Unfortunate Movepools in Competitive Pokémon (Gens 1 - 8)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 มิ.ย. 2022
- Today we're looking at some Pokémon that are mostly pretty great in a lot of ways, but unfortunately were denied some moves that would've made a lot of sense for them to get, but were unfortunately denied.
Hope you don't mind that I didn't cover Gen 7, it's a generation I'm not super familiar with, and this video was already shaping up to be much longer than I anticipated. If you have any examples of this sort of thing in Gen 7, please let me know!
Plague Von Karma's RBY Tradebacks video: • Why Tradebacks are ban...
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This is a reupload due to the original being too quiet, you can see the original here if you'd like to see the comments: • Video - เกม
This is a reupload cause unfortunately increasing the volume of a video after it's been uploaded is too advanced for youtube, your very cool comments on the OG will be remembered ):
Oof
I thought the original audio was a bit low
Shame youtube is more focused on dislikes than accessible features
The comments weren't cool, you're cool
So that’s why. Well, oof. I sorta reposted the comment anyways.
Yeah aight that makes sense. I just figured your videos were always a little quieter (not sure if its true for any other of your videos, i cant remember)
WHY DOESN’T WIGGLYTUFF LEARN MOONBLAST SHE LITERALLY EVOLVES WITH THE MOONSTONE
It also doesn't learn STAB Boomburst either
Maybe if Wigglytuff showed some skin or smiled a bit more she would succeed like her perfect cousin, Clefable.
@@annaangelic2318 tf did I read
@@balancemaster55 The truth.
@@annaangelic2318 excuse me?
Keep in mind they did Regigigas even more dirty because in Legends Arceus, the game with no abilities, they BUILT IN SLOW START just for him!
I'll never understand the hate that Game Freak has for our boy. If they just removed Slow Start entirely, Regigigas still wouldn't even be in the top 5 most overpowered legendaries.
they even introduced it in the same game as arceus, another normal type legendary coincidentally also with no functional ability, sure... but not one with a downside, and with even better stats than regigigas anyway. considering that was the first ag mon and regigigas still has never really even had a niche in pu, I don't know if it's funny or sad
@@zeemgeem how is multitype non functional lol
@@zeemgeem Also Mega Rayquaza literally created the AG tier???
I'm half expecting them to make a sort of *full power forme* for him since he's been kicked down for so long
Zacian’s most reliable counter being Quagsire will forever be the funniest thing ever.
It's Quagsire. Quag famously doesn't give a single fuck about tiering and just shows up wherever the hell it wants to be that day, so it being the one real reliable counter to Zacian, one of the most brokenly designed Pokemon ever, is really only fitting.
@@joshuamercer7572 Never change, Quagsire.
That's until Gen 9 comes around and gives Zacian leaf blade. Just imagine.
Though i guess Zacian having to add a move to counter Quagsire is still pretty funny.
@@babywizard9027 TBF, Zacian got nerfed HARD in SV. It's probably not going to be a huge issue due to both nerfs and Clodire hard countering even harder than Quagsire.
Quagsire sees use in every tier
□ king
□ queen
□ themperor (of utility)
☑ that thing you begrudgingly pick when hariyama just doesn't quite fit what your team has going on
One more thing that irks me about Zamazenta-Crowned is that Behemoth Bash, the move that has Zamazenta, the Shield Pokemon that is prominently defensive-oriented, ram into their opponent with their shield face, does not calculate damage based on the user's Defense stat. Zamazenta was done so dirty by Game Freak that I genuinely feel sorry for it. Cool design, but man is it more than useless when compared to Zacian.
Not to mention them nearly having the same movepool but they didn’t differentiate them enough. The same thing happened with the Swords of Justice (Cobalion’s movepool is almost decent offensively, Terrakion’s is good while the rest struggled).
@@IgnitedQuils I'm not into gen 8 OU did keldeo drop a few tiers because I know it had all the offensive tools it needs to succeed on OU for the past 3 gens. It's a little less convenient relying on icy win instead of ice beam but I don't remember that ever being a significant draw back to the point where I'd say it's lacking.
Zamazenta-C could have also received a Steel type version of Jungle Healing and Bulk Up, and also make Dauntless Shield a defensive version of Download too.
@@petelee2477 Toxapex is the reason Keldeo dropped
@@malakimphoros2164 toxapex was in gen 7 and keldeo was still OU
One movepool I've always found disappointing is every offensive Eeveelution. Like, they get stab and shadow ball and that's essentially it, whereas the support based ones get so so much more it leaves even the supposedly offensive ones in supportive roles. Like Espeon and Jolteon could be real good offensively but they just get literally no coverage. And don't even mention flareon, the poor poor boy.
Flareon is the poster child for bad move pools for me. I do to say that Sylveon has a decent movepool tho. Bc of Pixilate I would count it among the offensive Eeveelutions
At least for Espeon shadow ball is a pretty desirable coverage option for a psychic type, the other special attacker eeveelutions have absolutely terrible options especially after hidden power got dumpstered
And then you have fucking Sylveon getting the best of both fucking world as it got Mystical Fire of all things and now not only is it the most powerful in terms of damage, it's also the only one with Espeon (and technically Vaporeon but every Water type has Ice Bean come on) to have a coverage move to hit the resists to it's STAB. Sylveon didn't even fucking need that, it already was the best one and it's also really good defensively as well, couldn't you also at least have given Leafeon Stomping Tantrum and Jolteon Aurora Beam at the very least (because yes, I tried to make Weather Ball Jolteon work in a Hail team in gen 8 NU back when NU was first established and ...... shit was really not worth it even if that was fun as hell) ? Why is it only Sylveon that gets love ?! (I wanted to propose something for Flareon, but honestly I couldn't blame them here because even whilst trying I couldn't find something that actually helps it outside of ridiculous shit like giving it Shift Gear or something, this one probably needs to be remade from the ground up)
Glaceon with Water Pulse:
@@sephikong8323 didn't Glaceon got Freeze-Dry recently?
EDIT: or does it still not get it?
I feel like Slack Off needs to be much more common. Recover makes sense to be rarer, as it’s literally creating new cells. Slack Off is just it sitting down and relaxing a bit, which most anything can do.
Spoink: *sheds a tear*
My pipe bomb: *sheds a tear*
a little idea for spoink
if it does get slack off, make it so that when spoink uses slack off, before it ohko's itself, it drops the target's hp so that it's the same as its hp.
basically endeavor but a status move.
I agree - my best bet as to why it's not very common is that because slacking off is a lazy action, only Pokémon with a "lazy" disposition are given it, hence why it was originally Slaking's signature move. Iirc the least lazy Pokémon that gets it is Infernape, who only gets it in BDSP as a Heart Scale move - Slowpoke is in the name, Mr. Rime uses a cane and that slows people down, while Hippowdon is based on the hippo, another of the laziest animals. And yes, only those lines get it canonically. However, plenty of other Pokémon probably are "lazy" enough to use it, such as Torkoal, Turtonator, Snorlax, and Komala, and should at least get it through breeding like Hippowdon does.
@@astralnekomimi Snorlax with slack off....
This isn't really an unfortunate moveset since I don't know how much it would effect the metagame, but I was really confused when SwSh released and Polteageist couldn't learn Scald. It's tea, it absolutely should.
That would be so cute I love that
At least the self cooking Bacon can learn scald. It’s Super Delicious
wanna know who else get's scald: Centiskorch and Coalossal of all things
@@bulborb8756
Coalossal is understandable, given Geothermal activity and all that. Its ability is literally STEAM engine, of course it should be able to weaponize super hot water vapor
@@spindash64also, centiskorch is based off the hot part of a stove, so it reasonably should learn scald too
Okay I love how the video replay traffic spikes just after the "this video is brought to you by gamefreak" presumably because of people skipping forwards thinking it was actually an ad
Since you skipped gen 7, I'd like to mention aurora veil. It was a new move added in gen 7, and was even a TM. The funny thing was, Amaura and Aurorus couldn't learn it in gen 7. The pokemon based on and named after an aurora couldn't use the aurora move
they forgor 💀
for stuff like that it might be that the japanese names of those don't make "obvious" like the english tl. but no idea about your specific example, can't be assed to look it up
@@Emulleator Its the same in Japanese, Gamefreak caught lacking.
Not to mention they’re bulky ice types (or trying to be, those two 4x weaknesses while only having 3 not useful resists sucks big time) with snow warning. It would seem like the move aurora veil was made for them if it wasn’t made for A-ninetales, apart from that they couldn’t even learn it of course
The funnier part is that they also didn't get Power Gem
I want to bring up Rhyperior. Its movepool is almost perfect, but lacks two things. First, good recovery, oh well. Second, and the most infuriating, is that it has base 140 attack and reckless, but no head smash! It would have the strongest head smash in the game! On another note, Hitmonchan is the only hitmon that can't use sucker punch
Even Drain Punch would've done wonders
Which is especially hilarious considering Hitmonchan’s design is entirely based on punching.
@@Forged4War206 to be fair, the Japanese name for the move is "surprise attack", but there really isn't a reason for him not to have it
Well the strongest head smah I belive is rampardos
Not to be that guy but Rhyperior have solid rocj, the one with rock head is rhyhorn and rhydon. They all have reckless tho
Regigigas shouldn't have even gotten a diminishing ability. I can see how Slacking, a Mon that you can easily get at level 36 with Uber level stats would need an ability that weakens them (tho by today's standards, they probably wouldn't be too much without Truant).
But Regigigas is a legendary that, in order to obtain them, you need to have caugh 3 other legendaries and transferred them from a whole other generation of games. And your reward is something less useful than a Tauros or even a Raticate. Heck, with slow start their attack stat is *literally* equivalent to a Rattata (exactly 56).
Btw, love that Shredder's revenge music.
Yeah, mons like Slaking and Archeops having bad abilities make sense in a single-player progression point of view, but an exclusively post-game _legendary_ shouldn't have been given a detrimental ability at all.
That's like having the entire story of gen 1 play out, beating the league, going into Cerulean Cave, clearing the mazes, and finding the world's rarest Mr. Mime at the end. Thanks.
@@christiancinnabars1402 ''We attempted to create the strongest pokemon of all time using Mew's DNA... and we completely failed. Here's a fucking mime, you clown.''
I assume the thought process behind Regigigas was that they have a bst of 670, close to a box art legendary. So Gamefreak decided to give them that ability to balance it out so that they don't outdo any of the other gen 4 legendaries sitting at 580\600.
Not factoring at all A. how much that ability actually holds them back and how much worse they become than every other legendary in gen 4 (or ever); B. how much trouble you have to go through to obtain them, which should justify the bst (unprompted) compared to things like Heatran and Cresselia and C. that they're the lord of the 3 Regis, which should legitimize their power lore wise instead of making them worst than shit you'd find in the dumpster.
@@mrtable2861 it also makes regigigas the worst regi to use out of all of them and that says something considering regielekis movepool
@@mrtable2861 Honestly if that was the case having the ability only halving speed should have been enough. Like it could at least tank like a beast and deal good damage while having abyssmal speed. Idk why they chose to make attack drop too, just makes it super unviable. Also important to keep in mind you needed to have both a gen 3 game as well as a gen 4 one in order to even get Regigigas in it's debut generation.
@@greyscaleadaven My only guess as to why they didn't just do speed and instead also had it reduce attack was so that it still wouldn't be good even on trick room teams.
I am eternally mad that Ampharos does not get Tail Glow.
funny enough it did previously but tail glow either got axed or ampharos did until gen 4 remakes
Blame its Japanese name, which is "firefly light". Ampharos is clearly not a firefly...
@@nicholetheotter1957 Ah yes, so clearly the walking pile of power cables and the blue fish legendary are also clearly fireflies. My bad!
Seriously wtf
Not that it matters nowadays since Tail Glow has been snapped out of existence.
