Can FDM 3D Prints be Food Safe?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 พ.ค. 2024
- This video takes a quick look at some of the reasons why FDM 3D prints are not food safe and how to solve those issues.
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Layer lines are not your downfall! You can address those too! To print food safe things with my FDM machine, I use HIPS plastic from Filamentum (which they certify as food safe) with a stainless steel nozzle. Then I vapor smooth the layer lines using limonene, which is not a harsh chemical and is actually used in small quantities as a flavoring agent in some drinks. All issues addressed!
I haven't heard of any of this! Thanks for the advice, this is valuable info!
Excellent, thanks
do you by chance know of a good documentation/video on how to make FDM prints food safe using limonene?
@@danielg9927 - I might make a video about it myself, but all you have to do is put your part into a "vapor bath" like so many people do with ABS and acetone here on TH-cam. In fact, HIPS will dissolve in acetone as well, so you can use that instead of limonene, although I don't know why anyone would.
@@alexsalchemy I will note that using limonene does carry some risks. It is a skin irritant that rapidly penetrates the skin and can take other chemicals with it. When exposed to naturally occurring ozone, limonene converts into formaldehyde, which is a carcinogen. Anecdotally, I've been cautioned by chemists I trust to avoid it, as it might trigger a latent citrus allergy. I'm not saying it can't be safely used (gloves, mask, good ventilation), but I might recommend isopropyl smoothing as IPA is very safe and evaporates quickly so you know its gone after a minute or two.
For sake of argument let's say that a nozzle can lose 10% of its mass to erosion before its print quality is unacceptably low and it needs to be replaced. That means over its lifetime it can dump a harmful amount of lead into your prints - 4 mg. However, if you're able to get multiple prints out of a nozzle, that's going to be spread out over its lifetime. If you can get a hundred prints before replacing your nozzle, that means we're down to 0.04 mg lead per part - most of which will be sequestered inside and not on the surface. If we again pluck a number out of thin air and say that 10% of that will leech into your food over time, we're down to 0.004 mg - 4 micrograms. If one expected that leeching to happen all at once - dumping its fully fury into the very first it comes into contact with - you could simply wash it.
Now with all that said, if I were to open a restaurant with the shtick that all the dishes were 3d printed, I'd still use stainless steel nozzles to avoid any liability. But for home use? As a gimmick I'm only going to use a few times? I think a brass nozzle is far less hazardous than printing with the wrong filament or bacterial growth.
Yup, a lead test showed that many prints exhibited 0 detectable traces of lead over thousands of hours of prints. Basically...your tap water is worse.
Yeah, i'm pretty sure we oldtimers that lived with crap that was painted in lead paint, and got a good dose of the leaded fuel exhaust gases probably have more lead in the system already than you could ever take up from 3D printed plastic. Still, every microgram that can be avoided is a good thing. It will not kill you like a lead bullet to the brain, but why not avoid as much of it as possible, especially if it's as easy as swapping the brass nozzle (and all the other potential brass parts like bowden couplers and extruder drive gears) for a cheap non-brass or at least hard coated replacement part.
Yeah that's fair. I'm trying to approach this from an item you'd feel 100% comfortable selling to another person.
It's not really clear to me why so many people consider something that contains layer lines to not be food safe. It seems to me that there are many kitchen utensils with little surfaces, nooks and crannies that are of similar size as layer lines, yet we use and clean those without problems. Sometimes certain areas of blenders, food processors etc are actually impossible to clean. Sometimes plastic parts will have a 'scratchy' surface that under a microscope are formed similar to layer lines.
Now surely all of that might be problematic in itself, but sometimes it's as if standards go way up when we're talking about 3d printed parts.
The same thing goes for brass really. There are many brass kitchen implements and utensils on the market.
I do the argument about filament materials holds merit. Many manufacturers provide close to zero information about the recipe and additives, and even when they do it's unclear how clean the production process is. So probably best to opt for something the manufacturer guarantees is food safe.
shhhhh if they actually get the word out that you can print your own things, they loose money. I have to find the actual lab test that did swabs to show layer lines had zero effect on normal use and cleaning for food.
