
"Later, someone gets mad at Rapunzel FOR being kidnapped." I HAVE NEVER HAD MY CASSANDRA DISTASTE SUMMED UP SO WELL, WHAT IS HER DAMAGE
I like Cassandra, but, yeah her anger at Rapunzel makes no sense! 🤦♀
I love Cas but how the show handled her villain arc was a bit crazy. Part of her issues kinda were being mad that Repunzel was kidnapped. They should’ve had more focus on the other part of it which is that it was so easy for Repunzel to be liked and get a lot of the stuff she wanted. They could’ve and should’ve tied in a bit of her being mad at the kingdom for not being very good and made at her adopted dad for not telling her the truth and not having faith in her. Not having faith in her skills/trusting her is another part of why she’s mad at Repunzel.
There were better elements to have more focus on. I do get to an extent Cas being mad for getting her possible good life taken away especially with the trick of the memories making it seem like Gothel actually cared and loved her. It is still a bit weird for that part to have such a big focus. I feel like the songs Waiting in The Wings and Crossing The Line focuses on those moments so well to where you don’t need much more to justify her actions. Since they wanted to add more they didn’t need as much focus on those other elements.
What did Cass want from Rapunzel seriously??? An apology??
“Sorry your mom abandoned you to kidnap me . . . wait, no, I’m not sorry, because that was in no way, shape, or form my fault.”
And then people ship them 😭
PENN ZERO PFP, BASED
I want a Rapunzel AU where it’s set in modern times where a chronically online Rapunzel learns to touch grass because of manic pixie dream boy Eugene
Now that'd be awesome 😂
I think that’s an actual book.
Cress from the Lunar Chronicles tbh
@@tiaraglory2796nice to meet a fellow Lunar Chronicles fan
This would be absolutely incredible
In regards to Cassandra’s hatred of Rapunzel, I’m pretty sure the issue was that Cass needed someone to blame for her trauma, but the person actually responsible for it was dead. So instead of dealing with it in a healthy way, she decided to victim blame. (She is her mother’s daughter to an extent, I suppose.) I don’t think she would have hated Rapunzel if Gothel was still alive to take her frustrations out on. I love Cass, but she’s an adult, and she should have acted like it. She handled the whole thing childishly. Then again, considering she was raised by the guards, I suppose that shouldn’t be surprising.
Atleast Varian had the excuse of his dad being encased in amber and possibly dead, dude's clearly desperate and yknow, 14. Cass is like what, 23? I get the whole grabbing your destiny thing but girl it shoudlve been clear as day that she was being mznipulated, especially by that creepy ass child
@@hamstersandwich9917 She was an adult but she was still traumatized and being influenced by a demon.
Yep
Thank you for summarizing everything I see in Cass’s angst. So many people look past the fact that she’s watching her world fall apart for the first time and is crazy desperate for someone to blame. She’s grasping at straws and her logic is terrible, but that’s the point. Not to mention the literal demon stringing her along.
Beating the camera with the frying pan and then having it briefly become the pan flag was such a good bit
I WAS LOOKING FOR A COMMENT TALKING ABOUT THAT
That part caught me so off guard!
My favorite part of this show is how Rapunzel cuts her hair *at the same lenght Eugene did* it makes me smile and go HAH at any idiot that complains about Eugene "cutting her hair too short" like wow sorry the guy was dying and couldn't think of cutting it a little longer
Fr it's not his fault he was literally DYING LIKE 💀
And also, long hair was how Rapunzel was abused and exploited her whole life, and it's all you care about, that she's not "pretty" anymore?
And also like, HAIR GROWS. She'll only look a little odd for maybe a few weeks or months, and imo she doesn't even look bad with short hair?? What??
@@mimicmeywasn't the whole point that it didn't grow back when it was cut? cause I swear in the movie you can see that the original bit gothel cut was still very short???
@@belphegutz_ yeah, it was. That was something that was changed for the show though
Fun fact! My animation teacher worked on this series. They didnt have tablets, so if they needed a new hand or whatever, they had to draw a rough outline of what they needed to send to the rig people
edit: He left before they got tablets, but they got them eventually
That's cool
My favorite theory is that the moonstone made Cass ill because she gets paler and paler as season 3 goes on. Unfortunately nothing comes of it, but I would've loved if we unpacked that in a season 4. The music in this show slaps, and they really casted so many amazing singers.
You are a genius sir/ma'am
I haven’t heard that theory but I also like it
AND THE CONTRAST, THE SUN DROP HEALS WHILE THE MOON DROP MAKES YOU ILL, THE SUN DROP GIVES YOU WHAT YOU ONCE HAD, THE MOON DROP THEN TAKES IT AWAY FROM YOU
It kinda makes sense bcs if the sunflower keeps people young, the moonstone was probably just slowly killing her 😭
I love Jeramy Jordan
Athena changing her hair every time Rapunzel did was *chefs kiss*
I have to agree
Something you don't really talk about is how beautifully animated this series is. I'm still haunted by the way the first time Rapunzel sings the moonstones incantation looks. Girlie looks good with that flowing black hair.
