Can Tesla FSD 12.3.3 Handle RAIN?!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 เม.ย. 2024
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The car should be driving as safely and comfortably as possible, which means that it should be driving like a calm and relaxed taxi-driver that is taking immense caution to protect its passengers and will only be as assertive as it needs to be, not an aggressive driver who wants to get to their destination as quickly as possible. Safety and comfort should be the priority, not aggressiveness.
Unless you can select an 'aggressive mode'.
robotaxis should be this cautious… i imagine Waymo in SF is even more careful… FSD is the path to that
I'm surprised that your car doesn't stop and ask you to get out with all your complaining. 😉
😂
i would :))))
At this point in time, I'm honestly thinking that the car is a better driver than he is, lol.
@@AndreB23 💯
The more you complained
The more I felt the car was a safer driver.
He admits he's not in a hurry this trip yet complains about little inefficiencies. The future is get in, do your non-driving activities and get out at your destination. No stress about saving seconds.
Was it safe? That’s the metric you should be measuring. People a way too impatient. That’s what causes accidents.
Meh... There's more to driving than just safety. When taken to the limit, the safest thing to do in certain cases is to not move at all.
If FSD is to satisfy all the "I would have" it will never get done. Safety is the main issue and not for a nervous aggressive driver like yourself.
Even the best driver can't see everything at any time. It will be better in that sense.
The kids I've seen from the band of Mustakeers suggests otherwise.
I dont think youlle ver be 100% happy about it. It will always be like someone else driving and not like you driving.
you shouldn't be using private land to do short cuts for your public driving.
The States are way over the top about "private land" In the UK you'd just have someone moan at you for being inconsiderate or they might resort to a gate.
Think there is nothing wrong with the car . The driver on the other hand ...... :)))) Chill bud
Losing 20s in traffic is not a big deal. Especially when FSD is ready you can sit in the car with laptop and do almost everything you do sitting at home.
Elon once said the car will take the route it knows it can complete. Would be nice to be able to modify the route.
More impatient comments from the Good Dr. Is he really calling a two-minute difference a failure??
The title asks if 12.3.3 can handle rain and I was curious what you found because I had a phenomenal experience with v11 back in November when I found myself in a snowstorm getting from SLC to Park City Utah. It was dark and the snow was so heavy that I could not see the lines or the guard rail (I was in the left lane so I would only have cars on one side), but FSD Beta v11 handled it great. It kept telling me it was degraded but the traffic display clearly showed the lines and cars around me,. The traffic was very heavy and driving fast and close together and without FSD I would have had to figure a way to get across 3 lanes of traffic and get off at the next offramp and wait it out. Truly blew me away. About 2 months later I found myself driving from Santa Monica to San Luis Obispo and there was driving rain most of the way and although I had trouble seeing the road several times, FSD v11 did just fine. Very reassuring to look at the screen and see the lane ahead of me was clearly shown.
Great commentary. I find the same kind of things with local tips and trips. This morning car wanted to make a right turn off a major highway where there was no right turn lane with slowing down being a hazard and it should have used the intersection it used this morning going to my destination.
Car did great, the crazy driver is the passenger in this case
I have the same problem in my town where navigation always wants to take me through a very busy section with 4 stop lights in about five blocks with three lanes of very busy traffic. The route I like to take might be one minute longer and sometimes shorter but it's 2 two lane roads with very little traffic. What I did was breakdown the drive so that it goes the first mile to where I want to go when I get there I turn it off and reset the navigation for my next destination and then when I've reached that destination I turn it off and put in my final destination after doing that for several months now the car gives me that route as an option which I choose and it takes.
The thing that bothers me most is when putting in a series of destinations you have to start from your end point say destination d then put in C then b then a which really seems backwards to me. I should put in my first destination then the second destination then the 3rd and then my final destination. At least that's the way I think I need to go here first then there second and so on.
Thank you and I did watch your 10 things video.
_I should put in my first destination then the second destination then the 3rd and then my final destination._
One can argue about which is the more logical order, final destination first or first destination first; but you can enter first destination first, etc., and then just select "Edit" and drag the destinations into the correct order.