I would not worry about layer lines if the plastic can be heated to boiling water temperature without melting. For a good sterilization, it would be ideal to get it to 121°C (under pressure) for 15 minutes. This kills everything except for Prions. If the plastic handles 80°C for 30 minutes, this is already a pretty good value that kills most bacteria and yeast. Just a few viruses and fungal spores survive that treatment.
@@elitewolverine who are "they"?
@@beepboop8184 the same people that pay literal millions to protect their interests
Yeah you're probably on to something. I'd rather air on the side of caution in a video I'm releasing to the public. I'm also viewing this through the lens of most hobbyist 3D printers where PLA and PETG are the materials of choice. The layer lines may not be the real culprit but not being able to heat the object to a sanitizing temperature + time is what I thought the real underlying issue was.
But I'm willing to be wrong and this article got suggested: "Sanitization efficacy for safe use of 3D-printed parts for food and medical applications" by matt thomas. And it "shows that ordinary dish soap and water are totally sufficient to remove 90% or more of all of the pathogens he tested"
you could also probably use a material like PSU or PPSU that can go in a dishwasher to solve that last issue.
I hadn't heard of these plastics before, thanks for suggesting them. Looks like they print at 350-380°C. That's outside the temperature range of most hobbyist printers. Do you have experience printing with PSU and PPSU?
@@3DPrintStuff yeah I have an ended 3 v2 with a copperhead hot end from slice engineering that’s good up to 450c and an enclosure that can get to about 60c, which can get you some decent sized parts in those materials as well as Ultem and PAEK’s, all of which are materials I have at least some experience with. They’re not cheap but not totally unattainable on a hobbyist printer.
@@3DPrintStuffgenuinely impressed ur science is right on the money I mean haven't checked the math but content by weight considering leeching out especially with heat.
Spot on
@@3DPrintStuffgenuinely impressed ur science is right on the money I mean haven't checked the math but content by weight considering leeching out especially with heat.
Spot on
Thank you! Informative. PETG might be one of the best choices for filament, as it can be washed in a dishwasher.
Great point, I'm thinking about maybe doing a video where I put different filaments in the dishwasher and see how they deform.
PETG is borderline but works. I have thick wall vase mode PETG cups that have survived regular dishwasher use for a year or so, but undergone some minor deformation. Thicker would be better probably, but an annealable material like PET or PLA, annealed, would hold up even better. PLA is hard to anneal because it's soft and totally deforms at annealing temperatures, but PET is hard in the 82-100°C range ideal for annealing.
@@daliasprints9798 I've seen some success with annealing PLA -and PETG- in Green Sand. Parts need to be solid and filling with perimeters is better than 100% infill. Super thin sections can still deform.
@@kevinbevin2 PETG isn't annealable. That's the whole point of the "G" in PETG - the glycol prevents crystallization. It's remeltable to eliminate layer line weaknesses, but that won't increase heat stability like annealing would.
@@daliasprints9798I’ve been using 3D printed parts as a cup for drinking (cold only), and a plate to eat food. Due to the ironing there are zero visible layer lines although I know they’re still there.
I’m just using regular matte PLA and handwash after every use. Is this that bad? Stainless steel nozzle and all that.
Thank you so much for the short, straight-to-the-point delivery with this video!
You're welcome, thanks for the positive feedback :)
What people seem to not understand is that it is not safe or unsafe, there is a huge grey area. Usually the coloring is most critical when it comes to leaching chemicals. To truly be food safe you need to know exactly what is in your material, and a range of other data such as the expexted usage/time of using. Some injection molded sauce caps are only safe in combination with a minimum content in a bottle for example, and an expexted lifetime of 6 months.
virgin is best or just buy it from a company that marks it foodsafe as that means no bichemicals are used that are not food safe.
I agree there is a huge grey area. This video only really scratches the surface.
@@elitewolverine you are missing the point, no plastic is truly food safe as they all leach chemicals. Depending on the use case that can be acceptable for food applications.
A bigger concern for most people would be lead in brass plumbing connections before worrying about lead in 3d printer nozzles, having said that like you say, if it costs similar amount for a brass vs steel nozzle - why not go for the stainless steel one...
Yup, really just a precautionary thing.
Alright, don't eat the brass nozzle. Got it.
Yup that's it.