@@DMSwordsmasteroh the irony, how this comment had aged
Charizard should also definitely have it like just look at its tail
I think my most hated movepool limitations are the amount of special attacking Rock-types that don't learn Power Gem. Aurorus, Coalossal, Magcargo, Cradily, Omastar, etc. would all love that move. I also think removing Hidden Power really exposed how many Pokemon have terrible special movepools to this day. They sorta tried to fix some of it with giving Fairies Mystical Fire, but your Jolteon can't learn Aurora Beam or Icy Wind or whatever
Some other noteworthy ones:
- The Eeveelutions have all been forced to primarily learn moves of their respective types, which means the ones geared around offense are forced to have really limited coverage. Jolteon's only decent special coverage at this point is are Weather Ball, Shadow Ball, and Hyper Voice.
- For being a Pokemon introduced in Gen 8, Galarian Stunfisk has the moveset of like a Gen 1 Pokemon. Its best physical Steel STAB is fucking Metal Claw. Snap Trap is both super weak and Grass instead of Steel, when they could've done something like make it a Magma Storm clone. No Toxic, recovery, or Body Press either.
- Specifically in BDSP, Zapdos is a sad story. No Hidden Power, Heat Wave, or even Hurricane / Air Slash.
- I don't care how much this would break the meta, Snorlax needs Slack Off at this point. Relying on Rest doesn't really cut it anymore, and Snorlax slacks off all day anyway.
- On the topic of Pidgeot, its only reliable special moves are Flying and Fire type. Not even Hyper Voice. Even with a Mega, Pidgeot can't catch a break.
- Until Mega Evolutions, Pinsir was always outclassed by Heracross, and one of the reasons why is their difference in Bug STAB. The best Pinsir can presently manage is X-Scissor, while Heracross gets the stronger Megahorn, even though the things on Pinsir's head very much horns (the Dex calls them such multiple times). I can get wanting to make Heracross more special with its own signature move in GSC, but if in 2022, fucking Lapras and Virizion can learn Megahorn, why not Pinsir?
Something that I find freaking hilarious is that G. Stunfisk is a beast in Pokemon Go PvP. That thing acts like a defensive bandage for a team that lacks resists....actually kinda like ADV Snorlax, minus flaws of ADV meta
It's all about bullshit Lore Reasons.
Power Gem implies you have magic powers, so rock types get the L but Mismagius of all ghost people gets it.
Special rock types have just been shafted really.
@@MidoriNatsume I don't know if that really tracks considering non-magical Pokemon like Gigalith, Persian, and Vespiquen get it.
I could have sworn that Galarian Stunfisk could learn toxic. The more you know, I guess
Another thing about Zamazenta, it would be sick if Behemoth Bash worked like body press and used defense in calculation, making it not really care about intimidate
You know what I'd do? Make a category of moves called tackling moves and have the Dauntless Shield ability make ALL of them use the Defense stat.
@@nousername191 "All contact moves use the defense stat" would be a great change to the ability, shield doggy would be so much better.
@@emmahansen4858 yeah but then it's prettu good attack stat gets completely wasted
@@robertlupa8273 True, but it's a Fighting type that could abuse it's Defense & not worry about Burns.
@@HolyKnights888 and not have to rely on Howl, and instead use Iron Defense as its own Swords Dance.
And yeah- it makes no sense that it doesn't have King's Shield, so maybe give it that too, and we'd have something worthwhile in Ubers
Regigigas's movepool problems go deeper than just its lack of recovery and Protect. One can alternatively think of Regigigas as a Pokemon with 110/71/110/80/110/41 base stats and the ability "Effect of Atk/Spd EVs is halved. After 5 turns, get +2 Atk/Spd". That stat spread still looks pretty nice with its 110/110/110 defenses. The ability is kind of weird with the EV growth stuff, but it's not like such a defensive Pokemon was going to invest in Atk/Spd anyways. Would be nice to have something more useful, but at least you're not slacking off every other turn, right?
Problem is, it just doesn't have anything to do. All three of the other Regis have great moves for defensive Pokemon like Stealth Rock, Curse, Seismic Toss, Counter, and Explosion that would work well with such a bulky stat spread. Regigigas has none of them. In fact, it has no reliable stat boosting moves at all, and its only notable support move is Knock Off. Trying to use its higher Sp.Atk is also a non-starter. You're working with Earth Power and Thunderbolt, or maybe Charge Beam if you want to do a really bad Cresselia impression. So its only role is "generically bulky Knock Off/status user that will need Wish support", which just isn't in high demand.
God this is such a good point. Regigigas is (and I usually hate this word) a "noobtrap" in lower tiers where there's this pervasive belief in less experienced pllayers that its high base stats are totally worth the passivity and lack of output on the field. I find Regigigas is only really threatening in extremely low power metagames like ORAS ZU where many offensive and defensive Pokemon just don't have the capability to drive it off the field. Knock Off + T-Wave / Toxic can actually be pretty frustrating, as shown by other lower tier mono-Normal support Pokemon like Audino and Lickilicky. This is not at all a realistic or well-thought idea of "fixing" Regigigas, but if Regigigas itself had Wish (or a good smattering of other support moves), it would make for quite a funny bulky utility Pokemon in the very lowest tiers rather than being completely unranked and unviable in SS PU, SS ZU, and even SS SU.
funny part too is regieleki has the worst movepool out of all of them but because of its insane speed, powerful electric moves and trapping move and some support moves like rapid spin for some reason. that thing was in ou
Sidenote: its effective attack is only 55 with Adamant and max investment tho
460 displayed - effectively 230 after Slow Start
It's only effectively base 71 if you give it zero investment (356 displayed - effectively 178).
@@annaangelic2318 Funny thing is that Lickilicky is also much more offensively threatening than Regigigas while also sporting far better utility.
It irks me to no end that Regigigas is outclassed in nearly all respects by freaking Lickilicky of all things.
The most I can think to do to help with Regigigas... isn't even in Singles. The main set that gets run.
It's to either enact friendly fire against your own Cofagrigus and give Regigigas the Mummy ability, or use Skill Swap on your Regigigas, and hope the Skill Swapper can trade the move onto your opponent.
No Bulk Up, no King’s Shield,no recovery, no support moves, no Body Press, worse defensive typing than Zacian in both forms… Someone at Game Freak clearly hates Zamazenta
Edit: I just found out that Zamazenta can’t even learn Roar. At this point I’m surprised Game Freak even let it have Howl.
Knock Off immunity on a resisted Pokemon in the generation where Knock is at its best, 720 BST, one of the most underutilized and great defensive typings in the game... it's easy to see Zamazenta as a flop in comparison to Zacian, but it's hard to say a Pokemon too powerful for the OU of the generation it debuted in is truly "hated".
@@annaangelic2318
A box legendary should never even be considered for OU. The only one that’s shared the dishonor is Kyurem-Black, and even then that Pokémon atleast sucked enough it COULD be played in OU and eventually moved too Ubers proper.
@@marakrofitcac3425 "Should" has never defined the composition of OU with respect to Ubers. There are plenty of OU Pokemon which are good in Ubers or excel more in Ubers than in OU. Kyurem-Black being considered a healthy part of OU's metagame isn't because it's "trash", but that there's enough defensive pieces in OU to handle Kyu-B's set makeup. Ubers isn't a grade that a Pokemon gets for being good or bad relative to its base stats / moves, it's a playable banlist for Pokemon unhealthy in OU. Kyurem-Black isn't OU because it is too bad for "ubers proper"; it's OU because the defensive pieces of the BW/ORAS/SM metagames all took shapes where Kyu-B's sets at the time could be handled. Kyu-B could have been D rank in Ubers, but OU's specific environment of having many great Steel types, many of which check Kyu-B, and which most Ubers tiers do not have relative to their power levels.
@@marakrofitcac3425 *never
Try naming every defensive, bulky or even tanky pokemon with reliable recovery (Reocver, Roost, Slack Off, Soft-Boiled, Shore Up, Morning Sun, Moonlight, Synthesis, Leech Seed or hell even Giga Drain, Drain Punch, Leech Life or even Draining Kiss)
I'll start:
Toxapex - Recover+Regenerator as a ability
Slowtwins, Hippowdon - Slack Off
Clefable - Soft-Boiled (and Moonlight for thoese who never had a Clefable from Gen 3)
Corviknight, Skamory, Gliscor, Defensive Zapdos - Roost
Ferrothorn, Celesteelia - Leech Seed
Umbreon - Moonlight
Palssosand - Shore Up (it's signature move)
Avalugg - Recover (still bottom-tier by usage, but it actually had a niche in OU at some point)
My personal vote goes to Polteageist. Now it doesn't seem like a bad pokemon, it's currently in NU as a Shell Smasher. However, one big problem with this mon is coverage. It learns Shadow Ball, Dark Pulse, and...Giga Drain for its only really worthwhile special moves for its 134 Special Attack. Something fucking huge missing for flavor that I think would make the mon at least a little better is giving it Scald. For fuck's sake its a teapot pokemon, why CAN'T it learn Scald. Just a massive flavor fail
Because that makes sense, and GF hates making sense
You're kind of missing Stored Power, which actually synergizes really well with Shell Smash thanks to the fact it gives three double boosts, turning it into a 140 BP move basically. Pretty solid.
It is immensely stupid it doesn't get Scald though.
Polteageist is actually in RarelyUsed at the time of writing! While its kit definitely leaves something to be desired in terms of coverage, Polteageist has hardly any room to bring it. Shell Smash + Shadow Ball STAB is already two slots of your set, and Polteageist has to use its remaining ones on making sure its sweep is uninterrupted. Stored Power, Substitute + Cursed Body, Strength Sap, and Giga Drain are all options that Polteageist is strapped to add. I agree that it's frustrating that X Pokemon doesn't have Y move. However, Polteageist's whole flavor isn't about serving hot tea, it's about being cold leftover tea that curses you and leaves you with chills... is that really the best candidate for Scald?
It could have learned Scald, Thunderbolt, Ice Beam and Dazzling Gleam as it’s in a fucking teacup. Gen 8 was weird with movesets. (Not trying to insult you, just weirded out with GF’s move choices).
@@IgnitedQuils No worries!! I hope you don’t feel insulted by me either!! Careful about wishing for better coverage and water moves with good flavor: GameFreak might hear you and give it Water Spout.
I love how when you were talking about bastiodon, you threw in ugly, just to kinda kick him while he was down lmao.
Fun fact: out of the four Tapus, the only two to get Play Rough are, for some godforsaken reason, Tapu Fini and Tapu Lele, the two special attackers. Now Koko doesn't really need it thanks to having an ok special attack and Dazzling Gleam, but Bulu not having any physical fairy moves is pretty sad. It does absolutely nothing over Rillaboom and just sits around in UU being just decent, whereas it would have probably been a really good OU Fairy had it gotten Play Rough (or Grassy Glide for that matter, Bulu really got screwed over).
honestly i feel like a lot of types need some extra moves with more varied aesthetic flavoring, so pokemon can have good stab and coverage options even if it wouldnt aesthetically/thematically make sense for them to have the usual one. like i feel like tapu bulu using play rough would feel kinda weird but it should absolutely flex its fairy typing offensively
Maybe a move like "Refurbishment" could really help some bulky Pokemon without recovery out. Clone of Jungle Healing but Steel type, so 25% Health recovery and gets rid of status. Seems like it could be pretty helpful but not too overwhelming. Also please don't give it to Ferrothrorn dear god
you're right, let's give ferrothorn synthesis and spiky shield instead.
Ferrothorn probably wouldn't run it even if it got it tbh. Leech recovers similar enough health after 2 turns and makes it significantly less passive.