If you use voice to change routes, the car will do an automatic "END TRIP" and recalculate the route to the new destination. So one of my trips is "Navigate to H2", "Navigate to H3," "Navigate to Home", each issued at the right time for the next route to be done the way I like it. I believe we should be able to design routes with vias that do not terminate the trips, but simply permit our preferences to be honored. It would be good if the car would remember previous decisions, as well. Maybe some day.
I had this the other day in Texas. It took it waaay too easy in the rain on a straight highway by limiting my speed limit well below the normal flow of traffic. Even after the rain dried up, it was still wicked slow and wouldn’t go back to normal speed until 15 mins dry road.
I'm in U.K. and about your age Dr Know It All. I am aware - and still learning - that I need to make allowances for other road users sub-optimal driving skills I'm aware that I will always need to make these allowances because most drivers will never improve.
THANK YOU for doing the vid. So far except for a few times in stop-and-go interstate traffic, FSD did great for me in a modest rain.
BTW, are we at dual stacks again, with V11 handling the highway driving and V12 doing secondary roads? Or is Ego ever at V12, now?
I wonder if you've ever lost control in the rain? I have. At least four times. The first time produced a minor fender-bender. I was able to control two of the others before any collisions, but they were quite memorable (one was on an Interstate in Atlanta) and none of those three occurred at "excessive speed", in fact they were all at or under the speed limit. A forth was on a motorcycle and left me staring up through the rain trying to breathe around the pain of a compressed vertebra (fifth thoracic, if I remember correctly). Pain is an excellent teacher, and the lesson I learned you would consider paranoia, though I call it caution. I applaud FSD's "inefficient" choices that may have cost you five minutes, but reduced the chance of you having to deal for hours or days with the consequences precipitated by aggressive driving in adverse road or visibility conditions.
And you call that rain? *chuckles* The Georgia and Alabama skies are capable of dousing one much more thoroughly than the drizzle (ok, more than drizzle, maybe sprinkling?) of rain in the video. Looked more like a February San Diego shower than a Georgia spring rain. Even the mess I just drove back to Alabama through after watching the Eclipse in Marion, IL wasn't anywhere near the frog-stranglers we often have here, and overall I have to say that FSD 12.3.3 did an excellent job getting me home, sometimes setting the max speed down by five or even ten mph below the posted speed limit when the visibility was bad and letting me dial it up as much as I wanted to at other times. Worst behavior of FSD I had during the rainy leg of the trip was it refusing to change lanes at times, I think because it thought the spray from Perl's tires may have been another vehicle in her blind spot.
I've driven FSD in rain dozens of times including heavy rains. While you get the warning that FSD "may" get degraded only once has FSD ever disengaged since release V12. And when that occurred many ICE cars actually pulled over to the brake down lane on the interstate. Perhaps the heaviest rain I've driven in in over 40 years of driving.
I completely agree. I think it needs to think ahead just a bit more and set itself up for success. Just as in your examples.
In Google Maps you are typically offered a number of alternative routes and you can select the preferred one.
I should make detailed videos of the v12.3.3 performance on the hilly, twisty, blind dirt roads of my rural residence in northern New England...in the snow, in the rain, in the mud, on freshly graded gravel, etc. Plenty of opportunities to see FSD's hard limits, and plenty of failures. I'm confident that FSD's AI powered NN will grow to handle these complex ever-changing conditions, but FSD at this moment is unpredictable, and therefore unsafe, in many of the conditions I encounter (and report literally two dozen times) per 20 minute drive.
On the other end, FSD was absolutely brilliant on a 500 mile college visit to the congested, twisty, confusing roads of urban Massachusettes ...with zero interventions until the last 100 feet in parking lots. Mindblowing.
I agree, even in dry weather, FSD V12 is too aggressive for me on my local semi-rural and suburban roads. To be clear, it doesn't in my experience overdrive the road, but nudges into overdriving the potential surprises from pets/people/farm equipment and pickup trucks coming around the curve in the middle of the road straight at you at twice the posted speed limit.
On the plus side, FSD V12.3.3 doesn't drive so slow that it could not maneuver fast enough to evade oncoming threats (a little speed can be a very good thing, even defensively, to dodge those crazy middle-road-rednecks), so I'll yield to even the current FSD some credit on the twisty lanes, though I do NOT use auto-speed, preferring to be able to dial in best speed. Also, on the highway and secondary roads there-abouts, wow. I thought that base autopilot+TACC was enough for me, now I'm Jonesing for full time FSD in most of my driving, uh, supervising on the open road.