Also something to consider is all of the plastic/micro/macro plastic fibers that are created during printing that will end up in the food which has now, at least partially, been shown to result in very serious even life long gastrointestinal issues by becoming embedded in the lining that can ultimately require very invasive surgery (removing the whole colon). It's not an exclusively FDM issue, but at the same time why risk just for the sake of using 3D printed parts with food.
That is worth keeping in mind. More and more plastic is out there in the world. Hopefully someone can come up with an eco friendly filament that we can ingest without worrying.
look up "Sanitization efficacy for safe use of 3D-printed parts for food and medical applications by matt thomas"
Thanks for the suggestion, that is very interesting. Layer lines don't seem to be a big deal as long as proper cleaning is performed.
Good stuff.
Thanks.
so how much brass is in your home water supply ... also how much lead in the form of solder ... just asking
What about printing cups for water, etc.? I’ve been using one for a bit thinking it was safe lol
Do hardened steel nozzles/nozzle-x contain any lead? I've been using SS nozzles for years but have struggled to find anything about hardened steel containing lead
This is a good question. Hardened steel shouldn't contain any lead but that's not a guarantee. 304 and 316 stainless steels are industry standard for food applications and are just the safer choice when choosing a nozzle. That being said most companies don't disclose what stainless steel alloys they are using, they just use the generic "stainless steel" title.
Nozzle-x appears to be a hardened steel nozzle with a "polyphobic" coating, I'd be cautious of anything with a coating that could potentially end up in your print. We don't know what the "polyphobic" coating is made of because that's a proprietary material.
0:25 that would be enough for nogo about printing for something has contact with food.
You wont escape from this problem no matter what. Only solution that would solve this is to use petg
and clean that with alcohol bath and leave it under uv lamp. I had printed few things for a friend that was working in a hospital while covid hit hard. He said that my prints (printing petg in highier temp range without fans) were good enough that they didnt qualify to throw out after first usage (or rather cleaning).
i printed stuff for locals out of petg, and indeed, just up it to 260, turn off part fan, run it a little fast to help with warp, and it was good to go.
What kind of items were you printing for your friend?
I think you are talking about food grade rather than food safe. Food safe is not for direct contact with food - it would need food grade for this. Food safe can good for something like a pot for a plant that then produces fruits that are safe to eat. For cutting fruits, you need food grade. And you are correct in your video, food grade needs all of what you are showing, food safe not so much.
My understanding is that food grade refers to the material itself: "Food grade means that the material is either safe for human consumption or it is okay to come into direct contact with food products."
and food safe is that the item is safe for the intended use: "Food safe means that a food-grade material is also suitable for its intended use and will not create a food-safety hazard."
By those definitions food safe is inherently food grade but food grade is not inherently food safe.
www.industrialspec.com/about-us/blog/detail/fda-compliant-food-grade-food-safe-meanings
Are any of the filaments that can be smoothed with isopropyl food safe? You could sterilize and smooth in one step!
tons of food safe filaments
Not that I'm aware of. Maybe someone else can come along with a plastic I don't know about.
I coat my food prints in food-safe resin. Covers the layer lines, easier to clean.
Cool to hear from someone doing this, have you noticed the resin chipping off or cracking over time? Do you hand wash it only or put it in the dishwasher?
but arent extruder gears and those ptfe tubing cupplers made of bronze to ?
I imagine that temperature and surface area contact plays a big part in how much lead could leak into filament.
That's a good point, any part making contact with your filament should be taken into consideration but the nozzle is the most likely to impart foreign material.
i used pla for ice trays and with brassd nozzle . haven notice anythig about health and i have ice every morning ? will i died
You’re probably fine. This video is overly cautious.
Can you use a food grade silicone instead of plastic?
You could definitely print a mold and make parts out of food grade silicone. You'd probably want to prime and sand your mold to remove the layer lines from the final part.
What about vapor smoothed ASA or ABS?
Neither of those are food safe even in pure form.
like @Hagantic said, ASA and ABS should both be avoided for food contact applications.
I was going to say you can't do that. it ruins the tram of your bed and puts contaminants on the bed so it won't stick.