Yoooo i was fantasizing a move like that for steel types too in my grade school days! I think I called it "repairgo" or "hyper repair" or something
Refurbish would probably be a more likely name just because of length, but i think Polish would also be a great contender if a move like this ever existed
@@jimmyjuice697 and it already doesn't have to worry about poison
Since you left out Gen 7, I thought I’d mention this, because this is pretty infamously stupid.
Togedamaru, despite being an Electric Steel type, can only learn one singular steel move (through TM, not even through level up) in Gyro Ball. This is *awful* for Togedamaru with its base speed of 96, and the only way to get something like Iron Head on it is through the Move Tutor in USUM or TR’s in SWSH.
Pretty sad if you ask me
At least its not Galarian Stunfisk who's best physical Steel move is METAL CLAW or heck at least it didn't get forgotten like Morepeko because at least it learns Nuzzle. As far as pika clones go, Togedemaru is easily the best of them and works incredibly well in a variety of roles in both VGC and lower tier singles. Getting access to Wish Spiky Shield is really useful in combination with Iron Barbs and having some fairly decent flinch moves allow it to bring a lot more than just untauntable paralysis
@@munchrai6396 I never said Togedamaru is bad lmao, it’s pretty solid, but the steel move situation with it though (at least in its home games) is dumb.
nice profile pic
@@munchrai6396 Togedemaru also has the level 1 gimmick lol
@@donaldjgumpofficial5754 Dang, that's awesome. Didn't realize it got Endeavor in gen 8. Hell, it has a much better movepool than Aron, so you could potentially do a variety of Endeavor support sets with Nuzzle
It’s crazy to me that special electric types get thunderbolt. 95 base power 100 accuracy no drawbacks. Where physical electric types still have to rely on wild charge. 5 less base power and 1/3 recoil is ridiculous. And it didn’t even exist in gen 4 when Electivire and Luxray would have killed for decent physical stab. Any many other types have similar problems with physical/special moves. What’s with this! Increase power gem distribution! Buff wild charge! It’s been 5 generations since the physical/special split!
why is there not an electric quick attack yet
i mean electric is probably the type that needs a quick attack the _least_ but like, it's also _the_ most obvious type for one??? how the hell did _ice_ and _rock_ get a quick attack before electric?
Hey! Thunderbolt got nerfed to 90 in Gen 6! It and Wild Charge are totally balanced now with each other! /s
@@OmegaTyrant I see, you are a gamefreak employee.
I was going to mention this. My boy Eelektross really could have used a strong spammable physical electric move to complement its actually pretty good coverage, but nope. At least it manages to utterly dominate gen 7 PU as is, so that’s something.
it's not 95 anymore, it's 90 since Gen 6
same with Flamethrower and Ice Beam
I find it funny when looking at "illegal" moveset potential because some Pokémon similar to Armaldo being locked out of utility is sad but at the same time some mons are viable due to an event move that less than 1% of actual real world players would ever actually have.
I remember in your Dragon video saying that Salamance could use Wish and I was really confused as I was like 99% sure it couldn't, then I looked it up and it turns out it's a move only given to a Japanese event Bagon that lasted a month way back in 2003. Showdown doesn't care for how realistic or easily accessible a mon is to have on your team so long as it's theoretically possible to own, even if it's for a limited event mon decades ago that hardly anyone would actually have on a physical game cart (even fewer having perfect IV's too). Wish Chansey is another one that is a staple of several formats despite being rare as fuck and I always wonder how the meta of smogon would change if they just banned a bunch of these absurdly rare variants of Pokémon. It might not change too much depending on the generation but it would be interesting to see.
Just further rubs salt in the wound for those mons that do have illegal movesets for moves they 100% can learn or be egg moves just not at the same time.
It's like with Lance's Dragonite in RBY. Dragonite couldn't learn Barrier by any means til gen 6. But yet Lance's Dragonite can learn Barrier. Barrier has been removed in Sword and Shield
I remember one example of the tier changes might be a Heatran nerf since Eruption is only from the one available via Pokémon Ranger on the DS
Can’t some of them be passed down as egg moves though?
@@tezcanaslan2877 Event moves or ones from a particular generation cannot be passsd down through breeding. An event Chansey that knows wish can't pass it down via breeding. Same goes for Pokémon that learn move tutor moves from a specific gen or level up moves only from one gen.
Poliwrath for example can only learn Amnesia in gen 1, and breeding didn't exist in gen 1. So if you want a Poliwrath with egg moves it's impossible to have it learn an egg move like Encore then it cannot know Amnesia at the same time because only a gen 1 Poliwrath traded to a later gen can know Amnesia, and therefore couldn't also have known Encore as that is only taught in later gens from breeding.
The Chansey situation in particular irks me greatly. Wish Chansey for me is iconic, passing those big ole wishes with my bulky blob to heal my other guys to full. And somehow, despite how much *sense* it would make (the healer Pokemon healing allies? What a novel concept!), GF has never given us Wish Chansey since that one event from a decade ago.
Shoot, give us Wish Move Tutor, it's way too cool of a move to be locked to so few mons.
Side note. As of right now Knock Off in advanced is not valued as heavily now as it was in 2019/ 2020. Do to the fact that Hariyama is a very unreliable Tyranitar switch in because it's not sand immune so it cannot recover off those hits its tasked to take. Breloom is ussually preferred as not only does it have a superior utility move in Spore but also has the option of using stab priority which is extremely rare in advanced. Infact many top players believe Armaldo is better for the simple fact that it is sand immune and rock types are the strongest offensive type in advanced over all. Sand Immunity goes a very long way.
I'm no expert in ADV but I've found that Substitute + Three Attacks Hariyama is the superior set, anyways. All it has to do is switch in to Tyranitar once on an obvious Dark or Rock move, then use Substitute when the opponent is forced to switch out to avoid Cross Chop. Then you can hit whatever switches in with Cross Chop (fish for a crit on Skarmory), HP Ghost or Rock Slide. I'll take the immediate damage any day rather than use Knock Off on a non-stall Pokemon and hope that the sandstorm damage makes up for lost time.
I disagree with this and I don’t think you’re accurately representing the thoughts of top players in ADV. Hariyama continues to be seen in ADV and is even rated above Breloom by top players as recently as the 2022 VR update. Hariyama is pivotal against Skarmory teams and opens up a huge amount of flexibility for defensive builds just by bringing Knock Off to the table. Armaldo is certainly on the rise, but saying that top players are rating it consistently above Hariyama is not true. I love that you point out that the sand-immunity is a huge component of Armaldo’s rising viability. Hariyama is certainly not riding the same wave it was in 2019/2020, but it is an integral emergent element of ADV OU, and I think you ignore Hariyama’s defensive utility as a Rock-resist while at the same time hyping up a Rock-type spinner’s Rock STAB.
I recently found out Breloom and Charizard went from UUBL to OU while Porygon2 and Regice went from OU to UUBL. Not really a drastic change, purely cosmetic, but shows that the former two are more recognized in modern ADV OU.
@@butteredsalmonella I agree that it’s cool to see that past gens are living tiers. ADV UU itself is looking for a really big shake-up this year, so we may even see some UUBLs getting tested!
Don’t mind me I’m just appreciating a polite and civil conversation.
(Repost)
Surprised Poor Klinklang isn't mentioned, I genuinely think if that thing got Edgequake or even Rockslide + High Horsepower that thing would be high tier as hell. But no it gets the terrible Wild Charge and Normal Attacks for Coverage.
Half the time it doesn't even bother running coverage because of this.
Klinklang in gen7/ Natdex with rising voltage shift gear gear grind and wild charge with elec Z is a really good mu fish and surprises plenty of people. however it is a shame that you need a magnezone to get rid of opposing steels before it can do much, try it out regardless!
Vanilluxe too, almost worse tho
The funniest thing about Klinklang is that in BW, it didn't even have Wild Charge, that's a B2W2 addition.
Electric types also need some Physical STAB that doesn't require blood sacrifice.
Even something like an Electric Dragon Claw, but as generic looking as possible so anyone can get it.
@@MidoriNatsume Basically make Zing Zap extremely common.
Shoutout to every physical fire and dark type before generation 4. Looking at pokemon like Absol and Flareon makes me wonder sometimes if the people assigning their stats knew what game they were working on.
Flareon definitely had it a lot “better” on paper in generation 1 when its Special stat was still composite and equal to Jolteon and Vaporeon’s special stats. My assumption is that each Eevelution was designed around a good chunky special stat and one other standout stat - Vaporeon got HP, Jolteon got Speed, and Flareon got arguably the short end of the stick with Attack. There was always going to be one Eeveelution of the initial that would have been given the less helpful high stat for a mono-Special type, and in this universe it was Flareon. I think that design knowledge was lost a bit with the advent of other Eevelutions, which shuffle the base stats of the original trio and pull a new Pokémon out. Now we have an optimized fast special breaker like Espeon or a flop physically defensive Mono-Ice-type special tank like Glaceon. Sometimes you just get the right stat spread, and sometimes you’re the Flareon.
@@annaangelic2318 wasnt flareon in ou for a specific niche in gen 8?
@@saiyanscaris6530 Flareon was never “in” SS OU, but in early pre-DLC SS some players thought it had a niche before it was unranked from C on the vr in March 2020.
Kingler had the same issue. I feel there was fundamental communications issues in Pokemon 1's dev cycle.
I wonder if dark was supposed to be physical the whole time, and they just never noticed until gen 4. Seems like something we'll never really know about but it would be funny.
What is even sadder for Zamazenta is SV's box legendaries.
Miraidon is just as OP as Zacian, but Koraidon is amazing too. That plus Zamazenta getting nerfed because Zacian did... thing is taking Ls like no one's buisness.
Koraidon is definitely better than Zamazenta but it's very skewed in Miraidon's favor. Koraidon has the weird lack of Fire STAB despite being predominantly intended for fire teams. Also physical fire moves aren't the best in the world. Though it at least gets Flare Blitz. You know it's messed up with Flame Charge is legitimately used by it... It also has to make an actual choice between its signature move or Close Combat, which deals more damage by default but has a downside unlike Collision Course. It's absolutely a good pokemon, but...
Miraidon is just utterly ridiculous by comparison. Ability boosts its own friggin STAB on top of its SpAtk by default, signature that there's no contest in going for, it can literally punch through anything you stick in front of it because of its amazing combination of moves... It's like they combined DragMag into a single friggin pokemon. It's disgusting. I honest to God see it getting kicked into Anything Goes. It's already banned from NatDex.
They should have just done something silly for Zamazenta. Just, take off ten special attack or something. Something it wouldn't miss. But no.
_And it still doesn't get King's Shield._ Why do they hate the shield dog?
Zamazenta gets body press now, so the def boost just effectively became a free bulk-up.
The nerf was a blessing in disguise, since he followed in Kyurem Black's footsteps and fell to OU, where he's actually pretty solid. Also he has body press now, better late than never.
@@gregorymirabella1423mf Finch made a post that he might test Crowned in OU
but Zamazenta gets Body Press now! So...horray...?
I think my personal favorite awful moveset is Galarian Stunfisk. It's an ostensibly defensive Pokemon that doesn't really have anything unique at all that helps it be defensive, like, it gets Rest and Substitute, but not Toxic or Body Press? Okay, well, at least it has Earthqake, but its best Steel type STAB is Flash Cannon from a 66 base special attack, and don't even get me started on type coverage outside of that. But the funniest part about it is that its signature move, Snap Trap, isn't even a fucking STAB move, it's a grass type move for some reason. You can make Stunfisk grass type with Mimickry, but if you do that, the grassy terrain is going to be healing your opponent so the DoT effect is completely nullified, and you're switching a ground/steel type defensive mon for a grass type defensive mon. All you're gaining out of it is trapping your opponent in against Galarian Stunfisk, so maybe you can win when they run out the clock after they tab over to message their friends about the idiot playing Galarian Stunfisk.
