Do Vegan Men Give Women The Ick? (Vice Article Reaction and Discussion)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 พ.ค. 2024
- Today I'm discussing a Vice article that caused quite a stir in the vegan world last week: "We Asked Women If Vegan Men Give Them the Ick." We'll talk about the responses women gave in the article as well as the study the article was inspired by.
Vice article: www.vice.com/en/article/n7e58...
The study: link.springer.com/article/10....
The Protein Element in Nutrition by David McCay: archive.org/details/proteinel...
Intro 00:00
Vice article overview 02:47
The study 03:32
Meat & masculinity: brief history 12:22
Responses from Vice article 14:48
Final thoughts 22:10
Outro 23:56 - บันเทิง
Obviously ironic that the biggest “ick” is how 98% of these women answered the question. I’m looking at you, Martha 👀
I absolutely love your sense of humour. You could really double down a lot more with the cutting remarks- great job 😂❤😂❤😂❤
Thank you, Kerri. I had some fun with this one for sure 😂
So the majority is wrong and you are right and normal, right?
@@vovac8915 Normal? Your obvious implication that she ISN'T normal is just plain rude. Are you really that bent out of shape that the women who agreed with you expressed themselves in the most immature, fatuous way possible? Then again, if you thought you could do any better, you'd be doing so, not calling people abnormal in their comments.
I did have a girl who I was dating who broke up with me for going vegan.
Probably for the best since I now have a lovely vegan wife 😊
Happy things worked out for you! Sounds like you dodged a bullet.
These type of changes can really shake up a relationship! So happy you found your vegan person 🥰
Vice misrepresenting a study to create a clickbait title. There's a surprise. Sooner that septic excuse for a media outlet closes down the better.
Thoroughly unimpressed by everything about this article!
Recently stumbled upon your channel and have been binging your videos -- really high quality, well-researched and informative. You definitely deserve more subscribers! Sending support from the UK.
Thank you so much for the kind words and so happy you found my channel!! 💖🙏🏻
I WISH I knew more vegan men. They are a rare species where I live.
And maybe there would be more (or more willing to be open about it) if these stereotypes weren’t so pervasive!
You mean weaklings? Humans are an omnivorous species. Every deviant needs to prove himself in competition. Let's see who will procreate. Nature selects.
Where do you live?
I wish there were more vegan people in general where I live. All vegans I know live in other countries. I accepted that my wife will not go vegan unless most people around her are.
There’s something slightly unhinged about this video that I kind of like.
I'm pretty sure this is my favourite video I'm crying - vegan laughs are so hard to find, give me more 😂😂😂😂😂❤❤❤❤
Vegan men are much more compassionate humans! I wished I could find more vegan women
Agree! 💯
I had no idea about this, or, bless me, the Tik Tok phenomenon of ick (is everyone on there a 6-year-old pretending to be an adult?), so I found this alternatingly interesting and galling. Veganism is on the rise in Poland and other Eastern Euopean countries, so this is just the prevailing social norms smacking up against new trends. I appreciate your highlighting this study, and Vice's Vice-like sensationalizing of the topic in another culture that is smacking into a new trend, which in the UK is pretty obviously ineluctable. You did a lot of work for this one--not that you don't for others!--so thanks for posting : )
I love your analysis that Veganism being on the rise in these places is what’s causing increased friction. It makes me hopeful that this movement can grow even the most hostile-to-vegans meat-centric cultures.
Being vegan already requires courage because it means you'll stand up for what's right and protect the innocent, even if the vast majority of people don't. It means having the mental fortitude to withstand ignorant comments and mockery, but quite possibly vegan men get the worst of it here. For this alone, I think they deserve extra respect because they're not just going against the grain on ethics and diet, but also going against traditional gender roles and myths about masculinity.
I completely agree! If anything it shows a ton of confidence to forge ahead with what you believe is right despite what people think. And confidence is attractive. I think what most of society doesn’t get is we really don’t give a f*** what you think, and maybe that’s what bothers them the most 😝
@@TotallyForkable Lol 😄 Pretty much.
innocent??? wtaf???