You're not wrong haha
Very interesting topic I have not seen anywhere else. As some comments say, I think It would be interesting aswell taking into account if the materials are safe at 60-70ºC with water, since that are typical conditions in a dishwasher ("eco" mode can lower the temperature to about 50ºC, in exchange of time, but the user must be aware of the limitations).
Also, this can mitigate the problem with the layer lines, since the dishwasher should kill most bacteria.
If you find this topic interesting, I will be more than happy to see a future video about it.
dishwasher will not kill bacteria in 70ºC in atmospheric pressure. it wouldn't even fully penetrate biofilm in grooves betweeen layers. also most 3d prints are not water tight, even with 100% infill, so it's possible for bacteria to grow inside of prints.
While writing this video I wrote off dishwashers as an option thinking that they must get too hot for most 3D printing filaments. But you're right 60-70ºC is the typical dishwasher temperature after doing some research and that is a high enough temperature to sanitize. So there's definitely more to look into.
@@3DPrintStuff Thanks a lot for taking the time to answer to my comment. Looking forward to see future content.
@@sigmarpriest_ While you are probably right, I wonder if the same amount of requirements are fulfiled by of-the-shelf kitchen products (no gaps between unions where bacteria can grow, no scratches, etc). My guess is no. It is probably better to be on the safe side, but if a run on the dishwasher does not kill most bacteria we would have troubles with most of the kitchen stuff, even with no layer lines and watertight sealing.
what about vase mode?
layer lines?
Like zloe said, layer lines are still and issue in vase mode.
@@3DPrintStuff I thought vase mode eliminated them huh
@@3DPrintStuff With vase mode there is no virtually unreachable interior space to facilitate microorganism growth that can't be cleaned.
@@daliasprints9798 You do realize that FDM printers still print by stacking layers, right? Vase mode or not, doesn't matter how you slice your object. Just coat the print in food safe epoxy if you're really insistent on using 3D printed goods; else make it so that they never actually come in contact with food. Handles or other gadgets for your coffee thing, or clips or what not. Else use them with liners, like making a 3D printed mould or box or tray, putting a freezer bag and filling the bag instead - something like that.
What about SLA prints with plant-based or even biodegradable UV epoxy resin? At least the layer lines would be so thin or even non-existent that the bacteria problem would be solved.
Yeah you're right on this one. There are quite a few dental resins that are biocompatible but I haven't seen any that are specifically food safe materials. They aren't necessarily the same thing. I would feel pretty safe using dental resins for food applications but I wouldn't sell the product or offer it to others. Dental resins are also very expensive ~$300/kg, that's outside the budget of most hobbyist 3D printers. I don't know if we'll see those prices come down any time soon since dentists are the target market and they can afford to pay those higher prices and getting those resins certified is expensive.
Would need to check it under a microscope. Even if the layer lines are practically undetectable to us it doesn't mean it's not significant enough of an area for bacteria.
At the end of the day though we should probably compare to used kitchen equipment because I imagine a lot of stuff has been used enough to create similar levels of bacteria-friendly geometry yet we still consider those items "safe".
@@3DPrintStuff $250-$450/Kg and rated for one year, but only if you follow the validated post curing procedures which change depending on brand, eg post curing 20 minutes under a light while submerged in 60° Celsius glycerine, and repeating the procedure if you grind/sand the surface
as a manual bed leveling enjoyer cutting on the food on the print bed spiritually hurt me
I'm sorry for your pain.
Just boil/steam the items to sanitize. 100C is not hot enough to deform most materials. You can sterilize at lower temp, longer time.
That only kills germs. Materials can still be toxic.
@@lebojay hence why you buy food safe materials and there is many out there.
This is a good point. Maybe I'll have to do a follow up video about lower temperature sanitizing.
Great video but I have a few disagreements. They are not certified food safe. There is no regulatory agency with any standards on FDM 3D printing food safety. No company can independently audit and thus "certify" food safety in accordance with any regulations. They simply do not exist. Companies can put forth their best efforts but I would be careful saying they're "certified". My first question is by whom?
Also is there any evidence to suggest that layer lines are a breeding ground for bacteria? I continually hear this but it just sounds like conjecture. Has anybody actually studied this? I have not personally found a research paper on the subject but I may have missed one so if you know please share.