Also this is less competitive viability, but I am still mad that Shiftry doesn't get Tailwind, it's a tengu dammit. It wouldn't fix a damn thing about him but it would be cute.
Galarian Stunfisk definitely needs a face-lift (haha) but I don't think giving it like Iron Head or Gyro Ball would radically change its viability. I think you downplay Gunfisk's toolkit by neglecting its moves like Yawn, Sludge Bomb, Stone Edge, Foul Play, Pain Split, and especially Stealth Rock. I really doubt there is a way to truly "fix" a Pokemon like Stunfisk to the point where it would be considered top tier while still making it recognizable. Stunfisk and Gunfisk might not be on the playing field of Ferrothorn, but they are still valuable and viable in not just SS ZU but SS PU and SS NU as well. I would REALLY love to see Gunfisk with a better ability though, and the exciting part is that Gamefreak has left two ability slots open-ended for it.
@@annaangelic2318 honestly i did not know he was good in ZU and PU and despite my hatred for stunfisk i am weirdly happy for the little guy i think, good for them
You mean this video?
th-cam.com/video/MJczQywT4JY/w-d-xo.html
@@syris1952 Stunfisk rights!!!
@@annaangelic2318 For some reason I misread that as Stunfisk Fangirls
Thanks for the update!
Maybe a "Pokemon who suffered most from generation shifts"?
Sceptile and Regice losing badly from physical special split. Skuntank losing Pursuit, etc.
Eggsecutor would be Number 1.
Here's why:
Its 4x Weakness to Bug
Gen 2 Introduced Dark and Steel
Got Explosion Nerf in Gen 5
Its Speed became its biggest downfall
@@darianclark3980 Gen 2 also effectively cut its Special Defense by a whopping 60 points in the Special split, losing it nearly half of its special bulk, which then in turn made its slow speed that much more of a problem when it couldn't take a lot of special hits anymore.
The number one Pokemon that suffered on a purely mechanical level from the generational shift was Banette from gen 3 to gen 4. Banette was a great offensive sleeper and physical attacker in ADV UU, but losing out on physical Shadow Ball with perfect coverage in physical HP Fighting left it completely bereft for the rest of the generations. Banette isn't even ranked in DPP PU, below DPP NU and UU. Banette is a top tier Pokemon in DPP ZU (below DPP PU), but it's fallen hard from being a UU champ.
No way Skuntank "suffered" from the mechanical shift from gens 7 to 8. Gaining Nasty Plot was a boon for it. Skuntank is a strong Pokemon in SS ZU after being a top Pokemon in SS PU, which is where you'd kind of expect it to be after a generation introducing the standard new Pokemon for power creep as well as the smaller size of tiers. Pursuit being gone is definitely a hit to Dark types, but I don't think you know what you're talking about if you say that Skuntank is one of the biggest losers of mechanical shifts.
Tauros is my pick. Meta staple to literally who
Funny thing about Aerodactyl is I think it could be on this list in every single generation, because it's a physical Flying/Rock type with Rock Head, but doesn't get Brave Bird or Head Smash to use with them. I think if it had access to those two moves, it could be a serious threat even in the higher tiers. Mega Aerodactyl has the exact same problem, it has Tough Claws but the only STAB move it has that can make use of it is Sky Drop.
Regigigas would actually be pretty good, if it got access to Skill Swap.
As for gen 8, I would like to nominate... every single defensive Pokemon, because of Dynamax. One of the reasons Dynamax was banned was because of how heavily it favoured offense, with every offensive move effectively getting a free support move added onto it, and every support move becoming Protect. I think Dynamax would have been a lot more balanced if support pokemon could use max moves that combined two support moves, something like Rest+Heal Bell, or Stealth Rock+Whirlwind.
Dynamax was a mistake.
- doubled HP
- doesn’t consume an item slot
- free Z moves
- no flinching
- free stat boosts
- making certain moves like Roar, Encore, and Destiny Bond not work at all
- nullifying Red Card’s effect but still consuming the item
- all this for 3 whole turns
Buffing Dynamax by allowing Dynamaxed Pokémon to use status moves would make Dynamax more OP than it already is. (Especially with combined status moves)
Yooo imagine Regigigas Skill Swapping Slow Start on its opponents! "Who's laughing now?" >:D
@@GoldGuard "nullifying Red Card's effect but still consuming it"
OK that's stupid. It should just not activate
@@GoldGuard dynamax seems to be balanced around the doubles format. Doesn’t mean i agree with it but its a lot more sensible there.
Also you forgot another important one
Weight based moves start failing (low kick, heat crash, heavy slam etc..)
@@SemmmmProductions I was aware of that but I wasn’t sure if those moves were common enough for it to be a huge problem with Dynamax. It’s still dumb that certain moves like that don’t work at all though
I find it so weird that they decided to make Zacian the most broken thing ever, while at the same time making Zamazenta the laughing stock of ubers. It would be interesting to see how Zamazenta would do if it had access to some better utility moves and reliable recovery.
BDSP completely screwed over Zapdos, making it the worst it has ever been competitively. No Hurricane, no Hidden Power, and no Toxic. Has nothing it can do vs Ground-types and its best Flying STAB is...Drill Peck. Hoping this isn't permanent.
Not even Heat Wave I think, right? Zapdos was officially reverted to its Gen I status, but with other 400 pokemon instead of 150
@luizpdrnogueira ah right, no Heat Wave, either lmao. At least it still has U-turn, I guess.
Well the entire game sucks so it's not really a big news.
And no Heat Wave on Zapdos as well
Out of all the things they took away from gen 4 or refused to fix, who stopped the whole team to say “guys, we *have* to delete the entire movepool of these legends”?
1:08 the funny thing is, you find the Earthquake TM in the same place as Gible
I've always liked that, Earthquake so early in the adventure and you find it with a monster of a Pokémon
See I was dumb and probably gave my EQ TM to like a Quagsire
@@BigYellowSilly something cool is that Excadrill is the exact opposite to Garchomp. Not only learns Earthquake by level up, it does so at a decently low level
Being a Drillbur it learns it until level 33 (only wait 2 levels to evolve to get it a little bit earlier)
Or Excadrill learns it at level 36, not far from its evolution at level 31
Pretty sure thats platinum only too, dp wack af
16:22
"King/Queen/Themperor..."
Big Yellow deserves all the subscribers in the world. There are so, so, SO MANY golden lines in these vids.
Edit: Thinking about it, if Regigias had skill swap they would probably be an abomination to deal with, at least in theory. Sure, they would have trouble getting it off the first turn due to the low speed, but after that they're not only strong again but they've potentially crippled an opponent's key player. THAT would make them worthy of their legendary status.
Also Tradebacks Gen 1 looks cool AF.
Tradebacks sounds really sick but at the same time Lovely Kiss Snorlax
@@BigYellowSilly
Wait, so you're telling me that you *don't* want a 75% sleep move in a generation where Pokemon take a turn to wake up, all on a Pokemon that's already too good for its own good?
Are you saying you *don't* want a 2 meter 460 kg teddy bear to have PDA with an angry bull?
Suit yourself.
Skill Swap would be gross as fuck. Just give Regigigas Clear Body and let it be cool.
(Comment Reposted from the original video)
Gen 8 Ubers player here.
I know it was just a little text on the side, thank you for mentioning Zama-C's niche.
For those still confused, here's a little bit of a more in depth explanation.
With the rise of Yveltal, and Weavile, People have been clamoring for a way to switch into these beasts, Zamazenta's proved to be the best switch in to both of them.
On top of that Zamazenta Crowned has come out as a decent soft check to Calyrex Shadow! By that I mean, it's able to take at least one hit from even Specs Calyrex, and scout out what move it locks into, even trick. Why's this important? Well, due to Zamazenta Crowned's need to run the Rusted Shield, it's actually immune to trick, a method Calyrex usually has to deal with Yveltal.
Of course it should never be your ONLY answer to Calyrex, just a method to keep Yveltal's boots intact in a pinch.
Because of this, Zamazenta Crowned has found its place on bulkier teams, as a short term stop to threats and give other teammates some breathing room.
The short of it, Zamazenta Crowned soft checks a lotta threats.
The long of it is, Zamazenta Crowned provides insurance against
*breathe in*
Eternatus
Necrozma Dusk Mane
Galarian Darmanitan
Defensive Ho-Oh
Zekrom
Calyrex Ice
Rayquaza
Xerneas
Calyrex Shadow
Yveltal
and Weavile
of course Zama-C isn't reccomended to be your SOLE answer to any of them (besides maybe Yveltal and Weavile) But they greatly ease pressure in these matchups against extremely prominent Pokémon.
For example, Zamazenta Crowned eases pressure on checking Xerneas, allowing Dusk Mane to run one of its deadliest sets in Bulky Swords Dance. On top of that, Yveltal appreciates Zamazenta's Ability to absorb knock off, trick, and status ailments with rest.
Zamazenta's also blessed with the fact it's a steel type, not completely stone walled by Ferrothorn, making either one of the strongest wallbreakers in the entire tier, Kyogre, or one of the most potent Cleaners in the entire tier, Zekrom, stellar partners.
I really like Zamazenta's design, so I'm very happy to see that it's at least found its place in the meta.
If you wanna know more, check out its (WIP) Smogon Analysis page.
www.smogon.com/forums/threads/zamazenta-crowned-qc-2-2-gp-1-2.3681968/
Ty for keeping this comment this was a really informative one!
I’m so happy that my boi Zamazenta found a use in Ubers. He still needs recovery and body press ngl (or at least make Behemoth Bash function like body press)
Aw. I'm so happy my boi is useful even despite how dirty it was done
It feels like the Ubers club is saying to zamazenta "don't get to confortable here. When your buddies leave, we tossing you out real quick homeboy"
@@TheKaien01
Honestly, as long as stuff like Yveltal, Xerneas, Eternatus, and Dusk Mane, remain the monsters they are (they will they've all always been top tier in Ubers, and Eternatus is sure to be great in next Gen Ubers too.) Zamazenta-C will continue to have SOME kinda niche. Since, while it's not a complete stalwart answer to most things, its ability to compress soft checking so many Pokémon into one team slot allows teams that would otherwise need to be way bulkier, the freedom to play much more aggresively and use some of their more dangerous sets!
One that got me, especially as Sceptile is my 2nd favorite Pokemon and favorite starter, is that its Mega Evolution's best special dragon stab is Dragon Pulse, and does not have access to Draco Meteor. You wanna know the reason? Draco Meteor can only be taught via tutor to dragon types, which makes sense, but completely fucks Sceptile over because it only gets the dragon typing thru Mega Evolution. I suppose same can be said for Mega Ampharos as well.
Mega Sceptile really should've been a physical attacker and shit like this is why lmao. He had a great physical movepool and SD, but nope, they shoehorned him into being a special attacker for some reason despite always being depicted using physical moves, and having a signature move that's physical.
@@Slaking_ to be fair, its signature move was originally special. It got fucked in the gen 4 physical-special split lmao
@@henriquepacheco7473 All the more reason to make Mega Sceptile physical.
@@henriquepacheco7473 Hard to say Sceptile “got fucked” by the physical-special split when Sceptile’s fast special attacker kit was granted an even stronger Grass STAB in Leaf Storm that generation to perfectly match its hit-and-run / revenge killer play style. I would not describe going from being a niche UUBL mon to a strong UU mon as “getting fucked”
@@annaangelic2318 well, yeah, if you take a metaphor out of the specific context it was used in it tends to get stupid quick, that shouldn't be news to anyone.
When you began to introduce Aerodactyl, I KNEW it was Aerodactyl. GameFreak lives to gut poor Aerodactyl, and it could really be the subject of the whole video. Took this thing eight generations to get an alternate Flying STAB to Fly and Sky Attack. But beyond that, it's had Rock Head since abilities were introduced, but the only moves it's ever been able to take advantage of with it are Double-Edge (from FRLG/Emerald or VC transfer only) and Take Down.