I think the primary problem would be if the two people have different dietary lifestyles that are opposed to each other.
Yes in terms of day-to-day living and convenience that would be a big issue. I think when it comes to a moral stance like Veganism, though, it can be hard or impossible for people who don't see eye to eye on that to coexist, let alone have an intimate relationship.
I'd only be interested in dating vegan women, if I was interested in dating again🤣
💯🙌🏻
i mean. if they reversed the question i don't think most vegan men would date non vegan ladies. as a vegan men i wouldn't but i'm also not interested in dating in general.
Same. After breaking up with my ex-wife I don't even know if I could love again.
@@adioheadstart with loving yourself . Hobbies and also fitness both physical and mental . You got this
Interestingly, there is a part of the study where more men said they’d be unhappy if their significant other became vegetarian than the women who were asked, which seemed to imply women are more open minded about these things. So yes this article title/premise seems weirdly intent on doubling down on a harmful and untrue stereotype.
@@TotallyForkable My ex went vegan after I did. She's still vegan today with a beautiful vegan child! (not mine)
@@Cosdamotto Thank you, I'll try, but totally deflated and given up 😂
The _actual_ study's conclusion: non-vegans don't understand veganism, and sexist stereotypes are alive and well, especially in more conservative cultures.
Having known a lot of Eastern Europeans, including from Poland, I can confirm many still believe in traditional gender roles, and have homophobic tendencies, especially the older generations.
"The" conclusion could even be: "if you really empathise with a vegetarian/vegan (because they're your partner), you will probably realise they are making better dietary choices. If you don't want to think about the consequences of your own actions, it is more attractive to label vegetarians/vegans as "the other" and lump them together with other stigmatised minorities that make you feel uncomfortable. Cognitive dissonance?
Yes it didn’t really tell us much that we didn’t know. The location element is definitely interesting. I hope these harmful stereotypes will change over time as the generations shift.
Sexist stereotypes are fantastic, wish they would make a come back in the west
Why do you think they are fantastic?
Good work !
🙏🏻🙏🏻
Them flabbergasted zoom ins. 😂
🤣 So much flabbergastion!
Weird experience watching this video, every time some thought popped up in my head, you said it in a more coherent way a few seconds later. Thanks! Will forward people to your channel! I don't know how much of this you have covered already, but I feel there's a strong social bubble effect here as well. The people around me definitely don't seem to have negative view (or icks ;)) of vegans. It might be different with a different profession than mine, I don't know!
Actually, your video got me thinking. I also have this association of meat eating with masculinity and "being a real man".
I think what happened for me (probably due to other associations as well), is that I don't identify strongly with the word "man" anymore. When people talk about men, I don't feel like they are talking about me. I'm a bearded guy and guess most people who look at me would say I look masculin, but I don't feel like that word describes me. I guess I've unconsiously distanced myself from all the (to me) negative stereotypes about men, by distancing myself from the term "man" itself. Quite a cheap trick by my brain...
None of this stops me from mansplaining, though!
LOL! So glad you enjoyed the video! And really interesting thought on the “social bubble.” Maybe the author has a particularly immature group of friends, although some of the most obnoxious responses seemed to come from their social media callouts, so maybe it says more about the Vice audience and following 🤔
Also really interesting thoughts about relating to “man” and “masculinity.” Certainly these are ideas that are societally enforced to most of us at a young age, and takes time to unlearn. I tend to find men who are the most obsessed with masculinity are often the least mature, enlightened, etc. Like asserting/obsessing over one’s masculinity doesn’t actually make anyone objectively more masculine. Interesting food for thought all around!
As a gay, vegan guy, I probably don't help the stereotype
Sorry guys! 😂
LOL! 🤗💖
#quornfarts
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
🤪🙃
Goes to show why making appeals to social stigma/public perception is a fallacy.
Well said Mike 💖
What do you mean by this?
Framing the question as 'do vegan men give you the ick?' is a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy, no? You don't ask a leading question like unless you're fishing for confirmation bias.