Plastics for contact with food are regulated by the FDA. The material can be and is FDA approved, there are also European standards that cover plastics for food contact ((EU) 10/2011).
Here are 2 out of the 11 regulations that the material I received meets:
Section 2019s0 of the Federal, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, and Parts 182, 184, and 186 of the Food Additive Regulations.
(EU) Plastic Regulation 10/2011 as amended.
They are not covering 3D printing, they are covering the base material and the coloring additives.
I am probably just being overly cautious on this point. This article has been suggested by others: works.bepress.com/MAThomas/1/ that suggests there are simple protocols to clean 3d prints to meet a food safe state.
@@3DPrintStuff Right that's kind of my point. The base plastic can be medical grade for all I care. Without specific regulations on the manufacturing process it really does not matter how good the materials were prior.
@@Leviathan3DPrinting Are you referring to the manufacturing of the filament? or the 3D printing process of creating a part?
PETG is food safe, just dont microwave it.
It can be, as long as the color additives are also food safe and the manufacturer has good manufacturing practices.
the video only talks, doesn't show. Even the lead nozzle is a false equivalency. Per tests done of material through a nozzle. It has shown that there was 0 traces of lead on thousands of hours of prints. It was so small that it was safer than the water you drink.
Next material, this of course is a good one, avoid colors and fillers and you basically are good, though still go with the ones that say food safe.
Last, layer lines. If it is big enough for bacteria to grow, it is big enough for stuff like hydrogern peroxide, bleach, soap etc to clean. Don't leave your items out long enough for mold etc to grow and you are good to go.
Micro scratches happen all the time on plastic wear, sometimes far worse than layer lines.
If you redid this test by using a lead detector on prints, then a bacterial swab and growth analysis with cleaning then retest...then this video has something. Otherwise your just repeating talking points.
Thanks for the feedback, I'll keep it in mind for the next one.
So you need a new channel called Injection Mould Stuff?
Maybe someday and "CNC Stuff", "Laser Cut Stuff", "Forge Stuff" and many more haha.
I think we worry too much.
The sponge I use to wash my dishes has a gazillion of hairs on one side, and pores on the other (it is a sponge!)
The Dishwasher often has small amounts of food left on it.
We eat mouldy cheese!
My toothbrush has bristles.
Plates have cracks
Cutting boards have scratches - some are even made of wood (though that is thought to be anti-bacterial).
Some stuff is wrapped in leaves.
But watch out for a layer line - that might kill you!!!
I like the examples you gave. I also agree that we do worry a bit too much in the 3D printing community. This article actually makes it seem like layer lines aren't that bad: "Sanitization efficacy for safe use of 3D-printed parts for food and medical applications" by matt thomas
If the porous wood is safe, then fdm printed tools are safe too.
It's not that simple.
Woods porous nature actually helps it absorb bacteria and dry it out as the wood dries. The worry with 3D printed plastic is that if bacteria finds a way into the print that means water is also finding it's way in and has no real way to evacuate the print. This creates a breeding ground for bacteria in the print. Prints with 100% infill are less likely to have this issue.
Here are a couple interesting articles/papers:
www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0362028X22020932
news.ncsu.edu/2014/09/cutting-boards-food-safety/
“Hardwoods, like maple, are fine-grained, and the capillary action of those grains pulls down fluid, trapping the bacteria - which are killed off as the board dries after cleaning,” says Ben Chapman, a food safety researcher at NC State.
@3DPrintStuff there are bacteria even in your mouth. So you can use 3d printed tool in the kitchen. I do not like too much theoretical worries
Wood can absorb fat which do not evaporate and it is perfect for bacteria feed. So if wood is ok,Cohen 3d printed object are ok too.
I am using cutters and other tools in our kitchen and it's ok. Nothing bad with them.
I don't understand what you need to print to be food safe. If you need a funnel go to the dollar tree and get a 3 pack for $1
All sorts of stuff. Anything that's in your kitchen has the possibility of being 3D printed. A cup to drink out of, measuring cups, spoons, spatulas, straws (gross), chopsticks, custom cookie cutters and all sorts of other stuff. Or if you're prototyping for food production machinery it'd be nice for those parts to already be food safe during testing.