Take Down. Aerodactyl has had an ability that for five generations lets it take advantage of a 90 power, inaccurate Normal-type move with no side effects. To be fair, it's not the only Rock Head Pokémon with absolutely dire options, but it's probably the worst of them. (Rhydon also only gets Take Down, most others at least get Double-Edge.)
What are you talking about with the Rhydon Double-Edge thing? Rhydon has had Double-Edge since RB, and it uses it in metagames like ADV OU, DPP PU, and BW RU.
@@annaangelic2318 The only way Rhydon can have Double-Edge _now_ is as a transfer move, either from Gen III Tutor, the Dream World, or RBY VC. I'm not talking about when and where those methods are contemporary-that's completely different. Being that you can only get it as a transfer move, it can be difficult to get now outside of simulators, and can't even be used in some formats.
@@hokostudios I see. I assumed you were referring to simulators given that the video assumes an extreme amount of simulator use to portray some of the metagames being discussed. My mistake!
They could have let it learn Brave Bird and Head Smash. Even Crobat, that’s not a bird, knew Brave Bird since the move’s debut.
@@IgnitedQuils Crobat seems to be more of the exception than the rule. I get wanting the best physical Flying move so far on Aero, but I think the pterodactyl using Brave Bird when there's another existing fossil Pokemon meant to show the transition between dinosaurs and birds seems like a big stretch.
On the flipside of things, I do actually appreciate when they try to make moves to be more widely distributed. Like how Liquidation is meant to be given to basically every physical water type, or even just non-water type aquatic Pokemon. More recent new moves are good at this too, with Scorching Sands being a ground type move fire types can learn, or Burning Jealousy being a fire type move that dark and ghost types can learn. They should make more moves like that
Funniest meme on this I’ve seen is that Kyurem-B doesn’t get Ice Punch, but Wooper does
Don't forget Gastly
Kyurem black had such a glowup in gen 8. Not only did it get icicle spear and dd as you mentioned, but heavy duty boots was huge for it as well. The sub dd set was so hard to beat when it was in ou.
I kind of wish it didn’t get icicle spear since then it wouldn’t be in ubers where it sucks in
@@azeria1 ya maybe it should’ve gotten a more reliable physical ice stab that fits thematically like, uhhh, ICE PUNCH?!
freeze dry is also what it got so good luck to bulky physical waters
Everything benefitted from getting timbs
Flareon was always one of one of the most unfortunate pokemon imo. It's a physical fire type with very few decent physical moves. It's also a fire type stuck with guts, but it can't use a fire orb to activate it since it can't be burned. So you have to use a toxic orb to get any use out of it.
It's trying its hardest but it just can't get there
Guts on a Fire Type with no coverage is the worst idea ever
Fire and electric really lacks good offdnsive attack without recoil
to make things worse: it took until gen 6 for Flareon to get flare blitz, but that was too late
@@bulborb8756 Indeed, and to make things worse, Flareon still didnt get good coverage moves outside of Flare Blitz
@@USSFFRU honestly while Glaceon is far worse then Flareon....Flareon has been utter garbage for a lot longer
While not an example of a pokémon made bad by its movepool, it bugs me how gen 1 Alakazam has a super limited movepool. In gen 1 the most random of pokémon can learn moves like blizzard, fire blast, and thunderbolt, but Alakazam, despite being a very powerful special attacker that would greatly benefit from such moves, can't learn pretty much any other special move than psychic. I don't know, it would make more sense to me for a powerful psychic pokémon to be able to conjure fire or blizzards than for a random bull to lean those moves.
I remember playing LeafGreen and having to teach the Abra line Shock Wave because he can't learn Thunderbolt.
This is why we love starmie more
Thankfully, tradebacks did wonders for Alakazam. Ice Punch and Thunder Punch are great on it. It's not perfect, but it helps.
@@nsbathome That sounds amazing
I think Alakazam having limited coverage is actually a great flavor for it in the first generation! Alakazam is already considered the number 5 Pokémon in RBY OU and its tendency to create Psychic vs Psychic mirrors that slow the battle pace down is its own fascinating dynamic beyond just being a mini-Mewtwo throwing out whatever special coverage it wanted. Mr Mime’s access to Thunderbolt and Hypno’s access to sleep mean that the three non-legendary Mono-Psychics of RBY all have something to distinguish them, even if Hypno and Mr Mime fall a bit behind Alakazam.
To repost this from the original upload (since it was long and I don't want all the effort wasted lmao):
To give a gen 7 example, there's Lurantis. Funny little grass mantis, gets Contrary as an ability. And it's a physical attacker. So you'd think "oh huh, so it'll do the Malamar thing with Contrary-Superpower", which could be really good given that Lurantis has higher base attack than it (Lurantis even has decent physical coverage). But nope. In Sun-Moon, it only had Leaf Storm to use with Contrary. Now of course, this is what Serperior does. But Lurantis, while a physical attacker, actually has a higher Sp.A than Serp (80 on Lurantis, 75 on Serp). So you could also think "oh, so it's a better Serperior too"? Still nope. Serperior, famous for Contrary Leaf Storm and basically no coverage outside of Hidden Power & Dragon Pulse, somehow still has better coverage than it. Serp at least has a relatively neutral coverage move (DPulse). Lurantis? *Weather Ball*. That's it. All it gets. And on top of that, Serp is super fast. 113 base. Malamar? 73 base. Lurantis? Base *45*. So it's basically just a terrible hybrid of the two. Now, in the Ultra games, it did get Superpower, and Signal Beam (which is technically Special coverage), so it can actually be a halfway maybe okay physical attacker. But the best part? It isn't even used as an attacker primarily. It's a Defog support Pokémon in Gen 7. It's still not very good, only being decent in PU there, but the fact that it could barely even take advantage of Contrary in the base Sun & Moon is very mean.
Lurantis is such a messy mon and it's a shame cause the design is sick
I love my pajama pants not-a-bug and it's such a shame it's not very good.
Dang, I always thought Lurantis was a cool looking Pokémon, but never wound up using one and now I'm kinda glad I didn't which actually also makes me kinda sad as it was one of my more favorite new designs from gen 7.
Here's a funny little game!
Look at Lurantis' stats, then look at Tsareena's stats.
*_WHY_*
Surprised you didn't mention Vespiqueen having all of her exclusive signature moves removed in gen 8, completely nuking her from orbit
Vespiquen may have had its signature moves removed, but SWSH was actually the first generation ever where Vespiquen was not Untiered! Vespiquen was a dominant support Pokemon in SS ZU from August 2020 to October 2020 before the release of the Crown Tundra DLC. Roost, Toxic Spikes, Defog, and U-Turn are far superior moves to Attack Order / Defend Order / Heal Order anyway in a competitive singles context.
Am I missing something? Attack Order and Defend Order are still in SwSh (I used a Vespiquen in my playthrough). Only Heal Order was removed, which honestly is just more baffling.
@@av2279 Honestly not sure what I was smoking here. I totally misremembered, and I'm not sure what I was mistakenly thinking of.
@@av2279It does also still get Roost, which, one could argue is actually situationally superior to Heal Order...
But like cmon its cool as heck to get to use a mon's signature moves
@@Invisibool It got access to Roost because of BDSP. In SwSh and therefore Gen 8 VGC, Vespiquen did not get Roost.
Another good one I can think for specifically maingame play is Sneasel, who has always basically had all its good (or even just decent) physical STAB moves locked behind egg moves or tutors, which gets made worse by Sneasel often only being obtainable late in the game. So if you want to use Sneasel/Weavile in your playthroughs and have them be good, you have to trade for them already having the egg/tutor moves they really need, or go through the cumbersome process of breeding them those egg moves late in the game, which most people won't want to do. SWSH at least finally made Sneasel obtainable early and made Ice Punch a TM again, but in turn for some reason they made Sneasel not learn _any_ physical Ice and Dark moves by level up, so one that wasn't specifically bred to have those moves can't do anything until you get the aforementioned Ice Punch TM or evolve it.
Far from the worst movepool problem, as it can at least get those moves through some means unlike much more unfortunate pokemon, but still annoyingly inconvenient for no good reason.
And this is without even getting into the fact that for the first 2 generations of it's existence, it didn't even have any physical STAB moves at all, which was made all the worse by the fact that it's special attack is terrible and ice and dark moves were always special in gens 2 and 3. Granted this is pretty obvious stuff that most people must be at least casually aware of, but it still sucks that even though it had good enough attack and speed stats to be usable it was simply not because of this issue
@@matthewkuscienko4616 It was why Sneasel was seen as a joke the first two gens it’s been in. Even Gengar, a Pokemon lacking special STABs for the first few gens, was formidable and had defensive utility.
@@matthewkuscienko4616 As a big Sneasel fan since its debut, those first two generations of existence was rough, wanted to use it so badly but even as a kid I couldn't justify using a dual special type mon with such abysmal special attack. The Physical/Special split was such a godsend (and an evolution was nice too, though I always preferred Sneasel's design to Weavile's), though I'll always question why it took them until Gen 4 to do it (and why Dark was a Special type to begin with).
Man I wish Zamazenta had King’s shield, cus you know, he literally was the King’s shield
(GUESS I'LL POST THIS AGAIN) There is one kind of funny thing Regigigas did in Gen 8. In VGC. Because Regigigas is allowed there because lol imagine having slow start with two pokemon breathing down your neck.
Gen 8 introduced a new form for Weezing called Bong Weezing I mean Galarian Weezing. G-Weez has a new ability called Neutralizing Gas that nullifies the abilities of all pokemon in battle. Including your allies in doubles.
Needless to say, with this, Regigigas basically got to actually do stuff without any of the previous gimmicky, inconsistent garbage that people previously used like Worry Seed or Skill Swap. Add that with the fact it could Dynamax and suddenly Regigigas is, or at least was a noteworthy VGC threat.
And that is so cool. I love it when weird tech introduced later on gives previously utterly useless pokemon some time to shine.
Also I know apparently there was a niche with it back when Dark Void Smeargle was around but that's more of an indictment of how horrible DVSmeargle was than anything involving Regigigas' merits. You put both of your foes to sleep. That's basically a free two-kill no matter what you've got on your team unless you're using literal meme trash.
Just an addendum, isn't Kantonian Weezing with Neutralizing Gas the better partner for Regigigas in VGC?
@@thebumpercar1344 I... Actually forgot normal Weezing had that ability too lmao. I guess it would be? There are pros and cons to either one.
@@DMSwordsmaster : That's fair, K-Weezing only got it in Gen 8. I've seen videos of people playing with the team, the consensus is that the problem is keeping Weezing alive, and the Fairy type doesn't add anything significant to Weezing's resistances (barring the Dragon immunity), and adds a Steel weakness. You're still going to have to spam Protect to keep it alive, and you're not switching it in to a possible double attack anyway. The bigger issue is that Weezing, despite being a defensive mon, just has issues taking the high-powered hits in the current format with all the legendaries allowed in it.
All hail the magic bong baby!
I remember when Gen 8 first dropped and I found out Zamazenta didn't get body press, man I was furious. You'd think Gamefreak would have given the fighting type defensive boxart legendary the fighting defense scaling move that was introduced in the same generation as it.....but nope, that would make too much sense. Agree that Zamazenta looks cooler though, was the reason why I got Shield.
Zamazenta not getting Body Press is a sin.
In my opinion I prefer Zacian's design but why would they do a box legendary so dirty and only make one of them good (It's not even good, it's TOO good in fact, like Zacian is a free win most of the time. Which I would be fine with if zamazenta got a similar treatment at least.)
Also mega aggron is my favourite mega design and nothing comes close except for mega rayquaza but who doesn't like mega rayquaza.