Petition for Athena to watch all of the big hero 6 franchise
Yesssss
Yes, that will be fun to watch. Also nice pfp
I keep forgetting BH6 had a show
Yes please!!! I’m having trouble getting my monkey brain to focus on the 2D animated show and I need a way to force myself to watch it 😂
And shorts and a ba6max series@@KingOfGaymes
they had no business making the series SO EXPANDED but thanks god they did
When this show was first announced, I thought it was just another cash grab from Disney (and it sort of was on the company’s side). But the creators really did an amazing job expanding the lore and world of Tangled.
The music is fantastic, especially whenever Cassandra or Varian sing. And the story is well thought out in my opinion.
I watched the show from beginning to end while it was airing, and I’m telling you the cliffhangers 😂
This show has a soft spot in my heart, and I’m glad you covered it! ❤
Edit: I'm so glad you addressed Varian and the Seven Kingdoms 😭
My favorite fact is the voice actor for Varian is the voice for Lucifer Morningstar in hazbin hotel lol
For me I gave Before Happily Ever After and one episode of the show a chance. I enjoyed the movie but the first episode I saw I was kinda bored by. Sadly that kept me from watching it while it aired. I would’ve loved to see everyone’s predictions during those moments. I binged it a few years later.
I had heard some songs from it. One was an animatic that used Nothing Left to Loose. I had found from a comment or something saying that it’s from this show bc I needed to know where it was from so I could watch it. Then I was so busy with school to where I didn’t have much time and kinda forgot about it. Then I heard Ready as I’ll ever be I think first in an animatic again and then forgot abt it and then I heard the song on TikTok. After the best songs being in my feed I was like I gotta watch it now
@@spleens4200 He’s a very talented guy. He also played Jack Kelly in the broadway version of Newsies. I’m so glad he has gotten more big stuff somewhat recently with TTS and Hazbin Hotel
Same I remember when the show was airing I was enjoying every second of it. The cliffhangers left me shambles.
@@spleens4200My personal fav is that he also played as Light Yagami in Death Note: The Musical :D
Ngl Cassandra having a villain arc was kinda deserved and a cool idea to keep the show interesting especially after getting her hand burnt and crunchy. Cassandra had plenty of other reasons to be mad and fed up with Rapunzel but man the Gothel reason didn't land at all.
She had the right to be mad at Raps and even resent her for being abandoned bc who wouldn't. That could've fueled her villain arc but blaming Raps was where they lost me. She was a baby!
I believe the name for it is misplaced anger. An example of this would be an episode from Little House on the Prairie where a dad subconsciously blames his son for his wife dying in child birth and beats him anytime he drinks. While that is a fictional example, it happens a lot in real life.
@@genera1013yeah. I think a lot of people don’t realize that this is something people do all the time. They’ve probably done it but havent realized.
@@shadamyandsonamylover but narratively it makes her a very poor villian
@@xander7892 only in your opinion. A lot of people like Cassandra’s arc. I’ve seen the show 3 times and I grow to understand her arc more every time. It’s foreshadowed a bunch. And I always liked Cass’ arc.
@@shadamyandsonamyloverMy main beef with her arc is that its poorly written and, on the meta side of the cartoon, the actual writers didn't want her to be the villain, but Chris fucking Sonnenburg insisted his little mary sue oc get the spotlight
Not only does Cassandra get the opportunity to prove herself, she gets it several times!
'where did hugh.. go' is SUCH a good line im sobbig
Once more, Athena flys from afar and comes back to our nest. She feeds us with the best slop of content the wilds have to offer. And once we are full once more, she flys out bravely into the sky seeking for more to return with.
Yep
FEED US
*Screms like a bebe egel*
@@The_Darke_Lorde nah I imagine us more lick cockatoos, throwing out athenas actual family to get her to feed us instead
i feel like the use of the word "slop" here is insulting to the amazing videos she makes, but I also wholeheartedly agree a lot of youtube content is just brainmelting at this point
its always annoyed me how little effort mother gothel put in. like she could've so easily changed rapunzels name and just- not told her what a birthday is
Or moved to a little fishing village three kingdoms over instead of 20 miles from the castle town?
Rapunzel (5 years old): "Mother, when is my birthday?"
Gothel (distracted): "It's that day with all the floating lanterns."
R: "What."
G: "What."
@@Jaxelh no but like that's the thing, gothel 100% had to deliberately tell her too, cuz how would someone living in complete isolation basically since birth even know what the concept of a birthday is unless someone told her
Did she have a bunch of books to learn from though? Then again mother Gothel could’ve just proofread them and cross out any facts or details she didn’t like.
also why didnt she let rapunzerl play around the tower? it was hidden anyway, and if she did maybe rapunzel wont be so determent to go outside
“Don’t you dare talk about going outside ever again! Now if you’ll excuse me, I’m going outside.” What a hypocrite 😂
"I see why PAN is Rapunzels weapon of choice *Shows pan flag*"
"I need this polycule to be polyCOOL" im not even halfway the video but im crying
BTW Varian is voiced by Jeremy Jordan, who is literally one of the best actors on broadway right now.
