ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2023
- The Dark Horse has returned and this time it is the most even matchup we could get. The same day, dyno, specs of the cars, gearing - you name it, it's the same on both cars... except for that Coyote under the hood. With 500hp vs 486hp from the factory, it's time to find out if the Dark Horse is really a dud, or if it lives up to the claims of the highest horsepower Coyote yet!
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Let’s see the manual comparisons
Yes, please let us see the manuals with the 2021 Mach 1 track/performance package.
Good stuff!!!! Steeda just gets after it and gives you the results...No BS...thank you Steeda!!!
nice test, thanks for running same equipment, transmissions, day etc. It is appreciated.
Mach 1 makes more hp to the wheels than a dark horse....wow
Well there video on the 2021 mach 1 made 409hp in 6th gear so 1 gear higher. Plus for both they said their dyno runs lower then others.
@kevsar123 but the mach 1 was ran on the same dyno as the s650..... mach 1 must be underrated a good bit.
@@jamescundiff3264 Slightly underrated, not like BMWs but same concept. They run the engines hot multiple times and they take the lowest heat soaked number as the crank HP.
True I believe both are on their dyno seen a few othe videos where the dark horse was at 440hp.
@@kevsar123 that was a manual that made 440, these cars they compared are 10 speeds
Man do a stick shift comparison please! The autos are cool but the manuals make more than,”a little bit more” power compared with the lazy trans
Yes of course do manual. Thank you!! You guys rock!!
Wow. What a great and informative video. Am I the only one that noticed the Mach has more power than stated? Can't wait to get my Mach 1.
Great video thanks 👍
Pretty good numbers. You can have your heart broken watching certain yr vids. Had mine dyno'd on E85, headers in 5th. It put down 420 so I wouldn't get discouraged
thanks for the information 👍
yes please! Manual shoot out!
I think that spoiler is perfect it really accentuate the rear end body lines
Yes do a manual comparison. I have a 2021 mach 1, interesting.
Good test! Yes please dyno a manual transmission with 3.73 torsen rear differential comparison.
Yes, please test the manuals. I have a 2020 Mustang GT manual with a Vortech supercharger that made 600HP to the wheels on 91 pump gas.
great comparison , yes do the same in the manuals s550 and s650 ,
Yes to the manual comparisons
Oh I also wanted to add that years ago when I was growing up we had to use manuals to get the power to the road.. Auto's were not at all like they are now.. There was a lot of drive train loss in the 80's and 90's auto's.. So Manual was the only way to go when I was growing up, And missing gears was a part of the game back then.. But now if you want a quarter mile car you gotta have an automatic with the paddle shifters.. If all goes well I'll be picking up my Newish 2017 Mustang GT manual.. And I have to say I didn't try to quarter mile the thing but it shifted smooth and felt fine too me.. IDK maybe I will see what everyone is going on about with the T82 trans later on but I'm getting it.. But I have scene the fix for it anyway if I notice any problems, I'll get the short shifter and the custom Bracket, that is made for them. It just feels great to be on a real platform now... It's only going to be a weekend car anyway but once I get my finances back to comfortable again than, I will probably get some bolts on's and a Tune..
The 82 trans is fine stock. It's just not holding up well to torque levels that a boosted GT can easily make.
Yes manual transmission comparison would be great.
so go with your favorite body style and boost it got it!
❤Thank you for sharing God bless you
What rims are those on the dark horse? Also Great Video!
20” Steeda Trident Wheels!
www.steeda.com/trident-wheel-breakdown
What about axle dyno numbers?
Please show manual shift comparisons. Just ordered a 2024 GT 5.0 so interested how they compare with manual transmissions
Manual transmission you get to pick your RPM at shift so its speed will entirely depend on you and how fast you could shift as well as footwork. The vehicle also has to be able to take it
I thought these were manuals at first.. I am picking up my 2017 GT Manual tomorrow.. I have already scene a ton of vids about the T82 Manual.. Mine has 8,909 miles on it.. I didn't really go hard on the car when I test drove it.. I did do a 1st to 2cd pull and a 2 to 3 pull and everything felt smooth to me.. But the last time I drove a Manual was like 30 years ago. So the T82 felt great to me compared to what we had and drove 30/50 years ago.. I had a 1976 F-250 that I had to take off in second gear with.. It had the Granny Gear, for 1st gear.. We always had to rev up to down shift back in the day so, it was like riding a bike for me.. I do love the new automatic's!! I wish we had them back in the late 70's, 80's, and 90's..