I hate that someone design movepool at gamefreak clearly has favourism toward Zacian. It is a broken offensive pokemon that has Behemoth Blade to counter the very new battle system of the game (Dynamax), and the only kind of answer to it is Quagsire, which still get f*cked if you dont play your cards right, and become a liability if your opponent dont have Zacian. In the VGC that gamefreak design their competitive side around Zacian still not balance in anyway either, there are more answers compare to single but it is still one of, if not the best retristed Pokemon.
Then there is Zamazenta who has a joke of a movepool (just checked, it learns Solar Beam but not Body Press like wtf?) If they gave it Body Press and at least make Behemoth Bash using defense instead of attack, or make it defensive version of Behemoth Blade like protect on both of your Pokemon + reduce the dmg of Max moves.
Or the simple solution of switching Zamazenta and Zacian type. Making Zamazenta better with the best defensive type combination and Zacian least of a unkillable fast beast.
@@maivu4415 notot mention zacian normal form is in anything goes while zamazenta crowened almost got sent to ou
Plus, Zacian has higher base stats than regigigas, and a super good ability
@@guiguipop3658 more importantly it has speed and steel style and that ability it basicly
Has 2x damage from the start like you can just click
It says something that Shield version Postgame Hop is one of the legit most difficult fights in the series (assuming you weren’t force feeding your Mons Exp candies) _specifically because he has a high-level Zacian with a boss Trainer AI attached._
I still think the Pokemon with the officially worst movepool is Ledian. It is ment to be able to "punch good" - Until you realize it's weakest stat is his phys. attack stat.
Should it ever return it would be desperate for a change in stats, or a new evolution to actually give it something.
Or something like Parental Bond for punching moves, since, as the Moon dex entry puts it, "it aims to win by quantity rather than quality."
@@robertlupa8273 It's hard to make Ledian competent without breaking its lore, because it's supposed to be weak anyway. Even Parental Bond implies that you're fighting together with your offspring, so it doesn't really fit. Skill Link would be more suitable, but even then you aren't doing a lot with base 35 attack, and the multi-hit moves it could learn got cut in Gen 8. 75 BP Arm Thrust or Beat Up with physically strong attackers could make it function, especially with King's Rock flinch hax.
I guess an ability could be introduced in the future that would emulate Parental Bond that would be called Followup/Aftershock or something (or Iron Barbs/Rough Skin because it can be explained away that it reflexively punches the opponent when it makes contact - could be called Counterpuncher) with the movepool it currently has. It's frail, but 4x resistance to grass and fighting would give it a role. Or give it an evolution, dammit.
@@handanyldzhan9232 I said "something *like* Parental Bond". I only meant the effect. Of course the flavor doesn't fit Ledian at all, but the effect could.
And yeah, Ledian (and Ariados while we're at it, why not) could really use an evolution
Big Yellow said "Unfortunately" so many times in this vid I thought I was watching False Swipe Gaming. :P Shoutout to all the physical Electric types who don't get a decent physical electric move.
For gen7 I'd say kommo-o lacking a reliable special fighting STAB really hurts. The only special fighting move it gets is focus blast which feels absolutely dreadful to use in conjunction with its signature dragon move that drops its defenses, you're already gambling by bringing a 4x fairy weak mon in and you have to gamble with your STAB. It didn't feel quite as bad before usum but after you couldn't even justify fighting Z crystal because you wanted your signature crystal.
Another big loser in gen7 was guzzlord. An absolute unit of a mon with the classic "rest is your only recovery option haha xd" gimmick game freak loves. Araquanid arguably falls into the same category but at least it has access to the buffed STAB leech life, we can at least pretend that counts as reliable recovery.
I should also mention that in Sun & Moon, Kommo-o didn't reallt have a good physical fighting option as it only had Sky Uppercut which was a little inaccurate, of course the ultra games did fix that by giving him Close Combat, but i think it was still worth mentioning
Jumpluff had no flying moves by level up until gen four where it got bounce of all things and also u turn which is interesting but thankfully in gen five it got acrobatics which is definitely it’s best flying move also it can get strength sap by breeding so that’s interesting
Gen 5 was a good time to be a stab acrobatics mon
Wait, I thauggt it only gets acrobatics in gen 6
Did you know that Zamazenta represents one of the two ancient kings of Galar in SWSH? They're his companion Pokémon, so you can sort of think of them as the king's personal shield! Pretty neat!
That's crazy, I guess you could say they're a King's Shield, I wonder if they have a tool that helps convey that
@@BigYellowSilly And it would've been excusable to take another pokemon's signature move (Aegislash's to be exact) since it is a Legendary and a Mascot/Box-Art one as that, but no.
Whiling Blastoise finally got Shell Smash in Gen 8, it was too little too late. Rain is no longer permanent, and megas are gone (funnily enough, Mega Blastoise is banned in NatDex on PokemonShowdown cause of Shell Smash)
They also tried to give it (and other pokemon like Primarina, Hatterene, Goodra, Lapras and Gardevoir) reliable recovery in the form of a recent move Life Dew, but the problem is Life Dew doesn't heal shit in singles as it only heals 25% or 1/4 of HP regardless, and even in doubles/VGC the move saw very little play. So nothing fundamentally changed with Defensive Blastoise.
Maybe if Life Dew heals 50% in singles whiling 33% in doubles/VGC, Blastoise and the other mentioned might've actually have reliable recovery.
if megas do end up returning mega blastoise is going to be busted as hell
Life dew should be the same as jungle healing
I legitimately forgot how bad heracross’ fighting movepool was in gen 2.
The fact it didn't at least get DynamicPunch is insane tbh like it's a TM
I was one of those kids on the playground back in the Pokemania days and I could NEVER forget the feeling of hype turning into disappointment when I found and used one in Silver.
HGSS literally has a place in my hearts just for fixing some of those injustices. It becoming the ultimate answer to Whitney and the hax she can throw at you is just beautiful.
A lot of problems with physical rock types is that they're stuck with the unreliable stone edge. Lycanrock-Dusk is the biggest missed opportunity to me.
It has access to one of the coolest priority moves boosted by one of the best abilities in tough claws with great attack and speed but because its stuck with stone edge its just unreliable as an attacker. Most of them are forced to run close combat as their main attack which is doesn't get STAB on. It doesn't even get the much more reliable rock blast. It didn't even get close combat in gen 7.
Its so close to being goddamn amazing if it just got one good physical rock move especially if it was boosted by tough claws.
Also, the only slow Lycanroc form doesn't even get Accelerock.
If Regigigas at least got the classic "variated special movepool" a lot of normal type Pokemon get, you could get a weird slow pivot with inmese bulk and mediocre special but usable enough on lower tiers.
Or just give it teleport or volt switch and probably skyrocket as pivot
Gamefreak: Zamazenta, we're going to give you an ultimatum: We will give you Body Press
Zamazenta: FUCKING FINALLY!
Gamefreak: But we're gonna nerf you and Zacian. We're gonna nerf you to shit specifically.
Zamazenta: ...a small price to pay for salvation.
Still VERY powerful in VGC
I have an idea similar to this video where you could go over unfortunate stat spreads for pokemon. For example you got rampardos, decidueye, etc. I think it'd be an interesting video.
Gen 7 and 8 had a ton of that that'd be interesting
@@BigYellowSilly Lurantis says hi
@@BigYellowSillyHey, i just started watching your videos again. Will you ever consider this idea?
It's 2024, Zamacenta got Body press and it now completely outclasses Zacian in VGC. Being the most used restricted in the last regional, our boy is finally eating good.
In Sun and Moon, Togedemaru didn't get Steel STAB outside of Gyro Ball... on a Pokémon with Base 95 speed! Luckily it got Iron Head and Iron Tail in the Ultra Games but it was still weird to have a steel type with no steel stab for a while...
Also, in Gen 8 Tapu Bulu gets outclassed by a starter pokemon Rillaboom as it didn't get access to Grassy Glide - a grass type move that gets extra priority in Grassy Terrain which both Rillaboom and Tapu Bulu being able to set up on switch in. It is argued that the Isle of Armour move tutor moves weren't given to the Tapu's because they would become insanely broken but they probably should have also checked Rillaboom off of that list too as it is arguably one of the best pokemon in VGC due to Grassy Glide whilst Bulu just watches and weeps for what could have been (also it doesn't get Play Rough as a physical Fairy type but Grass/Fairy is a bad type combo anyways due to the quad poison weakness so I don't think it still would have had a chance against Rillaboom)
Giving terrain moves to the tapus would have been insanely broken, imagine a tapu koko rising voltage
@@helente764 tbh Lele with Expanding Force sounds worse, specially for doubles. Only Fini wouldn’t be really affected as Misty Explosion ain’t good anyway.
Tapu Bulu definitely struggles with Rillaboom boasting the Grassy Glide + Grassy Surge combo, but Bulu’s defensive utility and access to strong moves that Rillaboom lacks such as Horn Leech do give it definition. Rillaboom is also helped by its access to Knock Off and U-Turn to wear down its checks, whereas Tapu Bulu must break quickly if it is to avoid playing the long game.
@@alolancubone4737 yeah, scarf lele with expanding force would be such a menace
I remember using Muk alot in NU but always felt the lack of recovery let it down. I did like trying to get underpwered mons to perform. Then I realised it learns giga drain but it really should get drain punch (it does already get every other punching move). This was the best example of feeling personally let down by a pokemon not having a move.
Regigigas' movepool is absolutely terrible outside of physical attacks. It doesn't have a single move that raises its stats, so it has to stall for five turns on a shallow movepool, and even if it survives that, you can lower its stats and it can't do anything about it, and on top of that it's a physical attacker which means it's affected by intimidate. Even if Regigigas survives those five turns, it's attack is probably lower than the effective 80 base it started with. Regigias' ability and status movepool is so shit that it honestly might be better (or at least more fun) to try to turn its 9 special attacks (which mainly consists of near universal moves and some bad moves like snore and focus blast) into a working moveset than actually try to use its physical movepool aside from body press
You also gotta love the amazing unique move its got: Crush Grip.
It has ancient power? Wdym "it doesnt have a single move that raises its stats"? Annoying that a bunch of people probably took your word at face value.
@@Jin-lp5lt regigigas only has ancient power in legends arceus which doesn't have a competitive format, and even if it had it in other games, relying on a 10 percent chance each turn to get any setup at all is not a strategy that anyone is going to even try using, especially when you're likely to lose regigigas in 2-3 turns and are still stuck dealing with most of the stat drops and statuses like burn and paralysis, not to mention the stat boosts the other player got while you were hitting them with a 60 power move and protecting, even if you survive and get lucky with ancient power
Nah toxic stall gigas with knock off/body slam is where it’s at specifically on teams with grassy terrain. Not even worth trying to make it attack in formats that don’t change the mechanics but it’s bulk is legitimately great to the point where basically every ou pivot attack won’t break its sub when invested in bulk. Lacks good recovery options though so specifically needs the recovery from grassy terrain and knock off/body slam is there so it isn’t taunt bait. This is also the randoms gen 8 gigas set (though they specifically use body slam) and tbh it’s actually kinda decent there.
@@Altraduck25 there’s also power up punch not that it matters cuz the only attacks it should use are body slam or knock off
This isn't really an unfortunate movepool, but the fact that Hydreigon is basically the King of UU in Gens 6-8 and can STILL do well in OU shows how incredible its movepool is, especially in Gen 8. Nasty Plot is a MASSIVE threat, especially on Hydreigon
The funny thing in gen 7 was that until USUM there were no move tutors, so some new pokemon had really bad movepools. Tsareena’s best physical grass move was the 70bp Trop Kick, which lowered attack so there’s some utility, but Tsareena really wanted Power Whip, and it got a lot better when it did. Then there’s Kommo-O which had basically every setup move in the game but had like sky uppercut and clanging scales as its best STABs
There was a similar issue with Gen 6 (OR/AS) where they had to wait for Move-Tutors
whiling Chesnaught wanted STAB Drain Punch, it always had Rock Slide/Stone Edge, Earthquake and Poison Jab
Greninja liked Gunk Shot but was just fine with STABs, Ice Beam and Extrasensory (plus Protean is broken), and Goodra always has everything it wanted since Day 1..............offensively at least
Gen 6 didn't had it as bad as Gen 7, and here's the thing, neither Power Whip nor Close Combat were any Move Tutors prior to Sw/Sh so this was inexcuseable
I remembered before USUM Kommo’o was in RU and only ran special sets before its movepool got expanded. It was like Dragapult with a lackluster physical movepool.