Wild kratts lore, all I need is wild kratts lore. Heck you have already seen them. In odd squads there was a small cross over where Chris and Martian started doing their usual routine, then the odd squad came in to help them with something odd before leaving.
She mentioned in a community post a while back that she'll be covering Wild Kratts in August.
The day she gives us wild Kratts lore is the day my life is complete
Oh my gosh yes
I know she’s doing it in August but I can’t wait that long for my silly animal bois imma go feral Istg
Please do this @Atheap
The music in this is fantastic, anything with Cassandra or Varian is an immediate win. This show made me hate Gothel even more cause she had a whole ass kid that she abandoned to steal someone else's. The Decay incantation is easily one of the coolest things ever and moon stone Cass looks fantastic. Only still kinda ship Cass and Raps because I refuse to acknowledge Gothel as her mother though I do love the ship( poly Rapunzel real)
Agreed, no wonder Nothing Left to Lose was always my favorite song from the show
Yeah me liking this show and Varian helped me get more excited for Hazbin Hotel. Also I feel like despite some issues in the last season the Captain was a good dad for Cassandra.
nothing left to loose has been my most streamed song on spotify 3 years in a row 😭
@@hayamihinata4135 Nothing left to lose is such a slapping song
Eden Espinosa and Jeremy Jordan together are a recipe for a banger
tangled the series is one of my favorite shows, jeremy jordan deserved more than 3 songs 😭🙏
IKRRRRRRR HE NEEDED MORE EPISODES I LOVE JERJOR SOOOOO MUCH THATS HOW I DISCOVERED THIS SHOW
EXACTLY!!!!!
@@NewsiesForeverSecondToNone lmao with that username? I couldn't tell. (I fucking LOVE newsies, I have watched it 3 times in one day before; learning jeremy jordan was in TTS was the whole reason I started watching it lol) (I also like the songs he's in in the Bonnie and Clyde musical, even tho that musical is overall not a fav of mine)
I saw him in The Great Gatsby on Broadway yesterday and he was absolutely amazing, 11 year old me was screaming inside. I discovered him in tangled the series 5-6 years ago so that just felt like a full circle moment
@@Kay-sc8fi I saw him in Gatsby in April I was FREAKING OUT SO MUCH I EVEN GOT TO MEET HIM AT STAGEDOOR
They almost made a series, Varrien and the 7 Kingdoms, but the idea was scrapped because Disney didn’t think it would have been popular and I’m still upset about it. Varrien would have had such a cute love story with Hugo too. :(
Who's Hugo?
@@JandyAlcaparaz He was going to be a new character. I think he was the son of the villain too.
@@LordPanda9259 ight thx have a nc day
@@JandyAlcaparaz You too. :>
Disney severly misjudged their fanbase on that one. Unfortunely, I doubt theyd let hugo and varian be together, maybe if they made it now with the success of TOH but I doubt it. Really a shame too
Fun Fact: the kingdom is named after the Spanish word for “Crown”. It sharing the same name as the disease when the queen got sick was a mere coincidence.
Also, I’m glad I’m not the only one who hates Monty, I hated him since I was a kid. (Mostly cuz I was biased and had a hyperfixated love for Rapunzel as a kid…)
I always assumed it was referring to the sun's corona (thing you can view during an eclipse), bc of the whole sun motif they had going
@@berrymage. Oh yeah, prolly that to, that makes sense.
It’s so cool that they got the OG voice actors back for this, an all around great cast
Also this show was clearly taking casting seriously when they casted
Jeremy Jordan (Jack in Newsies, Clyde in Bonnie and Clyde, now Gatsby in the Great Gatsby, etc) as varian
Eden Espinosa (Maureen in Rent and original understudy of Elphaba in Wicked) as Cassandra
And James Monroe Iglehart (Genie in Aladdin, King Arthur in Spamalot and he was Lafayette/Jefferson in Hamilton at one point)
as Lance
I just remembered that both Jeremy and James were in Hazbin Hotel so if you want to hear more voice acting from them that’s where you could go
I’m still mad that Moana 2 got turned into a Movie when it was originally going to be a show.
Let’s hope the Tiana show makes it through
It was supposed to be a show? Also Tiana show?
@@morgancrabtree6248 yep Tiana show all we know about it is that it exists. My unrealistic expectation is that it’ll follow semi real world history and we’ll see Tiana try to get her restaurant through the Great Depression, and maybe have an arc where she nearly turns to voodoo to do so
@@Neevkl_7they'd need to be careful with a voodoo storyline, since it's a real religious practice Disney ended up worsening the image of
I hope it doesn’t turn out like Cinderella 2 (even though I like that film) or belles magical world
@@Neevkl_7 Yes! I really hope the Tiana series wasn’t scrapped. Tangled and The Princess and the Frog are two of my favorite movies. If the Tiana series is as good as TTS/RTA, then that would be amazing!