Don't worry too much about the MT-82 boogeyman problems. I have a 15 GT with 85k miles and drive my car pretty aggressive every day. Shift quickly and dropping the clutch. Have not had an issue with my MT82. I think most people with problems are flat shifting into third on slicks to be breaking them at this point.
exactly....knock on wood no issues with my 2017 either@@christopherhaynes8633
@christopherhaynes8633 your body style is good along with his its the 18s that have the problem. I had a 03 manual, 13 manual and then a 18 manual. No issues until the 18pp1 manual. Aluminum shift forks broken twice on 2 transmissions. I bought the car with 6800 miles on it. Checked the sevice record 3rd and 5th had been replaced already prior to my purchase. I sold it to Carmax have a 10 speed now. Wish i would have did it first go around is my only regret. I was stuck on manual life being hard headed even tho i heard rumors prior to purchase. You guys with 2nd gen coyote should be good enjoy your vehicles theyll hold up. Just stay away from 3rd gen manual lol
I've owned several new cars over the years. Proper full break in mileage is always somewhere between 5k and 20k miles from my experience.
Manual test YES
yeah let's get dem manual numbers!!
I know you can’t run 7th so it seems the numbers are more than fine. The numbers should be higher using the 1 to 1 7th gear.
Did you guys remove the carbon traps before testing them?
What are carbon traps?
GT did not have the carbon traps removed. Not sure about the DH.
Just made me want a Mach 1 even more
Manual comparison please!!!
Do it again after first oil change. I felt a 100% difference after my first one.
Butt dyno lol
@@pawg206 I'm clear, but I truly believe that the cars have a break-in programmed into the first oil reset. My personal experience with two 20 gt performance pack cars is that they felt stronger after 5k and an oil change.
@@spckovack my pp2 felt faster then my now base model gt and that’s supposed to be lighter. Your right I think it has to do with the stock tune from factory.
The GT performance was about a half second faster than the DarkHorse, on other respected mustang TH-cam channel comparisons.
Isn't this a track car? Where 0-60 matters like once
Everyone’s doing dyno runs instead of drag racing them. We’ve seen the dyno numbers so many times already
Theybaren't running the time because they are pigs. So, to determine if it actually makes more power, a side by side dyno test would be easier than getting both cars to the same weight and drag racing them.
Would the wheels make a difference? The Dark Horse does have the trident wheels
Woke Hores gets -20hp based on name alone.
@@RSProduction18 overall it’s got a way better stout motor, but not worth the extra money.
Manual comparison please.
Mach 1 still seems like it is beating Dark Horse consistently! LOL 🤣
I wonder if the Dyno is a tuning tool and numbers may vary between tools? Please advise
Disregard if your comment was sarcasm.
Different dynos, different temperature, different humidity, different height above sea level, different tires (yes drag radials show less hp on a dyno), different barometric pressure, different gear ratios, all play a factor and influence numbers
@@fartdonkey8290 it was (sarcasm)
Yes, please run a manuals!!!
“At the end of the day?” What about the beginning of the day or better yet the middle of the day?
I’d never use the suspension upgrades from the dark horse so those additional 10HP are not worth 20k for me.
Mach 1 owners rn. 🤴
The good old resonator deleter I
See.
😂😂😂
So the Dark Horse is right in line with a Mach1/Bullitt, both of which are rated 480, but dyno over DH by a few on average on Steeda dyno. Weird.
You could easily get another 40 to 35 horsepower out of the Dark Horse without any money and it could take 10 to 15 minutes to do it if you know what you're doing
What you see is with it not being adjusted
While percentage power losses give you an idea of drivetrain loss, they are not very accurate.