Crazy idea. The next time there is a hurricane you should see how FSD drives. I'm down to be your copilot. I've driven through the eye of category 4 hurricane just to see what it was like and it was awesome!!!!! Except for the destruction. But the power of the hurricane was amazing.
1:40 it only needs to come far enough forward to see around the corner.
Finally got V12 on my legacy X last night (12.3.4) and it drove me to the gym and back including my unmarked roads for the first time ever. I have to say it should pass the wife test as V11 was forbidden on all but interstates. One note though is it did not visualize or slow down/pull over for 2 emergency vehicles going the opposite way.
15:40 A few mph more doesn't make it. It's much harder to make up time once you're behind. It is a recipe for an accident. You have to figure out the timing of the lights. 22:09
We live in Florida mid state and had some torrential rain yesterday the car adjusted well, we felt safe with FSD. Later that day the car stopped 2 times at a stop light when it turned yellow two cars in left lane when through the red light, thought I was going to be rear ended because we stopped so fast, did not happen. What would better then human driver have done?
You don’t need a FSD CAR,,,,, YOU NEED a Chevy corvette,,, then you can go as fast as you want, not wait for traffic to clear,cut through parking lots, run stop lights, get in all of your ego tactics and then you can get to work 2 hole minutes faster. Great gob! I think you are a genius and I love your explanation of things ! I think Elon should get someone with more patience to test FSD. 😊
Impressive technology. It still needs refinement with lane selection, traffic flow, stop signs, ramp speed limits, etc. Hopefully this latest wide release will provide Tesla with the influx of data that they need to make great strides with FSD. Adding the ability to learn from mistakes (longer routes, high g-forces, intense stops, the need to pull forward to see, etc) would really accelerate fitting into new locales.
I’ve road tripped lately with 12.3.3 on a current Model Y. Something that is disconcerting is both when running FSD and when initiating it, if I’m on a dark unlit road or highway I get a message that the interior camera is blocked or blinded and FSD cancels or fails to start. Apparently there is insufficient light to monitor my attention.
Once the car can drive safely from point to point, then they can add different settings to closer match preferred driving styles.
I drive differently to my wife and my son drives differently to both of us, hard to please everyone with a few settings.
I totally agree with you, a human driver should be allowed to pick his favorite route and unless fsd finds a reason to deviate, such as construction or closed road, then it should reroute and continue. I think most drivers would appreciate to have that option.
V12 is still streets only per Release Notes. Easy way to tell is have Auto Speed set in V12 and when it switches to the V 11 Stack the Auto Speed will change to Max Speed.
It's not clear to me that a V12 stack will perform any better than the current one on access controlled highways.
This level of scrutiny MAY be appropriate in a year or so.
Safety is probably never going to be super efficient. (Time wise)
Thanks, buy not being picky That really isn't rain, light drizzel by UK standards and on a visit to Philly, I had to get to the airport from the city across the bridge and there was a BIG cumulus nimbus thunder cell dumping on the bridge, I think I drove about 15 mph IIRC there were certainly high wind notices as well: visibility was definitely highly impaired. even with wipers on fast. I'd like to see it dealing with that.
Definitely 75% improvement but the car still have huge lane management issues the same here in Toronto Canada, there is an other update 12.3.4 coming! Hopefully we will see some changes and , I agreed that in the HWY is v11
I have been thinking about road trips with FSD. You want to stop at a restaurant with no
Supercharger nearby so send it to charge. We need it to plug in somehow eg wireless charge!!
A Stack Of Errors going slow and following a slow car then missing the green light - - EXACTLY what I experience most days on U.K. roads following human drivers who have no idea how to make better progress. FSD is not confident yet in all circumstances
It is not more important to ensure that FSD works 100% of the time and then worry about nuanced details?
In a lot of situations, my FSD 12.3.3 will slow down significantly for no reason. Sometimes in the same place it won't slow down. I can't figure it out. In city driving, I set the speed limit to 10 mph over the speed limit and it keeps slowing down to even below the speed limit. Very frustrating when this happens and I just go out of FSD. FSD won't let me just use cruise/autopilot. Sometimes I want to set the speed and not let FSD frustrate me. Going overly fast or overly slow is not good.