The one thing we needed in season 3 that might have saved her villain arc was a full Cassandra backstory episode after be very afraid. In this episode Cassandra starts to pull away from Zahn Tiri because she knows hurting Rapunzel is too far. She would then stumble across the remains of the house of yesterday's tomorrow, which would then be magically reconstructed by Zahn Tiri and Cass would be shown more bad things about her past. Maybe she was interrogated as a four year old on the whereabouts of mother gothel to help them find the princess. (I definitely think king Fredrick would be desperate enough) Maybe her adoptive father was forced to do royal guard stuff and neglected Cassandra. Maybe Cass did things in her childhood that were well meaning, but her dad disapproved. We'd have owl maybe trying to reminder of all the good times in her life, and how much she loves rapunzel and her father. It would be interesting to see cass going back and forth between good and evil throughout the episode. Finally she'd succumb to darkness after Zahn Tiri tells her Rapunzel isn't a real friend. She'd point out how Rapunzel bever listen to Cass, or bother to try to understand how she was feeling. To seal the deal, she'd talk about what happened at the tree and say that Rapunzel easily could've grabbed the spear and used it herself, but insisted on using the decay spell, causing cass to hurt her hand. She then got mad at Cass for something that was 100% her fault. Zahn Tiri would convince Cass that no one ever truly loved and appreciated her, so why should she care for and appreciate others. Then black rocks would shoot out from the ground around cass as she succumbs to her rage. Owl, horrified by what he's seeing flies off to try to find Rapunzel.
But we didn't get that. Instead we got "pascal has a dragon friend", which Athena didn't even mention because nobody freaking cares.
I love pascal but every time I watch that episode I can't wait for it to be over
@UCNZ52xJ4uOe2jqlBUuOUbwg I'm doing fine. Honestly, the way Cassandra's villain arc was written makes me sad. She's my favorite character. I don't think I've ever felt such a strong emotional connection with a fictional human than I did with Cassandra. She literally made me cry. I relate to feeling inadequate, and getting angry when I felt like people weren't respecting my talents enough. I''ve been through that, and it took me a long time to be able to trust people to be my friends again. Even my own stepdad made me feel like garbage. And there are definitely times in my life where I just wanna sing crossing the line and shoot black rocks out of the floor at the people who care about me. So I don't blame Cassandra, I blame the writers.
I think a lot of this backstory was already implied though.
Every wig change ignited a stronger feeling of a different emotion I've never experienced before. Keep it up
Athena’s energy, dancing around in this long blonde wing, is EVERYTHING! She is slaying!
Ive always thought it was so weird that rapunzel and eugene meet and fall in love ON her 18th birthday, like nice save disney. 🤨
Eugene almost ended up like a 2010s minecraft youtuber
@@hijimnnyno no, she’s way too old for a Minecraft TH-camrs taste
@@yamyam4050REAL
For real, and the fact that he was the first man she’s ever met because she was being held captive and away from society.
The movie does not age well at all.
He really met her at 17 and then as soon as she turned 18 he kissed her. sir you're 26 and you're going after the girl who acts young cause shes been stuck a tower for years lmao
Cassandra's moon arc was done so unbelievably dirty, I still can't believe it. It could have been a great conflict, but nooooooooooooo
Did it ruin the show?
@@azureaquarius4487 do you hate the show?
for reals- the third season couldve been so much better but how cassandra's villain arc is done really brings it down ToT
@@anonymouslucario285 i wouldnt say it ruined the entire show. Watching season 1 and 2 is in my opinion not tainted by it because there the Rapunzel and Cassandra conflict actually builds up very well which the third season kinda just throws out of the window for flimsy bs.
So the build up remains, it's just the pay off that really sucks and is frustrating because you know how much could have been done with this but they just keep it aggravatingly vague and constantly go back and forth with Cassandra's characterization.
Cassandra is obviously the character hurt the most by this writing, but even for her, her character isn't outright ruined because of how noticeable the line is between season 2 and 3.
It is more infuriatingly wasted potential than actually ruining her character and the story
@@gargodziel would you recommend skipping season 3?
I do hate the obligatory everyone has to like everyone eposode, but honestly I do love how they don't end up friends in the end, and every time they meet it's as people with a dislike for eachother.