For example, a 480hp car makes 400whp which is a 16.6% power loss or 80hp.
Now if you supercharge this car and it makes 600whp, applying that same percentage loss means it is losing 120hp through the drivetrain.
From what I've seen, manual Mustangs are losing roughly 70hp and the autos lose 80hp.
Unless the drivetrain loss is measured on an engine dyno the numbers are guesstimates.
The generic 15-20% for auto makes sense still, but for a manual they have read as low as 10% up to 15% loss, You're better off working backwards and auto 18% and manual 13% (middle ground and it's pretty accurate)
In these examples, 24 GT is about 480hp and dark horse is about 504hp at the crank. which is still within the small gap for different conditions etc.
That's a loss of 86hp and 90hp respectively... with a manual that drops to about 60-75hp depending on the loss, but it shouldn't be more than 15% (probably less tbh).
I've seen quite a few dyno runs and the 13% rule seems more accurate.
So, the Mach1 makes a little more power AND is lighter than the Dark Horse?
Pretty sure mach 1 sport cup 2 tires are better too, going to be interesting to see if the dark horse can outrun the mach and gt350 at lightning lap.
I'm a manual guy but the auto trans doesn't lose as much HP as they used to. I know in muscle car circles especially Mustangs guys want to see those numbers but the reality is the 5.0 makes 400 wheel on a good day. Domestics don't underrate their cars because they know the customers get their pps hard with the big numbers.
Manual mach1s (stock tune) on youtube are putting down 450 at the wheel, auto loses a lot.
@@RSProduction18doesn't matter when the auto will beat it anyway.
@@jeffkelly9197 Truth.
My friends stock 2019 ecoboost 10 speed made 330wtrq stock.
a stock ecoboost makes 310 horsepower crank
@@seanvega387 yes I kno that, I didn't say anything about hp tho.
Now to a drag strip with drag radials on each to see the difference
Then when the result isn't what you want from the drag race what will be the next pivot? 😂 you could have not watched this video and actually went to your local track and found out. Video says dyno #'s not drag racing results..
Dark Horse is a waste of money. 10 more hp for $20k more, no thanks
hey you get an extra 200lbs with the car, maybe worth the $20?
@@anthonyglass1274 You're not accounting for the 10-20K dealer markups, which means you have zero clue what you are talking about!
@@anthonyglass1274your camparing apples to oranges. Last 2024 I saw was 45k so yeah 20k. I dont see why anyone would pick a s650 over a gen 3, mach 1 or gt350
@@anthonyglass1274 like I said your comparing apples to oranges. Only a smooth brain person would pick a fully loaded s650 thats 62k over a new mach 1 thats 58 to 62k. Plus mach 1 will hold its resale value way better
@@anthonyglass1274 But the Dark Horse has a dealer markup of at least $15k and the GT has no dealer markup
You guys are still "Beating the dead Horse"? No pun intended.... 🤭
Manual for sure!!
Manual please 🙏
Underdogs all day. Woof Woof. 🏆🏅🥇
Looks like the Mach 1 S550 is the way to go haha
How can a cars with the same transmission, driveshaft, similar rear ends have different drive train losses. Unless you are dynoing the other cars in a different gear it just seems like an excuse for the 2024 low numbers
This
Please do manuals
2021 manual mach 1 will eat a dark horse, dont get the detuned one.
The Dark Horse is selling more than the Shelby GT350 did can't believe this is happening after they said there would be no mark-ups.
Source?
Ya please lets see manuals on the dyno.
All respectable numbers for a daily street car.
Does this mean what the manufacturer advertises is not legit?? Thats a big difference in what you are paying for vs what is legit.
Auto puts down less power than manual, DH would get around 430 at the wheel with a manual.
And the dark horse with heavier rods!
I really don't care for the 2024 with that stupid interior but man that Dark Horse is full of air. I'd get a GT over that any day of the week.
interior lost all the lines that the mustang had for years. The new generation will like it, older generation is going to hate it. Its just a prep for the all electric mustang feel is my guess.