You had a good idea in a previous video about allowing the driver to converse with the FSD software to make modifications on the driving behavior. IE FSD: "drive 10 miles over the speed limit". Or FSD:" get in the center lane" etc.
Then it's not FSD.
The car is driving carefully-its fine!!!
I have had several cars with LKA and every one drops out in a torrential rain storm. Wonder how R.T. will react to encountering a torrential rain storm while on a trip.
Navigation system needs improvement! Every day I drive to my destination i disengage FSD to take a shorter route with fewer stoplights for over 2 years. I know none of my many friends who take the route Tesla navigation wants to take. I agree about local routing, 98% of my disengagement is for this reason. I love FSD, not so with faulty nav!
What were the lights blinking above the mirror when the car went under the overpass (9:37)?
Question re AI training. When Tesla start to train the next version, do they have to start with a blank slate and train on the entire video set, or can they take the current version and just add the extra training videos?
John
It would be interesting for you to time your route when you drive it and tell us what percentage slower V12.3.3 is!! Is it 50,40,30,20 or 10% slower. What is your guess? Is your guess correct?
Done a few drives with FSD V12 in rainy weather. The kind of rain V11 handles well. But V12 seems to respond poorly, overly cautious in rain, much worse than in good weather. All the impressive nuances go away in rain - eg handling unprotected left and right turns easily, simple lane changes going the right speed. Almost like they have handicapped it with less than perfect weather. Maybe guardrails on in rain. Maybe the are waiting to train it with more 'poor' weather videos.
What are the flashing lights above the rear view mirror?
FSD needs to allow preferred routes that people can program to memory.
Also FSD is about you not worrying about traffic. Give yourself time and let the car do its thing.
4:11 No manufacturer will program the car to run a red light.
Safety >>>>>> your impatience
1:15 it doesn't need wipers.
John, How about if you put in a destination in the mall on the way to work to fool the car into going the way you want
I could be wrong, but when you enter the first " faster road," there is no immediate speed sign to read, so how would it know that it has entered a faster speed area?
It goes by Map data in the Navigation Data file until it ‘sees’ a sign.
A bot trained on the best human behavior can be better than the best human because no single human is the best at everything. The best basketball player at the free throw line may not be the best at the three-point line or the best under the basket or the best guarding the basket or stealing the ball, but a bot trained on the best of the best can best human players at all of these tasks. I don't expect any humanoid bot to best human basketball players any time soon, but you get my point.
Another advantage of FSD is that it's not annoyed by backseat (or passenger seat) drivers who never want to drive themselves but always want to tell the driver what to do ... like my wife and Dr. Know.
Better than a bus driver!
So is this not really 12.3? You indicated in a recent video uoure still on version 11? True/False?
I would rather trust FSD to be the soccer mom rather than Dr. driving impatiently and at maximum speed limit.
V12.3.3 is a great driver, Doc Know-nit all in the other hand…
Take the keys from this man lol
I love most of your videos, Dr. K-I-A but I can’t watch the whole thing here without taking a Valium as your impatience and incessant complaining about how it’s not driving fast enough, not always choosing the fast lane, not speeding up when it sees the yellow light, compensated slightly for less than ideal weather etc. is making me very thankful that the car has been learning from the best drivers, not the aggressive drivers such as yourself. IMHO, if your viewers were to rate its driving style to yours, it would have the higher score. People need to be comfortable in Robo-Taxi, not biting their nails anxiously because it drives like you.
Backseat drive much?
Would you care about all of this if you were only a passenger and didn't pay attention? Likely not.
I can be an impatient driver too, but I found that when I'm using Autopilot I care much less. Sometimes I don't even notice that I'm stuck behind a slow driver.
Were you in assertive or chill mode?
Yeah it's not perfected but the core value of autonomous driving seems to be there?
Fifteen years ago you might have thought beta was science fiction. 12 sv is a newborn. Let it take baby steps and improve. It would be crazy if the software were "aggressive" at this point. Let it be conservative unless they can customize a bespoke version for you.
If it cannot handle rain how is it going to be in the snow?
I very much enjoyed your video on top ten things that need to be fixed in unsupervised FSD so I don't know why that one would be unpopular. The only thing I can think of is that in general, your videos are being watched by Tesla fan boys, and there is a fairly high percentage of them who simply don't want to hear anything negative about Tesla. Ever. Talking about 10 things that need correcting might have sounded overly negative to these people.