And makes all participants seem 5 years of age 🤭
It's a leading question for sure. They knew what they were doing. Not to be taken as serious journalism but rather a silly piece of media.
I've only met one vegan in my life who wasn't insufferable, he was a truck driver, and would bring trays of roasted vegetables over to the BBQ and didn't constantly talk about veganism.
Very well made video! New subscriber here ❤ I'm thinking about going vegan this year.
Thank you for the kind words and for subscribing! 🫶🏻💖
Have you read "The Sexual Politics of Meat" by Carol J. Adams? A deep history of our cultural relation to eating animals.
It's something I've been interested in reading for a long time! I think I will get to it soon.
Farted it away omg 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
📰💨💨💨
Lmao hearing this study being read by an American was quite entertaining. Yes, we do have the phrases 'wege terrorysta' and 'najpierw wege, potem homo'. I use the second one jokingly because there are in fact many vegetarians who identify as a part of LGBT community (me included).
It has a hilarious ring to it; it's funny in its ridiculousness, and thank you for translating! I love that you can laugh at it; I'm sure the carnists hate that! 🤗
i find those tiktok vegan cooks super attractive, a man than can cook me healthy vegan dishes or that cares about animals and/or the environment and his health is an a massive huge green flag for me.
So many green flags!
Although I'm vegan myself, 2 of the most annoying people I have ever met were vegan (only one was a man, they are a relatively rare species).
Most men seem to be terrified of standing up for an unpopular principal, it takes a brave man to go against the masses!
But, these 2 people were basically the same. No boundaries, helped themselves to food without asking, did not really help wirh communal activities and chores, were very forward, didn't really listen and were high maintenance.
Some of the most unpleasant online vegan men were very dogmatic, i get the impression it's better to be an alcoholic or drug addict than make a slip up, a pragmatic decision or a pure mistake.
Some of the vegan men have been the nicest people you will meet.
So hopefully avoiding cruelty, pain and death to animals doesn't give women the ick!
I have also met annoying vegans but by the numbers I've met far more annoying non-vegans 😂 Those people you mention seem to just be insufferable overall and I guarantee they were that way long before they were vegan!
Bottom line: annoying people exist, vegan and not, and wonderful people exist, vegan and not.
To note how sexist and bigoted a lot of Polish culture still is. It's no reference for a secular humanist society.
Thanks for sharing. I have a feeling there would be some interesting differences on how all of this is viewed even just among European countries.
I'm super late to this conversation, but I'm still going to add my 2¢: My partner and I have been together the better (and worse) part of 20 yrs. I went vegan in 05/15-06/15 (somewhere around there). He's still not vegan. He doesn't eat much meat, not around me, and never eats pigs; little eggs, and very little cheese (he's also pretty lactose intolerant, yeah fun😒). He actually eats a mostly herbivorous diet. Anyway, I'm not going to get into his background. Suffice it to say; I definitely do not find Vegan men icky! We were apart for a couple of years, and I tried to find a vegan guy🙄 I was insanely popular, I mean, to the point I got no rest! I did end up w/2 guys (1 relationship lasted a few months, 1 a yr), neither were vegan, or vegetarian. It's really difficult to find a guy who is, in KY. Btw As to meat eaters having the worst farts: I lived in an apartment with my partner and his twin brother. We also shared a bathroom. By far bro (twin) ate by FAR way more meat, dairy, eggs, etc than my partner, and actually gloated on it when drunk. Everyone knew when he had been in the bathroom, and he would generally let people steer clear of it for a while; while in contrast: people never even knew after I had gone. People's ignorance never fails to make me SMH
Wow, this was super interesting to read; thank you for sharing your story!! Plenty of people would disagree with me, but I do think "mixed" relationships can be beneficial from this perspective. If your husband had been with a non-vegan all these years, I imagine he would have eaten way more animal products, and maybe not thought twice about it. That drastic reduction is huge and perhaps that's the best we can hope for with some people.
And thank you for the anecdotal evidence about bathroom smells. Your experience seems to be the consensus 😷😂
I've never looked for vegan a partner specfically. My current partner (for over 10 years) switched their diet to match mine (as did my partner before). Most people assume my partner (woman) converted me (man) - It's amusing... *although I do miss out on the superiority factor....