Edit: Also I love how Varian isn't even technically a main character but still gets a hero dose of near-death experiences-
The character assassination of Cass by the writers will remain the biggest shame in this story. IMO when you look at the series in retrospect it's very clear they wrote the character of Cass with the intent to have her be a surprise antagonist especially with that eventual Mother Gothel connection reveal. The problem is, they gave Cass TOO MUCH positive characterization throughout all the early seasons. She was flawed and that was fine, you could see how she would be annoyed with Rapunzel or feel a bit jealous about not being number 1 or even the best at something. In the episodes where these are featured she works on them and it's cool to see her deal with realistic emotions that kids feel and work through those negative feelings. But the writers INSISTED on sticking to their original plan for Cass. Instead of thinking about organic storytelling and changing plans for her accordingly as her character and relationship to Rapunzel developed, THEY STUCK TO THE VILLAIN CASSANDRA PLAN. Cass had looooong outgrown that plan they had for her, but they went through with shoving her into this pre-determined role that DID NOT MAKE ANY SENSE for her character anymore. And what did it get Cassandra? One of the worst heel face turns in cartoon history. Motivations did not make sense. Her being attached to Mother Gothel did not make sense. Her convincing herself that Rapunzel was manipulative and abusive toward her did not make sense. Her completely falling for ghost girl Zantiri's lies did not make sense. Cassandra kept doing and saying things that did not make sense for her at that point in the story. She became a worse character because of what the writers forced upon her and that's so sad. She was a fun older and somewhat edgy cool sis type character otherwise. It will continue to piss me off until the end of time.
I wouldve believed it if it was only in the first half if s3 since she was isloted so i can see her being easily manipulated but the fact she continued to follow the plan after all that is just ridiculous. IMO they shoudve made her an anti hero and not the "main" villain, maybe a rival of sorts keeps crossing with the heroes despite not wanting anything to do with them
I heard that Cassandra was supposed to be aware she was Gothel's daughter the whole time and that she was supposed to manipulate Rapunzel by becoming her friend to get her in position to touch the rocks to activate her hair amd to get to the moonstone eventually, but have a crisis of conscience when she comes to genuinely value her fake friendship with Rapunzel and start to feel guilty about using Rapunzel. Right up until Challenge of the Brave, the writers were unsure if Cassandra was genuinely Rapunzel's friend or if she was tricking her before deciding to make her friendship with Rapunzel genuine to male Cassandra a less morally gray character and sympathetic.
Personally, I think the writers should have stuck with the original intent for Cassandra's character since the first few episodes support this intent. Cassandra sneaks Rapunzel out of the palace to show her the black rocks, which activate her hair. She intentionally isolates Rapunzel from Eugene and positions Rapunzel in a situation to keep Eugene in the dark about her hair while making Rapunzel choose to appease her to keep her friendship over being honest with Eugene. All these early incidents with Cassandra seem calculated if she was trying to play the long con of getting back at Rapunzel because of Gothel, instead of all of these things being mere coincidences.
God I never thought about how much chemistry ALL THREE of them have together until I watched this episode AND IT WORKS SO WELL OMG
Can I just take a moment to appreciate how hilarious the add placement was? Like genuinely one of the most entertaining sponsorships I think I’ve ever seen. Athena never dissapoints
Athena with a Morgan & Morgan sponsor was not on my lore bingo card
I unprompted started singing Ready as I'll Ever Be the other day, if that proves how good this series is
I still sing it when I get ready to go somewhere
Every time I need to go to work, I sing the song
I loved the hope you had for Cass's character arc and also how you legit sound like you wanna fist fight her while also simultaneously cheering her in to get with Rapunzel
Gothel really did not think this through. She had literal gold for herself and her daughter. All she had to do was get the job as the princess’ nanny and governess. Queen Victoria was fiercely loyal to Liesl, her nanny and governess. Then she and her daughter would live in the palace! The palace! Then she could have met the captain and fell in love with him and that’s how he becomes Cassandra’s dad.
Maybe she thought the king and queen agreeing to hire a random lady from an isolated wooded island with no references or experience to be their daughter's personal nanny would be... kindof a longshot?
@@elsie8757 1. its basically medieval times. 2. she has a daughter. that's really all the resume you needed back then
@@Daeneiracorn I'm pretty sure in medieval times, royal nannies and ladies in waiting were typically selected from among the (lower) nobility.
And anyway, even if Gothel did get a job as the princess's nursemaid or governess or whatever, that would still result in her having to share her "flower" with a bunch of other people, which she obviously didn't want.
@Daeneiracorn was the show in the middle ages? The time period in this show is so all over the place. 😑 I know it's fantasy, but other disney properties manage to be fantasy while still being at certain time and place.
Sleeping Beauty: 13th century France. Hunchback of Notre Dame: 15th century France. Snow White: 16th century Germany. Beauty and the Beast: 18th century France...disney really seems to like France 🤔...OH YEAH, Frozen: 19th century Norway. 😅 Tangled the series...???🤷♀️
1:13:52 On it. I absolutely love the hair changes whenever Rapunzel's does. It's nice attention to detail. Also really liked whenever you called out Cass' obliviousness to her own wrongdoings like that that one bit about the "power ascending" or the analogy of getting angry at people who you have made threats to planning to defend themselves.