@@IgnitedQuils kommo-o also got a zmove that was basicly an omniboost with insane power oh and its a sound based move which goes through substitue
The most disappointing thing I've ever felt was when I realized tentacruel can't learn something like recover. Tentacruel, based on jellyfish in which there's a type of jellyfish that can reverse its aging if it gets too old/sick/wounded doesn't learn recover
Heracross' move pool got buffed considerably in later gens. It got Brick Break in gen 3 and Close Combat in gen 4. Sadly power creep killed whatever competitive prowess it may have had outside of gimmicks with its Guts ability or its mega.
Mega Aggroon discussion made me think of Primal Groudon. If it had recovery outside of rest, it's entirely possible it would be AG in Gen 6 and 7. I personally really like Gen 6 and 7 Ubers a lot, and I'm kind of glad PDon DOESN'T have recovery. The flaw of not being able to truly take hits forever makes it much more interesting to play around, as much of a mandatory auto include as it is.
Imagine if P-Don got Morning Sun! 😳
@@sreenaths6829 As I said, that'd be Anything Goes sooooo fast lool
The Eveeloutions probably have it the roughest because they all learn so few moves overall. Especially Flareon who never got a great use for its stat distribution. It’s probably why sylveon is the best one; it’s got amazing stab some fire coverage and that’s all it needs so it having little else does nothing to make it worse.
In terms of coverage: Sylveon > Vaporeon > Espeon > Glaceon > Leafeon > Flareon > Umbreon > Jolteon
Not saying a lot due to how most of them lack good coverage
@@IgnitedQuils in terms of…
Big mistake
I remember glitching the fuck out of RBY as a small baby child and doing the glitch where you encounter Level 1 pokemon by teleporting away from trainer encounters (y'know the one that gets you Mew? yeah that one)
Point is, one of the trainers gives you a Scyther and I was so bummed his moveset was ass because his design was cool.
Replacing my original comment, but Seismetoad, despite having a higher Attack then Special Attack, has never gotten Waterfall for some reason, which is just bizarre. At least they got access to Liquidation later…
And it doesn’t get Ice Beam and Blizzard as well… it always weirded me out.
Feraligatr never got Waterfall in gen 2 despite being a mono Water type
to be fair, a fat toad can't really swim up a waterfall. lot's of water types had that issue, which was the main reason why liquidation was made.
@@IgnitedQuils Yet it can learn Power Whip... What the fucking is it whipping at you? Its tongue??
I kind of wish the Eeveelutions could learn offensive moves of each others' types to spread out their coverage. Maybe make it so Eevee can learn all kinds of crazy moves because of its unstable genetics and can keep them upon evolving and through the move reminder. It would also just be funny seeing, say, a Vaporeon run around with Fire Blast.
Also give Espeon Power Gem like all the other Pokemon with gems on their forehead.
Yeah, give it some weird/crazy moves, but nothing truly reliable (like Thunderbolt). That should make it interesting without making it too ridiculous.
Maybe give it access to a ton of moves through breeding of a type that don't have eeveelutions like dragon pulse, earthquake, earthpower, gunkshot, rockslide, signal beam etc.
I think Eevee should learn one weak attack of each of his evolutions for it to not be too powerful like:
Ember (and fire fang), Thunder shock (and thunder fang), Water gun, Bite, confusion, icy wind (and ice fang), Mega drain and draining kiss
24:22 I said this once before and I’ll say it again. A blast from the past seeing mega aggron with the name “the wall.” No one can outstall the wall.
Absolutely iconic vid
Klingklang not having high horsepower is sad, it really needs ground coverage, and high horsepower is a perfect pun for it
Klinklangs coverage is just gear grind wild charge and uhhhh facade? A 70 BP dark type move I forgot the name of?
@@ink3487 Assurance, and that move has 60 power
When Tyranitar moved from S+ to just S because it lost two stab moves, hilarious!
Also "let's talk about movepools, first, gen 1"... oh no
Tbh ttars movepool is crazy even without stab. Sure losing pursuit blows but that mon is so versatile and you could always hp for a reliable rock stab
@@musicstuff6310 it has crunch still
@@saiyanscaris6530 switches out into dark resist 😏
@@musicstuff6310 considering stone edge would still hurt and it gets fighting coverage and even iron tail
I think the funniest example of a completely barren move pool is Spectrier. I remember when it was new and seemed so gimmicky with only Shadow Ball really to attack with but it was so broken otherwise that it didn't need anything else.
Perfect example of how sometimes you don't need to give a Pokemon every move in the world for it to succeed.
Ngl I quite liked the trend with the Gen 8 DLC of having potentially amazing mons balanced by a garbage movepool
@@BigYellowSilly I agree! On the opposite side of the spectrum, Weavile finally has the ultimate physical Ice/Dark kit that Sneasel wished for so fervently back in GSC, and it’s dominating OU in a generation completely without Pursuit too!
I never understood why Cubone and Marowak aren’t able to learn swords dance in RBY despite literally having a bone sword as a weapon. They would still be forever outclassed but Sandslash if they had the move, but damn.
My best guess is that there just wasn’t an inclination to add Swords Dance to Cubone/Marowak’s sets due to the different nature of the more restricted and unique movepools of the time. Marowak’s access to special moves like Blizzard and Fire Blast while Sandslash is more focused on physical moves makes me think that these features were supposed to be what distinguished the two-stage mono-Ground evolutionary lines from each other aside from a few other things (such as their level-up movepools wrt STAB moves and where they are obtained). Once Pokémon had much more of a stable ground (haha) to elaborate upon itself, Marowak gained access to Swords Dance and a power boosting item while Sandslash would be a more polarized Pokémon with defensive utility like Rapid Spin + Spikes or offensive threats like Sand Veil / Sand Rush. Both even have access to Knock Off and Stealth Rock, got Alolan formes in the same generation, and returned to SWSH in the same DLC.
@@annaangelic2318 I honestly feel like it was some sort of oversight, because a lot of Pokémon move pools are really weird (such as Tangela being able to learn swords dance), but even if that was the case for Marowak in RBY it seems really odd for it to have even worse special than Sandslash and even Dugtrio. It’s stats are honestly just awful, and I don’t really know what gamefreaks intention was for it. At least it’s playstyle is defined in Gen 2 as a brutally powerful physical attacker.
@@paleoscinkus542 omg I can’t believe I forgot Dugtrio!!! It’s even included in the two stage mono-Grounds from Kanto that got Alolan forms, although it debuted in SWSH initially.
Zamazenta makes me actively angry. like lmao jokes mad at kids game but holy shit, Zamazenta feels like it was designed to appeal to me specifically and then shot in the head as a direct prank. It's insane that Game Freak seems scared of any Pokemon surviving a hit or two and not giving any defensive Pokemon healing but they'll happily introduce fucking attacker after attacker that just melts your HP bar so it ends up feeling like you're throwing nukes at each other. Not getting Body Press feels like it was done on purpose. That move was clearly designed for Zamazenta, and then it just doesn't get it. How do you forget that? I can't believe that was ignorance, I can only assume malice. God, it makes me furious.
Hell, Behemoth Bash is an attack ***WITH A SHIELD FACE*** and an animation that has Zamazenta going full shield... And it doesn't have Body Press's "uses defense as offense stat" gimmick.
WTF, Game Freak???
I get the frustration about Zamazenta compared to Zacian but I think you’re ignoring that there’s plenty of potent modern defensive Pokémon like Toxapex, Tapu Fini, Galarian Slowking, and Corviknight. There’s even been this sort of “domestication” of a lot of the more offensive and wallbreaking Pokémon of the earlier generations into defensive staples, like Multiscale Defog Dragonite, Unaware Clefable, Rocky Helmet tank Garchomp, and bulky Defog Zapdos. Zamazenta’s toolkit might miss out on a big addition to generation 8, but why get mad about it lacking something rather than excited that Zamazenta isn’t just designed to be the most unstoppable optimized force ever? Zamazenta-Crowned is even distinct in being the only Pokémon besides Silvally in generation 8 which can be safely switched into broken Knock Off without losing anything. I think that’s a huge defensive feature that gets overlooked, and utility is central to defensive Pokémon. Your focus on Zamazenta being seemingly “designed” to throw out the strongest Body Press possible makes me think your issue isn’t actually that there’s too much damage flying around, because you’re suggesting that Zamazenta adds to that rather than standing against it. If you were really interested in seeing Zamazenta as a keystone defensive Pokémon, I feel like you would suggest other options for it, such as status spreading moves, cleric moves, and item control moves.
@@annaangelic2318 What's a cleric move? Heal Bell? What else?
@@robertlupa8273 Cleric move is kind of a general category, but it usually includes support moves that heal your team. Wish, Heal Bell, Aromatherapy, Healing Wish, Lunar Dance, and Jungle Healing are all examples.
@@annaangelic2318 Because it's a legendary and legendaries are COOL! I want to be excited by the character that's ON THE BOX OF THE GAME I BOUGHT
Kind of a reverse case, a pokemon with a perfect move pool but fails, is Kricketune. In theory, it's a perfect webs setter. Taunt, webs, toxic, heal bell, and perish song make up a fantastic utility baseline. However, it's stats are so horrible that it will never be used ever. Even just 20 more speed or an evolution would make me use it all the time
instant sub for trails music.
Klinklang is my favorite example of one of these. Gear grind is a good move, but wild charge being your only other physical attack blows. Give that thing coverage and it shoots up multiple tiers overnight, if only because shift gear is a ridiculous setup move.
You should make a video going over the amazing movepool buffs that generation 8 added. A lot of new moves were introduced, a lot of old moves were buffed, and almost everything got better distribution of moves. A big example would be dual wingbeat or weatherball (weatherball was buffed).
This a fun idea, could work for older gens too
charizard i remember benefited from this alot and became a choice specs solar powered insane sun threat with hurricane, solarbeam, scorching sands, dragon pulse, focus blast and so on
The opposite of this is pretty interesting. What would otherwise be terrible Pokemon with amazing movesets.
Slurpuff sticks out as a good example. It's basically the perfect SL because of access to moves like Stickywebs, Endeavor, Yawn, and Misty Explosion. On top of this, it also gets access to Belly Drum, which allows it to terrorize lower tiers as an Unburden sweeper. Definitely a case of a mon winning the movepool lottery.
Zamazenta, Sceptile (wrong side for the movepool), Regigigas (physical moves at least), Regirock, Wigglytuff, Maractus (similar situtaion with Sceptile)
I really tried using Jigglypuff in USUM and even when I could teach it basically everything, it was still incredibly disappointing.
this do be a gen 5 kyurem black moment
edit: kyurem-B is also kinda slow so you cant revenge kill most of the base 100+ mons that run the tier (latios/keldeo/gengar) etc and even get crept by haxorus
yes gen 8 ZU slaps, can't wait to see the drops
ironically that meta has a mon that's a good example for this - Pinsir. If Sawk can have his Close Combat why can't Pinsir have his Megahorn? the fuck are these contraptions on top of his head for?
Was literally thinking this. They HATE to see a girlbug winning.