This is interesting; thanks for sharing!
Dr. Popper states when your tool no longer works then masculinity is out the window. WFPB4LIFE
Lol. Who are you referring to? Dr. Pimple Popper?!
One of the worst men I’ve ever encountered was a vegan so I’m biased lol
Correlation does not equal causation! 🤪🙃
Nice video lass fair play, disappointing an unsurprising overall.🌱🌅🍀
Glad you enjoyed it!! 🙏🏻
I am desperate for a vegan man! Please send help! 😣
(In a Paula Cole voice) 🎶 "Where Have All the Good [Vegan] Men Gone?"
My boyfriend is superior. Tall, Bodybuilder, very masculine.
Has a hard opinion on crrtain topics and is willing to stand up for his values.
At the same time he is very soft and gentle to me.
He is vegan, which makes him just more attractive in my opinion.
Yes; normalize men having many different sides to them!!
I have a horse who really likes to eat ham sandwiches and dried venison, So go figure that one, also every child starts off eating animal stuff from its mother's milk.
Right, its own mother's milk....which is natural and normal. How can that be applied to needlessly consuming flesh and byproducts from other animals?
Damn, almost 3 years vegan & no one ever told me about the sex cult of loving celery!
LOL. Take me to your leader!
I've dated three vegan men. All of them were highly intelligent, perceptive, and made for great conversation. A huge drawback for me though was that they seemed very pessimistic. I could be wrong, but based on my experiences, men who go vegan may be more prone to depressive tendencies and having a less hopeful view of the world than vegans of other genders. I think men are not raised to regulate their emotions as much as women are, and this may cause a greater amount of hopeless feelings that go unchecked. Seeing this in the men I dated made me feel like they needed more time to work on themselves, especially because I have depression and I did a lot of work to manage it and discover what worked for me. I hope they find what they need!
That's too many men
I think maybe it's the other way around. If men who are vegan are, as you've said, more likely to be thoughtful and insightful, that in itself can lead to depression. Maybe it's not the veganism that makes them depressed, it's the traits that make them vulnerable to depression that make them vegan?
Veganism is positively correlated with depression.
Thanks for sharing, and these are really interesting observations! I think Veganism and cynicism can go hand in hand for obvious reasons, and it can be a journey getting to the other side of that and not letting it affect every aspect of your life. And yes in general I think working on mental health/vulnerability has been stigmatized for men for so long that surely that can make things worse. Hopefully you have different experiences in your future relationships!
This is an interesting theory! You have to be "connected" at some deeper level to connect the dots and go vegan. Sometimes I wish I was less connected and didn't feel things so deeply, but I also recognize it's what gives me a large capacity for compassion, so I take the difficult with the good 🤷🏻♀️
20:07 they're not! ^-^
I think you're right unfortunately!
Being a vegan man works out good cause there are so many more beautiful vegan women out there. The odds are in our favor in the dating pool.
Pretty sure most vegan women date men who are not vegan. The delusion in you is strong. ROTF
Just another benefit of being a (straight) vegan man!
Do [people who care about animals] give you the ick?
When you put it THAT way....🫶🏻👏🏻
I'm a dad with 2 little kids. I went to a 100% whole food, plant-based diet for health reasons. It reversed my high cholesterol and high blood pressure, and I'm still hitting PRs in the gym on a regular basis. Homophobes and judgemental women give me "the ick." 😂 I guess they can laugh at me all the way to their statistically earlier grave.
I'm so happy to hear you have had medical success on WFPB diet; what a huge win! And what a blessing to be able to be healthy for your kids 💖
I stumbled on this video, but as an omnivore/ flexitarian I enjoyed this video 😂 I dont follow any particular diet, just what makes me happy/ healthy
Thanks for watching, and I'm so glad you enjoyed it!
Shame the animals have to die for your happiness.
To my benefit, strong pretend to be weak and the weak pretend to be strong. Prefer an aggressive animal lover over a snowflake who cares about others opinions so much they would hurt other and themself and call it Good.