0:03 Agreed, the Hercules, Aladdin, Little Mermaid, Lilo and Stich and Emporers new groove shows are better than all direct to video sequels combined
The "no wonder her weapon of choice is pan" joke was god tier
I _really_ loved your costume changes and that you didn't hold back on your opinion about Cassandra's villain arc without going overboard with it. You strike a really nice balance on getting the point across and what to then leave out (though I wished you commented on Cassandra leaving in the end)
I also appreciate that you always go out of your way to include the time stamps so we can take breaks and come back to it easier.
If I may just mention from my personal enjoyment, you obviously love music and theater/ musicals alot. I would love to hear more of your opinions on the songs and singers. Though, the videos are probably already long enough 😅
I just thought it's something you and alot of your viewers would enjoy as part of your videos
you have no idea how happy i am to see some sort of tts content still being made, and funny enough, vat7k was such a good idea that despite disney rejecting it, it made its own mini fandom and every once in a while it will get mentioned somewhere and the entire fandom rises up for a bit before sinking back down waiting to be mentioned again
Before The Owl House, this was the first Disney show I tried to follow as it was coming out. The only problem was, Disney never hic-yucking advertised anything within the third season well enough for me to know that it didn't just get cancelled after the season 2 cliffhanger.
I knew when the show was coming on and it was still difficult to catch episodes.
I even had DVR at the time, but Disney's schedule was so weird and stuff never came on time so I'd never be able to to fully record a whole episode
Y’all have no idea the sheer chokehold this show had on me when I was 15. I forced my cousin to watch it with me (and he eventually even started enjoying it), I’d watch it every day, sometimes during class, but because I was a quiet, studious kid the teachers never suspected a thing. I posted like 12 tangled fan fictions to ao3, I spent every waking second listening to the ost, when it came time for my birthday, all I wanted were the TTS books. I was so vocal abt my love for the show and movie that some of my teachers even started calling me Rapunzel. Like deadass once in my drama class some girls made fun of my Tourette’s and made me cry, so I walked out. When I came back to get my stuff, my teacher asked if I’d be ok and I said “yeah, I’ll go home and watch Tangled and I’ll be fine,” he looked at me and just said “you’re crazy! What is it with you and Tangled? Why Tangled??” It was intense for everyone involved. Shoutout to my cousin though for being the Varian to my Rapunzel.
LEGIT!!!! THis show meant soooo much to me at 14-15, genuinely is how I met all my online friends on instrgam, I got added to a group chat just cause we all loved varian sm and I'm so glad I met them all because we're all still friends to this day and it was just a really cool part of my life, I remember the nothing left to lose snippet coming out and avoiding it with my LIFEEEE everyone talking about it omg those were the times. And the fandom being called the black rockers haha.
@@sprinkles06 Ah I so wish I was more involved with the fandom!! But yeah us being called the black rockers was freakin epic I love it.
@@dearprincesscelestia6477 you weren't involved in the fandom? :0
@@sprinkles06 the thing abt Disney channel is that new shows tend to get little to no marketing in my country (Australia), so I wasn’t actually aware of the show at all until 2020 and didn’t start watching until 2023 ahaha. I didn’t have cable either and my family didn’t get Disney+ until late 2020. Now I’d say I’m fairly involved with what remains of the fandom. I still write fan fiction and draw fanart (none of which I’ve posted but yk), and I cosplayed as moonstone Cass at a convention last year. Plus I was also fairly young when the show first released so I wouldn’t have been allowed social media.
Omg same it's still to this day my comfort show. Sadly I only got to watch it when they started releasing season 3 but gooddddd it's so peak
Cassandra x Rapunzel is like adding your own oc in your fanfic to ship with a canon character so you can make the canon one gay
I don’t like that ship even though I love Cass
Same-@@laibatangled
@@laibatangledme too
@@laibatangled literally 😭it feels a little forced- like you're really having her relive moments with her that she shared and had with her soon to be fiance/husband that were key moments of their bonding together, like- what??
Well the show never tried to pretend it would work out? From the start we knew Rapunzel was going to marry Eugene.
The fact that Rapunzel might also be bi and had some unresolved feelings with her female best friend enriches her character, but it's not "making the canon gay".
1:13:26 this part is so funny cause when I hyperfixated on Tangled the series and Varian and the Seven Kingdoms, I told my sister all about it and eventually got her to watch the show. One of the first things she said when we finished it was “Where was Hugo? I thought Hugo was gonna be in it.”
Honestly, you putting into words the feelings I had to for Cassandra’s villain arc was SOOOOO VALIDATING. Like, as someone who’s just got to finish the series but had an acknowledgment of the general story for literal years, I just couldn’t justified how long they dragged Cassandra’s angst. At first it was cool, then it got the perfect amount of eeeevooool, then it continue to drag as Rapunzel gave her chance, after chance, after chance. I knew from the first episodes that Cassandra was hardheaded, but it got to a point when she actually just sounded, not only stupid but also incredibly dense. Every single thing started to be a contradiction and when her big plan was being questioned by Rapunzel (she became logic queen for a second, amazing moment), she still sounded bonkers.