Seems to me it should be 100 things he doesn't like!
😊
Dr. Pourquoi autant de commentaires sur le fait que la voiture ne conduit pas comme vous? Le logiciel n'est pas complet et est toujours officiellement Niv.2... Ne devrions nous pas attendre Niv.4 peut-être avant de demander une conduite personnalisée pour cette solution généralisée. * A l'exception de certains points peut-être.
Merci pour votre contribution sur YT & X
2 lanes in a residential area 50 mph . Where the hell do you live . I live near a 2 lane 50 mph road . But as soon as you start seeing houses it drops to 35.
To teach a car how to drive itself at a safer-than-human level, you'll need to be able to accurately simulate how human drivers around it will behave. So all of the human driving data will still be useful, just in a different way - it will be useful for modeling human driving behavior for use in adversarial training rather than for direct emulation. Very weird to think about.
I'm sympathetic with FSD. I don't understand your rambling description of "local Knowledge" either.
Yea it drives like my wife
Love your content. But how do you know that the car isn’t optimizing lane choices better than you? I have a situation where I deal with this condition all the time. There’s a long line of people headed to the high school in the right lane, but I can get by five or six of them by going in the left line and cutting over. I’ve learned from experience if I go in the left lane, I’ll always be able to get over if there’s at least four cars that I can pass. This is because at least 25% of drivers are slow idiots. I strongly suspect that optimizing lane choice doesn’t do much of anything for speed or safety. In order to figure this out you would need to do the same operation millions of times over 1000s of conditions. But isn’t this exactly what neural networks do?
I predict that FSD will never perform in a way that satisfies you, because of your self-professed desire to micro-optimize travel time. It will be a long time before even assertive mode will be that devoted to "efficiency." This is not a criticism, just an observation.
Talk about rain.
My 2022 Model Y has rain sensors that activate the windshield wipers automatically.
But the Boy Wonder disconnected those sensors
and activated the wipers based on the low-resolution camera looking forward.
This makes a lot of sense to a middle school class of kids - dump the moisture sensors and save $2 a car.
To me, it has been a nightmare of Elon sending out software updates to try to make the vision-based
wipers work - a total failure. They turn on when not needed, and when needed, don't turn on.
What Elon and that middle school class he must listen to forgot
is that at 2 AM in the morning on a dark road, that low-resolution camera can't see mist building up on the dark windshield so it never turns on the wipers. Now, if they were infrared, this crazy scheme might work.
Penny wise and pound foolish must be Elon's motto these days.
Wipers definitely need work!
Pulling around the slower car wasn't a "mistake," it was a choice, based on a conservative driving style. We should not complain that FSD is a conservative driver. That is a factor in reducing the probability of accidents. Hate to tell you this, Dr K, but you are an impatient driver.
Again it your criticisms seem to against the laws. Yellow light you can go through if it is unsafe to stop. It was always in this video safe to stop, it did the correct thing. I feel the more I watch your videos it is you that is the unsafe driver.
Going under speed limit is what everyone should be doing. This should not be considered as an issue.
My fsd is good but speed unbelievable annoying no cruise anymore just goes full fsd so no cruise and wrong speed not good for a guy with a heavy foot fsd is at best 7 out of 10
Good lord John! the problem is the driver not FSD. I would not want to drive with you. Take a pill.
I think you put your own driving habits on FSD. And you seem to me quite an aggressive driver. The most efficient way is not always the most save. I think you will never be happy with FSD. FSD is not for you.
And I think FSD drives better than you do.
Ironically, John doesn’t realize he is a C- driver. Classic cognitive dissonance
You need to take a Prozac Doc…. Think about what you are complaining about when a Toyota “radar drive assist” cannot even keep car centered
V12.3.3 in my opinion is ready for unsupervised robo taxi
Small errors here and there are also made by human drivers
I much prefer safe cautious FSD to overly aggressive humans like you .
No offense
Please stop mugging in your thumbnails. It's annoying.
So whiney
I am tired of your complaining ,,,,so I am leaving ,,please stop and let me out !
It is time to say goodbye. Dr.Know-it-all Knows not enough to be of interest. 👎🏻📉