The base model gt manual is where it's at. That's what i have, and it really doesn't need anything else, plus it's a lighter car.
Another video about the geldings, huh? 🤣🤣🤣 You might want to check out the Hennessy video of the gt350r vs the dark gelding. Trust me it's worth a peek. 🤣🤣🤣
Mach 1 ftw
Mach 1 is making 505+ at the crank. Simple Math.
Yes please do manual! That's the ONLY way to buy a Mustang!
Except for one problem; dyno's are NOT accurate. No dyno will give the exact same reading twice, and no two identical dyno's will ever read the same exact thing. That's a fact Jack.
Content for these S650 is all the same and nothing impressive 😂
Run a Supra because I'm curious if it will still make around 390 to the wheels 🤣
If Ford would just unlock the tuning... There would be nothing to complain about. Who keeps a Mustang stock anyways??
I have a stock 2021 Mach 1 track/performance package. I waiting for the right parts, not what’s popular or what others have placed on their vehicles. I want to build up my engine without mucking it up. I will be happy with 500-700 rear wheel horse power as a daily driver. (Recommendations)
people who don't have 10k lying around for an engine replacement if something goes south and the dealer sees the ECU's been flashed a few times
isnt that dude selling his darkhorse ?
The unique looking dark horse front end was intended to look good, instead uniquely, cheap, and ugly. GT looks much better.
Yeah...you need a new dyno.
When a person can't defend it.."I don't get caught up in dyno numbers.." In what world? LOL
Mach1 more power
It’s stupid to pay 80k for only 12 more hp over a GT. Dark horse isn’t impressive to me. I’d buy a 350 over a dark horse any day. I own a GT500
Lucky man
Manuals
Those 20's cost you 3hp.🤣
the only problem with these cars is they're mustangs
Its sad to see autos being bought when a manual is available.. .buy them while you still can People.
Would love to see manual runs.
ALSO, the more important thing to me, is power/weight ratio's compared to other cars, like camaro/challenger.
That is what wins races....
Unless Ford unlocks tuning these cars cannot be meaningfully modified and they are duds.
Lets see the Mach 1 manual vs Dark Horse manual. Stop playing. You know what we want.
Why do we keep saying they’re doing exactly what they should be doing. 405 wheel doesn’t equal 500 crank by any means with an 18% drive train loss. Lol. Math is not that hard of a subject. And weirdly enough the 2018 GT’s all ran higher numbers stock on the dyno than all the models posted. The question is, is the 5th gear the 1:1 gear? I can’t remember. Isn’t it the 7th on the 10R80? This poor dude instantly felt like he wasted his money on a dark horse. How many times we going to say dyno is just a tuning tool. Embarrassing numbers by ford.
Sounds like you're way more butt hurt than the people that are actually buying and enjoying these cars.
Because the gearing of the 10r80 in 5th gear doesn't hit redline on the dyno. 5.0 revs to 7500 so if the dyno run is 1k lower you are at least missing 10/15 hp. With an auto 420ish whp and 20 percent drive loss is easily 500 crank.There are many vids of the maual dark horse hitting 450 to the wheels. The auto dark horse will be faster than the manual regardless, so it's not like the 10 speed will under perform.
@@jeffkelly9197 drivetrain loss isn’t 20% on an auto. It’s around 15. We are really increasing the numbers because they’re so bad. Essentially the cars 483hp. It’s over rated. A not so new practice by ford. They did it with the terminator prior to it being boosted. They had to fix that. Let’s see what happens because the car as it stands is a disappointing joke.
@@TheCdM1981you are the guy that wants a refund from the shop who's dyno shows less than the one down the street
Wow.... so much for a 500hp mustang.... feels like a rip off 😅
Stupid drive train physics… GIVE ME MY HP’s BACK!
Haha. Ford's new "flagship" isn't really impressive is it ?
Buy a Camaro..more torque and more fun to drive! Has power down low where you normally drive , you do not have to rev the 6.2 to have some fun..its instant power!
Cat 4? Pft, barely even a tropical low.