I also thought that it probably was a moonstone thing, which I need to stand by, because otherwise it makes me annoyed. At some point, screaming like a small child the opposite of whatever the person that cares about you says, just because you’re petty, despite making zero sense with yourself, gets old.
My personal headcanon is that Cassandra actually died when she slammed the moonstone into her chest (the rocks came out of her body when they formed her catsuit-armor), so she has to be under the influence of the stone.
It is also obvious that the stone becomes her life energy from that point on, since she never eats again after that moment. Before we did see her eat and she is the only (important) character who we do not see eat in season 3.
Also her hair and eyes turn blue...most importantly her eyes, since changing eye color means being influenced/possessed by something. The show also shows us that detail multiple times.
So, when the stone broke Cassandra lost some of the life energy and that why she got paler.
Before someone ask how she could still move when Zhan Tiri took the stone away from her:
I like to thing the moonstone is similar to a soul gem from Madoka Magica in that regard.
Meaning she can stay away from it withing a certain distance to be able to move, but has to have it on her body to use it's powers.
I can't wait to see how TANGLED up Athena gets in the lore !
You're punny
Oh you * rolls eyes while smiling *
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
@@alexandrajones4518are you okay 😭🙏
@@Pollenisalifeofsatisfaction no
@@alexandrajones4518 real
The Ad transition actually almost made me slip and fall as I was going down they stairs in the library, I know who to call at least!
Athena. Please i swear that i am most certain that a lore video on All Hail King Julien and The adventures of Puss in Boots on Netflix would go unfathomably hard
The Adventures of Puss in Boots lore is something else. That show was bonkers (and I love it).
@vastro921 i know right? Thats why i think Athena might like it. The lore doesnt go off the deep end. It backflips off a cliff and swan dives into the deep end lmao
@@RockyCastor Can't think of a better description.
I think the reason Eugene looks better in 2D is because FINALLY, someone got his nose right. Consistently.
Interesting. I actually feel he looked better in the orginal CGI movie animation. And this is some who is not a huge fan of the look of CGI animation.
Love the commitment to swapping wigs every time the characters did. We love a costume change.
I love how in the lore series we’re evolving from kids shows to Disney Princess media.
Tangled is a franchise that I'm really glad Disney invested in and expanded. The amount of lore in this franchise? This was an amazing tv series and I'm so glad they created it
I wish Princess and the Frog had expanded lore. Or something. I guess it would be a bit difficult but not impossible to continue the story.
RIP Ray.
@@russellharrell2747 They could "dig a little deeper" into the voodoo aspects of the story. I think there was a scrapped storyline about Facilier being Mama Odie's son. If they were to add on to the universe and lore, I'd like to see that
@@kosmickats voodoo is a difficult subjet to tackle since it's still a practicing religion.
Yeah you could tell the writers poured alot of love into the world of series, especially moving forward with VaT7K
Rapunzel really said "this is my girlfriend and she can do no wrong"
3:46 THE PAN FLAG GOT A HUGE CHUCKLE OUT OF ME
I cannot put into words how much I needed Athena to plow through Tangled Lore
As someone who cohosts a podcast about this show (Corona After Dark: A Tangled Podcast,) I love seeing other people get as sucked in as I have and share their thoughts on it!
I agree that we should abolish Disney sequel movies and replace them with series with increasingly unhinged lore. More time for filler episodes that feel like fever dreams! Have an obligatory "everyone is a bird now" episode for every single show.
Varian deserved his own TV show, I’m so sad it got cancelled. The lore of him and his dad was amazing, and I wish we got a more in depth look on them. Like bro WHY DOES HE HAVE THAT BLUE STRIPE? Was it because his dad was part of the moon stone gang? Was it his mom?? 😭🙏
Ture I wanna know why he does have the stripe in his hair
@@The-Glitch-Erroralso- when when Cassandra tried to hold Moon!Rapunzel her hand got Burnt through layers of what I assume to be layers of military grade armor (which probably had leather or cotton underneath the metal), but when Varian does it with his alchemist’s gloves (which should be flame or combustion resistant, but that didn’t actually apply to him) the gloves instead melt Around his hands in a shower of sparkles.
@@Scarlet_Starlight Neat
No he didn’t!
I actually really enjoyed how they handled varian and Cassandra’s relationship even when he isn’t trying to flirt in Cassandra’s revenge that he loves her and cares for her. I still enjoy the ship with how similar they are and how opposite to them.
Athena: "Instead of leaving suggestions for the next video, can you tell me your favorite part of this one is?"