Completely agree. Confidence is quiet. Insecurity is aggressive and loud.
Vegan men don’t look for non vegan partners so it’s not really an issue
I think this is mostly true!
*considering a vegeterrorist tattoo* also is Martha the new Karen?
LOL fully in support of the tattoo, also yes Martha is definitely the new Karen 👏🏻🤣
As a single straight vegan man, it is quite difficult to find vegan women to date... and the omnis are 👀😔
This is interesting because I would think (and have heard) there are more vegan women than men. I hope this changes for you soon!
@@TotallyForkable I've heard the same as well often... But it seems like the hearsay is talking about taken vegan women, because single vegan women are a rarity. But from my anecdotal evidence, women are more receptive to trying out vegan food.
I think so too; after looking at this study, it's not surprising why!
1st
👋🏻👏🏻
thumb this up if men give you the ick and let's do our own little study :)
👎🏻
oh please just identify as vegan but eat meat 2024
huh?
Not sure why this popped up in my suggested videos list. Married to an omnivore (as I am myself), so glad.
I do automatically think of a man as being less masculine by being vegan. There’s only one vegan guy that I get along with, and I know his reasons for becoming vegan. Most of the plant based people I’ve known gave it up due to it not being as healthy.
In my single days being vegan would of made them an automatic “no”.
One thing I've learned is there are far more vegan people out there than we realize, most of whom don't fit into any one "stereotype". People get negative associations from 1 interaction and apply them to an entire group. Curious, are you yourself vegan? Thanks for watching!
@@TotallyForkable I grew up in the Portland, OR area and I have known many Vegans. ;) I am not, as I mentioned in my first comment. My husband and I eat both plants and animals. I believe in a balanced diet. I had to cut our dairy for a while and I think that cutting it out contributed to some health issues I had before I got pregnant and with my 6 month old. Started eating it again when pregnant and I’ve felt much better!
Oh sorry I missed that part of your comment! Thanks for clarifying. I guess I am in a bit of a bubble because I know many vegans who are incredibly healthy and most don't fit into any one stereotype.
These Red Pill Manosphere guys come across ss so childish and weak. And deeply insecure.
The insecurity is so loud! Unfortunately, "loudness" and "masculinity" are often conflated 🤦🏻♀️
Of course! Vegan men struggle with muscle weight. Skinny metro sexual men tend to be friend zoned by women. Vegan protein for building muscle is tough to get right for both quantity and quality.
I think this comes down to lack of exposure for you. I know a ton of vegan men, and I can’t really think of any that fall in the “skinny metro sexual” category. Most I know are on the bigger side.
@@TotallyForkable Well, that shows exactly what he has said. You don't know them because they struggle with women. You are a women. There are skinny metro sexual men out there, the fact that you don't know any of them just shows perfectly what he has said.
Does that mean that one gets skinny and metro sexual just because you go vegan as man? no of course not, but it requires more work and knowledge to get the amino acids and amount of protein right. The average guy often doesn't have this knowledge might end up more skinny on vegan diet. Sometimes healthier, but more skinny.
I think this could be true of anyone who hasn't done enough research before making a major dietary change. Also, vegan/plant-based being a niche and misunderstood diet doesn't help with this because there isn't as much structural support for new vegans (i.e. dietitians/doctors not educated on plant based diets, not as many options in restaurants, etc). This could be locational, too. I haven't heard people use the term "metro sexual" in the US since like the 2000s. Maybe this is a bigger stereotype in European countries.
@TotallyForkable Fair, I know more than a few donut vegans. The donut vegans also lack muscle though and fit that stereotype otherwise. The Stanford Twin study scarily highlighted the cost of vegan eating on health if folks don't do it right. The twins all lost muscle when their bodies were screaming to build "easy newbie gains" to get them into their genetic healthy range. I consume a ton of soy but even that has to be limited because of side effects and toxin concentrations that sources like whey don't have. If I didn't track down to the amino acid level every day then I would come up short from mixing protein sources to get close to the profiles eggs, milk, and meat have.