Klinklang, the definition of unfortunate movepool, wtf were they thinking
tbf klinklang's trash design makes very hard to imagine it at something that can fight in the first place. Like, what other think can it do outside of some tackles and slams? That's why his movepool consists in only that kind of attacks.
@@axletherojo7466 I really like klinklang…
Much better audio love it 💙 I'll be relistening later as I just finished the og vid
I suppose I'll reiterate this for the new and improved video, while also elaborating on my thoughts a bit.
Some of the biggest letdowns for me Moveset-wise are the lack of key Recoil Moves on certain Rock Head Pokémon. Aerodactyl and Tyrantrum stand out to me in particular since the former only has access to Take Down and Double-Edge, while the latter only gets access to Head Smash. It's especially strange to me since most Rock Head Pokémon get both sets of moves, but these two are the unfortunate exceptions.
It makes using Rock Head on either Pokémon rather pointless, since you're only getting decent non-STAB Normal Moves for Aerodactyl, and you're passing up on the pseudo-STAB for key coverage moves provided by Strong Jaw with Tyrantrum. Beyond that, I feel like Aerodactyl could benefit from Brave Bird and Wild Charge, since at the moment it has fuck all to do basically anywhere.
Aerodactyl with Brave Bird and Head Smash would be busted.
But hey, in a place where Rayquaza can mega evolve with a free item slot...
I think that obstagoon also have reckless with only double-edge, but at least it is STAB
@@helente764 Obstagoon gets stab guts facade like a champ
Rock Head is not at all pointless on Tyrantrum. Rock Head + Head Smash is an atomic STAB on its own that is very threatening to the SS NU metagame, and Tyrantrum does not want to be using Strong Jaw considering it doesn’t boost the STAB moves that Tyrantrum would want to be always packing. Tyrantrum’s Rock Head + Head Smash combo is largely why Rock-resists like Mudsdale, Silvally-Ground, Copperajah, and Stakataka are almost mandatory on nearly every SS NU team. I think Tyrantrum is absolutely delivering on what it means to have Head Smash + Rock Head in a superior way to something like Aggron.
@@orange6259 yeah ik, i was just pointing that it also had a pretty useless reckless
While they clearly went overboard with the Zama weaknesses and Zacian buffs (as well as the lack of balancing well into the Gen through the various updates S&S received), I think a lot of people forget how difficult it is to properly design and balance good defensive Mons, and how weary GF likely is about introducing too many powerful ones or just keeping any potential ones in check. Generally speaking the ratio of great defensive Mons to their great offensive counterparts is low, we usually only see a handful every Gen (Skarm, Bliss, Ferro, Pex) and conversely the amount of complaints about those Mons is much higher, probably reaching GF themselves.
I think even with every practical buff they could've given Zama in BP, KS, and recovery of some sort it still wouldn't nearly reach of heights of Zacian just due to it's slightly worse typing (Fighting/Steel is still very strong imo) and the less useful nature of its ability since it only covers half of its defensive profile while Zacian's covers all of its, but I at least understand why they didn't feel comfortable opening the pandora's box of walling tactics for it given its great speed and good attack (with stab fighting) that most great defensive Mons don't have either of.
There’s something hypnotic about your content, I’ve always felt you’re so persuasive with your commentary that you suck me in and don’t let me go. I’ve always sat still and watched the entire 20-30 minute entirety of your videos all at once which is pretty rare for me for any TH-cam video. Also for the longest time i was wondering what that fucking wooden thing on the top of your shelf was, now I know. It’s a lamp.
The fact Gyrados doesn’t learn any flying move other than bounce is just sad because, you know… it’s a flying type.
Aerodactyl always bothered me, usable type, and stats absolutely made for gen 1, and its movepool is hot garbage, absolute trash.
And then, to add insult to injury, they give Lance's aerodactyl in gen 2 rock slide, the move aerodactyl has been dying to get, and it doesn't recieve it....its like gamefreak trolled us all.
Well, at least it got EQ in gen 2.
My best guess is that Aerodactyl was designed as an example of a special reward Pokémon which trades a wide movepool for standout stats and typing in Gen 1. Aero’s big feature is that it has a strong neutral matchup versus the gym fight you obtain it right before (and it has a pretty alright Giovanni matchup too), just like its other fossil friends, but you can use one that flies and can take you around the region after you make it to Cinnabar. Rock/Flying would have been a difficult typing for players to deal with if Aero had STAB, especially with it being a part of the Lance fight and a Pokémon you can’t encounter anywhere else in the game other than reviving the Old Amber. Resistances to Normal + Fire and an immunity to Ground is pretty big in a generation where coverage is super limited and players are probably leaning hard on their Water/Electric/Ice types to take care of Lance’s menacing team.
An example of this in Gen 9 is Meowscarada not having any physical dark stab stronger than Night Slash. However, this doesn’t hurt as much when you realize everything is stab for Meowscarada
Kid named knock off and sucker punch:
Some of the movepool decisions from the folks at Game Freak will never cease to baffle me. I mean, some of the movepool limitations were kinda funny in Gen 1 because, well, Gen 1... but stuff like not giving Mega Aggron a recovery move outside Rest just feels bad, man. A defensive Pokemon without reliable recovery bothers me most of the time because it cuts into the thing that it's meant to do: sit there and take hits.
It always confused me that Togekiss never got Moonblast once it got the Fairy typing. I guess it would still prefer the Flying type Air Slash as its primary STAB because of the flinch chance boosted by Serene Grace... but we have a special attacking Fairy mon without _the_ special attacking Fairy move! Legends Arceus fixed this, thankfully.
The Eeveelutions' lack of coverage has been mentioned in a few other comments, but I wanted to reiterate it here because Espeon is my favourite Pokemon, but it's inferior to other Psychic attackers because of a worse movepool. Considering how popular Eevee and its evolutions are, you'd think the developers would give some cool and interesting additions to their movepools, but nope.
21:42 Plus, it's _Earthquake,_ one of the most widely distributed moves in the game!
25:35 Yoooo, I hear that Trails in the Sky OST!
Espeon doesn't get Mystical Fire (like Indeedee and Gardevoir do), hell it doesn't even get Power Gem despite that it has a fucking gem on it's head
Espeon has one niche that no other pokemon has.
Magic bounce and baton pass making it one of the most valuable members of the baton pass chain.
Try naming every defensive, bulky or even tanky pokemon with reliable recovery (Reocver, Roost, Slack Off, Soft-Boiled, Shore Up, Morning Sun, Moonlight, Synthesis, Leech Seed or hell even Giga Drain, Drain Punch, Leech Life or even Draining Kiss)
I'll start:
Toxapex - Recover+Regenerator as a ability
Slowtwins, Hippowdon - Slack Off
Clefable - Soft-Boiled (and Moonlight for thoese who never had a Clefable from Gen 3)
Corviknight, Skamory, Gliscor, Defensive Zapdos - Roost
Ferrothorn, Celesteelia - Leech Seed
Umbreon - Moonlight
Palssosand - Shore Up (it's signature move)
Avalugg - Recover (still bottom-tier by usage, but it actually had a niche in OU at some point)
Some fairy types besides Togekiss never got Moonblast either, such as Wigglytuff, Slurpuff and Hatterene.
@@goGothitaLOL "no Power Gem even tho it has a gem on its forehead"
Literally why? _Persian_ gets Power Gem for the same reason. Why not Espeon?
I don’t think zekrom has ever been outright terrible, but has had pretty bad movepool problems for years, it got dragon dance in gen 8 and that was great it’s really good and all, but it really should’ve had it this whole time, and it’s lack of ground coverage meant primal groudon’s very existence nullified zekroms viability, if it had dragon dance, earth power, and earthquake it’s physical and mixed sets would’ve been able to threaten primal groudon after some chip damage (which is NOT HARD to get in gen 6 and gen 7 ubers because groudon is used to check so many threats) in gen 6 in particular zekrom probably would’ve been a hilariously dangerous pair with xerneas because groudon is practically the only uber pokemon that can even stand up to it so putting that much pressure on one pokemon is really dangerous and might even be unhealthy for the metagame
Strongly disagree. Dragon/Electric is a very uncommon and powerful dual STAB combination, and Zekrom has the natural strength and even unique qualities that make it work. Toxic + diet Mold Breaker means Zekrom makes progress against a lot of traditional Electric checks. A box legendary having Roost as its reliable recovery on its own is exceptional. STAB Volt Switch and the signature Bolt Strike are both standout too. I think it‘s reductive to say Zekrom has movepool issues when it even has Defog rattling around in there. Even when PDon was menacing gens 6/7 Ubers, Zekrom could still be threatening against teams it as many Ubers teams build lazily with their only Electric-check being Primal Don, which completely lacks recovery and is vulnerable to mixed Draco sets or taking a Toxic. “Nullified viability” is a huge overstatement, even if it’s describing a C-rank ORAS/USUM Ubers mon, just because Zekrom did not fall out of the Ubers metagame entirely. Zekrom was definitely much more top tier in XY Ubers, but a lot of its issues are less about its movepool and more about the difficulty in trying to get a cohesive Ubers team that can handle the threat level of the metagame. Zekrom’s resistances haven’t always been superb unless it was sitting in front of a locked Kyogre, and having a speed tier vulnerable to big revenge killers like Xerneas hasn’t made things easier. My thought on Zekrom is that it’s more often held back by the way the metagame around it is shaped together around Ferrothorn being one of the most premiere Steels just because Kyogre or another box legendary forces it on every defensive team. Instead of solving its movepool issue with ground coverage, something along the lines of fire coverage for Ferrothorn or general Fighting coverage would be a better fit for it than EQ/EP in my opinion.
@@annaangelic2318 The removal of Primal Groudon and Mega Salamence gave Zekrom some breathing room. Feels great.
TBF, Electric/Dragon is nearly unresisted but I get what you mean due to not having a lot of useful physical coverage moves. No one sees it use Zen Headbutt, Crunch, Stone Edge and Dual Wingbeat.
Throwback to Dual Wingbeat Zekrom when Dynamax was legal in SS Ubers.
Regarding movepool issues (I’ll focus on Gen 8), I found it weird how Rillaboom lacks Rock Slide/Stone Edge. Since it looks like it would and Rock Slide is a common coverage move. If it did, it would have dealt better against Bug and Flying types.
Cinderace, despite its movepool being good, lacks Thunderpunch, Brick Break and CC (the former being common coverage for other Fire starters).
Sobble and Drizzile don’t learn Ice Beam and Hydro Pump but Inteleon does. Weird since the other starters, even when NFE, learned those.
The regis introduced this Gen had weird movesets. The previous ones all learned TBolt/Thunder, Earthquake, Flash Cannon, Focus Blast, Rock Slide and Superpower. I won’t count punching moves as Regieleki and Regidrago don’t have hands, but it was weird how they didn’t learn those moves.
Spectrier’s movepool I won’t explain how shallow it is, but Dragapult is a weird case for a pseudo legendary. Its special movepool is good but its Physical movepool is lacking. All the previous pseudo legendaries had vast movepools but Dragapult weirdly didn’t. And it doesn’t learn Shadow Claw but learn Dragon Claw. And it doesn’t learn Poltergeist.
Cinderace doesn't need Thunder Punch or CC, Libero is already good enough, plus it already got HJK
Both Rillaboom and Cinderace are already really good Pokémon without these moves so while they would appreciate these additions they don’t need it as we can clearly see.
@@ribombee4252 I see some talk about the major flaw of Rillaboom being Grass resistant Pokemon, mainly Flying types as it lacks super effective coverage against them. Hence why a move like Rock Slide would be preferable.
I don't know why but i can't stop watching this video
Big Yellow is a goldmine of youtube content
@@chandazure5929 facts
I remember being really really really confused years ago when my Toxtricity couldn't learn VenoShock. It's so dumb that the Low Key form can't learn it, TOX-TRICITY VENO-SHOCK