Me: You know what? How about both? My favorite part of the video was when you talked about Corona's guards being terrible at their job! Thank you, someone finally addressed that!! And you singing Ready as I'll ever be was beautiful 😍
For the request, I would love for you to cover Hanazuki: Full of Treasures... trust me this show is wild!! It has a LOT of drama for a kids show, the colors and the designs are just amazing and it's lore is very interesting!! WATCH IT PLEASE!!🥺
I've wanted this to be covered so much. Also Eugene needs to be checked... as well as anyone else Rapunzel's hit with that pan. That shit is cast iron and she hits hard.
Also why do people always assume Rapunzel needs to be protected? Challenge of the Brave shows she's actually very skilled in martial arts and combat.
Also fun fact: Queen Ariana is voiced by the same actress who played Claire Dunphy in Modern Family and Varian's voiced by Jeremy Jordan, who voiced Winn Schott in Supergirl.
Really? Julie Bowen? Oh my gosh.
Athena looks great in the rapunzel hair
6:31 Woah, woah, woah. “Falling”? Are we going to ignore the fact that the lizard TRIPPED HER? He is a hero
THE WAY I SCREAMED WHEN I SAW THIS, THIS IS LITERALLY MY HYPERFOCUS, THANK THE GODS ABOVE (also your lack of explanation for "be very afraid" makes me mad because it's so important for Varian's character)
I remember seeing commercials for this show and seeing cass with blue magic hair, like when did disney greenlight my fanfics???
There was so much that went on in this show and all the writers gave it their all for absolutely no reason.
that's the best part
Now I wanna see the Ever After High lore recap so badly (especially the part with two dead bodies in a well)
Athena used a Centaurworld audio clip halfway through the video which means SHE KNOWS WHAT IT IS!!! So I desperately need her to make a video on it
I can’t communicate how desperately I need you to make a video on Varian and the Seven Kingdoms lore, I promise we’re a dedicated fandom, we have enough content-
32:34 i always found it so wild that Repunzel just LET THE GUARDS THROW A 14YR OLD OUT INTO A SNOW STORM and didnt even think about if she should go make sure Varian/His dad were alive
3:43 one of my friends really liked tangled as a little kid so from ages 3-7 she would answer the door holding a frying pan threateningly and hit anyone she didn’t immediately recognise. This included her parents several times.
I wish companies would just go the TV series route instead of doing movie sequels. I've never even seen Tangled yet, but watched and liked the tv series.
This video's entire vibe of "No, shut up, Disney, they're poly!" Gives me so much life. I'm thriving.
Flynn in 2D kinda looks like one of the Wild Kratts 😭
Bruh that exactly what i said
Chris right? He's the brown haired one
He had a hotter character design in the cgi movie. Gothel also looked better in the cgi movie in my opinion.
I personally choose to believe that the Moonstone and/or Zhan Tiri did mess with Cass’s head and her perception of how bad things were with Rapunzel to get her to do a lot of those things. It just feels like less of Cass’s character is assassinated this way, because there were a few times where Rapunzel was a little inconsiderate or Cass’s feelings of being overshadowed were valid but never to a degree that would justify that reaction. I think she grabbed the Moonstone intentionally because she felt like less than, and after that it was a push and pull of it driving her kind of crazy and her having more lucid moments like when she almost let Rapunzel talk her down until something was said that triggered her anger again or when she fully regretted her actions and wanted to apologize until she was attacked and the Moonstone was able to capitalize on any negative feelings that caused. It also explains why Cass is nothing but remorseful and upset with herself the second the Moonstone is away from her. Might be a copout but I just think this is how they can have their cake and eat it too. Changing literally nothing else, if they just made it clear at a few points that Cass wasn’t in her right mind, they can have the villain arc but still say she’s a good person with some unresolved issues. Leaving it ambiguous really only hurt the arc.
Before I even watch all of this, I actually think the tangled movie is one of the cutest and interesting version of the rapunzel tale.
Versions*
"when will my life begin?" more like how much life can Rapunzel live ☝ also the pan joke 🩷💛🩵
I'm so glad you've covered this, the sinkhole of lore just keeps getting deeper the more you watch
Me if I was rapunzel: well sorry I was kidnapped and wasn't allowed to have contact with the outside world for 18 years.
There's actually a book called "what once was mine" (official Disney book, it's part of a series which is basically alternate universe versions of princess stories) and the premise is what if the queen drank a moon flower, and it like gave Rapunzel silver hair and I think just touching her kills people? I never finished it unfortunately, but it definitely was a bit darker, maybe like pg 13 instead of pg like the usual Disney stuff
tangled was underrated, it deserved more seasons. it was really damn good.
1:12:50
Immediately after seeing the characters' designs from Varian and the Seven Kingdoms, I saw Hugo and went "yup, that's his boyfriend. They got matching clothes"
Bro I love the movie because it was awesome but that SERIES
Was something else 😭, Cassandra was my fav 💖
I watched this entire series for ready as I’ll ever be, that song changed my brain chemistry, I can’t hear the phrase without almost breaking out in song. I had seen the first episode when I was little though, I wanted to hang out with Varian so bad.
(I also didn’t know there was a pre show movie-episode until now 💀💀)